Latoya

Hey all.

As of now we have my 3 in-laws that live with us and they seem really
behind. They've moved from Missouri and just because of what has been
going on (or lack thereof) in the past 2 weeks of Pinellas County
schools (you have to ask for books in some cases), we're considering
homeschooling them in the fall, too.

Can someone suggest a curriculum that we can buy for a 7th grader?
11th? and 12th? I want to do it this way because I don't know how to
gadge them in their learning. I know how to do this for my own
daughter because I had her and we're close. She'll definitely be
homeschooled started this summer! YAy -because she's been asking for
it continuously.

Anyone have any other suggestions for the 3 boys, let me know.
Thanks,
Latoya
Parenting, naturally...
www.naturalfamilyboutique.com/?Latoya

soggyboysmom

Latoya, you're asking in the wrong place - this is an *un*schooling
place. Curriculum materials are way down on the bottom as far as
learning goes here - perhaps if a child chooses to use a math book
to master a concept or something like that but in general life is
learning and we don't "gauge" them in their learning - there's
nothing to measure against, they are who they are doing what they're
doing as they choose to do it, whether it's mastering Age of Empires
or some other video/computer game or telling time with an analog
clock or learning about dinosaurs or dog breeds.

[email protected]

In a message dated 2/23/2005 10:59:22 AM Mountain Standard Time,
latoyadenise@... writes:

As of now we have my 3 in-laws that live with us and they seem really
behind. . . . Can someone suggest a curriculum that we can buy for a 7th
grader?
11th? and 12th? I want to do it this way because I don't know how to
gadge them in their learning.


-------------

Are they just with you temporarily?

If you want to do a more unschooling thing with them, maybe consider
Conlara. I don't think they let 12th graders graduate unless they've been with the
school longer; don't know about the junior.

_http://clonlara.org/_ (http://clonlara.org/)


That's my recommendation if you're only temporary guardians and they'll be
back in home or at school. If they're with you longterm, you could do
Clonlara more loosely, or maby forego it.

If I had to, for some legal reason, sign my kids up with some program, I'd
use Clonlara.

Sandra


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Fetteroll

on 2/23/05 12:17 PM, Latoya at latoyadenise@... wrote:

> Can someone suggest a curriculum that we can buy for a 7th grader?
> 11th? and 12th? I want to do it this way because I don't know how to
> gadge them in their learning. I know how to do this for my own
> daughter because I had her and we're close. She'll definitely be
> homeschooled started this summer!

I think you might treat your in-law's kids and your own daughter as separate
issues.

Homeschooling because the available schools are scary is a different goal
than homeschooling because someone wants to. And the solutions that feel
right will be different.

As Sandra suggested Clonlara is good. They'll help you as little or as much
as you want in designing a personalized program.

Community college could be an option too. (Depends on the laws in your
state.) The older ones could take just courses that truly interest them.
They might even take the GED and then not have to both with the rest of high
school. (There are courses and books and software to help prepare for it.)

If there were a curriculum you could plug someone into based on their age
and have it work, then schools would run perfectly, if you see what I mean.
But we all learn differently. Different styles. Different paces. If they
don't like school because their learning style is incompatible with school
style learning, recreating school at home isn't going to work any better
than school at school. It's going to be stressful for them and stressful for
you. Not because there's something wrong with them but because there's
something wrong with school/curriculum!

Your daughter, on the other hand, since she's asking to homeschool ... you
may want to look into unschooling for her. (The most common cause of people
giving up on homeschooling is doing school at home. That isn't the only
option!) With unschooling she can learn what she wants to learn and there's
no stress or strain of "making them do their work". We just help them pursue
what they naturally are drawn to. It's very much like the way they learn to
speak English: learning is a side effect of using English to get what they
want.

