[email protected]

In a message dated 6/28/2000 4:03:24 PM US Mountain Standard Time,
kworthen@... writes:

<< unschooling does not mean letting kids do whatever they want. it means
following their lead. eventually it all falls into place. >>

Could you give me an example please? I was after all asking, what I assumed
were, pertinent unschooling questions.

Dawn F

[email protected]

In a message dated 6/28/00 4:52:58 PM, NumoAstro@... writes:

<< Could you give me an example please? I was after all asking, what I
assumed
were, pertinent unschooling questions.

Dawn F >>

Hi Dawn!

Unschooling really came into focus for me when my son became interested in
dinosaurs. I made it my job to look for all the dinosaur resources that were
available to us. My computer is hooked up with my library, so I spent quite
a while reserving every dino book, video or audio tape I could find. When
all this bounty came in, I left it up to my son what to do with them. Some
of the books I really liked were ignored completely by him. I looked at them
myself and then took them back. Some of the resources I didn't think were as
good were the ones Colton poured over for hours. I just littered his path
with opportunities, and let him take it from there.

I had a successful idea of a way to learn about dinosaurs while catering
to one of Colton's big passions these days, trading cards. I found a dino
trading card game that came with a large stack of informative cards. We
played the game as per the instructions, but Colton played with it in other
ways as well. He would sort the cards into carnivores and herbivores, or
sort them by time period. In a short amount of time, while having an
absolute ball, Colton learned a wealth of information about the topic,
because he wanted to, and for his own reasons.

I also took him to our local Science Center for Dino Days and to see an
IMAX 3-D movie about T-Rex. In addition, we purchased a set of five computer
programs about dinos. I offered these activities and things before I
invested in them; if Colton hadn't been interested, that would have been OK.

Lately, Colton has gotten back into Harry Potter again, and we've reread
the books together. He is now making his own set of Harry Potter trading
cards. I am sure more activities will follow, and I am happy to go along for
the ride.

Blessings,
Carol

Cathie _

Hi Dawn. It sounds to me like you have a kid with a good attention span who
is going to stay with a subject until he gets all he needs from it. My 9
year old will get intensely interested in a topic, perhaps spending weeks
reading about space, or doing math squares, or drawing or just playing
Pokemon. When he gets his fill, he moves on. Sometimes he comes back to it
later, sometimes not. It has been great watching the way he learns so
naturally and is so self directed. It is not this way for all kids, so trust
him and be grateful. As for repetition, remember when you had to read the
same story over and over, or play peek-a-boo for ever? The best answer I
have found for this one is to have more kids-the older ones can take turns
with the repetitive things and none of us get as tired of it!!

Cathie-who just last nite had to decide if we should make the 3 year old get
off the computer at 10 p.m. or go to bed and leave her there!!


>----- Original Message -----
>From: <NumoAstro@...>

> > Hi All:
> >
> > Questions I have... How do you get comfortable with letting them do
>whatever
> > they want, whenever they want. Zak at the moment spends hours on the
>same
> > thing and I worry that he'll never give up building or playing on the
> > computer or doing whatever it is he's doing. Is this something that
>comes
> > over time. When some of your first started was this something you had
>to
> > deal with in yourselves or were you ok with whatever happened. What if
>the
> > something includes you doing things over and over again? How involved
>are
> > you in what they are doing? All day, when they ask?
> >
> > Feedback would be great.
> >
> > Dawn F

________________________________________________________________________
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[email protected]

Amy

Thanks for clarifying your intentions... Yes you are right... tensions have
been high and without the ability to "sense" what people are saying and how
they are saying it, it can come across as not helpful... Thanks again for the
info it's very helpful.

Dawn F

[email protected]

Carol:

Thank you so so so so much... I just printed off your e-mail... Now I think I
know what I'm doing and why... I was so confused about if he was suppose to
ask me for things. I know that what will work for me is the saturation of
things and then letting him pick and choose.

