Where have the parents gone? (about kid movies/TV)
~*~Tracy Austin
Why are the parents always missing or killed-off in so many movies/cartoons? My son (4) expressed an interest in seeing The Land Before Time. It's the adventures of cartoon dinosaurs. I went to Netflix to get it and read the description to find that he's an orphaned dino whose parents were killed in an earth quake...
This theme is prevalent in many kids movies/cartoons. My thinking is that if they had parents around that they had to go home to every night, it would cut short the adventure aspect of the shows:-) I have heard TV nay-sayers bring up this point as being a reason to avoid these types of shows and so thought I would post here and ask what the unschooling perspective is?
What comes to mind for me is that it could make kids resent their parents because if they were gone, life would be more fun...like on TV.
Thanks,
Tracy
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
This theme is prevalent in many kids movies/cartoons. My thinking is that if they had parents around that they had to go home to every night, it would cut short the adventure aspect of the shows:-) I have heard TV nay-sayers bring up this point as being a reason to avoid these types of shows and so thought I would post here and ask what the unschooling perspective is?
What comes to mind for me is that it could make kids resent their parents because if they were gone, life would be more fun...like on TV.
Thanks,
Tracy
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Joyce Fetteroll
On Jan 15, 2010, at 8:58 AM, ~*~Tracy Austin wrote:
parents out of the picture so the kids can face dangerous challenges.
I think even unschooling parents would draw the line at slaying
dragons and battling the evil overlord. Or at least the parents would
want to go along!
Why do the heroes of most books and movies not have a spouse and kids?
In Japanese cartoons and comics it's pretty much endemic that parents
work outside the country leaving their junior high and high school
kids to raise themselves ;-)
Joyce
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> My thinking is that if they had parents around that they had to goI think that's pretty much it. There needs to be some way to get the
> home to every night, it would cut short the adventure aspect of the
> shows:-)
parents out of the picture so the kids can face dangerous challenges.
I think even unschooling parents would draw the line at slaying
dragons and battling the evil overlord. Or at least the parents would
want to go along!
Why do the heroes of most books and movies not have a spouse and kids?
In Japanese cartoons and comics it's pretty much endemic that parents
work outside the country leaving their junior high and high school
kids to raise themselves ;-)
Joyce
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Hael
TRACY said: Why are the parents always missing or killed-off in so many
movies/cartoons? This theme is prevalent in many kids movies/cartoons.
My thinking is that if they had parents around that they had to go home
to every night, it would cut short the adventure aspect of the shows:-)
I realized when I read this that these were the types of shows *I*
always loved as a kid. I loved Punky Brewster (orphan) and all the
other TV shows about orphaned or abandoned children; there were tons of
movies out there about orphaned kids, or kids who had been separated
from their parents and had to face some challenge or adventure. Oliver
Twist, Empire of the Sun, shows about kids at boarding schools. Loved
'em all.
TRACY said: I have heard TV nay-sayers bring up this point as being a
reason to avoid these types of shows and so thought I would post here
and ask what the unschooling perspective is?
I don't know what the "general" unschooling perspective is, but as I've
been learning more about unschooling and the idea of trying not to
control and order your kids around, it strikes me that maybe what is so
appealing about these types of shows, especially to children who ARE
heavily controlled, is that it offers the alternative. It shows what
life would be like or could be like if you had the ability to make your
own choices (as a child).
As I was reading this and thinking about it, I also remembered that my
pretend play as a child was always about being abandoned or orphaned. I
was the sole person in control of my destiny during my pretend play.
I grew up with two very loving, albeit VERY controlling parents. I was
told everything to do, from what to wear, what to eat, what to think,
how to behave. The only place I was NOT controlled was in my pretend
play -- I wrote a lot of stories about children in control.
It strikes me now that perhaps this outlet is what controlled children
need and desire to act out their fantasies of being able to choose
things like what they eat and where they go and how they decide the next
move.
TRACY said: What comes to mind for me is that it could make kids resent
their parents because if they were gone, life would be more fun...like
on TV.
I doubt this, only from the perspective of a child who grew up adoring
this kind of stuff, and loved my parents like crazy. We went through
some rough patches during my teens and early 20s, because of their
controlling behavior. It strikes me that if they had not been quite so
controlling, perhaps I would not have resented them so much during those
years. But it wasn't because of movies and TV that I resented them, I
don't think.
