Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] making everyday life school?
[email protected]
> So, if I understand unschooling (and I'm sure I don't) it is basicallyWell, no, more like the child making everyday things he/she does into a
> making everyday things you do into a "lesson" without ever telling the
> child?
lesson without ever telling you! They quietly learn when you're not looking.
> Like sewing, (I think boys should learn to sew!), cutting outYeah, it's about what *they're* interested in. If that's sewing or kites,
> the pattern, cooking and measuring, building a model kit, kite, craft,
> etc.? It's having them being excited about a piece of history they
> read about and heading to the library to find out more? It's being
> open to what they are interested in at the moment?
fine. If you're interested in those things, do them and you're likely to get
some help, but it's not guaranteed.
> Which brings me to another question. How to teach them spelling,*I* teach spelling by waiting 'til my son asks, "How do you spell (whatever)
> vocabulary, phonograms to help them read.
and then I tell him.
> Are there "tools" you doWe limit TV by not having one, but I don't limit computer time at all. We
> use to help them learn? Do you limit their TV/computer game time?
have no computer games and no sound on our computer, which keeps the noise
level down considerably. ;-)
> Do you go to the library a lot? I guess I'm just having troubleYes, we go to the library a lot (usually--haven't in about 6 weeks though).
> imagineing my kids initiating a "learning experience"! Does
> unschooling put them behind academically? I mean, you want them to be
> able to basic adding and subtracting by a certain age and then
> multiplying and dividing by another age, right?
We have no age by which we expect them to achieve certain milestones. My son
is focused on words and numbers right now, but he also goes months without
thinking of anything but vehicles, which I also respect. I figure he learned
to talk just fine without "lessons."
Quite a different mindset!
:-) Diane
Nicki Clark
Hi everyone - I'm coming out of a loooong lurkdom for a quick intro.
I'm Nicki, mama in Michigan to Dalton (6.5) and Teegan (3.5). I have always
"believed in" unschooling but became unexpectedly single two years ago and
had to rely on childcare and then public school for my oldest child. I am
very grateful to be remarried to a wonderful supportive husband who has
agreed to support my homeschooling. Thankfully my oldest child has somehow
retained a LOT of his innocence despite his public school experience this
past year. He really loves school and has no desire to be taken out of it
but I can't imagine sending him when I don't *have* to and I can REALLY see
the harm that is taking place. I won't pretend he has been unharmed by the
public schools - but the harm that is done is so "typical" that it is seen
by friends and family as "normal growth" and "part of life". In fact, my
Mother (who is my only local relative and very close to my children) will
absolutely FREAK out about the prospects of homeschooling.
I'm challenged to try to maintain a balance with regular public school and
my own desire to unschool for the remainder of the school year. I hate
school <grin>. But Dalton has had another huge learning burst (at home) and
so it's reclaimed my desire to homeschool. He's on some numbers rampage
where he's hungry for learning every combo of ways numbers work and I am
(semi-reluctantly) guiding him. He announced on Friday that his teacher was
retiring (he was supposed to have his teacher 2 years in a row in this
program he is in but now that obviously won't happen even if he stayed in
PS) and I told him that pretty much sealed the homeschool deal and he whined
:-(. I pointed out that he would not even be able to do the math he loves
doing at school in the fall and he said "MOM! There's ALWAYS RECESS!". Like,
DUH! Like I said, he retains a lot of his innocence. He brought his
finger-knitting to his first day of Boy Scouts. He does math he learns at
home during recess and shares it with his friends (which so far has not been
a problem). He is constantly involved in some new home-project or
self-initiated lesson that he feels obligated to bring to school to share
with everyone. I always let him but I've ran into HUGE brick walls with his
teacher and she has literally told him he is not ALLOWED to do certain
things at home (read certain books, in particular). Luckily, so far it seems
his math teacher is more willing to encourage his home learning but his
regular teacher finds it extremely inappropriate. I can't STAND hearing this
child tell me "MOM, I HAVE to do XYZ or my teacher will be soooo mad at me!
She says ever since I started doing things YOUR way, my PERFORMANCE in
READING has DETERIORATED" (gag::choke::spew).
Anyway - that's my story in a nut shell. My Dh is a VERY reluctant supporter
of unschooling but I'm not worried - I know he'll come around. It's still a
faith leap for him but I've been watching it in action since my babies were
born so it is so far very natural for me. I'm just trying to make a
conscious effort to point out the differences and the "learning in action"
and so far that seems helpful.
Can't wait to de-lurk further and join in the discussion :)
Nicki
I'm Nicki, mama in Michigan to Dalton (6.5) and Teegan (3.5). I have always
"believed in" unschooling but became unexpectedly single two years ago and
had to rely on childcare and then public school for my oldest child. I am
very grateful to be remarried to a wonderful supportive husband who has
agreed to support my homeschooling. Thankfully my oldest child has somehow
retained a LOT of his innocence despite his public school experience this
past year. He really loves school and has no desire to be taken out of it
but I can't imagine sending him when I don't *have* to and I can REALLY see
the harm that is taking place. I won't pretend he has been unharmed by the
public schools - but the harm that is done is so "typical" that it is seen
by friends and family as "normal growth" and "part of life". In fact, my
Mother (who is my only local relative and very close to my children) will
absolutely FREAK out about the prospects of homeschooling.
