Other's quizzing my child
Loretta
I'm feeling so bummed today. My daughter came home from a playdate and the first thing she told me in the car was that her friend's Father (her friend goes to private school), came home and told my daughter that he was going to give her a problem. Before she had a chance to ask him a question, he said what's 17 minus 11? My daughter was caught so much off guard, it flustered her. She was embarrassed and put on the spot. He continued by giving her another math word problem and then asked his daughter (a year younger), who knew the answer.
I don't understand why parents of institutionalized schooled children feel the need to quiz my child, because she is home educated. Has anyone else experienced this?
Signed,
Flustered in Simi
I don't understand why parents of institutionalized schooled children feel the need to quiz my child, because she is home educated. Has anyone else experienced this?
Signed,
Flustered in Simi
Amanda Daly
This happens to my kids all the time! It used to make me really mad and while it is still frustrating what has ended up happening is my kids choose not to hang out with these kinds of families and my kids have gotten really good at asking questions back like "don't you know how to use a calculator?"
I think the funniest thing a schooled child said to my kids was that they needed to go to school so they could "learn about their education" !!!! I laughed so hard and luckily was there and told the other kids that I do not tell them how awful school is for kids and would appreciate it if they would not bother mine about not having to go to school. Kids repeat what their parents say :)
I think the funniest thing a schooled child said to my kids was that they needed to go to school so they could "learn about their education" !!!! I laughed so hard and luckily was there and told the other kids that I do not tell them how awful school is for kids and would appreciate it if they would not bother mine about not having to go to school. Kids repeat what their parents say :)
On Oct 5, 2011, at 6:52 AM, Loretta wrote:
> I'm feeling so bummed today. My daughter came home from a playdate and the first thing she told me in the car was that her friend's Father (her friend goes to private school), came home and told my daughter that he was going to give her a problem. Before she had a chance to ask him a question, he said what's 17 minus 11? My daughter was caught so much off guard, it flustered her. She was embarrassed and put on the spot. He continued by giving her another math word problem and then asked his daughter (a year younger), who knew the answer.
> I don't understand why parents of institutionalized schooled children feel the need to quiz my child, because she is home educated. Has anyone else experienced this?
> Signed,
> Flustered in Simi
>
>
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
It happens all the time to hsers.
I would give my child an answer to use when adults and others are being rude.
"I don't want to play that game."
Rude person persists?
"I would rather you talk to my Mom about that."
Nance
I would give my child an answer to use when adults and others are being rude.
"I don't want to play that game."
Rude person persists?
"I would rather you talk to my Mom about that."
Nance
--- In [email protected], "Loretta" <tinamariesmom@...> wrote:
>
> I'm feeling so bummed today. My daughter came home from a playdate and the first thing she told me in the car was that her friend's Father (her friend goes to private school), came home and told my daughter that he was going to give her a problem. Before she had a chance to ask him a question, he said what's 17 minus 11? My daughter was caught so much off guard, it flustered her. She was embarrassed and put on the spot. He continued by giving her another math word problem and then asked his daughter (a year younger), who knew the answer.
> I don't understand why parents of institutionalized schooled children feel the need to quiz my child, because she is home educated. Has anyone else experienced this?
> Signed,
> Flustered in Simi
>
Jen R
I have this problem with family members and a close family friend. No matter
what I say, they keep at it :-/
--
Jenny
Mom to DS (11), DD (9) DD (6)
what I say, they keep at it :-/
--
Jenny
Mom to DS (11), DD (9) DD (6)
On Wed, Oct 5, 2011 at 6:52 AM, Loretta <tinamariesmom@...> wrote:
> **
>
>
> I'm feeling so bummed today. My daughter came home from a playdate and the
> first thing she told me in the car was that her friend's Father (her friend
> goes to private school), came home and told my daughter that he was going to
> give her a problem. Before she had a chance to ask him a question, he said
> what's 17 minus 11? My daughter was caught so much off guard, it flustered
> her. She was embarrassed and put on the spot. He continued by giving her
> another math word problem and then asked his daughter (a year younger), who
> knew the answer.
> I don't understand why parents of institutionalized schooled children feel
> the need to quiz my child, because she is home educated. Has anyone else
> experienced this?
> Signed,
> Flustered in Simi
>
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
tookute2eat
That's hard:( My daughter finally decided that her only and best friend and her mother were toxic relationships, after 4 years. They would quiz her even long distance in emails while they were out of state for the winter, put her on the spot. Pressure her until she came home crying most times. I even spoke to the mother and she would not let up. Hannah had to make the decision to stop being friends. Broke her heart and mine to see her in so much pain:( The emails were relentless in the end. Telling her things like they don't want to see her flipping burgers for the rest of her life and that she needed to catch up on her schooling so she could get a job! I haven't told my dad that we unschool and I don't even want to go there. I was just thinking of when she turns 18, in 3 yrs., he's gonna ask about her diploma. UGH! Oh well. Guess I'll cross that bridge when I get to it. What's the worse that could happen?
We joined this group and another unschooling group on fb so Hannah could meet like-minded friends. She is now at the point where she knows what kind of friend she wants and is focusing on manifesting that;) She's such a strong and independant young woman, making the choice to end her relationship with her friend. I don't think she would have been able to do that if she had experienced the onslaught of constant peer pressure to fit in in public institutions. I love my daughter dearly and love to watch her blossom into this stable-minded individual;)
Connie
We joined this group and another unschooling group on fb so Hannah could meet like-minded friends. She is now at the point where she knows what kind of friend she wants and is focusing on manifesting that;) She's such a strong and independant young woman, making the choice to end her relationship with her friend. I don't think she would have been able to do that if she had experienced the onslaught of constant peer pressure to fit in in public institutions. I love my daughter dearly and love to watch her blossom into this stable-minded individual;)
Connie
--- In [email protected], "Loretta" <tinamariesmom@...> wrote:
>
> I'm feeling so bummed today. My daughter came home from a playdate and the first thing she told me in the car was that her friend's Father (her friend goes to private school), came home and told my daughter that he was going to give her a problem. Before she had a chance to ask him a question, he said what's 17 minus 11? My daughter was caught so much off guard, it flustered her. She was embarrassed and put on the spot. He continued by giving her another math word problem and then asked his daughter (a year younger), who knew the answer.
