Re: cesarean birth
[email protected]
Yeah for all us VBAC's!
Re: heparin lock
I just didn't want to have a needle stuck in my arm while I was having a
baby. This was 5 1/2 years ago. They (the medical establishment) said I
should have the hep lock in place in case my uterus ruptured during
labor, that I was more at risk for that because of the previous cesarean.
Well, I did some research. Uterine rupture is incredibly rare and is
not more likely in women who have had a cesarean, especially with low
horizontal cuts. The hep lock is supposed to provide instant access to
an IV. But, you can have a hep lock and the vein behind it can collapse,
so that wouldn't guarantee IV access after all. In emergencies, an IV
can be placed in the scalp or somewhere in the neck (can't remember -
clavicle vein or something?) I figured that in the event I became
unconscious because of a hemmoraghe (sp) from uterine rupture, I
certainly would not care where they stuck the IV! And I knew it was very
highly UNlikely for that to happen anyway.
Mary Ellen
The other day, she caught herself about to tell someone
her hair looked nice on the phone.
Re: heparin lock
I just didn't want to have a needle stuck in my arm while I was having a
baby. This was 5 1/2 years ago. They (the medical establishment) said I
should have the hep lock in place in case my uterus ruptured during
labor, that I was more at risk for that because of the previous cesarean.
Well, I did some research. Uterine rupture is incredibly rare and is
not more likely in women who have had a cesarean, especially with low
horizontal cuts. The hep lock is supposed to provide instant access to
an IV. But, you can have a hep lock and the vein behind it can collapse,
so that wouldn't guarantee IV access after all. In emergencies, an IV
can be placed in the scalp or somewhere in the neck (can't remember -
clavicle vein or something?) I figured that in the event I became
unconscious because of a hemmoraghe (sp) from uterine rupture, I
certainly would not care where they stuck the IV! And I knew it was very
highly UNlikely for that to happen anyway.
Mary Ellen
The other day, she caught herself about to tell someone
her hair looked nice on the phone.
Lynda
Well, as someone who coded and technically bled to death having kidlet #1, I
can vouch for the fact that they can find veins and I don't have good veins
to begin with.
Everything now is about plan for the absolute worst possible scenerio and
make things as easy as possible for the docs and who cares about the mother
and her comfort, etc.!
Lynda
can vouch for the fact that they can find veins and I don't have good veins
to begin with.
Everything now is about plan for the absolute worst possible scenerio and
make things as easy as possible for the docs and who cares about the mother
and her comfort, etc.!
Lynda
----- Original Message -----
From: <megates@...>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Monday, April 09, 2001 8:27 AM
Subject: [Unschooling-dotcom] Re: cesarean birth
> Yeah for all us VBAC's!
>
> Re: heparin lock
>
> I just didn't want to have a needle stuck in my arm while I was having a
> baby. This was 5 1/2 years ago. They (the medical establishment) said I
> should have the hep lock in place in case my uterus ruptured during
> labor, that I was more at risk for that because of the previous cesarean.
> Well, I did some research. Uterine rupture is incredibly rare and is
> not more likely in women who have had a cesarean, especially with low
> horizontal cuts. The hep lock is supposed to provide instant access to
> an IV. But, you can have a hep lock and the vein behind it can collapse,
> so that wouldn't guarantee IV access after all. In emergencies, an IV
> can be placed in the scalp or somewhere in the neck (can't remember -
> clavicle vein or something?) I figured that in the event I became
> unconscious because of a hemmoraghe (sp) from uterine rupture, I
> certainly would not care where they stuck the IV! And I knew it was very
> highly UNlikely for that to happen anyway.
>
> Mary Ellen
> The other day, she caught herself about to tell someone
> her hair looked nice on the phone.
>
>
> Message boards, timely articles, a free newsletter and more!
> Check it all out at: http://www.unschooling.com
>
> Addresses:
> Post message: [email protected]
> Unsubscribe: [email protected]
> List owner: [email protected]
> List settings page: http://www.egroups.com/group/Unschooling-dotcom
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
Nancy from MI
Well, I had a hep lock and it was no big deal. No pain --- and I felt
very good about only getting poked once. I have lots of problems with
much that doctor's do, but a hep lock, in my opinion, is a postive
thing. A hep lock MAY be seen as a convenience for the doc
or midwife, or preparation for the worse case scenario, but what's
wrong with a bit of caution? I felt better knowing it was there, just
in case.
(Sorry to stray so far off from unschooling!)
~Nancy
very good about only getting poked once. I have lots of problems with
much that doctor's do, but a hep lock, in my opinion, is a postive
thing. A hep lock MAY be seen as a convenience for the doc
or midwife, or preparation for the worse case scenario, but what's
wrong with a bit of caution? I felt better knowing it was there, just
in case.
