Not smart enough to unschool
squeakybiscuit
I've been reading through the posts and websites about unschooling,
and what I'm finding is that I'm not smart enough to unschool.
Someone on a thread here pointed out to her three year old that Plato
thought alot about the names of things. On another page, someone
pointed out to their child who was drawing triangles that all of the
angles add up to 180 degrees no matter the size or type of triangle.
In reading about unschooling, I am finding hundreds of examples of
this, and I don't know these sorts of things to point out to my child.
What to do when you don't know enough neat facts to interest your
child?
and what I'm finding is that I'm not smart enough to unschool.
Someone on a thread here pointed out to her three year old that Plato
thought alot about the names of things. On another page, someone
pointed out to their child who was drawing triangles that all of the
angles add up to 180 degrees no matter the size or type of triangle.
In reading about unschooling, I am finding hundreds of examples of
this, and I don't know these sorts of things to point out to my child.
What to do when you don't know enough neat facts to interest your
child?
Angela S.
Everyone has their own body of knowledge of things that they find
interesting and useful. Some people never think to share the things they
know and love with their children. Point out connections when you see them.
Make a conscious effort to do that if you don't already do it naturally.
Don't keep your kids home where they can only learn from you. Expose them
to all the wonders of this planet and to people who can enrich their lives.
It isn't about what you know. A big part of it is about helping them find
out what they want to know.
Angela
game-enthusiast@...
interesting and useful. Some people never think to share the things they
know and love with their children. Point out connections when you see them.
Make a conscious effort to do that if you don't already do it naturally.
Don't keep your kids home where they can only learn from you. Expose them
to all the wonders of this planet and to people who can enrich their lives.
It isn't about what you know. A big part of it is about helping them find
out what they want to know.
Angela
game-enthusiast@...
Sandra Dodd
On Feb 12, 2006, at 3:16 PM, squeakybiscuit wrote:
> What to do when you don't know enough neat facts to interest yourTell them what you Do know and be willing to learn more.
> child?
Sandra Dodd
On Feb 12, 2006, at 4:49 PM, Angela S. wrote:
And even those who do choose to share it won't know the same things
other people know. I can talk about what bands the members of
Crosby, Stills and Nash were in before, and pull the records off the
shelves and play the cuts that best show WHY those members were good
for the group. Does that "matter" in life? No more or less than
mentioning that the idea of an ideal, pure form of a thing is an idea
credited to Plato and something he wrote about. No more or less than
knowing that the same director who did Groundhog Day did Bedazzled,
and discussing what the two movies have in common. Someone who
shares the history of the Super Bowl or the Rolling Stones or the
construction of colliseums and other massive buildings through
history is helping children make connections, and connections are
what learning is made of.
Sandra
> Everyone has their own body of knowledge of things that they find===================
> interesting and useful. Some people never think to share the
> things they
> know and love with their children.
And even those who do choose to share it won't know the same things
other people know. I can talk about what bands the members of
Crosby, Stills and Nash were in before, and pull the records off the
shelves and play the cuts that best show WHY those members were good
for the group. Does that "matter" in life? No more or less than
mentioning that the idea of an ideal, pure form of a thing is an idea
credited to Plato and something he wrote about. No more or less than
knowing that the same director who did Groundhog Day did Bedazzled,
and discussing what the two movies have in common. Someone who
shares the history of the Super Bowl or the Rolling Stones or the
construction of colliseums and other massive buildings through
history is helping children make connections, and connections are
what learning is made of.
Sandra
Ren Allen
"What to do when you don't know enough neat facts to interest your
child?"
Ok, I'm going out on a limb here, so just slap me if I'm wrong....I'm
going to take a stab at analyzing. I could be waaaaay off, but maybe
not.:)
You're youngish? Maybe only one child so far (I'm not going back to
read posts and don't remember) possibly two...they're young still.
You came out of school like a LOT of us here, beaten down, not sure of
yourself and convinced there wasn't anything ultra special or "smart"
about you.
Well guess what? All the "smart" parents you're reading about here,
probably went through a period of time when they were really, really
unsure too. School doesn't do much in preparing us for day to day
information. What swirls all these lovely bits of information into our
lives, is INTEREST.
I've learned about angles in the last few years, I've learned a LOT
about philosophy and Plato and such in the last few years. Everything
I learned about history was done after leaving school. Most of my
"cultural literacy" was formed in my late 20's up to now.
I'm 36 now, with a teen and almost teen in the house. I've learned
right alongside them....researching bizarre factoids and trivia
whenever we feel like it.
The key is not how much knowledge you have at this point in your
life...it's HOW CURIOUS are you? That curiosity and interest is the
foundation for great unschooling, not how much information is crammed
into your brain!:) Honest.
I feel like a dunce on these lists some days....there's such a
wonderful variety of interesting, brilliant and wise people here.
Don't let it bug ya. Just grab onto one of those interesting bits of
information and ride the wave!! I can't tell you how many times I read
a post and run my butt over to google to learn more.
Just like your children, you are building a storehouse of the
information that you enjoy picking up.
Ren
learninginfreedom.com
child?"
Ok, I'm going out on a limb here, so just slap me if I'm wrong....I'm
going to take a stab at analyzing. I could be waaaaay off, but maybe
not.:)
You're youngish? Maybe only one child so far (I'm not going back to
read posts and don't remember) possibly two...they're young still.
You came out of school like a LOT of us here, beaten down, not sure of
yourself and convinced there wasn't anything ultra special or "smart"
about you.
Well guess what? All the "smart" parents you're reading about here,
probably went through a period of time when they were really, really
unsure too. School doesn't do much in preparing us for day to day
information. What swirls all these lovely bits of information into our
lives, is INTEREST.
I've learned about angles in the last few years, I've learned a LOT
about philosophy and Plato and such in the last few years. Everything
I learned about history was done after leaving school. Most of my
"cultural literacy" was formed in my late 20's up to now.
I'm 36 now, with a teen and almost teen in the house. I've learned
right alongside them....researching bizarre factoids and trivia
whenever we feel like it.
The key is not how much knowledge you have at this point in your
life...it's HOW CURIOUS are you? That curiosity and interest is the
foundation for great unschooling, not how much information is crammed
into your brain!:) Honest.
I feel like a dunce on these lists some days....there's such a
wonderful variety of interesting, brilliant and wise people here.
Don't let it bug ya. Just grab onto one of those interesting bits of
information and ride the wave!! I can't tell you how many times I read
a post and run my butt over to google to learn more.
Just like your children, you are building a storehouse of the
information that you enjoy picking up.
Ren
learninginfreedom.com
Erin Erin
Ren,
Actually, I'm 33 and have three kids. They are 13,12 and 8. I was an A
student and in the gifted class and came out of school feeling VERY smart.
It wasn't until I became a parent and got the internet that I realized how
much I didn't know.
When my kids ask questions, I normally do not know the answer. We usually do
a search on google and if that doesn't yeild any results we post on a
message board geared to experts in that area to talk to someone who might
know.
Perhaps it's because none of the schoolish topics interested me that I don't
remember anything I learned in school. I got A's in math, so I'm sure we
went over the angle thing at some point. The facts just escape me now.
