Been lurking
mother_bhaer
Sorry I just posted a question and I don't think I've introduced
myself yet. Been lurking for months and I guess I just forgot I
hadn't done that.
I'm Terri. Been married 12 years. We have 7yod and 11yos. Ds loves
Star Wars Lego computer game, climbing trees, magic tricks of all
kinds, friends to play with, going barefoot and building with Legos.
Dd loves to paint and draw, playing with dolls, Polly Pockets, and
horses, and listening to Kim Possible cd. She also loves to write
encouraging notes to everybody and mail them all over the place
(after she has me write it so she can copy it in her own handwriting).
We've always homeschooled. I've always been relaxed, but began to be
frustrated trying to make ds (who does not like to read even though
he can well) do the little bit of school-type work we were doing.
Back in Dec. I remembered unschooling and I started my big research
project that is ongoing. I'm convinced 100%, dh maybe 70%. I'm
still working on him. :)
I've been greatly encouraged and I have learned so much here already.
Terri
myself yet. Been lurking for months and I guess I just forgot I
hadn't done that.
I'm Terri. Been married 12 years. We have 7yod and 11yos. Ds loves
Star Wars Lego computer game, climbing trees, magic tricks of all
kinds, friends to play with, going barefoot and building with Legos.
Dd loves to paint and draw, playing with dolls, Polly Pockets, and
horses, and listening to Kim Possible cd. She also loves to write
encouraging notes to everybody and mail them all over the place
(after she has me write it so she can copy it in her own handwriting).
We've always homeschooled. I've always been relaxed, but began to be
frustrated trying to make ds (who does not like to read even though
he can well) do the little bit of school-type work we were doing.
Back in Dec. I remembered unschooling and I started my big research
project that is ongoing. I'm convinced 100%, dh maybe 70%. I'm
still working on him. :)
I've been greatly encouraged and I have learned so much here already.
Terri
[email protected]
In a message dated 6/29/05 3:24:33 PM, Kent_Terri@... writes:
There's a new John Holt review online he might like. It's a man writing.
Some guys like that. (The quotes are John Holt, anyway, and the rest is Deb
Lewis, a solid and confident unschooler.
http://sandradodd.com/holt/teachyourown
http://sandradodd.com/holt/alifeworthliving
http://sandradodd.com/holt/quotes.html
Some other Holt stuff...
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> I'm convinced 100%, dh maybe 70%. I'm70% is quite strong for a husband in the first few months! <g>
> still working on him. :)
>
There's a new John Holt review online he might like. It's a man writing.
Some guys like that. (The quotes are John Holt, anyway, and the rest is Deb
Lewis, a solid and confident unschooler.
http://sandradodd.com/holt/teachyourown
http://sandradodd.com/holt/alifeworthliving
http://sandradodd.com/holt/quotes.html
Some other Holt stuff...
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Karri Lewis
Hi I haven't posted in awhile,
I'm not sure about what I can or should be doing about this:
My kids are 1 and 3. My 3-year-old is very spirited. Let me first say that I truly believe in abiding by the natural rhythms of my children. I'm finding it hard to balance this at night when my dd is cranky, but refusing to go to bed when she's tired. I have tried in the past to get her to bed and she just won't sleep. She continually pops up and won't stay in the bed. She says that she wants mommy or daddy with her. If we do lay down with her at the earlier time, she tosses and turns and won't sleep even though she is very tired. This is hard because I only have so long with her to lay down because I have to go to DS too. So we usually just have her come out and lay on the couch where daddy is watching very loud tv and of course she won't go to sleep, even though we can see that she is exhausted. The problem is that DH refuses to lie down with her in the family bed at an "early" (to him) time because he doesn't want to fall asleep and he wants to stay up later. I wish
that I could just have her play quietly in her room, but she is afraid to be alone in there. I feel torn too because I have a very awake 1 year-old to take care of as well. He too only wants mommy at night. DH hates to have him crying in his ear when I go lay down with Lindsay. Also, DS is a night owl. Is there anyway to get them on the same sleep rhythm? Or is DS just too young still? And since they are two totally different kids this probably will never happen, right? We (dh and I) read stories to DD and try to promote calm, although I must say that DH continues to watch loud t.v. that effects all of us. DH is unwilling to turn tv off to promote calm when we are trying to wind down. The bedrooms in our house are very small so the rocking chair is in the playroom where our only tv is. DD usually ends up going to bed with DH when she probably should have went (because of tiredness) about two hours before. I feel this is wrong and not respecting her body's needs because she
is obviously tired. She has a tendency to wake up cranky in the morning too.
I also feel that we are at a loss for having any couple time to talk at night and since we do the family bed also, we are never alone to talk. On top of it, at night we have a very tired DD screaming at us. I know that this will pass and is very fleeting. I'm just afraid this arrangement is not working for us and is really taking its toll on our marriage. I tend to get angry that DH won't help with the kids more and he's exhausted from working all day (11 1/2 hrs) and doesn't really want to help. When I do ask him for help and he does it, he seems very resentful We are BOTH just exhausted. We do have my mom watch the kids on occasion so that we can have couple time, but quite frankly this does not seem like enough time to have good communication in our marriage. Our marriage is definitely suffering and I don't know what to do about gaining more ways for us to find time for each other. Any suggestions/advice would be appreciated.
Karri, Lindsay (4/16/02) and Camden (6/8/04)
I like to concentrate on my blessings, not my disappointments. -Dee Johnson
---------------------------------
Yahoo! Sports
Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
I'm not sure about what I can or should be doing about this:
My kids are 1 and 3. My 3-year-old is very spirited. Let me first say that I truly believe in abiding by the natural rhythms of my children. I'm finding it hard to balance this at night when my dd is cranky, but refusing to go to bed when she's tired. I have tried in the past to get her to bed and she just won't sleep. She continually pops up and won't stay in the bed. She says that she wants mommy or daddy with her. If we do lay down with her at the earlier time, she tosses and turns and won't sleep even though she is very tired. This is hard because I only have so long with her to lay down because I have to go to DS too. So we usually just have her come out and lay on the couch where daddy is watching very loud tv and of course she won't go to sleep, even though we can see that she is exhausted. The problem is that DH refuses to lie down with her in the family bed at an "early" (to him) time because he doesn't want to fall asleep and he wants to stay up later. I wish
that I could just have her play quietly in her room, but she is afraid to be alone in there. I feel torn too because I have a very awake 1 year-old to take care of as well. He too only wants mommy at night. DH hates to have him crying in his ear when I go lay down with Lindsay. Also, DS is a night owl. Is there anyway to get them on the same sleep rhythm? Or is DS just too young still? And since they are two totally different kids this probably will never happen, right? We (dh and I) read stories to DD and try to promote calm, although I must say that DH continues to watch loud t.v. that effects all of us. DH is unwilling to turn tv off to promote calm when we are trying to wind down. The bedrooms in our house are very small so the rocking chair is in the playroom where our only tv is. DD usually ends up going to bed with DH when she probably should have went (because of tiredness) about two hours before. I feel this is wrong and not respecting her body's needs because she
is obviously tired. She has a tendency to wake up cranky in the morning too.
I also feel that we are at a loss for having any couple time to talk at night and since we do the family bed also, we are never alone to talk. On top of it, at night we have a very tired DD screaming at us. I know that this will pass and is very fleeting. I'm just afraid this arrangement is not working for us and is really taking its toll on our marriage. I tend to get angry that DH won't help with the kids more and he's exhausted from working all day (11 1/2 hrs) and doesn't really want to help. When I do ask him for help and he does it, he seems very resentful We are BOTH just exhausted. We do have my mom watch the kids on occasion so that we can have couple time, but quite frankly this does not seem like enough time to have good communication in our marriage. Our marriage is definitely suffering and I don't know what to do about gaining more ways for us to find time for each other. Any suggestions/advice would be appreciated.
Karri, Lindsay (4/16/02) and Camden (6/8/04)
I like to concentrate on my blessings, not my disappointments. -Dee Johnson
---------------------------------
Yahoo! Sports
Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
arcarpenter2003
--- In [email protected], Karri Lewis
<karri_a_lewis@y...> wrote:
==I'm finding it hard to balance this at night when my dd is cranky,
but refusing to go to bed when she's tired. <snip> So we usually just
have her come out and lay on the couch where daddy is watching very
loud tv==
When my son is obviously tired but wired <g>, it usually means he
needs some sensory help, as in the stuff often recommended in the
book, The Out-of-Sync Child. Hard rocking, hard massage, squeezing,
or (that famous solution -- it works for us) a drive in the car. I
believe the theory is that some kids have trouble sensing their own
body's needs, like the need for sleep, and some of this sensory
stimulation helps their body get re-organized and sense those things
again. Doing this kind of stuff earlier in the day may help, too, as
well as other sensory things like wrapping her up like a taco,
brushing her skin, making sure she gets to swing or jump (trampoline
or couch cushions <G>), and so on.
