how to deal with violence
Stephanie Kimball
Hello wonderful Unschoolers,
I have been lurking on this list for a while now, and have benefitted
tremendously from other people's questions and answers. A hearty
thank you to all for the very thoughtful responses you write -- I
don't know how you find the time, let alone the clarity, but I'm
extremely grateful that you do. :)
The problem I need help with right now is my 10 year old son's violent
behavior. He has always been a sensitive kid -- as in, if he spilled
his milk he'd go ballistic, screaming at everyone over the "waste,"
threatening to lick it up off the floor, completely unable to let it
go. (He was NEVER yelled at or punished in any way for spilling milk
or other accidents; even if the glass broke I would just calmly clean
it up -- sometimes I'd even humor him by saving the shards of glass in
a paper bag since he'd be insistent that we could glue it back
together again.....) He seems to explode almost any time things do
not go his way, though the rest of the time he is a sweet,
affectionate, incredibly smart kid. Over the years, as he's gotten
bigger, his outbursts have become more physical -- hitting, kicking,
even biting, and often throwing large/dangerous objects (i.e.
chairs). It's to the point now where his 7yo sister is developing
coping strategies for dealing with her brother's tantrums, and is
careful to avoid situations that might set him off. Sometimes she is
very frustrated by having to compromise so much, and I worry about her
not feeling safe in her own home.
A couple years ago I read the book Explosive Child, and from that
started to look for ways to decrease the frustration level for my
son. However, he often explodes over things I cannot control (like
the weather), making that strategy seem rather limited. Since joining
this List I have been more conscious of trying to say "yes," and
letting it sound like "yes" (I'd gotten in the habit of saying
"maybe," for fear of setting him up for disappointment and tantrums
if I said yes and then couldn't make it so -- but he hears "maybe"
as "no," or at least as "only if more important things get done
first", that sort of thing.) I've also been trying to recognize his
needs better and respect his desires more. I've given up the power
struggles over candy and bedtime, I make efforts to be physical with
him in positive ways (hugs, playful wrestling, etc.) and so on. I try
to think of special projects we can work on together. I try to find
ways to support his desires and dreams. I try to be more gentle,
over all.
But it seems it's never enough. On a given day he might make 5
requests that I say yes to, but the 6th one is something I can't do
and he goes nuts -- sometimes even screaming things like, "you don't
even care about me, you don't even WANT me to be able to do _______."
Sometimes I gently point out the 5 things I said yes to, but that
feels icky and doesn't seem to do much good.
My kids spent last weekend at their dad's house. I got a call from my
ex around 8pm on Friday, desperate to know what to do as DS was
screaming and throwing things. Apparently he'd promised them ice
cream, but they were obnoxious in the store, and didn't quit when he
said they'd better or no ice cream...... so, no ice cream. In the car
on the way home DS kicked and screamed, and once home he punched and
threw things....... Their dad threatened to cancel the next day's
activities if DS didn't stop, which he didn't. The first thing I
suggested was to quit making ultimatums, as DS is not capable of
responding to them in that state. While we were talking DS slipped a
note under his door apologizing -- and I said, get off the phone now,
there's your opening. I then got a call from DD, who was clearly
cowering in her room, calling me and talking a mile a minute to shut
out the conflict around her. Eventually they went back for ice cream.
I expect my kids' dad will be confronting me soon on how to deal with
DS. He (their dad) has never been a hands-on parent, aside from
taking them on occasional fun outings on weekends. He has always
looked to me to figure things out and deal with them, and advise him
how to proceed -- except he doesn't catch on well to the gist of
things, instead taking whatever I might say as a script. It's
annoying (and lonely) for me, but that's not the issue right now. I
worry that he's going to suggest or even insist upon counseling and/or
drugs, and even though I sometimes wonder if that's where we're
headed, I really think there's some other unmet need here, and would
strongly prefer to figure that out and deal with it directly.