(Sorry to stray so far off from unschooling!)
~Nancy
--- In Unschooling-dotcom@y..., "Lynda" <lurine@s...> wrote:
> Well, as someone who coded and technically bled to death having
kidlet #1, I
> can vouch for the fact that they can find veins and I don't have
good veins
> to begin with.
>
> Everything now is about plan for the absolute worst possible
scenerio and
> make things as easy as possible for the docs and who cares about the
mother
> and her comfort, etc.!
>
> Lynda
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <megates@j...>
> To: <Unschooling-dotcom@y...>
> Sent: Monday, April 09, 2001 8:27 AM
> Subject: [Unschooling-dotcom] Re: cesarean birth
>
>
> > Yeah for all us VBAC's!
> >
> > Re: heparin lock
> >
> > I just didn't want to have a needle stuck in my arm while I was
having a
> > baby. This was 5 1/2 years ago. They (the medical establishment)
said I
> > should have the hep lock in place in case my uterus ruptured
during
> > labor, that I was more at risk for that because of the previous
cesarean.
> > Well, I did some research. Uterine rupture is incredibly rare
and is
> > not more likely in women who have had a cesarean, especially with
low
> > horizontal cuts. The hep lock is supposed to provide instant
access to
> > an IV. But, you can have a hep lock and the vein behind it can
collapse,
> > so that wouldn't guarantee IV access after all. In emergencies,
an IV
> > can be placed in the scalp or somewhere in the neck (can't
remember -
> > clavicle vein or something?) I figured that in the event I became
> > unconscious because of a hemmoraghe (sp) from uterine rupture, I
> > certainly would not care where they stuck the IV! And I knew it
was very
> > highly UNlikely for that to happen anyway.
> >
> > Mary Ellen
> > The other day, she caught herself about to tell someone
> > her hair looked nice on the phone.
> >
> >
> > Message boards, timely articles, a free newsletter and more!
> > Check it all out at: http://www.unschooling.com
> >
> > Addresses:
> > Post message: [email protected]
> > Unsubscribe: [email protected]
> > List owner: [email protected]
> > List settings page:
http://www.egroups.com/group/Unschooling-dotcom
> >
> >
> > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> >
> >
Tracy Oldfield
Well, I had a hep lock and it was no big deal. No pain -
-- and I felt
very good about only getting poked once. I have lots of
problems with
much that doctor's do, but a hep lock, in my opinion,
is a postive
thing. A hep lock MAY be seen as a convenience for the
doc
or midwife, or preparation for the worse case scenario,
but what's
wrong with a bit of caution? I felt better knowing it
was there, just
in case.
(Sorry to stray so far off from unschooling!)
~Nancy
Are we talking about the little plastic gadget like a
tap, that gets stuck in a vein? Well I wouldn't want
one for a 'natural' birth in hospital, partly because
it adds to the medicalisation of the process (the
mother being seen as a patient rather than a woman
giving birth) and partly because the last time I had
one it was stuck on the inside of my elbow and not
taken out for a couple of days. so I couldn't move that
arm. It hurt like hell and I had a huge bruise
afterwards. But then the doc who put it in was
clueless, he tried one that was too big at first...
JME :-)
Tracy
-- and I felt
very good about only getting poked once. I have lots of
problems with
much that doctor's do, but a hep lock, in my opinion,
is a postive
thing. A hep lock MAY be seen as a convenience for the
doc
or midwife, or preparation for the worse case scenario,
but what's
wrong with a bit of caution? I felt better knowing it
was there, just
in case.
(Sorry to stray so far off from unschooling!)
~Nancy
Are we talking about the little plastic gadget like a
tap, that gets stuck in a vein? Well I wouldn't want
one for a 'natural' birth in hospital, partly because
it adds to the medicalisation of the process (the
mother being seen as a patient rather than a woman
giving birth) and partly because the last time I had
one it was stuck on the inside of my elbow and not
taken out for a couple of days. so I couldn't move that
arm. It hurt like hell and I had a huge bruise
afterwards. But then the doc who put it in was
clueless, he tried one that was too big at first...
JME :-)
Tracy
Nancy from MI
Tracy:
Ouch! I feel bad for you! I guess everyone's "hep lock" experience is
as different as everyone's labor and delivery experience.
~Nancy
--- In Unschooling-dotcom@y..., "Tracy Oldfield" <tracy.oldfield@n...>
wrote:
Ouch! I feel bad for you! I guess everyone's "hep lock" experience is
as different as everyone's labor and delivery experience.