A couple of good books that give overviews of Homeschooling are:

The Homeschooling Handbook
The Homeschooling Book of Answers
The Unschooling Handbook

You may want to check out the Home Education Magazine groups on Yahoo. They
tend to be quiet until someone asks a question but there may be people there
with more knowledge of schoolish programs.

http://groups.yahoo.com/search?query=HEM-

Joyce

[email protected]

The situation between the adults and kids is important. By some states'
laws homeschooling has to be done by a parent, so without adoption or at least
full legal guardianship, Clonlara would be a legal cover (they would be
enrolled in an accredited school) for a questionable legal situation.

Sandra


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Latoya

Thanks everyone for your info.

I've been unschooling with my daughter and not labeling it as such.
She's naturally curious, whereas the boys have been indoctrinated in
to having someone guide them along the way. And, man, this is hard to
get them to come up with something by themselves off the tops of
their heads.

We do have legal guardianship of them.

It is very discouraging to see that these boys have just been passed
from one grade to another without knowing certain things. I
definitely don't want to recreate the school scene, but for reading
and math for them, I may have to. I found out last night that the 7th
grader doesn't know or understand fractions. Upon his arrival I found
that he is basically a functioning illiterate. If I don't stand over
him, the homework doesn't get done and the whole family has to stay
up on in to the night 'til he's done. I'm not going to stay up
another night like that again over 13 reading questions.
The other 2 boys: the oldest seems to be okay in math and catching on
to it better, however, doesn't comprehend what he reads in books too
well. The middle boy is the same in comprehension, but definitely
better at math.

A GED is not an option for our household. If we don't see some
significant improvement by the time school is out for this summer,
we'll be pulling them out. I do know that this summer will be an
intensive in learning. I've already asked my friend, the math
teacher, to step in and get everyone up to their levels of
understanding. We're not asking for them to start any new math
revolutions or anything; just understanding.

The reading, language, and spelling, I will be helping with and in
different ways until we get to a point of where the supervision isn't
needed as much and we are doing more guidance (unschooling).

My husband is the history buff, so there it is. This mixed with some
on hand experiences, along with consistency, I'm sure will get them
on track and ready for their next step - whatever they want that to
be.

Thanks,
Latoya
Parenting, naturally...
http://www.naturalfamilyboutique.com/?Latoya

[email protected]

In a message dated 2/25/2005 11:16:35 AM Mountain Standard Time,
latoyadenise@... writes:

And, man, this is hard to
get them to come up with something by themselves off the tops of
their heads.



Then don't!
YOU come up with things off the top of your head, adn things everyone can do
together, not one thing for a tenth grader and another thing for a junior.
Live a busy SHARED life.

-=-I found out last night that the 7th
grader doesn't know or understand fractions. Upon his arrival I found
that he is basically a functioning illiterate. If I don't stand over
him, the homework doesn't get done and the whole family has to stay
up on in to the night 'til he's done.-=-

Kirby (18) is taking Math 99 at the community college. Kirby, who never
took a math lesson once in his life before this, has an A average after five
weeks (up from a B in the 4th week). Others there, who have been to school for
thirteen years, do not have an A.

That means that if you CONTINUE to try to force fractions into this poor
child, you could be doing more harm than good, but he will resent you (you
yourself personally) whereas he could have resented professionally trained
teachers randomly provided by the state.

Will you guarantee his success?
No.
You are only guaranteed to disturb his peace, your peace, and the peace of
your entire house.

Not knowing fractions didn't keep Kirby from passing a math placement test
into the third level (not the beginning or second level). And it wan'ts "not
knowing fractions," it was not understanding the language of mathematical
notation, which as languages go is NOT very consistent or clear. Fractions can
be shown all KINDS of ways. Multiplication can be shown four or five ways.

Back off this boy, for his good.
Play games. Build a deck or plant a garden or paint a room or tile a floor
and don't say "math," just let the real-life need for math seep up from the
ground around his feet without comment. Raining it down on his head didn't
work in school, and you only keep the same wound open by continuing that.