The key to being "good" at school is basically retaining facts for about a
week until the test and then forgetting them. If you're "good" at that you
are made to feel really smart. Then you get out in the real world and
realize that "school" smart and real smart are two very different things.
Erin
Actually, I'm 33 and have three kids. They are 13,12 and 8. I was an A
student and in the gifted class and came out of school feeling VERY smart.
It wasn't until I became a parent and got the internet that I realized how
much I didn't know.
When my kids ask questions, I normally do not know the answer. We usually do
a search on google and if that doesn't yeild any results we post on a
message board geared to experts in that area to talk to someone who might
know.
Perhaps it's because none of the schoolish topics interested me that I don't
remember anything I learned in school. I got A's in math, so I'm sure we
went over the angle thing at some point. The facts just escape me now.
The key to being "good" at school is basically retaining facts for about a
week until the test and then forgetting them. If you're "good" at that you
are made to feel really smart. Then you get out in the real world and
realize that "school" smart and real smart are two very different things.
Erin
On 2/12/06, Ren Allen <starsuncloud@...> wrote:
>
> "What to do when you don't know enough neat facts to interest your
> child?"
>
> Ok, I'm going out on a limb here, so just slap me if I'm wrong....I'm
> going to take a stab at analyzing. I could be waaaaay off, but maybe
> not.:)
> You're youngish? Maybe only one child so far (I'm not going back to
> read posts and don't remember) possibly two...they're young still.
>
> You came out of school like a LOT of us here, beaten down, not sure of
> yourself and convinced there wasn't anything ultra special or "smart"
> about you.
>
> Well guess what? All the "smart" parents you're reading about here,
> probably went through a period of time when they were really, really
> unsure too. School doesn't do much in preparing us for day to day
> information. What swirls all these lovely bits of information into our
> lives, is INTEREST.
>
> I've learned about angles in the last few years, I've learned a LOT
> about philosophy and Plato and such in the last few years. Everything
> I learned about history was done after leaving school. Most of my
> "cultural literacy" was formed in my late 20's up to now.
>
> I'm 36 now, with a teen and almost teen in the house. I've learned
> right alongside them....researching bizarre factoids and trivia
> whenever we feel like it.
>
> The key is not how much knowledge you have at this point in your
> life...it's HOW CURIOUS are you? That curiosity and interest is the
> foundation for great unschooling, not how much information is crammed
> into your brain!:) Honest.
>
> I feel like a dunce on these lists some days....there's such a
> wonderful variety of interesting, brilliant and wise people here.
> Don't let it bug ya. Just grab onto one of those interesting bits of
> information and ride the wave!! I can't tell you how many times I read
> a post and run my butt over to google to learn more.
>
> Just like your children, you are building a storehouse of the
> information that you enjoy picking up.
>
> Ren
> learninginfreedom.com
>
>
>
>
>
> "List Posting Policies" are provided in the files area of this group.
>
> Visit the Unschooling website and message boards: <
> http://www.unschooling.info>
>
>
>
> SPONSORED LINKS
> Graduate school education<http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Graduate+school+education&w1=Graduate+school+education&w2=High+school+education&w3=Home+school+education&w4=Middle+school+education&w5=New+york+school+education&w6=School+education+in+california&c=6&s=181&.sig=XeERtAmMH6xOclFlfF3kXw> High
> school education<http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=High+school+education&w1=Graduate+school+education&w2=High+school+education&w3=Home+school+education&w4=Middle+school+education&w5=New+york+school+education&w6=School+education+in+california&c=6&s=181&.sig=89oOLkTPWnhxf__b2u72QA> Home
> school education<http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Home+school+education&w1=Graduate+school+education&w2=High+school+education&w3=Home+school+education&w4=Middle+school+education&w5=New+york+school+education&w6=School+education+in+california&c=6&s=181&.sig=1aW-X2S2ZokW3qzZ8RgBsQ> Middle
> school education<http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Middle+school+education&w1=Graduate+school+education&w2=High+school+education&w3=Home+school+education&w4=Middle+school+education&w5=New+york+school+education&w6=School+education+in+california&c=6&s=181&.sig=ekWG86FHE6rjFjd8jaZHOw> New
> york school education<http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=New+york+school+education&w1=Graduate+school+education&w2=High+school+education&w3=Home+school+education&w4=Middle+school+education&w5=New+york+school+education&w6=School+education+in+california&c=6&s=181&.sig=aSJE8BjHS18knvLinwtebQ> School
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Sandra Dodd
On Feb 12, 2006, at 5:18 PM, Ren Allen wrote:
"Dunce." What a school word!
I spent some time with Pam Sorooshian and her two younger girls last
month. I feel intimidated sometimes by the depth of Roxana's
knowledge, and the intensity of some of her interests. All of Pam's
kids have taken classes at a college near them. That makes me look
at my kids and think for a fleeting moment that they're like pound
puppies next to Pam's show dogs. It's not fair, it's not right, it's
not totally true (but it might be a little bit true <bwg>), but my
kids probably know as much as her kids do, it's just way more
scattery. Pam's kids know a lot about a few things. Rosie knows
lots about soccer and horses. My kids, nothing. My kids know a
little about a lot of things. <g> I don't mind that, but I still
have a pause when I'm around someone whose child is an expert at
something.
Here's the deal, though...
When I was in school, I was relatively expert on The Beatles.
Certainly didn't learn it in school, but the other kids would ask me
when the next album was coming out, or who wrote which songs, or
whatever. My best friend played piano better than anyone else in
town. She didn't learn that in school, but school certainly made use
of it, and gave her music credit for being the accompanist for the
chorus class. (Lame deal, but she enjoyed being there more than
taking P.E., which it got her out of.) One friend was a silversmith;
learned from his dad, and was making jewelry good enough to sell by
his teens. Some of the girls from Santa Clara Pueblo were making
potters, and are now considered "potters," meaning have been making
traditional pottery all their lives. When we were kids, they were
experts already (beginning, but had experience and opportunity others
didn't have). Some kids rode rodeo, or trained horses or dogs for
ranchwork.
The range of what kids do and what parents know is no broader or more
narrow among unschoolers than other—but parents whose kids are in
school have the dubious luxury of leaving it all up to the teachers;
unschooling parents need to wade into the world and start gathering
some good stuff!
Sandra
> I feel like a dunce on these lists some days....there's such a============
> wonderful variety of interesting, brilliant and wise people here.
"Dunce." What a school word!
I spent some time with Pam Sorooshian and her two younger girls last
month. I feel intimidated sometimes by the depth of Roxana's
knowledge, and the intensity of some of her interests. All of Pam's
kids have taken classes at a college near them. That makes me look
at my kids and think for a fleeting moment that they're like pound
puppies next to Pam's show dogs. It's not fair, it's not right, it's
not totally true (but it might be a little bit true <bwg>), but my
kids probably know as much as her kids do, it's just way more
scattery. Pam's kids know a lot about a few things. Rosie knows
lots about soccer and horses. My kids, nothing. My kids know a
little about a lot of things. <g> I don't mind that, but I still
have a pause when I'm around someone whose child is an expert at
something.