I'm challenged to try to maintain a balance with regular public school and
my own desire to unschool for the remainder of the school year. I hate
school <grin>. But Dalton has had another huge learning burst (at home) and
so it's reclaimed my desire to homeschool. He's on some numbers rampage
where he's hungry for learning every combo of ways numbers work and I am
(semi-reluctantly) guiding him. He announced on Friday that his teacher was
retiring (he was supposed to have his teacher 2 years in a row in this
program he is in but now that obviously won't happen even if he stayed in
PS) and I told him that pretty much sealed the homeschool deal and he whined
:-(. I pointed out that he would not even be able to do the math he loves
doing at school in the fall and he said "MOM! There's ALWAYS RECESS!". Like,
DUH! Like I said, he retains a lot of his innocence. He brought his
finger-knitting to his first day of Boy Scouts. He does math he learns at
home during recess and shares it with his friends (which so far has not been
a problem). He is constantly involved in some new home-project or
self-initiated lesson that he feels obligated to bring to school to share
with everyone. I always let him but I've ran into HUGE brick walls with his
teacher and she has literally told him he is not ALLOWED to do certain
things at home (read certain books, in particular). Luckily, so far it seems
his math teacher is more willing to encourage his home learning but his
regular teacher finds it extremely inappropriate. I can't STAND hearing this
child tell me "MOM, I HAVE to do XYZ or my teacher will be soooo mad at me!
She says ever since I started doing things YOUR way, my PERFORMANCE in
READING has DETERIORATED" (gag::choke::spew).
Anyway - that's my story in a nut shell. My Dh is a VERY reluctant supporter
of unschooling but I'm not worried - I know he'll come around. It's still a
faith leap for him but I've been watching it in action since my babies were
born so it is so far very natural for me. I'm just trying to make a
conscious effort to point out the differences and the "learning in action"
and so far that seems helpful.
Can't wait to de-lurk further and join in the discussion :)
Nicki
Nicki Clark
<<I guess I'm just having trouble
child's interests, especially their passions. Those are almost always
self-initiated learning experiences. Obviously they were exposed to
SOMEthing in life to develop the interest in the first place but it usually
wasn't a unit or lesson or classroom.
For instance, off the bat I can tell you my 3yo is passionate about
dinosaurs and bugs. I did not intentionally expose my child to those things
in the hopes of creating a passion. I exposed him to those things as parts
of life, reading, movies, gardening, whatever. I can't predict what will be
his next passion. When he does develop his new passions at this level I do
not interfere much unless he asks (and he will!). He has a "bug jar" he made
at our homeschooling group's garden that he keeps in his room and spends a
large portion of his day digging silently by himself in the dirt in our yard
finding new creatures and adding them to his jar. Sometimes he'll ask about
a bug and we'll research it a bit. Eventually he'll dump out his jar and let
his friends free and start over. Last month it was worms and he wanted to
see what compost looks like so we kept the worms for a month and then let
them back in our garden. Dinosaurs - same thing. We have tons of books,
videos (Nat'l Geographic has great dino videos), toys and visit every dino
exhibit that comes near our city. I'm not much interested in dinos or bugs
myself :) but his love of learning is contagious and I've learned a lot
through osmosis :). It's also been contagious enough to revitalize a love of
bugs and dinos in my 6yo. But we don't do unit studies on these things or
specifically set of formal learning. We just learn through living, doing,
following what makes sense and what drives us.
Nicki
> imagineing my kids initiating a "learning experience"!One of the things I tell my Dh and others who ask is to think about your
child's interests, especially their passions. Those are almost always
self-initiated learning experiences. Obviously they were exposed to
SOMEthing in life to develop the interest in the first place but it usually
wasn't a unit or lesson or classroom.
For instance, off the bat I can tell you my 3yo is passionate about
dinosaurs and bugs. I did not intentionally expose my child to those things
in the hopes of creating a passion. I exposed him to those things as parts
of life, reading, movies, gardening, whatever. I can't predict what will be
his next passion. When he does develop his new passions at this level I do
not interfere much unless he asks (and he will!). He has a "bug jar" he made
at our homeschooling group's garden that he keeps in his room and spends a
large portion of his day digging silently by himself in the dirt in our yard
finding new creatures and adding them to his jar. Sometimes he'll ask about
a bug and we'll research it a bit. Eventually he'll dump out his jar and let
his friends free and start over. Last month it was worms and he wanted to
see what compost looks like so we kept the worms for a month and then let
them back in our garden. Dinosaurs - same thing. We have tons of books,
videos (Nat'l Geographic has great dino videos), toys and visit every dino
exhibit that comes near our city. I'm not much interested in dinos or bugs
myself :) but his love of learning is contagious and I've learned a lot
through osmosis :). It's also been contagious enough to revitalize a love of
bugs and dinos in my 6yo. But we don't do unit studies on these things or
specifically set of formal learning. We just learn through living, doing,
following what makes sense and what drives us.