> I don't understand why parents of institutionalized schooled children feel the need to quiz my child, because she is home educated. Has anyone else experienced this?
> Signed,
> Flustered in Simi
>
Denise Jordan
Well my sister is a public school teacher and she told my daughter she would have more friends if she went to school. She is the one that wants to go to school just for socializing so this makes it even harder for me when my sister makes dumb remarks to my kids. Are there any of you in the Pensacola [FL, USA] area? Looking for unschoolers with kids around 11. son 11, daughter 9 thanks
Sacha Davis
yeah, my mom does this and it drives me nuts. I've asked her to stop
teaching him, and I've coached him that he can ask her to stop if he
wants. It comes from her anxiety around our unschooling approach and
feeling that if we're not going to teach, she'll sneak it in as often as
she can. It's her problem so I work hard to make sure my son doesn't
internalize it. And that man who has to find a way to put down a
kid...well, that's HIS problem. That kind of behavior makes me think he
lack confidence about his own choices.
S.
teaching him, and I've coached him that he can ask her to stop if he
wants. It comes from her anxiety around our unschooling approach and
feeling that if we're not going to teach, she'll sneak it in as often as
she can. It's her problem so I work hard to make sure my son doesn't
internalize it. And that man who has to find a way to put down a
kid...well, that's HIS problem. That kind of behavior makes me think he
lack confidence about his own choices.
S.
> I have this problem with family members and a close family friend. No
> matter
> what I say, they keep at it :-/
>
> --
> Jenny
> Mom to DS (11), DD (9) DD (6)
>
>
>
> On Wed, Oct 5, 2011 at 6:52 AM, Loretta <tinamariesmom@...> wrote:
>
>> **
>>
>>
>> I'm feeling so bummed today. My daughter came home from a playdate and
>> the
>> first thing she told me in the car was that her friend's Father (her
>> friend
>> goes to private school), came home and told my daughter that he was
>> going to
>> give her a problem. Before she had a chance to ask him a question, he
>> said
>> what's 17 minus 11? My daughter was caught so much off guard, it
>> flustered
>> her. She was embarrassed and put on the spot. He continued by giving her
>> another math word problem and then asked his daughter (a year younger),
>> who
>> knew the answer.
>> I don't understand why parents of institutionalized schooled children
>> feel
>> the need to quiz my child, because she is home educated. Has anyone else
>> experienced this?
>> Signed,
>> Flustered in Simi
>>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
Tova
It's not about quantity, but quality when it comes to friends!
My daughter goes to the school recess 1+ a week down the street from us to make other friends in addition to her homeschooled friends. I like the idea of taking the good parts of school and leaving the rest.
My daughter goes to the school recess 1+ a week down the street from us to make other friends in addition to her homeschooled friends. I like the idea of taking the good parts of school and leaving the rest.
--- On Wed, 10/5/11, Denise Jordan <denisejordan4@...> wrote:
From: Denise Jordan <denisejordan4@...>
Subject: RE: [unschoolingbasics] Other's quizzing my child
To: "unschooling" <[email protected]>
Date: Wednesday, October 5, 2011, 1:23 PM
Well my sister is a public school teacher and she told my daughter she would have more friends if she went to school. She is the one that wants to go to school just for socializing so this makes it even harder for me when my sister makes dumb remarks to my kids. Are there any of you in the Pensacola [FL, USA] area? Looking for unschoolers with kids around 11. son 11, daughter 9 thanks
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
mamabearvictoria
I appreciate your post, Sumi. This is coming up in several areas for us too.
My own mother quizzes the kids on spelling and math. As a 2nd year unschooler, my kids get questioned by my chiropractor about what they are learning whenever we go in for appts. Then she interrogates me - "Isn't she learning about the missions this year? She IS in fourth grade and YOU KNOW that is a state standard."
I'm waiting to finally be more comfortable with these aggressive types and telling them to mind their own business.
Any one have empowering comebacks that aren't 'suspicion' arousing? Something to tell them to back off? Our preference is to not be defensive. After all there is nothing to defend! ARgh!
Victoria
My own mother quizzes the kids on spelling and math. As a 2nd year unschooler, my kids get questioned by my chiropractor about what they are learning whenever we go in for appts. Then she interrogates me - "Isn't she learning about the missions this year? She IS in fourth grade and YOU KNOW that is a state standard."
I'm waiting to finally be more comfortable with these aggressive types and telling them to mind their own business.
Any one have empowering comebacks that aren't 'suspicion' arousing? Something to tell them to back off? Our preference is to not be defensive. After all there is nothing to defend! ARgh!
Victoria
--- In [email protected], "Loretta" <tinamariesmom@...> wrote:
>
> I'm feeling so bummed today. My daughter came home from a playdate and the first thing she told me in the car was that her friend's Father (her friend goes to private school), came home and told my daughter that he was going to give her a problem. Before she had a chance to ask him a question, he said what's 17 minus 11? My daughter was caught so much off guard, it flustered her. She was embarrassed and put on the spot. He continued by giving her another math word problem and then asked his daughter (a year younger), who knew the answer.
> I don't understand why parents of institutionalized schooled children feel the need to quiz my child, because she is home educated. Has anyone else experienced this?