Also, is she getting plenty of natural light during the day, and then
are you keeping the lights low so that the house naturally gets dark
as the sun sets? Use those bio-rhythms. <g>
As far as your husband, would he be open to watching the TV using
headphones, to cut down on the sound for everyone else?
Just some ideas off the top of my head. I hope this gets better soon.
Peace,
Amy
<karri_a_lewis@y...> wrote:
==I'm finding it hard to balance this at night when my dd is cranky,
but refusing to go to bed when she's tired. <snip> So we usually just
have her come out and lay on the couch where daddy is watching very
loud tv==
When my son is obviously tired but wired <g>, it usually means he
needs some sensory help, as in the stuff often recommended in the
book, The Out-of-Sync Child. Hard rocking, hard massage, squeezing,
or (that famous solution -- it works for us) a drive in the car. I
believe the theory is that some kids have trouble sensing their own
body's needs, like the need for sleep, and some of this sensory
stimulation helps their body get re-organized and sense those things
again. Doing this kind of stuff earlier in the day may help, too, as
well as other sensory things like wrapping her up like a taco,
brushing her skin, making sure she gets to swing or jump (trampoline
or couch cushions <G>), and so on.
Also, is she getting plenty of natural light during the day, and then
are you keeping the lights low so that the house naturally gets dark
as the sun sets? Use those bio-rhythms. <g>
As far as your husband, would he be open to watching the TV using
headphones, to cut down on the sound for everyone else?
Just some ideas off the top of my head. I hope this gets better soon.
Peace,
Amy
dtsh26
Hi, Karri
I have a 4 yr old boy. I've allowed him to fall asleep on the couch
as well. Too get him to brush his teeth, I start a race to the
bathroom(works every time), after brushing, he grabs his pillow and
cover and heads to the couch. I then lower the lights, lower the
volume on the tv and sometimes switch the channel to something that
is not action packed(travel channels work for me). And, usually
within 20-30min he is asleep and I can move him to his room. Also,
having a routine is key in this area, ex. my JJ knows that after
brushing he gets his pillow, lights go off and so on. And, it's not
going to work in a snap, give her time to get used to the new
routine.
Also, make sure that she is getting enough sleep, my son is usually
cranky/whiny the next day if he doesn't get enough sleep the night
before. As far as having time to talk to hubby, we've used the
telephone to our advantage in my home because my dh somtimes leaves
when I get in and comes in when I'm sleeping, so the next morning,
we talk via phone, email or instant messenger. Also getting your dd
to go to sleep earlier so that you can have time to yourself and for
hubby might also help at night.
Hope this helps,
Dee
--- In [email protected], Karri Lewis
<karri_a_lewis@y...> wrote:
my children. I'm finding it hard to balance this at night when my
dd is cranky, but refusing to go to bed when she's tired. I have
tried in the past to get her to bed and she just won't sleep. She
continually pops up and won't stay in the bed. She says that she
wants mommy or daddy with her. If we do lay down with her at the
earlier time, she tosses and turns and won't sleep even though she
is very tired. This is hard because I only have so long with her to
lay down because I have to go to DS too. So we usually just have
her come out and lay on the couch where daddy is watching very loud
tv and of course she won't go to sleep, even though we can see that
she is exhausted. The problem is that DH refuses to lie down with
her in the family bed at an "early" (to him) time because he
doesn't want to fall asleep and he wants to stay up later. I wish
awake 1 year-old to take care of as well. He too only wants mommy
at night. DH hates to have him crying in his ear when I go lay down
with Lindsay. Also, DS is a night owl. Is there anyway to get them
on the same sleep rhythm? Or is DS just too young still? And since
they are two totally different kids this probably will never happen,
right? We (dh and I) read stories to DD and try to promote calm,
although I must say that DH continues to watch loud t.v. that
effects all of us. DH is unwilling to turn tv off to promote calm
when we are trying to wind down. The bedrooms in our house are very
small so the rocking chair is in the playroom where our only tv is.
DD usually ends up going to bed with DH when she probably should
have went (because of tiredness) about two hours before. I feel
this is wrong and not respecting her body's needs because she
alone to talk. On top of it, at night we have a very tired DD
screaming at us. I know that this will pass and is very fleeting.
I'm just afraid this arrangement is not working for us and is really
taking its toll on our marriage. I tend to get angry that DH won't
help with the kids more and he's exhausted from working all day (11
1/2 hrs) and doesn't really want to help. When I do ask him for
help and he does it, he seems very resentful We are BOTH just
exhausted. We do have my mom watch the kids on occasion so that we
can have couple time, but quite frankly this does not seem like
enough time to have good communication in our marriage. Our
marriage is definitely suffering and I don't know what to do about
gaining more ways for us to find time for each other. Any
suggestions/advice would be appreciated.
I have a 4 yr old boy. I've allowed him to fall asleep on the couch
as well. Too get him to brush his teeth, I start a race to the
bathroom(works every time), after brushing, he grabs his pillow and
cover and heads to the couch. I then lower the lights, lower the
volume on the tv and sometimes switch the channel to something that
is not action packed(travel channels work for me). And, usually
within 20-30min he is asleep and I can move him to his room. Also,
having a routine is key in this area, ex. my JJ knows that after
brushing he gets his pillow, lights go off and so on. And, it's not
going to work in a snap, give her time to get used to the new
routine.
Also, make sure that she is getting enough sleep, my son is usually
cranky/whiny the next day if he doesn't get enough sleep the night
before. As far as having time to talk to hubby, we've used the
telephone to our advantage in my home because my dh somtimes leaves
when I get in and comes in when I'm sleeping, so the next morning,
we talk via phone, email or instant messenger. Also getting your dd
to go to sleep earlier so that you can have time to yourself and for
hubby might also help at night.
Hope this helps,
Dee
--- In [email protected], Karri Lewis
<karri_a_lewis@y...> wrote:
>first say that I truly believe in abiding by the natural rhythms of
> Hi I haven't posted in awhile,
>
> I'm not sure about what I can or should be doing about this:
>
> My kids are 1 and 3. My 3-year-old is very spirited. Let me
my children. I'm finding it hard to balance this at night when my
dd is cranky, but refusing to go to bed when she's tired. I have
tried in the past to get her to bed and she just won't sleep. She
continually pops up and won't stay in the bed. She says that she
wants mommy or daddy with her. If we do lay down with her at the
earlier time, she tosses and turns and won't sleep even though she
is very tired. This is hard because I only have so long with her to
lay down because I have to go to DS too. So we usually just have
her come out and lay on the couch where daddy is watching very loud
tv and of course she won't go to sleep, even though we can see that
she is exhausted. The problem is that DH refuses to lie down with
her in the family bed at an "early" (to him) time because he
doesn't want to fall asleep and he wants to stay up later. I wish
> that I could just have her play quietly in her room, but she isafraid to be alone in there. I feel torn too because I have a very
awake 1 year-old to take care of as well. He too only wants mommy
at night. DH hates to have him crying in his ear when I go lay down
with Lindsay. Also, DS is a night owl. Is there anyway to get them
on the same sleep rhythm? Or is DS just too young still? And since
they are two totally different kids this probably will never happen,
right? We (dh and I) read stories to DD and try to promote calm,
although I must say that DH continues to watch loud t.v. that
effects all of us. DH is unwilling to turn tv off to promote calm
when we are trying to wind down. The bedrooms in our house are very
small so the rocking chair is in the playroom where our only tv is.
DD usually ends up going to bed with DH when she probably should
have went (because of tiredness) about two hours before. I feel
this is wrong and not respecting her body's needs because she
> is obviously tired. She has a tendency to wake up cranky in themorning too.
>talk at night and since we do the family bed also, we are never
> I also feel that we are at a loss for having any couple time to
alone to talk. On top of it, at night we have a very tired DD
screaming at us. I know that this will pass and is very fleeting.
I'm just afraid this arrangement is not working for us and is really
taking its toll on our marriage. I tend to get angry that DH won't
help with the kids more and he's exhausted from working all day (11
1/2 hrs) and doesn't really want to help. When I do ask him for
help and he does it, he seems very resentful We are BOTH just
exhausted. We do have my mom watch the kids on occasion so that we
can have couple time, but quite frankly this does not seem like
enough time to have good communication in our marriage. Our
marriage is definitely suffering and I don't know what to do about
gaining more ways for us to find time for each other. Any
suggestions/advice would be appreciated.
>Dee Johnson
>
>
> Karri, Lindsay (4/16/02) and Camden (6/8/04)
>
> I like to concentrate on my blessings, not my disappointments. -
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> Yahoo! Sports
> Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
arcarpenter2003
--- In [email protected], "arcarpenter2003"
<arcarpenter@g...> wrote:
== I
respectful manner than I did here. She says that she didn't believe
that her son "didn't know when he needed to go to sleep," but that he
was living such a joyful, exciting life, he needed some help letting
go of the awake. <g> I like that focus better.
