Pets!
Brooke
Hi everyone,
I need suggestions! We have been unschooling since my oldest daughter was
born (she is now almost 12) I am a single mother and have three other
children all of whom are unschooled.
we also have a number of pets, two cats, one kitten, one puppy and lately
Ashley (my eldest) has bought two rats. (Skipping lightly over the fact that
her choice of pets leaves me stone-cold) the actual problem is this - in the
past when Ashley was younger she has had her own puppies and kittens and has
always failed to do her share of caring for them. After the last debacle
when I had to rehome her 10 month old puppy, I said that I would never again
buy her a pet - if she wanted one she would need to save up and buy it
herself plus do all the caring for it.
She finally bought these two rats and their cage - had them at home for a
day and went off to a friend's place to play. She phoned later that night to
say she was going to stay the night! I reluctantly fed and looked after her
pet rats but now I am in a quandary.
If I say that the rats have to go back to the petshop, I feel like I am
teaching her that living things are expendable. If I allow the rats to
starve or get ill through neglect, I really couldn't live with myself. How
do I ensure that she learns that pets are a commitment not to be taken
lightly and not to be passed on when she is bored???
Brooke
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
I need suggestions! We have been unschooling since my oldest daughter was
born (she is now almost 12) I am a single mother and have three other
children all of whom are unschooled.
we also have a number of pets, two cats, one kitten, one puppy and lately
Ashley (my eldest) has bought two rats. (Skipping lightly over the fact that
her choice of pets leaves me stone-cold) the actual problem is this - in the
past when Ashley was younger she has had her own puppies and kittens and has
always failed to do her share of caring for them. After the last debacle
when I had to rehome her 10 month old puppy, I said that I would never again
buy her a pet - if she wanted one she would need to save up and buy it
herself plus do all the caring for it.
She finally bought these two rats and their cage - had them at home for a
day and went off to a friend's place to play. She phoned later that night to
say she was going to stay the night! I reluctantly fed and looked after her
pet rats but now I am in a quandary.
If I say that the rats have to go back to the petshop, I feel like I am
teaching her that living things are expendable. If I allow the rats to
starve or get ill through neglect, I really couldn't live with myself. How
do I ensure that she learns that pets are a commitment not to be taken
lightly and not to be passed on when she is bored???
Brooke
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Molly Mahnke
Rats are very social creatures. (We have five females.) You might explain
to her that she is their "mommy". They will get to know her voice and her
touch and will get to be loyal to her. Personally, if it were one of my
children begging for a pet, with a history as you explained, I still
wouldn't have let her buy one, even with her own money. Animals are
living creatures and don't deserve to be neglected just because their 11
yr. old. owner doesn't feel like dealing with the responsibility anymore.
You may explain to her that neglecting the animals she promised to care
for is just like you neglecting to feed and care for her. It is your
responsiblity as her mom to care for her. She knowingly took on these
animals and they are her responsiblity.
Buttons
--- Brooke <BrookeNZ@...> wrote:
to her that she is their "mommy". They will get to know her voice and her
touch and will get to be loyal to her. Personally, if it were one of my
children begging for a pet, with a history as you explained, I still
wouldn't have let her buy one, even with her own money. Animals are
living creatures and don't deserve to be neglected just because their 11
yr. old. owner doesn't feel like dealing with the responsibility anymore.
You may explain to her that neglecting the animals she promised to care
for is just like you neglecting to feed and care for her. It is your
responsiblity as her mom to care for her. She knowingly took on these
animals and they are her responsiblity.
Buttons
--- Brooke <BrookeNZ@...> wrote:
> Hi everyone,
>
> I need suggestions! We have been unschooling since my oldest daughter
> was
> born (she is now almost 12) I am a single mother and have three other
> children all of whom are unschooled.
>
> we also have a number of pets, two cats, one kitten, one puppy and
> lately
> Ashley (my eldest) has bought two rats. (Skipping lightly over the fact
> that
> her choice of pets leaves me stone-cold) the actual problem is this - in
> the
> past when Ashley was younger she has had her own puppies and kittens and
> has
> always failed to do her share of caring for them. After the last debacle
> when I had to rehome her 10 month old puppy, I said that I would never
> again
> buy her a pet - if she wanted one she would need to save up and buy it
> herself plus do all the caring for it.
>
> She finally bought these two rats and their cage - had them at home for
> a
> day and went off to a friend's place to play. She phoned later that
> night to
> say she was going to stay the night! I reluctantly fed and looked after
> her
> pet rats but now I am in a quandary.
>
> If I say that the rats have to go back to the petshop, I feel like I am
> teaching her that living things are expendable. If I allow the rats to
> starve or get ill through neglect, I really couldn't live with myself.
> How
> do I ensure that she learns that pets are a commitment not to be taken
> lightly and not to be passed on when she is bored???
>
> Brooke
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
LisaBugg
> She finally bought these two rats and their cage - had them at home for ato
> day and went off to a friend's place to play. She phoned later that night
> say she was going to stay the night! I reluctantly fed and looked afterher
> pet rats but now I am in a quandary.I'm sort of not following? How is spending the night with a friend equated
>
> If I say that the rats have to go back to the petshop, I feel like I am
> teaching her that living things are expendable. If I allow the rats to
> starve or get ill through neglect, I really couldn't live with myself. How
> do I ensure that she learns that pets are a commitment not to be taken
> lightly and not to be passed on when she is bored???
with being bored by the rats? If you wanted her to take care of the rats,
could she have come home, fed them, and then left to spend the night with
the friend?
I have never had rats, so I'm not sure if they need feeding more than once a
day or if they are like our gerbil, where you can place food in the cage for
a couple of days at a time. I know the water bottle lasts a couple of days
here.
[email protected]
Hi, we have lots of pets here too. We live in the country and I guess the
kids figure we have the room. I guess it is a good thing that I like having
animals around too. We have never had rats though I hear they make great
pets. In the past we have had guinea pigs and gerbils. We loved the guinea
pigs but not so much the gerbils because they seemed intent on biting us. Now
our main pets are Siberean Huskies. It started with my 11 yr old wanting one
so he could start a dog team and has grown to all the kids (ages 13, 15, 17)
joining in. Now we have 7 huskies. The kids have them pull carts in parades
and pull them on scooters for fun. And if we have snow then we have them pull
a sled too. But there is definitely a lot of chores that go with that many
dogs. I just have a rule, chores first. When the kids get up in the morning
the dogs have to be feed and watered. After the kids have breakfast the dog
pens must be cleaned. In the summer the dogs need to be put in their
play/execise pen early before it gets hot. At first the kids would forget.