Here's the deal, though...
When I was in school, I was relatively expert on The Beatles.
Certainly didn't learn it in school, but the other kids would ask me
when the next album was coming out, or who wrote which songs, or
whatever. My best friend played piano better than anyone else in
town. She didn't learn that in school, but school certainly made use
of it, and gave her music credit for being the accompanist for the
chorus class. (Lame deal, but she enjoyed being there more than
taking P.E., which it got her out of.) One friend was a silversmith;
learned from his dad, and was making jewelry good enough to sell by
his teens. Some of the girls from Santa Clara Pueblo were making
potters, and are now considered "potters," meaning have been making
traditional pottery all their lives. When we were kids, they were
experts already (beginning, but had experience and opportunity others
didn't have). Some kids rode rodeo, or trained horses or dogs for
ranchwork.
The range of what kids do and what parents know is no broader or more
narrow among unschoolers than other—but parents whose kids are in
school have the dubious luxury of leaving it all up to the teachers;
unschooling parents need to wade into the world and start gathering
some good stuff!
Sandra
Ren Allen
"Actually, I'm 33 and have three kids. They are 13,12 and 8. I was an A
student and in the gifted class and came out of school feeling VERY
smart. It wasn't until I became a parent and got the internet that I
realized how much I didn't know."
See...that's why I said I'm going out on a limb!! Totally off.:)
BUT, my other hunch was that maybe you're newer to unschooling? I only
say that because unschooling has been a profoundly healing influence
in my own life and in many other families.
Isn't it sad that whether or not you leave school feeling smart or
dumb, you quickly find out that you've been fooled? That school didn't
do anything to help you do the things that really matter for your own
life's journey. I had this notion that I wasn't very bright, that I
just couldn't follow through well enough and wasn't "living up to
potential", basically lots of yucky baggage that didn't help me.
Maybe you just need to reclaim that creative spark?
You already know how to find information, so don't worry about how
much you have! You're doing the important part of helping your
children find resources they might need.
Ren
learninginfreedom.com
student and in the gifted class and came out of school feeling VERY
smart. It wasn't until I became a parent and got the internet that I
realized how much I didn't know."
See...that's why I said I'm going out on a limb!! Totally off.:)
BUT, my other hunch was that maybe you're newer to unschooling? I only
say that because unschooling has been a profoundly healing influence
in my own life and in many other families.
Isn't it sad that whether or not you leave school feeling smart or
dumb, you quickly find out that you've been fooled? That school didn't
do anything to help you do the things that really matter for your own
life's journey. I had this notion that I wasn't very bright, that I
just couldn't follow through well enough and wasn't "living up to
potential", basically lots of yucky baggage that didn't help me.
Maybe you just need to reclaim that creative spark?
You already know how to find information, so don't worry about how
much you have! You're doing the important part of helping your
children find resources they might need.
Ren
learninginfreedom.com
Heather Woodward
Erin,
You are right! I feel the same way sometimes. I had this finance Professor
in college who allowed us to make our own "cheat" sheets with formulas,
because he said never in real life will you not be able to look something up
or use a calculator! I sat next to an exchange student from Germany, who was
really an engineering student - and he didn't have to write down
formulas...but everyone else did. It took a lot of the pressure off.
Just today we looked up Onomatopoeia! and I am sure that I was supposed to
have learned that in school. And my daughter was figuring 3/4 of 12 or
something and was dividing the 12 by 4 first and then multiplying. I was
taught the opposite - which gives you a larger number to divide by.... so I
was amazed at how she figures these things. I learn much more today than I
did simply becasue I am open to it
Heather
You are right! I feel the same way sometimes. I had this finance Professor
in college who allowed us to make our own "cheat" sheets with formulas,
because he said never in real life will you not be able to look something up
or use a calculator! I sat next to an exchange student from Germany, who was
really an engineering student - and he didn't have to write down
formulas...but everyone else did. It took a lot of the pressure off.
Just today we looked up Onomatopoeia! and I am sure that I was supposed to
have learned that in school. And my daughter was figuring 3/4 of 12 or
something and was dividing the 12 by 4 first and then multiplying. I was
taught the opposite - which gives you a larger number to divide by.... so I
was amazed at how she figures these things. I learn much more today than I
did simply becasue I am open to it
Heather
----- Original Message -----
From: "Erin Erin" <squeakybiscuit@...>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Sunday, February 12, 2006 8:06 PM
Subject: Re: [UnschoolingDiscussion] Not smart enough to unschool
> Ren,
>
> Actually, I'm 33 and have three kids. They are 13,12 and 8. I was an A
> student and in the gifted class and came out of school feeling VERY smart.
> It wasn't until I became a parent and got the internet that I realized how
> much I didn't know.
>
> When my kids ask questions, I normally do not know the answer. We usually
do
> a search on google and if that doesn't yeild any results we post on a
> message board geared to experts in that area to talk to someone who might
> know.
>
> Perhaps it's because none of the schoolish topics interested me that I
don't
> remember anything I learned in school. I got A's in math, so I'm sure we
> went over the angle thing at some point. The facts just escape me now.
>
> The key to being "good" at school is basically retaining facts for about a
> week until the test and then forgetting them. If you're "good" at that you
> are made to feel really smart. Then you get out in the real world and
> realize that "school" smart and real smart are two very different things.
>
>
> Erin
>
>
> On 2/12/06, Ren Allen <starsuncloud@...> wrote:
> >
> > "What to do when you don't know enough neat facts to interest your
> > child?"
> >
> > Ok, I'm going out on a limb here, so just slap me if I'm wrong....I'm
> > going to take a stab at analyzing. I could be waaaaay off, but maybe
> > not.:)
> > You're youngish? Maybe only one child so far (I'm not going back to
> > read posts and don't remember) possibly two...they're young still.
> >
> > You came out of school like a LOT of us here, beaten down, not sure of
> > yourself and convinced there wasn't anything ultra special or "smart"
> > about you.
> >
> > Well guess what? All the "smart" parents you're reading about here,
> > probably went through a period of time when they were really, really
> > unsure too. School doesn't do much in preparing us for day to day
> > information. What swirls all these lovely bits of information into our
> > lives, is INTEREST.
> >
> > I've learned about angles in the last few years, I've learned a LOT
> > about philosophy and Plato and such in the last few years. Everything
> > I learned about history was done after leaving school. Most of my
> > "cultural literacy" was formed in my late 20's up to now.
> >
> > I'm 36 now, with a teen and almost teen in the house. I've learned
> > right alongside them....researching bizarre factoids and trivia
> > whenever we feel like it.
> >
> > The key is not how much knowledge you have at this point in your
> > life...it's HOW CURIOUS are you? That curiosity and interest is the
> > foundation for great unschooling, not how much information is crammed
> > into your brain!:) Honest.
> >
> > I feel like a dunce on these lists some days....there's such a
> > wonderful variety of interesting, brilliant and wise people here.
> > Don't let it bug ya. Just grab onto one of those interesting bits of
> > information and ride the wave!! I can't tell you how many times I read
> > a post and run my butt over to google to learn more.
> >
> > Just like your children, you are building a storehouse of the
> > information that you enjoy picking up.