Peace,
Amy
<arcarpenter@g...> wrote:
== I
> believe the theory is that some kids have trouble sensing their ownActually, I think Anne Ohman talks about this in a better and more
> body's needs, like the need for sleep, and some of this sensory
> stimulation helps their body get re-organized and sense those things
> again. ==
respectful manner than I did here. She says that she didn't believe
that her son "didn't know when he needed to go to sleep," but that he
was living such a joyful, exciting life, he needed some help letting
go of the awake. <g> I like that focus better.
Peace,
Amy
Krisula Moyer
Hi Karri,
I wonder if you could get a set of headphones for dh to use that might help
keep things quiet during the going to sleep time. If he would agree to shut
off lights and come to kiss Lindsey goodnight then it would seem to her as
if everything is dark and winding down. Then he could return to the TV
using headphones in the other room. It's not an answer for the deeper
issues, but maybe just addressing the noise issue first would help you all
get past the harried frustrating part and clear your head to think of more
solutions.
Also, I just thought of something we used to do with Trayton when he was
sleepy. Dark, quiet, lying next to him, I would ask him to put his head on
the pillow and then I would breath long, slow, audible breaths next to him.
He would eventually slow his breathing to match mine and fall asleep. Anika
and Sydney both drop off when I read chapter books (preferably without
pictures). And one last thing. I used to always try to help Sydney go to
bed while Anika was nursing. When it looked like she was going to be hungry
in the evening, I'd turn off all the lights in the house and retreat to a
quiet spot (her bed or mine or the couch ) and do the aforementioned
routines. That way the baby was sure to be quiet. A lot of the time I fell
asleep with them. (modeling?) ;)
So much for evening couple time. Oh well, we had periods of not enough.
But mornings were sometimes better than evenings for that anyway.
-Krisula
===================================
Message: 1
Date: Wed, 29 Jun 2005 23:45:53 -0700 (PDT)
From: Karri Lewis <karri_a_lewis@...>
Subject: helping little kids get in the mood for bedtime and other advice
(long)
Hi I haven't posted in awhile,
I'm not sure about what I can or should be doing about this:
My kids are 1 and 3. My 3-year-old is very spirited. Let me first say that
I truly believe in abiding by the natural rhythms of my children. I'm
finding it hard to balance this at night when my dd is cranky, but refusing
to go to bed when she's tired. I have tried in the past to get her to bed
and she just won't sleep. She continually pops up and won't stay in the bed.
She says that she wants mommy or daddy with her. If we do lay down with her
at the earlier time, she tosses and turns and won't sleep even though she is
very tired. This is hard because I only have so long with her to lay down
because I have to go to DS too. So we usually just have her come out and
lay on the couch where daddy is watching very loud tv and of course she
won't go to sleep, even though we can see that she is exhausted. The
problem is that DH refuses to lie down with her in the family bed at an
"early" (to him) time because he doesn't want to fall asleep and he wants
to stay up later. I wish that I could just have her play quietly in her
room, but she is afraid to be alone in there. I feel torn too because I have
a very awake 1 year-old to take care of as well. He too only wants mommy at
night. DH hates to have him crying in his ear when I go lay down with
Lindsay. Also, DS is a night owl. Is there anyway to get them on the same
sleep rhythm? Or is DS just too young still? And since they are two
totally different kids this probably will never happen, right? We (dh and
I) read stories to DD and try to promote calm, although I must say that DH
continues to watch loud t.v. that effects all of us. DH is unwilling to
turn tv off to promote calm when we are trying to wind down. The bedrooms
in our house are very small so the rocking chair is in the playroom where
our only tv is. DD usually ends up going to bed with DH when she probably
should have went (because of tiredness) about two hours before. I feel this
is wrong and not respecting her body's needs because she is obviously
tired. She has a tendency to wake up cranky in the morning too.
I also feel that we are at a loss for having any couple time to talk at
night and since we do the family bed also, we are never alone to talk. On
top of it, at night we have a very tired DD screaming at us. I know that
this will pass and is very fleeting. I'm just afraid this arrangement is
not working for us and is really taking its toll on our marriage. I tend to
get angry that DH won't help with the kids more and he's exhausted from
working all day (11 1/2 hrs) and doesn't really want to help. When I do ask
him for help and he does it, he seems very resentful We are BOTH just
exhausted. We do have my mom watch the kids on occasion so that we can have
couple time, but quite frankly this does not seem like enough time to have
good communication in our marriage. Our marriage is definitely suffering
and I don't know what to do about gaining more ways for us to find time for
each other. Any suggestions/advice would be appreciated.
Karri, Lindsay (4/16/02) and Camden (6/8/04)
I like to concentrate on my blessings, not my disappointments. -Dee Johnson
================================================
I wonder if you could get a set of headphones for dh to use that might help
keep things quiet during the going to sleep time. If he would agree to shut
off lights and come to kiss Lindsey goodnight then it would seem to her as
if everything is dark and winding down. Then he could return to the TV
using headphones in the other room. It's not an answer for the deeper
issues, but maybe just addressing the noise issue first would help you all
get past the harried frustrating part and clear your head to think of more
solutions.
Also, I just thought of something we used to do with Trayton when he was
sleepy. Dark, quiet, lying next to him, I would ask him to put his head on
the pillow and then I would breath long, slow, audible breaths next to him.
He would eventually slow his breathing to match mine and fall asleep. Anika
and Sydney both drop off when I read chapter books (preferably without
pictures). And one last thing. I used to always try to help Sydney go to
bed while Anika was nursing. When it looked like she was going to be hungry
in the evening, I'd turn off all the lights in the house and retreat to a
quiet spot (her bed or mine or the couch ) and do the aforementioned
routines. That way the baby was sure to be quiet. A lot of the time I fell
asleep with them. (modeling?) ;)
So much for evening couple time. Oh well, we had periods of not enough.
But mornings were sometimes better than evenings for that anyway.
-Krisula
===================================
Message: 1
Date: Wed, 29 Jun 2005 23:45:53 -0700 (PDT)
From: Karri Lewis <karri_a_lewis@...>
Subject: helping little kids get in the mood for bedtime and other advice
(long)
Hi I haven't posted in awhile,
I'm not sure about what I can or should be doing about this:
My kids are 1 and 3. My 3-year-old is very spirited. Let me first say that
I truly believe in abiding by the natural rhythms of my children. I'm
finding it hard to balance this at night when my dd is cranky, but refusing
to go to bed when she's tired. I have tried in the past to get her to bed
and she just won't sleep. She continually pops up and won't stay in the bed.
She says that she wants mommy or daddy with her. If we do lay down with her
at the earlier time, she tosses and turns and won't sleep even though she is
very tired. This is hard because I only have so long with her to lay down
because I have to go to DS too. So we usually just have her come out and
lay on the couch where daddy is watching very loud tv and of course she
won't go to sleep, even though we can see that she is exhausted. The
problem is that DH refuses to lie down with her in the family bed at an
"early" (to him) time because he doesn't want to fall asleep and he wants
to stay up later. I wish that I could just have her play quietly in her
room, but she is afraid to be alone in there. I feel torn too because I have
a very awake 1 year-old to take care of as well. He too only wants mommy at
night. DH hates to have him crying in his ear when I go lay down with
Lindsay. Also, DS is a night owl. Is there anyway to get them on the same
sleep rhythm? Or is DS just too young still? And since they are two
totally different kids this probably will never happen, right? We (dh and
I) read stories to DD and try to promote calm, although I must say that DH
continues to watch loud t.v. that effects all of us. DH is unwilling to
turn tv off to promote calm when we are trying to wind down. The bedrooms
in our house are very small so the rocking chair is in the playroom where
our only tv is. DD usually ends up going to bed with DH when she probably
should have went (because of tiredness) about two hours before. I feel this
is wrong and not respecting her body's needs because she is obviously
tired. She has a tendency to wake up cranky in the morning too.
I also feel that we are at a loss for having any couple time to talk at
night and since we do the family bed also, we are never alone to talk. On
top of it, at night we have a very tired DD screaming at us. I know that
this will pass and is very fleeting. I'm just afraid this arrangement is
not working for us and is really taking its toll on our marriage. I tend to
get angry that DH won't help with the kids more and he's exhausted from
working all day (11 1/2 hrs) and doesn't really want to help. When I do ask
him for help and he does it, he seems very resentful We are BOTH just
exhausted. We do have my mom watch the kids on occasion so that we can have
couple time, but quite frankly this does not seem like enough time to have
good communication in our marriage. Our marriage is definitely suffering
and I don't know what to do about gaining more ways for us to find time for
each other. Any suggestions/advice would be appreciated.
Karri, Lindsay (4/16/02) and Camden (6/8/04)
I like to concentrate on my blessings, not my disappointments. -Dee Johnson
================================================
Kathleen Whitfield
on 7/1/05 3:44 AM, [email protected] at
[email protected] wrote:
We all go to bed together, at least the 1yo and 3yo often go to bed at the
same time and in the same place. Sometimes the older two are watching TV or
doing something else on their own. Occasionally, the 3yo, who doesn't
usually take naps except in the car, goes to sleep while watching TV or
she'll just go into the bedroom and before I know it she's asleep. I read at
night as well, if it works (sometimes the 1-year-old will be too grabby with
the book). Oftentimes I'm nursing him while I read. Sometimes the kids ask
for a story with no book. The 3yo invariably wants "Goldilocks," complete
with goofy voices, but the older children like family stories about my
childhood or their babyhoods or dh's and my courtship. I think it's hard on
3yos when they see the littlest one getting exclusive mommy attention. My
husband does very well with the kids, but the little ones have always seemed
to need *me* during bedtime. It has made things easier (and I think is
kinder) to just go with that. It helps the 3yo to fall asleep in my bed.