~Nancy
--- In Unschooling-dotcom@y..., "Tracy Oldfield" <tracy.oldfield@n...>
wrote:
> Well, I had a hep lock and it was no big deal. No pain -
> -- and I felt
> very good about only getting poked once. I have lots of
> problems with
> much that doctor's do, but a hep lock, in my opinion,
> is a postive
> thing. A hep lock MAY be seen as a convenience for the
> doc
> or midwife, or preparation for the worse case scenario,
> but what's
> wrong with a bit of caution? I felt better knowing it
> was there, just
> in case.
>
> (Sorry to stray so far off from unschooling!)
>
> ~Nancy
>
>
> Are we talking about the little plastic gadget like a
> tap, that gets stuck in a vein? Well I wouldn't want
> one for a 'natural' birth in hospital, partly because
> it adds to the medicalisation of the process (the
> mother being seen as a patient rather than a woman
> giving birth) and partly because the last time I had
> one it was stuck on the inside of my elbow and not
> taken out for a couple of days. so I couldn't move that
> arm. It hurt like hell and I had a huge bruise
> afterwards. But then the doc who put it in was
> clueless, he tried one that was too big at first...
>
> JME :-)
> Tracy
Lynda
Sounds like they put in a pic line which is a little more invasive than a
hep lock. Also, hep locks can be put in most any good sized vein and the
pic is usually put in that vein on the inside edge of your elbow.
Lynda
hep lock. Also, hep locks can be put in most any good sized vein and the
pic is usually put in that vein on the inside edge of your elbow.
Lynda
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tracy Oldfield" <tracy.oldfield@...>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Monday, April 09, 2001 10:42 AM
Subject: Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] Re: cesarean birth
> Well, I had a hep lock and it was no big deal. No pain -
> -- and I felt
> very good about only getting poked once. I have lots of
> problems with
> much that doctor's do, but a hep lock, in my opinion,
> is a postive
> thing. A hep lock MAY be seen as a convenience for the
> doc
> or midwife, or preparation for the worse case scenario,
> but what's
> wrong with a bit of caution? I felt better knowing it
> was there, just
> in case.
>
> (Sorry to stray so far off from unschooling!)
>
> ~Nancy
>
>
> Are we talking about the little plastic gadget like a
> tap, that gets stuck in a vein? Well I wouldn't want
> one for a 'natural' birth in hospital, partly because
> it adds to the medicalisation of the process (the
> mother being seen as a patient rather than a woman
> giving birth) and partly because the last time I had
> one it was stuck on the inside of my elbow and not
> taken out for a couple of days. so I couldn't move that
> arm. It hurt like hell and I had a huge bruise
> afterwards. But then the doc who put it in was
> clueless, he tried one that was too big at first...
>
> JME :-)
> Tracy
>
>
> Message boards, timely articles, a free newsletter and more!
> Check it all out at: http://www.unschooling.com
>
> Addresses:
> Post message: [email protected]
> Unsubscribe: [email protected]
> List owner: [email protected]
> List settings page: http://www.egroups.com/group/Unschooling-dotcom
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
Lynda
Generally speaking, any needle stick has a very good potential to be an
infection waiting to happen. IVs of any nature can create sites for
throwing clots and create inflammations of the veins. Hep locks are
routinely the site of staph infections. Needle sticks also have the
potential to set you up for forms of cellulitis.
Less invasive is always better unless there is a real need for the
precaution. This is just one more area where patients are not informed, nor
usually asked for their permission.
Lynda
infection waiting to happen. IVs of any nature can create sites for
throwing clots and create inflammations of the veins. Hep locks are
routinely the site of staph infections. Needle sticks also have the
potential to set you up for forms of cellulitis.
Less invasive is always better unless there is a real need for the
precaution. This is just one more area where patients are not informed, nor
usually asked for their permission.
Lynda
----- Original Message -----
From: "Nancy from MI" <hammondcentral@...>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Monday, April 09, 2001 9:48 AM
Subject: [Unschooling-dotcom] Re: cesarean birth
> Well, I had a hep lock and it was no big deal. No pain --- and I felt
> very good about only getting poked once. I have lots of problems with
> much that doctor's do, but a hep lock, in my opinion, is a postive
> thing. A hep lock MAY be seen as a convenience for the doc
> or midwife, or preparation for the worse case scenario, but what's
> wrong with a bit of caution? I felt better knowing it was there, just
> in case.
>
> (Sorry to stray so far off from unschooling!)
>
> ~Nancy
>
>
> --- In Unschooling-dotcom@y..., "Lynda" <lurine@s...> wrote:
> > Well, as someone who coded and technically bled to death having
> kidlet #1, I
> > can vouch for the fact that they can find veins and I don't have
> good veins
> > to begin with.
