A Food Scenerio
dana_burdick
My friend asked me to post a question for her about her son's food
choices.
One day for lunch she took her two kids to an outdoor mall which had
several restaurants. My friend and her daughter wanted to get
something from the Una Mas. Her son, however, eats a limited number
of things and did not want anything to eat from this restaurant, but
expressed that he would love a cookie from the Starbucks.
Since he hadn't eaten since breakfast, should she insist/gently
persuade/shove down his troat a quesadilla? Or, should she say, "I'd
love to get you a cookie as soon as your sister and I are done with
our meal here at the Una Mas."
I am, I mean, she is interested in knowing your thoughts. ;)
-Dana
choices.
One day for lunch she took her two kids to an outdoor mall which had
several restaurants. My friend and her daughter wanted to get
something from the Una Mas. Her son, however, eats a limited number
of things and did not want anything to eat from this restaurant, but
expressed that he would love a cookie from the Starbucks.
Since he hadn't eaten since breakfast, should she insist/gently
persuade/shove down his troat a quesadilla? Or, should she say, "I'd
love to get you a cookie as soon as your sister and I are done with
our meal here at the Una Mas."
I am, I mean, she is interested in knowing your thoughts. ;)
-Dana
TreeGoddess
On Jun 15, 2005, at 5:32 PM, dana_burdick wrote:
-=-Since he hadn't eaten since breakfast, should she insist/gently
persuade/shove down his troat a quesadilla? Or, should she say, "I'd
love to get you a cookie as soon as your sister and I are done with
our meal here at the Una Mas."-=-
What I would have done was get the cookie and a drink from Starbucks
first. Then he could bring his food over to a table while I ordered
and eat my food at the outdoor restaurant. He could have been happily
munching his cookie then rather than having to wait and watch you eat
first. Kinda mean to make him wait. KWIM?
-Tracy-
"Peace *will* enter your life, but you
need to clear a spot for her to sit down."
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
In a message dated 6/15/2005 4:38:57 PM Central Standard Time,
DanaBurdick@... writes:
Her son, however, eats a limited number
of things and did not want anything to eat from this restaurant, but
expressed that he would love a cookie from the Starbucks.
~~~
Just get him the cookie! For crying out loud, who cares what he eats from
one 4 hour period to the next?
And why make him wait to get the cookie until after you and his SISTER eat?
Is that some kind of bizarre punishment you're doing to make him eat? It's
totally missing the point of food autonomy, I'll tell you that.
Karen, disturbed by this scenario.
www.badchair.net
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
DanaBurdick@... writes:
Her son, however, eats a limited number
of things and did not want anything to eat from this restaurant, but
expressed that he would love a cookie from the Starbucks.
~~~
Just get him the cookie! For crying out loud, who cares what he eats from
one 4 hour period to the next?
And why make him wait to get the cookie until after you and his SISTER eat?
Is that some kind of bizarre punishment you're doing to make him eat? It's
totally missing the point of food autonomy, I'll tell you that.
Karen, disturbed by this scenario.
www.badchair.net
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Joyce Fetteroll
On Jun 15, 2005, at 5:32 PM, dana_burdick wrote:
friends to a place with food that's repulsive to you (chicken liver and
pigs feet?). Should they make you wait until they're done with their
meal before they go with you to get a piece of double fudge cake that's
calling to you? Or should they insist you have some pigs feet and
chicken livers first?
Joyce
> Since he hadn't eaten since breakfast, should she insist/gentlyLet's say you skipped breakfast for whatever reason and you went with
> persuade/shove down his troat a quesadilla?
friends to a place with food that's repulsive to you (chicken liver and
pigs feet?). Should they make you wait until they're done with their
meal before they go with you to get a piece of double fudge cake that's
calling to you? Or should they insist you have some pigs feet and
chicken livers first?
Joyce
[email protected]
In a message dated 6/15/2005 3:39:05 PM Mountain Daylight Time,
DanaBurdick@... writes:
-=-My friend and her daughter wanted to get
something from the Una Mas. Her son, however, eats a limited number
of things and did not want anything to eat from this restaurant, but
expressed that he would love a cookie from the Starbucks.-=-
I would've taken the whole group to get the cookie, and he could eat the
cookie while he stood in the Una Mas line.
-=-Since he hadn't eaten since breakfast, should she insist/gently
persuade/shove down his troat a quesadilla? Or, should she say, "I'd
love to get you a cookie as soon as your sister and I are done with
our meal here at the Una Mas."-=-
Both seem punitive.
A quesadilla isn't all that much better for a person than a cookie.
To make him smell food and wait (especially if he's very young) is cruel.
That's my opinion. If the purpose of food is nurture and energy, figuring
out how to get everyone some food is primary. If the purpose of food is
training, I have no interest in helping someone find a training-style answer.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
DanaBurdick@... writes:
-=-My friend and her daughter wanted to get
something from the Una Mas. Her son, however, eats a limited number
of things and did not want anything to eat from this restaurant, but
expressed that he would love a cookie from the Starbucks.-=-
I would've taken the whole group to get the cookie, and he could eat the
cookie while he stood in the Una Mas line.
-=-Since he hadn't eaten since breakfast, should she insist/gently
persuade/shove down his troat a quesadilla? Or, should she say, "I'd
love to get you a cookie as soon as your sister and I are done with
our meal here at the Una Mas."-=-
Both seem punitive.
A quesadilla isn't all that much better for a person than a cookie.
To make him smell food and wait (especially if he's very young) is cruel.
That's my opinion. If the purpose of food is nurture and energy, figuring
out how to get everyone some food is primary. If the purpose of food is
training, I have no interest in helping someone find a training-style answer.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
K Krejci
Life is uncertain - eat dessert first.
:)
Kathy
--- dana_burdick <DanaBurdick@...> wrote:
http://www.good2bdognutz.com
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:)
Kathy
--- dana_burdick <DanaBurdick@...> wrote:
> My friend asked me to post a question for her abouthttp://us.click.yahoo.com/dm21UC/gsnJAA/HwKMAA/0xXolB/TM
> her son's food
> choices.
>
> One day for lunch she took her two kids to an
> outdoor mall which had
> several restaurants. My friend and her daughter
> wanted to get
> something from the Una Mas. Her son, however, eats
> a limited number
> of things and did not want anything to eat from this
> restaurant, but
> expressed that he would love a cookie from the
> Starbucks.
>
> Since he hadn't eaten since breakfast, should she
> insist/gently
> persuade/shove down his troat a quesadilla? Or,
> should she say, "I'd
> love to get you a cookie as soon as your sister and
> I are done with
> our meal here at the Una Mas."
>
> I am, I mean, she is interested in knowing your
> thoughts. ;)
>
> -Dana
>
>
>
>
>
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>
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dana_burdick
I just wanted to clarify that I started the original post as if it
was a question for my friend. I was attempting to joke around a
little, but realize now that the words were ineffective (i.e. bad
joke.) I wanted to make it clear that this question is entirely mine
and not of any friend.
I wanted to say here what I ended up doing at the Una Mas and what
happened later on in the day.
I _did_ get the cookie for him and I _didn't_ make
him eat anything he didn't want to. We got the cookie after we ate
because he wasn't hungry at the time and was intersted in explaining
a science experiment to me. My daughter and I, on the other hand,
were hungry so we just happened to eat first before getting him a
cookie. He didn't care one way or the other, so there was no issue
of punishment or anything.
But the story is not finished. Later, my son has a major blood
sugar dip and was very emotional and combative because he had only
eaten a slice of bread and a cookie the entire day. Similar
scenarios of this sort have happened many times. I allow the
children to eat anything anytime, but they tend to break down later
when they have not had sufficient calories and/or protein to carry
them through. Food is available to them, but they choose not to eat
until it is too late and they are crying and yelling. So, I am
interested in knowing what suggestions people might have for
handling this pattern and helping my children through this bit of a
stickler.
Thanks in advance,
-Dana
was a question for my friend. I was attempting to joke around a
little, but realize now that the words were ineffective (i.e. bad
joke.) I wanted to make it clear that this question is entirely mine
and not of any friend.
I wanted to say here what I ended up doing at the Una Mas and what
happened later on in the day.