However, I have no idea what that "unmet need" could be, even though
I've been dealing with this for 7-8 years now, so I'm not sure I could
make much of a case for avoiding the drugs/therapy approach.
So I guess I have 3 questions. 1) Can you shed any light on DS's
tantrums and violence (in the process of writing this, I have resolved
to keep finding more ways to shower him with YES and love and
kindness, to be a "bottomless well" to his seemingly "bottomless
pit" of need); 2) How would you suggest I handle the violent
outbursts when they do occur? (I've tried and quit the "loss of
privileges" strategy, and "time out" never worked, but it's not
acceptable for my daughter to get hurt or for things to get
broken....... and honestly, being hit and kicked myself doesn't do
much for my relationship with my son either!); and 3) any
suggestions for what I might say to his dad when he turns to me for
answers on how to deal with all this? That's a lot to ask. #2 is
my biggest priority.
Thanks in advance for your thoughts!
stephanie
I have been lurking on this list for a while now, and have benefitted
tremendously from other people's questions and answers. A hearty
thank you to all for the very thoughtful responses you write -- I
don't know how you find the time, let alone the clarity, but I'm
extremely grateful that you do. :)
The problem I need help with right now is my 10 year old son's violent
behavior. He has always been a sensitive kid -- as in, if he spilled
his milk he'd go ballistic, screaming at everyone over the "waste,"
threatening to lick it up off the floor, completely unable to let it
go. (He was NEVER yelled at or punished in any way for spilling milk
or other accidents; even if the glass broke I would just calmly clean
it up -- sometimes I'd even humor him by saving the shards of glass in
a paper bag since he'd be insistent that we could glue it back
together again.....) He seems to explode almost any time things do
not go his way, though the rest of the time he is a sweet,
affectionate, incredibly smart kid. Over the years, as he's gotten
bigger, his outbursts have become more physical -- hitting, kicking,
even biting, and often throwing large/dangerous objects (i.e.
chairs). It's to the point now where his 7yo sister is developing
coping strategies for dealing with her brother's tantrums, and is
careful to avoid situations that might set him off. Sometimes she is
very frustrated by having to compromise so much, and I worry about her
not feeling safe in her own home.
A couple years ago I read the book Explosive Child, and from that
started to look for ways to decrease the frustration level for my
son. However, he often explodes over things I cannot control (like
the weather), making that strategy seem rather limited. Since joining
this List I have been more conscious of trying to say "yes," and
letting it sound like "yes" (I'd gotten in the habit of saying
"maybe," for fear of setting him up for disappointment and tantrums
if I said yes and then couldn't make it so -- but he hears "maybe"
as "no," or at least as "only if more important things get done
first", that sort of thing.) I've also been trying to recognize his
needs better and respect his desires more. I've given up the power
struggles over candy and bedtime, I make efforts to be physical with
him in positive ways (hugs, playful wrestling, etc.) and so on. I try
to think of special projects we can work on together. I try to find
ways to support his desires and dreams. I try to be more gentle,
over all.
But it seems it's never enough. On a given day he might make 5
requests that I say yes to, but the 6th one is something I can't do
and he goes nuts -- sometimes even screaming things like, "you don't
even care about me, you don't even WANT me to be able to do _______."
Sometimes I gently point out the 5 things I said yes to, but that
feels icky and doesn't seem to do much good.
My kids spent last weekend at their dad's house. I got a call from my
ex around 8pm on Friday, desperate to know what to do as DS was
screaming and throwing things. Apparently he'd promised them ice
cream, but they were obnoxious in the store, and didn't quit when he
said they'd better or no ice cream...... so, no ice cream. In the car
on the way home DS kicked and screamed, and once home he punched and
threw things....... Their dad threatened to cancel the next day's
activities if DS didn't stop, which he didn't. The first thing I
suggested was to quit making ultimatums, as DS is not capable of
responding to them in that state. While we were talking DS slipped a
note under his door apologizing -- and I said, get off the phone now,
there's your opening. I then got a call from DD, who was clearly
cowering in her room, calling me and talking a mile a minute to shut
out the conflict around her. Eventually they went back for ice cream.