Again, much and many thanks

Dawn F

Amy

unschooling does not mean letting kids do whatever they want. it means
following their lead. eventually it all falls into place.
amy
----- Original Message -----
From: <NumoAstro@...>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Wednesday, June 28, 2000 3:53 PM
Subject: [Unschooling-dotcom] Unschooling - Letting them do anything they
want


> Hi All:
>
> Questions I have... How do you get comfortable with letting them do
whatever
> they want, whenever they want. Zak at the moment spends hours on the same
> thing and I worry that he'll never give up building or playing on the
> computer or doing whatever it is he's doing. Is this something that comes
> over time. When some of your first started was this something you had to
> deal with in yourselves or were you ok with whatever happened. What if
the
> something includes you doing things over and over again? How involved are
> you in what they are doing? All day, when they ask?
>
> Feedback would be great.
>
> Dawn F
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Get Red Herring perspective on the flood of venture capital here and
> abroad with FREE e-newsletters: Dealflow, Dealflow Europe and VCPS.
> http://click.egroups.com/1/5015/14/_/448294/_/962232834/
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>
> Message boards, timely articles, a free newsletter and more!
> Check it all out at: http://www.unschooling.com
>
> To Unsubscribe: mailto:[email protected]
>
>

Bonnie Painter

Dawn,

If you sit down and really think about it, doesn't Zak know an awful lot
already? The reason I ask this is because I found it fairly easy to trust
that my son was learning on his own. He had always been interested in
trains and I know how much he learned about them. I also know all of the
other concepts he learned because of trains (counting cars, physics of how
steam powers engines, etc.) and he would play with trains for hours on end.
But the knowledge that came from that interest was endless. Now he has
moved on to Skyscrapers and Bridges, Star Wars, Space Program. It all does
happen and it is a miracle to watch...

Bonnie


>From: NumoAstro@...
>Reply-To: [email protected]
>To: [email protected]
>Subject: [Unschooling-dotcom] Unschooling - Letting them do anything they
>want
>Date: Wed, 28 Jun 2000 18:53:45 EDT
>
>Hi All:
>
>Questions I have... How do you get comfortable with letting them do
>whatever
>they want, whenever they want. Zak at the moment spends hours on the same
>thing and I worry that he'll never give up building or playing on the
>computer or doing whatever it is he's doing. Is this something that comes
>over time. When some of your first started was this something you had to
>deal with in yourselves or were you ok with whatever happened. What if the
>something includes you doing things over and over again? How involved are
>you in what they are doing? All day, when they ask?
>
>Feedback would be great.
>
>Dawn F

________________________________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com

[email protected]

Dawn,
i figured when i started h/schooling almost 7 yrs. ago that i would borrow
the good from ps and leave out the bad. therefore, i try to allow free time
to play with whatever toys, puzzles, games, etc. as much as possible. we do a
lot of activities outside the house with 3 of my 4 being "school-age":13, 8,
& 5, so inside the house we have down time unless we are doing a unit study
together or my 2 older sons are working on some math or Bible or English with
me 1 on 1 (a few times a week). no tv and no vcr and no computer unless
requested and earned-chores and lessons done. i do what the schools do to
control to some extent with which toys the children play: i rotate them in
and out of the toy closet and i leave out and available different learning
materials-# balancing scale, magnet set, dominoes, etc. all of the toys and
art supplies and books are on shelves at their level, though, so they can
pull out something i put away if they really want it. if i see only 1 kind of
play going on for a long time and not getting more complicated or involving
anyone else, then i might suggest a supplement to the activity: dressing up
as the character in the game or activity, involving me or a sibling in the
game, or writing a story-dictated-about the play. i don't make the popular
game/activity vanish, but i will try to move it to a new location.
bridget

Amy

um, i guess an example would be like when my daughter told me she was
interested in pirates. we went on the internet, went to the library, etc. to
find out about them. for the next few days everything we did revolved around
pirates. we did addition with pirate flags, creative writing, etc.