Nicki
[email protected]
To Nicki -
I'm a 'lurker' too. But that's only because I didn't find unschooling
to be the best route for my dd (her choice). That said, however, I
think unschooling is great - just not for us. So I come to this list
to listen because I learn new ideas all the time.
You wrote <she has literally told him he is not ALLOWED to do certain
things at home (read certain books, in particular). Luckily, so far
it seems his math teacher is more willing to encourage his home
learning but his regular teacher finds it extremely inappropriate.>
I would go BALLISTIC if a teacher had the audacity to tell my child
what he is or is not allowed to do at home!!!! Unless you're talking
about pornography (which I'm sure you're not), then she has no right
to interfere in your homelife. Even if you're using methods
contradictory to hers. Personally, I would complain to the principal
and the school board about her interference. And this is coming from
a former teacher! So, stick to your ideas and get him home. Once he's
home, he'll enjoy it as much (probably more) than he ever did school.
My dd was unwilling to homeschool too. Now she wouldn't dream of
going to school.
Just my .02 cents.
Jane
I'm a 'lurker' too. But that's only because I didn't find unschooling
to be the best route for my dd (her choice). That said, however, I
think unschooling is great - just not for us. So I come to this list
to listen because I learn new ideas all the time.
You wrote <she has literally told him he is not ALLOWED to do certain
things at home (read certain books, in particular). Luckily, so far
it seems his math teacher is more willing to encourage his home
learning but his regular teacher finds it extremely inappropriate.>
I would go BALLISTIC if a teacher had the audacity to tell my child
what he is or is not allowed to do at home!!!! Unless you're talking
about pornography (which I'm sure you're not), then she has no right
to interfere in your homelife. Even if you're using methods
contradictory to hers. Personally, I would complain to the principal
and the school board about her interference. And this is coming from
a former teacher! So, stick to your ideas and get him home. Once he's
home, he'll enjoy it as much (probably more) than he ever did school.
My dd was unwilling to homeschool too. Now she wouldn't dream of
going to school.
Just my .02 cents.
Jane
--- In Unschooling-dotcom@y..., "Nicki Clark" <nicki@d...> wrote:
> Hi everyone - I'm coming out of a loooong lurkdom for a quick intro.
>
> I'm Nicki, mama in Michigan to Dalton (6.5) and Teegan (3.5). I
have always
> "believed in" unschooling but became unexpectedly single two years
ago and
> had to rely on childcare and then public school for my oldest
child. I am
> very grateful to be remarried to a wonderful supportive husband who
has
> agreed to support my homeschooling. Thankfully my oldest child has
somehow
> retained a LOT of his innocence despite his public school
experience this
> past year. He really loves school and has no desire to be taken out
of it
> but I can't imagine sending him when I don't *have* to and I can
REALLY see
> the harm that is taking place. I won't pretend he has been unharmed
by the
> public schools - but the harm that is done is so "typical" that it
is seen
> by friends and family as "normal growth" and "part of life". In
fact, my
> Mother (who is my only local relative and very close to my
children) will
> absolutely FREAK out about the prospects of homeschooling.
>
> I'm challenged to try to maintain a balance with regular public
school and
> my own desire to unschool for the remainder of the school year. I
hate
> school <grin>. But Dalton has had another huge learning burst (at
home) and
> so it's reclaimed my desire to homeschool. He's on some numbers
rampage
> where he's hungry for learning every combo of ways numbers work and
I am
> (semi-reluctantly) guiding him. He announced on Friday that his
teacher was
> retiring (he was supposed to have his teacher 2 years in a row in
this
> program he is in but now that obviously won't happen even if he
stayed in
> PS) and I told him that pretty much sealed the homeschool deal and
he whined
> :-(. I pointed out that he would not even be able to do the math he
loves
> doing at school in the fall and he said "MOM! There's ALWAYS
RECESS!". Like,
> DUH! Like I said, he retains a lot of his innocence. He brought his
> finger-knitting to his first day of Boy Scouts. He does math he
learns at
> home during recess and shares it with his friends (which so far has
not been
> a problem). He is constantly involved in some new home-project or
> self-initiated lesson that he feels obligated to bring to school to
share
> with everyone. I always let him but I've ran into HUGE brick walls
with his
> teacher and she has literally told him he is not ALLOWED to do
certain
> things at home (read certain books, in particular). Luckily, so far
it seems
> his math teacher is more willing to encourage his home learning but
his
> regular teacher finds it extremely inappropriate. I can't STAND
hearing this
> child tell me "MOM, I HAVE to do XYZ or my teacher will be soooo
mad at me!
> She says ever since I started doing things YOUR way, my PERFORMANCE
in
> READING has DETERIORATED" (gag::choke::spew).
