[UnschoolingDiscussion] Children's Protective Services
Katy Jennings
Hello everyone,
I need some advice and encouragement. Today I received a knock on my door from a Children's Protective Services officer. It seems that someone (anonymously) turned me in to CPS for neglect. The report said that I have a 9yo son that has never been to school (true), that I am not registered to homeschool (not true), and that we live in filth (not true, though I am a packrat, and things are a little cluttered).
It also said that I do not teach Richard anything. I told the officer that I don't break things down into "subjects," and that is where someone may have gotten confused. I told her that at the moment we have about 25 books about Egypt checked out from the library, and with those Richard is learning everything from math and science to language and history. This is all true. I did mostly check those books out for my niece, but since then Richard has gotten into them too. I told her that we do lots of short trips to interesting and historic places, and that learning is everywhere. When she asked if we "do math," I told her that we did, though I am sure that my idea of "doing math" and hers are a little different.
The officer interviewed me and Richard, and will be back next week to tour my house. I am a little worried, because I tend to freeze up when confronted, I am not very good with words. I think I explained what we do pretty well though.
I talked to Richard a little bit about it. I told him that it may confuse the matter to use the term unschooling, and that he should just say we homeschool. I hope he doesn't feel that I am being dishonest.
I am kind of numb at this point, but I cannot believe that someone has done this. I keep going over and over in my head who could have called, I know that it is not healthy to obsess about it, but I cannot help it.
I had to come up with someone to vouch for me, and I had a real hard time because I don't know who called! I did finally come up with someone who I know in my heart didn't call and will have good things to say, but I feel so untrusting of everyone right now.
Any advice would be appreciated!
Thanks,
Katy
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
I need some advice and encouragement. Today I received a knock on my door from a Children's Protective Services officer. It seems that someone (anonymously) turned me in to CPS for neglect. The report said that I have a 9yo son that has never been to school (true), that I am not registered to homeschool (not true), and that we live in filth (not true, though I am a packrat, and things are a little cluttered).
It also said that I do not teach Richard anything. I told the officer that I don't break things down into "subjects," and that is where someone may have gotten confused. I told her that at the moment we have about 25 books about Egypt checked out from the library, and with those Richard is learning everything from math and science to language and history. This is all true. I did mostly check those books out for my niece, but since then Richard has gotten into them too. I told her that we do lots of short trips to interesting and historic places, and that learning is everywhere. When she asked if we "do math," I told her that we did, though I am sure that my idea of "doing math" and hers are a little different.
The officer interviewed me and Richard, and will be back next week to tour my house. I am a little worried, because I tend to freeze up when confronted, I am not very good with words. I think I explained what we do pretty well though.
I talked to Richard a little bit about it. I told him that it may confuse the matter to use the term unschooling, and that he should just say we homeschool. I hope he doesn't feel that I am being dishonest.
I am kind of numb at this point, but I cannot believe that someone has done this. I keep going over and over in my head who could have called, I know that it is not healthy to obsess about it, but I cannot help it.
I had to come up with someone to vouch for me, and I had a real hard time because I don't know who called! I did finally come up with someone who I know in my heart didn't call and will have good things to say, but I feel so untrusting of everyone right now.
Any advice would be appreciated!
Thanks,
Katy
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
In a message dated 4/22/2005 5:02:01 PM Mountain Daylight Time,
kjennings95@... writes:
I told him that it may confuse the matter to use the term unschooling, and
that he should just say we homeschool. I hope he doesn't feel that I am being
dishonest.
Unschooling is homeschooling.
It really bothers me when anyone says otherwise.
It's not dishonest.
-=-I had to come up with someone to vouch for me, and I had a real hard time
because I don't know who called! I did finally come up with someone who I
know in my heart didn't call and will have good things to say, but I feel so
untrusting of everyone right now. -=-
What I would do is come up with the same kinds of things I would put in a
portfolio. If you have a calendar with records of museum visits, playgroups,
camping, whatever--you could make a list.
You might want to consider something like these (there are three here, if
you follow the links) and make one of your own or at least use it as ideas for
things to present or consider:
_http://sandradodd.com/unschoolingcurriculum_
(http://sandradodd.com/unschoolingcurriculum)
I'm really sorry someone did this to you.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
kjennings95@... writes:
I told him that it may confuse the matter to use the term unschooling, and
that he should just say we homeschool. I hope he doesn't feel that I am being
dishonest.
Unschooling is homeschooling.
It really bothers me when anyone says otherwise.
It's not dishonest.
-=-I had to come up with someone to vouch for me, and I had a real hard time
because I don't know who called! I did finally come up with someone who I
know in my heart didn't call and will have good things to say, but I feel so
untrusting of everyone right now. -=-
What I would do is come up with the same kinds of things I would put in a
portfolio. If you have a calendar with records of museum visits, playgroups,
camping, whatever--you could make a list.