They would want to get on the pc or playstation, so I would remind them. I
did not order them to get out there, I would just remind them and off they
would go. Now it has become habit. Of course I am not so stern that there are
not exceptions to the rule. Last night the kids got a call to see if they
would like to help buck bales for a few hours. That meant money so of course
they wanted to go. Since it was spur of the moment and evening chores had not
been done I said I would do them. To me they are not really chores anyway, I
like to spend time with the dogs too, they are so sweet and each is unique.
The kids were gone till 11:00 last night and anyone who has lifted a hay bale
knows how heavy they are and what a job it would be to buck them for 4 hours.
So I took care of chores this morning too so the kids can sleep in. Everyone
is different on how they raise their kids and that is great. But here if the
kids get a pet then they have to take care of it. I have had good luck with
them doing so with only an occasional reminding. But if they just refused to
do it then I would say no psx, pc, karate classes, etc. I am not going to let
animals suffer because the kids decided they are tired of them. And I am not
going to take over for them all the time. I do not have that much free time.
Anyway, that is what I do here. I am sure that you will find a solution that
fits your family.
Have a lovely day
Candy
kids figure we have the room. I guess it is a good thing that I like having
animals around too. We have never had rats though I hear they make great
pets. In the past we have had guinea pigs and gerbils. We loved the guinea
pigs but not so much the gerbils because they seemed intent on biting us. Now
our main pets are Siberean Huskies. It started with my 11 yr old wanting one
so he could start a dog team and has grown to all the kids (ages 13, 15, 17)
joining in. Now we have 7 huskies. The kids have them pull carts in parades
and pull them on scooters for fun. And if we have snow then we have them pull
a sled too. But there is definitely a lot of chores that go with that many
dogs. I just have a rule, chores first. When the kids get up in the morning
the dogs have to be feed and watered. After the kids have breakfast the dog
pens must be cleaned. In the summer the dogs need to be put in their
play/execise pen early before it gets hot. At first the kids would forget.
They would want to get on the pc or playstation, so I would remind them. I
did not order them to get out there, I would just remind them and off they
would go. Now it has become habit. Of course I am not so stern that there are
not exceptions to the rule. Last night the kids got a call to see if they
would like to help buck bales for a few hours. That meant money so of course
they wanted to go. Since it was spur of the moment and evening chores had not
been done I said I would do them. To me they are not really chores anyway, I
like to spend time with the dogs too, they are so sweet and each is unique.
The kids were gone till 11:00 last night and anyone who has lifted a hay bale
knows how heavy they are and what a job it would be to buck them for 4 hours.
So I took care of chores this morning too so the kids can sleep in. Everyone
is different on how they raise their kids and that is great. But here if the
kids get a pet then they have to take care of it. I have had good luck with
them doing so with only an occasional reminding. But if they just refused to
do it then I would say no psx, pc, karate classes, etc. I am not going to let
animals suffer because the kids decided they are tired of them. And I am not
going to take over for them all the time. I do not have that much free time.
Anyway, that is what I do here. I am sure that you will find a solution that
fits your family.
Have a lovely day
Candy
[email protected]
<< She knowingly took on these
animals and they are her responsiblity. >>
Kids can't knowingly do things as "knowingly" as adults can, because they're
kids.
They don't know the meaning of years, or forever. Adults hardly can.
With the earlier incident, the child was even younger.
Are rats more important than spending the night elsewhere when the
opportunity arises? The truth is she doesn't live all alone and there are
others in the family who can help out.
If I lived all alone, it would be a problem that we have a dog and some cats.
But I don't live alone. The few times the entire family is gone overnight,
we ask a friend to feed them, maybe even to stay with them. But if one or
even four of us are gone, those who are home keep them.
Since there's a rat aversion in the mom, maybe charge the child money for the
times others have to care for her pets? If she gets allowance, maybe chart
what she's not going to get.
But the problem there is levels of tolerance. If the parent cleans the cage
every time it's not as clean as possible but the child would have waited a
couple of days, it wouldn't be fair to charge for that.
-=-How
do I ensure that she learns that pets are a commitment not to be taken
lightly and not to be passed on when she is bored???-=-
I think your relationship with her is important and to harm it by being
inflexible, expecting too much understanding, or being cold about something
she cares about would be worse than just feeding rats sometimes. Rats don't
live as long as dogs or parrots. That's the good news (if there is any <g>).
I had a rat when I was ten or so. When it was cold one night it escaped the
bed and came and got in bed with me. There were two kids in that room and it
came to me! I saw it as a sign of true love. Later it killed my cousin's
parakeet. We gave it away. It destroyed a fancy Christmas fruitcake the
grandmother had worked on for over a week. They gave it away. It fought
with a parrot they had had since before they had children. They gave it away
to relatives in Santa Fe and I lost track of its adventures.
You might find a family in which both parents think rats are great and give
them the whole setup (your daughter might, I mean) in a year or so when she's
tired of keeping them. Rats won't pine away with sorrow at being given away
and having their names changed as a dog might.
I think helping kids with all their projects and tasks and goals is just part
of being a parent. I'm glad my kids are healthy and mobile and able to take
care of themselves to the extent they can, and that they're curious and want
to do things. They can't be self-sufficient; they're kids.
When I see a family with a child who will still be needing serious daily
tending even when he's an adult I'm thrilled that mine can walk, read, climb
and sing. When I see a family raising a child their own teen accidently
produced, I hope mine will be smart and lucky and responsible. For some
families, even having a child turn 18 or 20 doesn't end the labor.
Sandra
----------------------------------------------------------------
Sandra
"Everything counts."
http://expage.com/SandraDodd
http://expage.com/RadicalUnschooling
animals and they are her responsiblity. >>
Kids can't knowingly do things as "knowingly" as adults can, because they're
kids.
They don't know the meaning of years, or forever. Adults hardly can.
With the earlier incident, the child was even younger.
Are rats more important than spending the night elsewhere when the
opportunity arises? The truth is she doesn't live all alone and there are
others in the family who can help out.
If I lived all alone, it would be a problem that we have a dog and some cats.
But I don't live alone. The few times the entire family is gone overnight,
we ask a friend to feed them, maybe even to stay with them. But if one or
even four of us are gone, those who are home keep them.
Since there's a rat aversion in the mom, maybe charge the child money for the
times others have to care for her pets? If she gets allowance, maybe chart
what she's not going to get.
