Hello
Helen Hegener
I've been receiving messages from this list since the day it
started, forwarded by folks who thought I should be kept informed
about such things, and I figured I might as well save them some effort
and just join the group. So here I am. :::waving to old and new
friends, and friends yet-to-be:::
I'm Helen Hegener, notorious lurker on literally hundreds of
lists, and an unschooler from Day One. Many of you will be aware of
the post I sent to our own Unschooling lists (and many non-unschooling
lists) today, in which I described myself (and unschooling) like
this:
I am an unschooler. Not just an unschooling mom - my husband
and I raised five kids, all grown - but an unschooler myself. My two
youngest siblings never attended school, and they're both well into
their thirties. My mother unschooled herself as well, although it was
decades before the term had any meaning. My grandchildren are being
unschooled right now, and I'm delightedly helping. I know a thing or
two about what the word unschooling means. But for all reasonable
intents and purposes, and for the record, I do not make any real
distinction between unschooling and homeschooling. Homeschooling is
about living sensibly with our children, our parents, our
community,our world. Is there any better definition of
unschooling?
That said, I'll probably just lurk for the most part, but if
asked a direct question, I'll reply.
Helen
Ren Allen
"But for all reasonable intents and purposes, and for the record, I
do not make any real distinction between unschooling and
homeschooling. Homeschooling is about living sensibly with our
children, our parents, our community,our world. Is there any better
definition of unschooling?"
First of all, welcome Helen! I'm glad you decided to stop by.
Now for the question:
How is it that you make no distinction between those that bring
school into their home and those that prefer natural learning...to
me there is a world of difference.
In our inclusive support group, we have all types of homeschoolers,
so I understand the need for people to support each other in the
decision to bring our children out of the school system. But in a
discussion (real life or otherwise) I don't see how one can pretend
there is no difference.
There are hues and shades to everything. But I have NO desire to
help parents figure out what curriculum to use, or how to make their
kids do math or how to enforce chores. Living joyfully and learning
wtih children is the goal in my home, and hence the information I
prefer to share with others.
I see a world of difference. I understand your desire to have
homeschoolers support each other (I think I do anyway) and to not
have divisions within the homeschool community. But there are real
life divisions that exist. I think you've made that clear yourself
in speaking out against HSLDA.
That being said, I'm truly glad you're here. And although I disagree
with your decision about the HEM lists, I know there is much wisdom
about unschooling you have to share with us all.
Ren
do not make any real distinction between unschooling and
homeschooling. Homeschooling is about living sensibly with our
children, our parents, our community,our world. Is there any better
definition of unschooling?"
First of all, welcome Helen! I'm glad you decided to stop by.
Now for the question:
How is it that you make no distinction between those that bring
school into their home and those that prefer natural learning...to
me there is a world of difference.
In our inclusive support group, we have all types of homeschoolers,
so I understand the need for people to support each other in the
decision to bring our children out of the school system. But in a
discussion (real life or otherwise) I don't see how one can pretend
there is no difference.
There are hues and shades to everything. But I have NO desire to
help parents figure out what curriculum to use, or how to make their
kids do math or how to enforce chores. Living joyfully and learning
wtih children is the goal in my home, and hence the information I
prefer to share with others.
I see a world of difference. I understand your desire to have
homeschoolers support each other (I think I do anyway) and to not
have divisions within the homeschool community. But there are real
life divisions that exist. I think you've made that clear yourself
in speaking out against HSLDA.
That being said, I'm truly glad you're here. And although I disagree
with your decision about the HEM lists, I know there is much wisdom
about unschooling you have to share with us all.
Ren
pam sorooshian
Hi,
I'm Pam Sorooshian. I live in Orange County, California, and my
husband, Cyrus, and I have 3 unschooled teenage daughters: Rose (13),
Roxana (16), and Roya (19). My husband is from Iran, we met in grad
school while both getting degrees in econometrics. I worked for years
in the energy industry, mostly on evaluating energy conservation
programs. Cyrus still does that kind of work. I also have taught
college-level statistics and economics courses for many years, still
teach one class at the local community college.
My oldest daughter, Roya, has a million interests - spinning, knitting,
ceramics, painting, poetry writing, and on and on. She's high energy.
She's finished two years of college and plans to take a year off and
then go back and major in recreation administration with a minor in
business management. Her goal is to own and run an arts camp for kids.
Roxana is completely wrapped up in musical theater. She goes to every
show she can manage and she performs in as many shows as possible.
She's been in Les Miserables and in Grease at the local community
colleges and is going to be in Pirates of Penzance this summer. She
spends a lot of time on her laptop playing computer games and she
creates websites galore. Right now she's busily putting up a website
that indexes all the poems, riddles, and recipes in the entire Redwall
series of books.
Rosie plays soccer and rides horses. I spend much of my time sitting
around at the stables while she does what horse people do. She also
plays Magic, the Gathering and Dungeons and Dragons and other
role-playing games. And she spends hours IMing with her friends -
passing around lots of quizzes and other stuff like that.
I put some pictures in the photos area of this list. One is of my local
hsing group, DragonTree HomeLearners, and another is of my husband and
our three daughters and there is one of me.
Here is a link to the photos area:
<http://photos.groups.yahoo.com/group/unschoolingbasics/lst>.
-pam
"To parents I say, above all else, don't let your home become some
terrible miniature copy of the school. No lesson plans! No quizzes!
No tests! No report cards! Even leaving your kids alone would be
better; at least they could figure out some things on their own. Live
together, as well as you can; enjoy life together, as much as you can."
John Holt in "Teach Your Own"
I'm Pam Sorooshian. I live in Orange County, California, and my
husband, Cyrus, and I have 3 unschooled teenage daughters: Rose (13),
Roxana (16), and Roya (19). My husband is from Iran, we met in grad
school while both getting degrees in econometrics. I worked for years
in the energy industry, mostly on evaluating energy conservation
programs. Cyrus still does that kind of work. I also have taught
college-level statistics and economics courses for many years, still
teach one class at the local community college.
My oldest daughter, Roya, has a million interests - spinning, knitting,
ceramics, painting, poetry writing, and on and on. She's high energy.
She's finished two years of college and plans to take a year off and
then go back and major in recreation administration with a minor in
business management. Her goal is to own and run an arts camp for kids.
Roxana is completely wrapped up in musical theater. She goes to every
show she can manage and she performs in as many shows as possible.
She's been in Les Miserables and in Grease at the local community
colleges and is going to be in Pirates of Penzance this summer. She
spends a lot of time on her laptop playing computer games and she
creates websites galore. Right now she's busily putting up a website
that indexes all the poems, riddles, and recipes in the entire Redwall
series of books.
Rosie plays soccer and rides horses. I spend much of my time sitting
around at the stables while she does what horse people do. She also
plays Magic, the Gathering and Dungeons and Dragons and other
role-playing games. And she spends hours IMing with her friends -
passing around lots of quizzes and other stuff like that.
I put some pictures in the photos area of this list. One is of my local
hsing group, DragonTree HomeLearners, and another is of my husband and
our three daughters and there is one of me.
Here is a link to the photos area:
<http://photos.groups.yahoo.com/group/unschoolingbasics/lst>.
-pam
"To parents I say, above all else, don't let your home become some
terrible miniature copy of the school. No lesson plans! No quizzes!
No tests! No report cards! Even leaving your kids alone would be
better; at least they could figure out some things on their own. Live
together, as well as you can; enjoy life together, as much as you can."
John Holt in "Teach Your Own"
Helen Hegener
At 1:54 AM +0000 5/31/04, Ren Allen wrote:
methods of homeschooling. I see school at home and natural learning
as simply two methods of homeschooling; two methods on a very wide
scale of options.
thought they should be the same thing. That would be folly indeed.
What I said was, and I'll quote myself: "I do not make any real
distinction between unschooling and homeschooling."
Our family has been unschooling - what I'm guessing you refer to here
as natural learning - for four generations now. But we don't refer to
ourselves as unschoolers. We are simply homeschoolers.