You might want to consider something like these (there are three here, if
you follow the links) and make one of your own or at least use it as ideas for
things to present or consider:
_http://sandradodd.com/unschoolingcurriculum_
(http://sandradodd.com/unschoolingcurriculum)
I'm really sorry someone did this to you.
Sandra
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Elizabeth Hill
**
I had to come up with someone to vouch for me, and I had a real hard time because I don't know who called! I did finally come up with someone who I know in my heart didn't call and will have good things to say, but I feel so untrusting of everyone right now.
Any advice would be appreciated!**
Hi, Katy --
What state do you live in? Are you in touch with groups of homeschoolers in your state? I ask because education laws vary widely from state to state. It's important that you be able to show that you are in compliance with the mandatory education laws in your state.
I'm confident you'll get through this. Hang in there and be calm.
Betsy
I had to come up with someone to vouch for me, and I had a real hard time because I don't know who called! I did finally come up with someone who I know in my heart didn't call and will have good things to say, but I feel so untrusting of everyone right now.
Any advice would be appreciated!**
Hi, Katy --
What state do you live in? Are you in touch with groups of homeschoolers in your state? I ask because education laws vary widely from state to state. It's important that you be able to show that you are in compliance with the mandatory education laws in your state.
I'm confident you'll get through this. Hang in there and be calm.
Betsy
Latoya
Katy, I agree that you should find out what the laws are. You know
you've been following the law, however, you should find out what the
law is. If there are no signs of abuse, then why did they sit and
talk and want to come back for a tour of the house? You should call
the board of education and find out about this, then make sure your
portfolio is in order.
Why did they say they wanted a tour? Did you agree to this? It seems
to me that they were given too much opportunity to invade your space
and right to homeschool your child.
Oh, yeah, homeschool/unschool - I don't think you did anything wrong
in explaining this to your child that he is homeschooled. If you can
simply explain to him that the thought to some may be shocking and
seem as if you're doing nothing. There's another lesson: how many
more historical figures were persecuted/ousted/labeled negatively,
because their thoughts were different from the mainstream, or those
in power?
I would like to continue to be updated on this, please post your
findings and results,
Latoya
you've been following the law, however, you should find out what the
law is. If there are no signs of abuse, then why did they sit and
talk and want to come back for a tour of the house? You should call
the board of education and find out about this, then make sure your
portfolio is in order.
Why did they say they wanted a tour? Did you agree to this? It seems
to me that they were given too much opportunity to invade your space
and right to homeschool your child.
Oh, yeah, homeschool/unschool - I don't think you did anything wrong
in explaining this to your child that he is homeschooled. If you can
simply explain to him that the thought to some may be shocking and
seem as if you're doing nothing. There's another lesson: how many
more historical figures were persecuted/ousted/labeled negatively,
because their thoughts were different from the mainstream, or those
in power?
I would like to continue to be updated on this, please post your
findings and results,
Latoya
jimpetersonl
Were I in your place, I would seriously consider contacting a lawyer
as what has taken place appears to be a violation of your (and your
son's) rights under the fourth amendment.
It appears you are in WA, where, in order to be in compliance with the
law, you need to register, qualify (college credits or qualifying
course), immunization records, and test annually. You do not need,
according to state law, to keep a record of how you do things, and,
moreover, "all decisions relating to philosophy or doctrine, selection
of books, teaching materials and curriculum, and methods, timing, and
place in the provision or evaluation of home-based instruction shall
be the responsibility of the parent except for matters specifically
referred to in this chapter." (RCW Chapter 28A.200.020).
http://www.k12.wa.us/PrivateEd/HomeBasedEd/regulations.aspx
Assuming you are in compliance with state law, you have fulfilled the
compulsory attendance law. (RCW Chapter 28A.225.010)
I would NOT allow any CPS personnal in my home without a lawyer (mine)
present, and I would NOT allow CPS to interview my child without
counsel present. They rely on people's fear of their power to go
beyond their authority (and search homes and take children). I'd call
a lawyer.
~Sue
someone (anonymously) turned me in to CPS for neglect. The report
said that I have a 9yo son that has never been to school (true), that
I am not registered to homeschool (not true), and that we live in
filth (not true, though I am a packrat, and things are a little
cluttered).
where someone may have gotten confused. I told her that at the moment
we have about 25 books about Egypt checked out from the library, and
with those Richard is learning everything from math and science to
language and history. This is all true. I did mostly check those
books out for my niece, but since then Richard has gotten into them
too. I told her that we do lots of short trips to interesting and
historic places, and that learning is everywhere. When she asked if
we "do math," I told her that we did, though I am sure that my idea of
"doing math" and hers are a little different.
when confronted, I am not very good with words. I think I explained
what we do pretty well though.
just say we homeschool. I hope he doesn't feel that I am being
dishonest.
called, I know that it is not healthy to obsess about it, but I cannot
help it.
someone who I know in my heart didn't call and will have good things
to say, but I feel so untrusting of everyone right now.
as what has taken place appears to be a violation of your (and your
son's) rights under the fourth amendment.