I _did_ get the cookie for him and I _didn't_ make
him eat anything he didn't want to. We got the cookie after we ate
because he wasn't hungry at the time and was intersted in explaining
a science experiment to me. My daughter and I, on the other hand,
were hungry so we just happened to eat first before getting him a
cookie. He didn't care one way or the other, so there was no issue
of punishment or anything.
But the story is not finished. Later, my son has a major blood
sugar dip and was very emotional and combative because he had only
eaten a slice of bread and a cookie the entire day. Similar
scenarios of this sort have happened many times. I allow the
children to eat anything anytime, but they tend to break down later
when they have not had sufficient calories and/or protein to carry
them through. Food is available to them, but they choose not to eat
until it is too late and they are crying and yelling. So, I am
interested in knowing what suggestions people might have for
handling this pattern and helping my children through this bit of a
stickler.
Thanks in advance,
-Dana
[email protected]
In a message dated 6/15/2005 11:25:45 PM Eastern Standard Time,
kraekrej@... writes:
Life is uncertain - eat dessert first
*************
Did you make that up or are you quoting someone? I so totally love it.
Thanks- another delicious quote for my fridge.
Kirsten (4/73)- mom to 3 sons: Skyler (5/96), Aric (5/97), and Sawyer (3/99),
wife to Carl (5/72)
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
kraekrej@... writes:
Life is uncertain - eat dessert first
*************
Did you make that up or are you quoting someone? I so totally love it.
Thanks- another delicious quote for my fridge.
Kirsten (4/73)- mom to 3 sons: Skyler (5/96), Aric (5/97), and Sawyer (3/99),
wife to Carl (5/72)
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
Milk shakes, ice cream and pizza have saved us and cranky kids many times.
I have carried water, string cheese, fruit roll-ups and nuts lots of times
(after the kids outgrew the cheerios and fruit juice stage, when I carried
those along all the time).
Sometimes if it's been a while, a tuna and egg salad sandwich will really
hit the spot, and it's pretty easy to carry along, too, and cheap enough that if
it ends up being fed to the cat or dog it's no big loss.
When we camped, I'd take jerkey and some little cheese and sausage balls for
kids to snack on if they were feeling protein deprived and a meal wasn't
imminent. At home it's easy for them to get something out of the freezer and
microwave it, but with camping they have to wait for meals more than they're
used to. Those cheese ball things (I've never settled on a good name for
them <g>) can be made lots of ways, and don't go bad in a day of being out.
Someone asked me for that recipe just a couple of weeks ago and I had to look too
hard so I put it here
_http://www.sandradodd.com/sausageballs/_
(http://www.sandradodd.com/sausageballs/)
I called it sausage balls, but they can be made without the sausage.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
I have carried water, string cheese, fruit roll-ups and nuts lots of times
(after the kids outgrew the cheerios and fruit juice stage, when I carried
those along all the time).
Sometimes if it's been a while, a tuna and egg salad sandwich will really
hit the spot, and it's pretty easy to carry along, too, and cheap enough that if
it ends up being fed to the cat or dog it's no big loss.
When we camped, I'd take jerkey and some little cheese and sausage balls for
kids to snack on if they were feeling protein deprived and a meal wasn't
imminent. At home it's easy for them to get something out of the freezer and
microwave it, but with camping they have to wait for meals more than they're
used to. Those cheese ball things (I've never settled on a good name for
them <g>) can be made lots of ways, and don't go bad in a day of being out.
Someone asked me for that recipe just a couple of weeks ago and I had to look too
hard so I put it here
_http://www.sandradodd.com/sausageballs/_
(http://www.sandradodd.com/sausageballs/)
I called it sausage balls, but they can be made without the sausage.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
dana_burdick
Thanks for the food ideas. My problem is more that the food is there,
but does not get eaten, especially when my son is playing video
games. Oops. I just answered my own question. I know what you all
will say. Put the food in front of him as he plays. I haven't done
this yet and will definitely try it. My own food habits follow a
similar pattern and I don't get the signal that I'm hungry so I don't
eat until it's too late and I have a headache and am cranky.
Thinking about food in advance is trying to say the least...heavy
sigh. I guess there is no help there. If only I were rich, I would
have a personal chef to set food in front of my family and I. :)
I was sort of hoping that the kids would get those old internal
signals going and would make good food choices based on how the food
makes them feel after eating it. I'm wondering what other's opinion
is on this. Is this similiar to what people mistakenly think about
unschooling? All children will read Shakespear and love Calculus to
boot left to learn on their own? Obviously, not every person is going
to like Shakespear and not every person is going to like salad. I
don't have any expectation that my kids will love salad at any time in
their lives, but are my expectations too high to expect that they
should gravitate to a variaty of food that supplies an adequate amount
of nutrition? Obviously, my lack of trust is showing in that last
sentence. I am interested in other folks opinions/experiences with
this.
-Dana
but does not get eaten, especially when my son is playing video
games. Oops. I just answered my own question. I know what you all
will say. Put the food in front of him as he plays. I haven't done
this yet and will definitely try it. My own food habits follow a
similar pattern and I don't get the signal that I'm hungry so I don't
eat until it's too late and I have a headache and am cranky.
Thinking about food in advance is trying to say the least...heavy
sigh. I guess there is no help there. If only I were rich, I would
have a personal chef to set food in front of my family and I. :)
I was sort of hoping that the kids would get those old internal
signals going and would make good food choices based on how the food
makes them feel after eating it. I'm wondering what other's opinion
is on this. Is this similiar to what people mistakenly think about
unschooling? All children will read Shakespear and love Calculus to
boot left to learn on their own? Obviously, not every person is going
to like Shakespear and not every person is going to like salad. I
don't have any expectation that my kids will love salad at any time in
their lives, but are my expectations too high to expect that they
should gravitate to a variaty of food that supplies an adequate amount
of nutrition? Obviously, my lack of trust is showing in that last
sentence. I am interested in other folks opinions/experiences with
this.
-Dana
Lisa M. Cottrell Bentley
> Since he hadn't eaten since breakfast, should she insist/gentlyNone of the above. I'd first get the cookie (offering my to get one for
> persuade/shove down his troat a quesadilla? Or, should she say, "I'd
> love to get you a cookie as soon as your sister and I are done with
> our meal here at the Una Mas."
my other child, too), then get the food for my other child and myself,
then sit down with the both of them and enjoy our meals and talk and
have a really nice time. Nutrition averages out nicely when it isn't
forced.
-Lisa in AZ
Robyn Coburn
<<<<<I just wanted to clarify that I started the original post as if it
was a question for my friend. I was attempting to joke around a
little, but realize now that the words were ineffective (i.e. bad
joke.) I wanted to make it clear that this question is entirely mine
and not of any friend.>>>
Just ignore the last bit of my reply then.
<<<<<But the story is not finished. Later, my son has a major blood
sugar dip and was very emotional and combative because he had only
eaten a slice of bread and a cookie the entire day. Similar
scenarios of this sort have happened many times. I allow the
children to eat anything anytime, but they tend to break down later
when they have not had sufficient calories and/or protein to carry
them through. Food is available to them, but they choose not to eat
until it is too late and they are crying and yelling. So, I am
interested in knowing what suggestions people might have for
handling this pattern and helping my children through this bit of a
stickler.>>>>>
This kind of thing has happened with Jayn (5.5) at times when we are out,
with either unrealized by her hunger or tiredness, and I usually have a good
idea which it is. I have said to her "your behavior is telling me that you
are probably hungry". I almost always have the food bag with us, or at least
in the car, with an assortment of snacks and drinks.
If the needy behavior is having an impact on other children at a playdate, I
have in the past actually picked her up and carried her to a private place
with the food. She usually will eat when the yummy thing is right in front
of her, and it only takes a bite or two to restore her calm. She will then
rationally and calmly tell me about how bad she was feeling.
When Jayn is like this any appeals to logic are futile. The only thing that
helps her feel better is to put liked food right there. So far it has not
happened that she has refused to then eat.
<<<<Food is available to them>>>>
Other than when you are out, what does this mean at your house?
I bring Jayn a sandwich and a sliced up piece of fruit to where she is if it
seems like it has been a long time, and she is very engaged in something.
Other people talk about things like "monkey platters" of finger foods that
are right there on the table, or dishes at child's eye level in the fridge
that require neither preparation time nor adult assistance.