> Signed,
> Flustered in Simi
>
Gen
One possible comeback to the chiropractor: "Well, you went to fourth grade so why don't you tell me about the missions?"
And, odds are s/he remembers nothing about them just like 99.9 percent of the rest of us.
So after the hemming and hawing stops, you have made a point that the "standard" might not be so crucial after all.
And, odds are s/he remembers nothing about them just like 99.9 percent of the rest of us.
So after the hemming and hawing stops, you have made a point that the "standard" might not be so crucial after all.
Kelly Lovejoy
I'd say you weren't convincing enough or didn't really mean it.
What if you said that they could no longer see the children if they quiz them again?
I told family that my children aren't performing monkeys. If they could not stop treating them as if they were performing monkeys, I would keep the children from visiting. When they asked why we didn't visit, I told them why.
I have that power, and I am not afraid to use it.
~Kelly
Kelly Lovejoy
"There is no single effort more radical in its potential for saving the world than a transformation of the way we raise our children." Marianne Williamson
-----Original Message-----
From: Jen R <chaoticrapture@...>
I have this problem with family members and a close family friend. No matter
what I say, they keep at it :-/
--
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
What if you said that they could no longer see the children if they quiz them again?
I told family that my children aren't performing monkeys. If they could not stop treating them as if they were performing monkeys, I would keep the children from visiting. When they asked why we didn't visit, I told them why.
I have that power, and I am not afraid to use it.
~Kelly
Kelly Lovejoy
"There is no single effort more radical in its potential for saving the world than a transformation of the way we raise our children." Marianne Williamson
-----Original Message-----
From: Jen R <chaoticrapture@...>
I have this problem with family members and a close family friend. No matter
what I say, they keep at it :-/
--
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Kelly Lovejoy
I would ask her whether she thought she did a good job or a bad job raising me.
If she thinks she did a GOOD job, she needs to back off, trust me, and let me parent, knowing that I had a good role model. *I* am now the parent.
If she thinks she did a BAD job, then she DEFINITELY needs to back off and let me parent so that we don't pass on that bad parenting model.
Should she choose to continue to undermine my decisions/choices, then I can and will keep the children from her. My children's welfare comes before her---she should NOT interfere.
~Kelly
Kelly Lovejoy
"There is no single effort more radical in its potential for saving the world than a transformation of the way we raise our children." Marianne Williamson
-----Original Message-----
From: Sacha Davis <sacha@...>
yeah, my mom does this and it drives me nuts. I've asked her to stop
teaching him, and I've coached him that he can ask her to stop if he
wants. It comes from her anxiety around our unschooling approach and
feeling that if we're not going to teach, she'll sneak it in as often as
she can. It's her problem so I work hard to make sure my son doesn't
internalize it. And that man who has to find a way to put down a
kid...well, that's HIS problem. That kind of behavior makes me think he
lack confidence about his own choices.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
If she thinks she did a GOOD job, she needs to back off, trust me, and let me parent, knowing that I had a good role model. *I* am now the parent.
If she thinks she did a BAD job, then she DEFINITELY needs to back off and let me parent so that we don't pass on that bad parenting model.
Should she choose to continue to undermine my decisions/choices, then I can and will keep the children from her. My children's welfare comes before her---she should NOT interfere.
~Kelly
Kelly Lovejoy
"There is no single effort more radical in its potential for saving the world than a transformation of the way we raise our children." Marianne Williamson
-----Original Message-----
From: Sacha Davis <sacha@...>
yeah, my mom does this and it drives me nuts. I've asked her to stop
teaching him, and I've coached him that he can ask her to stop if he
wants. It comes from her anxiety around our unschooling approach and
feeling that if we're not going to teach, she'll sneak it in as often as
she can. It's her problem so I work hard to make sure my son doesn't
internalize it. And that man who has to find a way to put down a
kid...well, that's HIS problem. That kind of behavior makes me think he
lack confidence about his own choices.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Kelly Lovejoy
-----Original Message-----
From: tookute2eat <tookute2eat@...>
Telling her things like they don't want to see her
flipping burgers for the rest of her life and that she needed to catch up on her
schooling so she could get a job! I haven't told my dad that we unschool and I
don't even want to go there.
-=-=-=-=-=-
Many unschoolers have jobs way before schooled kids. Our kids have the time to work. Schooled kids do not.
-=-=-=-=-=-
I was just thinking of when she turns 18, in 3
yrs., he's gonna ask about her diploma. UGH! Oh well. Guess I'll cross that
bridge when I get to it. What's the worse that could happen?
-=-=-=-=-
A diploma is a piece of paper. Go here to order your favorite diploma. www.homeschooldiploma.com Seriously. It's just as valuable as any brickandmortar school's diploma.
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
We joined this group and another unschooling group on fb so Hannah could meet
like-minded friends. She is now at the point where she knows what kind of friend
she wants and is focusing on manifesting that;)
-=-=-=-=-
Quit "manifesting" and go out and meet like-minded people. Find other hobbyists. Go to an unschooling conference or gathering near you. If there isn't one near you, go to the next one coming up---whereever it is in the country. Don't "manifest:" make it happen.
~Kelly
Kelly Lovejoy
"There is no single effort more radical in its potential for saving the world than a transformation of the way we raise our children." Marianne Williamson
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
From: tookute2eat <tookute2eat@...>
Telling her things like they don't want to see her
flipping burgers for the rest of her life and that she needed to catch up on her
schooling so she could get a job! I haven't told my dad that we unschool and I
don't even want to go there.
-=-=-=-=-=-
Many unschoolers have jobs way before schooled kids. Our kids have the time to work. Schooled kids do not.