I expect my kids' dad will be confronting me soon on how to deal with
DS. He (their dad) has never been a hands-on parent, aside from
taking them on occasional fun outings on weekends. He has always
looked to me to figure things out and deal with them, and advise him
how to proceed -- except he doesn't catch on well to the gist of
things, instead taking whatever I might say as a script. It's
annoying (and lonely) for me, but that's not the issue right now. I
worry that he's going to suggest or even insist upon counseling and/or
drugs, and even though I sometimes wonder if that's where we're
headed, I really think there's some other unmet need here, and would
strongly prefer to figure that out and deal with it directly.
However, I have no idea what that "unmet need" could be, even though
I've been dealing with this for 7-8 years now, so I'm not sure I could
make much of a case for avoiding the drugs/therapy approach.
So I guess I have 3 questions. 1) Can you shed any light on DS's
tantrums and violence (in the process of writing this, I have resolved
to keep finding more ways to shower him with YES and love and
kindness, to be a "bottomless well" to his seemingly "bottomless
pit" of need); 2) How would you suggest I handle the violent
outbursts when they do occur? (I've tried and quit the "loss of
privileges" strategy, and "time out" never worked, but it's not
acceptable for my daughter to get hurt or for things to get
broken....... and honestly, being hit and kicked myself doesn't do
much for my relationship with my son either!); and 3) any
suggestions for what I might say to his dad when he turns to me for
answers on how to deal with all this? That's a lot to ask. #2 is
my biggest priority.
Thanks in advance for your thoughts!
stephanie
Rachelle Marsden
shed any light on DS's tantrums and violence (in the process of writing
this, I have resolved to keep finding more ways to shower him with YES and
love and kindness, to be a "bottomless well" to his seemingly "bottomless
pit" of need) In situations where I feel confused by my children's
behaviours (control issues), I look at how I'm being, as a reflection. It's
called "shadow process" (look up on Google if you desire). Often we get
into cycles with our loved ones because we have yet to recognize the mirror
of them in ourselves, continually activating triggers and perpetuating the
cycle. Your description vibe/language also seems tinged with resentment -
do you really know you are *free* to respond however you want, every moment,
in every situation with your son. You CAN say 'no", regardless of whatever
parenting/schooling/unschooling practice you are choosing to gravitate
towards. You are free to choose how to respond.
Being present, knowing all is well, holding space, not trying to "resolve"
the "problem" when the behaviours occur, on a consistent basis may help him
feel more empowered to "be" with his emotions, rather than seeking outside
solutions, gratification, etc. The way to hold this space is to be clear
in yourself with the mirrored emotions. Lots of joyful work! Good luck!
Lovingly,
Rachelle
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
this, I have resolved to keep finding more ways to shower him with YES and
love and kindness, to be a "bottomless well" to his seemingly "bottomless
pit" of need) In situations where I feel confused by my children's
behaviours (control issues), I look at how I'm being, as a reflection. It's
called "shadow process" (look up on Google if you desire). Often we get
into cycles with our loved ones because we have yet to recognize the mirror
of them in ourselves, continually activating triggers and perpetuating the
cycle. Your description vibe/language also seems tinged with resentment -
do you really know you are *free* to respond however you want, every moment,
in every situation with your son. You CAN say 'no", regardless of whatever
parenting/schooling/unschooling practice you are choosing to gravitate
towards. You are free to choose how to respond.
Being present, knowing all is well, holding space, not trying to "resolve"
the "problem" when the behaviours occur, on a consistent basis may help him
feel more empowered to "be" with his emotions, rather than seeking outside
solutions, gratification, etc. The way to hold this space is to be clear
in yourself with the mirrored emotions. Lots of joyful work! Good luck!