But the problem there is levels of tolerance. If the parent cleans the cage
every time it's not as clean as possible but the child would have waited a
couple of days, it wouldn't be fair to charge for that.
-=-How
do I ensure that she learns that pets are a commitment not to be taken
lightly and not to be passed on when she is bored???-=-
I think your relationship with her is important and to harm it by being
inflexible, expecting too much understanding, or being cold about something
she cares about would be worse than just feeding rats sometimes. Rats don't
live as long as dogs or parrots. That's the good news (if there is any <g>).
I had a rat when I was ten or so. When it was cold one night it escaped the
bed and came and got in bed with me. There were two kids in that room and it
came to me! I saw it as a sign of true love. Later it killed my cousin's
parakeet. We gave it away. It destroyed a fancy Christmas fruitcake the
grandmother had worked on for over a week. They gave it away. It fought
with a parrot they had had since before they had children. They gave it away
to relatives in Santa Fe and I lost track of its adventures.
You might find a family in which both parents think rats are great and give
them the whole setup (your daughter might, I mean) in a year or so when she's
tired of keeping them. Rats won't pine away with sorrow at being given away
and having their names changed as a dog might.
I think helping kids with all their projects and tasks and goals is just part
of being a parent. I'm glad my kids are healthy and mobile and able to take
care of themselves to the extent they can, and that they're curious and want
to do things. They can't be self-sufficient; they're kids.
When I see a family with a child who will still be needing serious daily
tending even when he's an adult I'm thrilled that mine can walk, read, climb
and sing. When I see a family raising a child their own teen accidently
produced, I hope mine will be smart and lucky and responsible. For some
families, even having a child turn 18 or 20 doesn't end the labor.
Sandra
----------------------------------------------------------------
Sandra
"Everything counts."
http://expage.com/SandraDodd
http://expage.com/RadicalUnschooling
Jessi
> There were two kids in that room and itGosh I hate these Yahoo ads at the bottom and tops of posts when you are
>came to me! I saw it as a sign of true love. Later it killed my cousin's
>parakeet. We gave it away. It destroyed a fancy Christmas fruitcake the
>grandmother had worked on for over a week. They gave it away. It fought
>with a parrot they had had since before they had children. They gave it away
>to relatives in Santa Fe and I lost track of its adventures.
trying to reply...but I digress...
My rats lived in the room with my parrots! I am surprised the parrot did
not bite the rat...mine sure would LOL...I have an Umbrella Cockatoo and a
yellow Crowned Amazon...neither would have allowed the rats in the
cage...the umbrella loves cat tails :o) she will go after them everytime
one gets close to her cage
Jessi
"Be yourself, everyone else is already taken" Gilbert Perreira
Like Avon? Check out my site! http://www.youravon.com/jspurr
Jessi
>Do your kids want to come here and help me? I have to buy about 50 bales
>not exceptions to the rule. Last night the kids got a call to see if they
>would like to help buck bales for a few hours. That meant money so of course
>they wanted to go. Since it was spur of the moment and evening chores had not
>been done I said I would do them. To me they are not really chores anyway, I
>like to spend time with the dogs too, they are so sweet and each is unique.
>The kids were gone till 11:00 last night and anyone who has lifted a hay bale
>knows how heavy they are and what a job it would be to buck them for 4 hours.
of straw and hay and then have to stack it and make it neat of course and
that stuff is so heavy...you are right there!
Jessi
"Be yourself, everyone else is already taken" Gilbert Perreira
Like Avon? Check out my site! http://www.youravon.com/jspurr
Jessi
>subject to the <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/>Yahoo! Terms of Service.Brooke, how old are your other children? Could your daughter make a deal
with one of them that if she is spending the night elsewhere, that they
could feed and water them?
I have had 3 rats in my time and I know that going a night without food is
not a bad thing, as long as she came home the next day to feed them. They
will not scream or make any noise and they usually hoard a bit anyway, at
least mine did in a corner of the cage...unless the other rat found its
stash :o)
Jessi
"Be yourself, everyone else is already taken" Gilbert Perreira
Like Avon? Check out my site! http://www.youravon.com/jspurr
Brooke
Dear Sandra and all others who replied,
I have no objection at all to her going away overnight or even longer; my
issue was that she did not make any arrangements to have her brother (8) or
sisters care for these vermin...um...dear little members of the family while
she was to be away.
I am very happy to help out when required but at almost 12 I do expect
Ashley to have the foresight to make arrangements for their care and feeding
when she is unable to do so. Is that unreasonable??
ease give me more feedback - what ages do you all think a child can
reasonably expected to do this level of caring??
Love
Brooke
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
I have no objection at all to her going away overnight or even longer; my
issue was that she did not make any arrangements to have her brother (8) or
sisters care for these vermin...um...dear little members of the family while
she was to be away.
I am very happy to help out when required but at almost 12 I do expect
Ashley to have the foresight to make arrangements for their care and feeding
when she is unable to do so. Is that unreasonable??
ease give me more feedback - what ages do you all think a child can
reasonably expected to do this level of caring??
Love
Brooke
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
In a message dated 7/15/01 5:53:38 PM, BrookeNZ@... writes:
<< these vermin...um...dear little members of the family >>
Sandra
"Everything counts."
http://expage.com/SandraDodd
http://expage.com/RadicalUnschooling
<< these vermin...um...dear little members of the family >>
Sandra
"Everything counts."
http://expage.com/SandraDodd
http://expage.com/RadicalUnschooling
[email protected]
Sorry about the premature "send" before.
<< these vermin...um...dear little members of the family >>
HEY!
Holly and I save food for prairie dogs, and we take them water and we visit
them.
We have a friend who says (with *Feeling*) "VERMIN!"
and sometimes she is less charitable and says "plague-bearing vermin"
(because we are in a pneumonic/bubonic plague area, but it's deer mice, NOT
cute little prairie dogs, who want to give us plague).
Perhaps I was overly sympathetic because I have an affinity for vermin. I
mean rodents. I mean cute little mammals that sit on their haunches and hold
their food with their two cute little paws.
Sandra
<< these vermin...um...dear little members of the family >>
HEY!
Holly and I save food for prairie dogs, and we take them water and we visit
them.
We have a friend who says (with *Feeling*) "VERMIN!"
and sometimes she is less charitable and says "plague-bearing vermin"
(because we are in a pneumonic/bubonic plague area, but it's deer mice, NOT
cute little prairie dogs, who want to give us plague).