-=-=-=-=-=-
I was just thinking of when she turns 18, in 3
yrs., he's gonna ask about her diploma. UGH! Oh well. Guess I'll cross that
bridge when I get to it. What's the worse that could happen?
-=-=-=-=-
A diploma is a piece of paper. Go here to order your favorite diploma. www.homeschooldiploma.com Seriously. It's just as valuable as any brickandmortar school's diploma.
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
We joined this group and another unschooling group on fb so Hannah could meet
like-minded friends. She is now at the point where she knows what kind of friend
she wants and is focusing on manifesting that;)
-=-=-=-=-
Quit "manifesting" and go out and meet like-minded people. Find other hobbyists. Go to an unschooling conference or gathering near you. If there isn't one near you, go to the next one coming up---whereever it is in the country. Don't "manifest:" make it happen.
~Kelly
Kelly Lovejoy
"There is no single effort more radical in its potential for saving the world than a transformation of the way we raise our children." Marianne Williamson
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Kelly Lovejoy
Perfect!
~Kelly
Kelly Lovejoy
"There is no single effort more radical in its potential for saving the world than a transformation of the way we raise our children." Marianne Williamson
-----Original Message-----
From: Gen <genealogy92109@...>
One possible comeback to the chiropractor: "Well, you went to fourth grade so
why don't you tell me about the missions?"
And, odds are s/he remembers nothing about them just like 99.9 percent of the
rest of us.
So after the hemming and hawing stops, you have made a point that the "standard"
might not be so crucial after all.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
~Kelly
Kelly Lovejoy
"There is no single effort more radical in its potential for saving the world than a transformation of the way we raise our children." Marianne Williamson
-----Original Message-----
From: Gen <genealogy92109@...>
One possible comeback to the chiropractor: "Well, you went to fourth grade so
why don't you tell me about the missions?"
And, odds are s/he remembers nothing about them just like 99.9 percent of the
rest of us.
So after the hemming and hawing stops, you have made a point that the "standard"
might not be so crucial after all.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
melissa maranda
What missions???
Melissa Maranda, MA
Licensed Mental Health Counselor
Substance Abuse Specialist
Basic NLP Certified
http://www.facebook.com/mmcounseling
To: [email protected]
From: kbcdlovejo@...
Date: Thu, 6 Oct 2011 17:22:14 -0400
Subject: Re: [unschoolingbasics] Re: Other's quizzing my child
Perfect!
~Kelly
Kelly Lovejoy
"There is no single effort more radical in its potential for saving the world than a transformation of the way we raise our children." Marianne Williamson
-----Original Message-----
From: Gen <genealogy92109@...>
One possible comeback to the chiropractor: "Well, you went to fourth grade so
why don't you tell me about the missions?"
And, odds are s/he remembers nothing about them just like 99.9 percent of the
rest of us.
So after the hemming and hawing stops, you have made a point that the "standard"
might not be so crucial after all.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Melissa Maranda, MA
Licensed Mental Health Counselor
Substance Abuse Specialist
Basic NLP Certified
http://www.facebook.com/mmcounseling
To: [email protected]
From: kbcdlovejo@...
Date: Thu, 6 Oct 2011 17:22:14 -0400
Subject: Re: [unschoolingbasics] Re: Other's quizzing my child
Perfect!
~Kelly
Kelly Lovejoy
"There is no single effort more radical in its potential for saving the world than a transformation of the way we raise our children." Marianne Williamson
-----Original Message-----
From: Gen <genealogy92109@...>
One possible comeback to the chiropractor: "Well, you went to fourth grade so
why don't you tell me about the missions?"
And, odds are s/he remembers nothing about them just like 99.9 percent of the
rest of us.
So after the hemming and hawing stops, you have made a point that the "standard"
might not be so crucial after all.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Kelly Lovejoy
Probably in Califormia, Florida, Texas or New Mexico: missions set up by (usually Spanish) missionaries/monks in the New World.
It's common for schools to study state history in fourth grade.
In SC, it would be Francis Marion, revolutionary war sites, burning of Columbia, and Sherman's March to the Sea.
In MA, it would be Minute Men, Ben Franklin, and Sam Adams. <G>
~Kelly
Kelly Lovejoy
"There is no single effort more radical in its potential for saving the world than a transformation of the way we raise our children." Marianne Williamson
-----Original Message-----
From: melissa maranda <love.gratitude@...>
What missions???
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
It's common for schools to study state history in fourth grade.
In SC, it would be Francis Marion, revolutionary war sites, burning of Columbia, and Sherman's March to the Sea.
In MA, it would be Minute Men, Ben Franklin, and Sam Adams. <G>
~Kelly
Kelly Lovejoy
"There is no single effort more radical in its potential for saving the world than a transformation of the way we raise our children." Marianne Williamson
-----Original Message-----
From: melissa maranda <love.gratitude@...>
What missions???
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
melissa maranda
Ha, I've never heard of these missions and I went to fourth grade. I also have a Master's degree. I also taught third and fourth grade in a private school. Never heard of them.
Melissa Maranda, MA
Licensed Mental Health Counselor
Substance Abuse Specialist
Basic NLP Certified
http://www.facebook.com/mmcounseling
To: [email protected]
From: kbcdlovejo@...
Date: Thu, 6 Oct 2011 18:26:53 -0400
Subject: Re: [unschoolingbasics] Re: Other's quizzing my child
Probably in Califormia, Florida, Texas or New Mexico: missions set up by (usually Spanish) missionaries/monks in the New World.
It's common for schools to study state history in fourth grade.
In SC, it would be Francis Marion, revolutionary war sites, burning of Columbia, and Sherman's March to the Sea.