Could you give me an example please? I was after all asking, what I assumed
> were, pertinent unschooling questions.

i know tensions have been high on this list lately and i was not being
sarcastic. i was giving you the same standard answer i would give anyone who
asked about unschooling. hope i didn't offend.
amy
>


From: <NumoAstro@...>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Wednesday, June 28, 2000 4:16 PM
Subject: Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] Unschooling - Letting them do anything
they want


> In a message dated 6/28/2000 4:03:24 PM US Mountain Standard Time,
> kworthen@... writes:
>
> << unschooling does not mean letting kids do whatever they want. it means
> following their lead. eventually it all falls into place. >>
>
> > Dawn F
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Free, Unlimited Calls Anywhere!
> Visit Firetalk.com - click below.
> http://click.egroups.com/1/5479/14/_/448294/_/962234194/
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message boards, timely articles, a free newsletter and more!
> Check it all out at: http://www.unschooling.com
>
> To Unsubscribe: mailto:[email protected]
>
>

[email protected]

Thanks Bridget:

Another e-mail with lots of great ideas for me.

Dawn F

susan wilson

hi cathie,

our 4+ yos has done this a number of time. what we did was - gave a
flash light, showed him the lights switches he would need to turn off,
reminded him to go to the bathroom . we ran through the procedure 4 x
then went to bed. some nights he stayed up 'til 1 am but he was happy
w/ his independence and handled it just fine. he did this maybe 1/2
dozen times for a few months but has not done it for many months now,
i guess it was some sort of burst of independence.

-susan
austin,tx


> Cathie-who just last nite had to decide if we should make the 3 year
old get
> off the computer at 10 p.m. or go to bed and leave her there!!
>

susan wilson

>
>>----- Original Message -----
>>From: <NumoAstro@...>
> Hi All:

> Questions I have... How do you get comfortable with letting them do
whatever they want, whenever they want.

i struggled w/ this. my son is only 4 so i don't have long-term
experience but what i ran into is, for example he would ask for
something like he wanted to learn math so we looked into all kinds
ways of learning math and he picked out miqoun/cuisenaire rods. so we
got a set - books & rods - and he would not sit down and do it.
though he continued to ask to be taught math. i got frustrated
because i had bought this material and thought 'we should use it' but
when i thought about it for a bit i realized it has nothing to do with
the money or if and when he uses the material. it has to do w/
enjoying what you have and playing with it. i believe he will use any
and all material he asks for, be it today or years from now. so i
would say yes let them do whatever they want and try to join in if
they let you and you want to, or just do your thing near by. but most
importantly listen to them, trust them and have fun w/ them.

> Zak at the moment spends hours on the same thing and I worry that
he'll never give up building or playing on the
> computer or doing whatever it is he's doing. Is this something that
comes over time. When some of your first
> started was this something you had to deal with in yourselves or
were you ok with whatever happened.

rene' seem to go through phases where he does the same thing over and
over like he'll play on the computer for long periods then he won't go
near it for long periods, or it could be legos or chemistry
experiments or whatever catches his fancy. but everything he does he
enjoys and what he builds for example becomes more and more intricate
and fascinating. i would recommending reading some of the material
they have available online at sudbury valley school (if you need the
addy i can get it for you). it really helped me relax and stop
focusing on 'results' and trust in the nature craving for learning
that children have.

> What if the something includes you doing things over and over again?
How involved are you in what they are
> doing?

if you like it - very involved; if you have no desire to be doing it-
as little as you can get away with :)

> All day, when they ask?

no:) i'm a firm believer in honesty and independence<g>. if they need
help - yes, but if they can manage it on their own- no. i have this
problem w/ reading books - i just can't take reading the same book
over and over again. luckily my dh doesn't mind so rene' gets books
read over and over by him. but since i like to read to him in the
morning i tried to get him to choose chapter books to read but he
refused. so what i did , just a few weeks ago, was pick a book -
"carry on mr bowditch" (a book he had choosen to buy but would not
let me read him) - and i told him i was reading this myself and that i
would be happy to read it out loud if he wanted me too and he said
sure. now he not only happily listens but actually asks me to read
another chapter. so this way we're both happy!

> Feedback would be great.
>
> Dawn F


take care,
susan,
austin,tx

[email protected]

In a message dated 6/30/2000 4:57:22 PM US Mountain Standard Time,
fxfireob@... writes:

<< some nights he stayed up 'til 1 am but he was happy
w/ his independence and handled it just fine. >>

this is something I'm going to struggle with... On the one hand Steve and I
want some time together (to keep our marriage alive and working) and on the
other hand I don't want to restrict Zak and want to let him go to bed when he
wants. We are going to talk about this issue tonight and see how we both
feel a bit more... The more I learn about unschooling the more I realize it
affects so many areas of our lives.