Robyn L. Coburn
--
No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
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was a question for my friend. I was attempting to joke around a
little, but realize now that the words were ineffective (i.e. bad
joke.) I wanted to make it clear that this question is entirely mine
and not of any friend.>>>
Just ignore the last bit of my reply then.
<<<<<But the story is not finished. Later, my son has a major blood
sugar dip and was very emotional and combative because he had only
eaten a slice of bread and a cookie the entire day. Similar
scenarios of this sort have happened many times. I allow the
children to eat anything anytime, but they tend to break down later
when they have not had sufficient calories and/or protein to carry
them through. Food is available to them, but they choose not to eat
until it is too late and they are crying and yelling. So, I am
interested in knowing what suggestions people might have for
handling this pattern and helping my children through this bit of a
stickler.>>>>>
This kind of thing has happened with Jayn (5.5) at times when we are out,
with either unrealized by her hunger or tiredness, and I usually have a good
idea which it is. I have said to her "your behavior is telling me that you
are probably hungry". I almost always have the food bag with us, or at least
in the car, with an assortment of snacks and drinks.
If the needy behavior is having an impact on other children at a playdate, I
have in the past actually picked her up and carried her to a private place
with the food. She usually will eat when the yummy thing is right in front
of her, and it only takes a bite or two to restore her calm. She will then
rationally and calmly tell me about how bad she was feeling.
When Jayn is like this any appeals to logic are futile. The only thing that
helps her feel better is to put liked food right there. So far it has not
happened that she has refused to then eat.
<<<<Food is available to them>>>>
Other than when you are out, what does this mean at your house?
I bring Jayn a sandwich and a sliced up piece of fruit to where she is if it
seems like it has been a long time, and she is very engaged in something.
Other people talk about things like "monkey platters" of finger foods that
are right there on the table, or dishes at child's eye level in the fridge
that require neither preparation time nor adult assistance.
Robyn L. Coburn
--
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Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
Version: 7.0.323 / Virus Database: 267.7.5/18 - Release Date: 6/15/2005
Robyn Coburn
<<<<Since he hadn't eaten since breakfast,>>>>>
That would be irrelevant to me in terms of menu choice in a similar
situation, but might make me more willing to put his need before mine and
anyone else's in my party who had eaten recently and was less hungry.
<<<< should she insist/gently
persuade/shove down his troat a quesadilla?>>>>
Well I would never do so, once Jayn had expressed her disinterest in it.
<<<<< Or, should she say, "I'd
love to get you a cookie as soon as your sister and I are done with
our meal here at the Una Mas." >>>>>
My answer to this might depend on the ages of the children. For example
could the sister be left in the restaurant for a moment while Mom and son
went across the courtyard to get the cookie? A very much younger child would
have a harder time waiting for his cookie than an older one.
The principle behind it of procuring the food that was the child's choice -
I always get Jayn what she wants to eat if it is gettable.
<<<<I am, I mean, she is interested in knowing your thoughts. ;)>>>>
Huh?
The wink prompts me to ask is this friend really you? If so it's better to
be upfront and honest with us.
Robyn L. Coburn
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Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
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That would be irrelevant to me in terms of menu choice in a similar
situation, but might make me more willing to put his need before mine and
anyone else's in my party who had eaten recently and was less hungry.
<<<< should she insist/gently
persuade/shove down his troat a quesadilla?>>>>
Well I would never do so, once Jayn had expressed her disinterest in it.
<<<<< Or, should she say, "I'd
love to get you a cookie as soon as your sister and I are done with
our meal here at the Una Mas." >>>>>
My answer to this might depend on the ages of the children. For example
could the sister be left in the restaurant for a moment while Mom and son
went across the courtyard to get the cookie? A very much younger child would
have a harder time waiting for his cookie than an older one.
The principle behind it of procuring the food that was the child's choice -
I always get Jayn what she wants to eat if it is gettable.
<<<<I am, I mean, she is interested in knowing your thoughts. ;)>>>>
Huh?
The wink prompts me to ask is this friend really you? If so it's better to
be upfront and honest with us.
Robyn L. Coburn
--
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Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
Version: 7.0.323 / Virus Database: 267.7.5/18 - Release Date: 6/15/2005
Joyce Fetteroll
On Jun 16, 2005, at 12:04 AM, dana_burdick wrote:
Carry quick snacks like nuts and such. Don't wait until they say
they're hungry if you've noticed they don't realize their hunger until
it's too late and they're about to melt down!
to help them avoid meltdowns? Would they like you to carry or buy
different snacks? Are your offers for full meals and they don't want to
interrupt what they're doing?
Joyce
> But the story is not finished. Later, my son has a major bloodBe proactive. Be aware of them and offer food before they're starving.
> sugar dip and was very emotional and combative because he had only
> eaten a slice of bread and a cookie the entire day.
Carry quick snacks like nuts and such. Don't wait until they say
they're hungry if you've noticed they don't realize their hunger until
it's too late and they're about to melt down!
> Food is available to them, but they choose not to eatHave talked about it with them? Have you asked them what you could do
> until it is too late and they are crying and yelling.
to help them avoid meltdowns? Would they like you to carry or buy
different snacks? Are your offers for full meals and they don't want to
interrupt what they're doing?
Joyce
[email protected]
In a message dated 6/15/2005 11:15:40 PM Central Standard Time,
DanaBurdick@... writes:
Later, my son has a major blood
sugar dip and was very emotional and combative because he had only
eaten a slice of bread and a cookie the entire day. Similar
scenarios of this sort have happened many times.
~~~
Provide food without making him choose it first. My son has a terrible time
deciding what to eat and when he was 4 or 5 it was horrible, with some of
the same consequences. I offered him bites of what I had at odd times (ham
sandwich or whatever) and he would usually take one. As he got older and could
see the pattern I could have a conversation about it with him. We called the
reaction the "hungry uglies". So, on the mornings he asked me to run out
and get donuts (a major cause of the hungry uglies for him), I'd ask, "how are
we going to prevent the hungry uglies?" and he'd have an idea...maybe a piece
of cheese first or he could eat again at 10:00 or get a piece of sausage
with his donut.
One thing I absolutely counted on to prevent that behavior was me fixing
something to eat and nibbling on it myself. I wouldn't say, "I'm slicing up an
apple, want some?" I'd just go in and slice up the apple and go plop down
beside him and eat it. For Will, it's the change from doing what he's doing to
deciding what to eat that seems to be the problem. He doesn't want to have
to think about food--he just wants it in front of him. At restaurants, he
needs lots of time to look at the menu, even if he's just getting the same
thing he always gets. When I cook, instead of putting salad on his plate, I save
out half the cucumber and slice it up and put on his plate. I cut up a
little steak for his plate. I only put things on his plate that I know he has
eaten and liked in the past. At 11, I can ask him if he's hungry and he'll say
"I had a bowl of cereal" or "YEAH!" He no longer says, "what are you
making?"
It's a progression. He knows he has to eat. When he was younger he didn't
recognize those symptoms of hunger in time. We didn't put pressure on him to
try new things (he learned about trying new things from Blues Clues when he
was 3--his palate is way more adventurous than mine). We don't make him eat
anything he doesn't want, even if he asked for it. It was hard at first,
because I'm a waste not/want not type of person.
Now he wakes up and asks me to take him to the local diner for their
farmer's breakfast, pancakes, eggs, sausage gravy and biscuits, bacon, etc. He eats
much more than he used to, and he can fix himself something if I'm not
thinking about it. If I ask him if he wants a grilled cheese, he usually says
yes. I still surprise him with food in his room and he sometimes doesn't know
he's hungry until he sees it. But the hungry uglies are a thing of the past.
He thinks about how much sugar he's had himself, and makes adjustments.
The learning curve wasn't all that steep.
Karen
www.badchair.net
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
DanaBurdick@... writes:
Later, my son has a major blood
sugar dip and was very emotional and combative because he had only
eaten a slice of bread and a cookie the entire day. Similar
scenarios of this sort have happened many times.