> >
> > Ren
> > learninginfreedom.com
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > "List Posting Policies" are provided in the files area of this group.
> >
> > Visit the Unschooling website and message boards: <
> > http://www.unschooling.info>
> >
> >
> >
> > SPONSORED LINKS
> > Graduate school
education<http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Graduate+school+education&w1=G
raduate+school+education&w2=High+school+education&w3=Home+school+education&w
4=Middle+school+education&w5=New+york+school+education&w6=School+education+i
n+california&c=6&s=181&.sig=XeERtAmMH6xOclFlfF3kXw> High
> > school
education<http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=High+school+education&w1=Gradu
ate+school+education&w2=High+school+education&w3=Home+school+education&w4=Mi
ddle+school+education&w5=New+york+school+education&w6=School+education+in+ca
lifornia&c=6&s=181&.sig=89oOLkTPWnhxf__b2u72QA> Home
> > school
education<http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Home+school+education&w1=Gradu
ate+school+education&w2=High+school+education&w3=Home+school+education&w4=Mi
ddle+school+education&w5=New+york+school+education&w6=School+education+in+ca
lifornia&c=6&s=181&.sig=1aW-X2S2ZokW3qzZ8RgBsQ> Middle
> > school
education<http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?t=ms&k=Middle+school+education&w1=Gra
duate+school+education&w2=High+school+education&w3=Home+school+education&w4=
Middle+school+education&w5=New+york+school+education&w6=School+education+in+
california&c=6&s=181&.sig=ekWG86FHE6rjFjd8jaZHOw> New
> > york school
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Laura Endres
>>>>>What to do when you don't know enough neat facts to interest yourWhy, start learning all the things you want to know about!
>>>>>child?
And tell the kids you don't know when you don't know, but offer to find out together or help them seek another resource for the answers they're looking for.
Here's a quote for you, that just came to me from a friend living abroad....
"I would rather live in a world where my life is
surrounded by mystery than live in a world so small
that my mind could comprehend it." ~Henry Emerson Fosdick
Enjoy the search,
Laura
*~*~*~*~*~*
"out beyond the ideas of wrongdoing and right doing, there is a field. I'll meet you there." ~Rumi
*~*~*~*~*~*
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Pamela Sorooshian
On Feb 12, 2006, at 4:18 PM, Ren Allen wrote:
children's museums and bookstores and libraries. Watch movies and tv.
Listen to tapes. Go camping and go on the nature walks with the
rangers. Hang out in the visitor centers. Talk to people and ask them
questions. Don't be a snob about it - there are interesting people
everywhere and the most unexpected people often have the most
interesting stories to tell.
Visit your own local area as if you are a tourist. Take tours. Google
local buildings, people, newspapers, stories, and so on. Stop and
watch buildings go up at construction sites. Try a new fruit or
vegetable. Eat out at an ethnic restaurant you haven't tried before.
In other words, be a little adventurous and have fun.
It'll all add up.
Don't TRY to learn stuff - just look for stuff that interests you and
enjoy yourself. The learning will "just happen."
-pam
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> The key is not how much knowledge you have at this point in yourAnd - go places, read stuff, go to the zoo and the aquarium and
> life...it's HOW CURIOUS are you? That curiosity and interest is the
> foundation for great unschooling, not how much information is crammed
> into your brain!:) Honest.
children's museums and bookstores and libraries. Watch movies and tv.
Listen to tapes. Go camping and go on the nature walks with the
rangers. Hang out in the visitor centers. Talk to people and ask them
questions. Don't be a snob about it - there are interesting people
everywhere and the most unexpected people often have the most
interesting stories to tell.
Visit your own local area as if you are a tourist. Take tours. Google
local buildings, people, newspapers, stories, and so on. Stop and
watch buildings go up at construction sites. Try a new fruit or
vegetable. Eat out at an ethnic restaurant you haven't tried before.
In other words, be a little adventurous and have fun.
It'll all add up.
Don't TRY to learn stuff - just look for stuff that interests you and
enjoy yourself. The learning will "just happen."
-pam
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Pamela Sorooshian
On Feb 12, 2006, at 5:11 PM, Sandra Dodd wrote:
wish my kids were more like hers.
I guess we have some level of "kid envy" going <g> - but what I
admire about Sandra's kids seems a lot more important than depth of
knowledge about certain things. They are SO good-natured and nice and
generous. They are incredibly quick-thinking and intelligent and --
interesting!
-pam
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> It's not fair, it's not right, it'sYeah, well, what Sandra didn't mention is how I actually SAID how I
> not totally true (but it might be a little bit true <bwg>), but my
> kids probably know as much as her kids do, it's just way more
> scattery.
wish my kids were more like hers.
I guess we have some level of "kid envy" going <g> - but what I
admire about Sandra's kids seems a lot more important than depth of
knowledge about certain things. They are SO good-natured and nice and
generous. They are incredibly quick-thinking and intelligent and --
interesting!
-pam
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Drew & Tami
What Pam said! With an emphasis on the generous...Cassidy (5) and Adam (3)
still can't get over how Holly let them play in the "Barbie room with a
light on a string" as long as they wanted! And pushed them on the swings!
And came to their grandma's house to swim (with the rest of the family)!
And Marty put the dog away so she wouldn't scare them!
My kids are now sadly disappointed when they encounter "big kids" who
"aren't nice like Holly and her brothers."
Tami, who finds the Dodds to be a very inspiring group of people!
knowledge about certain things. They are SO good-natured and nice and
generous. They are incredibly quick-thinking and intelligent and --
interesting!
-pam <<<
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
still can't get over how Holly let them play in the "Barbie room with a
light on a string" as long as they wanted! And pushed them on the swings!
And came to their grandma's house to swim (with the rest of the family)!
And Marty put the dog away so she wouldn't scare them!
My kids are now sadly disappointed when they encounter "big kids" who
"aren't nice like Holly and her brothers."
Tami, who finds the Dodds to be a very inspiring group of people!
>>> I guess we have some level of "kid envy" going <g> - but what Iadmire about Sandra's kids seems a lot more important than depth of
knowledge about certain things. They are SO good-natured and nice and
generous. They are incredibly quick-thinking and intelligent and --
interesting!
-pam <<<
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Sandra Dodd
On Feb 12, 2006, at 6:06 PM, Erin Erin wrote:
But even if "facts" (as in memorized phrases or numbers) escape you,
you can still reconstruct it or figure it out, can't you? Because if
you can't (and got A's), I would hazard a guess (maybe as wrong as
Ren's <bwg>) that it's because you've TRIED to block out such things.
As to angles and triangles and squares and such...
You know just from everyday speech or from manipulating photos with
Photoshop or something what 90 degrees, means, right? And "a right
angle"?
And you know what someone means when they said they've changed 180
degrees from what they used to believe?
And you know something about 360 degrees having to do with the earth
or circles or sewing or something, maybe?
Nothing left then but to remember that the total of a circle or a
square is 360 degrees (the whole thing, from the center in all
directions) but that a triangle is only half of that (180).
If you feel like buying some educational stuff, consider a geoboard.