Lovingly,
Rachelle
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
plaidpanties666
--- In [email protected], Stephanie Kimball <kimball.stephanie@...> wrote:
It really important to notice what he gravitates toward and what seems to help. Its easy to see the bad stuff :( so make a conscious effort to notice the good stuff. Write it down even! That will give you more tools and options. Its just as important to Notice - out loud to your son - when things are better, even if that's marginal. I know at first, with Ray, we had to notice things that weren't as bad as they could have been and go from there. That helps you see him in a better light, but more importantly, it helps Him see himself in a better light, as someone who has tools and skills. I'm talking about things like noticing, if he throws something, when he's not throwing At another person and saying something positive about that- that's important. It will help him build better skills.
Talk with him Outside of stressful situations and come up with strategies for when he melts down. Things for him to try, things for You to do if he loses it completely. Ask him what he thinks helps, or might help and experiment. Check in later to see if the experiment was okay - something like shutting him in his room might be okay even if it seems hard in the moment if he's agreed to try it as a one-time thing to see how it plays out. Also bring him into the process of coming up with strategies for dad (I'll have another post about dad).
Its important to help your guy feel like he has plenty of choices, and also that he has plenty of capabilities. You can say "yes" all day long, but if he needs a chair to reach the light-switch, can't open a jar without help, can't find his socks and then it rains he'll fall apart. Little things like that will add up to "this is the worst day of my life" without you even noticing! So look for ways to make his life easier overall. Help him feel in control so that when the world is out of control (and it will be) he's less likely to fall to pieces (but still have strategies in place for when he does, because he will).
Also come up with strategies and agreements with your dd for what to do "in the moment". Let her know you want her to be safe.
---Meredith (Mo 8, Ray 16)
>> A couple years ago I read the book Explosive ChildAnother good book is The Out of Sync Child - whether or not you think he has sensory integration issues, there are lots and lots of good strategies and activities for helping kids with big energy needs. Hugging and wrestling don't go far enough! He likely needs lots and lots of big-muscle movement. If he tends to throw, look into big things to do with arms - throwing in a controlled way, but also swinging heavy objects, swinging on a rope or vine, climbing and hanging by the arms, that sort of thing. Find him older guy friends, people who can pick him up and throw him, or be climbed on, or at least keep up with him ;) Ask around people with intense teenage boys to see if any would be willing to play with a little guy (like a big brother program!).
It really important to notice what he gravitates toward and what seems to help. Its easy to see the bad stuff :( so make a conscious effort to notice the good stuff. Write it down even! That will give you more tools and options. Its just as important to Notice - out loud to your son - when things are better, even if that's marginal. I know at first, with Ray, we had to notice things that weren't as bad as they could have been and go from there. That helps you see him in a better light, but more importantly, it helps Him see himself in a better light, as someone who has tools and skills. I'm talking about things like noticing, if he throws something, when he's not throwing At another person and saying something positive about that- that's important. It will help him build better skills.
Talk with him Outside of stressful situations and come up with strategies for when he melts down. Things for him to try, things for You to do if he loses it completely. Ask him what he thinks helps, or might help and experiment. Check in later to see if the experiment was okay - something like shutting him in his room might be okay even if it seems hard in the moment if he's agreed to try it as a one-time thing to see how it plays out. Also bring him into the process of coming up with strategies for dad (I'll have another post about dad).
Its important to help your guy feel like he has plenty of choices, and also that he has plenty of capabilities. You can say "yes" all day long, but if he needs a chair to reach the light-switch, can't open a jar without help, can't find his socks and then it rains he'll fall apart. Little things like that will add up to "this is the worst day of my life" without you even noticing! So look for ways to make his life easier overall. Help him feel in control so that when the world is out of control (and it will be) he's less likely to fall to pieces (but still have strategies in place for when he does, because he will).
Also come up with strategies and agreements with your dd for what to do "in the moment". Let her know you want her to be safe.