Perhaps I was overly sympathetic because I have an affinity for vermin. I
mean rodents. I mean cute little mammals that sit on their haunches and hold
their food with their two cute little paws.
Sandra
[email protected]
On Sun, 15 Jul 2001 20:33:58 EDT SandraDodd@... writes:
pathologist and one year for Christmas, my brother and I each got one of
the extras - we'd already done mice years before. In high school I had a
rat named Spike, who came to school with me. Our latest rat was Harry
Potter (a hooded rat with a white line of fur on his forehead). He was a
domestic rat but we got him from the animal shelter where he had been
turned in as a stray... before that my daughter was briefly in the
mouse-breeding business, and before that we had a hamster who would run
around loose and sleep with the cats (we have oh-so-wimpy cats), and
before that we had a ferret, who would also run around loose but would
chase the cats.
I actually like ferrets best, but now we're in California where they have
misguidedly made them illegal... so we're thinking of a chinchilla next,
although my daughter really would prefer to have a rabbit again, I
think...
We've never really had pets that ended up being hers or mine, they've all
sort of ended up being family pets... like, Harry was mine, but she would
play with him and hold him while I cleaned the cage and stuff (in his
dottage, Harry bit her friend's finger and blood spurted everywhere, that
was exciting) and I helped with her mice, and she feeds the cats
sometimes which have got to be techinically my pets because they're older
than she is. I guess it just seems easier to me for each of us to do
stuff as it needs to be done... I mean, if she was around and I was
zipping past the mouse cage and noticed that the water was low, I would
mention it to her in passing and expect that when she came to a good
stopping place in what she was doing, she'd take care of it... which
worked often enough to keep me from feeling put-upon, most of the time
anyway.
Daron
> Perhaps I was overly sympathetic because I have an affinity forvermin. I
> mean rodents. I mean cute little mammals that sit on their haunchesand hold
> their food with their two cute little paws.I had my first pet rat 25 years ago - my dad was (and is) a research
pathologist and one year for Christmas, my brother and I each got one of
the extras - we'd already done mice years before. In high school I had a
rat named Spike, who came to school with me. Our latest rat was Harry
Potter (a hooded rat with a white line of fur on his forehead). He was a
domestic rat but we got him from the animal shelter where he had been
turned in as a stray... before that my daughter was briefly in the
mouse-breeding business, and before that we had a hamster who would run
around loose and sleep with the cats (we have oh-so-wimpy cats), and
before that we had a ferret, who would also run around loose but would
chase the cats.
I actually like ferrets best, but now we're in California where they have
misguidedly made them illegal... so we're thinking of a chinchilla next,
although my daughter really would prefer to have a rabbit again, I
think...
We've never really had pets that ended up being hers or mine, they've all
sort of ended up being family pets... like, Harry was mine, but she would
play with him and hold him while I cleaned the cage and stuff (in his
dottage, Harry bit her friend's finger and blood spurted everywhere, that
was exciting) and I helped with her mice, and she feeds the cats
sometimes which have got to be techinically my pets because they're older
than she is. I guess it just seems easier to me for each of us to do
stuff as it needs to be done... I mean, if she was around and I was
zipping past the mouse cage and noticed that the water was low, I would
mention it to her in passing and expect that when she came to a good
stopping place in what she was doing, she'd take care of it... which
worked often enough to keep me from feeling put-upon, most of the time
anyway.
Daron
Lynda
Let's see:
Eldest kidlet took care of her horses starting when she was 5. Or at least
she thought she did <g> But the point is that she faithfully did what she
could and never forgot them.
Eldest son took care of his rabbits starting when he was 4 and his goats
when he was 7.
Son #2 had various pets but never did accept the responsibility so he
stopped "owning" any pets. He just never had that "organized" a mind and
would "forget" the pets when he became involved in something else.
Son #3 had lizards, turtles, cats, guinea pigs, rats and birds starting when
he was 3. He did fine with his responsibilities until he discovered girls.
By 17 he had given away most of his pets except for his extremely nasty
tempered chiclid which he still has.
My point being that it is the individual child, not an age. BUT, IMHO, by
age 12 if they want the pet they should be willing to accept the
responsibility or not have the pet.
Lynda
Eldest kidlet took care of her horses starting when she was 5. Or at least
she thought she did <g> But the point is that she faithfully did what she
could and never forgot them.
Eldest son took care of his rabbits starting when he was 4 and his goats
when he was 7.
Son #2 had various pets but never did accept the responsibility so he
stopped "owning" any pets. He just never had that "organized" a mind and
would "forget" the pets when he became involved in something else.
Son #3 had lizards, turtles, cats, guinea pigs, rats and birds starting when
he was 3. He did fine with his responsibilities until he discovered girls.
By 17 he had given away most of his pets except for his extremely nasty
tempered chiclid which he still has.
My point being that it is the individual child, not an age. BUT, IMHO, by
age 12 if they want the pet they should be willing to accept the
responsibility or not have the pet.
Lynda
----- Original Message -----
From: Brooke <BrookeNZ@...>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Sunday, July 15, 2001 4:57 PM
Subject: Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] Pets!
> Dear Sandra and all others who replied,
>
> I have no objection at all to her going away overnight or even longer; my
> issue was that she did not make any arrangements to have her brother (8)
or
> sisters care for these vermin...um...dear little members of the family
while
> she was to be away.
>
> I am very happy to help out when required but at almost 12 I do expect
> Ashley to have the foresight to make arrangements for their care and
feeding
> when she is unable to do so. Is that unreasonable??
> ease give me more feedback - what ages do you all think a child can
> reasonably expected to do this level of caring??
>
> Love
> Brooke
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
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Lynda
Daron,
I believe the bill just passed that makes it legal to have a ferret in CA
providing that it is neutered.
Lynda, in CA
I believe the bill just passed that makes it legal to have a ferret in CA
providing that it is neutered.
Lynda, in CA
----- Original Message -----
From: <freeform@...>
>
> I had my first pet rat 25 years ago - my dad was (and is) a research
> pathologist and one year for Christmas, my brother and I each got one of
> the extras - we'd already done mice years before. In high school I had a
> rat named Spike, who came to school with me. Our latest rat was Harry
> Potter (a hooded rat with a white line of fur on his forehead). He was a
> domestic rat but we got him from the animal shelter where he had been
> turned in as a stray... before that my daughter was briefly in the
> mouse-breeding business, and before that we had a hamster who would run
> around loose and sleep with the cats (we have oh-so-wimpy cats), and
> before that we had a ferret, who would also run around loose but would
> chase the cats.