It's a plastic pegboard you use for playing with rubber bands. That
can be just plain fun, and might help you understand some things you
didn't really get in school. It really helped me a lot. They're
cheap. If you have an educational supply house you can get one for
$5 or so probably, or order them cheaper (except the "plus postage"
part) online somewhere.
We have computer games that have shown the kids things about angles
without me getting involved. <g> And if your kids weren't interested
in those kinds of games but you yourself were feeling math-needy, you
could play them yourself. They might be lured over if you're having
fun.
There's something about triangles and Holly here:
http://sandradodd.com/dot/hypotenuse
Sandra
> I got A's in math, so I'm sure we==============
> went over the angle thing at some point. The facts just escape me now.
But even if "facts" (as in memorized phrases or numbers) escape you,
you can still reconstruct it or figure it out, can't you? Because if
you can't (and got A's), I would hazard a guess (maybe as wrong as
Ren's <bwg>) that it's because you've TRIED to block out such things.
As to angles and triangles and squares and such...
You know just from everyday speech or from manipulating photos with
Photoshop or something what 90 degrees, means, right? And "a right
angle"?
And you know what someone means when they said they've changed 180
degrees from what they used to believe?
And you know something about 360 degrees having to do with the earth
or circles or sewing or something, maybe?
Nothing left then but to remember that the total of a circle or a
square is 360 degrees (the whole thing, from the center in all
directions) but that a triangle is only half of that (180).
If you feel like buying some educational stuff, consider a geoboard.
It's a plastic pegboard you use for playing with rubber bands. That
can be just plain fun, and might help you understand some things you
didn't really get in school. It really helped me a lot. They're
cheap. If you have an educational supply house you can get one for
$5 or so probably, or order them cheaper (except the "plus postage"
part) online somewhere.
We have computer games that have shown the kids things about angles
without me getting involved. <g> And if your kids weren't interested
in those kinds of games but you yourself were feeling math-needy, you
could play them yourself. They might be lured over if you're having
fun.
There's something about triangles and Holly here:
http://sandradodd.com/dot/hypotenuse
Sandra
Sandra Dodd
On Feb 12, 2006, at 6:11 PM, Sandra Dodd wrote:
They might've made potters one way or another when they were older...
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> Some of the girls from Santa Clara Pueblo were makingMaking POTS (sorry)...
> potters, and are now considered "potters,"
They might've made potters one way or another when they were older...
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
elainegh8
I feel that one of the most important things I say to my children
is "I don't know, but we can find out". I hope I'm passing on the fact
that when they don't know something that it's OK. That if they want to
know something then there are lots of ways of finding out. I want
them to know that everyone has gaps in the their knowledge including
me, professors, mathematicians, chefs, TV presenters, authors,
everyone!
BWs Elaine
is "I don't know, but we can find out". I hope I'm passing on the fact
that when they don't know something that it's OK. That if they want to
know something then there are lots of ways of finding out. I want
them to know that everyone has gaps in the their knowledge including
me, professors, mathematicians, chefs, TV presenters, authors,
everyone!
BWs Elaine
elainegh8
Do you think it would be easy to make a geoboard? They look pretty
simple from the one pic I've seen (I think it was in Sandra's book
Moving a Puddle). Just wondered as it looks like they could just be
made with a square of wood and some nails?
BWs Elaine
simple from the one pic I've seen (I think it was in Sandra's book
Moving a Puddle). Just wondered as it looks like they could just be
made with a square of wood and some nails?
BWs Elaine
Sandra Dodd
> -=-Cassidy (5) and Adam (3)Thanks! That swimming thing, though... you were doing US a favor!
> still can't get over how Holly let them play in the "Barbie room
> with a
> light on a string" as long as they wanted! And pushed them on the
> swings!
> And came to their grandma's house to swim (with the rest of the
> family)!
> And Marty put the dog away so she wouldn't scare them!-=-
And the food was great.
I will pass the compliments on to them, their dad, their grandma... <g>
Except for the zinging insults (made in fun, but I still feel the
zing), older kids have been really nice to my kids too. My kids tend
not to have the urge to zing others (though they can retaliate if
needed, and they do practice on me sometimes, especially Marty). But
when Kirby was thirteen he started attending midnight-to-whenever
anime club meetings, and was invited, attended to and transported by
various older members. It wasn't even Kirby's idea, and he didn't
call around for rides. They would remember him and arrange for
whichever would take him, or sometimes I would deliver him and he
would get a ride home with someone else.
When Marty got old enough to be more fun than irritating to Kirby (it
happened gradually), Kirby started inviting him to gaming sessions
and movies and parties. Just in the past four months or so, Holly
has reached the point that either or both of the boys will include
her, too. That's a huge relief for me, because the year or two
leading up to that point in both cases led to a lot of hurt feelings
from not being invited, and then sometimes invited, and then
excluded, or not even asked. The occasional invitation just seemed
to make the "not this time" instances worse.
There's no way to avoid those awkward times.
There is a younger neighbor who has periodically tried to get Holly's
undivided attention (or sometimes will settle for ANY attention), and
though she used to hang around with his sister, she just can't get
into playing with him much, especially now that she's passed into
real teen years. I feel sorry for him. A couple of times in the
past year she has done a brief thing with him, but it's more
rejection than agreement (poor guy).
There are two neighbor girls who ended up not being playmates because
Holly was impatient and frustrated that their opening conversation
was REPEATEDLY the automatic dialog "Where do you go to school?" and
the same questions about homeschooling they would have asked if they
had never met her before. One went through it three times, and
another about five, before Holly just started avoiding them. Partly
it was her feeling that they weren't really paying any attention to
her or her answers, partly that they were boring, and partly they
seemed jealously disturbed (which is probably why they blanked out on
the answers—they couldn't very well process the idea that she really
didn't have school or lessons).
My kids really aren't universally as nice to every human, but they
have grown up without the prejudices about age that school ingrains
in people, and they're freer with other unschoolers out of relief at
being understood and appreciated instead of being prodded and
interviewed.
Sandra
Sandra Dodd
On Feb 13, 2006, at 9:33 AM, elainegh8 wrote:
There was a whole artform done with string and nails in the 70's.
Computers do the same things on screensavers everywhere, but...
(let me look)...
http://www.mathcats.com/crafts/stringart.html
http://www.teachersnetwork.org/dcs/math/stringart/
StringArt_TeacherNotes_files/
Hey! Here's an online geoboard. You put the "rubber bands" on with
the mouse, and you can color in the area you've outlined. AND these
rubber bands won't break!
http://nlvm.usu.edu/en/nav/frames_asid_277_g_1_t_3.html?open=activities
Here's something from a set of math things a homeschooling dad has
made, about the angles of a triangle adding up to 180:
http://argyll.epsb.ca/jreed/math9/strand3/triangle_angle_sum.htm
Pretty cool! You don't have to say anything about it, just play with
it about thirty seconds and you'll have the idea down. <g>
His site came up on a google search for geoboard, and the main page
is this:
http://argyll.epsb.ca/jreed/
Sandra
> Do you think it would be easy to make a geoboard? They look prettyYou could but it would be more dangerous.
