Re: punishments and rewards
Andrea
Danielle,
I loved your post.you seem like a UP parent.are you on the UP board?? I do
not know what "imo", or "op" (could that be a typo for UP?) mean. Could you
clarify?
<The first goal, imo, is not a misdirected goal--if a person is feeling
grumpy or cranky, then being in a less social situation is likely a good
plan. I do that when I'm feeling grumpy for whatever reason.
Yes, I agree, but the person who is sending the child off has to be really
clear that it isn't a punishment. This is something that the child needs to
understand, not just the parent. If the parent says it's not punishment,
but the child feels punished, then what's the difference in the child's
mind? Is the child behind the door calming down, or getting more stirred up
and angry because of guilt, shame and possible abandonment (or a feeling of
love-withdrawal?). Yes, he may calm down eventually, but who knows why? Is
he exhausted from the situation, or does he realize that "If I'm highly
emotional, I will be banished, so I better suck it up, pull it together, so
that I can be loved again"
<There have been times when I've gently removed one of my children from a
space, but the goal has always been to help them honor and process their
emotions in a space that's conducive to that and respectful to the other
members of the household. So, when I remove one of my children or gently
suggest they go to a safe space and offer to go with them, the goal is
to help them process their strong feelings, not to make them stop having
those strong feelings or to isolate them if that's not a choice they'd
like to make. I'm there to be with them, comfort them, maintain a calm
presence in the face of their intense emotion, whatever.
The intention there is clearly made by the language you so eloquently
used."gently removed", "gently suggest.and offer to go with them." I think
it is so important that they not feel alone. They are so new to so many
things in their world, and to be all alone to process (which is really an
adult term for something that takes years to do well.most of us just
perseverate about what we just experienced that stimulated those feelings).
You obviously intend, in that example, to help your child understand
feelings. That is sooooooooo important.esp for boys, who still in 2006 are
expected not to show them much.
<Consciously and carefully thinking through actions with my children and
measuring them against the yardstick of how I might behave with an equal
has been an invaluable tool in my own journey in respectful parenting.
I think that is wonderful advice.
Andrea
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
I loved your post.you seem like a UP parent.are you on the UP board?? I do
not know what "imo", or "op" (could that be a typo for UP?) mean. Could you
clarify?
<The first goal, imo, is not a misdirected goal--if a person is feeling
grumpy or cranky, then being in a less social situation is likely a good
plan. I do that when I'm feeling grumpy for whatever reason.
Yes, I agree, but the person who is sending the child off has to be really
clear that it isn't a punishment. This is something that the child needs to
understand, not just the parent. If the parent says it's not punishment,
but the child feels punished, then what's the difference in the child's
mind? Is the child behind the door calming down, or getting more stirred up
and angry because of guilt, shame and possible abandonment (or a feeling of
love-withdrawal?). Yes, he may calm down eventually, but who knows why? Is
he exhausted from the situation, or does he realize that "If I'm highly
emotional, I will be banished, so I better suck it up, pull it together, so
that I can be loved again"
<There have been times when I've gently removed one of my children from a
space, but the goal has always been to help them honor and process their
emotions in a space that's conducive to that and respectful to the other
members of the household. So, when I remove one of my children or gently
suggest they go to a safe space and offer to go with them, the goal is
to help them process their strong feelings, not to make them stop having
those strong feelings or to isolate them if that's not a choice they'd
like to make. I'm there to be with them, comfort them, maintain a calm
presence in the face of their intense emotion, whatever.
The intention there is clearly made by the language you so eloquently
used."gently removed", "gently suggest.and offer to go with them." I think
it is so important that they not feel alone. They are so new to so many
things in their world, and to be all alone to process (which is really an
adult term for something that takes years to do well.most of us just
perseverate about what we just experienced that stimulated those feelings).
You obviously intend, in that example, to help your child understand
feelings. That is sooooooooo important.esp for boys, who still in 2006 are
expected not to show them much.
<Consciously and carefully thinking through actions with my children and
measuring them against the yardstick of how I might behave with an equal
has been an invaluable tool in my own journey in respectful parenting.
I think that is wonderful advice.