Stop inflicting damage so that healing can happen.

-=- I do know that this summer will be an
intensive in learning. I've already asked my friend, the math
teacher, to step in and get everyone up to their levels of
understanding. We're not asking for them to start any new math
revolutions or anything; just understanding.
-=-

You aren't likely to find support for this on an unschooling list.
You can't "Know" that this summer will be intensive in learning. It might
be just intensive in frustration and waste of time for you and your math
teacher friend, and in more and deeper sorrow for your young relatives.

Give them a summer of freedom, no matter what else you do.

If you think school's methods are good, and these kids only need MORE of it,
maybe you need to stop moving, talking and reading and look as openly as you
can at what you're seeing, at what your own life in school was like.

For some reason you don't need to tell us, these boys are not living with
their own parents. Something didn't go well for them, and healing would be
worth more than all the math on earth right now.

-=-The reading, language, and spelling, I will be helping with and in
different ways until we get to a point of where the supervision isn't
needed as much and we are doing more guidance (unschooling).-=-

Carts before horses, BIG time.
If you unschool now, six lives improve now. You've scheduled years of
anti-unschooling which will only make eventual unschooling harder IF you ever get
there.

-=-I'm sure will get them
on track and ready for their next step - whatever they want that to
be.
-=-

What if their next step should be that they get OFF the track and graze in a
wonderful pasture where they can learn without someone counting laps and
whipping them on?

Sandra




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

TreeGoddess

On Feb 25, 2005, at 10:04 AM, Latoya wrote:

-=-A GED is not an option for our household.-=-

Really? Why? Did you hold a family meeting and everyone unanimously
agreed that you as a family were banning GEDs as an option? What would
happen if one of the children took the test and got their GED? I'm
curious about that statement.

-Tracy-

"Yes, Peace *will* enter your life, but you
need to clear a spot for her to sit down."

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Latoya

I thank you for those words of encouragement. I appreciate them,
however, these boys have been frolicking in the fields long enough
and once they have found an understanding (beit an inkling) is when
I'll let up. I'm not stressed at all about this, its a necessary
step.

I'm glad my husband agrees. I believe this pressure is necessary
because for them the road is usually (for little black boys) very
easily and statistically dead or in jail. So, I'd rather do it and
show them how to avoid that road. This isn't them rebelling because
they know, its because they are inadequately prepared to move on or
event to question.

I thank you again, I took from your message what I could - and I'm
thankful for that, Sandra. I will, however, remember to keep it fun
because obviously the method used while they were in school didn't
work.

Latoya

Fetteroll

on 2/26/05 2:08 PM, Latoya at latoyadenise@... wrote:

> its a necessary step.

As far as learning is concerned, no it's not a necessary step.

School and discipline aren't necessary for learning. Learning just happens
when someone is supported in following their interests.

*But* it sounds like you are facing other factors and fears. It is
unfortunate that being a black male with no high school diploma isn't the
same as being a white male with no high school diploma. :-/

So maybe it will help you help them better to realize that you're actually
working towards a different goal than learning? Learning is the *tool*
you're using to get them something better.

Joyce

[email protected]

In a message dated 2/26/2005 12:42:28 P.M. Mountain Standard Time,
latoyadenise@... writes:

I'm glad my husband agrees. I believe this pressure is necessary
because for them the road is usually (for little black boys) very
easily and statistically dead or in jail.


=============

They don't have any comparison group of kids who didn't go to school.

There's a black family here with a girl and two boys. The mom's a great
unschooler and the dad's totally resistant and critical all the time and says
even though the mom has a degree in education, it's different for black boys.

Black kids learn the same way anyone does--from curiosity, interest and need
to know.
Black kids fail to learn the same way anyone does--from deciding the stuff
is irrelevant or the teacher is trying to make them do things they don't want
to do without regard for what they DO care about.