> simple from the one pic I've seen (I think it was in Sandra's book
> Moving a Puddle). Just wondered as it looks like they could just be
> made with a square of wood and some nails?
>
> BWs Elaine
>
There was a whole artform done with string and nails in the 70's.
Computers do the same things on screensavers everywhere, but...
(let me look)...
http://www.mathcats.com/crafts/stringart.html
http://www.teachersnetwork.org/dcs/math/stringart/
StringArt_TeacherNotes_files/
Hey! Here's an online geoboard. You put the "rubber bands" on with
the mouse, and you can color in the area you've outlined. AND these
rubber bands won't break!
http://nlvm.usu.edu/en/nav/frames_asid_277_g_1_t_3.html?open=activities
Here's something from a set of math things a homeschooling dad has
made, about the angles of a triangle adding up to 180:
http://argyll.epsb.ca/jreed/math9/strand3/triangle_angle_sum.htm
Pretty cool! You don't have to say anything about it, just play with
it about thirty seconds and you'll have the idea down. <g>
His site came up on a google search for geoboard, and the main page
is this:
http://argyll.epsb.ca/jreed/
Sandra
Tracey Inman
>>A big part of it is about helping them findout what they want to know.<<
I agree with Angela! I have a dd who is extremely gifted in
art/drawing/painting. I can't draw a stick person. We went to local art
galleries and made contacts with people I thought could lead us to someone
who could help. I was honest in telling them I don't know how to help my dd
except by connecting her with someone like you. We ended up connecting with
a local artist who just took her under his wing and mentors her. She had
her first art showing at age 13 all because my dh took a few pieces to the
Chamber of Commerce when he heard they were going to have a showing of the
local artist and they were so blown away that they asked her to be a part of
it. It has snow balled from there.
So don't be afraid you don't know enough. Be excited that there is so much
that you and your children will learn on your journey. I know more know
about art than I did a year ago. Now, don't get too excited.....I still
can't draw a stick person!!! :) To be completely honest, somedays I feel
like I learn more from them than they learn because of me!
~Tracey I. - Mom to Rachael (13) & Madison (10)
Rue Kream
>>Do you think it would be easy to make a geoboard?**We made one for my niece. It was way too much effort when you can buy
them inexpensively. We ended up finding some wooden ones in both round and
square formats online(I think it might have been here:
http://www.etacuisenaire.com/catalog/product?deptId=OUTLET&prodId=020123&par
entId=&bc=1) and making a wall of them at our house. Lots of fun :o).
~Rue
http://www.freechild.info/
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Betsy Hill
**The key is not how much knowledge you have at this point in your
life...it's HOW CURIOUS are you?**
I'd add, just let go of the idea that you are supposed to know
everything already because you are "done" with school. That's a
powerful myth, but it isn't so. Learning doesn't happen well in a
school with textbooks. Learning is a fundamental part of life and
continues lifelong. We all have the opportunity to constantly encounter
new and "unknown" and fascinating things. We're not supposed to stop
learning when we reach school-leaving age.
Any concept that comes up in your life that you wish you knew more about
is an opportunity. It is NOT a missed question on a test. If you are
grading yourself, as a teacher would, with an imaginary red pen, just
put down the pen and stop downgrading yourself. Let go of the idea that
"we were supposed to cover this before" and just enjoy covering (or
toying) with the concepts now.
There's more information in the world than we could swallow in a
century. Just sip it or gulp it as you wish, but know that you'll never
drain the whole ocean.
Betsy
life...it's HOW CURIOUS are you?**
I'd add, just let go of the idea that you are supposed to know
everything already because you are "done" with school. That's a
powerful myth, but it isn't so. Learning doesn't happen well in a
school with textbooks. Learning is a fundamental part of life and
continues lifelong. We all have the opportunity to constantly encounter
new and "unknown" and fascinating things. We're not supposed to stop
learning when we reach school-leaving age.
Any concept that comes up in your life that you wish you knew more about
is an opportunity. It is NOT a missed question on a test. If you are
grading yourself, as a teacher would, with an imaginary red pen, just
put down the pen and stop downgrading yourself. Let go of the idea that
"we were supposed to cover this before" and just enjoy covering (or
toying) with the concepts now.
There's more information in the world than we could swallow in a
century. Just sip it or gulp it as you wish, but know that you'll never
drain the whole ocean.
Betsy
Ren Allen
One of my favorite quotes ever, and one I live by:
"I am constantly doing that which I do not know, in order that I may
learn it"
~Pablo Picasso
Ren
learninginfreedom.com
"I am constantly doing that which I do not know, in order that I may
learn it"
~Pablo Picasso
Ren
learninginfreedom.com
M Walker
Ah, but that Plato tidbit is the ONLY thing I remember
from two semesters of a college Philosophy class!
And I think the only reason that stuck with me is
because my boyfriend's roommate had one of those
computer chairs without a back and pads for your shins
to rest on. I saw it in their room and had no idea
what it was--they had to convince me that it was a
chair. So the "pure form" of "chair" was an example I
could bring to class the next day and talk about.
My mother often says that her three children led her
down paths she'd never have traveled on her own. She
facilitated all sorts of interests we had that she
didn't share, and she learned all sorts of things
she'd never have known if we'd never been born.
- Meg
<<Someone on a thread here pointed out to her three
year old that Plato
thought alot about the names of things. On another
page, someone
pointed out to their child who was drawing triangles
that all of the
angles add up to 180 degrees no matter the size or
type of triangle.
In reading about unschooling, I am finding hundreds of
examples of
this, and I don't know these sorts of things to point
out to my child.>>
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
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from two semesters of a college Philosophy class!
And I think the only reason that stuck with me is
because my boyfriend's roommate had one of those
computer chairs without a back and pads for your shins
to rest on. I saw it in their room and had no idea
what it was--they had to convince me that it was a
chair. So the "pure form" of "chair" was an example I
could bring to class the next day and talk about.
My mother often says that her three children led her
down paths she'd never have traveled on her own. She
facilitated all sorts of interests we had that she
didn't share, and she learned all sorts of things
she'd never have known if we'd never been born.
- Meg
<<Someone on a thread here pointed out to her three
year old that Plato
thought alot about the names of things. On another
page, someone
pointed out to their child who was drawing triangles
that all of the
angles add up to 180 degrees no matter the size or
type of triangle.
In reading about unschooling, I am finding hundreds of
examples of
this, and I don't know these sorts of things to point
out to my child.>>
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com
Sandra Dodd
On Feb 13, 2006, at 12:40 PM, Betsy Hill wrote:
You can TRY to stop.
Some people, sadly, seem to succeed and feel more successful the less
they're learning. They feel more "grown."
The same kinds of people tend not to play.
And darned if play and learning don't turn out to be related!
Sandra
> We're not supposed to stopYou can if you want to.
> learning when we reach school-leaving age.
You can TRY to stop.
Some people, sadly, seem to succeed and feel more successful the less
they're learning. They feel more "grown."
The same kinds of people tend not to play.
And darned if play and learning don't turn out to be related!