In MA, it would be Minute Men, Ben Franklin, and Sam Adams. <G>
~Kelly
Kelly Lovejoy
"There is no single effort more radical in its potential for saving the world than a transformation of the way we raise our children." Marianne Williamson
-----Original Message-----
From: melissa maranda <love.gratitude@...>
What missions???
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Melissa Maranda, MA
Licensed Mental Health Counselor
Substance Abuse Specialist
Basic NLP Certified
http://www.facebook.com/mmcounseling
To: [email protected]
From: kbcdlovejo@...
Date: Thu, 6 Oct 2011 18:26:53 -0400
Subject: Re: [unschoolingbasics] Re: Other's quizzing my child
Probably in Califormia, Florida, Texas or New Mexico: missions set up by (usually Spanish) missionaries/monks in the New World.
It's common for schools to study state history in fourth grade.
In SC, it would be Francis Marion, revolutionary war sites, burning of Columbia, and Sherman's March to the Sea.
In MA, it would be Minute Men, Ben Franklin, and Sam Adams. <G>
~Kelly
Kelly Lovejoy
"There is no single effort more radical in its potential for saving the world than a transformation of the way we raise our children." Marianne Williamson
-----Original Message-----
From: melissa maranda <love.gratitude@...>
What missions???
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
tookute2eat
Ironically, she has been working the past couple summers for this woman at her nursery! lol. Learning all kinds of things about fruit trees, plants, etc.
Connie
Connie
--- In [email protected], Kelly Lovejoy <kbcdlovejo@...> wrote:
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
>
> From: tookute2eat <tookute2eat@...>
>
>
> Telling her things like they don't want to see her
> flipping burgers for the rest of her life and that she needed to catch up on her
> schooling so she could get a job! I haven't told my dad that we unschool and I
> don't even want to go there.
> -=-=-=-=-=-
> Many unschoolers have jobs way before schooled kids. Our kids have the time to work. Schooled kids do not.
> -=-=-=-=-=-
> I was just thinking of when she turns 18, in 3
> yrs., he's gonna ask about her diploma. UGH! Oh well. Guess I'll cross that
> bridge when I get to it. What's the worse that could happen?
> -=-=-=-=-
>
> A diploma is a piece of paper. Go here to order your favorite diploma. www.homeschooldiploma.com Seriously. It's just as valuable as any brickandmortar school's diploma.
>
>
>
> -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
>
>
>
> We joined this group and another unschooling group on fb so Hannah could meet
> like-minded friends. She is now at the point where she knows what kind of friend
> she wants and is focusing on manifesting that;)
> -=-=-=-=-
>
>
>
> Quit "manifesting" and go out and meet like-minded people. Find other hobbyists. Go to an unschooling conference or gathering near you. If there isn't one near you, go to the next one coming up---whereever it is in the country. Don't "manifest:" make it happen.
>
>
>
>
> ~Kelly
>
> Kelly Lovejoy
> "There is no single effort more radical in its potential for saving the world than a transformation of the way we raise our children." Marianne Williamson
>
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Meredith
"mamabearvictoria" <coloradodays@...> wrote:
How good are you at projecting confidence? That seems to be a big factor in this sort of thing. If you're good at projecting confidence then you can say "oh, that's not on our agenda right now" or something equally vague and people don't tend to respond, its when you hesitate and show a lack of assurance that they jump on you.
In that sense it may be less a matter of a snappy comeback than learning how to Seem more confident than you feel in the moment. A lot of that has to do with posture and tone and can be learned by learning some physical skill - yoga or self-defense, sword-fighting or even a dance class (or video) can give you the skills to stand up tall, smile and say "that's what I Love about Homeschooling - we can mix things up a bit!" (or whatever - I'm No Good at snappy comebacks, personally) without opening the door for criticism.
It's also okay to coach your kids a bit - right before you visit someone if it helps - on how to refuse to answer questions. I've made a point of listening to Mo's schooled friends to know what They say - they get quizzed, too, but they know how to answer! They say "I dunno" in a dull voice and look away. Alternately, they'll say "I KNOW!" but not actually answer the question, just act indignant. Or they'll huff and say "I'm Not in School right now!" in that special eye-rolling voice. Mo has picked up some of those tactics on her own, hanging out with school kids - and Ray learned them in school and made heavy use of them once he was out.
It helps me to keep in mind that most adults flat out have No Idea how to talk to children and so they quiz them as a kind of fallback. With Ray, I'd offer other topics "tell grandma about your new xyz". Mo's not so conversational, but she's better at standing up for herself and refusing to answer rude questions.
---Meredith
>> Any one have empowering comebacks that aren't 'suspicion' arousing? Something to tell them to back off? Our preference is to not be defensive. After all there is nothing to defend! ARgh!****************
How good are you at projecting confidence? That seems to be a big factor in this sort of thing. If you're good at projecting confidence then you can say "oh, that's not on our agenda right now" or something equally vague and people don't tend to respond, its when you hesitate and show a lack of assurance that they jump on you.
In that sense it may be less a matter of a snappy comeback than learning how to Seem more confident than you feel in the moment. A lot of that has to do with posture and tone and can be learned by learning some physical skill - yoga or self-defense, sword-fighting or even a dance class (or video) can give you the skills to stand up tall, smile and say "that's what I Love about Homeschooling - we can mix things up a bit!" (or whatever - I'm No Good at snappy comebacks, personally) without opening the door for criticism.
It's also okay to coach your kids a bit - right before you visit someone if it helps - on how to refuse to answer questions. I've made a point of listening to Mo's schooled friends to know what They say - they get quizzed, too, but they know how to answer! They say "I dunno" in a dull voice and look away. Alternately, they'll say "I KNOW!" but not actually answer the question, just act indignant. Or they'll huff and say "I'm Not in School right now!" in that special eye-rolling voice. Mo has picked up some of those tactics on her own, hanging out with school kids - and Ray learned them in school and made heavy use of them once he was out.
