rules and principles and math
nellebelle
I thought a quote from a book I'm reading was interesting.
I'm reading the first book, Shaman's Crossing, in the latest trilogy, Soldier Son Trilogy, written by someone I met about 25 years ago. (you can find her website at Robin Hobb)
She is not an unschooler or a homeschooler, although she had four children. Her youngest is now a teen.
This quote touches on the differences between appearing to know math and really knowing math and between rules and principles.
Mary Ellen
"I was good at math, but I was good at it in a rote way, just as a small child can recite "nine plus twelve is twenty-one" long before he knows what numbers are or that they signify quantities. I could manipulate numbers and symbols accurately because I knew the rules. Gord, however, understood the principles. He explained exponents in a way that made me understand that I had been looking at a map of mathematics and Gord knew the countryside of it. That is an inadequate explanation for such a subtle awakening, but it is the best I can do."
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
I'm reading the first book, Shaman's Crossing, in the latest trilogy, Soldier Son Trilogy, written by someone I met about 25 years ago. (you can find her website at Robin Hobb)
She is not an unschooler or a homeschooler, although she had four children. Her youngest is now a teen.
This quote touches on the differences between appearing to know math and really knowing math and between rules and principles.
Mary Ellen
"I was good at math, but I was good at it in a rote way, just as a small child can recite "nine plus twelve is twenty-one" long before he knows what numbers are or that they signify quantities. I could manipulate numbers and symbols accurately because I knew the rules. Gord, however, understood the principles. He explained exponents in a way that made me understand that I had been looking at a map of mathematics and Gord knew the countryside of it. That is an inadequate explanation for such a subtle awakening, but it is the best I can do."
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
I really liked that math quote. When I went to put it somewhere for others
to find later, I found this:
----------------------
I saved this without keeping the name, date or place and it's been a while
so I honestly don't remember who wrote it at all. And I bet the author has
changed her thoughts, so it's a relic and can stand without credit. It was from
some unschooling discussion in 2004, and more recent comments will follow.
-=- The reason this conversation is really bothering me, is because Sandra
kept responding with other points that had nothing to do with my one and only
question. (Her points are GREAT ones, and ones I in fact agree with, but they
are points about something other that my one question: Should I give my 4 & 7
year olds that particular game? She never said Yes (and why) or NO (and why).
You might ask yourself if you were trying to have a conversation with someone
and they were skipping over your particular question, and making lots of other
points that had nothing to do with what you were still trying to talk about!!!
I'm not wound up and defensive and angry. Although I find myself frustrated,
and now on the defense trying to tell you (and Sandra) that I agree with all
those points she made, BUT IT'S NOT WHAT I'M TALKING ABOUT. That's all.-=-
A question like "should I buy this, yes or no?" isn't the kind of questions
others can answer very well. And if we did, we'd need to say WHY we thought
no, which would involve explaining a principle. And with all of the best
answers, it needs to start, "It depends."
If we answer questions with "yes" and "no," and give people what they claim
to want, or what they think they want, we are chucking fish out instead of
providing information on how to fish, how to make one's own custom fishing
equipment and when and where the fishing is great. Unschooling can't work as a
series of yes/no questions.
Another principle at work. Helping people learn to find their own answers is
vastly superior to distributing answers on demand. And those who volunteer
their time and experience are not willing to hold other's hands for years or
months. They want to empower others. Empowerment is a principle, not a rule.
Learning to examine one's own life and needs and beliefs is necessary for
unschooling to work. When priorities and principles are coming clearer, such questions
as whether or not to buy a particular game or tool or movie or food are EASY,
simple, happy questions. That's why the mom quoted above didn't get the
simple straight answer she thought she needed. No one wanted to waste time or
energy sending her down the wrong path.
-------------------------------------------
(end of that quote)
-----------------------------------------
Sometimes people think they just need to know something simple, a rule, when
they really could use having a principle so they wouldn't NEED the simple
answers or more rules.
That above and Mary Ellen's math quote and comments are both here:
http://sandradodd.com/rulebound
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
to find later, I found this:
----------------------
I saved this without keeping the name, date or place and it's been a while
so I honestly don't remember who wrote it at all. And I bet the author has
changed her thoughts, so it's a relic and can stand without credit. It was from
some unschooling discussion in 2004, and more recent comments will follow.
-=- The reason this conversation is really bothering me, is because Sandra
kept responding with other points that had nothing to do with my one and only
question. (Her points are GREAT ones, and ones I in fact agree with, but they
are points about something other that my one question: Should I give my 4 & 7
year olds that particular game? She never said Yes (and why) or NO (and why).
You might ask yourself if you were trying to have a conversation with someone
and they were skipping over your particular question, and making lots of other
points that had nothing to do with what you were still trying to talk about!!!
I'm not wound up and defensive and angry. Although I find myself frustrated,
and now on the defense trying to tell you (and Sandra) that I agree with all
those points she made, BUT IT'S NOT WHAT I'M TALKING ABOUT. That's all.-=-
A question like "should I buy this, yes or no?" isn't the kind of questions
others can answer very well. And if we did, we'd need to say WHY we thought
no, which would involve explaining a principle. And with all of the best
answers, it needs to start, "It depends."
If we answer questions with "yes" and "no," and give people what they claim
to want, or what they think they want, we are chucking fish out instead of
providing information on how to fish, how to make one's own custom fishing
equipment and when and where the fishing is great. Unschooling can't work as a
series of yes/no questions.
Another principle at work. Helping people learn to find their own answers is
vastly superior to distributing answers on demand. And those who volunteer
their time and experience are not willing to hold other's hands for years or
months. They want to empower others. Empowerment is a principle, not a rule.
Learning to examine one's own life and needs and beliefs is necessary for
unschooling to work. When priorities and principles are coming clearer, such questions
as whether or not to buy a particular game or tool or movie or food are EASY,
simple, happy questions. That's why the mom quoted above didn't get the
simple straight answer she thought she needed. No one wanted to waste time or
energy sending her down the wrong path.
-------------------------------------------
(end of that quote)
-----------------------------------------
Sometimes people think they just need to know something simple, a rule, when
they really could use having a principle so they wouldn't NEED the simple
answers or more rules.
That above and Mary Ellen's math quote and comments are both here:
http://sandradodd.com/rulebound
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]