What is "well rounded" anyway?
April M
This is interesting that this has come up. I recently was part of an on-line
conversation on a non-unschooling homeschool list about unschooling. It was
brought up because of an article I was part of in the local paper about
unschooling. The conversation was very respectful which isn't always the
case on non-unschooling lists...anyway, being "well rounded" was brought up
and discussed. It's the first time I've run into that concern in regards to
unschooling. The concern expressed was basically "if I don't force my kids
to learn certain things, they will not be 'well rounded'" We discussed the
definition of 'well rounded' which of course, had different meanings to
different people so defining our meanings cleared up a lot. It seems to me
that in this day and age it is impossible to know 'a little about
everything' (one of the definitions that was used) and being exposed to
different things, places, people, etc is going to be limited to some degree
by one's income, location, interests, etc. regardless of how one is
educated. I'm not particularly worried about my kids being 'well rounded'.
My kids have areas of interest they pursue...but because of friends, my own
interests, activities they're involved in, they become exposed to things
they wouldn't on their own. They are more 'well rounded' than some, less
than others....but what seems right for us at this time. So though I'm not
worried about it, I find it an interesting topic of conversation and
thought.
~April
Mom to Kate-18, Lisa-15, Karl-13, & Ben-9.
*REACH Homeschool Group, an inclusive group meeting throughout Oakland
County.. http://www.homeschoolingonashoestring.com/REACH_home.html
*Michigan Youth Theater...Acting On Our Dreams...
<http://www.michiganyouththeater.org/>
"What one knows is, in youth, of little moment; they know enough who know
how to learn."
Henry Brooks Adams (1838-1918)
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
conversation on a non-unschooling homeschool list about unschooling. It was
brought up because of an article I was part of in the local paper about
unschooling. The conversation was very respectful which isn't always the
case on non-unschooling lists...anyway, being "well rounded" was brought up
and discussed. It's the first time I've run into that concern in regards to
unschooling. The concern expressed was basically "if I don't force my kids
to learn certain things, they will not be 'well rounded'" We discussed the
definition of 'well rounded' which of course, had different meanings to
different people so defining our meanings cleared up a lot. It seems to me
that in this day and age it is impossible to know 'a little about
everything' (one of the definitions that was used) and being exposed to
different things, places, people, etc is going to be limited to some degree
by one's income, location, interests, etc. regardless of how one is
educated. I'm not particularly worried about my kids being 'well rounded'.
My kids have areas of interest they pursue...but because of friends, my own
interests, activities they're involved in, they become exposed to things
they wouldn't on their own. They are more 'well rounded' than some, less
than others....but what seems right for us at this time. So though I'm not
worried about it, I find it an interesting topic of conversation and
thought.
~April
Mom to Kate-18, Lisa-15, Karl-13, & Ben-9.
*REACH Homeschool Group, an inclusive group meeting throughout Oakland
County.. http://www.homeschoolingonashoestring.com/REACH_home.html
*Michigan Youth Theater...Acting On Our Dreams...
<http://www.michiganyouththeater.org/>
"What one knows is, in youth, of little moment; they know enough who know
how to learn."
Henry Brooks Adams (1838-1918)
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Debbie
I have been wondering something along these lines too.
Specifically, how would you veteran unschoolers handle a child who, when given total freedom to direct their own learning, will choose to plop down in front of the television set or their Gameboy every day, rather than go outdoors to inspect nature, or read a book, or do a baking or science project, or do any physical activity, etc.? I realize television can be educational, but what if that was all the child ever wanted to do? OK, I can see an obvious answer - get rid of the television! LOL, but seriously, even if there is no TV in your home, how would you handle a child who is lazy about anything to do with education, such as writing or reading something now and then, etc.?
Debbie
The concern expressed was basically "if I don't force my kids
to learn certain things, they will not be 'well rounded'"
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Specifically, how would you veteran unschoolers handle a child who, when given total freedom to direct their own learning, will choose to plop down in front of the television set or their Gameboy every day, rather than go outdoors to inspect nature, or read a book, or do a baking or science project, or do any physical activity, etc.? I realize television can be educational, but what if that was all the child ever wanted to do? OK, I can see an obvious answer - get rid of the television! LOL, but seriously, even if there is no TV in your home, how would you handle a child who is lazy about anything to do with education, such as writing or reading something now and then, etc.?