> >
> > Everything now is about plan for the absolute worst possible
> scenerio and
> > make things as easy as possible for the docs and who cares about the
> mother
> > and her comfort, etc.!
> >
> > Lynda
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: <megates@j...>
> > To: <Unschooling-dotcom@y...>
> > Sent: Monday, April 09, 2001 8:27 AM
> > Subject: [Unschooling-dotcom] Re: cesarean birth
> >
> >
> > > Yeah for all us VBAC's!
> > >
> > > Re: heparin lock
> > >
> > > I just didn't want to have a needle stuck in my arm while I was
> having a
> > > baby. This was 5 1/2 years ago. They (the medical establishment)
> said I
> > > should have the hep lock in place in case my uterus ruptured
> during
> > > labor, that I was more at risk for that because of the previous
> cesarean.
> > > Well, I did some research. Uterine rupture is incredibly rare
> and is
> > > not more likely in women who have had a cesarean, especially with
> low
> > > horizontal cuts. The hep lock is supposed to provide instant
> access to
> > > an IV. But, you can have a hep lock and the vein behind it can
> collapse,
> > > so that wouldn't guarantee IV access after all. In emergencies,
> an IV
> > > can be placed in the scalp or somewhere in the neck (can't
> remember -
> > > clavicle vein or something?) I figured that in the event I became
> > > unconscious because of a hemmoraghe (sp) from uterine rupture, I
> > > certainly would not care where they stuck the IV! And I knew it
> was very
> > > highly UNlikely for that to happen anyway.
> > >
> > > Mary Ellen
> > > The other day, she caught herself about to tell someone
> > > her hair looked nice on the phone.
> > >
> > >
> > > Message boards, timely articles, a free newsletter and more!
> > > Check it all out at: http://www.unschooling.com
> > >
> > > Addresses:
> > > Post message: [email protected]
> > > Unsubscribe: [email protected]
> > > List owner: [email protected]
> > > List settings page:
> http://www.egroups.com/group/Unschooling-dotcom
> > >
> > >
> > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
> http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> > >
> > >
>
>
>
> Message boards, timely articles, a free newsletter and more!
> Check it all out at: http://www.unschooling.com
>
> Addresses:
> Post message: [email protected]
> Unsubscribe: [email protected]
> List owner: [email protected]
> List settings page: http://www.egroups.com/group/Unschooling-dotcom
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
B P
Wups, sent that one by accident before I was done... Sorry...
As I was saying, I'm not comfortable thinking my oldest is getting
all she needs for the rest of her life... On the other hand, I'm a
firm believer that when you need something, you will do what it takes
to learn it. At least, that's been my personal experience. But my dd
is very timid, afraid of new things, afraid of failure...
Meanwhile, I am glad I joined this list. It has been encouraging
to be in the company of other unschoolers. But it would be nice to
read posts from parents of older kids. I don't have much time to read,
let alone post, and I'm doing this online which is slow, so I often end
up deleting lots of things without reading them. If anyone sends a
post about teens, I hope it says so in the subject! I usually read new
threads (but not posts with "digest" in the subject, alas...).
I hope to find even more encouragement here. Thanks for letting me
say my piece...
Bea
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail.
http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/
As I was saying, I'm not comfortable thinking my oldest is getting
all she needs for the rest of her life... On the other hand, I'm a
firm believer that when you need something, you will do what it takes
to learn it. At least, that's been my personal experience. But my dd
is very timid, afraid of new things, afraid of failure...
Meanwhile, I am glad I joined this list. It has been encouraging
to be in the company of other unschoolers. But it would be nice to
read posts from parents of older kids. I don't have much time to read,
let alone post, and I'm doing this online which is slow, so I often end
up deleting lots of things without reading them. If anyone sends a
post about teens, I hope it says so in the subject! I usually read new
threads (but not posts with "digest" in the subject, alas...).
I hope to find even more encouragement here. Thanks for letting me
say my piece...
Bea
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail.
http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/
Tracy Oldfield
Sounds like they put in a pic line which is a little
more invasive than a
hep lock. Also, hep locks can be put in most any good
sized vein and the
pic is usually put in that vein on the inside edge of
your elbow.
Lynda
Well, I saw someone else (might have been on telly)
with the same thing in the back of their hand, much
more sensible place for it!
Loooong time ago, that.
Tracy
more invasive than a
hep lock. Also, hep locks can be put in most any good
sized vein and the
pic is usually put in that vein on the inside edge of
your elbow.