Sandra
Kathy
I sure can relate to this! I, too, did well in school, and the
further away from school I've gotten, the more I realize how little I
really retained. Invariably what I remember is either something I
was interested in or something that I used in my daily life. With my
kids, I'm finding that I'm learning anew and enjoying it a whole lot
more. I never cared much for science in school, but my boys are so
interested in nature and animals that I've cultivated an interest in
some of the same things. I'm finding that without all the pressure
to perform, I really enjoy learning about all sorts of things that I
used to hate. And a lot of these things make more sense now because
I'm learning with a context and not just memorizing facts out of a
textbook.
As an aside, I'm rather a timid person (school didn't help with
that), but being a mother has forced me to be more outgoing and I
have no problem asking the "experts" at museums, zoos, etc. questions
because I want my kids to be comfortable asking whatever questions
they have. I don't want them to be like I was.
Kathy
--- In [email protected], Erin Erin
<squeakybiscuit@...> wrote:
school+education&w3=Home+school+education&w4=Middle+school+education&w
5=New+york+school+education&w6=School+education+in+california&c=6&s=18
1&.sig=XeERtAmMH6xOclFlfF3kXw> High
ol+education&w3=Home+school+education&w4=Middle+school+education&w5=Ne
w+york+school+education&w6=School+education+in+california&c=6&s=181&.s
ig=89oOLkTPWnhxf__b2u72QA> Home
ol+education&w3=Home+school+education&w4=Middle+school+education&w5=Ne
w+york+school+education&w6=School+education+in+california&c=6&s=181&.s
ig=1aW-X2S2ZokW3qzZ8RgBsQ> Middle
hool+education&w3=Home+school+education&w4=Middle+school+education&w5=
New+york+school+education&w6=School+education+in+california&c=6&s=181&
.sig=ekWG86FHE6rjFjd8jaZHOw> New
school+education&w3=Home+school+education&w4=Middle+school+education&w
5=New+york+school+education&w6=School+education+in+california&c=6&s=18
1&.sig=aSJE8BjHS18knvLinwtebQ> School
High+school+education&w3=Home+school+education&w4=Middle+school+educat
ion&w5=New+york+school+education&w6=School+education+in+california&c=6
&s=181&.sig=gkGybS6R2TNc7Ffa1FldiA>
Discussion>"
[email protected]?subject=Unsubscribe>
further away from school I've gotten, the more I realize how little I
really retained. Invariably what I remember is either something I
was interested in or something that I used in my daily life. With my
kids, I'm finding that I'm learning anew and enjoying it a whole lot
more. I never cared much for science in school, but my boys are so
interested in nature and animals that I've cultivated an interest in
some of the same things. I'm finding that without all the pressure
to perform, I really enjoy learning about all sorts of things that I
used to hate. And a lot of these things make more sense now because
I'm learning with a context and not just memorizing facts out of a
textbook.
As an aside, I'm rather a timid person (school didn't help with
that), but being a mother has forced me to be more outgoing and I
have no problem asking the "experts" at museums, zoos, etc. questions
because I want my kids to be comfortable asking whatever questions
they have. I don't want them to be like I was.
Kathy
--- In [email protected], Erin Erin
<squeakybiscuit@...> wrote:
>an A
> Ren,
>
> Actually, I'm 33 and have three kids. They are 13,12 and 8. I was
> student and in the gifted class and came out of school feeling VERYsmart.
> It wasn't until I became a parent and got the internet that Irealized how
> much I didn't know.usually do
>
> When my kids ask questions, I normally do not know the answer. We
> a search on google and if that doesn't yeild any results we post ona
> message board geared to experts in that area to talk to someone whomight
> know.that I don't
>
> Perhaps it's because none of the schoolish topics interested me
> remember anything I learned in school. I got A's in math, so I'msure we
> went over the angle thing at some point. The facts just escape menow.
>about a
> The key to being "good" at school is basically retaining facts for
> week until the test and then forgetting them. If you're "good" atthat you
> are made to feel really smart. Then you get out in the real worldand
> realize that "school" smart and real smart are two very differentthings.
>wrong....I'm
>
> Erin
>
>
> On 2/12/06, Ren Allen <starsuncloud@...> wrote:
> >
> > "What to do when you don't know enough neat facts to interest your
> > child?"
> >
> > Ok, I'm going out on a limb here, so just slap me if I'm
> > going to take a stab at analyzing. I could be waaaaay off, butmaybe
> > not.:)to
> > You're youngish? Maybe only one child so far (I'm not going back
> > read posts and don't remember) possibly two...they're young still.sure of
> >
> > You came out of school like a LOT of us here, beaten down, not
> > yourself and convinced there wasn't anything ultra specialor "smart"
> > about you.here,
> >
> > Well guess what? All the "smart" parents you're reading about
> > probably went through a period of time when they were really,really
> > unsure too. School doesn't do much in preparing us for day to dayinto our
> > information. What swirls all these lovely bits of information
> > lives, is INTEREST.LOT
> >
> > I've learned about angles in the last few years, I've learned a
> > about philosophy and Plato and such in the last few years.Everything
> > I learned about history was done after leaving school. Most of mythe
> > "cultural literacy" was formed in my late 20's up to now.
> >
> > I'm 36 now, with a teen and almost teen in the house. I've learned
> > right alongside them....researching bizarre factoids and trivia
> > whenever we feel like it.
> >
> > The key is not how much knowledge you have at this point in your
> > life...it's HOW CURIOUS are you? That curiosity and interest is
> > foundation for great unschooling, not how much information iscrammed
> > into your brain!:) Honest.of
> >
> > I feel like a dunce on these lists some days....there's such a
> > wonderful variety of interesting, brilliant and wise people here.
> > Don't let it bug ya. Just grab onto one of those interesting bits
> > information and ride the wave!! I can't tell you how many times Iread
> > a post and run my butt over to google to learn more.group.
> >
> > Just like your children, you are building a storehouse of the
> > information that you enjoy picking up.
> >
> > Ren
> > learninginfreedom.com
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > "List Posting Policies" are provided in the files area of this
> >t=ms&k=Graduate+school+education&w1=Graduate+school+education&w2=High+
> > Visit the Unschooling website and message boards: <
> > http://www.unschooling.info>
> >
> >
> >
> > SPONSORED LINKS
> > Graduate school education<http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?
school+education&w3=Home+school+education&w4=Middle+school+education&w
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> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
Betsy Hill
** You can if you want to.
You can TRY to stop.
Some people, sadly, seem to succeed and feel more successful the less
they're learning. They feel more "grown."
The same kinds of people tend not to play.
And darned if play and learning don't turn out to be related!**
Right!
Stopping playing is about the most powerful way I can think of to stop
(or stunt) learning.
(This is anti-advice. Don't anyone take it!)
Betsy
You can TRY to stop.
Some people, sadly, seem to succeed and feel more successful the less
they're learning. They feel more "grown."
The same kinds of people tend not to play.
And darned if play and learning don't turn out to be related!**
Right!
Stopping playing is about the most powerful way I can think of to stop
(or stunt) learning.
(This is anti-advice. Don't anyone take it!)
Betsy
S Drag-teine
"and are now considered "potters," meaning have been making traditional
pottery all their lives."