Andrea
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Andrea
<Oh, and a bag of Oreos helps, too, sometimes
This would make my child worse.esp during the sugar crash after about 20-30
minutes!
Andrea
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
This would make my child worse.esp during the sugar crash after about 20-30
minutes!
Andrea
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Danielle Conger
Andrea wrote:
guy's big trigger), and the 20-30 minutes was enough to get us
gracefully through the store and to the car in a pinch, which was my
intention.
--
~~Danielle
Emily (8), Julia (7), Sam (5)
http://www.danielleconger.com/Homeschool/Welcomehome.html
~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*
"With our thoughts, we make the world." ~~Buddha
> <Oh, and a bag of Oreos helps, too, sometimesWell, we've used the Nature's Path brand, which has no corn syrup (my
>
>
>
> This would make my child worse.esp during the sugar crash after about
> 20-30
> minutes!
guy's big trigger), and the 20-30 minutes was enough to get us
gracefully through the store and to the car in a pinch, which was my
intention.
--
~~Danielle
Emily (8), Julia (7), Sam (5)
http://www.danielleconger.com/Homeschool/Welcomehome.html
~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*
"With our thoughts, we make the world." ~~Buddha
Danielle Conger
Andrea wrote:
"in my opinion" = imo
"in my not so humble opinion" = imnsho
"for what it's worth" = fwiw
"know what I mean" = kwim
goal, but to accompany them and support them through the difficult
situation.
--
~~Danielle
Emily (8), Julia (7), Sam (5)
http://www.danielleconger.com/Homeschool/Welcomehome.html
~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*
"With our thoughts, we make the world." ~~Buddha
> Danielle,No, I frequent the AlwaysUnschooled list; that's where I'm most active.
>
> I loved your post.you seem like a UP parent.are you on the UP board??
> I do
> not know what "imo", or "op" (could that be a typo for UP?) mean.
> Could you
> clarify?
>
"in my opinion" = imo
"in my not so humble opinion" = imnsho
"for what it's worth" = fwiw
"know what I mean" = kwim
>My point was *not* to send the child off by him/ herself at all for this
>
> <The first goal, imo, is not a misdirected goal--if a person is feeling
>
> grumpy or cranky, then being in a less social situation is likely a good
>
> plan. I do that when I'm feeling grumpy for whatever reason.
>
>
>
> Yes, I agree, but the person who is sending the child off has to be really
> clear that it isn't a punishment. This is something that the child
> needs to
> understand, not just the parent. If the parent says it's not punishment,
> but the child feels punished, then what's the difference in the child's
> mind? Is the child behind the door calming down, or getting more
> stirred up
> and angry because of guilt, shame and possible abandonment (or a
> feeling of
> love-withdrawal?). Yes, he may calm down eventually, but who knows
> why? Is
> he exhausted from the situation, or does he realize that "If I'm highly
> emotional, I will be banished, so I better suck it up, pull it
> together, so
> that I can be loved again"
goal, but to accompany them and support them through the difficult
situation.
--
~~Danielle
Emily (8), Julia (7), Sam (5)
http://www.danielleconger.com/Homeschool/Welcomehome.html
~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*
"With our thoughts, we make the world." ~~Buddha
Ren Allen
"> This would make my child worse.esp during the sugar crash after about
protein available to level it all out. So if the child has had protein
in the last hour or so, it should be ok unless they have some trigger
due to health issues.
I think sugar is demonized unfairly. I'm pretty health conscious, but
I discovered that I was blaming sugar for my children's behavior when
it was usually something much deeper (like my control issues!!).
For health conscious families, there are many alternative choices
available, so the child can still have their favorite snacks (like
Danielle mentioned).
Ren
learninginfreedom.com
> 20-30sugar crashes usually happen because the body doesn't have enough
> minutes!"
protein available to level it all out. So if the child has had protein
in the last hour or so, it should be ok unless they have some trigger
due to health issues.
I think sugar is demonized unfairly. I'm pretty health conscious, but
I discovered that I was blaming sugar for my children's behavior when
it was usually something much deeper (like my control issues!!).
For health conscious families, there are many alternative choices
available, so the child can still have their favorite snacks (like
Danielle mentioned).
Ren
learninginfreedom.com