Thanks for giving me something to think about.

Dawn F

[email protected]

Susan:

Your e-mail has been so incredibly helpful... I already have Sudbury, and all
the democratic schools in this country, on my favorite list. When we first
decided that we were not going to do "school" as everyone else the first
place I started looking was on line for alternative schools. We even thought
about moving to Northern California (my fav place in the world) so that Zak
could go to a democratic school... Then we thought about the family
experience of his grandma and grandpa that he would lose. (mum and dad
wouldn't move there if you paid them and I have no idea why)..

I think you hit the nail on the head when you said "results" I think I need
to look at that idea that I want to see some kind of concrete results instead
of trusting the process and seeing what happens and the "result" maybe that I
become not so neurotic about everything in life(LOL)... So there's a benefit
for all of us in this family.

Anyway, again, much thanks for the input. I've printed off your e-mail for
hubby to read.

Dawn F

susan wilson

here's what we do. we let him stay up late because he seem to prefer
this and then he sleeps late. so we get up a few hours before him -
so we get time together from 6 or 7 'til 9 am. this works for us
because we both like the mornings better so it's kind of a win win.
>
> << some nights he stayed up 'til 1 am but he was happy
> w/ his independence and handled it just fine. >>
>
> this is something I'm going to struggle with... On the one hand
Steve and I
> want some time together (to keep our marriage alive and working) and
on the
> other hand I don't want to restrict Zak and want to let him go to
bed when
> he
> wants. We are going to talk about this issue tonight and see how we
both
> feel a bit more... The more I learn about unschooling the more I
realize it
> affects so many areas of our lives.
>
> Thanks for giving me something to think about.
>
> Dawn F

Holly Atchison

I have the same trouble with the two girls. We have a routine that they go
to bed after dinner, bath, and a story. (And Most nights a big fight) But I
sometimes feel that they should decide when bedtime would be and we wouldn't
have such a fight on our hands. On the other hand....I REALLY NEED THEIR
SLEEP some nights. My husband is a staunch "kids in bed by 8" kind of guy
but I was always happiest as a child when I picked my bedtime so this leaves
me confused. I'd love to hear everyone elses bedtime routines too.

Holly (who would love to be free minded enough to just do it and let her
kids pick bedtime alone)


>From: NumoAstro@...
>Reply-To: [email protected]
>To: [email protected]
>Subject: Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] Unschooling - Letting them do anything
>they want
>Date: Fri, 30 Jun 2000 21:07:23 EDT
>
>In a message dated 6/30/2000 4:57:22 PM US Mountain Standard Time,
>fxfireob@... writes:
>
><< some nights he stayed up 'til 1 am but he was happy
> w/ his independence and handled it just fine. >>
>
>this is something I'm going to struggle with... On the one hand Steve and I
>want some time together (to keep our marriage alive and working) and on the
>other hand I don't want to restrict Zak and want to let him go to bed when
>he
>wants. We are going to talk about this issue tonight and see how we both
>feel a bit more... The more I learn about unschooling the more I realize it
>affects so many areas of our lives.
>
>Thanks for giving me something to think about.
>
>Dawn F
>
>------------------------------------------------------------------------
>Free, Unlimited Calls Anywhere!
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>
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Holly Atchison

Susan,

I know that you were responding to Dawns questions but I think that you gave
some great advice so Thanks! Also I'd love that webpage you were talking
about for Sudbury Valley School too! Lili is 4 and I am new to Unschooling
so It was nice to see just how someone else does it.