~~~
Provide food without making him choose it first. My son has a terrible time
deciding what to eat and when he was 4 or 5 it was horrible, with some of
the same consequences. I offered him bites of what I had at odd times (ham
sandwich or whatever) and he would usually take one. As he got older and could
see the pattern I could have a conversation about it with him. We called the
reaction the "hungry uglies". So, on the mornings he asked me to run out
and get donuts (a major cause of the hungry uglies for him), I'd ask, "how are
we going to prevent the hungry uglies?" and he'd have an idea...maybe a piece
of cheese first or he could eat again at 10:00 or get a piece of sausage
with his donut.
One thing I absolutely counted on to prevent that behavior was me fixing
something to eat and nibbling on it myself. I wouldn't say, "I'm slicing up an
apple, want some?" I'd just go in and slice up the apple and go plop down
beside him and eat it. For Will, it's the change from doing what he's doing to
deciding what to eat that seems to be the problem. He doesn't want to have
to think about food--he just wants it in front of him. At restaurants, he
needs lots of time to look at the menu, even if he's just getting the same
thing he always gets. When I cook, instead of putting salad on his plate, I save
out half the cucumber and slice it up and put on his plate. I cut up a
little steak for his plate. I only put things on his plate that I know he has
eaten and liked in the past. At 11, I can ask him if he's hungry and he'll say
"I had a bowl of cereal" or "YEAH!" He no longer says, "what are you
making?"
It's a progression. He knows he has to eat. When he was younger he didn't
recognize those symptoms of hunger in time. We didn't put pressure on him to
try new things (he learned about trying new things from Blues Clues when he
was 3--his palate is way more adventurous than mine). We don't make him eat
anything he doesn't want, even if he asked for it. It was hard at first,
because I'm a waste not/want not type of person.
Now he wakes up and asks me to take him to the local diner for their
farmer's breakfast, pancakes, eggs, sausage gravy and biscuits, bacon, etc. He eats
much more than he used to, and he can fix himself something if I'm not
thinking about it. If I ask him if he wants a grilled cheese, he usually says
yes. I still surprise him with food in his room and he sometimes doesn't know
he's hungry until he sees it. But the hungry uglies are a thing of the past.
He thinks about how much sugar he's had himself, and makes adjustments.
The learning curve wasn't all that steep.
Karen
www.badchair.net
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Danielle Conger
dana_burdick wrote:
the cookie first if he had expressed that as we were deciding where to
eat. I couldn't ascertain whether this was a food court situation or a
sit down, waitress type situation. The beauty of food courts is that
*everyone* should be able to find something to enjoy. A sit down
restaurant is slightly different, and if I'd known about the cookie in
advance, then the cookie would've been the first on our agenda. If I
were sitting down with my three young kids and we were already in the
middle of eating when the cookie came up, I would tell my son that we'd
stop first thing after I'd paid the check here. I wouldn't be able to
run get it while I left them at the table, and none of them is old
enough to head over on their own, so I would feel kinda stuck. I'd also
try to see if there were any cookies or something available where we
were that he might like to have instead or at least in the mean time.
this because we've had lots of conversations about it. *I'm* also very
much like this, so he gets it from me, and I'm able to model good
choices for him, so it's not always about *him.* Because of this, he's
very used to the, "Sure! What can I get you with the cookie that will
help your body feel full and keep your blood sugar even?" He gets this
rather often because he'll ask for a cookie or ice cream first thing in
the morning when he wakes up, an especially important time of the day
for him to have protein of some sort. He's fine with the response
because he's always gotten the cookie in addition to the food and
usually first while I'm preparing whatever else he's going to eat. So, I
would've launched into that same pattern with Sam in the situation you
describe. I would've said "Sure! Do you see anything else here that I
can get you to eat with your cookie so your blood sugar doesn't drop?"
I'm not sure how old your children are. My Sam is 5, so I'm still
extremely involved in helping him get meals, which offers lots of
opportunities for conversation. I've been setting up the solution to
this dilemma for quite a while now, so the important groundwork is
already laid.
--
~~Danielle
Emily (7), Julia (6), Sam (5)
http://www.danielleconger.com/Homeschool/Welcomehome.html
~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*
"With our thoughts, we make the world." ~~Buddha
>I _did_ get the cookie for him and I _didn't_ makeFwiw, although it's already been said, I agree that I would've gotten
>him eat anything he didn't want to. We got the cookie after we ate
>because he wasn't hungry at the time and was intersted in explaining
>a science experiment to me. My daughter and I, on the other hand,
>were hungry so we just happened to eat first before getting him a
>cookie. He didn't care one way or the other, so there was no issue
>of punishment or anything.
>
>
the cookie first if he had expressed that as we were deciding where to
eat. I couldn't ascertain whether this was a food court situation or a
sit down, waitress type situation. The beauty of food courts is that
*everyone* should be able to find something to enjoy. A sit down
restaurant is slightly different, and if I'd known about the cookie in
advance, then the cookie would've been the first on our agenda. If I
were sitting down with my three young kids and we were already in the
middle of eating when the cookie came up, I would tell my son that we'd
stop first thing after I'd paid the check here. I wouldn't be able to
run get it while I left them at the table, and none of them is old
enough to head over on their own, so I would feel kinda stuck. I'd also
try to see if there were any cookies or something available where we
were that he might like to have instead or at least in the mean time.
>But the story is not finished. Later, my son has a major bloodI have a son who is *very* much like this, but he also knows he's like
>sugar dip and was very emotional and combative because he had only
>eaten a slice of bread and a cookie the entire day. Similar
>scenarios of this sort have happened many times. I allow the
>children to eat anything anytime, but they tend to break down later
>when they have not had sufficient calories and/or protein to carry
>them through. Food is available to them, but they choose not to eat
>until it is too late and they are crying and yelling. So, I am
>interested in knowing what suggestions people might have for
>handling this pattern and helping my children through this bit of a
>stickler.
>
this because we've had lots of conversations about it. *I'm* also very
much like this, so he gets it from me, and I'm able to model good
choices for him, so it's not always about *him.* Because of this, he's
very used to the, "Sure! What can I get you with the cookie that will
help your body feel full and keep your blood sugar even?" He gets this
rather often because he'll ask for a cookie or ice cream first thing in
the morning when he wakes up, an especially important time of the day
for him to have protein of some sort. He's fine with the response
because he's always gotten the cookie in addition to the food and
usually first while I'm preparing whatever else he's going to eat. So, I
would've launched into that same pattern with Sam in the situation you
describe. I would've said "Sure! Do you see anything else here that I
can get you to eat with your cookie so your blood sugar doesn't drop?"
I'm not sure how old your children are. My Sam is 5, so I'm still
extremely involved in helping him get meals, which offers lots of
opportunities for conversation. I've been setting up the solution to
this dilemma for quite a while now, so the important groundwork is
already laid.
--
~~Danielle
Emily (7), Julia (6), Sam (5)
http://www.danielleconger.com/Homeschool/Welcomehome.html
~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*
"With our thoughts, we make the world." ~~Buddha
soggyboysmom
As Danielle said, information, information, information, over time,
will have an effect. My DS is just turned 7 and we noted the blood
sugar/protein lack situation probably 3 or 4 years ago. If I notice
he's starting to get on the edgy side, I may offer to make him
something, I may just get out some foods and put them by him. Also,
since I get grumpy without food too, I might say "hey I'm starting
to feel a little hungry. Think I'll get (whatever). Want some?"
(okay so not typically in verbose complete paragraphs - generally,
it's more part and parcel of the flow of talk throughout the day).
He requested we keep a list of protein foods on the chalkboard in
the kitchen for his easy reference - sometimes he just can't think
of anything and seeing it there takes some of the pressure off him.
Sometimes seeing it acts as a reminder "oh yeah I think I'll have
some of that". And, when we're out, there's always some way to get
food quick - whether it's a snack bag in the car, spare cash for a
quick run to a minimart or whatever, some way to get needed food in
pretty quickly. We've found that string cheese (and now they
have 'swirl' string cheese that has cheddar swirled in) and even
plain cheese cut with mini cookie cutters into shapes travel pretty
well for a day - oh and baby bel cheeses too (bonus is that DS likes
to play with the wax off the baby bel cheese - food and toy in one!
lol). Over time, DS has gotten more able to notice when he's needing
a refill - if he's being a car, he needs more "fuel" at
the "pitstop". We've also done things like bring him a snack and
remind him that a Jedi (or whatever character he was being) needed
to keep his energy up, so we brought him ...(and we make up some
odd, in-character name for whatever it is - 'Naboo fish balls' or
whatever).
will have an effect. My DS is just turned 7 and we noted the blood
sugar/protein lack situation probably 3 or 4 years ago. If I notice
he's starting to get on the edgy side, I may offer to make him
something, I may just get out some foods and put them by him. Also,
since I get grumpy without food too, I might say "hey I'm starting
to feel a little hungry. Think I'll get (whatever). Want some?"