It helps me to keep in mind that most adults flat out have No Idea how to talk to children and so they quiz them as a kind of fallback. With Ray, I'd offer other topics "tell grandma about your new xyz". Mo's not so conversational, but she's better at standing up for herself and refusing to answer rude questions.
---Meredith
Meredith
Kelly Lovejoy <kbcdlovejo@...> wrote:
Ray just turned 18 - about a week ago. He's been working in one capacity or another for four years. Some of it is the kind of "after school" and "summer job" stuff other boys his age do - yard work and odd jobs, but he does it whenever its needed and has built a reputation as someone who can be depended on to show up and help out. He has also worked for local farmers doing fencing and animal care, worked at a local tree farm, and he has made and sold wood and metal creations at events and shows. He was able to purchase everything he wanted for his party with money he made at a show the week before, selling wooden spoons, forks and hand-made knives with wood and bone handles.
The big excitement of turning 18 for Ray is he doesn't have to have "parental permission" to do the things he's been doing for four years - not that it slowed him down, but now and then it was a hassle to have to say "oh, yeah, you need to talk to my parents...".
---Meredith
>> Many unschoolers have jobs way before schooled kids. Our kids have the time to work. Schooled kids do not.****************
Ray just turned 18 - about a week ago. He's been working in one capacity or another for four years. Some of it is the kind of "after school" and "summer job" stuff other boys his age do - yard work and odd jobs, but he does it whenever its needed and has built a reputation as someone who can be depended on to show up and help out. He has also worked for local farmers doing fencing and animal care, worked at a local tree farm, and he has made and sold wood and metal creations at events and shows. He was able to purchase everything he wanted for his party with money he made at a show the week before, selling wooden spoons, forks and hand-made knives with wood and bone handles.
The big excitement of turning 18 for Ray is he doesn't have to have "parental permission" to do the things he's been doing for four years - not that it slowed him down, but now and then it was a hassle to have to say "oh, yeah, you need to talk to my parents...".
---Meredith
Meredith
Kelly Lovejoy <kbcdlovejo@...> wrote:
In TN, where I live, it would be a lot of Civil War hoo-haa, but I'm not "from 'round here" so the details are sketchy to me. I Do know that Ray left school at 13 not knowing the "Rebel Flag" and the Flag or the Confederacy were the same thing. That's how divorced his school history lessons were from real life. The Confederacy was bad and in the past. But the Rebel Flag flying from neighbors homes and emblazoned on local pickup trucks and ball caps is good and noble and patriotic.
Mo knows we live on land stolen from other people and farmed by people forced into slavery. She doesn't know the details of the Civil War, but she knows that our home has a sad and bloody history and some of our ancestors may have done shameful things - that's not something she would have learned in school.
---Meredith
>> It's common for schools to study state history in fourth grade.*******************
>
>> In SC, it would be Francis Marion, revolutionary war sites, burning of Columbia, and Sherman's March to the Sea.
In TN, where I live, it would be a lot of Civil War hoo-haa, but I'm not "from 'round here" so the details are sketchy to me. I Do know that Ray left school at 13 not knowing the "Rebel Flag" and the Flag or the Confederacy were the same thing. That's how divorced his school history lessons were from real life. The Confederacy was bad and in the past. But the Rebel Flag flying from neighbors homes and emblazoned on local pickup trucks and ball caps is good and noble and patriotic.
Mo knows we live on land stolen from other people and farmed by people forced into slavery. She doesn't know the details of the Civil War, but she knows that our home has a sad and bloody history and some of our ancestors may have done shameful things - that's not something she would have learned in school.
---Meredith
tookute2eat
I love it! So true. Isn't that what publicly educated kids learn to say, besides the"manners" they pick up from having to be defensive after all the demoralization in a public institution.
How do people think homeschooled or unschooled children will respond? Differently?
Connie
Meredith wrote: I've made a point of listening to Mo's schooled friends to know what They say - they get quizzed, too, but they know how to answer! They say "I dunno" in a dull voice and look away. Alternately, they'll say "I KNOW!" but not actually answer the question, just act indignant. Or they'll huff and say "I'm Not in School right now!" in that special eye-rolling voice.
How do people think homeschooled or unschooled children will respond? Differently?
Connie
Meredith wrote: I've made a point of listening to Mo's schooled friends to know what They say - they get quizzed, too, but they know how to answer! They say "I dunno" in a dull voice and look away. Alternately, they'll say "I KNOW!" but not actually answer the question, just act indignant. Or they'll huff and say "I'm Not in School right now!" in that special eye-rolling voice.
undermom
**The big excitement of turning 18 for Ray is he doesn't have to have "parental permission" to do the things he's been doing for four years - not that it slowed him down, but now and then it was a hassle to have to say "oh, yeah, you need to talk to my parents...". **
When Patrick was 17 it was kind of annoying to both of us that he had to have me physically purchase the knife he wanted. We're not even talking about a sheath knife or anything like that, this was an itty bitty teeny tiny little knife. The law says knives can't be sold to anyone under 18.
Another thing that bothered him a lot after he was 16 or so was our having to sign risk release forms for him. The idea that he couldn't make decisions for himself about what risks he was or was not willing to take with his body was really disturbing to him, and the ethical dilemma of our being able to sign away his rights. At 18 he entered this weird state of responsibility/but not -for instance, in this state we no longer have the right to see his medical records but we are still legally obligated to pay his medical bills. We have such a weird jumbled mess of legal/moral/philosophical stuff built up around *age of maturity*
Deborah in IL
When Patrick was 17 it was kind of annoying to both of us that he had to have me physically purchase the knife he wanted. We're not even talking about a sheath knife or anything like that, this was an itty bitty teeny tiny little knife. The law says knives can't be sold to anyone under 18.