I have only thrown pottery for three years - I do well enough I guess since
I sell out at most shows I do but I guess I can't be a "potter" since my
mother didn't throw pottery and I didn't have the opportunity to throw
potter since birth.
Shannon
Melaleuca Customer
Join our club and swap paperback books for FREE - PaperBackSwap.com
-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected]
[mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Sandra Dodd
Sent: Sunday, February 12, 2006 8:11 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [UnschoolingDiscussion] Not smart enough to unschool
pottery all their lives."
I have only thrown pottery for three years - I do well enough I guess since
I sell out at most shows I do but I guess I can't be a "potter" since my
mother didn't throw pottery and I didn't have the opportunity to throw
potter since birth.
Shannon
Melaleuca Customer
Join our club and swap paperback books for FREE - PaperBackSwap.com
-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected]
[mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Sandra Dodd
Sent: Sunday, February 12, 2006 8:11 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [UnschoolingDiscussion] Not smart enough to unschool
On Feb 12, 2006, at 5:18 PM, Ren Allen wrote:
> I feel like a dunce on these lists some days....there's such a
> wonderful variety of interesting, brilliant and wise people here.
============
"Dunce." What a school word!
I spent some time with Pam Sorooshian and her two younger girls last
month. I feel intimidated sometimes by the depth of Roxana's
knowledge, and the intensity of some of her interests. All of Pam's
kids have taken classes at a college near them. That makes me look
at my kids and think for a fleeting moment that they're like pound
puppies next to Pam's show dogs. It's not fair, it's not right, it's
not totally true (but it might be a little bit true <bwg>), but my
kids probably know as much as her kids do, it's just way more
scattery. Pam's kids know a lot about a few things. Rosie knows
lots about soccer and horses. My kids, nothing. My kids know a
little about a lot of things. <g> I don't mind that, but I still
have a pause when I'm around someone whose child is an expert at
something.
Here's the deal, though...
When I was in school, I was relatively expert on The Beatles.
Certainly didn't learn it in school, but the other kids would ask me
when the next album was coming out, or who wrote which songs, or
whatever. My best friend played piano better than anyone else in
town. She didn't learn that in school, but school certainly made use
of it, and gave her music credit for being the accompanist for the
chorus class. (Lame deal, but she enjoyed being there more than
taking P.E., which it got her out of.) One friend was a silversmith;
learned from his dad, and was making jewelry good enough to sell by
his teens. Some of the girls from Santa Clara Pueblo were making
potters, and are now considered "potters," meaning have been making
traditional pottery all their lives. When we were kids, they were
experts already (beginning, but had experience and opportunity others
didn't have). Some kids rode rodeo, or trained horses or dogs for
ranchwork.
The range of what kids do and what parents know is no broader or more
narrow among unschoolers than other-but parents whose kids are in
school have the dubious luxury of leaving it all up to the teachers;
unschooling parents need to wade into the world and start gathering
some good stuff!
Sandra
"List Posting Policies" are provided in the files area of this group.
Visit the Unschooling website and message boards:
<http://www.unschooling.info>
Yahoo! Groups Links
Sandra Dodd
On Feb 15, 2006, at 12:24 PM, S Drag-teine wrote:
since
I sell out at most shows I do but I guess I can't be a "potter" since my
mother didn't throw pottery and I didn't have the opportunity to throw
potter since birth.
======================================================================
Santa Clara Pueblo potters are practicing an art form of long
continuing tradition.
You could never become a potter of Santa Clara Pueblo. Neither could I.
The definition below (which you quoted) along with the quotation
marks around "potter" were intended to suggest the added depth of the
situation. A teen starting out wouldn't be considered one of the
potters at the pueblo, but after years of doing it and mastering the
whole process, then might be considered "a potter" within that
tradition.
They don't throw the pots, they're coil pots of local clay, fired in
traditional ways.
http://www.art-legends.com/santaclara.html
http://www.puebloarts.com/Santa%20Clara/santa_clara.htm
http://www.camerontradingpost.net/catalog_c45033.html
(Best photos I could find with a google search of Santa Clara Pueblo
traditional pottery
======================================================================
The original topic was about how people learn things naturally,
wasn't it?
Let's get back to that.
Sandra
> "and are now considered "potters," meaning have been makingI have only thrown pottery for three years - I do well enough I guess
> traditional
> pottery all their lives."
>
since
I sell out at most shows I do but I guess I can't be a "potter" since my
mother didn't throw pottery and I didn't have the opportunity to throw
potter since birth.
======================================================================
Santa Clara Pueblo potters are practicing an art form of long
continuing tradition.
You could never become a potter of Santa Clara Pueblo. Neither could I.
The definition below (which you quoted) along with the quotation
marks around "potter" were intended to suggest the added depth of the
situation. A teen starting out wouldn't be considered one of the
potters at the pueblo, but after years of doing it and mastering the
whole process, then might be considered "a potter" within that
tradition.
They don't throw the pots, they're coil pots of local clay, fired in
traditional ways.
http://www.art-legends.com/santaclara.html
http://www.puebloarts.com/Santa%20Clara/santa_clara.htm
http://www.camerontradingpost.net/catalog_c45033.html
(Best photos I could find with a google search of Santa Clara Pueblo
traditional pottery
======================================================================
The original topic was about how people learn things naturally,
wasn't it?
Let's get back to that.
Sandra
[email protected]
In a message dated 2/12/2006 8:48:59 PM Eastern Standard Time,
starsuncloud@... writes:
have any sense), but then act and treat me like I wasn't, so I got it two-fold.
It took me at least 10 years out of school before I even got a glimer that
maybe they were wrong-after all, isn't it "mother knows best"? Yikes. Not in my
opinion, anymore! And in the 10 or so years since that glimmer, I've started to
hesitantly believe that I'm really smart-though it is SO easy to backslide
when something comes along like this board full of smart folks! :~) You're not
alone, Erin, in feeling that sometimes. Just focus on the fun it is to look
things up and learn new things-we have a blast doing that here, and sometimes I'm
almost too excited and anxious for when the boys are ready for MORE! :~)
Peace,
Sang
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
starsuncloud@... writes:
> Isn't it sad that whether or not you leave school feeling smart orI did, too. At home, my mother would tell me I was "so smart" (but didn't
> dumb, you quickly find out that you've been fooled? That school didn't
> do anything to help you do the things that really matter for your own
> life's journey. I had this notion that I wasn't very bright, that I
> just couldn't follow through well enough and wasn't "living up to
> potential", basically lots of yucky baggage that didn't help me.
>
have any sense), but then act and treat me like I wasn't, so I got it two-fold.
It took me at least 10 years out of school before I even got a glimer that
maybe they were wrong-after all, isn't it "mother knows best"? Yikes. Not in my
opinion, anymore! And in the 10 or so years since that glimmer, I've started to
hesitantly believe that I'm really smart-though it is SO easy to backslide
when something comes along like this board full of smart folks! :~) You're not
alone, Erin, in feeling that sometimes. Just focus on the fun it is to look
things up and learn new things-we have a blast doing that here, and sometimes I'm
almost too excited and anxious for when the boys are ready for MORE! :~)
Peace,
Sang
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]