Now, I continue to adore my parents and have a terrific relationship
with them, although we disagree on how to raise children (surprise).
I wonder how fascinated my own children will be with such themes, if
they are NOT so heavily controlled.
Interesting....
Thanks for the food for thought.
Deb
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
movies/cartoons? This theme is prevalent in many kids movies/cartoons.
My thinking is that if they had parents around that they had to go home
to every night, it would cut short the adventure aspect of the shows:-)
I realized when I read this that these were the types of shows *I*
always loved as a kid. I loved Punky Brewster (orphan) and all the
other TV shows about orphaned or abandoned children; there were tons of
movies out there about orphaned kids, or kids who had been separated
from their parents and had to face some challenge or adventure. Oliver
Twist, Empire of the Sun, shows about kids at boarding schools. Loved
'em all.
TRACY said: I have heard TV nay-sayers bring up this point as being a
reason to avoid these types of shows and so thought I would post here
and ask what the unschooling perspective is?
I don't know what the "general" unschooling perspective is, but as I've
been learning more about unschooling and the idea of trying not to
control and order your kids around, it strikes me that maybe what is so
appealing about these types of shows, especially to children who ARE
heavily controlled, is that it offers the alternative. It shows what
life would be like or could be like if you had the ability to make your
own choices (as a child).
As I was reading this and thinking about it, I also remembered that my
pretend play as a child was always about being abandoned or orphaned. I
was the sole person in control of my destiny during my pretend play.
I grew up with two very loving, albeit VERY controlling parents. I was
told everything to do, from what to wear, what to eat, what to think,
how to behave. The only place I was NOT controlled was in my pretend
play -- I wrote a lot of stories about children in control.
It strikes me now that perhaps this outlet is what controlled children
need and desire to act out their fantasies of being able to choose
things like what they eat and where they go and how they decide the next
move.
TRACY said: What comes to mind for me is that it could make kids resent
their parents because if they were gone, life would be more fun...like
on TV.
I doubt this, only from the perspective of a child who grew up adoring
this kind of stuff, and loved my parents like crazy. We went through
some rough patches during my teens and early 20s, because of their
controlling behavior. It strikes me that if they had not been quite so
controlling, perhaps I would not have resented them so much during those
years. But it wasn't because of movies and TV that I resented them, I
don't think.
Now, I continue to adore my parents and have a terrific relationship
with them, although we disagree on how to raise children (surprise).
I wonder how fascinated my own children will be with such themes, if
they are NOT so heavily controlled.
Interesting....
Thanks for the food for thought.
Deb
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Monica Van Stelton
Hello,
I think you are right parents care for their children that is why they set limits and movie makers won't make much money if they have to put limits too. What ever makes them make more money...That is part of the reason we don't watch tv at home. I watch netflix and you tube at night when my baby is asleep. This way I am the one who shapes and expose him to the real world. Tv gives children the idea that whatever they are watching is real they don't know the difference. Even adults cry with sad movies...why do we cry if it is not real, nobody got killed or hurt for real....but it gives you a sense of reality when you see the characters in the movie, because they are real.
Anyway, I won't let my son watch tv until he can spell it and write the whole word and even then it won't be tv, maybe some educational videos.
Monica
I think you are right parents care for their children that is why they set limits and movie makers won't make much money if they have to put limits too. What ever makes them make more money...That is part of the reason we don't watch tv at home. I watch netflix and you tube at night when my baby is asleep. This way I am the one who shapes and expose him to the real world. Tv gives children the idea that whatever they are watching is real they don't know the difference. Even adults cry with sad movies...why do we cry if it is not real, nobody got killed or hurt for real....but it gives you a sense of reality when you see the characters in the movie, because they are real.
Anyway, I won't let my son watch tv until he can spell it and write the whole word and even then it won't be tv, maybe some educational videos.
Monica
plaidpanties666
--- In [email protected], "~*~Tracy Austin" <webinfusion@...> wrote:
And legends and fairy tales too, don't forget, its not exactly a modern phenomenon.