>
> I actually like ferrets best, but now we're in California where they have
> misguidedly made them illegal... so we're thinking of a chinchilla next,
> although my daughter really would prefer to have a rabbit again, I
> think...
>
> We've never really had pets that ended up being hers or mine, they've all
> sort of ended up being family pets... like, Harry was mine, but she would
> play with him and hold him while I cleaned the cage and stuff (in his
> dottage, Harry bit her friend's finger and blood spurted everywhere, that
> was exciting) and I helped with her mice, and she feeds the cats
> sometimes which have got to be techinically my pets because they're older
> than she is. I guess it just seems easier to me for each of us to do
> stuff as it needs to be done... I mean, if she was around and I was
> zipping past the mouse cage and noticed that the water was low, I would
> mention it to her in passing and expect that when she came to a good
> stopping place in what she was doing, she'd take care of it... which
> worked often enough to keep me from feeling put-upon, most of the time
> anyway.
>
> Daron
>
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>
>
Nanci Kuykendall
For some reason, call me funny, I don't like pets that
bite. I like my pets good tempered, at the very least
towards the family, but preferably not atacking or
injuring anyone who is not teasing/hurting them in
some way. Maybe that is why I have always been
somewhat hesitant about rodents, although I had mice
and a hamster as a teenager, and I do enjoy rabbits,
if they are not too nervous.
Nanci K.
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bite. I like my pets good tempered, at the very least
towards the family, but preferably not atacking or
injuring anyone who is not teasing/hurting them in
some way. Maybe that is why I have always been
somewhat hesitant about rodents, although I had mice
and a hamster as a teenager, and I do enjoy rabbits,
if they are not too nervous.
Nanci K.
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Sharon Rudd
Dear Sandra
I once read in Environmental Health manual of
infectious diseases, published in Atlanta that it was
the prairie dogs with a flea vector. And that the
primary contact with humans was prairie dogs through
the coyotes, fleas, then people due mostly to human
encroachment. But it still isn't too common. 8 or so
cases annually. I can't reference my source. I wasn't
supposed to read it in the first place, and I no
longer have access to it.
Dine' used to (some still do) keep them as pets.
Plague is not a serious problem. (THE SCALPEL AND THE
SILVER BEAR by Dr. Lori Arivso Alvord)
Holly is a lucky little girl to have a Mama that does
so much WITH her. How different is her exposure to
prairie dogs (and so much as so many other
experiences) that that arcade game of bopping them on
the head!! I've even seen a version of that in
chilrens' game sections of toy stores.
Sharon
--- SandraDodd@... wrote:
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I once read in Environmental Health manual of
infectious diseases, published in Atlanta that it was
the prairie dogs with a flea vector. And that the
primary contact with humans was prairie dogs through
the coyotes, fleas, then people due mostly to human
encroachment. But it still isn't too common. 8 or so
cases annually. I can't reference my source. I wasn't
supposed to read it in the first place, and I no
longer have access to it.
Dine' used to (some still do) keep them as pets.
Plague is not a serious problem. (THE SCALPEL AND THE
SILVER BEAR by Dr. Lori Arivso Alvord)
Holly is a lucky little girl to have a Mama that does
so much WITH her. How different is her exposure to
prairie dogs (and so much as so many other
experiences) that that arcade game of bopping them on
the head!! I've even seen a version of that in
chilrens' game sections of toy stores.
Sharon
--- SandraDodd@... wrote:
> Holly and I save food for prairie dogs, and we take__________________________________________________
> them water and we visit
> them.
> and sometimes she is less charitable and says
> "plague-bearing vermin"
> (because we are in a pneumonic/bubonic plague area,
> but it's deer mice, NOT
> cute little prairie dogs, who want to give us
> plague).
> ]>
> Sandra
>
>
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Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail
http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/
[email protected]
In a message dated 7/16/01 7:07:57 PM, bearspawprint@... writes:
<< I once read in Environmental Health manual of
infectious diseases, published in Atlanta that it was
the prairie dogs with a flea vector. >>
If it was in the past four years, it may be so. Four or five years ago every
case they traced back had to do with deer mice in the Manzanos, and some were
found in eastern Albuquerque--not infecting, but caught and tested and
"guilty."
It's dead animals that get you anyway.
The University of New Mexico Hospital (here in town) is the champion plague
authority. I would be surprised if prairie dogs weren't a danger, but there
are only fewer than five cases a year, and those are fixed with antibiotics.
They've had very few get to pneumonic (big bad phase) plague, and few (two?)
deaths, last I knew, over a fifteen year or so recording period.
We camp in those mountains at least twice a year, often with a hundred or
thousand other people (crazy SCA stuff) and I only know of one incident--some
one went home to Kansas or Nebraska, I think it was, but they remembered the
announcement warning about symptoms, and had their doctor call UNM, and it
was all fixed up.
I have heard that Japanese were importing prairie dogs for pets. I can
hardly imagine, after hearing how small their houses are, how and where they
might be keeping them.
Sandra
Sandra
"Everything counts."
http://expage.com/SandraDodd
http://expage.com/RadicalUnschooling
<< I once read in Environmental Health manual of
infectious diseases, published in Atlanta that it was
the prairie dogs with a flea vector. >>
If it was in the past four years, it may be so. Four or five years ago every
case they traced back had to do with deer mice in the Manzanos, and some were
found in eastern Albuquerque--not infecting, but caught and tested and
"guilty."
It's dead animals that get you anyway.
The University of New Mexico Hospital (here in town) is the champion plague
authority. I would be surprised if prairie dogs weren't a danger, but there
are only fewer than five cases a year, and those are fixed with antibiotics.
They've had very few get to pneumonic (big bad phase) plague, and few (two?)
deaths, last I knew, over a fifteen year or so recording period.
We camp in those mountains at least twice a year, often with a hundred or
thousand other people (crazy SCA stuff) and I only know of one incident--some
one went home to Kansas or Nebraska, I think it was, but they remembered the
announcement warning about symptoms, and had their doctor call UNM, and it
was all fixed up.
I have heard that Japanese were importing prairie dogs for pets. I can
hardly imagine, after hearing how small their houses are, how and where they
might be keeping them.
Sandra
Sandra
"Everything counts."
http://expage.com/SandraDodd
http://expage.com/RadicalUnschooling
Bronwen
Hi Brooke :-)
when she is unable to do so.<<
I am thinking that you actually "expect" her to NOT make arrangements-to drop the ball.