(okay so not typically in verbose complete paragraphs - generally,
it's more part and parcel of the flow of talk throughout the day).
He requested we keep a list of protein foods on the chalkboard in
the kitchen for his easy reference - sometimes he just can't think
of anything and seeing it there takes some of the pressure off him.
Sometimes seeing it acts as a reminder "oh yeah I think I'll have
some of that". And, when we're out, there's always some way to get
food quick - whether it's a snack bag in the car, spare cash for a
quick run to a minimart or whatever, some way to get needed food in
pretty quickly. We've found that string cheese (and now they
have 'swirl' string cheese that has cheddar swirled in) and even
plain cheese cut with mini cookie cutters into shapes travel pretty
well for a day - oh and baby bel cheeses too (bonus is that DS likes
to play with the wax off the baby bel cheese - food and toy in one!
lol). Over time, DS has gotten more able to notice when he's needing
a refill - if he's being a car, he needs more "fuel" at
the "pitstop". We've also done things like bring him a snack and
remind him that a Jedi (or whatever character he was being) needed
to keep his energy up, so we brought him ...(and we make up some
odd, in-character name for whatever it is - 'Naboo fish balls' or
whatever).
[email protected]
In a message dated 6/16/2005 4:06:33 AM Mountain Daylight Time,
dezigna@... writes:
-=-She usually will eat when the yummy thing is right in front
of her, and it only takes a bite or two to restore her calm. She will then
rationally and calmly tell me about how bad she was feeling.-=-
I like this, and it makes sense to me, and I wish everyone just knew it
calmly in their insides.
I cringe when people say "I asked him if he wanted to eat and he said no."
Put some food where he can reach it, and bypass the chit-chat and
negotiations. LOTS of times people (adults included) say "no" about food because they
can't slow their minds enough to think about what they would want to eat, or
they don't want to stop what they're doing and risk it being a LONG food break
with distracting conversation while they're trying to concentrate. I do
that with writing sometimes. If Keith asks me if I want breakfast, I say no
rather than break my train of thought. If he puts food in reach, I eat it and
everything's better.
I do that for my kids. Yesterday they were each involved in a video game
for a long time (not all at once, different times and places). I made
sandwiches and delivered them where they were and each kid was happily relieved and
only had to interact with me about this long: "Thanks! cool." No longer.
They didn't have to pause or tell their teammates they'd be back (these were
Halo2 and World of Warcraft situations.)
I also had times of warm conversation with each of them yesterday (Holly
several times because she's been gone and keeps coming to hang out with me and
tell me stories). Both Kirby and Marty sought me out just to talk sometime
during the day. It was a good day.
The worst thing would've been one of them really didn't want a sandwich, but
we have a dog and three cats, so it wouldn't have been really horrible.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
dezigna@... writes:
-=-She usually will eat when the yummy thing is right in front
of her, and it only takes a bite or two to restore her calm. She will then
rationally and calmly tell me about how bad she was feeling.-=-
I like this, and it makes sense to me, and I wish everyone just knew it
calmly in their insides.
I cringe when people say "I asked him if he wanted to eat and he said no."
Put some food where he can reach it, and bypass the chit-chat and
negotiations. LOTS of times people (adults included) say "no" about food because they
can't slow their minds enough to think about what they would want to eat, or
they don't want to stop what they're doing and risk it being a LONG food break
with distracting conversation while they're trying to concentrate. I do
that with writing sometimes. If Keith asks me if I want breakfast, I say no
rather than break my train of thought. If he puts food in reach, I eat it and
everything's better.
I do that for my kids. Yesterday they were each involved in a video game
for a long time (not all at once, different times and places). I made
sandwiches and delivered them where they were and each kid was happily relieved and
only had to interact with me about this long: "Thanks! cool." No longer.
They didn't have to pause or tell their teammates they'd be back (these were
Halo2 and World of Warcraft situations.)
I also had times of warm conversation with each of them yesterday (Holly
several times because she's been gone and keeps coming to hang out with me and
tell me stories). Both Kirby and Marty sought me out just to talk sometime
during the day. It was a good day.
The worst thing would've been one of them really didn't want a sandwich, but
we have a dog and three cats, so it wouldn't have been really horrible.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
dana_burdick
>I would've said "Sure! Do you see anything else here that IThese types of conversations go on all the time. And, I am often
>can get you to eat with your cookie so your blood sugar doesn't drop?"
talking about the importance of different types of foods. I have a
fairly restricted diet myself due to a food allergy, so my kids see
that effect of good food and bad food on me all the time. In that way
I am a role model (notice, I didn't say 'good' role model). I just
want to note here that I do not force my food restrictions on them in
anyway. I do have to pay very close attention though that they are
not exhibiting the same food reactions as I have. Allergies build
over time. So, while they do not seem allergic at this point, that
doesn't necessarily mean they won't become allergic in the future.
Even if I say something similar as you quote above, my son and my
daughter for that matter will not necessarily choose something else to
eat. This is when the pattern begins. They are happy with a cookie.
They do not get hungry later on and they do not eat anything else
later on, then their blood sugar drops. So I am compelled to remind
them to eat something. And, I'm compelled to remind them to eat
something good in the first place. I am trying not to follow through
on these urges, however. As in the case with the cookie, I went ahead
and bought the cookie for him as he wished.
I am trying to find the balance between my concerns for their
nutrition and my concern for their autonomy. Ultimately, I want them
to become fully autonomous in there food choices and for them to do is
successfully without these dips. They and I have not arrived yet,
that's why I'm posing the question to the group.
-Dana
[email protected]
In a message dated 6/16/2005 6:22:01 AM Mountain Daylight Time,
DanaBurdick@... writes:
Thinking about food in advance is trying to say the least...heavy
sigh. I guess there is no help there. If only I were rich, I would
have a personal chef to set food in front of my family and I. :)
If you don't do it yourself, it's extra unfair to be cranky that your kids
haven't developed that awareness of what their body needs. But the good news
is, they'll probably learn it more easily than you have because they started
earlier!
-=-I was sort of hoping that the kids would get those old internal
signals going and would make good food choices based on how the food
makes them feel after eating it. I'm wondering what other's opinion
is on this. Is this similiar to what people mistakenly think about
unschooling? -=-
Well...
That makes it sound like you've already decided it's a mistaken idea, and
false.
My kids do have good awareness of what they need to eat. That doesn't mean
they love salad or eat "enough fruit" (by the charts), but it absolutely
DOES mean they don't live on sweets or starches. (Kirby eats more breakfast
cereal than I think is good, but if I start to rag on him I'm sure that will
only be worse than leaving him alone.) They're all good about eating protein
and drinking water and juice and milk, though they'll drink soda too. They
don't crave soda. They eat it with pizza and things that "need soda."
And it's not just "how the foods make them feel after," it's almost a
knowledge of needing more roughage or something soothing to the stomach. Sometimes
one of them will just want rice or ramen with nothing else. Filling but
bland.
Marty and Holly have braces. I forget they're not supposed to eat popcorn
or nuts. They never, ever forget. Kids whose parents try to control what
they can and can't eat because they have braces will have kids who sneak the
foods thinking they're "winning" or getting away with something. I've known
several other (controlled schooled) kids with braces who seemed to think that as
long as their parents or the orthodontist didn't know, it was okay. Holly
and Marty are fully aware of the reasons not to chew sticky gum or have hard
food or corn on the cob. One of Holly's favorite foods is apple, and she
used to eat them a lot. She chose to have braces, though, and now she'll only
eat cut-up apple.