Holly
Mom to Lili age 4 and Tacy age 2


>From: susan wilson <fxfireob@...>
>Reply-To: [email protected]
>To: [email protected]
>Subject: Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] Unschooling - Letting them do anything
>they want
>Date: Fri, 30 Jun 2000 19:49:34 -0500
>
>
>
> >
> >>----- Original Message -----
> >>From: <NumoAstro@...>
> > Hi All:
>
> > Questions I have... How do you get comfortable with letting them do
>whatever they want, whenever they want.
>
>i struggled w/ this. my son is only 4 so i don't have long-term
>experience but what i ran into is, for example he would ask for
>something like he wanted to learn math so we looked into all kinds
>ways of learning math and he picked out miqoun/cuisenaire rods. so we
>got a set - books & rods - and he would not sit down and do it.
>though he continued to ask to be taught math. i got frustrated
>because i had bought this material and thought 'we should use it' but
>when i thought about it for a bit i realized it has nothing to do with
>the money or if and when he uses the material. it has to do w/
>enjoying what you have and playing with it. i believe he will use any
>and all material he asks for, be it today or years from now. so i
>would say yes let them do whatever they want and try to join in if
>they let you and you want to, or just do your thing near by. but most
>importantly listen to them, trust them and have fun w/ them.
>
> > Zak at the moment spends hours on the same thing and I worry that
>he'll never give up building or playing on the
> > computer or doing whatever it is he's doing. Is this something that
>comes over time. When some of your first
> > started was this something you had to deal with in yourselves or
>were you ok with whatever happened.
>
>rene' seem to go through phases where he does the same thing over and
>over like he'll play on the computer for long periods then he won't go
>near it for long periods, or it could be legos or chemistry
>experiments or whatever catches his fancy. but everything he does he
>enjoys and what he builds for example becomes more and more intricate
>and fascinating. i would recommending reading some of the material
>they have available online at sudbury valley school (if you need the
>addy i can get it for you). it really helped me relax and stop
>focusing on 'results' and trust in the nature craving for learning
>that children have.
>
> > What if the something includes you doing things over and over again?
> How involved are you in what they are
> > doing?
>
>if you like it - very involved; if you have no desire to be doing it-
>as little as you can get away with :)
>
> > All day, when they ask?
>
>no:) i'm a firm believer in honesty and independence<g>. if they need
>help - yes, but if they can manage it on their own- no. i have this
>problem w/ reading books - i just can't take reading the same book
>over and over again. luckily my dh doesn't mind so rene' gets books
>read over and over by him. but since i like to read to him in the
>morning i tried to get him to choose chapter books to read but he
>refused. so what i did , just a few weeks ago, was pick a book -
>"carry on mr bowditch" (a book he had choosen to buy but would not
>let me read him) - and i told him i was reading this myself and that i
>would be happy to read it out loud if he wanted me too and he said
>sure. now he not only happily listens but actually asks me to read
>another chapter. so this way we're both happy!
>
> > Feedback would be great.
> >
> > Dawn F
>
>
>take care,
>susan,
>austin,tx
>
>
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>
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>
>

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Bonnie Painter

I understand exactly what you are saying. My husband and I find that we
only have a "private" life after 1am most of the time. Luckily, we are all
night owls and he requires minimal sleep. I, on the other hand, just sleep
in with the kids (who of course, sleep until 10 am or later since they
stayed up so late) Some nights, when we are craving each other's company,
we will bathe them early and put them to bed. This works especially if I
have to work outside of the home and don't get home until after dh has them
in bed.

Good luck with whatever you decide. This is what is working for us right
now.

Bonnie - who has had a lot of afternoon romps when kids are watching movies
or outside playing with friends ;)


>From: NumoAstro@...
>Reply-To: [email protected]
>To: [email protected]
>Subject: Re: [Unschooling-dotcom] Unschooling - Letting them do anything
>they want
>Date: Fri, 30 Jun 2000 21:07:23 EDT
>
>In a message dated 6/30/2000 4:57:22 PM US Mountain Standard Time,
>fxfireob@... writes:
>
><< some nights he stayed up 'til 1 am but he was happy
> w/ his independence and handled it just fine. >>
>
>this is something I'm going to struggle with... On the one hand Steve and I
>want some time together (to keep our marriage alive and working) and on the
>other hand I don't want to restrict Zak and want to let him go to bed when
>he
>wants. We are going to talk about this issue tonight and see how we both
>feel a bit more... The more I learn about unschooling the more I realize it
>affects so many areas of our lives.
>
>Thanks for giving me something to think about.
>
>Dawn F

________________________________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com