---Meredith (Mo 8, Ray 16)
Ulrike haupt
Hi Stephanie
From what I am learning it is really not possible to tell you exactly what
the unmet need may be. But you can figure it out yuorself. When he gets into
his 'fit' HOW do you feel at the first moment? That is the key to what the
unmet need is. Do you feel angry and want to overpower him? Then he is
asking for appropriate empowerment, Do you feel irritated and frustrated?
Then his need is for appropriate attention. Do you feel hurt and wantt o
hurt back he may be expresing the inappropriate goal of revenge for which
the 'therapy' is to go for ultimate child acceptance and appreciation. Or
you may feel insecure and have the urge to 'help' him cope which indicates
that he has a need for smaller chunks of experiences to enable him to cope.
As I said, just having a meltdown does not really indicate the unmet need.
Blissings
Ulrike
From Namibia - somewhere in Africa
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From what I am learning it is really not possible to tell you exactly what
the unmet need may be. But you can figure it out yuorself. When he gets into
his 'fit' HOW do you feel at the first moment? That is the key to what the
unmet need is. Do you feel angry and want to overpower him? Then he is
asking for appropriate empowerment, Do you feel irritated and frustrated?
Then his need is for appropriate attention. Do you feel hurt and wantt o
hurt back he may be expresing the inappropriate goal of revenge for which
the 'therapy' is to go for ultimate child acceptance and appreciation. Or
you may feel insecure and have the urge to 'help' him cope which indicates
that he has a need for smaller chunks of experiences to enable him to cope.
As I said, just having a meltdown does not really indicate the unmet need.
Blissings
Ulrike
From Namibia - somewhere in Africa
__________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature
database 5108 (20100512) __________
The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.
http://www.eset.com
Erica
Stephanie,
Before I go any farther, I'm speaking as a mom here who experiences what you're describing multiple times, daily. So I truly empathize with your frustrations. I would encourage you to continue trial and error in attempting to get to the 'roots' of the issue. Has DS always been this way or was there a definitive age where you noticed a distinct change in his behaviors? What makes it better? Worse? The questioning process is exhausting, but I have found that as I 'talk' through things, I'm able to pick up on things that actually are working. Things that may have become so automatic that I'm not even aware of their effectiveness.
It is very challenging as a parent to observe how one child's intense actions are negatively impacting your other children, your quality of life and the daily dynamics of your household. You are not alone!
One book that I would seek out is "When My Worries Get Too Big" by Kari Dunn Buron. It's actually kind of like a story woven into a workbook that helps to identify feelings on a scale and then come up with a plan of how to handle those feelings etc. Amazon does a much better job of explaining it! :-) http://tinyurl.com/2645wo7
Erica
Before I go any farther, I'm speaking as a mom here who experiences what you're describing multiple times, daily. So I truly empathize with your frustrations. I would encourage you to continue trial and error in attempting to get to the 'roots' of the issue. Has DS always been this way or was there a definitive age where you noticed a distinct change in his behaviors? What makes it better? Worse? The questioning process is exhausting, but I have found that as I 'talk' through things, I'm able to pick up on things that actually are working. Things that may have become so automatic that I'm not even aware of their effectiveness.
It is very challenging as a parent to observe how one child's intense actions are negatively impacting your other children, your quality of life and the daily dynamics of your household. You are not alone!
One book that I would seek out is "When My Worries Get Too Big" by Kari Dunn Buron. It's actually kind of like a story woven into a workbook that helps to identify feelings on a scale and then come up with a plan of how to handle those feelings etc. Amazon does a much better job of explaining it! :-) http://tinyurl.com/2645wo7
Erica
plaidpanties666
--- In [email protected], Stephanie Kimball <kimball.stephanie@...> wrote:
Beyond that, if he likes a script, here are some things George recommends, from the time when Ray lived with his bio-mom and George only had weekend visits:
George says:
Only do kid things when your kid is visiting. Don't run errands, clean house or work on the car, do things your kid enjoys. Make it a priority to have a fun day with your kid. Remember this is all the time you get to be a dad, so make the most of it. Keep your time fun and positive. Be a "yes" man. Don't worry about "being consistent" with rules or teaching your kid lessons, the most important lesson he needs is that his dad loves him, so focus on that. Treat kid-days like a vacation - kids don't expect all the same rules on vacation so it won't "undermine" the other parent.