Another thing that bothered him a lot after he was 16 or so was our having to sign risk release forms for him. The idea that he couldn't make decisions for himself about what risks he was or was not willing to take with his body was really disturbing to him, and the ethical dilemma of our being able to sign away his rights. At 18 he entered this weird state of responsibility/but not -for instance, in this state we no longer have the right to see his medical records but we are still legally obligated to pay his medical bills. We have such a weird jumbled mess of legal/moral/philosophical stuff built up around *age of maturity*
Deborah in IL
Joyce Fetteroll
On Oct 7, 2011, at 1:36 PM, tookute2eat wrote:
People are confident kids are learning in school even if they say "I
dunno."
People aren't confident homeschooled kids are learning so "I dunno"
sounds like neglect.
If I could help it, I never wanted people to walk away uncomfortable
about homeschooling. It doesn't do homeschooling any good. And it
might make them release that discomfort on the next homeschooling mom
-- or homeschooled child --- they meet.
If someone groused about a homeschooled child who said "I dunno" to
their question, I'd definitely point out that schooled kids say the
same and that kids don't give a lot of thought to what they're learning.
I think Sandra Dodd's daughter Holly would say confidently, "I don't
know. But if you tell me, then I will!" And she had a couple of math
problems of her own memorized to ask back.
Joyce
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> How do people think homeschooled or unschooled children willThey shouldn't but they will.
> respond? Differently?
People are confident kids are learning in school even if they say "I
dunno."
People aren't confident homeschooled kids are learning so "I dunno"
sounds like neglect.
If I could help it, I never wanted people to walk away uncomfortable
about homeschooling. It doesn't do homeschooling any good. And it
might make them release that discomfort on the next homeschooling mom
-- or homeschooled child --- they meet.
If someone groused about a homeschooled child who said "I dunno" to
their question, I'd definitely point out that schooled kids say the
same and that kids don't give a lot of thought to what they're learning.
I think Sandra Dodd's daughter Holly would say confidently, "I don't
know. But if you tell me, then I will!" And she had a couple of math
problems of her own memorized to ask back.
Joyce
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Loretta B.
Hi - Thank you all for your feedback! It's so great to have a support
group, even it is only online. Wished some of you lived in my area.
Also, now my daughter doesn't
want to go to this friend's house and I have ties with the Mother. I'm
trying to think of a way to let this Mother know that I didn't appreciate my
daughter being put "on the spot" when I wasn't there. However, i just don't
know how to go about expressing this, without coming across as being
defensive or angry (which I feel anyway). Any thoughts? Thanks. Loretta
group, even it is only online. Wished some of you lived in my area.
Also, now my daughter doesn't
want to go to this friend's house and I have ties with the Mother. I'm
trying to think of a way to let this Mother know that I didn't appreciate my
daughter being put "on the spot" when I wasn't there. However, i just don't
know how to go about expressing this, without coming across as being
defensive or angry (which I feel anyway). Any thoughts? Thanks. Loretta
Daria S
--- In [email protected], "Loretta B." <tinamariesmom@...> wrote:
I would let her know I'm feeling a bit defensive and angry, and I don't want to blame her and that I value her friendship. And I don't want my daughter being quizzed. And ask what she thinks?
>I believe being authentic - and non-blaming - fosters better connections than false politeness.
> Hi - Thank you all for your feedback! It's so great to have a support
> group, even it is only online. Wished some of you lived in my area.
> Also, now my daughter doesn't
> want to go to this friend's house and I have ties with the Mother. I'm
> trying to think of a way to let this Mother know that I didn't appreciate my
> daughter being put "on the spot" when I wasn't there. However, i just don't
> know how to go about expressing this, without coming across as being
> defensive or angry (which I feel anyway). Any thoughts? Thanks. Loretta
>
I would let her know I'm feeling a bit defensive and angry, and I don't want to blame her and that I value her friendship. And I don't want my daughter being quizzed. And ask what she thinks?
Meredith
"Loretta B." <tinamariesmom@...> wrote:
Some friends fall by the wayside while unschooling - temporarily or permanently. I have a friend I rarely see because our daughters no longer get along. In that case it wasn't quizzing, but teasing, and I supported my daughter's desire not to spend time with someone who was going to tease her so much. As our kids are getting older, we've found ways to see each other more without the kids - we have other things in common and stick to those topics, since we're on wildly different wavelengths where parenting is concerned.
---Meredith
>It's so great to have a supportIt Is nice to have other unschoolers to get support from, but I want to clarify that this isn't specifically a support group, or rather the goal isn't so much to support individuals but to support those ideas which help unschooling to flourish.
> group, even it is only online.
> Also, now my daughter doesn'tYou don't have to say anything, but you could comment that your daughter didn't like being quizzed and you understand her sentiments. Don't make it a lecture, though.
> want to go to this friend's house and I have ties with the Mother. I'm
> trying to think of a way to let this Mother know that I didn't appreciate my
> daughter being put "on the spot" when I wasn't there.
Some friends fall by the wayside while unschooling - temporarily or permanently. I have a friend I rarely see because our daughters no longer get along. In that case it wasn't quizzing, but teasing, and I supported my daughter's desire not to spend time with someone who was going to tease her so much. As our kids are getting older, we've found ways to see each other more without the kids - we have other things in common and stick to those topics, since we're on wildly different wavelengths where parenting is concerned.
---Meredith
Meredith
"Daria S" <daria_simionescu@...> wrote:
Sometimes "authentic" and "non-blaming" can be mutually exclusive, though, if someone has a lot of old baggage - and the sort of person who's likely to do a lot of quizzing and comparison is likely to have a lot of old baggage.