Then, I move her in with the 9yo, who is in a double bed in the same room,
because she moves around a lot and wakes up the baby.
I also think that the way the culture presents children going to bed is just
unrealistic. You know, mom puts the kid in bed, reads a story and says,
"Good night," and then turns off the life and leaves. All my kids really
like my presence while they're going to bed. Esp. when they're toddlers. The
older ones will say they're tired and can go off and go to sleep on their
own, but they prefer it if I come in with them for at least a bit. And I
usually do it. I think it's a nice way to connect with them, esp. as they've
gotten older and are doing more running around in the neighborhood and the
oldest goes to camps and activities without me.
We're also in a not-ideal housing situation right now. My landlady lives
next door, separate from us only by some drywall. She gets up around 5 for
work, and she has complained about toddler feet running around. (Yes, we are
getting out of this situation.) Because of this, though, our house has
"quiet hours" like a college dorm or something. I'm not thrilled about the
situation, but it's something we have to deal with right now. There have
been some good things about it, however. I'm just not the "schedule" type,
but the routine has been comforting for the 3yo in particular.
We don't fight over bedtime. Things I've done to help get them ready for bed
is make sure that they do get a lot of active play during the day. The 3yo
really does better we've gone on walks or to the park and she's gotten some
time to run around.
I know there were other issues involving your dh, but I wanted to focus on
the things that seemed more in your control. :-(
Kathleen
in LA
[email protected] wrote:
> My kids are 1 and 3. My 3-year-old is very spirited. Let me first say thatMy kids are 1, 3, 7 and 9.
> I truly believe in abiding by the natural rhythms of my children. I'm
> finding it hard to balance this at night when my dd is cranky, but refusing
> to go to bed when she's tired. I have tried in the past to get her to bed
> and she just won't sleep. She continually pops up and won't stay in the bed.
> She says that she wants mommy or daddy with her. If we do lay down with her
> at the earlier time, she tosses and turns and won't sleep even though she is
> very tired. This is hard because I only have so long with her to lay down
> because I have to go to DS too.
We all go to bed together, at least the 1yo and 3yo often go to bed at the
same time and in the same place. Sometimes the older two are watching TV or
doing something else on their own. Occasionally, the 3yo, who doesn't
usually take naps except in the car, goes to sleep while watching TV or
she'll just go into the bedroom and before I know it she's asleep. I read at
night as well, if it works (sometimes the 1-year-old will be too grabby with
the book). Oftentimes I'm nursing him while I read. Sometimes the kids ask
for a story with no book. The 3yo invariably wants "Goldilocks," complete
with goofy voices, but the older children like family stories about my
childhood or their babyhoods or dh's and my courtship. I think it's hard on
3yos when they see the littlest one getting exclusive mommy attention. My
husband does very well with the kids, but the little ones have always seemed
to need *me* during bedtime. It has made things easier (and I think is
kinder) to just go with that. It helps the 3yo to fall asleep in my bed.
Then, I move her in with the 9yo, who is in a double bed in the same room,
because she moves around a lot and wakes up the baby.
I also think that the way the culture presents children going to bed is just
unrealistic. You know, mom puts the kid in bed, reads a story and says,
"Good night," and then turns off the life and leaves. All my kids really
like my presence while they're going to bed. Esp. when they're toddlers. The
older ones will say they're tired and can go off and go to sleep on their
own, but they prefer it if I come in with them for at least a bit. And I
usually do it. I think it's a nice way to connect with them, esp. as they've
gotten older and are doing more running around in the neighborhood and the
oldest goes to camps and activities without me.
We're also in a not-ideal housing situation right now. My landlady lives
next door, separate from us only by some drywall. She gets up around 5 for
work, and she has complained about toddler feet running around. (Yes, we are
getting out of this situation.) Because of this, though, our house has
"quiet hours" like a college dorm or something. I'm not thrilled about the
situation, but it's something we have to deal with right now. There have
been some good things about it, however. I'm just not the "schedule" type,
but the routine has been comforting for the 3yo in particular.
We don't fight over bedtime. Things I've done to help get them ready for bed
is make sure that they do get a lot of active play during the day. The 3yo
really does better we've gone on walks or to the park and she's gotten some
time to run around.
I know there were other issues involving your dh, but I wanted to focus on
the things that seemed more in your control. :-(
Kathleen
in LA
Dana Matt
> > My kids are 1 and 3. My 3-year-old is veryThat's a lot to expect a 3 yo to go to bed by herself!
> spirited. Let me first say that
> > I truly believe in abiding by the natural rhythms
> of my children. I'm
> > finding it hard to balance this at night when my
> dd is cranky, but refusing
> > to go to bed when she's tired. I have tried in
> the past to get her to bed
> > and she just won't sleep. She continually pops up
> and won't stay in the bed.
> > She says that she wants mommy or daddy with her.
My kids are 12 and 7, and the 12 yo has just started
sleeping alone within the last year. My kids and
hubby and I always go to bed around the same time, and
we watch TV in bed until we fall alseep. We never
have any nighttime problems....
Dana
Guadalupe's Coffee Roaster
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Roasted to Perfection Daily
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arcarpenter2003
--- In [email protected], Dana Matt
<hoffmanwilson@y...> wrote:
== She continually pops up
assuming you were parenting her to bed but she still wasn't falling
asleep. Dopey me. <g>
Yes, at 3 and 1, a family bed situation could work really nicely for
you. We have two mattresses pushed together on the floor, and a TV in
the bedroom, and books nearby. Very nice for nursing, reading,
watching Baby Einstein or other gentle videos, and overall quiet
activities together as we all doze off.
If we go to bed a little earlier, and the kids fall asleep a little
earlier, then I can extricate myself and crawl over to my husband's
side of the bed so we can chat quietly or, um, whatever. ;) But we
kind of roll with the situation on that one.
The problem I was describing in my earlier post is that my 2 year old
will nurse, lie there for a while, and then pop up and want to play,
roll over us, etc. *That's* when I bring in the sensory stuff --
something to help him release the awake.
Okay, I feel better now that I've clarified. <g>
Peace,
Amy
<hoffmanwilson@y...> wrote:
== She continually pops up
> > and won't stay in the bed.Oh yeah, I was reading fast and kind of missed that line. I was
> > > She says that she wants mommy or daddy with her.
>
> That's a lot to expect a 3 yo to go to bed by herself!==
assuming you were parenting her to bed but she still wasn't falling
asleep. Dopey me. <g>
Yes, at 3 and 1, a family bed situation could work really nicely for
you. We have two mattresses pushed together on the floor, and a TV in
the bedroom, and books nearby. Very nice for nursing, reading,
watching Baby Einstein or other gentle videos, and overall quiet
activities together as we all doze off.
If we go to bed a little earlier, and the kids fall asleep a little
earlier, then I can extricate myself and crawl over to my husband's
side of the bed so we can chat quietly or, um, whatever. ;) But we
kind of roll with the situation on that one.
The problem I was describing in my earlier post is that my 2 year old
will nurse, lie there for a while, and then pop up and want to play,
roll over us, etc. *That's* when I bring in the sensory stuff --
something to help him release the awake.
Okay, I feel better now that I've clarified. <g>
Peace,
Amy
Karri Lewis
Yes, even I have a hard time getting in touch with my own physical needs, especially sleep. A drive in the car would end up taking an hour or two before she would fall asleep because she truly fights sleep even when she can barely keep her eyes open (sigh). With gas prices, that is just not practical for us. I honestly don't think that she would sit still long enough to give her a massage, lol. Yeah, I need to definitely make sure she is able to run out her immense energy base on a daily basis. Sometimes I think I lack in that category with a 1 year-old to take care of too. It's tough trying to juggle both of their needs in a very respectful, loving way. Thanks for the advice:-) I liked the natural light and letting it get dark without lights in the house idea. I will try that.
-Karri
arcarpenter2003 <arcarpenter@...> wrote:
When my son is obviously tired but wired <g>, it usually means he
needs some sensory help, as in the stuff often recommended in the
book, The Out-of-Sync Child. Hard rocking, hard massage, squeezing,
or (that famous solution -- it works for us) a drive in the car. I
believe the theory is that some kids have trouble sensing their own
body's needs, like the need for sleep, and some of this sensory
stimulation helps their body get re-organized and sense those things
again. Doing this kind of stuff earlier in the day may help, too, as
well as other sensory things like wrapping her up like a taco,
brushing her skin, making sure she gets to swing or jump (trampoline
or couch cushions <G>), and so on.