>
> Anyway - that's my story in a nut shell. My Dh is a VERY reluctant
supporter
> of unschooling but I'm not worried - I know he'll come around. It's
still a
> faith leap for him but I've been watching it in action since my
babies were
> born so it is so far very natural for me. I'm just trying to make a
> conscious effort to point out the differences and the "learning in
action"
> and so far that seems helpful.
>
> Can't wait to de-lurk further and join in the discussion :)
>
> Nicki
Tracy Oldfield
I'm challenged to try to maintain a balance with
regular public school and
my own desire to unschool for the remainder of the
school year. I hate
school <grin>. But Dalton has had another huge learning
burst (at home) and
so it's reclaimed my desire to homeschool. He's on some
numbers rampage
where he's hungry for learning every combo of ways
numbers work and I am
(semi-reluctantly) guiding him. He announced on Friday
that his teacher was
retiring (he was supposed to have his teacher 2 years
in a row in this
program he is in but now that obviously won't happen
even if he stayed in
PS) and I told him that pretty much sealed the
homeschool deal and he whined
:-(.
Can you take the POV that he's an unschooler with a
very time-comsuming hobby, ie going to school?! Just a
thought...
Tracy
regular public school and
my own desire to unschool for the remainder of the
school year. I hate
school <grin>. But Dalton has had another huge learning
burst (at home) and
so it's reclaimed my desire to homeschool. He's on some
numbers rampage
where he's hungry for learning every combo of ways
numbers work and I am
(semi-reluctantly) guiding him. He announced on Friday
that his teacher was
retiring (he was supposed to have his teacher 2 years
in a row in this
program he is in but now that obviously won't happen
even if he stayed in
PS) and I told him that pretty much sealed the
homeschool deal and he whined
:-(.
Can you take the POV that he's an unschooler with a
very time-comsuming hobby, ie going to school?! Just a
thought...
Tracy
Nicki Clark
<<Can you take the POV that he's an unschooler with a
very time-comsuming hobby, ie going to school?! Just a
thought...>>
Thanks Tracy...lol. Yeah, he says every morning "Bye, Mom...see you in 7
hours". No, I'm not kidding. This is his regular goodbye for us. He thinks
this is cool, I think it's terrifying. Especially last week when my 3yo
slept peacefully in my bed during a tornado that *I* knew was way north of
us while my 6yo was hovering in a restroom wondering if his school was going
to be demolished by a tornado for an hour.
It would be much easier to take this POV if the teachers were supportive but
they act VERY taken aback or challenged or insulted or something. I refuse
to speak to them about it because frankly it is none of their business. But
I'm afraid I am becoming rather adversarial and have even stooped to telling
Dalton that these are people we hire to do a job for us - not parent my
children or tell me how I can spend my spare time with my kids.
The case in point that I referred to, by the way, was that my son was having
trouble progressing with his reading. I had an epiphany that perhaps he
should read just in his head, develop an actual (gasp) enjoyment of reading
and then his reading would progress. Well - this worked for exactly two days
when he came home announcing that his teacher forbade him from reading the
books I picked out (Amelia Bedlia of all things) because they were "too
advanced" for him and now he will not read at all. I fought and fought but
it will just be one of those things that can wait. He needs to be
de-schooled because right now he firmly believes that his teacher is the
word of God and the end all be all of learning. She has more power in my own
home than I have and that is just messed up. Like someone said - it's not
like I'm exposing him to porn. It was Amelia Bedilia. Finally, the teacher
backed down and agreed he could read those books *as long as* he was reading
them - out loud - to me. He was specifically NOT allowed to read in his
head. I will not even go into how totally absurd this is. I mean WHO the
hell (besides people who record audio books for a living) needs to be
proficient readers out loud. He spends SO much time trying to get
intonation, fluency and emphasis correct that progress is totally lost (as
is enjoyment - the real issue to me). Take away fluency, intonation and
proper emphasis and he's a GREAT little reader who (for awhile anyway -
until his teacher brainwashed him) really enjoyed reading and had full
comprehension. Isn't that the goal? Sheesh.
Nicki
very time-comsuming hobby, ie going to school?! Just a
thought...>>
Thanks Tracy...lol. Yeah, he says every morning "Bye, Mom...see you in 7
hours". No, I'm not kidding. This is his regular goodbye for us. He thinks
this is cool, I think it's terrifying. Especially last week when my 3yo
slept peacefully in my bed during a tornado that *I* knew was way north of
us while my 6yo was hovering in a restroom wondering if his school was going
to be demolished by a tornado for an hour.
It would be much easier to take this POV if the teachers were supportive but
they act VERY taken aback or challenged or insulted or something. I refuse
to speak to them about it because frankly it is none of their business. But
I'm afraid I am becoming rather adversarial and have even stooped to telling
Dalton that these are people we hire to do a job for us - not parent my
children or tell me how I can spend my spare time with my kids.