I take it you equate homeschooling with school at home. Can you tell
me - simply because I'm curious - how you arrived at that conclusion,
assuming it's true?
publishing HEM and working on the Web. :-)
community. Unfortunately they are a reality we all need to recognize
and deal with as respectfully as possible. What I'm saying is that I
do not recognize a division between homeschooling and unschooling.
Please feel free to grill me until you're sure you understand where
I'm coming from on this issue. And please don't be too quick to write
off the general homeschool populace in defense of what you term
natural learning. Homeschooling is a *big* word. :-)
Helen
>First of all, welcome Helen! I'm glad you decided to stop by.Thanks Ren, it's nice to be welcomed to your new list!
>Now for the question:I don't believe I said that I make no distinction between the various
>How is it that you make no distinction between those that bring
>school into their home and those that prefer natural learning...to
>me there is a world of difference.
methods of homeschooling. I see school at home and natural learning
as simply two methods of homeschooling; two methods on a very wide
scale of options.
>In our inclusive support group, we have all types of homeschoolers,I'm afraid I don't see how you arrived at the conclusion that I
>so I understand the need for people to support each other in the
>decision to bring our children out of the school system. But in a
>discussion (real life or otherwise) I don't see how one can pretend
>there is no difference.
thought they should be the same thing. That would be folly indeed.
What I said was, and I'll quote myself: "I do not make any real
distinction between unschooling and homeschooling."
Our family has been unschooling - what I'm guessing you refer to here
as natural learning - for four generations now. But we don't refer to
ourselves as unschoolers. We are simply homeschoolers.
I take it you equate homeschooling with school at home. Can you tell
me - simply because I'm curious - how you arrived at that conclusion,
assuming it's true?
>There are hues and shades to everything. But I have NO desire toI completely agree. That's been my goal for the 20+ years we've been
>help parents figure out what curriculum to use, or how to make their
>kids do math or how to enforce chores. Living joyfully and learning
>wtih children is the goal in my home, and hence the information I
>prefer to share with others.
publishing HEM and working on the Web. :-)
>I see a world of difference. I understand your desire to haveI'm not saying there shouldn't be divisions within the homeschooling
>homeschoolers support each other (I think I do anyway) and to not
>have divisions within the homeschool community. But there are real
>life divisions that exist. I think you've made that clear yourself
>in speaking out against HSLDA.
community. Unfortunately they are a reality we all need to recognize
and deal with as respectfully as possible. What I'm saying is that I
do not recognize a division between homeschooling and unschooling.
>That being said, I'm truly glad you're here. And although I disagreeThanks Ren, I appreciate the vote of confidence! :-)
>with your decision about the HEM lists, I know there is much wisdom
>about unschooling you have to share with us all.
Please feel free to grill me until you're sure you understand where
I'm coming from on this issue. And please don't be too quick to write
off the general homeschool populace in defense of what you term
natural learning. Homeschooling is a *big* word. :-)
Helen
Jon and Rue Kream
>>I see school at
home and natural learning
as simply two methods of homeschooling;
as simply two methods of homeschooling;
>>I do not
make any real
distinction between unschooling and homeschooling.
distinction between unschooling and homeschooling.
**Hi Helen
- Do you mean that you could rephrase this sentence as "I see school at
home and natural learning as simply two methods of unschooling"? That the
words are interchangable for you? Or am I misunderstanding?
~Rue
Helen Hegener
At 9:36 PM -0400 5/31/04, Jon and Rue Kream wrote:
>>I see school at home and natural learning
as simply two methods of homeschooling;>>I do not make any real
distinction between unschooling and homeschooling.**Hi Helen - Do you mean that you could rephrase this sentence as "I see school at home and natural learning as simply two methods of unschooling"? That the words are interchangable for you? Or am I misunderstanding? ~RueI wouldn't say school at home was a method of unschooling...I think of them as almost polar opposites.Helen
[email protected]
I let this one through---but I'm doubting you'll get the advice you
were looking for.
If you can open your mind to other possibilities, you may find
unschooling's just what you're looking for---without even knowing it.
But...brace yourself. This is NOT a mainstream parenting list. It's NOT
academically oriented.
I'm assuming you read the posting guidelines, so don't be surprised by
the anwers you receive.
~Kelly
Kelly Lovejoy
Conference Coordinator
Live and Learn Unschooling Conference
http://liveandlearnconference.org
"The hardest problem for the brain is not learning, but forgetting. No
matter how hard we try, we can't deliberately forget something we have
learned, and that is catastrophic if we learn that we can't learn."
~Frank Smith
________________________________________________________________________
Check out AOL.com today. Breaking news, video search, pictures, email
and IM. All on demand. Always Free.
were looking for.
If you can open your mind to other possibilities, you may find
unschooling's just what you're looking for---without even knowing it.
But...brace yourself. This is NOT a mainstream parenting list. It's NOT
academically oriented.
I'm assuming you read the posting guidelines, so don't be surprised by
the anwers you receive.
~Kelly
Kelly Lovejoy
Conference Coordinator
Live and Learn Unschooling Conference
http://liveandlearnconference.org
"The hardest problem for the brain is not learning, but forgetting. No
matter how hard we try, we can't deliberately forget something we have
learned, and that is catastrophic if we learn that we can't learn."
~Frank Smith
________________________________________________________________________
Check out AOL.com today. Breaking news, video search, pictures, email
and IM. All on demand. Always Free.
kirstenarbo
Hi,
I joined a short time ago. Haven't had the time to do much more than
lurk. Homeschooler of two boys (5) & (11) for 3 years and have been
unschooling for 2 years. We love it! We are in south Louisiana.
Though we are rather new to unschooling, I can't imagine anything
else. I'm happy to have found this group. Just reading your emails has
been a source of inspiration. - Warmly, Kirsten
I joined a short time ago. Haven't had the time to do much more than
lurk. Homeschooler of two boys (5) & (11) for 3 years and have been
unschooling for 2 years. We love it! We are in south Louisiana.
Though we are rather new to unschooling, I can't imagine anything
else. I'm happy to have found this group. Just reading your emails has
been a source of inspiration. - Warmly, Kirsten
Wildflower
Hello everyone. I am a unschooled mom unschooling my three daughters
aged 15, 12, and 8. We are also the happy coworkers of our home
business run mainly by my husband. We have 2 dogs, 1 cat, 3 guinea
pigs, 4 fish, and 1 parakeet. We have enjoyed gleaning wisdom form
many of you already. Thanks for having us.
Kindest Regards,
Melissa
aged 15, 12, and 8. We are also the happy coworkers of our home
business run mainly by my husband. We have 2 dogs, 1 cat, 3 guinea
pigs, 4 fish, and 1 parakeet. We have enjoyed gleaning wisdom form
many of you already. Thanks for having us.
Kindest Regards,
Melissa
Debra Rossing
>I guess my biggest thing is getting over this fear that I have to bedoing something or pushing them in some direction or the other
That's where -you- need to deschool - the kids are fine, the fears are
in your head. When they pop up ask yourself Why? and sit with the
thought for a minute and see why that fear or worry is there. When
looked at it straight on, all those big lurking fears tend to turn from
lions to kittens and run away. You also need time to stop looking for
things that look like 'school' - learning is happening, all the time,
really. Learning is also NOT visible - it's internal, just like
digestion is internal. You can't see your kids absorbing nutrients after
they eat but you know it's there because they're (presumably) pretty
healthy and growing. School education is, in some ways, "bulemia of the
brain" - they stuff you with tons of factoids then you are required to
regurgitate it, over and over and over. The problem is, not a lot of
learning "nutrition" is getting in. Learning is *internal* in focus and
in motivation - it's intrinsic.
Something that might be helpful (or not) is to go pursue something of
interest for yourself. Not to the exclusion of the kids but if your
brain and hands are occupied with watercolors or soapmaking or gardening
or whatever, your not sitting there nervously watching for signs of
"learning" happening. They might come watch, they might not, they might
want to try it, they might not. All of that is fine. Unschooling is not
"just for kids", it's not an "educational method" so much as a way of
living and being together. Think back to your dating days - you wanted
to know all about your Beloved and vice versa. So, you might notice
"hey, there's a new sushi place just opened up. Beloved loves sushi.