Also, is she getting plenty of natural light during the day, and then
are you keeping the lights low so that the house naturally gets dark
as the sun sets? Use those bio-rhythms. <g>
As far as your husband, would he be open to watching the TV using
headphones, to cut down on the sound for everyone else?
Just some ideas off the top of my head. I hope this gets better soon.
Peace,
Amy
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Karri, Lindsay (4/16/02) and Camden (6/8/04)
I like to concentrate on my blessings, not my disappointments. -Dee Johnson
---------------------------------
Yahoo! Sports
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
-Karri
arcarpenter2003 <arcarpenter@...> wrote:
When my son is obviously tired but wired <g>, it usually means he
needs some sensory help, as in the stuff often recommended in the
book, The Out-of-Sync Child. Hard rocking, hard massage, squeezing,
or (that famous solution -- it works for us) a drive in the car. I
believe the theory is that some kids have trouble sensing their own
body's needs, like the need for sleep, and some of this sensory
stimulation helps their body get re-organized and sense those things
again. Doing this kind of stuff earlier in the day may help, too, as
well as other sensory things like wrapping her up like a taco,
brushing her skin, making sure she gets to swing or jump (trampoline
or couch cushions <G>), and so on.
Also, is she getting plenty of natural light during the day, and then
are you keeping the lights low so that the house naturally gets dark
as the sun sets? Use those bio-rhythms. <g>
As far as your husband, would he be open to watching the TV using
headphones, to cut down on the sound for everyone else?
Just some ideas off the top of my head. I hope this gets better soon.
Peace,
Amy
"List Posting Policies" are provided in the files area of this group.
Visit the Unschooling website and message boards: <http://www.unschooling.info>
---------------------------------
YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS
Visit your group "UnschoolingDiscussion" on the web.
To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
[email protected]
Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
---------------------------------
Karri, Lindsay (4/16/02) and Camden (6/8/04)
I like to concentrate on my blessings, not my disappointments. -Dee Johnson
---------------------------------
Yahoo! Sports
Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Karri Lewis
Yeah, the problem is DH won't turn down the volume that much and he is usually watching something that he wants to watch. The funny thing is, if we turn it to one of her shows, she'll stay up even if she is really tired and watch. We've done that (a few times just to see how long it would take for her to fall asleep "willingly"). She'll stay up exhausted until 3 a.m., if someone is with her and her shows are on. She has a very hard time transitioning from awake to asleep. She literally hates to sleep. If we all go to bed, she goes because she does not want to be alone. She is always told that she does not have to go to bed. The thing is that I also need to have some alone time (let alone time with DH) and I usually take it after everyone is asleep. I'm a spirited adult and I have to work on oversensory overload and decompress from the events of the day. My daughter is like this too. It's just the way that I am and I need that to parent with a "clear head." I'm not getting
a whole lot of help from DH to get that.
-Karri
dtsh26 <deedre26@...> wrote:
Hi, Karri
I have a 4 yr old boy. I've allowed him to fall asleep on the couch
as well. Too get him to brush his teeth, I start a race to the
bathroom(works every time), after brushing, he grabs his pillow and
cover and heads to the couch. I then lower the lights, lower the
volume on the tv and sometimes switch the channel to something that
is not action packed(travel channels work for me). And, usually
within 20-30min he is asleep and I can move him to his room. Also,
having a routine is key in this area, ex. my JJ knows that after
brushing he gets his pillow, lights go off and so on. And, it's not
going to work in a snap, give her time to get used to the new
routine.
Also, make sure that she is getting enough sleep, my son is usually
cranky/whiny the next day if he doesn't get enough sleep the night
before. As far as having time to talk to hubby, we've used the
telephone to our advantage in my home because my dh somtimes leaves
when I get in and comes in when I'm sleeping, so the next morning,
we talk via phone, email or instant messenger. Also getting your dd
to go to sleep earlier so that you can have time to yourself and for
hubby might also help at night.
Hope this helps,
Dee
Karri, Lindsay (4/16/02) and Camden (6/8/04)
I like to concentrate on my blessings, not my disappointments. -Dee Johnson
---------------------------------
Yahoo! Sports
Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
a whole lot of help from DH to get that.
-Karri
dtsh26 <deedre26@...> wrote:
Hi, Karri
I have a 4 yr old boy. I've allowed him to fall asleep on the couch
as well. Too get him to brush his teeth, I start a race to the
bathroom(works every time), after brushing, he grabs his pillow and
cover and heads to the couch. I then lower the lights, lower the
volume on the tv and sometimes switch the channel to something that
is not action packed(travel channels work for me). And, usually
within 20-30min he is asleep and I can move him to his room. Also,
having a routine is key in this area, ex. my JJ knows that after
brushing he gets his pillow, lights go off and so on. And, it's not
going to work in a snap, give her time to get used to the new
routine.
Also, make sure that she is getting enough sleep, my son is usually
cranky/whiny the next day if he doesn't get enough sleep the night
before. As far as having time to talk to hubby, we've used the
telephone to our advantage in my home because my dh somtimes leaves
when I get in and comes in when I'm sleeping, so the next morning,
we talk via phone, email or instant messenger. Also getting your dd
to go to sleep earlier so that you can have time to yourself and for
hubby might also help at night.
Hope this helps,
Dee
Karri, Lindsay (4/16/02) and Camden (6/8/04)
I like to concentrate on my blessings, not my disappointments. -Dee Johnson
---------------------------------
Yahoo! Sports
Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Karri Lewis
I really love the headphone idea! I hope DH will go for that. That would help all of us. Also,
the breathing, reading and nursing ideas I like. DS sometimes doesn't nurse, if I'm reading
to Lindsay in bed. He often is not tired when she is. Then he gets excited and jumps all
over us, even in low light, lol. That's when I ask DH to help by taking him, but then DS will
just cry and DH comes in and says, "he wants you." Usually, then I take the baby and he
goes to bed with Lindsay. She's upset because she still wants me:-( It's frustrating and
hard to not be able to always meet their needs. Thanks, Krisula:-) I like your ideas.
-Karri
Krisula Moyer wrote:
I wonder if you could get a set of headphones for dh to use that might help
keep things quiet during the going to sleep time.
Karri, Lindsay (4/16/02) and Camden (6/8/04)
I like to concentrate on my blessings, not my disappointments. -Dee Johnson
---------------------------------
Yahoo! Sports
Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
the breathing, reading and nursing ideas I like. DS sometimes doesn't nurse, if I'm reading
to Lindsay in bed. He often is not tired when she is. Then he gets excited and jumps all
over us, even in low light, lol. That's when I ask DH to help by taking him, but then DS will
just cry and DH comes in and says, "he wants you." Usually, then I take the baby and he
goes to bed with Lindsay. She's upset because she still wants me:-( It's frustrating and
hard to not be able to always meet their needs. Thanks, Krisula:-) I like your ideas.
-Karri
Krisula Moyer wrote:
I wonder if you could get a set of headphones for dh to use that might help
keep things quiet during the going to sleep time.
Karri, Lindsay (4/16/02) and Camden (6/8/04)
I like to concentrate on my blessings, not my disappointments. -Dee Johnson
---------------------------------
Yahoo! Sports
Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
In a message dated 7/2/05 2:09:24 AM, karri_a_lewis@... writes:
Maybe "always" is too much, then.
There are many things between "You have to go to bed now because it's 8:00"
and "You don't have to go to bed at all."
When I've made an argument against arbitrary bedtimes, it's been against
ARBITRARY bedtimes and the fear, frustration and arguments they cause. If
bedtime is "when everyone else is going to be" or "when we have to be quiet because
of the neighbors" or "when mom's too sleepy to stay up with you anymore (in
the case of younger children), that is not arbitrary. That's for a real
reason, not just a rule that's not worth "enforcing."
Sometimes people come to these discussions and their relationship with their
child is very indirect, because of arbitrary (and sometimes harmful) rules and
structures and punshments and of clinging to school-related or farm-related
ideas about when children SHOULD be up and SHOULD be asleep, or that children
SHOULD sleep in the dark in their own rooms, alone.
Examining those problems doesn't mean unschooling demands NO "let's go to bed
now" and NO structure. Reason and persuasion and logic are good things.
If a child needs to go to sleep because she's exhausted but resistent, tell
her she can see her shows the next day. If a child needs to go to sleep
because there's an early morning outting or appointment, explain that, and find
ways to get her asleep. Rock her, drive her, something.
I used to put on a favorite cassette tape (CDs last even longer!) and say
"Try to go to sleep, and if you're still awake when this ends, you can get back
up. Maybe twice, Marty outlasted a tape, but I wouldn't swear it was even
twice.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> If we all go to bed, she goes because she does not want to be alone. She=============
> is always told that she does not have to go to bed.
>
Maybe "always" is too much, then.
There are many things between "You have to go to bed now because it's 8:00"
and "You don't have to go to bed at all."