The case in point that I referred to, by the way, was that my son was having
trouble progressing with his reading. I had an epiphany that perhaps he
should read just in his head, develop an actual (gasp) enjoyment of reading
and then his reading would progress. Well - this worked for exactly two days
when he came home announcing that his teacher forbade him from reading the
books I picked out (Amelia Bedlia of all things) because they were "too
advanced" for him and now he will not read at all. I fought and fought but
it will just be one of those things that can wait. He needs to be
de-schooled because right now he firmly believes that his teacher is the
word of God and the end all be all of learning. She has more power in my own
home than I have and that is just messed up. Like someone said - it's not
like I'm exposing him to porn. It was Amelia Bedilia. Finally, the teacher
backed down and agreed he could read those books *as long as* he was reading
them - out loud - to me. He was specifically NOT allowed to read in his
head. I will not even go into how totally absurd this is. I mean WHO the
hell (besides people who record audio books for a living) needs to be
proficient readers out loud. He spends SO much time trying to get
intonation, fluency and emphasis correct that progress is totally lost (as
is enjoyment - the real issue to me). Take away fluency, intonation and
proper emphasis and he's a GREAT little reader who (for awhile anyway -
until his teacher brainwashed him) really enjoyed reading and had full
comprehension. Isn't that the goal? Sheesh.
Nicki
Tracy Oldfield
It would be much easier to take this POV if the
teachers were supportive but
they act VERY taken aback or challenged or insulted or
something. I refuse
to speak to them about it because frankly it is none of
their business. But
I'm afraid I am becoming rather adversarial and have
even stooped to telling
Dalton that these are people we hire to do a job for us
- not parent my
children or tell me how I can spend my spare time with
my kids.
The case in point that I referred to, by the way, was
that my son was having
trouble progressing with his reading. I had an epiphany
that perhaps he
should read just in his head, develop an actual (gasp)
enjoyment of reading
and then his reading would progress. Well - this worked
for exactly two days
when he came home announcing that his teacher forbade
him from reading the
books I picked out (Amelia Bedlia of all things)
because they were "too
advanced" for him and now he will not read at all. I
fought and fought but
it will just be one of those things that can wait. He
needs to be
de-schooled because right now he firmly believes that
his teacher is the
word of God and the end all be all of learning. She has
more power in my own
home than I have and that is just messed up. Like
someone said - it's not
like I'm exposing him to porn. It was Amelia Bedilia.
Finally, the teacher
backed down and agreed he could read those books *as
long as* he was reading
them - out loud - to me. He was specifically NOT
allowed to read in his
head. I will not even go into how totally absurd this
is. I mean WHO the
hell (besides people who record audio books for a
living) needs to be
proficient readers out loud. He spends SO much time
trying to get
intonation, fluency and emphasis correct that progress
is totally lost (as
is enjoyment - the real issue to me). Take away
fluency, intonation and
proper emphasis and he's a GREAT little reader who (for
awhile anyway -
until his teacher brainwashed him) really enjoyed
reading and had full
comprehension. Isn't that the goal? Sheesh.
Nicki
UGH! Don't know about stooping, sounds like you're
standing proud to tell your son that this woman is no
more special than a bus-driver or shop-assistant or
anything, she's there to be an adult presence in a room
full of small children and try to teach them what she
knows, which may or may not be useful to any of the
children in the room. Scary. A friend of mine had a
similar situation, pulled younger children out but
eldest wouldn't leave, child seriously needs
deschooling, de-peer-orienting too, btw.
I never had that problem, despite being an early
reader. Though I do have a tendency to believe
everything I read, which I've heard is common among
'earlies'
Bet you're looking forward to the Summer...
Tracy
teachers were supportive but
they act VERY taken aback or challenged or insulted or
something. I refuse
to speak to them about it because frankly it is none of
their business. But
I'm afraid I am becoming rather adversarial and have
even stooped to telling
Dalton that these are people we hire to do a job for us
- not parent my
children or tell me how I can spend my spare time with
my kids.
The case in point that I referred to, by the way, was
that my son was having
trouble progressing with his reading. I had an epiphany
that perhaps he
should read just in his head, develop an actual (gasp)
enjoyment of reading
and then his reading would progress. Well - this worked
for exactly two days
when he came home announcing that his teacher forbade
him from reading the
books I picked out (Amelia Bedlia of all things)
because they were "too
advanced" for him and now he will not read at all. I
fought and fought but
it will just be one of those things that can wait. He
needs to be
de-schooled because right now he firmly believes that
his teacher is the
word of God and the end all be all of learning. She has
more power in my own
home than I have and that is just messed up. Like
someone said - it's not
like I'm exposing him to porn. It was Amelia Bedilia.
Finally, the teacher
backed down and agreed he could read those books *as
long as* he was reading
them - out loud - to me. He was specifically NOT
allowed to read in his
head. I will not even go into how totally absurd this
is. I mean WHO the
hell (besides people who record audio books for a
living) needs to be
proficient readers out loud. He spends SO much time
trying to get
intonation, fluency and emphasis correct that progress
is totally lost (as
is enjoyment - the real issue to me). Take away
fluency, intonation and
proper emphasis and he's a GREAT little reader who (for
awhile anyway -
until his teacher brainwashed him) really enjoyed
reading and had full
comprehension. Isn't that the goal? Sheesh.