I'll have to mention it" And you do. Beloved might say "COOL! Let's go!"
or maybe "How about we check it out next week" or maybe "thanks, I'll
keep that in mind" or any of a myriad responses. You don't just say
"There's a new sushi place. You told me last week you like sushi. So, we
have to go there tomorrow." Nor do you say "You're 35 years old now, you
'should' try sushi so I've arranged for some books on sushi from the
library and we'll be going to a sushi restaurant on Thursday" regardless
of whether your Beloved *wants* to try sushi. However, if *you* love
sushi, you might ask your Beloved to come along with you to your
favorite place, not as a "lesson" or "learning experience" but simply to
share something that brings you joy. Beloved may or may not end up
liking sushi and that's fine. So, your "mission" is to be a 'student' of
your kids and find ways to support and facilitate things - drive them to
places, help them look up stuff online, whatever *at their request for
however long they have interest*. They might want to know where the word
"window" comes from. If all they need is a 2 minute look up in the
dictionary to check out that it comes from a Latin root meaning "see
through piece of glass" that's where it stops. If they then want to go
paint with glass paint on the windows, that's what happens next - no
"history of windows" lessons or books on windows or whatever,
until/unless that is the direction they want to take it. (Is this making
sense?)
We have LOTS of games and books and rolls of duct tape (hubby's current
creative passion) and paper towel tubes and toilet paper tubes and empty
egg cartons and boxes and movies and music and videogames and magazines
and markers and craft sticks and all sorts of stuff. Neither staying
home NOR going out are necessary for "encouraging creativity" - each
person is different. Some are inspired by a walk in the woods or the
shape of a playscape or a big empty beach to build on while others are
at their most creative at 2 in the morning with a word processor or
video capture software or a big sketchpad and colored pencils.
What constitutes "too busy" varies by person, by family, by "season". We
have times when we're home pretty much every day. We have times when
we're doing things out and about often. For us, having more than 3 or 4
"scheduled" things per week is plenty, but assorted spontaneous stuff
comes up and we decide -as a family- if anyone is interested, do we want
to do this, and so on. Sometimes a spontaneous trip to a park or a movie
or whatever is great. Other times we'd rather just hang out at home and
maybe watch a DVD or play a board game or simply just BE at home
together.
Deb
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eden love
Hello Everyone,
My name is Shana. I am a single mom of an Autisic boy. His name is Thor and he is 8 years old. I have just pulled him out of public school to start home schooling him. Since I am a 1st time home schooling mom, I am looking for information and help. Since I have no idea what I'm doing. :) Thank you for letting me join the group and looking forward to hearing great idea's that I can do with my son.
Have A Great Day!
Shana
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
My name is Shana. I am a single mom of an Autisic boy. His name is Thor and he is 8 years old. I have just pulled him out of public school to start home schooling him. Since I am a 1st time home schooling mom, I am looking for information and help. Since I have no idea what I'm doing. :) Thank you for letting me join the group and looking forward to hearing great idea's that I can do with my son.
Have A Great Day!
Shana
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Melissa Gray
Shana,
What is your goal with your son? I have several children on the
spectrum, and unschooling is very different than typical homeschooling.
Melissa
Mom to Joshua, Breanna, Emily, Rachel, Samuel, Daniel and Avari
Wife to Zane
blog me at
http://startlinglives.blogspot.com/
http://startlinglives365.blogspot.com
What is your goal with your son? I have several children on the
spectrum, and unschooling is very different than typical homeschooling.
Melissa
Mom to Joshua, Breanna, Emily, Rachel, Samuel, Daniel and Avari
Wife to Zane
blog me at
http://startlinglives.blogspot.com/
http://startlinglives365.blogspot.com
On Sep 22, 2008, at 10:16 AM, eden love wrote:
> Hello Everyone,
> My name is Shana. I am a single mom of an Autisic boy. His name
> is Thor and he is 8 years old. I have just pulled him out of public
> school to start home schooling him. Since I am a 1st time home
> schooling mom, I am looking for information and help. Since I have
> no idea what I'm doing. :) Thank you for letting me join the group
> and looking forward to hearing great idea's that I can do with my son.
>
> Have A Great Day!
>
> Shana
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
shana
Melissa,
Thor is classic Autisic, with A.D.D./A.D.H.D. also has panic
attacks and limited verbal. My goals right now, with Thor are for his
panic attacks to decrease, handwritting to get better, to beable to
start reading, and also to do simple math as of now. The school that
Thor was in did not teach him anything, until I had to raise cane
last year to have them teach him the site words, help him count to
50, and get him into an art and music programs. The school did not
think that Thor could learnthe site words, well he did. Thor learned
kindergarden to 2nd grade site words. At the beginning of this year I
was told that the school would not help Thor with the art and music
program since the was not enough funding. So, that's how we can into
home schooling though a friend. She told me since I'm an Artist that
I should look into unschooling for Thor. So I really don't know the
diffrence between the two. If someone could help me out, that would
be great. Thor works really well with art and music. And that's why
she recommened me to unschooling. We are now in a program called
Umbrella School. So,as of now I am useing the internet to go about
idea's to help Thor with home schooling. I have made a ton of flash
cards, and went out and got the both of us library cards. But since,
we live in a small town; the books that Thor can use are never there.
Are there any sites that we can vist to help us along? I would love
some feedback on what I can do. I am open to anything.
Have a great night!
Shana
--- In [email protected], Melissa Gray
<autismhelp@...> wrote:
Thor is classic Autisic, with A.D.D./A.D.H.D. also has panic
attacks and limited verbal. My goals right now, with Thor are for his
panic attacks to decrease, handwritting to get better, to beable to
start reading, and also to do simple math as of now. The school that
Thor was in did not teach him anything, until I had to raise cane
last year to have them teach him the site words, help him count to
50, and get him into an art and music programs. The school did not
think that Thor could learnthe site words, well he did. Thor learned
kindergarden to 2nd grade site words. At the beginning of this year I
was told that the school would not help Thor with the art and music
program since the was not enough funding. So, that's how we can into
home schooling though a friend. She told me since I'm an Artist that
I should look into unschooling for Thor. So I really don't know the
diffrence between the two. If someone could help me out, that would
be great. Thor works really well with art and music. And that's why
she recommened me to unschooling. We are now in a program called
Umbrella School. So,as of now I am useing the internet to go about
idea's to help Thor with home schooling. I have made a ton of flash
cards, and went out and got the both of us library cards. But since,
we live in a small town; the books that Thor can use are never there.
Are there any sites that we can vist to help us along? I would love
some feedback on what I can do. I am open to anything.
Have a great night!
Shana
--- In [email protected], Melissa Gray
<autismhelp@...> wrote:
>homeschooling.
> Shana,
> What is your goal with your son? I have several children on the
> spectrum, and unschooling is very different than typical
>name
>
> Melissa
> Mom to Joshua, Breanna, Emily, Rachel, Samuel, Daniel and Avari
> Wife to Zane
>
> blog me at
> http://startlinglives.blogspot.com/
> http://startlinglives365.blogspot.com
>
>
>
> On Sep 22, 2008, at 10:16 AM, eden love wrote:
>
> > Hello Everyone,
> > My name is Shana. I am a single mom of an Autisic boy. His
> > is Thor and he is 8 years old. I have just pulled him out ofpublic
> > school to start home schooling him. Since I am a 1st time homehave
> > schooling mom, I am looking for information and help. Since I
> > no idea what I'm doing. :) Thank you for letting me join thegroup
> > and looking forward to hearing great idea's that I can do with myson.
> >
> > Have A Great Day!
> >
> > Shana
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
Ren Allen
~~My goals right now, with Thor are for his
panic attacks to decrease, handwritting to get better, to be able to
start reading, and also to do simple math as of now.~~
Welcome Shana. What you'll hear about at this list, is what matters to
Thor, not what your goals are for him. We believe that all humans are
born to learn and learn best when NOT being pushed or coerced to learn
anything. I imagine his panic attacks will naturally decrease as his
interests and spirit are supported and he is out of the stressful
school environment.
Unschooling is about trust. Trust that your child will learn to read
and write when they (and only they) have a good reason to learn it
and/or the developmental ability to learn it. Math and reading and
writing are all around us. They get absorbed as we explore life.