Here is my feedback - forget all of her "history", pretend she is your friend- not someone you have to "teach responsibility" to, take a deep breath and then respond. It might sound something like, "Oh, HI! I just called cause I wasn't sure if the rats had a babysitter- you know me! I'm just icked out by it!" She might say, "oh shoot! I forgot, hmm..Im so sorry, um let me talk to dad."
I could make up a bunch of different things you or she might say- but the point is- you are coming from a perspective of "she just doesnt take responsibility!" ("expecting" failure) and what really helps (at least in my experience)is to believe she is and will be responsible and capable.
We are our children's mirrors :-)
Love to you,
Bronwen
Chloe '88
Reed '92
Gordon '00
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>>I am very happy to help out when required but at almost 12 I do expectAshley to have the foresight to make arrangements for their care and feeding
when she is unable to do so.<<
I am thinking that you actually "expect" her to NOT make arrangements-to drop the ball.
Here is my feedback - forget all of her "history", pretend she is your friend- not someone you have to "teach responsibility" to, take a deep breath and then respond. It might sound something like, "Oh, HI! I just called cause I wasn't sure if the rats had a babysitter- you know me! I'm just icked out by it!" She might say, "oh shoot! I forgot, hmm..Im so sorry, um let me talk to dad."
I could make up a bunch of different things you or she might say- but the point is- you are coming from a perspective of "she just doesnt take responsibility!" ("expecting" failure) and what really helps (at least in my experience)is to believe she is and will be responsible and capable.
We are our children's mirrors :-)
Love to you,
Bronwen
Chloe '88
Reed '92
Gordon '00
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Annette Naake
I know I'm a little behind on this thread, but as we have a cat, fish, two
guinea pigs and now two land hermit crabs (in addition to sons 8 and 4), I
feel qualified to comment. I think I also have a slightly different point of
view than most others.
I have always considered whatever animals I allow in (or around) the house
to be my responsibility. To me, the dividend for the kids is not the daily
drudgery of cleaning cages and taking dogs for walks, but the enjoyment of
cuddling a cat or guinea pig and the love they give you back, or the
scientific interest in watching an aquarium environment or a hermit crab. I
try to model loving and responsible care of the creatures and I think I have
succeeded in setting a good example, because the kids are kind to them and
respectful of all animals. I can say from the kids' point of view, the
animals have all been a 100 percent positive and enjoyable experience -- no
drudgery. They usually do feed or water the animals on the occasions when I
ask (sometimes they say they're busy with something else, and I don't force
it) and they always are eager to cuddle and feed a guinea pig during story
time or while watching TV. (I think guinea pigs are the ideal pet for this
age group -- domesticated, cuddly, not nocturnal, hardy and, well, darn cute
in their beady-eyed way.)
When I was a young teen-ager we got a dog (at my request) and it was my
responsibility to walk it and feed it. After a few years, I really dreaded
the chores and was thoroughly tired of the dog. I am not crazy about dogs to
this day. I am hoping to spare my kids this type of negative experience.
(Another good thing about guinea pigs -- they usually only live about four
or five years.)
In the past the guys have asked for a dog, and I always say no because I
don't want to take care of one, listen to it bark in the yard, clean up
after it, etc.
Annette
_________________________________________________________________
Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com
guinea pigs and now two land hermit crabs (in addition to sons 8 and 4), I
feel qualified to comment. I think I also have a slightly different point of
view than most others.
I have always considered whatever animals I allow in (or around) the house
to be my responsibility. To me, the dividend for the kids is not the daily
drudgery of cleaning cages and taking dogs for walks, but the enjoyment of
cuddling a cat or guinea pig and the love they give you back, or the
scientific interest in watching an aquarium environment or a hermit crab. I
try to model loving and responsible care of the creatures and I think I have
succeeded in setting a good example, because the kids are kind to them and
respectful of all animals. I can say from the kids' point of view, the
animals have all been a 100 percent positive and enjoyable experience -- no
drudgery. They usually do feed or water the animals on the occasions when I
ask (sometimes they say they're busy with something else, and I don't force
it) and they always are eager to cuddle and feed a guinea pig during story
time or while watching TV. (I think guinea pigs are the ideal pet for this
age group -- domesticated, cuddly, not nocturnal, hardy and, well, darn cute
in their beady-eyed way.)
When I was a young teen-ager we got a dog (at my request) and it was my
responsibility to walk it and feed it. After a few years, I really dreaded
the chores and was thoroughly tired of the dog. I am not crazy about dogs to
this day. I am hoping to spare my kids this type of negative experience.
(Another good thing about guinea pigs -- they usually only live about four
or five years.)
In the past the guys have asked for a dog, and I always say no because I
don't want to take care of one, listen to it bark in the yard, clean up
after it, etc.
Annette
_________________________________________________________________
Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com
Brooke
Dear Jessi,
Thanks for your reply. My other children are 8, 6 and 3 so yes, the two
eldest could certainly care for the rats when Ashley isn't home. My concern
was that she hadn't made any arrangements to have someone else care for the
wee critters.
Brooke
-------Original Message-------
From: [email protected]
Date: Monday, July 16, 2001 01:44:50 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] Pets!
with one of them that if she is spending the night elsewhere, that they
could feed and water them?
I have had 3 rats in my time and I know that going a night without food is
not a bad thing, as long as she came home the next day to feed them. They
will not scream or make any noise and they usually hoard a bit anyway, at
least mine did in a corner of the cage...unless the other rat found its
stash :o)
Jessi
"Be yourself, everyone else is already taken" Gilbert Perreira
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Thanks for your reply. My other children are 8, 6 and 3 so yes, the two
eldest could certainly care for the rats when Ashley isn't home. My concern
was that she hadn't made any arrangements to have someone else care for the
wee critters.
Brooke
-------Original Message-------
From: [email protected]
Date: Monday, July 16, 2001 01:44:50 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] Pets!
>subject to the <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/>Yahoo! Terms of Service.Brooke, how old are your other children? Could your daughter make a deal
with one of them that if she is spending the night elsewhere, that they
could feed and water them?
I have had 3 rats in my time and I know that going a night without food is
not a bad thing, as long as she came home the next day to feed them. They
will not scream or make any noise and they usually hoard a bit anyway, at
least mine did in a corner of the cage...unless the other rat found its
stash :o)
Jessi
"Be yourself, everyone else is already taken" Gilbert Perreira
Like Avon? Check out my site! http://www.youravon.com/jspurr
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Brooke
Yes Lynda,
I do tend to agree with you. However I also want to keep giving her
opportunities to care for pets ie I don't want to say "No, three years ago
you didn't look after your kitten and asked me to give it away so now you
can't have any more pets."