Nicki
UGH! Don't know about stooping, sounds like you're
standing proud to tell your son that this woman is no
more special than a bus-driver or shop-assistant or
anything, she's there to be an adult presence in a room
full of small children and try to teach them what she
knows, which may or may not be useful to any of the
children in the room. Scary. A friend of mine had a
similar situation, pulled younger children out but
eldest wouldn't leave, child seriously needs
deschooling, de-peer-orienting too, btw.
I never had that problem, despite being an early
reader. Though I do have a tendency to believe
everything I read, which I've heard is common among
'earlies'
Bet you're looking forward to the Summer...
Tracy
Laura Yolo
So Nicki, how long till school is out where you are?
:)What is wrong with these people? I'm sure your ds
will be quite happy at home once he's been away from
school for awhile. Good luck holding your tongue till
the end of the year, I remember feeling the same way
by the end of the year last year. And I still feel
like the worst/wrong decision I ever made was to let
my 9yo ds attend ps for 1st and 2nd grade. It was a
damaging experience for him and he and I still need to
be "de-schooled" for lack of a better word, but we're
working on it.
=====
Laura, blessed to be the mommy of
Jenny 11/6/85
Shaw 5/22/87
Ryan 7/9/89
Noah 3/9/92
Aidan 1/24/00
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Auctions - buy the things you want at great prices
http://auctions.yahoo.com/
:)What is wrong with these people? I'm sure your ds
will be quite happy at home once he's been away from
school for awhile. Good luck holding your tongue till
the end of the year, I remember feeling the same way
by the end of the year last year. And I still feel
like the worst/wrong decision I ever made was to let
my 9yo ds attend ps for 1st and 2nd grade. It was a
damaging experience for him and he and I still need to
be "de-schooled" for lack of a better word, but we're
working on it.
=====
Laura, blessed to be the mommy of
Jenny 11/6/85
Shaw 5/22/87
Ryan 7/9/89
Noah 3/9/92
Aidan 1/24/00
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Auctions - buy the things you want at great prices
http://auctions.yahoo.com/
[email protected]
To Nicki -
WHY hold your tongue? Tell that teacher (in no uncertain, non-abusive
words) to 'back off'. Your son will be allowed to 'read in his head'
at home whether she likes it or not. If it wasn't so close to the end
of school, then you should request a change in classes. (This, of
course, is only IF you were leaving him in ps which I hope you're not
going to do.)
I am absolutely amazed that most people assume they have no rights in
schools. I guess it's part of the brainwashing still working in
adulthood. Every parent should be able to stand up for what they
believe is right for their child.
Hang in there, hold your head high and speak your mind. What possible
harm can that teacher do to you? Ask you to take your son out of
school? Gladly!
Jane
WHY hold your tongue? Tell that teacher (in no uncertain, non-abusive
words) to 'back off'. Your son will be allowed to 'read in his head'
at home whether she likes it or not. If it wasn't so close to the end
of school, then you should request a change in classes. (This, of
course, is only IF you were leaving him in ps which I hope you're not
going to do.)
I am absolutely amazed that most people assume they have no rights in
schools. I guess it's part of the brainwashing still working in
adulthood. Every parent should be able to stand up for what they
believe is right for their child.
Hang in there, hold your head high and speak your mind. What possible
harm can that teacher do to you? Ask you to take your son out of
school? Gladly!
Jane
--- In Unschooling-dotcom@y..., Laura Yolo <ljyolo@y...> wrote:
> So Nicki, how long till school is out where you are?
> :)What is wrong with these people? I'm sure your ds
> will be quite happy at home once he's been away from
> school for awhile. Good luck holding your tongue till
> the end of the year, I remember feeling the same way
> by the end of the year last year. And I still feel
> like the worst/wrong decision I ever made was to let
> my 9yo ds attend ps for 1st and 2nd grade. It was a
> damaging experience for him and he and I still need to
> be "de-schooled" for lack of a better word, but we're
> working on it.
>
>
>
> =====
> Laura, blessed to be the mommy of
> Jenny 11/6/85
> Shaw 5/22/87
> Ryan 7/9/89
> Noah 3/9/92
> Aidan 1/24/00
>
> __________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Auctions - buy the things you want at great prices
> http://auctions.yahoo.com/
Nicki Clark
<<WHY hold your tongue?>>
Well, it's not for lack of rights. It's because I view the PS system as
unchangeable, a failed system. If I actually thought I'd see change, I might
devote more of my time to the PS system because I *do* consider it to be an
important system for the large majority of the country. I've always thought
I'd be one of those parents who homeschools but also keeps a strong arm in
the local PS to be proactive in change on that end too. I didn't want to be
one of the "whiners" who talks about all that is wrong with the PS system
but doesn't bother to do anything to change it. But what I've grown to
believe is that the system is flawed for far too many reasons and that large
enough change to make PS an enriching growth experience for all simply is a
joke. It can't be done. I could still fight for the sake of fighting - just
so I could *say* that I'm being proactive. But that would take precious time
and energy away from our family and for what? For nothing. Instead, I
consider PS to be a lost cause. I try not to "whine" about how PS is so
doomed and all the problems inherent to it because I am NOT willing to be
proactive in change. Instead of just believe what I believe in choose to
spend my time focused on my children.