When I've made an argument against arbitrary bedtimes, it's been against
ARBITRARY bedtimes and the fear, frustration and arguments they cause. If
bedtime is "when everyone else is going to be" or "when we have to be quiet because
of the neighbors" or "when mom's too sleepy to stay up with you anymore (in
the case of younger children), that is not arbitrary. That's for a real
reason, not just a rule that's not worth "enforcing."
Sometimes people come to these discussions and their relationship with their
child is very indirect, because of arbitrary (and sometimes harmful) rules and
structures and punshments and of clinging to school-related or farm-related
ideas about when children SHOULD be up and SHOULD be asleep, or that children
SHOULD sleep in the dark in their own rooms, alone.
Examining those problems doesn't mean unschooling demands NO "let's go to bed
now" and NO structure. Reason and persuasion and logic are good things.
If a child needs to go to sleep because she's exhausted but resistent, tell
her she can see her shows the next day. If a child needs to go to sleep
because there's an early morning outting or appointment, explain that, and find
ways to get her asleep. Rock her, drive her, something.
I used to put on a favorite cassette tape (CDs last even longer!) and say
"Try to go to sleep, and if you're still awake when this ends, you can get back
up. Maybe twice, Marty outlasted a tape, but I wouldn't swear it was even
twice.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
In a message dated 7/2/05 4:05:15 AM, karri_a_lewis@... writes:
Maybe record your husband's shows, and ask him to watch them later, after the
kids are asleep, or the next day, or the weekend, so that he's not stuck to
the TV while you're needing help with kids.
They won't always be little. It will be a shame if he misses their younger
years for TV shows he could watch later. Taxi is on DVD now. Mork and
Mindy. <g> Shows I thought I'd die if I missed, when they were new, I can
watch every day. But I don't! Hmmmm....
My husband was always a Disney buff, so it was easy for him to watch a movie
with one of the kids. He could watch The Jungle Book or Aladdin ANYtime.
Maybe your husband could find movies he and the kids could watch together.
Neverending Story is on DVD now. That's a good one dads can like. The
Princess Bride is easy to go to sleep to. Willow.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> That's when I ask DH to help by taking him, but then DS willThese days will pass.
> just cry and DH comes in and says, "he wants you." Usually, then I take the
> baby and he
> goes to bed with Lindsay. She's upset because she still wants me:-( It's
> frustrating and
> hard to not be able to always meet their needs.
>
Maybe record your husband's shows, and ask him to watch them later, after the
kids are asleep, or the next day, or the weekend, so that he's not stuck to
the TV while you're needing help with kids.
They won't always be little. It will be a shame if he misses their younger
years for TV shows he could watch later. Taxi is on DVD now. Mork and
Mindy. <g> Shows I thought I'd die if I missed, when they were new, I can
watch every day. But I don't! Hmmmm....
My husband was always a Disney buff, so it was easy for him to watch a movie
with one of the kids. He could watch The Jungle Book or Aladdin ANYtime.
Maybe your husband could find movies he and the kids could watch together.
Neverending Story is on DVD now. That's a good one dads can like. The
Princess Bride is easy to go to sleep to. Willow.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Pam Sorooshian
On Jul 2, 2005, at 6:50 AM, SandraDodd@... wrote:
she wakes up refreshed, you can say, "Oooh, that was a good rest,
wasn't it?" Help her recognize that she feels so GOOD after getting
some rest and not good when she's exhausted and wired up and forcing
herself to stay awake.
My kids all often, almost always, fell asleep wherever they happened to
be when they got sleepy - never "put them to bed" until they were
already asleep and we carried them (or slightly woke them and walked
them, as they got older).
I know Karri and her daughter, by the way, in noncyber-life, and I
don't think I've ever met a more "intense" kid than Lindsay - she is go
go go go - her mind never slows down, her body keeps up. I had one
similar to this (Roya) and it was the same way - just go go go always
to the point of total mental and physical exhaustion and then trying
still to keep going. They get very frantic.
The number one best thing that worked to help Roya calm down enough to
fall asleep was a LOT of exercise during the day - like hours and hours
of swimming or being at the beach, for example, then, after a good
dinner, a warm bath and putting on soft comfy pajamas. Timing was
crucial. If I let her get too overtired, nothing would work and she'd
finally have a meltdown and neither of us would get to sleep until we
were MORE than exhausted. But, a warm bath at the right time and then
soft pajamas and then I'd talk her into snuggling - I'd read to her,
something soft and not too exciting. And I'd read slowly and softly.
And I would take slow breaths and she'd often just start breathing more
slowly along with me.
Karri - you're going to have to find a way to convince your husband
that it is WORTH it to have the tv sound down - if it is on softly,
that'll be fine, background noise won't keep her awake, it is sudden
loud sounds that will get her riled up.
If he understood that finding a bedtime routine that worked to settle
her down would mean a far less frantic and more enjoyable evening for
him, too, he'd be more likely to cooperate, don't you think?
I had the same kind of problem with my husband - I'd be sitting in the
living room, have FINALLY gotten Roya started settling down, I could
tell she was winding down, but he'd switch channels to a really loud
channel, or go into the kitchen (which is right there - small house)
and run the trash compactor, or even just start whistling or something
that would get her ears perked up. I was just so much more in tune with
what was needed in our environment to help her calm down and get ready
to sleep. He thought I should be able to just put her in another room,
in a bed, and say, "Stay there and go to sleep," and that was that.
By the way, when the kids were older - when Roxana was 3 1/2 and Roya
was 6 1/2, we DID have a time that we just called "quiet time." I had
another baby by then and was very worn out and desperately needed that
time AND they were very willing - they LIKED it. Turns out that's when
Roxana learned to read - during those "quiet times" with her sister
when she was, apparently, constantly asking Roya, "What does this
spell? What is this word?" We made that "quiet time" nice for them -
they'd pick out baskets of books and small toys to take into their
beds, so that they would have them at hand, and they'd have warm milk
first (which I always thought was just disgusting but my husband got
them started and they liked it) and we'd put soft music on a tape
player and so on. I didn't read aloud then - because I was never good
at reading aloud at night, I was too tired all the time. They looked
forward to it. Nobody ever told them to go to sleep - and they could
have come out, occasionally did, but really not often. Mostly they just
set their stuff aside and turned over and went to sleep in a half hour
or an hour or so.
When Roxana was a baby, I'd sit on the couch to nurse her and call Roya
to come and keep me company. I'd ask her to sing me a song, tell me a
story, etc. Then I might ask her to put on a story tape and come
snuggle up with me. Or we'd put on tv, but on something sweet and soft
(David the Gnome!!! Anybody else remember him?). The best tv would be a
video that we'd already watched lots.
So - a practical idea for you, Karri. A little tv for Lindsay to watch,
with headphones even -- a dvd/tv combo - you can get one for under a
hundred dollars, I'm sure. And get some dvd's that are going to work
well for her to fall asleep by.
-pam
> I used to put on a favorite cassette tape (CDs last even longer!) andAlso, make sleeping a positive thing in the way you talk about it. When
> say
> "Try to go to sleep, and if you're still awake when this ends, you can
> get back
> up. Maybe twice, Marty outlasted a tape, but I wouldn't swear it
> was even
> twice.
she wakes up refreshed, you can say, "Oooh, that was a good rest,
wasn't it?" Help her recognize that she feels so GOOD after getting
some rest and not good when she's exhausted and wired up and forcing
herself to stay awake.
My kids all often, almost always, fell asleep wherever they happened to
be when they got sleepy - never "put them to bed" until they were
already asleep and we carried them (or slightly woke them and walked
them, as they got older).
I know Karri and her daughter, by the way, in noncyber-life, and I
don't think I've ever met a more "intense" kid than Lindsay - she is go
go go go - her mind never slows down, her body keeps up. I had one
similar to this (Roya) and it was the same way - just go go go always
to the point of total mental and physical exhaustion and then trying
still to keep going. They get very frantic.
The number one best thing that worked to help Roya calm down enough to
fall asleep was a LOT of exercise during the day - like hours and hours
of swimming or being at the beach, for example, then, after a good
dinner, a warm bath and putting on soft comfy pajamas. Timing was
crucial. If I let her get too overtired, nothing would work and she'd
finally have a meltdown and neither of us would get to sleep until we
were MORE than exhausted. But, a warm bath at the right time and then
soft pajamas and then I'd talk her into snuggling - I'd read to her,
something soft and not too exciting. And I'd read slowly and softly.
And I would take slow breaths and she'd often just start breathing more
slowly along with me.
Karri - you're going to have to find a way to convince your husband
that it is WORTH it to have the tv sound down - if it is on softly,
that'll be fine, background noise won't keep her awake, it is sudden
loud sounds that will get her riled up.
If he understood that finding a bedtime routine that worked to settle
her down would mean a far less frantic and more enjoyable evening for
him, too, he'd be more likely to cooperate, don't you think?
I had the same kind of problem with my husband - I'd be sitting in the
living room, have FINALLY gotten Roya started settling down, I could
tell she was winding down, but he'd switch channels to a really loud
channel, or go into the kitchen (which is right there - small house)
and run the trash compactor, or even just start whistling or something
that would get her ears perked up. I was just so much more in tune with
what was needed in our environment to help her calm down and get ready
to sleep. He thought I should be able to just put her in another room,
in a bed, and say, "Stay there and go to sleep," and that was that.