Unschooling is about living well together, so we will focus on advice
about living, not teaching.:)
~~The school that Thor was in did not teach him anything, until I had
to raise cane last year to have them teach him the site words, help
him count to 50, and get him into an art and music programs. The
school did not think that Thor could learn the site words, well he
did. Thor learned kindergarden to 2nd grade site words. ~~
It's "sight", not "site". Site is a location. Sight is related to
vision. It sounds like you care deeply for your child (which led you
here) but all that energy spent fighting the school must have been
exhausting! Isn't it great that you can now use that energy to have
FUN together? Forget sight words and counting. He will learn those
just fine in due time.
Right now, I would highly recommend calling a vacation for you both to
heal. YOu don't have to fight the system any more, he doesn't have to
put up with the stress. You can both focus on enjoying each other's
company and doing things that bring you JOY. Learning is in the joy.
Truly.
~~She told me since I'm an Artist that
be a hugely life changing shift for you all. But unschooling works for
anyone, not just artistic types!
~~I have made a ton of flash
you how to paint, and I pulled out some flash cards, how would that
make you feel? Flash cards are great for turning into art btw.;) But
to use them aimed at getting information into a person? Nah. Let it
go. He might enjoy playing with them in his own way, but I would never
recommend trying to "teach" someone with them. It's condescending.
It sounds like you've never heard of unschooling before this friend
talked to you. You're going to hear a lot of ideas at this list that
are quite opposite from anything you've heard from parents and
teachers up to this point.
We're not big fans of school at home here. So keep on reading and try
to take it all in without getting offended....which can be a challenge
when parenting issues are being discussed. I recommend reading at the
following sites:
http://sandradodd.com/unschooling
http://joyfullyrejoycing.com/
That should be enough to keep you reading for a few years! lol
There are many members here who have blogs, if you want a glimpse into
what a school-free life looks like.:)
Ren
radicalunschooling.blogspot.com
teawithren.blogspot.com
panic attacks to decrease, handwritting to get better, to be able to
start reading, and also to do simple math as of now.~~
Welcome Shana. What you'll hear about at this list, is what matters to
Thor, not what your goals are for him. We believe that all humans are
born to learn and learn best when NOT being pushed or coerced to learn
anything. I imagine his panic attacks will naturally decrease as his
interests and spirit are supported and he is out of the stressful
school environment.
Unschooling is about trust. Trust that your child will learn to read
and write when they (and only they) have a good reason to learn it
and/or the developmental ability to learn it. Math and reading and
writing are all around us. They get absorbed as we explore life.
Unschooling is about living well together, so we will focus on advice
about living, not teaching.:)
~~The school that Thor was in did not teach him anything, until I had
to raise cane last year to have them teach him the site words, help
him count to 50, and get him into an art and music programs. The
school did not think that Thor could learn the site words, well he
did. Thor learned kindergarden to 2nd grade site words. ~~
It's "sight", not "site". Site is a location. Sight is related to
vision. It sounds like you care deeply for your child (which led you
here) but all that energy spent fighting the school must have been
exhausting! Isn't it great that you can now use that energy to have
FUN together? Forget sight words and counting. He will learn those
just fine in due time.
Right now, I would highly recommend calling a vacation for you both to
heal. YOu don't have to fight the system any more, he doesn't have to
put up with the stress. You can both focus on enjoying each other's
company and doing things that bring you JOY. Learning is in the joy.
Truly.
~~She told me since I'm an Artist that
> I should look into unschooling for Thor.~~You have a lovely friend to have recommended unschooling. This could
be a hugely life changing shift for you all. But unschooling works for
anyone, not just artistic types!
~~I have made a ton of flash
> cards, and went out and got the both of us library cards.~~Flash cards are icky in my opinion. If you came and asked me to show
you how to paint, and I pulled out some flash cards, how would that
make you feel? Flash cards are great for turning into art btw.;) But
to use them aimed at getting information into a person? Nah. Let it
go. He might enjoy playing with them in his own way, but I would never
recommend trying to "teach" someone with them. It's condescending.
It sounds like you've never heard of unschooling before this friend
talked to you. You're going to hear a lot of ideas at this list that
are quite opposite from anything you've heard from parents and
teachers up to this point.
We're not big fans of school at home here. So keep on reading and try
to take it all in without getting offended....which can be a challenge
when parenting issues are being discussed. I recommend reading at the
following sites:
http://sandradodd.com/unschooling
http://joyfullyrejoycing.com/
That should be enough to keep you reading for a few years! lol
There are many members here who have blogs, if you want a glimpse into
what a school-free life looks like.:)
Ren
radicalunschooling.blogspot.com
teawithren.blogspot.com
The Patersons
I would look in RDI therapy and forget the 'static skills'. Relationship
Development Intervention is much closer to unschooling than any of what you
are talking about below, and more rewarding for the child in the long run.
Cecily
From: [email protected]
[mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of shana
Sent: Tuesday, 23 September 2008 9:37 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: [SPAM][unschoolingbasics] Re: Hello
Melissa,
Thor is classic Autisic, with A.D.D./A.D.H.D. also has panic
attacks and limited verbal. My goals right now, with Thor are for his
panic attacks to decrease, handwritting to get better, to beable to
start reading, and also to do simple math as of now. The school that
Thor was in did not teach him anything, until I had to raise cane
last year to have them teach him the site words, help him count to
50, and get him into an art and music programs. The school did not
think that Thor could learnthe site words, well he did. Thor learned
kindergarden to 2nd grade site words. At the beginning of this year I
was told that the school would not help Thor with the art and music
program since the was not enough funding. So, that's how we can into
home schooling though a friend. She told me since I'm an Artist that
I should look into unschooling for Thor. So I really don't know the
diffrence between the two. If someone could help me out, that would
be great. Thor works really well with art and music. And that's why
she recommened me to unschooling. We are now in a program called
Umbrella School. So,as of now I am useing the internet to go about
idea's to help Thor with home schooling. I have made a ton of flash
cards, and went out and got the both of us library cards. But since,
we live in a small town; the books that Thor can use are never there.
Are there any sites that we can vist to help us along? I would love
some feedback on what I can do. I am open to anything.
Have a great night!
Shana
--- In [email protected]
<mailto:unschoolingbasics%40yahoogroups.com> , Melissa Gray
<autismhelp@...> wrote:
Development Intervention is much closer to unschooling than any of what you
are talking about below, and more rewarding for the child in the long run.
Cecily
From: [email protected]
[mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of shana
Sent: Tuesday, 23 September 2008 9:37 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: [SPAM][unschoolingbasics] Re: Hello
Melissa,
Thor is classic Autisic, with A.D.D./A.D.H.D. also has panic
attacks and limited verbal. My goals right now, with Thor are for his
panic attacks to decrease, handwritting to get better, to beable to
start reading, and also to do simple math as of now. The school that
Thor was in did not teach him anything, until I had to raise cane
last year to have them teach him the site words, help him count to
50, and get him into an art and music programs. The school did not
think that Thor could learnthe site words, well he did. Thor learned
kindergarden to 2nd grade site words. At the beginning of this year I
was told that the school would not help Thor with the art and music
program since the was not enough funding. So, that's how we can into
home schooling though a friend. She told me since I'm an Artist that
I should look into unschooling for Thor. So I really don't know the
diffrence between the two. If someone could help me out, that would
be great. Thor works really well with art and music. And that's why
she recommened me to unschooling. We are now in a program called
Umbrella School. So,as of now I am useing the internet to go about
idea's to help Thor with home schooling. I have made a ton of flash
cards, and went out and got the both of us library cards. But since,
we live in a small town; the books that Thor can use are never there.
Are there any sites that we can vist to help us along? I would love
some feedback on what I can do. I am open to anything.
Have a great night!
Shana
--- In [email protected]
<mailto:unschoolingbasics%40yahoogroups.com> , Melissa Gray
<autismhelp@...> wrote:
>homeschooling.