I did struggle long and hard and had many conversations with my dh about
what to do in terms of that particular situation at my son's school and
decided that it simply was not worth fighting for change. At MOST it would
get THIS teacher to tip-toe around MY child. But a much more important fight
worth fighting, in my opinion, is the fight to get my own child to see that
his worth is not dictated by this or any other adult. That his abilities are
something internal to him that only he is in control of and that certainly
no teacher whose salary WE pay can "be mad at him" or make him otherwise
feel bad or blue for not agreeing to do things HER way. I can most easily
change HIS view of the PS system and put it in perspective. I can NOT change
the entire PS world's view of my child. It is just an impossible (and moot)
battle with too much wasted misguided energy.
<<I am absolutely amazed that most people assume they have no rights in
schools.>>
And at the doctor's office :) It's the same mentality - that these people we
PAY to do a SERVICE for us are somehow in charge and can dictate what we do
and how we do it and when and can make us feel like crap. We PAY for
that?!!?!?
Nicki
Well, it's not for lack of rights. It's because I view the PS system as
unchangeable, a failed system. If I actually thought I'd see change, I might
devote more of my time to the PS system because I *do* consider it to be an
important system for the large majority of the country. I've always thought
I'd be one of those parents who homeschools but also keeps a strong arm in
the local PS to be proactive in change on that end too. I didn't want to be
one of the "whiners" who talks about all that is wrong with the PS system
but doesn't bother to do anything to change it. But what I've grown to
believe is that the system is flawed for far too many reasons and that large
enough change to make PS an enriching growth experience for all simply is a
joke. It can't be done. I could still fight for the sake of fighting - just
so I could *say* that I'm being proactive. But that would take precious time
and energy away from our family and for what? For nothing. Instead, I
consider PS to be a lost cause. I try not to "whine" about how PS is so
doomed and all the problems inherent to it because I am NOT willing to be
proactive in change. Instead of just believe what I believe in choose to
spend my time focused on my children.
I did struggle long and hard and had many conversations with my dh about
what to do in terms of that particular situation at my son's school and
decided that it simply was not worth fighting for change. At MOST it would
get THIS teacher to tip-toe around MY child. But a much more important fight
worth fighting, in my opinion, is the fight to get my own child to see that
his worth is not dictated by this or any other adult. That his abilities are
something internal to him that only he is in control of and that certainly
no teacher whose salary WE pay can "be mad at him" or make him otherwise
feel bad or blue for not agreeing to do things HER way. I can most easily
change HIS view of the PS system and put it in perspective. I can NOT change
the entire PS world's view of my child. It is just an impossible (and moot)
battle with too much wasted misguided energy.
<<I am absolutely amazed that most people assume they have no rights in
schools.>>
And at the doctor's office :) It's the same mentality - that these people we
PAY to do a SERVICE for us are somehow in charge and can dictate what we do
and how we do it and when and can make us feel like crap. We PAY for
that?!!?!?
Nicki
[email protected]
Nicki -
I absolutely agree with you. And I know that speaking up will
probably not change this teacher or the school or the system.
However, if a bully was abusing your son, wouldn't you stand up and
say something? Knowing full well that the bully probably won't get
the message? This teacher is a legitimized bully to your son. So I'm
glad that you're getting him out of that situation.
Although it may seem that none of our 'stands' would make any
difference, I think people still need to voice their concerns, their
rights and insist on them. For instance, although not many of us
question our doctors, there is a growing flood of people willing to
address their concerns, challenge their doctors, and expect better
care where years before they would never have even thought to
question. Change - even slow, slow change - has to start with
something; some small gesture.
Had a teacher been unwilling to give me their curriculum outline at
the beginning of the school year, I would have run straight to the
principal and/or the school board and demanded it. But that's me and
maybe it's because I'm a former teacher and know how the system is
and school's don't intimidate me.
My dd was in school for 4 years before we started homeschooling. And
the schools and the teachers knew me and what I expected out of the
school and them. And I got it. Not so much because I 'knew the ropes'
but because I was persistent. Of course, I was known as 'that
mother' and, I'm sure, worse names. But that's a small price to pay
for the results.
I'm not trying to criticize you. I think you've done well and will
love homeschooling.
We didn't leave the system for homeschooling; we really just kind of
fell into it and now love it. Good luck to you.
Jane
I absolutely agree with you. And I know that speaking up will
probably not change this teacher or the school or the system.
However, if a bully was abusing your son, wouldn't you stand up and
say something? Knowing full well that the bully probably won't get
the message? This teacher is a legitimized bully to your son. So I'm
glad that you're getting him out of that situation.