Lynda
Well, I saw someone else (might have been on telly)
with the same thing in the back of their hand, much
more sensible place for it!
Loooong time ago, that.
Tracy
[email protected]
In a message dated 4/9/01 5:37:27 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
emailbeep@... writes:
<< But it would be nice to
read posts from parents of older kids. I >>
Hi, I am unschooling kids ages 4, 9, almost 13 (2, twins), and almost
17. I have found that it gets easier as they get older because they develop
their own interests more and more and lead themselves into things they want
to learn more about. My oldest is very serious about music and spends 2 to 3
hours playing guitar plus more time studying his Music Theory books. We are
in California so he is taking the high school proficieny exam this month and
if he passes, he'll have the legal equivalent of a diploma. From there, he's
planning to take community college classes in things that interest him,
primarily music, but some other things as well. He spends about 2 hrs a day
on the internet usually and has developed strong opinions about many issues
from reading others' and posting his own on the bulletin boards that interest
him. He also reads a lot. I do recommend books sometimes and he has read
books he probably wouldn't have read on his own but ended up loving. He said
his favorite is a book called Disobedience by Jane Hamilton (one of my
suggestions).
One of our almost 13 yr olds loves writing and gardening. Yesterday he
got to spend part of the day with a family in our h/s group that does organic
gardening and got to help harvest and learn a lot. He will go back again
when they're ready for him. He also spends many hours writing long science
fiction novels on the computer.
My other almost 13 yr old loves history, reading fantasy, and activism.
He knows the Civil War really well and has many books on it (including the
huge volumes by Shelby Foote, his favorite). He loves the Harry Potter books
and King Arthur and other fantasy series. He is planning to join me and his
dad in volunteering for Habitat for Humanity (his will have to be fund
raising and other off building site activities until he's 14 according to the
rules). He recently read The Jungle about the meat packing plants at the
turn of the previous century and has strong views about that and other
injustices.
All of this sounds good (even to me) in print and in fact, I am excited
about many recent developments in all of our lives. But there are many days
that wouldn't look very impressive to an observer. And when I read one of
the John Holt books a few years ago about some of the accomplishments of
unschoolers, they sounded incredible to me, not something I could picture our
family doing.
I believe if you just trust your child and yourself enough, all of you
will find your own best paths. I do think it is good to expose kids to
enough for them to find the things that catch their interests but these can
be the normal things in your own life and the lives of people you know.
Sorry this was so long!
Lucy
emailbeep@... writes:
<< But it would be nice to
read posts from parents of older kids. I >>
Hi, I am unschooling kids ages 4, 9, almost 13 (2, twins), and almost
17. I have found that it gets easier as they get older because they develop
their own interests more and more and lead themselves into things they want
to learn more about. My oldest is very serious about music and spends 2 to 3
hours playing guitar plus more time studying his Music Theory books. We are
in California so he is taking the high school proficieny exam this month and
if he passes, he'll have the legal equivalent of a diploma. From there, he's
planning to take community college classes in things that interest him,
primarily music, but some other things as well. He spends about 2 hrs a day
on the internet usually and has developed strong opinions about many issues
from reading others' and posting his own on the bulletin boards that interest
him. He also reads a lot. I do recommend books sometimes and he has read
books he probably wouldn't have read on his own but ended up loving. He said
his favorite is a book called Disobedience by Jane Hamilton (one of my
suggestions).
One of our almost 13 yr olds loves writing and gardening. Yesterday he
got to spend part of the day with a family in our h/s group that does organic
gardening and got to help harvest and learn a lot. He will go back again
when they're ready for him. He also spends many hours writing long science
fiction novels on the computer.
My other almost 13 yr old loves history, reading fantasy, and activism.
He knows the Civil War really well and has many books on it (including the
huge volumes by Shelby Foote, his favorite). He loves the Harry Potter books
and King Arthur and other fantasy series. He is planning to join me and his
dad in volunteering for Habitat for Humanity (his will have to be fund
raising and other off building site activities until he's 14 according to the
rules). He recently read The Jungle about the meat packing plants at the
turn of the previous century and has strong views about that and other
injustices.
All of this sounds good (even to me) in print and in fact, I am excited
about many recent developments in all of our lives. But there are many days
that wouldn't look very impressive to an observer. And when I read one of
the John Holt books a few years ago about some of the accomplishments of
unschoolers, they sounded incredible to me, not something I could picture our
family doing.
I believe if you just trust your child and yourself enough, all of you
will find your own best paths. I do think it is good to expose kids to
enough for them to find the things that catch their interests but these can
be the normal things in your own life and the lives of people you know.
Sorry this was so long!
Lucy