> Shana,
> What is your goal with your son? I have several children on the
> spectrum, and unschooling is very different than typical
>name
>
> Melissa
> Mom to Joshua, Breanna, Emily, Rachel, Samuel, Daniel and Avari
> Wife to Zane
>
> blog me at
> http://startlinglives.blogspot.com/
> http://startlinglives365.blogspot.com
>
>
>
> On Sep 22, 2008, at 10:16 AM, eden love wrote:
>
> > Hello Everyone,
> > My name is Shana. I am a single mom of an Autisic boy. His
> > is Thor and he is 8 years old. I have just pulled him out ofpublic
> > school to start home schooling him. Since I am a 1st time homehave
> > schooling mom, I am looking for information and help. Since I
> > no idea what I'm doing. :) Thank you for letting me join thegroup
> > and looking forward to hearing great idea's that I can do with myson.
> >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > Have A Great Day!
> >
> > Shana
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
sakdow
I'm new to this list, have been reading through posts and enjoyed what I have been reading. I look forward to reading more.
My name is Abby, I am married and we have one 11 year old daughter. My mom also lives with us. My husband and I started out homeschooling our daughter with a curriculum base. As we moved on and learned more about her learning style and we became more and more relaxed homeschoolers. Now I would call us relaxed homeschoolers with unschool leanings. Our lifestyle is getting to be more of an unschool way of life and I love seeing my daughter thrive.
However we are having some problems. My mom doesn't get it. My mom felt that math needed to be more curriculum based. She just doesn't understand how a child can learn math without doing problems or memorizing multiplications tables. She said she has vision of my daughter trying to get a job and not being able to count money and failing in life. I encouraged mom to work with my daughter and it is very much a workbook, worksheet style of learning. My daughter isn't really a worksheet kind of kid so this is always met with frustration for both of them. I bought the Family Math book and mom did read and try a few things but went back to the workbooks. She recently decided that our daughter would need to come to her and ask for math lessons. Well guess what, she never asks. This frustrated my mom to no end. Mom and I had another conversation about what unschooling is and she just doesn't understand. She feels I am failing my daughter. I told her about (and followed up with the links in an e-mail) Dayna Martin's website and you tube videos and Sandra Dodd's website. I have also sent her links to this discussion group, and two others. I am hoping that she follows through and really hoping she joins in here. I think having someone else, not her daughter whom she lives with, discuss these ideas with her, and will make a huge difference in her understanding and acceptance. Can anyone offer any other advice?
It just breaks my heart to see all the conflict and frustration. Mom wants to be involved. Our daughter loves having her Grammy in the house. They have this wonderful relationship. Mom is really unschooling with our daughter in many other ways, she just can't seem to see it with this one topic.
Blessings
Abby
My name is Abby, I am married and we have one 11 year old daughter. My mom also lives with us. My husband and I started out homeschooling our daughter with a curriculum base. As we moved on and learned more about her learning style and we became more and more relaxed homeschoolers. Now I would call us relaxed homeschoolers with unschool leanings. Our lifestyle is getting to be more of an unschool way of life and I love seeing my daughter thrive.
However we are having some problems. My mom doesn't get it. My mom felt that math needed to be more curriculum based. She just doesn't understand how a child can learn math without doing problems or memorizing multiplications tables. She said she has vision of my daughter trying to get a job and not being able to count money and failing in life. I encouraged mom to work with my daughter and it is very much a workbook, worksheet style of learning. My daughter isn't really a worksheet kind of kid so this is always met with frustration for both of them. I bought the Family Math book and mom did read and try a few things but went back to the workbooks. She recently decided that our daughter would need to come to her and ask for math lessons. Well guess what, she never asks. This frustrated my mom to no end. Mom and I had another conversation about what unschooling is and she just doesn't understand. She feels I am failing my daughter. I told her about (and followed up with the links in an e-mail) Dayna Martin's website and you tube videos and Sandra Dodd's website. I have also sent her links to this discussion group, and two others. I am hoping that she follows through and really hoping she joins in here. I think having someone else, not her daughter whom she lives with, discuss these ideas with her, and will make a huge difference in her understanding and acceptance. Can anyone offer any other advice?
It just breaks my heart to see all the conflict and frustration. Mom wants to be involved. Our daughter loves having her Grammy in the house. They have this wonderful relationship. Mom is really unschooling with our daughter in many other ways, she just can't seem to see it with this one topic.
Blessings
Abby
swissarmy_wife
--- In [email protected], "sakdow" <sakdow@...> wrote:
Also, can you get to a conference? Maybe you could bring your mom to a conference where she can see and meet other unschooled children. You sound very close to your mom, a conference might be a place where you can explore and enjoy unschooling together.
Maybe she could read Rue Kream's book that has been mentioned a lot lately.
Hope that helps. I'm sure you will get lots of good ideas from the members here.
Heather
www.swissarmywife.net
> It just breaks my heart to see all the conflict and frustration. Mom wants to be involved. Our daughter loves having her Grammy in the house. They have this wonderful relationship. Mom is really unschooling with our daughter in many other ways, she just can't seem to see it with this one topic.******This might seem a little harsh, but is it possible for you to politely let your mom know that you have made a decision for your daughter? I once told my father, after too much intrusion, that he had his turn to raise his kids and now it's mine and i didn't appreciate him telling me what to do. It actually went over very well. He never mentioned it again, but he never intruded inappropriately again either. I was calm, yet confident and very serious about it.
Also, can you get to a conference? Maybe you could bring your mom to a conference where she can see and meet other unschooled children. You sound very close to your mom, a conference might be a place where you can explore and enjoy unschooling together.
Maybe she could read Rue Kream's book that has been mentioned a lot lately.
Hope that helps. I'm sure you will get lots of good ideas from the members here.
Heather
www.swissarmywife.net
Joyce Fetteroll
On Jun 20, 2009, at 12:02 AM, sakdow wrote:
that if your daughter feels pressure to do what she doesn't want to
do, starts relating frustration to math, your mother will be driving
your daughter away from her *and* from math.
If the goal is to have fun and math become a *side effect* of the
fun, your daughter is more likely to spend more time on the math. So
instead of focusing on what she can get into your daughter, set the
goal to be having fun.
Maybe she's overwhelmed with reading. It could be coming here and
asking questions would help. But maybe more reading will help:
http://joyfullyrejoycing.com/
Scroll down the left side. There are 5 pages on math written by
someone who was an Electrical Engineer in her former life and knows
how impossible it seemed that math could be learned without school
methods.
I spent 12 years training to get into Calculus class in college. My
daughter spent zilch and jumped into her father's college Statistics
class at 12 (and eventually took Calculus when she was 16). She's
*not* a math head. (She's an artist, writer and musician primarily.)
She doesn't do math puzzles for fun. But her experiences with math
her whole life were fun and practical for her own purposes. There was
no drudgery or pressure. She absorbed the concepts by using them just
as kids absorb where to put nouns and verbs in sentences without
knowing what nouns and verbs are. *Because* her understanding came
from using math in real life in contexts she understood and wanted
answers from, she built a true understanding. So when faced with
notation, it was just an add on to what she already understood rather
than the beginning point for understanding something she didn't know
or care about as it is with kids in school.
Joyce
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> I encouraged mom to work with my daughter and it is very much aHow about encouraging her to have fun with your daughter? Point out
> workbook, worksheet style of learning.
that if your daughter feels pressure to do what she doesn't want to
do, starts relating frustration to math, your mother will be driving
your daughter away from her *and* from math.
If the goal is to have fun and math become a *side effect* of the
fun, your daughter is more likely to spend more time on the math. So
instead of focusing on what she can get into your daughter, set the
goal to be having fun.
Maybe she's overwhelmed with reading. It could be coming here and
asking questions would help. But maybe more reading will help:
http://joyfullyrejoycing.com/
Scroll down the left side. There are 5 pages on math written by
someone who was an Electrical Engineer in her former life and knows
how impossible it seemed that math could be learned without school
methods.
I spent 12 years training to get into Calculus class in college. My
daughter spent zilch and jumped into her father's college Statistics
class at 12 (and eventually took Calculus when she was 16). She's
*not* a math head. (She's an artist, writer and musician primarily.)