-=-I'm not stressed at all about this, its a necessary
step.
-=-

"Necessary" is only true if there are no examples of success without those
steps.
"Have to" is belied by examples of those who did not do those things and had
the same or better results.

Some people think they have to spank or their kids won't be honest or kind.
My kids are honest and kind. There is good evidence that spanking makes
kids sneaky and mean, in fact, but even without that, if two families' kids are
equally honest and kind but one spanked and one didn't, spanking was not
necessary. They didn't have to.

Same with reading lessons.
Same with math lessons.

-=-these boys have been frolicking in the fields long enough
and once they have found an understanding (beit an inkling) is when
I'll let up. -=-

If you let them frolick long enough, they will gain understanding far beyond
inklings in real ways.

Sandra


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Latoya

Yes, we did have a meeting and decided that GED was not an option and
a standard diploma would be sought either via homeschool or public
school. We had this meeting the 2nd day they arrived.

Latoya


--- In [email protected], TreeGoddess
<treegoddess@c...> wrote:
>
> On Feb 25, 2005, at 10:04 AM, Latoya wrote:
>
> -=-A GED is not an option for our household.-=-
>
> Really? Why? Did you hold a family meeting and everyone
unanimously
> agreed that you as a family were banning GEDs as an option? What
would
> happen if one of the children took the test and got their GED? I'm
> curious about that statement.
>
> -Tracy-
>
> "Yes, Peace *will* enter your life, but you
> need to clear a spot for her to sit down."
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[email protected]

In a message dated 2/28/05 6:06:16 PM, latoyadenise@... writes:

<< and

a standard diploma would be sought either via homeschool >>

If you want "a standard diploma" via homeschool, your options are more
limited. Some homeschooling curriculae are not fully accredited (some of the
Christian ones, if I understand correctly). A GED is WAY, way cheaper and IS
"accredited" (recognized by the government as an equivalent of public school). In
New Mexico, if one gets a GED before adulthood, it's a high school diploma
straight up, issued by the state board of education. Says so: High School
Diploma right on the diploma they send.

Possibly other states have similar options.

Sandra

Heidi Here

Sandra,
Is there away to find out if our state issues a high school diploma and not a GED if done before the child is of age?
Thanks for all you knowledge.
Heidi
----- Original Message -----
From: SandraDodd@...
To: [email protected]
Sent: Monday, February 28, 2005 9:55 PM
Subject: Re: [UnschoolingDiscussion] Re: Curriculum for...oh, no GED



In a message dated 2/28/05 6:06:16 PM, latoyadenise@... writes:

<< and

a standard diploma would be sought either via homeschool >>

If you want "a standard diploma" via homeschool, your options are more
limited. Some homeschooling curriculae are not fully accredited (some of the
Christian ones, if I understand correctly). A GED is WAY, way cheaper and IS
"accredited" (recognized by the government as an equivalent of public school). In
New Mexico, if one gets a GED before adulthood, it's a high school diploma
straight up, issued by the state board of education. Says so: High School
Diploma right on the diploma they send.

Possibly other states have similar options.

Sandra


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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Pam Sorooshian

On Mar 1, 2005, at 5:35 AM, Heidi Here wrote:

> Is there away to find out if our state issues a high school diploma
> and not a GED if done before the child is of age?
> Thanks for all you knowledge.

This is something you should be asking at your state level - most
states now have a state-wide homeschooling organization. If you don't
know how to contact them, you can try looking at the NHEN website
<www.NHEN.org> under state legal information and in the support group
database there.

-pam

[email protected]

In a message dated 3/1/2005 8:03:37 AM Mountain Standard Time,
kleincrew@... writes:

Is there away to find out if our state issues a high school diploma and not
a GED if done before the child is of age?


-------------------------

Ask on a local homeschooling list. Someone with older kids will know. And
the law might have changed, too. It changed in New Mexico quite a bit
lately. And you can probably just go to google and read about your state's GED
policies.

Sandra


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]