*****
Given that you son's pretty high energy, you could suggest big-body things for him and dad to do together. I think your advice to stop giving ultimatums and apologize is good!
---Meredith
>> I expect my kids' dad will be confronting me soon on how to deal withIs he willing to take the kids on separate days? That might help *him* in the sense of giving him only one persons needs to deal with at a time, and also give your kids some special time with each parent.
> DS. He (their dad) has never been a hands-on parent, aside from
> taking them on occasional fun outings on weekends. He has always
> looked to me to figure things out and deal with them, and advise him
> how to proceed -- except he doesn't catch on well to the gist of
> things, instead taking whatever I might say as a script.
Beyond that, if he likes a script, here are some things George recommends, from the time when Ray lived with his bio-mom and George only had weekend visits:
George says:
Only do kid things when your kid is visiting. Don't run errands, clean house or work on the car, do things your kid enjoys. Make it a priority to have a fun day with your kid. Remember this is all the time you get to be a dad, so make the most of it. Keep your time fun and positive. Be a "yes" man. Don't worry about "being consistent" with rules or teaching your kid lessons, the most important lesson he needs is that his dad loves him, so focus on that. Treat kid-days like a vacation - kids don't expect all the same rules on vacation so it won't "undermine" the other parent.
*****
Given that you son's pretty high energy, you could suggest big-body things for him and dad to do together. I think your advice to stop giving ultimatums and apologize is good!
---Meredith
Paul & Camille
Just wanted to share - I had a problem with my 6 y.o son hitting us,
often. I had tried alot of different things regarding this including a
bouncy toy that stood up after being hit. I ended up telling him that it
hurt my feelings when he hit me and I didnt hit him and didnt like him
hitting me. Later that afternoon he asked me if I would come into his
room and he talked to me about it.... He had been hit at age 4 by a boy
aged 8 at Church! and even though he hit him back that was the first and
only time he has been treated like this. He had also been asking me to
hit him!!!! which freaked me out somewhat also. So when I went into his
room he said to me that he often has a 'picture in his head' of Jacq
hitting him. We spoke about how it made him feel, how he could do
something else when those pictures came into his head and also that it was
*not* his fault and that Jacq was the one with the problem and not ds. I
also told him that we would never hit him ever, and that if anyone else
did to let me know and I will help him deal with it right away. This was
about 3 weeks ago and he hasnt hit anyone since the talk. I think it
helped him to release his feelings and feel safe. I found it really
interesting how something that happened so long ago could affect him like
this and his coping mechanisms, you just never know what it maybe.
often. I had tried alot of different things regarding this including a
bouncy toy that stood up after being hit. I ended up telling him that it
hurt my feelings when he hit me and I didnt hit him and didnt like him
hitting me. Later that afternoon he asked me if I would come into his
room and he talked to me about it.... He had been hit at age 4 by a boy
aged 8 at Church! and even though he hit him back that was the first and
only time he has been treated like this. He had also been asking me to
hit him!!!! which freaked me out somewhat also. So when I went into his
room he said to me that he often has a 'picture in his head' of Jacq
hitting him. We spoke about how it made him feel, how he could do
something else when those pictures came into his head and also that it was
*not* his fault and that Jacq was the one with the problem and not ds. I
also told him that we would never hit him ever, and that if anyone else
did to let me know and I will help him deal with it right away. This was
about 3 weeks ago and he hasnt hit anyone since the talk. I think it
helped him to release his feelings and feel safe. I found it really
interesting how something that happened so long ago could affect him like
this and his coping mechanisms, you just never know what it maybe.