-=- Is this similiar to what people mistakenly think about
unschooling? All children will read Shakespear and love Calculus to
boot left to learn on their own? Obviously, not every person is going
to like Shakespear and not every person is going to like salad.-=-
The idea that Shakespeare is like salad, though, is (I'm thinking maybe) a
schoolish idea. Shakespeare is part of a balanced curriculum. Salad is part
of a balanced modern diet.
Some people live and breathe Shakespeare. That's not unhealthy.
Shakespeare involves history, poetry, costume, philosophy, theology, politics,
language, interpersonal relations, prejudices, slapstick humor, culture... and
that's before even getting to the actual staging, sets, costume, lighting, music,
make-up...
Salad is just salad. It doesn't need to be in the form of a salad. There
are other and better ways to eat green vegetables than chopped in a bowl with
too much vinegar, oil and sugar on top.
-=-I don't have any expectation that my kids will love salad at any time in
their lives,-=-
Lots of people go through a season in their lives (or in the year) when they
love salad. It doesn't mean salad is their favorite food. Are their
cooks here who know of websites specializing in salad recipes? There are seafood
salads and potato and macaroni salads and chicken salads and all KINDS of
salads.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
DanaBurdick@... writes:
Thinking about food in advance is trying to say the least...heavy
sigh. I guess there is no help there. If only I were rich, I would
have a personal chef to set food in front of my family and I. :)
If you don't do it yourself, it's extra unfair to be cranky that your kids
haven't developed that awareness of what their body needs. But the good news
is, they'll probably learn it more easily than you have because they started
earlier!
-=-I was sort of hoping that the kids would get those old internal
signals going and would make good food choices based on how the food
makes them feel after eating it. I'm wondering what other's opinion
is on this. Is this similiar to what people mistakenly think about
unschooling? -=-
Well...
That makes it sound like you've already decided it's a mistaken idea, and
false.
My kids do have good awareness of what they need to eat. That doesn't mean
they love salad or eat "enough fruit" (by the charts), but it absolutely
DOES mean they don't live on sweets or starches. (Kirby eats more breakfast
cereal than I think is good, but if I start to rag on him I'm sure that will
only be worse than leaving him alone.) They're all good about eating protein
and drinking water and juice and milk, though they'll drink soda too. They
don't crave soda. They eat it with pizza and things that "need soda."
And it's not just "how the foods make them feel after," it's almost a
knowledge of needing more roughage or something soothing to the stomach. Sometimes
one of them will just want rice or ramen with nothing else. Filling but
bland.
Marty and Holly have braces. I forget they're not supposed to eat popcorn
or nuts. They never, ever forget. Kids whose parents try to control what
they can and can't eat because they have braces will have kids who sneak the
foods thinking they're "winning" or getting away with something. I've known
several other (controlled schooled) kids with braces who seemed to think that as
long as their parents or the orthodontist didn't know, it was okay. Holly
and Marty are fully aware of the reasons not to chew sticky gum or have hard
food or corn on the cob. One of Holly's favorite foods is apple, and she
used to eat them a lot. She chose to have braces, though, and now she'll only
eat cut-up apple.
-=- Is this similiar to what people mistakenly think about
unschooling? All children will read Shakespear and love Calculus to
boot left to learn on their own? Obviously, not every person is going
to like Shakespear and not every person is going to like salad.-=-
The idea that Shakespeare is like salad, though, is (I'm thinking maybe) a
schoolish idea. Shakespeare is part of a balanced curriculum. Salad is part
of a balanced modern diet.
Some people live and breathe Shakespeare. That's not unhealthy.
Shakespeare involves history, poetry, costume, philosophy, theology, politics,
language, interpersonal relations, prejudices, slapstick humor, culture... and
that's before even getting to the actual staging, sets, costume, lighting, music,
make-up...
Salad is just salad. It doesn't need to be in the form of a salad. There
are other and better ways to eat green vegetables than chopped in a bowl with
too much vinegar, oil and sugar on top.
-=-I don't have any expectation that my kids will love salad at any time in
their lives,-=-
Lots of people go through a season in their lives (or in the year) when they
love salad. It doesn't mean salad is their favorite food. Are their
cooks here who know of websites specializing in salad recipes? There are seafood
salads and potato and macaroni salads and chicken salads and all KINDS of
salads.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
dana_burdick
He requested we keep a list of protein foods on the chalkboard in
This is a great suggestion.
This is another thing I have tried doing. When my son is on the
computer, I will invite him to come eat with my daughter and I, say,
when we are having breakfast or something. No pressure, just a
simple invitation. He can choose to come or not. He has come every
time so far with this approach. It has been fun for all of us too
having everyone around the table in the morning. In the event he
didn't want to come, I would say to him that he could just get
something later when he takes a break. My hope is that I can extend
this type of thing into other situations. I will keep working at
building on good scenarios such as these.
Thanks everyone for your suggestions.
-Dana
> the kitchen for his easy reference - sometimes he just can't thinkhim.
> of anything and seeing it there takes some of the pressure off
This is a great suggestion.
This is another thing I have tried doing. When my son is on the
computer, I will invite him to come eat with my daughter and I, say,
when we are having breakfast or something. No pressure, just a
simple invitation. He can choose to come or not. He has come every
time so far with this approach. It has been fun for all of us too
having everyone around the table in the morning. In the event he
didn't want to come, I would say to him that he could just get
something later when he takes a break. My hope is that I can extend
this type of thing into other situations. I will keep working at
building on good scenarios such as these.
Thanks everyone for your suggestions.
-Dana
Dana Matt
> But the story is not finished. Later, my son has aI would have offered mine a starbuck's latte as
> major blood
> sugar dip and was very emotional and combative
> because he had only
> eaten a slice of bread and a cookie the entire day.
well--the protein in the milk may have been what he
needed....
(the other)
Dana
(and coffee goddess)
Guadalupe's Coffee Roaster
100% Organic Fair Trade Coffee
Roasted to Perfection Daily
http://www.guadalupescoffee.com
__________________________________
Discover Yahoo!
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Dana Matt
> This is another thing I have tried doing. When myMy kids would get too hungry if I did this. I bring
> son is on the
> computer, I will invite him to come eat with my
> daughter and I, say,
> when we are having breakfast or something....... In
> the event he
> didn't want to come, I would say to him that he
> could just get
> something later when he takes a break.
them food to their computer,or their TV, or their tent
or dollhouse or book or whatever, instead.
(the other)
Dana
Guadalupe's Coffee Roaster
100% Organic Fair Trade Coffee
Roasted to Perfection Daily
http://www.guadalupescoffee.com
__________________________________
Discover Yahoo!
Have fun online with music videos, cool games, IM and more. Check it out!
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soggyboysmom
--- In [email protected], Dana Matt
<hoffmanwilson@y...> wrote:
the kitchen and alert DS that there's food coming so he can set up a
table (we have plastic lightweight stack tables in the living room -
stackable, storeable, easy to move and arrange) and then I'll bring
it out to him, sometimes he'll come get it at a commercial break,
etc.
Good stuff for eating elsewhere: DS is really fond of wraps - any
kind of wraps; microwave a flour tortilla with cheese inside -
instant, easily portable grilled cheese; he'll even do PBJ wraps;
cold cuts work fine too; anything spreadable - cream cheese and ham
wraps are tasty - tuck in a pickle spear when you roll it or mix in
some dill pickle relish in with the cream cheese for more flavor;
scrambled eggs and sausage rolled up fresh way better than fast food
breakfast burritos; you can even make BIG pancakes and use them to
wrap eggs and sausages. Drop biscuits with shredded cheese and meat
(ham, ground meat/sausage, etc), veggies (bell pepper etc) are great
handy bites (a donut place near here calls them 'scones' but I'm not
sure if they fit the definition of a proper scone or not). DH and DS
can both play certain video and computer games one handed while
eating a wrap.
<hoffmanwilson@y...> wrote:
>Depending on what's going on sometimes I'll dish up the plates in
> > This is another thing I have tried doing. When my
> > son is on the
> > computer, I will invite him to come eat with my
> > daughter and I, say,
> > when we are having breakfast or something....... In
> > the event he
> > didn't want to come, I would say to him that he
> > could just get
> > something later when he takes a break.
>
> My kids would get too hungry if I did this. I bring
> them food to their computer,or their TV, or their tent
> or dollhouse or book or whatever, instead.