Debbie
The concern expressed was basically "if I don't force my kids
to learn certain things, they will not be 'well rounded'"
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Fetteroll
on 2/3/05 10:46 AM, Debbie at onehundredacrewood@... wrote:
How would you handle a child who spent all day outdoors and never read a
book?
How would you handle a child who spent all day reading and never watched TV?
Those sound like ridiculous questions but you can help yourself see real
learning by first seeing that TV and GameBoy and nature and books are all
legitimate ways of exploring the world.
And then second get involved with your child. Find out what he loves about
what he's doing.
And make sure he's happy. Is he choosing TV and GameBoy because the other
options aren't as engaging *to him*? Is there something else in his life and
TV and GameBoya are an escape. Taking away the TV and GameBoy doesn't solve
why it's happening. That will still be there. (And add stress to both your
lives on top of it.)
And then make sure he has opportunities that *he* likes just as well as TV
and GameBoy available regularly. It's your responsiblity to strew
opportunites not your responsibility to make him try them! ;-) But if your
strewing is falling flat it might be that you're too focused on things that
are "good for him" and not as atuned to what he loves as you could be. Or it
could be that he's going through a period of needed to do exactly what he's
doing.
If you focus on the negative of getting him to stop doing what he's doing,
he'll sense that and cling to it because it will feel like it's on the verge
of becoming limited or forbidden and he'll need to get as much as possible.
If you focus on the positive of strewing his life with things he enjoys, the
calmer he'll be about leaving the TV and GameBoy.
Gaming magazines? Game reviews (and perhaps writing them) at Amazon?
Conventions? Selling old games on eBay? Trivia games on the internet?
Checklists and episode descriptions of his favorite TV shows.
One thing that helped my daughter was getting TiVo. I think it's easy to
feel a slave to the programming schedule. Kids can feel like they have to be
there to watch or they'll miss something. TiVo can record favorite shows on
its hard drive automatically (you just key in the name of the show and get a
"Season Pass" to it -- you don't need to know when it's on or what channel).
(The hard drives hold 30-100 or so hours of programs but you can transfer
them to video tape if he likes watching the same episodes again.) That way
the shows can be available whenever a child feels like watching rather than
only when the programmers decide to put it on.
Joyce
> Specifically, how would you veteran unschoolers handle a child who, when givenHow old is he? And how long has "every day" been going on?
> total freedom to direct their own learning, will choose to plop down in front
> of the television set or their Gameboy every day, rather than go outdoors to
> inspect nature, or read a book, or do a baking or science project, or do any
> physical activity, etc.?
How would you handle a child who spent all day outdoors and never read a
book?
How would you handle a child who spent all day reading and never watched TV?
Those sound like ridiculous questions but you can help yourself see real
learning by first seeing that TV and GameBoy and nature and books are all
legitimate ways of exploring the world.
And then second get involved with your child. Find out what he loves about
what he's doing.
And make sure he's happy. Is he choosing TV and GameBoy because the other
options aren't as engaging *to him*? Is there something else in his life and
TV and GameBoya are an escape. Taking away the TV and GameBoy doesn't solve
why it's happening. That will still be there. (And add stress to both your
lives on top of it.)
And then make sure he has opportunities that *he* likes just as well as TV
and GameBoy available regularly. It's your responsiblity to strew
opportunites not your responsibility to make him try them! ;-) But if your
strewing is falling flat it might be that you're too focused on things that
are "good for him" and not as atuned to what he loves as you could be. Or it
could be that he's going through a period of needed to do exactly what he's
doing.
If you focus on the negative of getting him to stop doing what he's doing,
he'll sense that and cling to it because it will feel like it's on the verge
of becoming limited or forbidden and he'll need to get as much as possible.
If you focus on the positive of strewing his life with things he enjoys, the
calmer he'll be about leaving the TV and GameBoy.
Gaming magazines? Game reviews (and perhaps writing them) at Amazon?