lparaujo2001
Hi. I'm a member who has never posted but this thread hit a cord. I had problems with my eldest son's violence towards my younger two sons for many years, and it got the point -- without getting into too much detail -- that it just became too much for me and my husband to handle before our family just split apart. We homeschooled and unschooled our son for nine years, but we had to come to the conclusion of seeking assistance from outside the home before it got the point of no return as we feared for the safety of everyone in the home due to my son's explosive rages during the day while my husband worked outside the home. My son, who is now 13 going on 14, is autistic, has asperger's, and is on the low spectrum of mentally retarded and is extremely physically strong and has been enrolled in a school for children with special needs for the last two years where he receives therapy for his emotional issues and physical meltdowns and outbursts, and we get coached along as well as a family so that we can contribute positively to our son's success in the home and outside the home. He's not perfect and once in a while he'll revert and have an emotional and physical meltdown, but we are much better at handling the situation, and he too now has a better grip of calming himself down with the tools he has received at school when he's in the process of a meltdown. Progress has been slow but steady but things have gotten better as there is a light at the end of the tunnel where there is hope and there is proof of change for the better as he feels so much better about himself, and we are in loving support of trying to do all we can to help him succeed in life and seeking assistance outside the home was the way to go for us. It may not be for you, but sometimes a fresh, different perspective helps and no one knows how it feels unless they've walked in your shoes as its an emotionally exhausting toll-taking road. I have walked in your shoes, dear, and believe me, you aren not alone. If you want to e-mail me privately, please do. Best to you, your son, and your family.
Leticia
Leticia
plaidpanties666
--- In [email protected], "lparaujo2001" <lparaujo2001@...> wrote:
I think this is a really important point - sometimes outside help is vital! Please don't anyone think that unschooling always means going it alone or sticking it out for the sake of an ideal.
The Most important part of unschooling is to foster the relationships within the family. If there's something going on in your family that's tearing apart relationships, that's the biggest most important issue to address, and as Leticia points out, sometime an outside perspective can help a lot!
When Ray went to live with his bio-mom George and I had one caveat, which was that he *had to* go to school. Sounds funny coming from me, right? But I'd do it again because I honestly believe it was better for Ray's relationship with his bio-mom and his relationship with himeself, too. Some family situations Don't work with unschooling.
I also can't help but thinking - this is a 10yo boy. He's getting close to puberty, and that's a time when boys in divorced families often feel the need for a dad more sharply than before. Even if moving in with dad within the next couple years isn't a possibility, its worthwhile to honor that need for connection between a son and his father.
---Meredith (Mo 8, Ray 16)
>we had to come to the conclusion of seeking assistance from outside the home before it got the point of no return****************
I think this is a really important point - sometimes outside help is vital! Please don't anyone think that unschooling always means going it alone or sticking it out for the sake of an ideal.
The Most important part of unschooling is to foster the relationships within the family. If there's something going on in your family that's tearing apart relationships, that's the biggest most important issue to address, and as Leticia points out, sometime an outside perspective can help a lot!
When Ray went to live with his bio-mom George and I had one caveat, which was that he *had to* go to school. Sounds funny coming from me, right? But I'd do it again because I honestly believe it was better for Ray's relationship with his bio-mom and his relationship with himeself, too. Some family situations Don't work with unschooling.
>>he receives therapy for his emotional issuesOh! Something I meant to bring up was the idea of therapy. That's a can of worms, trying to explain unschooling to a therapist, for sure, but in the original question there's a divorce. I know from experience that divorce can play a big big part in the sorts of emotional issues that come up with kids who are melting down in violent ways, and that might be something to address in a therapy sort of situation.
I also can't help but thinking - this is a 10yo boy. He's getting close to puberty, and that's a time when boys in divorced families often feel the need for a dad more sharply than before. Even if moving in with dad within the next couple years isn't a possibility, its worthwhile to honor that need for connection between a son and his father.