But sometimes this house feels like it has a revolving door on it when it
comes to her pets :(
Brooke
-------Original Message-------
From: [email protected]
Date: Monday, July 16, 2001 06:14:57 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] Pets!
Let's see:
Eldest kidlet took care of her horses starting when she was 5. Or at least
she thought she did <g> But the point is that she faithfully did what she
could and never forgot them.
Eldest son took care of his rabbits starting when he was 4 and his goats
when he was 7.
Son #2 had various pets but never did accept the responsibility so he
stopped "owning" any pets. He just never had that "organized" a mind and
would "forget" the pets when he became involved in something else.
Son #3 had lizards, turtles, cats, guinea pigs, rats and birds starting when
he was 3. He did fine with his responsibilities until he discovered girls.
By 17 he had given away most of his pets except for his extremely nasty
tempered chiclid which he still has.
My point being that it is the individual child, not an age. BUT, IMHO, by
age 12 if they want the pet they should be willing to accept the
responsibility or not have the pet.
Lynda
I do tend to agree with you. However I also want to keep giving her
opportunities to care for pets ie I don't want to say "No, three years ago
you didn't look after your kitten and asked me to give it away so now you
can't have any more pets."
But sometimes this house feels like it has a revolving door on it when it
comes to her pets :(
Brooke
-------Original Message-------
From: [email protected]
Date: Monday, July 16, 2001 06:14:57 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] Pets!
Let's see:
Eldest kidlet took care of her horses starting when she was 5. Or at least
she thought she did <g> But the point is that she faithfully did what she
could and never forgot them.
Eldest son took care of his rabbits starting when he was 4 and his goats
when he was 7.
Son #2 had various pets but never did accept the responsibility so he
stopped "owning" any pets. He just never had that "organized" a mind and
would "forget" the pets when he became involved in something else.
Son #3 had lizards, turtles, cats, guinea pigs, rats and birds starting when
he was 3. He did fine with his responsibilities until he discovered girls.
By 17 he had given away most of his pets except for his extremely nasty
tempered chiclid which he still has.
My point being that it is the individual child, not an age. BUT, IMHO, by
age 12 if they want the pet they should be willing to accept the
responsibility or not have the pet.
Lynda
----- Original Message -----
From: Brooke <BrookeNZ@...>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Sunday, July 15, 2001 4:57 PM
Subject: Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] Pets!
> Dear Sandra and all others who replied,
>
> I have no objection at all to her going away overnight or even longer; my
> issue was that she did not make any arrangements to have her brother (8)
or
> sisters care for these vermin...um...dear little members of the family
while
> she was to be away.
>
> I am very happy to help out when required but at almost 12 I do expect
> Ashley to have the foresight to make arrangements for their care and
feeding
> when she is unable to do so. Is that unreasonable??
> ease give me more feedback - what ages do you all think a child can
> reasonably expected to do this level of caring??
>
> Love
> Brooke
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
> Message boards, timely articles, a free newsletter and more!
> Check it all out at: http://www.unschooling.com
>
> To unsubscribe, set preferences, or read archives:
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>
> Another great list sponsored by Home Education Magazine!
> http://www.home-ed-magazine.com
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
Message boards, timely articles, a free newsletter and more!
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Brooke
Dear Bronwen,
Boy did you hit a nerve with this reply! LOL I was so defensive when I read
it that I decided a) I had better wait a couple of days before replying and
b) I had better examine WHY I was so defensive!!
I think you are right, unfortunately. Ashley is almost 12 and since she was
6 has had four puppies (all of whom she asked me to give away as she was
tired of looking after them) three kittens (all of whom she asked me to give
away as she was tired of looking after them) and an aquarium of fish that
she managed to persuade her younger brother he really, really wanted when..
she got tired of looking after them!
I guess I feel like I am torn between letting her learn responsibility and
protecting the animals from being considered as chattels that can be just
passed on when the novelty factor wears off.
I do understand what you are saying about a gentle query being possibly all
that is required. I guess I was just afraid that my fun, positive, gentle
reminders can be misconstrued as "nagging" by a child who no longer has any
interest in doing the necessary task.
Hmmmmmmmmmmm - maybe it is my attitude that needs work!
Thanks for the thoughtful and thought-provoking reply!!
Love
Brooke
-------Original Message-------
From: [email protected]
Date: Wednesday, July 18, 2001 04:41:43 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] Pets!
Hi Brooke :-)
when she is unable to do so.<<
I am thinking that you actually "expect" her to NOT make arrangements-to
drop the ball.
Here is my feedback - forget all of her "history", pretend she is your
friend- not someone you have to "teach responsibility" to, take a deep
breath and then respond. It might sound something like, "Oh, HI! I just
called cause I wasn't sure if the rats had a babysitter- you know me! I'm
just icked out by it!" She might say, "oh shoot! I forgot, hmm..Im so sorry,
um let me talk to dad."
I could make up a bunch of different things you or she might say- but the
point is- you are coming from a perspective of "she just doesnt take
responsibility!" ("expecting" failure) and what really helps (at least in my
experience)is to believe she is and will be responsible and capable.
We are our children's mirrors :-)
Love to you,
Bronwen
Chloe '88
Reed '92
Gordon '00
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Message boards, timely articles, a free newsletter and more!
Check it all out at: http://www.unschooling.com
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Boy did you hit a nerve with this reply! LOL I was so defensive when I read
it that I decided a) I had better wait a couple of days before replying and
b) I had better examine WHY I was so defensive!!
I think you are right, unfortunately. Ashley is almost 12 and since she was
6 has had four puppies (all of whom she asked me to give away as she was
tired of looking after them) three kittens (all of whom she asked me to give
away as she was tired of looking after them) and an aquarium of fish that
she managed to persuade her younger brother he really, really wanted when..
she got tired of looking after them!
I guess I feel like I am torn between letting her learn responsibility and
protecting the animals from being considered as chattels that can be just
passed on when the novelty factor wears off.
I do understand what you are saying about a gentle query being possibly all
that is required. I guess I was just afraid that my fun, positive, gentle
reminders can be misconstrued as "nagging" by a child who no longer has any
interest in doing the necessary task.
Hmmmmmmmmmmm - maybe it is my attitude that needs work!
Thanks for the thoughtful and thought-provoking reply!!