Conventions? Selling old games on eBay? Trivia games on the internet?
Checklists and episode descriptions of his favorite TV shows.
One thing that helped my daughter was getting TiVo. I think it's easy to
feel a slave to the programming schedule. Kids can feel like they have to be
there to watch or they'll miss something. TiVo can record favorite shows on
its hard drive automatically (you just key in the name of the show and get a
"Season Pass" to it -- you don't need to know when it's on or what channel).
(The hard drives hold 30-100 or so hours of programs but you can transfer
them to video tape if he likes watching the same episodes again.) That way
the shows can be available whenever a child feels like watching rather than
only when the programmers decide to put it on.
Joyce
Robyn Coburn
<<<<<< Specifically, how would you veteran unschoolers handle a child who,
when given total freedom to direct their own learning, will choose to plop
down in front of the television set or their Gameboy every day, rather than
go outdoors to inspect nature, or read a book, or do a baking or science
project, or do any physical activity, etc.? >>>>>
I'd assume that's what the child wanted and needed that day.
I'd not hassle them with expressed judgments (even if I felt any) about
other activities being better, which will only enhance the child's desire
for the tv and gameboys, and could make the child feel bad about liking
these things. Although I do, as others have suggested, look around at what
else is going on and try to keep plenty of other stuff available.
Is the kid still deschooling? I ask this because you use the possibly
schooly phrase "science project". Last week Jayn (5) and I created a bunch
of different herbal decoctions. She had been experimenting with mixing
different spices and herbs in flour to "make pies", and we both got
interested in the aromas. I suggested making some perfume using some alcohol
and then Jayn wanted to keep making more and more. So it kinda turned into a
big project of putting various combinations - all her devising - into
different liquids. Now we have some amazing flavored honey, fragrant dish
soap, strongly flavored vinegar, alcohol rub, and aromatic massage oil.
Water just went icky - as I warned Jayn that it probably would.
None of this was in the nature of a "school project" or with the idea that
she "should" learn some science (how could she not?), but just because it
was fun, and because initially *I* got excited about the lovely fragrance
she was creating with her mixtures and wanted to preserve it somehow.
Jayn watches a varying amount of tv or dvd's every day. Usually she watches
in conjunction with playing other games. She also uses tv as a segue into
her day in the morning, and late at night when I am just too pooped to play
on. She doesn't seem to care for Gameboy - I think she prefers better
graphics than that tiny screen can render. She plays various computer games,
and will request dh or I to play particular X-box games for her, while she
watches avidly and comments and makes suggestions. I usually watch her shows
with her or nearby, especially attentive if they are new to me.
OTOH at this moment she is in the bedroom watching a dvd alone. It will only
be a few more minutes before she calls to me to join her I'm sure. Today my
plans include cleaning out the fridge and general tidying. Jayn wants to hit
the park later on, and invite our neighbor to play for a while. I expect
there will be plenty of tv/dvd in the background, and some reading later on.
I have taken to reading to Jayn while she is in her tub, if she wants me to.
Now how to get a tv into the bathroom......;)
<<<<I realize television can be educational, but what if that was all the
child ever wanted to do? OK, I can see an obvious answer - get rid of the
television!>>>>>
I CAN see that you are joking, however this is often (not here but in other
places) put forward as a serious and genuine answer. In case anyone gets the
idea that this is a good idea, I would discourage anyone to do this in this
situation, because I feel very strongly that the child could not help but
see it as punitive. What next? The Gameboy goes if it is played "too much"?
Perhaps the child would immediately learn the usefulness of subterfuge and a
need to keep their interests hidden from Mom in case that was the next thing
removed.
<<<< LOL, but seriously, even if there is no TV in your home, how would you
handle a child who is lazy about anything to do with education, such as
writing or reading something now and then, etc.? >>>>
I try not to use this kind of damning negative language about my child -
even in my own mind. I don't try to handle *her*, but only my own reactions
and language. It gets easier, or at least I have found it so, the more I
practice acceptance of where she is at. There it is really - a conscious
choice to a practice acceptance and use positive (or neutral) words.