---Meredith (Mo 8, Ray 16)
Erica Guthaus
On May 13, 2010, at 1:24 PM, plaidpanties666 wrote:
someone who is still new to this list, but not so new to the idea of
unschooling, I've kind of felt like many of the responses to varying
posts do send a message that you can do all things better at home
without interventions mucking up the process. Not meaning to sound
harsh and of course that just my opinion.
It is hard when you're already in a schooling mindset that swims
against the stream to be dealing with a kid that also swims upstream
as well and the suggestions make everything seem so easy if only you
would ____ (fill in the blank)
Grace,
Erica
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> I think this is a really important point - sometimes outside helpMeredith thank you for clarifying that in no uncertain terms! As
> is vital! Please don't anyone think that unschooling always means
> going it alone or sticking it out for the sake of an ideal.
someone who is still new to this list, but not so new to the idea of
unschooling, I've kind of felt like many of the responses to varying
posts do send a message that you can do all things better at home
without interventions mucking up the process. Not meaning to sound
harsh and of course that just my opinion.
It is hard when you're already in a schooling mindset that swims
against the stream to be dealing with a kid that also swims upstream
as well and the suggestions make everything seem so easy if only you
would ____ (fill in the blank)
Grace,
Erica
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Nicole Willoughby
I feel like you have gotten some really great responses. I have an autistic son who is very violent at times and Ive had to hospitalize him twice. Its not my ideal thing to do but my girls also have the right to live in a safe happy house :)
You can't always do it alone and you should'nt have to.
If you decide you might one some outside help please see this link.
http://www.healthedadlit.com/
Dr. Stowe used to be my oldest's pediatrician when she was a baby and Id still happily be using her had we not moved. She is in north houston but may be able to do consultations over the phone or refer you to someone in your area.
Oh and btw, she is an unschooler -;)
Nicole
"I've seen the village, and I don't want it raising my child." - LC
You can't always do it alone and you should'nt have to.
If you decide you might one some outside help please see this link.
http://www.healthedadlit.com/
Dr. Stowe used to be my oldest's pediatrician when she was a baby and Id still happily be using her had we not moved. She is in north houston but may be able to do consultations over the phone or refer you to someone in your area.
Oh and btw, she is an unschooler -;)
Nicole
"I've seen the village, and I don't want it raising my child." - LC
--- On Thu, 5/13/10, plaidpanties666 <plaidpanties666@...> wrote:
From: plaidpanties666 <plaidpanties666@...>
Subject: [unschoolingbasics] Re: how to deal with violence
To: [email protected]
Date: Thursday, May 13, 2010, 12:24 PM
--- In unschoolingbasics@ yahoogroups. com, "lparaujo2001" <lparaujo2001@ ...> wrote:
>we had to come to the conclusion of seeking assistance from outside the home before it got the point of no return
************ ****
I think this is a really important point - sometimes outside help is vital! Please don't anyone think that unschooling always means going it alone or sticking it out for the sake of an ideal.
The Most important part of unschooling is to foster the relationships within the family. If there's something going on in your family that's tearing apart relationships, that's the biggest most important issue to address, and as Leticia points out, sometime an outside perspective can help a lot!
When Ray went to live with his bio-mom George and I had one caveat, which was that he *had to* go to school. Sounds funny coming from me, right? But I'd do it again because I honestly believe it was better for Ray's relationship with his bio-mom and his relationship with himeself, too. Some family situations Don't work with unschooling.
>>he receives therapy for his emotional issues
Oh! Something I meant to bring up was the idea of therapy. That's a can of worms, trying to explain unschooling to a therapist, for sure, but in the original question there's a divorce. I know from experience that divorce can play a big big part in the sorts of emotional issues that come up with kids who are melting down in violent ways, and that might be something to address in a therapy sort of situation.
I also can't help but thinking - this is a 10yo boy. He's getting close to puberty, and that's a time when boys in divorced families often feel the need for a dad more sharply than before. Even if moving in with dad within the next couple years isn't a possibility, its worthwhile to honor that need for connection between a son and his father.
---Meredith (Mo 8, Ray 16)
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]