By the way, when the kids were older - when Roxana was 3 1/2 and Roya
was 6 1/2, we DID have a time that we just called "quiet time." I had
another baby by then and was very worn out and desperately needed that
time AND they were very willing - they LIKED it. Turns out that's when
Roxana learned to read - during those "quiet times" with her sister
when she was, apparently, constantly asking Roya, "What does this
spell? What is this word?" We made that "quiet time" nice for them -
they'd pick out baskets of books and small toys to take into their
beds, so that they would have them at hand, and they'd have warm milk
first (which I always thought was just disgusting but my husband got
them started and they liked it) and we'd put soft music on a tape
player and so on. I didn't read aloud then - because I was never good
at reading aloud at night, I was too tired all the time. They looked
forward to it. Nobody ever told them to go to sleep - and they could
have come out, occasionally did, but really not often. Mostly they just
set their stuff aside and turned over and went to sleep in a half hour
or an hour or so.
When Roxana was a baby, I'd sit on the couch to nurse her and call Roya
to come and keep me company. I'd ask her to sing me a song, tell me a
story, etc. Then I might ask her to put on a story tape and come
snuggle up with me. Or we'd put on tv, but on something sweet and soft
(David the Gnome!!! Anybody else remember him?). The best tv would be a
video that we'd already watched lots.
So - a practical idea for you, Karri. A little tv for Lindsay to watch,
with headphones even -- a dvd/tv combo - you can get one for under a
hundred dollars, I'm sure. And get some dvd's that are going to work
well for her to fall asleep by.
-pam
[email protected]
In a message dated 7/2/05 8:36:59 PM, ecsamhill@... writes:
but this time I was folding each thing as I picked it up. As I folded shirts
for Marty and Holly, and stacked each in his or her basket, and made sure the
underwear was rightside out and the socks were paired up, I thought about why
I didn't mind doing it.
It's healing for my inner child. I think first how "unfair" it is that I
folded laundry then because I had to, yet I'm not "making" my kids fold other
people's laundry as I had to. Then I think how nice it would have felt if
*just once* my mom had brought all my clothes to me, folded and stacked, and said
something sweet to me, and smiled. And I think of me when I do that for
them, and it feels good.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> When insisting that my husband be quiet at my son's "going to bed time", IThe other day I was folding clothes. Sometimes I sort first and then fold,
> did take the time to sympathize that it was unfair that he was treated
> inconsiderately as a child, but that I wasn't going to let him have the "fun" of
> being the inconsiderate adult.
>
but this time I was folding each thing as I picked it up. As I folded shirts
for Marty and Holly, and stacked each in his or her basket, and made sure the
underwear was rightside out and the socks were paired up, I thought about why
I didn't mind doing it.
It's healing for my inner child. I think first how "unfair" it is that I
folded laundry then because I had to, yet I'm not "making" my kids fold other
people's laundry as I had to. Then I think how nice it would have felt if
*just once* my mom had brought all my clothes to me, folded and stacked, and said
something sweet to me, and smiled. And I think of me when I do that for
them, and it feels good.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Elizabeth Hill
**
He thought I should be able to just put her in another room,
in a bed, and say, "Stay there and go to sleep," and that was that.**
My husband, as the youngest, was put into his room and told to sleep while very loud TV was going on in the living room, not far away, and the whole rest of the family was up and watching. As an adult guest sleeping in that same house, I tried to retire early (of my own choice) and I can't imagine how anyone could sleep through that noise. I certainly couldn't -- and I wanted to!
When insisting that my husband be quiet at my son's "going to bed time", I did take the time to sympathize that it was unfair that he was treated inconsiderately as a child, but that I wasn't going to let him have the "fun" of being the inconsiderate adult.
Betsy
He thought I should be able to just put her in another room,
in a bed, and say, "Stay there and go to sleep," and that was that.**
My husband, as the youngest, was put into his room and told to sleep while very loud TV was going on in the living room, not far away, and the whole rest of the family was up and watching. As an adult guest sleeping in that same house, I tried to retire early (of my own choice) and I can't imagine how anyone could sleep through that noise. I certainly couldn't -- and I wanted to!
When insisting that my husband be quiet at my son's "going to bed time", I did take the time to sympathize that it was unfair that he was treated inconsiderately as a child, but that I wasn't going to let him have the "fun" of being the inconsiderate adult.
Betsy
Karri Lewis
Pam Sorooshian <pamsoroosh@...> wrote:
<<<<I know Karri and her daughter, by the way, in noncyber-life, and I
don't think I've ever met a more "intense" kid than Lindsay - she is go
go go go - her mind never slows down, her body keeps up. I had one
similar to this (Roya) and it was the same way - just go go go always
to the point of total mental and physical exhaustion and then trying
still to keep going. They get very frantic.>>>>
Yes, I'm so glad to know you:-) With your experience with Roya, it's helped me tremendously to share experiences.
<<<<The number one best thing that worked to help Roya calm down enough to
fall asleep was a LOT of exercise during the day - >>>>>
Yes, this is when she settles in best at night. When she has had a very "active" day. I'm working on doing that more regularly. The baby and I are sick with a bad cold again. We both have fevers. I hate this because then I can't get her out and she *needs* that. I do open up the backyard and let her "run." She tells me it's too hot for her to be out there lately, though. I do have a secret weapon, though when I'm really desperate to get her excercise. We have a bounce house that I set up on occasion and she bounces inside of it inside the house, lol. It takes up the whole playroom when it is up, but it's been a lifesaver at times for energy burn off when we haven't been able to get out.
<<<<Karri - you're going to have to find a way to convince your husband
that it is WORTH it to have the tv sound down - if it is on softly,
that'll be fine, background noise won't keep her awake, it is sudden
loud sounds that will get her riled up. If he understood that finding a bedtime routine that worked to settle
her down would mean a far less frantic and more enjoyable evening for
him, too, he'd be more likely to cooperate, don't you think?
<<<He thought I should be able to just put her in another room,
in a bed, and say, "Stay there and go to sleep," and that was that.>>>>
Yeah, Jim would like it to be this way too.
<<<<<When Roxana was a baby, I'd sit on the couch to nurse her and call Roya
to come and keep me company. I'd ask her to sing me a song, tell me a
story, etc. Then I might ask her to put on a story tape and come
snuggle up with me. Or we'd put on tv, but on something sweet and soft
(David the Gnome!!! Anybody else remember him?). The best tv would be a
video that we'd already watched lots.>>>>>
I like the idea to have her sing me a song. She'd like that. She does come snuggle with me and we do put her "shows" on that she likes (Reading Rainbow and Scooby Doo).
<<<<<So - a practical idea for you, Karri. A little tv for Lindsay to watch,
with headphones even -- a dvd/tv combo - you can get one for under a
hundred dollars, I'm sure. And get some dvd's that are going to work
well for her to fall asleep by.>>>>
Great idea, I'll look into it. As long as it is under 100 we can probably swing it.
Thanks for sharing your suggestions and experience, Pam:-)
-Karri
Karri, Lindsay (4/16/02) and Camden (6/8/04)
I like to concentrate on my blessings, not my disappointments. -Dee Johnson
---------------------------------
Sell on Yahoo! Auctions - No fees. Bid on great items.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
<<<<I know Karri and her daughter, by the way, in noncyber-life, and I
don't think I've ever met a more "intense" kid than Lindsay - she is go
go go go - her mind never slows down, her body keeps up. I had one
similar to this (Roya) and it was the same way - just go go go always
to the point of total mental and physical exhaustion and then trying
still to keep going. They get very frantic.>>>>
Yes, I'm so glad to know you:-) With your experience with Roya, it's helped me tremendously to share experiences.
<<<<The number one best thing that worked to help Roya calm down enough to
fall asleep was a LOT of exercise during the day - >>>>>
Yes, this is when she settles in best at night. When she has had a very "active" day. I'm working on doing that more regularly. The baby and I are sick with a bad cold again. We both have fevers. I hate this because then I can't get her out and she *needs* that. I do open up the backyard and let her "run." She tells me it's too hot for her to be out there lately, though. I do have a secret weapon, though when I'm really desperate to get her excercise. We have a bounce house that I set up on occasion and she bounces inside of it inside the house, lol. It takes up the whole playroom when it is up, but it's been a lifesaver at times for energy burn off when we haven't been able to get out.
<<<<Karri - you're going to have to find a way to convince your husband
that it is WORTH it to have the tv sound down - if it is on softly,
that'll be fine, background noise won't keep her awake, it is sudden
loud sounds that will get her riled up. If he understood that finding a bedtime routine that worked to settle
her down would mean a far less frantic and more enjoyable evening for
him, too, he'd be more likely to cooperate, don't you think?
>>>>I actually told him what you said and he agreed to get a pair of headphones. I've known that the sound has bothered Lindsay for a long time and he is starting to get it, by other people saying so. We bought the headphones and he just needs to set them up now;-) They are wireless.