From the perspective of actually *writing* fiction, its a useful plot device, much like using a foreigner as a main character (and less often a person with a severe disability). Its *effective* to offer your viewer/listener/reader a perspective of someone who is a little out of place, a little mystified and hampered by the complexities of the world of your story. It gives you reasons to explain things, or reasons to keep your audience guessing! The child or foreigner can also make mistakes that adults wouldn't be expected to make, which advances the plot nicely. In terms of character development, children are also convenient in that the audience is easily willing to accept growth and change - adults are often so ossified in who they are, and that's not so fun for the audience.
---Meredith (Mo 8, Ray 16)
>*****************
> Why are the parents always missing or killed-off in so many movies/cartoons?
And legends and fairy tales too, don't forget, its not exactly a modern phenomenon.
From the perspective of actually *writing* fiction, its a useful plot device, much like using a foreigner as a main character (and less often a person with a severe disability). Its *effective* to offer your viewer/listener/reader a perspective of someone who is a little out of place, a little mystified and hampered by the complexities of the world of your story. It gives you reasons to explain things, or reasons to keep your audience guessing! The child or foreigner can also make mistakes that adults wouldn't be expected to make, which advances the plot nicely. In terms of character development, children are also convenient in that the audience is easily willing to accept growth and change - adults are often so ossified in who they are, and that's not so fun for the audience.
---Meredith (Mo 8, Ray 16)
plaidpanties666
-- In [email protected], Monica Van Stelton <tatyland_usa@...> wrote:
Modern parents set limits because they've been told its good parenting to do so - it certainly comes out of care, but also from a history in which neither parents nor children had the choices that exist nowadays. Its not necessary to set limits for children to experience that care. Helping children problem solve and find ways to overcome the very natural limits of the world around them shows them just as much care, as well as providing them with a valuable resource in the form of helpful parents.
Actually, adults are the ones who do that - kids are pretty good about figuring out the differences for themselves, when adults don't confuse the matter by treating a moving picture like its real life.
The ability to write "television" doesn't have much to do with the ability to indicate that he does or doesn't want to watch a particular show. If you're watching something and your child is present, be aware of your child! That's a much better strategy than making some kind of rule. Watch your child watching and see what his reaction is. Is he bored? Find something else to watch. Is he upset? Find something else to watch. Is he confused? Watch Him more. Ask if he wants to talk about it, if he's the talking sort. Or play out some of the themes from the show to help him explore concepts if he'd rather.
Empowering a child where any kind of media is concerned is a very interactive process in the same way empowering a child to learn about everything else is interactive. Children explore and experiment and they hope to have the support of their parents - not to stand in the way of what they want to explore, but to work with them so that they can be the ones to discover their own interests and their own comfort levels.
---Meredith (Mo 8, Ray 16)
> I think you are right parents care for their children that is why they set limits***************
Modern parents set limits because they've been told its good parenting to do so - it certainly comes out of care, but also from a history in which neither parents nor children had the choices that exist nowadays. Its not necessary to set limits for children to experience that care. Helping children problem solve and find ways to overcome the very natural limits of the world around them shows them just as much care, as well as providing them with a valuable resource in the form of helpful parents.
>>I watch netflix and you tube at night when my baby is asleep.Babies aren't often much interested in tv or movies, they're interested in direct personal experience. Some young children adore movies and tv and find enormous value in being able to watch and watch and watch - while others will be passingly interested and not watch so much. In any case, what young children "get" from any particular show or movie is often very very different from what adults perceive.
>>This way I am the one who shapes and expose him to the real world.Unschooling isn't about shaping children, its about living with them in partnership. Young children are remarkably good about letting parents know what they do and don't want to be "exposed to". Its totally possible to learn to respond to your child's cues and discover what he or she finds marvelous - or unsettling or dull or otherwise inappropriate for that particular child at that particular time.
>>Tv gives children the idea that whatever they are watching is real they don't know the difference.*******************
Actually, adults are the ones who do that - kids are pretty good about figuring out the differences for themselves, when adults don't confuse the matter by treating a moving picture like its real life.
>>Even adults cry with sad movies...why do we cry if it is not realWe cry because we choose to explore those emotions. Just last night I climbed into the bathtub with a book I Knew would make me cry - it was an active choice on my part. When kids are empowered where media are concerned, they also have the ability to choose to explore. They can Choose to be scared, or disgusted, or sad, or they can choose to leave the room or say "I don't want to watch this" with the knowledge that that's okay.