While ever you keep dividing real life into sanctioned educational and
"other than", you will find it tough to get to Unschooling. While ever you
keep the idea that "laziness", rather than say "lack of interest at the
moment" or "prefers other activities", as your expressed view of your child
you will find it harder to get to Unschooling with joy.
Robyn L. Coburn
The concern expressed was basically "if I don't force my kids
to learn certain things, they will not be 'well rounded'"
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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when given total freedom to direct their own learning, will choose to plop
down in front of the television set or their Gameboy every day, rather than
go outdoors to inspect nature, or read a book, or do a baking or science
project, or do any physical activity, etc.? >>>>>
I'd assume that's what the child wanted and needed that day.
I'd not hassle them with expressed judgments (even if I felt any) about
other activities being better, which will only enhance the child's desire
for the tv and gameboys, and could make the child feel bad about liking
these things. Although I do, as others have suggested, look around at what
else is going on and try to keep plenty of other stuff available.
Is the kid still deschooling? I ask this because you use the possibly
schooly phrase "science project". Last week Jayn (5) and I created a bunch
of different herbal decoctions. She had been experimenting with mixing
different spices and herbs in flour to "make pies", and we both got
interested in the aromas. I suggested making some perfume using some alcohol
and then Jayn wanted to keep making more and more. So it kinda turned into a
big project of putting various combinations - all her devising - into
different liquids. Now we have some amazing flavored honey, fragrant dish
soap, strongly flavored vinegar, alcohol rub, and aromatic massage oil.
Water just went icky - as I warned Jayn that it probably would.
None of this was in the nature of a "school project" or with the idea that
she "should" learn some science (how could she not?), but just because it
was fun, and because initially *I* got excited about the lovely fragrance
she was creating with her mixtures and wanted to preserve it somehow.
Jayn watches a varying amount of tv or dvd's every day. Usually she watches
in conjunction with playing other games. She also uses tv as a segue into
her day in the morning, and late at night when I am just too pooped to play
on. She doesn't seem to care for Gameboy - I think she prefers better
graphics than that tiny screen can render. She plays various computer games,
and will request dh or I to play particular X-box games for her, while she
watches avidly and comments and makes suggestions. I usually watch her shows
with her or nearby, especially attentive if they are new to me.
OTOH at this moment she is in the bedroom watching a dvd alone. It will only
be a few more minutes before she calls to me to join her I'm sure. Today my
plans include cleaning out the fridge and general tidying. Jayn wants to hit
the park later on, and invite our neighbor to play for a while. I expect
there will be plenty of tv/dvd in the background, and some reading later on.
I have taken to reading to Jayn while she is in her tub, if she wants me to.
Now how to get a tv into the bathroom......;)
<<<<I realize television can be educational, but what if that was all the
child ever wanted to do? OK, I can see an obvious answer - get rid of the
television!>>>>>
I CAN see that you are joking, however this is often (not here but in other
places) put forward as a serious and genuine answer. In case anyone gets the
idea that this is a good idea, I would discourage anyone to do this in this
situation, because I feel very strongly that the child could not help but
see it as punitive. What next? The Gameboy goes if it is played "too much"?
Perhaps the child would immediately learn the usefulness of subterfuge and a
need to keep their interests hidden from Mom in case that was the next thing
removed.
<<<< LOL, but seriously, even if there is no TV in your home, how would you
handle a child who is lazy about anything to do with education, such as
writing or reading something now and then, etc.? >>>>
I try not to use this kind of damning negative language about my child -
even in my own mind. I don't try to handle *her*, but only my own reactions
and language. It gets easier, or at least I have found it so, the more I
practice acceptance of where she is at. There it is really - a conscious
choice to a practice acceptance and use positive (or neutral) words.
While ever you keep dividing real life into sanctioned educational and
"other than", you will find it tough to get to Unschooling. While ever you
keep the idea that "laziness", rather than say "lack of interest at the
moment" or "prefers other activities", as your expressed view of your child
you will find it harder to get to Unschooling with joy.
Robyn L. Coburn
The concern expressed was basically "if I don't force my kids
to learn certain things, they will not be 'well rounded'"
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Yahoo! Groups Links
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