She doesn't do math puzzles for fun. But her experiences with math
her whole life were fun and practical for her own purposes. There was
no drudgery or pressure. She absorbed the concepts by using them just
as kids absorb where to put nouns and verbs in sentences without
knowing what nouns and verbs are. *Because* her understanding came
from using math in real life in contexts she understood and wanted
answers from, she built a true understanding. So when faced with
notation, it was just an add on to what she already understood rather
than the beginning point for understanding something she didn't know
or care about as it is with kids in school.
Joyce
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Amy Dingmann
Hi there, I'm new here as well, Abby...and our situations are kind of similar so I thought I would respond.
My name is Amy and my hubsband and I unschool our two sons. We also have parents (mine) sharing a house with us. Our decision to homeschool got a few eyebrows raised. Moving to unschooling made heads spin. In the beginning (as more structured homeschoolers) what helped was my parents would occasionally attend things with us, like a homeschool gym class or whatever. Or we'd be out and about for the day and we'd stop at a park and hook up with the area homeschool buddies....while mom or dad were with us. And they got to see none of us had three heads :) That really opened their eyes to it simply being a different way of life. And now as we move into unschooling, they are there to witness the constant learning that can't be separated from life. They ask questions respectfully, I answer respectfully, realizing that them sharing a house with us is taking them on a journey totally foriegn to anything they've previously known about "school", "learning" or
"education. It takes patience on everyone's part.
As far as your mom's specific issues with math, books/disc.groups/etc might help, or it might just take time. According to your mom, math needs to be more curriculum based. It might take her seeing your daughter figuring it out without curriculum for her to "get it". And since you're not curriculum based and trying to race against someone's calendar, it might just take time for your mom to see that it will eventually come together. :)
Good Luck,
Amy
wakeupstartlearning.blogspot.com
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
My name is Amy and my hubsband and I unschool our two sons. We also have parents (mine) sharing a house with us. Our decision to homeschool got a few eyebrows raised. Moving to unschooling made heads spin. In the beginning (as more structured homeschoolers) what helped was my parents would occasionally attend things with us, like a homeschool gym class or whatever. Or we'd be out and about for the day and we'd stop at a park and hook up with the area homeschool buddies....while mom or dad were with us. And they got to see none of us had three heads :) That really opened their eyes to it simply being a different way of life. And now as we move into unschooling, they are there to witness the constant learning that can't be separated from life. They ask questions respectfully, I answer respectfully, realizing that them sharing a house with us is taking them on a journey totally foriegn to anything they've previously known about "school", "learning" or
"education. It takes patience on everyone's part.
As far as your mom's specific issues with math, books/disc.groups/etc might help, or it might just take time. According to your mom, math needs to be more curriculum based. It might take her seeing your daughter figuring it out without curriculum for her to "get it". And since you're not curriculum based and trying to race against someone's calendar, it might just take time for your mom to see that it will eventually come together. :)
Good Luck,
Amy
wakeupstartlearning.blogspot.com
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
With fun and math in mind, Mom might visit Pam Sorooshian's website.
http://homepage.mac.com/pamsoroosh/iblog/math/C671963116/index.html
Nance
http://homepage.mac.com/pamsoroosh/iblog/math/C671963116/index.html
Nance
--- In [email protected], Joyce Fetteroll <jfetteroll@...> wrote:
>
>
> On Jun 20, 2009, at 12:02 AM, sakdow wrote:
>
> > I encouraged mom to work with my daughter and it is very much a
> > workbook, worksheet style of learning.
>
> How about encouraging her to have fun with your daughter? Point out
> that if your daughter feels pressure to do what she doesn't want to
> do, starts relating frustration to math, your mother will be driving
> your daughter away from her *and* from math.
>
> If the goal is to have fun and math become a *side effect* of the
> fun, your daughter is more likely to spend more time on the math. So
> instead of focusing on what she can get into your daughter, set the
> goal to be having fun.
>
Meredith
--- In [email protected], "sakdow" <sakdow@...> wrote:
Be as gentle with your mom as you can about her concerns - take the concerns seriously! But realize that isn't the same as letting her dictate how to live with and "educate" your dd. If your mom has any kind of spiritual practice, it may help to encourage her to "turn this over to god" or whatever the equivalent may be for her. Her worries are her worries, and you may not be able to fix them. Let her know that that you value and cherish her presence in your dd's life, but she doesn't "need" to do the math stuff. You've researched the matter, there are other ways to learn, and her "help" is getting in the way. Maybe don't say it quite like that ;) but its okay to articulate some boundaries - yours and your dds.
There's an unschooling board for "non-traditional" families that may have extra anti-unschooling pressure as a result (divided families, grandparents in the home, single parents, three or more parents...) that you might find helpful (its not as busy as this board, though):
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/crazylifeunschoolers/
---Meredith (Mo 7, Ray 15)
>I think having someone else, not her daughter whom she lives with, discuss these ideas with her, and will make a huge difference in her understanding and acceptance. Can anyone offer any other advice?**************************
Be as gentle with your mom as you can about her concerns - take the concerns seriously! But realize that isn't the same as letting her dictate how to live with and "educate" your dd. If your mom has any kind of spiritual practice, it may help to encourage her to "turn this over to god" or whatever the equivalent may be for her. Her worries are her worries, and you may not be able to fix them. Let her know that that you value and cherish her presence in your dd's life, but she doesn't "need" to do the math stuff. You've researched the matter, there are other ways to learn, and her "help" is getting in the way. Maybe don't say it quite like that ;) but its okay to articulate some boundaries - yours and your dds.
There's an unschooling board for "non-traditional" families that may have extra anti-unschooling pressure as a result (divided families, grandparents in the home, single parents, three or more parents...) that you might find helpful (its not as busy as this board, though):
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/crazylifeunschoolers/
---Meredith (Mo 7, Ray 15)
Faith Void
There is also grandLEAP for grands! It's a yahoo group, I can't make
links from my phone. Maybe someone can.
Faith
Sent from my iPhone
links from my phone. Maybe someone can.
Faith
Sent from my iPhone
On Jun 21, 2009, at 9:48 AM, "Meredith" <meredith@...> wrote:
>
>
> --- In [email protected], "sakdow" <sakdow@...> wrote:
> >I think having someone else, not her daughter whom she lives with,
> discuss these ideas with her, and will make a huge difference in her
> understanding and acceptance. Can anyone offer any other advice?
> **************************
>
> Be as gentle with your mom as you can about her concerns - take the
> concerns seriously! But realize that isn't the same as letting her
> dictate how to live with and "educate" your dd. If your mom has any
> kind of spiritual practice, it may help to encourage her to "turn
> this over to god" or whatever the equivalent may be for her. Her
> worries are her worries, and you may not be able to fix them. Let
> her know that that you value and cherish her presence in your dd's
> life, but she doesn't "need" to do the math stuff. You've researched
> the matter, there are other ways to learn, and her "help" is getting
> in the way. Maybe don't say it quite like that ;) but its okay to
> articulate some boundaries - yours and your dds.
>
> There's an unschooling board for "non-traditional" families that may
> have extra anti-unschooling pressure as a result (divided families,
> grandparents in the home, single parents, three or more parents...)
> that you might find helpful (its not as busy as this board, though):
>
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/crazylifeunschoolers/
>
> ---Meredith (Mo 7, Ray 15)
>
>
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
sakdow
I want to thank everyone for the wonderful links and advice! I passed along the links and some of the information I thought might be helpful. I also got some great ideas on strewing from another conversation here. This group is really full of wonderful information!
I brought up the idea of us all attending an unschool conference together as well. There is one in Ohio in February that I want to attend, so I have been telling my Mom about it to plant the seed. She has attended a few events we have gone to with local homeschool groups. That group is a mix of every type of homeschool and unschool style families out together. I know she has talked with unschool families she just may not have realized it at the time.
There was a discussion here about what unschooling looks like. While reading I realized that Mom hasn't realized she was looking at unschooling while it was happening, even though she has participated in it herself. The "cuddling on the couch" really hit home. My daughter and I often learn while sitting on the cough chatting or reading and looking stuff up on laptops. There have been a couple of recent incidents where we were on the couch reading or talking and my mom would walk up and say "Hey lets go do school work". I would tell her we are reading or discussing whatever we were discussing (I think it was local government) and Mom would look very confused by that. I realize now that Mom was having this curriculum conflict then but didn't come out and say it in that way. She also didn't recognize what my daughter and I were doing as learning. I feel like I have a better understanding of what she was seeing now and I think that gives me a better tool for explaining and helping my mom to understand.