Politeness can be gentle and non-intrusive, rather than "false" - a way of smoothing things over for the sake of maintaining a relationship you value warts and all. Some relationships Are warty and uncomfortable but valuable anyway.
---Meredith
>> I believe being authentic - and non-blaming - fosters better connections than false politeness.******************
Sometimes "authentic" and "non-blaming" can be mutually exclusive, though, if someone has a lot of old baggage - and the sort of person who's likely to do a lot of quizzing and comparison is likely to have a lot of old baggage.
Politeness can be gentle and non-intrusive, rather than "false" - a way of smoothing things over for the sake of maintaining a relationship you value warts and all. Some relationships Are warty and uncomfortable but valuable anyway.
---Meredith
Daria S
I'm feeling a bit defensive too :) - that's definitely my 'baggage'
I would reword my choice of words: 'false politeness.' Indeed politeness does not have to be false.
Gentle and non-intrusive was what I was intending to express with "non-blaming."
And I do believe authenticity, in a way that takes responsibility for personal feelings without blaming another - connects and deepends relationships.
Hiding one's feelings - will not build a healthy relationship. And hiding feelings makes self esteem suffer - knowing that their feelings are valuable and being able to express them is a powerful skill that children learn from their caregivers. And much, if not almost all of that learning, is by imitating what is modeled for them.
I would reword my choice of words: 'false politeness.' Indeed politeness does not have to be false.
Gentle and non-intrusive was what I was intending to express with "non-blaming."
And I do believe authenticity, in a way that takes responsibility for personal feelings without blaming another - connects and deepends relationships.
Hiding one's feelings - will not build a healthy relationship. And hiding feelings makes self esteem suffer - knowing that their feelings are valuable and being able to express them is a powerful skill that children learn from their caregivers. And much, if not almost all of that learning, is by imitating what is modeled for them.
--- In [email protected], "Meredith" <plaidpanties666@...> wrote:
>
> "Daria S" <daria_simionescu@> wrote:
> >> I believe being authentic - and non-blaming - fosters better connections than false politeness.
> ******************
>
> Sometimes "authentic" and "non-blaming" can be mutually exclusive, though, if someone has a lot of old baggage - and the sort of person who's likely to do a lot of quizzing and comparison is likely to have a lot of old baggage.
>
> Politeness can be gentle and non-intrusive, rather than "false" - a way of smoothing things over for the sake of maintaining a relationship you value warts and all. Some relationships Are warty and uncomfortable but valuable anyway.
>
> ---Meredith
>
Meredith
> I'm feeling a bit defensive too :) - that's definitely my 'baggage'I'm sorry you're feeling defensive! I think you're bringing up really wonderful issues to consider in light of how unschooling works: the nature of learning and relationships are right at the core of unschooling, so I'm going to keep on with those topics. But if it makes you uncomfortable, feel free to skip over my posts.
As a side note, Because it is sometimes emotionally challenging to see one's words discussed in this manner, feel free to ask any of the list owners or moderators to post something for you anonymously. Sometimes that can help you see people responding to words and ideas rather than taking the matter personally.
Onward!
>much, if not almost all of that learning, is by imitating what is modeled for them*****************
Not all, or even most, actually. Kids do learn from what they see, but they learn a great deal by trying out what they see and comparing their unique experiences to what they expect to happen. That's important! A lot of parents of young children, especially, get hung up on the idea of "modelling" - I did, and it got in the way of my understanding how people learn. Observation is part of it, but humans are't just sponges - not even very young children! Experimentation and comparison is a big, big part of how people decide Which parts of what they observe are useful to them as individuals.
> Hiding one's feelings - will not build a healthy relationship.It depends on what you mean - and not all relationships need aspire to an ideal of health to be valuable. My relationship with my stepson's mother is much, much better for my efforts to hide my feelings. She's not in a position to respond to my feelings with anything other than defensiveness - she's too fragile, emotionally - so out of kindness to her I don't express them. My girlfriend is fragile in similar ways, so I only share feelings with her she's able to respond to without delving into her own issues. She doesn't want me to be her therapist!
But all that being said, not all relationships are worth keeping, including those with family members. If an adult relationship is putting too much stress on your children and your relationship with them, it may be better to step away as gently as you can, with nothing said at all. Hiding your real feelings is sometimes an act of kindness - and the world needs more kindness.
> Hiding one's feelings - will not build a healthy relationship.In regards to parenting, sometimes hiding one's feelings is better for children. My kids don't always need to know about My old baggage rearing its ugly head, sometimes they're better served by me biting my tongue and learning from them, learning to see the world afresh, through their eyes.
I'm not saying its a good idea to "always" hide one's feelings - sometimes those feelings are useful information, sometimes they do help to deepen a parent-child relationship. But adult feelings can get in the way, too - in the way of seeing our children for who they are, and in the way of children developing their own views and feelings.
>>hiding feelings makes self esteem sufferMy own experience is that when I conceal my feelings out of kindness to another person, my self esteem grows. I see myself as more sensitive and caring. It might be good to add as a caveat, that I don't exactly have a silver tongue in person! I'm not a smooth or witty conversationalist for the most part and I'm much more likely to think of a gentle and non-intrusive way of phrasing something After I've stuck my food in my mouth. So silence, for me, really is golden at times.
This is a good example of taking a good idea or principle - that feelings are valuable and worthwhile - and creating a rule around it: don't hide them. Step away from the rule and see the reasons behind it. It can be just as good to honor another's feelings as one's own by being silent, or sidestepping an issue by changing the subject. But that's not a rule either! One should not Always hide one's feelings anymore than one should Never do such a thing. It's a matter of building up understanding and communication skills. The more you understand someone else's perspective, the more thoughtfully you can decide how your words will impact that person.
---Meredith