Re: Thoughts
Thomas and Nanci Kuykendall
At 09:00 PM 6/13/99 -0400, you wrote:
this form of communication, I believe. You MUST choose your words
carefully in order to effectively communicate with a group of strangers in
this medium, as there is no body language, foreknowledge of the speakers'
beliefs or personalities, facial expressions or voice tone (all the things
mentioned before) to put their words in context. In effective novels,
conversation is always accompanied by inner thought or body language of the
characters, something we do not have the benefit of here. I have found the
same problem on other lists where the topic is important and emotionally
charged, such as this one.
'Maybe we should make like novels and include our thoughts and body
language, etc...' she thought with a wry smirk. 'Maybe then we could all
get along and focus more on Unschooling and less on finger pointing, or
whatever. Actually, with all the creative minds around here,' she mused,
her eyes gleaming with a delighted smile of anticipation 'this could lead
to some really fun ways to avoid future confusion.' She rubbed her hands
together expectantly.
Nanci K. in Idaho
>From: mainmom@...I agree, but it is not limited to this list. It is mainly the problem with
>What I do find uncomfrotable, and have just realized, is the underlying
>tone of things being right and wrong. Of terms being picked apart and
>corrected. Of having to choose words too carefully. Reminders of what
>subjects should be and what should not be. Of when to move on or not.
>I haven't seen anyone curse or call someone names. I haven't seen anyone
>ramble on about their health or the weather. I haven't seen anyone post
>for days about something that has been long forgotten.
>Mary in FL
this form of communication, I believe. You MUST choose your words
carefully in order to effectively communicate with a group of strangers in
this medium, as there is no body language, foreknowledge of the speakers'
beliefs or personalities, facial expressions or voice tone (all the things
mentioned before) to put their words in context. In effective novels,
conversation is always accompanied by inner thought or body language of the
characters, something we do not have the benefit of here. I have found the
same problem on other lists where the topic is important and emotionally
charged, such as this one.
'Maybe we should make like novels and include our thoughts and body
language, etc...' she thought with a wry smirk. 'Maybe then we could all
get along and focus more on Unschooling and less on finger pointing, or
whatever. Actually, with all the creative minds around here,' she mused,
her eyes gleaming with a delighted smile of anticipation 'this could lead
to some really fun ways to avoid future confusion.' She rubbed her hands
together expectantly.
Nanci K. in Idaho
B & T Simpson
>it surely would be amusing and fun to read! also wondering to myself, if
>
>
>>'Maybe we should make like novels and include our thoughts and body
>language, etc...' she thought with a wry smirk. 'Maybe then we could all
>get along and focus more on Unschooling and less on finger pointing, or
>whatever. Actually, with all the creative minds around here,' she mused,
>her eyes gleaming with a delighted smile of anticipation 'this could lead
>to some really fun ways to avoid future confusion.' She rubbed her hands
>together expectantly.>>>
>
>Nanci K. in Idaho, I don't know If I could do it I thought to myself, but
anyone on the list expecially those with more experience, has anyone come up
with a great letter or something along those lines explaining what
unschooling is to family members who are overly concerned that we are not
insuring that our children are learning what they should know? My father
asked me the other week how Morgan (12yo) was doing, and expressed his
concerns, he said "I understand the interest lead learning (big surprise to
me!) but what if she is not interested in the right stuff??" I stated that
many people have gone this way an been very successful and are doing fine!
he said that he had moved several times as a child, and missed out on the
basics of english, and to this day could not tell me what they were, what I
said in return was " well dad, I went thru the public school system, and was
forced to learn all of that and still to this day coudn't tell you the
difference between a noun a pronoun an adverb ect.." I can somewhat , but
that would have blured my point! they don't know we are planning to unschool
the other two in the fall, (well started the day they were released from
thos walls!) and I dread the thought of telling them, they are just sure she
won't be able to hold a job either , because she won't be discaplined into a
structured environment! how did all of you who have been doing this for
years explain this and do they ever get it? I understand they are just
concerned, and this is all new to everyone, but I would like to help them to
understand better without forcing it down their throats or being nasty about
it, and the funny thing is, my dad didn't go to collage, and had a job in
electronics at Up John, he tore apart microscopes and Maspectromiters which
at that point there were few people who knew how to do that and he was one
of them! he did take corispondence courses in electronics while managing
mcdonalds and caring for us!
confused and wanting them to understand and feel compfortable with this
whole thing so that they don't end up quizing my kids!