I brought up the idea of us all attending an unschool conference together as well. There is one in Ohio in February that I want to attend, so I have been telling my Mom about it to plant the seed. She has attended a few events we have gone to with local homeschool groups. That group is a mix of every type of homeschool and unschool style families out together. I know she has talked with unschool families she just may not have realized it at the time.
There was a discussion here about what unschooling looks like. While reading I realized that Mom hasn't realized she was looking at unschooling while it was happening, even though she has participated in it herself. The "cuddling on the couch" really hit home. My daughter and I often learn while sitting on the cough chatting or reading and looking stuff up on laptops. There have been a couple of recent incidents where we were on the couch reading or talking and my mom would walk up and say "Hey lets go do school work". I would tell her we are reading or discussing whatever we were discussing (I think it was local government) and Mom would look very confused by that. I realize now that Mom was having this curriculum conflict then but didn't come out and say it in that way. She also didn't recognize what my daughter and I were doing as learning. I feel like I have a better understanding of what she was seeing now and I think that gives me a better tool for explaining and helping my mom to understand.
btoolan2003
I am sitting in my living room with Kathryn and a bunch of really cool unschooled teenagers, thinking about the one tiny green tomato in my garden and listening to a conversation about crocheting bathmats accompanied by a hummed rendition of âthe first row is the hardestâ¦â (hummed to the tune of âthe first cut is the deepest.â) The house smells like freshly mowed grass and waffles, and I am hoping that I will see the foxes that live in the cemetery across the road this afternoon.
I guess this is a typical day in the life of an unschooling parent.
My name is Beth Toolan. I live in Salem, MA with my wife, Kathryn Baptista, our almost 20 year old son, Julian and Sadel, 12, who has shared our lives for the past 16 months and will be moving on to new adventures in a few weeks. We have unschooled Julian since he was 8.
I am really looking forward to seeing many of you at the Northeast Unschooling Conference this August. Some of my favorite people in the whole world will be there â" the Lovejoys, the Kreams, the Davis-Pitres, Marji Zintz, the Yablonski- Bieglers⦠and I am so looking forward to reconnecting with old friends and making lots of new ones.
I am especially excited about spending a few hours learning from Rue Kream, wife of Jon and parent of Dagny and Rowan, unschooling guru and author of the book, âParenting A Free Child: An Unschooled Life.â Any of you who have met Rue, talked with her on the discussion boards, read her book, or admired her butt on the bookâs front cover will share my awe at her gentle, kind wisdom and her unwavering commitment to parenting free children and supporting all of us to do so as well.
Friends, laughter, music, a great location just north of Boston, and a loving and welcoming community of people who share the unschooling lifestyle â" I canât think of a better way to spend the last few days of August.
Please visit our website at www.northeastunschoolingconference.com for more information and to register.
I hope to see you there!
I guess this is a typical day in the life of an unschooling parent.
My name is Beth Toolan. I live in Salem, MA with my wife, Kathryn Baptista, our almost 20 year old son, Julian and Sadel, 12, who has shared our lives for the past 16 months and will be moving on to new adventures in a few weeks. We have unschooled Julian since he was 8.
I am really looking forward to seeing many of you at the Northeast Unschooling Conference this August. Some of my favorite people in the whole world will be there â" the Lovejoys, the Kreams, the Davis-Pitres, Marji Zintz, the Yablonski- Bieglers⦠and I am so looking forward to reconnecting with old friends and making lots of new ones.
I am especially excited about spending a few hours learning from Rue Kream, wife of Jon and parent of Dagny and Rowan, unschooling guru and author of the book, âParenting A Free Child: An Unschooled Life.â Any of you who have met Rue, talked with her on the discussion boards, read her book, or admired her butt on the bookâs front cover will share my awe at her gentle, kind wisdom and her unwavering commitment to parenting free children and supporting all of us to do so as well.
Friends, laughter, music, a great location just north of Boston, and a loving and welcoming community of people who share the unschooling lifestyle â" I canât think of a better way to spend the last few days of August.
Please visit our website at www.northeastunschoolingconference.com for more information and to register.
I hope to see you there!
Dora Font
Will this conference be in the same location (Massachusetts) next
year? I have family in Mass and would love to attend. But this year
on that weekend I'm having my wisdom tooth out.
Thanks
Dora
year? I have family in Mass and would love to attend. But this year
on that weekend I'm having my wisdom tooth out.
Thanks
Dora
Debra Rossing
If Kathryn and Beth put it together again next year, it should be in a
similar location. This year's location is actually different by a
couples miles from the last few years but since they are in that area,
if they are organizing it, that's where it'll be.
Deb R
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similar location. This year's location is actually different by a
couples miles from the last few years but since they are in that area,
if they are organizing it, that's where it'll be.
Deb R
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intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they
are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify
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Suzie
Hi everyone
I have a little boy who is 4 and an 18 month old boy. We are moving into less controlled ways of living. At the moment it feels as though we are dabbling, rather than unschooling, so I am pretty sure this is why we are hitting a few bumps. I have always controlled my eldest's food and sleep and we have recently been trying to let go of that. Ohhh we're finding it hard! Does it take a while for things to settle down? On the food thing; yesterday he ate 6 icecreams and has had one for breakfast this morning. I would think this is because it's been restricted and he's now exploring. Is it? He has always had a sweet tooth and doesn't like fruit or veg (unless the fruit is in a puree). He's very reluctant to try new food and rarely does. Because I am finding the 6 icecream thing hard I end up saying "no" by no.6, which is not what I want to be doing at all.
On the sleep thing; he just seems really tired! He comes up to bed with us when we do, as we all sleep in the same bed, but he still wants to jump around and not go to sleep even though he is really exhausted. We then become stressed as we don't want him to wake the baby up. He still wakes fairly early and is grumpy through not getting enough sleep. Will this too settle down with a bit of time?
It seems to me that he's not listening to his body yet, but I am wondering how long this takes or is he too young? Or am I looking at it from totally the wrong angle?
Also my husband is finding it really hard with the kids not going to bed before us, so not sure how to deal with that...
Any insights would be really appreciated.
Thanks
Suzie
I have a little boy who is 4 and an 18 month old boy. We are moving into less controlled ways of living. At the moment it feels as though we are dabbling, rather than unschooling, so I am pretty sure this is why we are hitting a few bumps. I have always controlled my eldest's food and sleep and we have recently been trying to let go of that. Ohhh we're finding it hard! Does it take a while for things to settle down? On the food thing; yesterday he ate 6 icecreams and has had one for breakfast this morning. I would think this is because it's been restricted and he's now exploring. Is it? He has always had a sweet tooth and doesn't like fruit or veg (unless the fruit is in a puree). He's very reluctant to try new food and rarely does. Because I am finding the 6 icecream thing hard I end up saying "no" by no.6, which is not what I want to be doing at all.
On the sleep thing; he just seems really tired! He comes up to bed with us when we do, as we all sleep in the same bed, but he still wants to jump around and not go to sleep even though he is really exhausted. We then become stressed as we don't want him to wake the baby up. He still wakes fairly early and is grumpy through not getting enough sleep. Will this too settle down with a bit of time?
It seems to me that he's not listening to his body yet, but I am wondering how long this takes or is he too young? Or am I looking at it from totally the wrong angle?
Also my husband is finding it really hard with the kids not going to bed before us, so not sure how to deal with that...
Any insights would be really appreciated.
Thanks
Suzie
plaidpanties666
"Suzie" <suzepetch@...> wrote:
He may need the help of a routine to settle down. That could be a sort of traditional bath-read-snuggle routine, or it could involve putting in a movie that mom and dad can doze through. It could even involve an hour or more of very active play to work out the last of the wiggles before bed. Don't be afraid to experiment a little and find out what helps your guys settle down. At the same time, it can help to shift the focus to "rest" instead of "sleep" - which may mean a partner who needs to get up early moves to another bed for awhile so he can get the sleep he needs.