Although it may seem that none of our 'stands' would make any
difference, I think people still need to voice their concerns, their
rights and insist on them. For instance, although not many of us
question our doctors, there is a growing flood of people willing to
address their concerns, challenge their doctors, and expect better
care where years before they would never have even thought to
question. Change - even slow, slow change - has to start with
something; some small gesture.
Had a teacher been unwilling to give me their curriculum outline at
the beginning of the school year, I would have run straight to the
principal and/or the school board and demanded it. But that's me and
maybe it's because I'm a former teacher and know how the system is
and school's don't intimidate me.
My dd was in school for 4 years before we started homeschooling. And
the schools and the teachers knew me and what I expected out of the
school and them. And I got it. Not so much because I 'knew the ropes'
but because I was persistent. Of course, I was known as 'that
mother' and, I'm sure, worse names. But that's a small price to pay
for the results.
I'm not trying to criticize you. I think you've done well and will
love homeschooling.
We didn't leave the system for homeschooling; we really just kind of
fell into it and now love it. Good luck to you.
Jane
--- In Unschooling-dotcom@y..., "Nicki Clark" <nicki@d...> wrote:
> <<WHY hold your tongue?>>
>
> Well, it's not for lack of rights. It's because I view the PS
system as
> unchangeable, a failed system. If I actually thought I'd see
change, I might
> devote more of my time to the PS system because I *do* consider it
to be an
> important system for the large majority of the country. I've always
thought
> I'd be one of those parents who homeschools but also keeps a strong
arm in
> the local PS to be proactive in change on that end too. I didn't
want to be
> one of the "whiners" who talks about all that is wrong with the PS
system
> but doesn't bother to do anything to change it. But what I've grown
to
> believe is that the system is flawed for far too many reasons and
that large
> enough change to make PS an enriching growth experience for all
simply is a
> joke. It can't be done. I could still fight for the sake of
fighting - just
> so I could *say* that I'm being proactive. But that would take
precious time
> and energy away from our family and for what? For nothing. Instead,
I
> consider PS to be a lost cause. I try not to "whine" about how PS
is so
> doomed and all the problems inherent to it because I am NOT willing
to be
> proactive in change. Instead of just believe what I believe in
choose to
> spend my time focused on my children.
>
> I did struggle long and hard and had many conversations with my dh
about
> what to do in terms of that particular situation at my son's school
and
> decided that it simply was not worth fighting for change. At MOST
it would
> get THIS teacher to tip-toe around MY child. But a much more
important fight
> worth fighting, in my opinion, is the fight to get my own child to
see that
> his worth is not dictated by this or any other adult. That his
abilities are
> something internal to him that only he is in control of and that
certainly
> no teacher whose salary WE pay can "be mad at him" or make him
otherwise
> feel bad or blue for not agreeing to do things HER way. I can most
easily
> change HIS view of the PS system and put it in perspective. I can
NOT change
> the entire PS world's view of my child. It is just an impossible
(and moot)
> battle with too much wasted misguided energy.
>
> <<I am absolutely amazed that most people assume they have no
rights in
> schools.>>
>
> And at the doctor's office :) It's the same mentality - that these
people we
> PAY to do a SERVICE for us are somehow in charge and can dictate
what we do
> and how we do it and when and can make us feel like crap. We PAY for
> that?!!?!?
>
> Nicki
Tracy Oldfield
To Nicki -
WHY hold your tongue? Tell that teacher (in no
uncertain, non-abusive
words) to 'back off'. Your son will be allowed to 'read
in his head'
at home whether she likes it or not. If it wasn't so
close to the end
of school, then you should request a change in classes.
(This, of
course, is only IF you were leaving him in ps which I
hope you're not
going to do.)
I am absolutely amazed that most people assume they
have no rights in
schools. I guess it's part of the brainwashing still
working in
adulthood. Every parent should be able to stand up for
what they
believe is right for their child.
Hang in there, hold your head high and speak your mind.
What possible
harm can that teacher do to you? Ask you to take your
son out of
school? Gladly!
Jane
Seconded, and use your best arguments and do so in
front of your son, so that he knows how important it is
to you that he learns things his way and that the
teacher is not exempt from being told how not to do
stuff :-)
Tracy
WHY hold your tongue? Tell that teacher (in no
uncertain, non-abusive
words) to 'back off'. Your son will be allowed to 'read
in his head'
at home whether she likes it or not. If it wasn't so
close to the end
of school, then you should request a change in classes.
(This, of
course, is only IF you were leaving him in ps which I
hope you're not
going to do.)
I am absolutely amazed that most people assume they
have no rights in
schools. I guess it's part of the brainwashing still
working in
adulthood. Every parent should be able to stand up for
what they
believe is right for their child.
Hang in there, hold your head high and speak your mind.
What possible
harm can that teacher do to you? Ask you to take your
son out of
school? Gladly!
Jane
Seconded, and use your best arguments and do so in
front of your son, so that he knows how important it is
to you that he learns things his way and that the
teacher is not exempt from being told how not to do
stuff :-)
Tracy