<<<He thought I should be able to just put her in another room,
in a bed, and say, "Stay there and go to sleep," and that was that.>>>>
Yeah, Jim would like it to be this way too.
<<<<<When Roxana was a baby, I'd sit on the couch to nurse her and call Roya
to come and keep me company. I'd ask her to sing me a song, tell me a
story, etc. Then I might ask her to put on a story tape and come
snuggle up with me. Or we'd put on tv, but on something sweet and soft
(David the Gnome!!! Anybody else remember him?). The best tv would be a
video that we'd already watched lots.>>>>>
I like the idea to have her sing me a song. She'd like that. She does come snuggle with me and we do put her "shows" on that she likes (Reading Rainbow and Scooby Doo).
<<<<<So - a practical idea for you, Karri. A little tv for Lindsay to watch,
with headphones even -- a dvd/tv combo - you can get one for under a
hundred dollars, I'm sure. And get some dvd's that are going to work
well for her to fall asleep by.>>>>
Great idea, I'll look into it. As long as it is under 100 we can probably swing it.
Thanks for sharing your suggestions and experience, Pam:-)
-Karri
Karri, Lindsay (4/16/02) and Camden (6/8/04)
I like to concentrate on my blessings, not my disappointments. -Dee Johnson
---------------------------------
Sell on Yahoo! Auctions - No fees. Bid on great items.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Karri Lewis
Thank you, I think it has helped me to be told this. I was concerned about being too "controlling" because we are so exhausted that DH and I want to go to bed when she may or may not be ready.
SandraDodd@... wrote:
<<<<<Maybe "always" is too much, then.
There are many things between "You have to go to bed now because it's 8:00"
and "You don't have to go to bed at all."
When I've made an argument against arbitrary bedtimes, it's been against
ARBITRARY bedtimes and the fear, frustration and arguments they cause. If
bedtime is "when everyone else is going to be" or "when we have to be quiet because
of the neighbors" or "when mom's too sleepy to stay up with you anymore (in
the case of younger children), that is not arbitrary. That's for a real
reason, not just a rule that's not worth "enforcing.">>>>>
Karri, Lindsay (4/16/02) and Camden (6/8/04)
I like to concentrate on my blessings, not my disappointments. -Dee Johnson
---------------------------------
Yahoo! Mail for Mobile
Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your mobile phone.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
SandraDodd@... wrote:
<<<<<Maybe "always" is too much, then.
There are many things between "You have to go to bed now because it's 8:00"
and "You don't have to go to bed at all."
When I've made an argument against arbitrary bedtimes, it's been against
ARBITRARY bedtimes and the fear, frustration and arguments they cause. If
bedtime is "when everyone else is going to be" or "when we have to be quiet because
of the neighbors" or "when mom's too sleepy to stay up with you anymore (in
the case of younger children), that is not arbitrary. That's for a real
reason, not just a rule that's not worth "enforcing.">>>>>
Karri, Lindsay (4/16/02) and Camden (6/8/04)
I like to concentrate on my blessings, not my disappointments. -Dee Johnson
---------------------------------
Yahoo! Mail for Mobile
Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your mobile phone.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Karri Lewis
SandraDodd@... wrote:
<<<<These days will pass.
Maybe record your husband's shows, and ask him to watch them later, after the
kids are asleep, or the next day, or the weekend, so that he's not stuck to
the TV while you're needing help with kids.>>>>
We have Tivo. He still likes to watch when the kids are playing in the same room.
<<<<They won't always be little. It will be a shame if he misses their younger
years for TV shows he could watch later.>>>>
I agree. I'm just not sure if there is anything that I could say for him to realize this.
<<<<My husband was always a Disney buff, so it was easy for him to watch a movie
with one of the kids. He could watch The Jungle Book or Aladdin ANYtime.
Maybe your husband could find movies he and the kids could watch together.
Neverending Story is on DVD now. That's a good one dads can like. The
Princess Bride is easy to go to sleep to. Willow.>>>>
I will try these. He does watch Scooby Doo with her. So maybe he'd go for other things. They usually take turns watching each other's shows, but DD doesn't really pay too much attention when his shows are on. Tonite he did get on the floor to play with the kids for awhile. I was so excited by this. I told him that I thought that Lindsay really enjoyed playing with him like that. I hope it continues:-) Maybe he is starting to see what he is missing.
-Karri
Karri, Lindsay (4/16/02) and Camden (6/8/04)
I like to concentrate on my blessings, not my disappointments. -Dee Johnson
---------------------------------
Sell on Yahoo! Auctions - No fees. Bid on great items.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
<<<<These days will pass.
Maybe record your husband's shows, and ask him to watch them later, after the
kids are asleep, or the next day, or the weekend, so that he's not stuck to
the TV while you're needing help with kids.>>>>
We have Tivo. He still likes to watch when the kids are playing in the same room.
<<<<They won't always be little. It will be a shame if he misses their younger
years for TV shows he could watch later.>>>>
I agree. I'm just not sure if there is anything that I could say for him to realize this.
<<<<My husband was always a Disney buff, so it was easy for him to watch a movie
with one of the kids. He could watch The Jungle Book or Aladdin ANYtime.
Maybe your husband could find movies he and the kids could watch together.
Neverending Story is on DVD now. That's a good one dads can like. The
Princess Bride is easy to go to sleep to. Willow.>>>>
I will try these. He does watch Scooby Doo with her. So maybe he'd go for other things. They usually take turns watching each other's shows, but DD doesn't really pay too much attention when his shows are on. Tonite he did get on the floor to play with the kids for awhile. I was so excited by this. I told him that I thought that Lindsay really enjoyed playing with him like that. I hope it continues:-) Maybe he is starting to see what he is missing.
-Karri
Karri, Lindsay (4/16/02) and Camden (6/8/04)
I like to concentrate on my blessings, not my disappointments. -Dee Johnson
---------------------------------
Sell on Yahoo! Auctions - No fees. Bid on great items.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
In a message dated 7/6/05 3:44:03 AM, karri_a_lewis@... writes:
to sleep, but he hated worse to be the only one awake, so there was a
Discovery Toys cassette tape about the circus. It was designed for drawing, and
there were quiet places where they would wait for the listener to draw. Then the
narration would continue. Marty listened to that dozens of times, maybe a
hundred. He never heard the end. But it was a way for him to stay in the
bed, trying to hear more than he had heard before. <g>
Holly had a going to sleep tape. It still surfaces around here sometimes.
I used to have the means to make cassettes from other cassettes and albums
and made tons. (Now I'd like to chuck them all, but they're so... you know.
Familiar. And worn out, and losing their labels. And I can't take more
with the equipment I have at the moment.)
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> I like the idea to have her sing me a song. She'd like that. She does comeThere was a while when Marty was three or four that he had a hard time going
> snuggle with me and we do put her "shows" on that she likes (Reading Rainbow
> and Scooby Doo).
>
>
to sleep, but he hated worse to be the only one awake, so there was a
Discovery Toys cassette tape about the circus. It was designed for drawing, and
there were quiet places where they would wait for the listener to draw. Then the
narration would continue. Marty listened to that dozens of times, maybe a
hundred. He never heard the end. But it was a way for him to stay in the
bed, trying to hear more than he had heard before. <g>
Holly had a going to sleep tape. It still surfaces around here sometimes.
I used to have the means to make cassettes from other cassettes and albums
and made tons. (Now I'd like to chuck them all, but they're so... you know.
Familiar. And worn out, and losing their labels. And I can't take more
with the equipment I have at the moment.)
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
-=-I agree. I'm just not sure if there is anything that I could say for him
to realize this.-=-
Maybe say...
"If that child grows up while you're watching TV, you'll regret it. Maybe
not today. Maybe not tomorrow, but soon and for the rest of your life."
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
to realize this.-=-
Maybe say...
"If that child grows up while you're watching TV, you'll regret it. Maybe
not today. Maybe not tomorrow, but soon and for the rest of your life."
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Danielle Conger
SandraDodd@... wrote:
Ahhh, one of my all-time favorite movies to fall asleep to, as someone
who really needs something familiar playing to stop my brain and let me
get to sleep.
--
~~Danielle
Emily (7), Julia (6), Sam (5)
http://www.danielleconger.com/Homeschool/Welcomehome.html
~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*
"With our thoughts, we make the world." ~~Buddha
>-=-I agree. I'm just not sure if there is anything that I could say for him=========
>to realize this.-=-
>
>Maybe say...
>"If that child grows up while you're watching TV, you'll regret it. Maybe
>not today. Maybe not tomorrow, but soon and for the rest of your life."
>
>
>
Ahhh, one of my all-time favorite movies to fall asleep to, as someone
who really needs something familiar playing to stop my brain and let me
get to sleep.
--
~~Danielle
Emily (7), Julia (6), Sam (5)
http://www.danielleconger.com/Homeschool/Welcomehome.html
~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*
"With our thoughts, we make the world." ~~Buddha