Tanya Ohio
>
>------------------------------------------------------------------------
>Looking for a new hobby? Want to make a new friend?
>http://www.onelist.com
>Come join one of over 165,000 e-mail communities at ONElist!
>------------------------------------------------------------------------
>Check it out!
>http://www.unschooling.com
>
>
[email protected]
In a message dated 6/14/1999 10:28:39 AM, michigan@... wrote:
<<"I understand the interest lead learning (big surprise to
me!) but what if she is not interested in the right stuff??">>
Ask him what "the right stuff" would be.
Most people assume there is one body of material which all schools teach, and
that's not so. As to literature and details of science and such, it varies
greatly. The right stuff might be more likely seen as what gives her
substantial opportunities to think, be analytical, to connect history to
science and music to math and all that. Maybe a conversation about the best
stuff he ever learned (and how and where) would be enlightening for your dad.
Sandra
<<"I understand the interest lead learning (big surprise to
me!) but what if she is not interested in the right stuff??">>
Ask him what "the right stuff" would be.
Most people assume there is one body of material which all schools teach, and
that's not so. As to literature and details of science and such, it varies
greatly. The right stuff might be more likely seen as what gives her
substantial opportunities to think, be analytical, to connect history to
science and music to math and all that. Maybe a conversation about the best
stuff he ever learned (and how and where) would be enlightening for your dad.
Sandra
[email protected]
In a message dated 6/14/99 11:45:27 AM Central Daylight Time,
SandraDodd@... writes:
<< Maybe a conversation about the best
stuff he ever learned (and how and where) would be enlightening for your
dad. >>
Great advice. In the few short days I have been here I am getting so much
simple yet powerful advice.
Kelly
SandraDodd@... writes:
<< Maybe a conversation about the best
stuff he ever learned (and how and where) would be enlightening for your
dad. >>
Great advice. In the few short days I have been here I am getting so much
simple yet powerful advice.
Kelly
[email protected]
> In a message dated 6/14/99 11:45:27 AM Central Daylight Time,I, too, think this is great advice. However, it reminded me of a
> SandraDodd@... writes:
>
> << Maybe a conversation about the best
> stuff he ever learned (and how and where) would be enlightening for your
> dad. >>
conversation I had with a friend of mine from college who is my age (32). I
was explaining homeschooling (just in the most basic sense, not in the
details of unschooling, just the notion of not sending your child to school)
and why I was planning on it when I had kids. Her reply was, "I think kids
should go to school because everyone needs to learn how to be bored and how
to jump through hoops." I was so floored by this response (usually I get
something about socialization or quality of education or jobs or college),
this recognition of the problems of school but embracing it at the same time,
that I truly didn't know what to say. Has anyone else ever encountered this
argument from someone? If so, what did you say?
Elizabeth
[email protected]
In a message dated 6/14/99 2:01:06 PM PST, Evalsquid@... writes:
<< Her reply was, "I think kids
should go to school because everyone needs to learn how to be bored and how
to jump through hoops." I was so floored by this response (usually I get
something about socialization or quality of education or jobs or college),
this recognition of the problems of school but embracing it at the same
time,
that I truly didn't know what to say. Has anyone else ever encountered this
argument from someone? If so, what did you say?
mind (spoken by my mother in law, who worries they won't be able to get a
job.)
I reply, usually to those types of comments, that I don't want my children to
"learn to be bored". I want my children to learn how to get rid of boredom
so that they are always engaged in something that is helping them grow into
productive adults. People who love their jobs, rarely get bored with them.
If my children can figure out what they LOVE to do, and make a living at it -
then there is no need to be bored in school or out.
Mary
<< Her reply was, "I think kids
should go to school because everyone needs to learn how to be bored and how
to jump through hoops." I was so floored by this response (usually I get
something about socialization or quality of education or jobs or college),
this recognition of the problems of school but embracing it at the same
time,
that I truly didn't know what to say. Has anyone else ever encountered this
argument from someone? If so, what did you say?
>>Similar comments. "How will they learn to sit at a desk all day?" comes to
mind (spoken by my mother in law, who worries they won't be able to get a
job.)
I reply, usually to those types of comments, that I don't want my children to
"learn to be bored". I want my children to learn how to get rid of boredom
so that they are always engaged in something that is helping them grow into
productive adults. People who love their jobs, rarely get bored with them.