> (the other)
> Dana
>
the kitchen and alert DS that there's food coming so he can set up a
table (we have plastic lightweight stack tables in the living room -
stackable, storeable, easy to move and arrange) and then I'll bring
it out to him, sometimes he'll come get it at a commercial break,
etc.
Good stuff for eating elsewhere: DS is really fond of wraps - any
kind of wraps; microwave a flour tortilla with cheese inside -
instant, easily portable grilled cheese; he'll even do PBJ wraps;
cold cuts work fine too; anything spreadable - cream cheese and ham
wraps are tasty - tuck in a pickle spear when you roll it or mix in
some dill pickle relish in with the cream cheese for more flavor;
scrambled eggs and sausage rolled up fresh way better than fast food
breakfast burritos; you can even make BIG pancakes and use them to
wrap eggs and sausages. Drop biscuits with shredded cheese and meat
(ham, ground meat/sausage, etc), veggies (bell pepper etc) are great
handy bites (a donut place near here calls them 'scones' but I'm not
sure if they fit the definition of a proper scone or not). DH and DS
can both play certain video and computer games one handed while
eating a wrap.
[email protected]
In a message dated 6/16/2005 10:26:21 AM Central Standard Time,
DanaBurdick@... writes:
In the event he
didn't want to come, I would say to him that he could just get
something later when he takes a break.
~~~
If the goal is to keep him on an even keel, why wouldn't one of the options
be to bring the food to the computer?
Karen
www.badchair.net
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
DanaBurdick@... writes:
In the event he
didn't want to come, I would say to him that he could just get
something later when he takes a break.
~~~
If the goal is to keep him on an even keel, why wouldn't one of the options
be to bring the food to the computer?
Karen
www.badchair.net
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
arcarpenter2003
--- In [email protected], "dana_burdick"
<DanaBurdick@c...> wrote:
==> I was sort of hoping that the kids would get those old internal
factors, too. As long as they have information *and* freedom *and*
the support/help as they need it, they will. The choices they made
last week may be completely different from the ones they make next
year. It's a learning process -- it doesn't happen all at once, or
even in neat little graduated steps. It happens over time, at their
own pace.
== My own food habits follow a
are learning together, as in so much of unschooling.
If it were me, and I started to realize that I had some behaviors
(about waiting to eat) that I was doing habitually, I would probably
start exploring that and journaling about it, bringing up memories and
images I associate with the issue -- getting a good look at the
choices my unconscious is making while I'm not looking, so to speak.
I would also start noting when I do feel enthusiastic about food and
when I don't. When I do, I would use that energy to make some good,
nurturing food and snacks ahead of time. Banana nut bread, apple
cheddar nut bread, whole wheat pancakes, frozen smoothie popsicles, a
batch of trail mix, a whole-wheat pasta dish that will keep or freeze,
a big salad ... even just cutting up cheese and lunchmeat and veggies
for finger snacks over the next few days. Stuff that you like and
stuff that your kids like. Focus on finger foods, since it sounds
like your kids (and maybe you) need to be able to eat while you're
doing the things that interest you.
Then, as you head into the times that you don't feel so energetic
about food, you have stuff made ahead that you can feel good about and
can easily pull out. To bring to your children while they're watching
TV. To bring with you on outings. And so on. <G>
== are my expectations too high to expect that they
when it comes to words like gravitate and variety and adequate and
nutrition. My kids gravitate to a variety of adequately nutrional
foods, by my definition, but they still have ice cream or otter pops
for breakfast sometimes. <G> And they still will go through phases
where they eat mostly one food or one type of food for days at a time.
I think you will answer your own question as you take a breath and
honestly explore your own expectations. Remember that "nutrition"
balances out over a few days. Remember that they need information
(not nagging) given in a helpful, supportive, "let's try it and see"
environment. Remember that your expectations may be (are probably)
colored by your own issues.
A pretty good book that might help you explore these issues is
_Preventing Childhood Eating Problems_ by Jane R. Hirschmann. It's a
little mainstream on things like weaning (or at one point she mentions
the difficulty of living with teenagers -- definitely not
unschooling), but it contains references to the scientific data that
supports "self-demand feeding," as she calls it.
Hope that helps.
Peace,
Amy
<DanaBurdick@c...> wrote:
==> I was sort of hoping that the kids would get those old internal
> signals going and would make good food choices based on how the foodOh, but they will -- and they'll make choices based on a lot of other
> makes them feel after eating it. ==
factors, too. As long as they have information *and* freedom *and*
the support/help as they need it, they will. The choices they made
last week may be completely different from the ones they make next
year. It's a learning process -- it doesn't happen all at once, or
even in neat little graduated steps. It happens over time, at their
own pace.
== My own food habits follow a
> similar pattern and I don't get the signal that I'm hungry so I don'tSo no wonder they're having the same issue, right? You and your kids
> eat until it's too late and I have a headache and am cranky.
> Thinking about food in advance is trying to say the least...heavy
> sigh. I guess there is no help there. If only I were rich, I would
> have a personal chef to set food in front of my family and I. :)==
are learning together, as in so much of unschooling.
If it were me, and I started to realize that I had some behaviors
(about waiting to eat) that I was doing habitually, I would probably
start exploring that and journaling about it, bringing up memories and
images I associate with the issue -- getting a good look at the
choices my unconscious is making while I'm not looking, so to speak.
I would also start noting when I do feel enthusiastic about food and
when I don't. When I do, I would use that energy to make some good,
nurturing food and snacks ahead of time. Banana nut bread, apple
cheddar nut bread, whole wheat pancakes, frozen smoothie popsicles, a
batch of trail mix, a whole-wheat pasta dish that will keep or freeze,
a big salad ... even just cutting up cheese and lunchmeat and veggies
for finger snacks over the next few days. Stuff that you like and
stuff that your kids like. Focus on finger foods, since it sounds
like your kids (and maybe you) need to be able to eat while you're
doing the things that interest you.
Then, as you head into the times that you don't feel so energetic
about food, you have stuff made ahead that you can feel good about and
can easily pull out. To bring to your children while they're watching
TV. To bring with you on outings. And so on. <G>
== are my expectations too high to expect that they
> should gravitate to a variaty of food that supplies an adequate amountI can't get in your head and see what exactly your expectations are
> of nutrition? ==
when it comes to words like gravitate and variety and adequate and
nutrition. My kids gravitate to a variety of adequately nutrional
foods, by my definition, but they still have ice cream or otter pops
for breakfast sometimes. <G> And they still will go through phases
where they eat mostly one food or one type of food for days at a time.
I think you will answer your own question as you take a breath and
honestly explore your own expectations. Remember that "nutrition"
balances out over a few days. Remember that they need information
(not nagging) given in a helpful, supportive, "let's try it and see"
environment. Remember that your expectations may be (are probably)
colored by your own issues.
A pretty good book that might help you explore these issues is
_Preventing Childhood Eating Problems_ by Jane R. Hirschmann. It's a
little mainstream on things like weaning (or at one point she mentions
the difficulty of living with teenagers -- definitely not
unschooling), but it contains references to the scientific data that
supports "self-demand feeding," as she calls it.
Hope that helps.
Peace,
Amy
diana jenner
dana_burdick wrote:
a couple bucks to get himself a cookie, or I would walk with him while
waiting for my food to arrive at Una Mas. Hannah's 8 and is usually
happy to hang out and read or draw while I tend to Hayden.
bread for him to have after the cookie he will "love". If there's a
peanut butter somethin, I'll grab that. We'd go back to the restaurant,
a win-win situation-- what a great memory for the boy! And as a bonus,
the wonderful smell of the mexican food might just convince him to
nibble off your plate!
:) diana
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>My friend asked me to post a question for her about her son's foodI would either send my son (he's six, we've been in this situation) with
>choices.
>
>One day for lunch she took her two kids to an outdoor mall which had
>several restaurants. My friend and her daughter wanted to get
>something from the Una Mas. Her son, however, eats a limited number
>of things and did not want anything to eat from this restaurant, but
>expressed that he would love a cookie from the Starbucks.
>
>
a couple bucks to get himself a cookie, or I would walk with him while
waiting for my food to arrive at Una Mas. Hannah's 8 and is usually
happy to hang out and read or draw while I tend to Hayden.