Love
Brooke
-------Original Message-------
From: [email protected]
Date: Wednesday, July 18, 2001 04:41:43 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] Pets!
Hi Brooke :-)
>>I am very happy to help out when required but at almost 12 I do expectAshley to have the foresight to make arrangements for their care and feeding
when she is unable to do so.<<
I am thinking that you actually "expect" her to NOT make arrangements-to
drop the ball.
Here is my feedback - forget all of her "history", pretend she is your
friend- not someone you have to "teach responsibility" to, take a deep
breath and then respond. It might sound something like, "Oh, HI! I just
called cause I wasn't sure if the rats had a babysitter- you know me! I'm
just icked out by it!" She might say, "oh shoot! I forgot, hmm..Im so sorry,
um let me talk to dad."
I could make up a bunch of different things you or she might say- but the
point is- you are coming from a perspective of "she just doesnt take
responsibility!" ("expecting" failure) and what really helps (at least in my
experience)is to believe she is and will be responsible and capable.
We are our children's mirrors :-)
Love to you,
Bronwen
Chloe '88
Reed '92
Gordon '00
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Bronwen
Hi Brooke!
reminders can be misconstrued as "nagging" by a child who no longer has any
interest in doing the necessary task.>>
Totally! I hate being thought of as a nag! I like what Annette said about doing the things herself. I have been thinking alot lately about modeling and chores. How ever can I think our kids are going to like taking care of the house if I just treat it as pure drudgery- "please please help me clean the gross kitchen!!"
I have been concentrating on my attitude- like if I see something that needs to be done- like Chloe weed eated the yard (without me asking!) but she left the weed eater out in the yard and stuff. I thought about yelling, "CHloe you left the weed eater out- just like your dad- never FINISHES things!" (now that sounds polite!) BUt instead, I thought- you know, I am just going to put it away- I am out here already, and I would love to help her- after all she weed eated! Then later I said, " Dont worry, I put away the weed eater for you" She said "oh thanks mom!"
ANyway, I am always saying things like "lets pick up as we go"- "it doesnt matter who made the mess- lets just all pick up"- so then why would I say- "go out there and pick up that weed eater!" When I was just out there?-see I need to attend my own lectures....hee hee
Love,
Bronwen
Chloe '88
Reed '92
Gordon '00
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>>Boy did you hit a nerve with this reply!*oh man! i wrote it maybe too fast cause i was in a hurry- sorry. I love a quote I read once, "attend your own lectures". Usually what I can help people with, I do or have done myself and am trying to stop! (that is what I meant by "in my experience"!)
>>I do understand what you are saying about a gentle query being possibly allthat is required. I guess I was just afraid that my fun, positive, gentle
reminders can be misconstrued as "nagging" by a child who no longer has any
interest in doing the necessary task.>>
Totally! I hate being thought of as a nag! I like what Annette said about doing the things herself. I have been thinking alot lately about modeling and chores. How ever can I think our kids are going to like taking care of the house if I just treat it as pure drudgery- "please please help me clean the gross kitchen!!"
I have been concentrating on my attitude- like if I see something that needs to be done- like Chloe weed eated the yard (without me asking!) but she left the weed eater out in the yard and stuff. I thought about yelling, "CHloe you left the weed eater out- just like your dad- never FINISHES things!" (now that sounds polite!) BUt instead, I thought- you know, I am just going to put it away- I am out here already, and I would love to help her- after all she weed eated! Then later I said, " Dont worry, I put away the weed eater for you" She said "oh thanks mom!"
ANyway, I am always saying things like "lets pick up as we go"- "it doesnt matter who made the mess- lets just all pick up"- so then why would I say- "go out there and pick up that weed eater!" When I was just out there?-see I need to attend my own lectures....hee hee
Love,
Bronwen
Chloe '88
Reed '92
Gordon '00
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Debra Bures
We have 3 dogs and a horse, and my youngest dd (9) wants rats and a goat. We've been to the library a lot and she's been on the internet a lot and has learned quite a bit about rats. I am learning to set aside my sensitivities about the cute little beasties/rodents, and to support her in her interest.
My oldest dd's(13) passion is horses. I don't love horses but I do love my daughter and HER love of horses. She cleans his stall daily, worms him, immunizes him and feeds. And we all help out. there's something magical about being in the barn in the dark... As far as I am concerned, it doesn't get much better than this...
I wonder what the world would be like if we had had the support to follow our dreams and to know what our passions were when we were young....
Debra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
My oldest dd's(13) passion is horses. I don't love horses but I do love my daughter and HER love of horses. She cleans his stall daily, worms him, immunizes him and feeds. And we all help out. there's something magical about being in the barn in the dark... As far as I am concerned, it doesn't get much better than this...
I wonder what the world would be like if we had had the support to follow our dreams and to know what our passions were when we were young....
Debra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Sharon Rudd
Dear Debra
Can you pursue some of your dreams now? Perhaps at
this older age you know what you REALLY have aptitudes
for. You obviously have an aptitude for mothering.
Your children are lucky to have you. And their pets!
We have a horse (two in a few days) a goat (named
Stupid....it is a LOT of bother. She has horns and
the horns are dangerous. She gets her head stuck in
the oddest places, but it is difficult, and dangerous
to get her our. If you get a kid (they are really
really cute, and fairly easy to care for)for a pet, I
would suggest that you get one without horns. I'm no
goat espert, but the horns are a pain. We also have
dogs, cats, rabbits, chickens, ducks and one
cockatiel, and lots of wildlife, which sometimes are
temporary pets.
Sharon
--- Debra Bures <buresfam@...> wrote:
I wonder what the world would be like if we had had
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Can you pursue some of your dreams now? Perhaps at
this older age you know what you REALLY have aptitudes
for. You obviously have an aptitude for mothering.
Your children are lucky to have you. And their pets!
We have a horse (two in a few days) a goat (named
Stupid....it is a LOT of bother. She has horns and
the horns are dangerous. She gets her head stuck in
the oddest places, but it is difficult, and dangerous
to get her our. If you get a kid (they are really
really cute, and fairly easy to care for)for a pet, I
would suggest that you get one without horns. I'm no
goat espert, but the horns are a pain. We also have
dogs, cats, rabbits, chickens, ducks and one
cockatiel, and lots of wildlife, which sometimes are
temporary pets.
Sharon
--- Debra Bures <buresfam@...> wrote:
I wonder what the world would be like if we had had
> the support to follow our dreams and to know what__________________________________________________
> our passions were when we were young....
> Debra
>
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