If my children can figure out what they LOVE to do, and make a living at it -
then there is no need to be bored in school or out.
Mary
A.Y.
Yep, I've heard this too, and always feel very sad about this.
I hope my kids grown up to be radically different than a hoop jumper, and start
to change the world about that hoop jumping stuff! :) <Bg>
Ann
Has anyone else ever encountered this
I hope my kids grown up to be radically different than a hoop jumper, and start
to change the world about that hoop jumping stuff! :) <Bg>
Ann
Has anyone else ever encountered this
> argument from someone? If so, what did you say?
>
The White's
Yes, my sister also thinks somewhat the same. She feels that her children
will not be prepared for "the real world" if they have not suffered thru the
same things everyone else does. She thinks they will not be able to handle
life without exposing them to all things, including violent TV and video
games (my 8 yr old nephew has been playing for about a yr the video game
those kids from Columbine shootings were playing, can't remember the name).
She doesn't go out of her way to expose them, but she doesn't monitor much
at all. She also tends to tell her children, in their times of crisis, to
get over it, that's life...or get used to it, that's life.
I prefer to give my children an attitude that they can work to change things
they don't like....a sense of creativity in approaching problems or things
that don't work, toward fixing them. I prefer to keep violence away from my
family, including nightly news programs (my kids are still young, 6 & 2). I
prefer exposing my kids to many different cultures and let them learn about
life by living it, not suffering thru it.
Cindy in VA
will not be prepared for "the real world" if they have not suffered thru the
same things everyone else does. She thinks they will not be able to handle
life without exposing them to all things, including violent TV and video
games (my 8 yr old nephew has been playing for about a yr the video game
those kids from Columbine shootings were playing, can't remember the name).
She doesn't go out of her way to expose them, but she doesn't monitor much
at all. She also tends to tell her children, in their times of crisis, to
get over it, that's life...or get used to it, that's life.
I prefer to give my children an attitude that they can work to change things
they don't like....a sense of creativity in approaching problems or things
that don't work, toward fixing them. I prefer to keep violence away from my
family, including nightly news programs (my kids are still young, 6 & 2). I
prefer exposing my kids to many different cultures and let them learn about
life by living it, not suffering thru it.
Cindy in VA
----- Original Message -----
From: <Evalsquid@...>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Monday, June 14, 1999 2:59 PM
Subject: Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] Thoughts
> From: Evalsquid@...
>
>
> > In a message dated 6/14/99 11:45:27 AM Central Daylight Time,
> > SandraDodd@... writes:
> >
> > << Maybe a conversation about the best
> > stuff he ever learned (and how and where) would be enlightening for
your
> > dad. >>
>
> I, too, think this is great advice. However, it reminded me of a
> conversation I had with a friend of mine from college who is my age (32).
I
> was explaining homeschooling (just in the most basic sense, not in the
> details of unschooling, just the notion of not sending your child to
school)
> and why I was planning on it when I had kids. Her reply was, "I think
kids
> should go to school because everyone needs to learn how to be bored and
how
> to jump through hoops." I was so floored by this response (usually I get
> something about socialization or quality of education or jobs or college),
> this recognition of the problems of school but embracing it at the same
time,
> that I truly didn't know what to say. Has anyone else ever encountered
this
> argument from someone? If so, what did you say?
>
> Elizabeth
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> How has ONElist changed your life?
> Share your story with us at http://www.onelist.com
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Check it out!
> http://www.unschooling.com
>
[email protected]
In a message dated 6/14/99 2:01:08 PM PST, Evalsquid@... writes:
<< Her reply was, "I think kids should go to school because everyone needs
to learn how to be bored and how to jump through hoops." >>
this sounds like a person who is very unhappy with their present career/job.
<g>
I have never, ever heard that comment before. Maybe a good comeback would be
that you disagree because you want your kids to know they don't have to live
boring lifes, jump through hoops to satisfy someone else. You want htem to
be happy in no matter what they do and thats the goal?
Christina
<< Her reply was, "I think kids should go to school because everyone needs
to learn how to be bored and how to jump through hoops." >>
this sounds like a person who is very unhappy with their present career/job.
<g>
I have never, ever heard that comment before. Maybe a good comeback would be
that you disagree because you want your kids to know they don't have to live
boring lifes, jump through hoops to satisfy someone else. You want htem to
be happy in no matter what they do and thats the goal?
Christina