>Since he hadn't eaten since breakfast, should she insist/gentlyWhile at Starbucks I might pick up a slice of banana bread or pumpkin
>persuade/shove down his troat a quesadilla? Or, should she say, "I'd
>love to get you a cookie as soon as your sister and I are done with
>our meal here at the Una Mas."
>
>
bread for him to have after the cookie he will "love". If there's a
peanut butter somethin, I'll grab that. We'd go back to the restaurant,
a win-win situation-- what a great memory for the boy! And as a bonus,
the wonderful smell of the mexican food might just convince him to
nibble off your plate!
:) diana
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
soggyboysmom
--- In [email protected], diana jenner
<hahamommy@s...> wrote:
with you - string cheese, a plastic wrapped peanut butter cookie,
some trail mix, etc - they take little space, time, effort, money
and pay off in a big way in the long run. That way, as you are on
line (at Starbucks or Una Mas), you can grab one and say "until we
get the ordering done, how about this to tide you over?" Not as a
substitute but simply acknowledging that buying food often entails
lines and you want to accommodate things as quickly as possible
while waiting for their main goal.
The reason the pb mention got this thought going is that we make
peanut butter, banana, honey, oatmeal, raisin, chocolate chip
cookies where the banana and honey subs for the sugars and where fat
free plain (or vanilla) yogurt subs for the butter/shortning. They
come out more like ball shaped muffins and they are quite sturdy for
travel snacks. Great for eating on the move and contains protein,
fruit, dairy, and complex carbs and *chocolate*<grin>. Sometimes we
also use other dried fruits like cranberries or cherries; sometimes
we put in peanuts or other chopped nuts; sometimes we use mini M&Ms
for color. Whatever's handy.
<hahamommy@s...> wrote:
> dana_burdick wrote:The peanut butter thing triggered another thought - pack a snack
>
> >My friend asked me to post a question for her about her son's
>food
> >choices.
> >
> >One day for lunch she took her two kids to an outdoor mall which
>had
> >several restaurants. My friend and her daughter wanted to get
> >something from the Una Mas. Her son, however, eats a limited
>number
> >of things and did not want anything to eat from this restaurant,
>but
> >expressed that he would love a cookie from the Starbucks.
>
with you - string cheese, a plastic wrapped peanut butter cookie,
some trail mix, etc - they take little space, time, effort, money
and pay off in a big way in the long run. That way, as you are on
line (at Starbucks or Una Mas), you can grab one and say "until we
get the ordering done, how about this to tide you over?" Not as a
substitute but simply acknowledging that buying food often entails
lines and you want to accommodate things as quickly as possible
while waiting for their main goal.
The reason the pb mention got this thought going is that we make
peanut butter, banana, honey, oatmeal, raisin, chocolate chip
cookies where the banana and honey subs for the sugars and where fat
free plain (or vanilla) yogurt subs for the butter/shortning. They
come out more like ball shaped muffins and they are quite sturdy for
travel snacks. Great for eating on the move and contains protein,
fruit, dairy, and complex carbs and *chocolate*<grin>. Sometimes we
also use other dried fruits like cranberries or cherries; sometimes
we put in peanuts or other chopped nuts; sometimes we use mini M&Ms
for color. Whatever's handy.
[email protected]
In a message dated 6/16/2005 9:25:40 AM Mountain Daylight Time,
DanaBurdick@... writes:
They do not get hungry later on and they do not eat anything else
later on, then their blood sugar drops. So I am compelled to remind
them to eat something.
Avoid "compelled."
"Compelled" is being driven by forces outside ourselves.
You choose to remind them, but that's not your only choice.
-=- And, I'm compelled to remind them to eat
something good in the first place. -=-
??
Your reminders aren't working then. But that's why you came for more ideas,
right?
Instead of reminding, present food itself, not food-talk.
If you're feeling compelled, that adds stress. Here are various people's
ideas about the difference between thinking you "have to" do something and
coming to see your actions as choices made for good reasons.
(http://www.sandradodd.com/haveto)
_http://www.sandradodd.com/unschool/haveto_
(http://www.sandradodd.com/unschool/haveto)
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
DanaBurdick@... writes:
They do not get hungry later on and they do not eat anything else
later on, then their blood sugar drops. So I am compelled to remind
them to eat something.
Avoid "compelled."
"Compelled" is being driven by forces outside ourselves.
You choose to remind them, but that's not your only choice.
-=- And, I'm compelled to remind them to eat
something good in the first place. -=-
??
Your reminders aren't working then. But that's why you came for more ideas,
right?
Instead of reminding, present food itself, not food-talk.
If you're feeling compelled, that adds stress. Here are various people's
ideas about the difference between thinking you "have to" do something and
coming to see your actions as choices made for good reasons.
(http://www.sandradodd.com/haveto)
_http://www.sandradodd.com/unschool/haveto_
(http://www.sandradodd.com/unschool/haveto)
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Tracy
My daughter eats maybe 15 different things. 90% of them are very good
for her (raw carrots, garbanzo beans, yoghurt, etc )but are very
specific;, like Aunt Millies 7 Grain Indian Bread and natural peanut
Butter from a particular grocery store, 2% milk from a particular
grocery.... The ONLY food outside of the house she will eat, is
Wendy's chicken Nuggets - it's also the only meat she eats (she hasn't
actually figured it out yet - she's convinced they're made from mean
and evil roosters so she assures herself that it's a good thing). Of
course she'll eat cookies and ice cream too - but ironically she won't
touch chips, crackers or most prepared snack foods from a convenience
store...and frankly when we are away from home there are days when
that is all she has available beccause there is no Wendys or Aunt
Millies Indian bread, or whatever. So, she gets cookies and apple
juice if thats what is available.
The most important thing my 6 year old daughter has learned, is that
she WILL feel like crap when thats all she eats. So at this very young
age, she packs a lunch when ever we leave the house for any length of
time...PB sandwiches, carrots , apples, string cheese, water....
People used to think I was crazy when I'd allow her the cookie or ice
cream just like in your friends situation...but in the short run (I
can't say "long" run because the child is so young!) it has paid off
in that she is extremely aware of her own nutritional needs. She paces
herself very well and knows when she needs to fuel up on what she
considers "good food".
--- In [email protected], "dana_burdick"
<DanaBurdick@c...> wrote:
for her (raw carrots, garbanzo beans, yoghurt, etc )but are very
specific;, like Aunt Millies 7 Grain Indian Bread and natural peanut
Butter from a particular grocery store, 2% milk from a particular
grocery.... The ONLY food outside of the house she will eat, is
Wendy's chicken Nuggets - it's also the only meat she eats (she hasn't
actually figured it out yet - she's convinced they're made from mean
and evil roosters so she assures herself that it's a good thing). Of
course she'll eat cookies and ice cream too - but ironically she won't
touch chips, crackers or most prepared snack foods from a convenience
store...and frankly when we are away from home there are days when
that is all she has available beccause there is no Wendys or Aunt
Millies Indian bread, or whatever. So, she gets cookies and apple
juice if thats what is available.
The most important thing my 6 year old daughter has learned, is that
she WILL feel like crap when thats all she eats. So at this very young
age, she packs a lunch when ever we leave the house for any length of
time...PB sandwiches, carrots , apples, string cheese, water....
People used to think I was crazy when I'd allow her the cookie or ice
cream just like in your friends situation...but in the short run (I
can't say "long" run because the child is so young!) it has paid off
in that she is extremely aware of her own nutritional needs. She paces
herself very well and knows when she needs to fuel up on what she
considers "good food".
--- In [email protected], "dana_burdick"
<DanaBurdick@c...> wrote:
> My friend asked me to post a question for her about her son's food
> choices.
>
> One day for lunch she took her two kids to an outdoor mall which had
> several restaurants. My friend and her daughter wanted to get
> something from the Una Mas. Her son, however, eats a limited number
> of things and did not want anything to eat from this restaurant, but
> expressed that he would love a cookie from the Starbucks.
>
> Since he hadn't eaten since breakfast, should she insist/gently
> persuade/shove down his troat a quesadilla? Or, should she say, "I'd
> love to get you a cookie as soon as your sister and I are done with
> our meal here at the Una Mas."
>
> I am, I mean, she is interested in knowing your thoughts. ;)
>
> -Dana