Some of it is that, but some is that little kids need lots of fast energy *and* lots of protein *and* lots of fat. Ice cream is the perfect food from that perspective. Look for other ways to offer sweet, rich, dense foods: cookies, cakes, pies, muffins, waffles, custards. Make your own as much as you can - that lets you offer good quality proteins and fats *and* feel better about what your kids are eating. It's also important that foods be easy, attractive and convenient to busy little people. Given the option of waiting ten minutes for something to be cooked and eating something Right Now, its totally natural for a child to choose the immediate option.
Love him up. Let him know often and sincerely that you appreciate all he does for you and the kids. Let him know he's wanted, respected and sexy. Find lots of little ways to connect with him during the day, so he's not dependent on that hour at "bedtime" to get all his emotional needs met - send him emails or text messages if you can, blow him kisses across children's heads and ambush him in the bathroom now and then. The more he feels important and special, the more easily he'll relax into these crazy changes you're trying to make.
---Meredith
>> On the sleep thing; he just seems really tired! He comes up to bed with us when we do, as we all sleep in the same bed, but he still wants to jump around and not go to sleep even though he is really exhausted.***************
He may need the help of a routine to settle down. That could be a sort of traditional bath-read-snuggle routine, or it could involve putting in a movie that mom and dad can doze through. It could even involve an hour or more of very active play to work out the last of the wiggles before bed. Don't be afraid to experiment a little and find out what helps your guys settle down. At the same time, it can help to shift the focus to "rest" instead of "sleep" - which may mean a partner who needs to get up early moves to another bed for awhile so he can get the sleep he needs.
>>I would think this is because it's been restricted and he's now exploring. Is it?***************
Some of it is that, but some is that little kids need lots of fast energy *and* lots of protein *and* lots of fat. Ice cream is the perfect food from that perspective. Look for other ways to offer sweet, rich, dense foods: cookies, cakes, pies, muffins, waffles, custards. Make your own as much as you can - that lets you offer good quality proteins and fats *and* feel better about what your kids are eating. It's also important that foods be easy, attractive and convenient to busy little people. Given the option of waiting ten minutes for something to be cooked and eating something Right Now, its totally natural for a child to choose the immediate option.
> Also my husband is finding it really hard with the kids not going to bed before us, so not sure how to deal with that...***************
Love him up. Let him know often and sincerely that you appreciate all he does for you and the kids. Let him know he's wanted, respected and sexy. Find lots of little ways to connect with him during the day, so he's not dependent on that hour at "bedtime" to get all his emotional needs met - send him emails or text messages if you can, blow him kisses across children's heads and ambush him in the bathroom now and then. The more he feels important and special, the more easily he'll relax into these crazy changes you're trying to make.
---Meredith
Suze Petcher
Thanks so much for your reply Meredith! All really useful. I think my son is an 'active before bed' type of guy. He doesn't really do snuggles. Too busy.
For some time I have been referring to 'rest' rather than 'sleep', as the other problem is that he is actually afraid of falling asleep -
the sensation of slipping into the unconscious.
I think the food ideas are great. I wonder whether I have been too worried about healthy food and what he's not eating, rather than
planning for how unbelievably active he is. He must burn up a huge amount of calories as he NEVER stops moving, not even in his sleep!
I will go the smorgasbord option with high calorie stuff and see if he is happier grazing and eating on the go. Previous to this we've been doing specific meal
times and no snacks in between, which, aside from being very controlling, is perhaps not suiting his physicality.
My husband will be very pleased to being 'loved up'! I think he probably often feels under-appreciated as so much focus is on the kids
and they take every bit of energy out of us both. He's pretty low down on the food chain, probably unfairly. Family balance is not something
that comes very naturally to me. He does think I have crazy ideas, but is amazingly open-minded about it considering.
Thanks again,
Suzie
To: [email protected]
From: plaidpanties666@...
Date: Tue, 12 Jul 2011 17:27:45 +0000
Subject: [unschoolingbasics] Re: Hello
"Suzie" <suzepetch@...> wrote:
He may need the help of a routine to settle down. That could be a sort of traditional bath-read-snuggle routine, or it could involve putting in a movie that mom and dad can doze through. It could even involve an hour or more of very active play to work out the last of the wiggles before bed. Don't be afraid to experiment a little and find out what helps your guys settle down. At the same time, it can help to shift the focus to "rest" instead of "sleep" - which may mean a partner who needs to get up early moves to another bed for awhile so he can get the sleep he needs.
Some of it is that, but some is that little kids need lots of fast energy *and* lots of protein *and* lots of fat. Ice cream is the perfect food from that perspective. Look for other ways to offer sweet, rich, dense foods: cookies, cakes, pies, muffins, waffles, custards. Make your own as much as you can - that lets you offer good quality proteins and fats *and* feel better about what your kids are eating. It's also important that foods be easy, attractive and convenient to busy little people. Given the option of waiting ten minutes for something to be cooked and eating something Right Now, its totally natural for a child to choose the immediate option.
Love him up. Let him know often and sincerely that you appreciate all he does for you and the kids. Let him know he's wanted, respected and sexy. Find lots of little ways to connect with him during the day, so he's not dependent on that hour at "bedtime" to get all his emotional needs met - send him emails or text messages if you can, blow him kisses across children's heads and ambush him in the bathroom now and then. The more he feels important and special, the more easily he'll relax into these crazy changes you're trying to make.
---Meredith
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
For some time I have been referring to 'rest' rather than 'sleep', as the other problem is that he is actually afraid of falling asleep -
the sensation of slipping into the unconscious.
I think the food ideas are great. I wonder whether I have been too worried about healthy food and what he's not eating, rather than
planning for how unbelievably active he is. He must burn up a huge amount of calories as he NEVER stops moving, not even in his sleep!
I will go the smorgasbord option with high calorie stuff and see if he is happier grazing and eating on the go. Previous to this we've been doing specific meal
times and no snacks in between, which, aside from being very controlling, is perhaps not suiting his physicality.
My husband will be very pleased to being 'loved up'! I think he probably often feels under-appreciated as so much focus is on the kids
and they take every bit of energy out of us both. He's pretty low down on the food chain, probably unfairly. Family balance is not something
that comes very naturally to me. He does think I have crazy ideas, but is amazingly open-minded about it considering.
Thanks again,
Suzie
To: [email protected]
From: plaidpanties666@...
Date: Tue, 12 Jul 2011 17:27:45 +0000
Subject: [unschoolingbasics] Re: Hello
"Suzie" <suzepetch@...> wrote:
>> On the sleep thing; he just seems really tired! He comes up to bed with us when we do, as we all sleep in the same bed, but he still wants to jump around and not go to sleep even though he is really exhausted.***************
He may need the help of a routine to settle down. That could be a sort of traditional bath-read-snuggle routine, or it could involve putting in a movie that mom and dad can doze through. It could even involve an hour or more of very active play to work out the last of the wiggles before bed. Don't be afraid to experiment a little and find out what helps your guys settle down. At the same time, it can help to shift the focus to "rest" instead of "sleep" - which may mean a partner who needs to get up early moves to another bed for awhile so he can get the sleep he needs.
>>I would think this is because it's been restricted and he's now exploring. Is it?***************
Some of it is that, but some is that little kids need lots of fast energy *and* lots of protein *and* lots of fat. Ice cream is the perfect food from that perspective. Look for other ways to offer sweet, rich, dense foods: cookies, cakes, pies, muffins, waffles, custards. Make your own as much as you can - that lets you offer good quality proteins and fats *and* feel better about what your kids are eating. It's also important that foods be easy, attractive and convenient to busy little people. Given the option of waiting ten minutes for something to be cooked and eating something Right Now, its totally natural for a child to choose the immediate option.
> Also my husband is finding it really hard with the kids not going to bed before us, so not sure how to deal with that...***************
Love him up. Let him know often and sincerely that you appreciate all he does for you and the kids. Let him know he's wanted, respected and sexy. Find lots of little ways to connect with him during the day, so he's not dependent on that hour at "bedtime" to get all his emotional needs met - send him emails or text messages if you can, blow him kisses across children's heads and ambush him in the bathroom now and then. The more he feels important and special, the more easily he'll relax into these crazy changes you're trying to make.
---Meredith
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]