It appears you are in WA, where, in order to be in compliance with the
law, you need to register, qualify (college credits or qualifying
course), immunization records, and test annually. You do not need,
according to state law, to keep a record of how you do things, and,
moreover, "all decisions relating to philosophy or doctrine, selection
of books, teaching materials and curriculum, and methods, timing, and
place in the provision or evaluation of home-based instruction shall
be the responsibility of the parent except for matters specifically
referred to in this chapter." (RCW Chapter 28A.200.020).
http://www.k12.wa.us/PrivateEd/HomeBasedEd/regulations.aspx
Assuming you are in compliance with state law, you have fulfilled the
compulsory attendance law. (RCW Chapter 28A.225.010)
I would NOT allow any CPS personnal in my home without a lawyer (mine)
present, and I would NOT allow CPS to interview my child without
counsel present. They rely on people's fear of their power to go
beyond their authority (and search homes and take children). I'd call
a lawyer.
~Sue
> Hello everyone,my door from a Children's Protective Services officer. It seems that
> I need some advice and encouragement. Today I received a knock on
someone (anonymously) turned me in to CPS for neglect. The report
said that I have a 9yo son that has never been to school (true), that
I am not registered to homeschool (not true), and that we live in
filth (not true, though I am a packrat, and things are a little
cluttered).
> It also said that I do not teach Richard anything. I told theofficer that I don't break things down into "subjects," and that is
where someone may have gotten confused. I told her that at the moment
we have about 25 books about Egypt checked out from the library, and
with those Richard is learning everything from math and science to
language and history. This is all true. I did mostly check those
books out for my niece, but since then Richard has gotten into them
too. I told her that we do lots of short trips to interesting and
historic places, and that learning is everywhere. When she asked if
we "do math," I told her that we did, though I am sure that my idea of
"doing math" and hers are a little different.
> The officer interviewed me and Richard, and will be back next weekto tour my house. I am a little worried, because I tend to freeze up
when confronted, I am not very good with words. I think I explained
what we do pretty well though.
> I talked to Richard a little bit about it. I told him that it mayconfuse the matter to use the term unschooling, and that he should
just say we homeschool. I hope he doesn't feel that I am being
dishonest.
> I am kind of numb at this point, but I cannot believe that someonehas done this. I keep going over and over in my head who could have
called, I know that it is not healthy to obsess about it, but I cannot
help it.
> I had to come up with someone to vouch for me, and I had a real hardtime because I don't know who called! I did finally come up with
someone who I know in my heart didn't call and will have good things
to say, but I feel so untrusting of everyone right now.
> Any advice would be appreciated!F07755
> Thanks,
> Katy
>
Roslynn
I have always been told that if they show up at my door to not let
them in. I do not have to invite them in my home. HSLDA will have
some good advice for you but I think you have to be a member? I would
be careful at this point because you did o.k. a home visit and if you
now say they aren't allowed they will think you have something to
hide. It's a nervous thing to think about and I hope all turns out
well for you!
Roslynn
when confronted, I am not very good with words. I think I explained
what we do pretty well though.
them in. I do not have to invite them in my home. HSLDA will have
some good advice for you but I think you have to be a member? I would
be careful at this point because you did o.k. a home visit and if you
now say they aren't allowed they will think you have something to
hide. It's a nervous thing to think about and I hope all turns out
well for you!
Roslynn
> The officer interviewed me and Richard, and will be back next weekto tour my house. I am a little worried, because I tend to freeze up
when confronted, I am not very good with words. I think I explained
what we do pretty well though.
> Katy
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
nellebelle
>>>>>>>>HSLDA will havesome good advice for you but I think you have to be a member?>>>>>>>>
Local and State homeschool groups have more accurate information than HSLDA.
Mary Ellen
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Pam Sorooshian
On Apr 22, 2005, at 7:56 PM, jimpetersonl wrote:
I'd contact an attorney and my state organization, if there is one.
99 percent of the time these things are just dropped - I'm surprised
they even want to come back at all, though, so that's, in itself,
unusual.
Please let us know for sure what state you're in - you never know,
somebody here might even know a homeschooling parent/attorney who'd
advise you pro bono.
-pam
> It appears you are in WA,Katy - for some reason I thought you were in New Mexico.
I'd contact an attorney and my state organization, if there is one.
99 percent of the time these things are just dropped - I'm surprised
they even want to come back at all, though, so that's, in itself,
unusual.
Please let us know for sure what state you're in - you never know,
somebody here might even know a homeschooling parent/attorney who'd
advise you pro bono.
-pam
jimpetersonl
She is. She said that she is in NM.
I said "appears" since I was unsure.
~Sue
I said "appears" since I was unsure.
~Sue
> > It appears you are in WA,
>
> Katy - for some reason I thought you were in New Mexico.
> -pam