>>> Anyway, I won't let my son watch tv until he can spell it and write the whole  word***********************
The ability to write "television" doesn't have much to do with the ability to indicate that he does or doesn't want to watch a particular show. If you're watching something and your child is present, be aware of your child! That's a much better strategy than making some kind of rule. Watch your child watching and see what his reaction is. Is he bored? Find something else to watch. Is he upset? Find something else to watch. Is he confused? Watch Him more. Ask if he wants to talk about it, if he's the talking sort. Or play out some of the themes from the show to help him explore concepts if he'd rather.
Empowering a child where any kind of media is concerned is a very interactive process in the same way empowering a child to learn about everything else is interactive. Children explore and experiment and they hope to have the support of their parents - not to stand in the way of what they want to explore, but to work with them so that they can be the ones to discover their own interests and their own comfort levels.
---Meredith (Mo 8, Ray 16)
Joyce Fetteroll
On Jan 15, 2010, at 10:47 AM, Monica Van Stelton wrote:
story. The foundation of good story telling is a character who has a
problem (desire) with obstacles in his path for him to overcome.
That's nothing new. It's been that way since the beginning of stories.
Parents are big obstacles between kids and adventure, but if they
were obstacles in every story for kids it would get dull. Easier and
quicker to get right to the story about a strong, capable,
independent child (like the child reading or watching wants to be) to
remove the parents from the picture. (Orphaning is one way, but
there's also camp, sending parents off to work, hospitals, make them
wacky eccentrics and so on.)
Even unschooling parents would be obstacles to a good story because
they'd be in there helping, not letting the child risk life and limb
on their own. *I* didn't want to read about parents and their kids
when I was a kid. I wanted to read about strong competent kids
solving their own problems.
off the grid. Even if your computer and internet access is from the
library you're using resources provided by others who've made money.
Not much different than sneaking a drink or a smoke or other thing
you think it's bad for kids. It's not only hypocritical but it sets
up an "okay for adults/bad for kids" dichotomy that increases the
value of that commodity, makes it a right of passage from being a
controlled kid to a free adult.
But, even so, shaping isn't a good image for unschoolers to hold. Nor
is casting oneself as the gateway to the world.
While it is true unschooling parents are the gateway, that's just the
way life is set up and to expand our children's worlds, help them
explore what interests them, it's helpful to be aware of that power
and do what we can to step back and open the doors that intrigue them
rather than just the doors we want them to have.
several fantasies my daughter held onto for a long time because she
wanted them to be true (Pokemon :-) it won't help parents relate to
their children to see their kids as easily fooled by the difference
between reality and fantasy.
In fact it's often *parents* that have a problem telling reality from
fantasy when they claim violent video games and TV will cause kids to
be violent. *Kids* know they aren't killing anyone in a video game.
They can restart it and the "dead" character and "destroyed"
buildings will be back. It's confusing to kids to call that violence.
(Especially if the parent is using real life strong arm controlling
tactics to stop the child from pretend violence!)
point of story telling? Story telling evolved *because* we can care
about people and animals and things who aren't real.
just wrapped in different clothing. (Can't watch until he can spell
it?? Maybe?? So if you change your mind when he can spell it, it'll
be "Oops, didn't really mean it!")
A lot of the words spent explaining unschooling are about how to
build relationships. This is about control and fear, the antithesis
of what we're trying to help parents get. It's advice parents can get
from any parenting board. This site offers ways to help parents deal
with their fears and partner with their child to explore the world.
Make their worlds bigger, not smaller with walls against the scary
monsters of TV and sugar and unnatural cotton.
Joyce
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> I think you are right parents care for their children that is whyThey won't make much money because they won't be telling an engaging
> they set limits and movie makers won't make much money if they have
> to put limits too.
story. The foundation of good story telling is a character who has a
problem (desire) with obstacles in his path for him to overcome.
That's nothing new. It's been that way since the beginning of stories.
Parents are big obstacles between kids and adventure, but if they
were obstacles in every story for kids it would get dull. Easier and
quicker to get right to the story about a strong, capable,
independent child (like the child reading or watching wants to be) to
remove the parents from the picture. (Orphaning is one way, but
there's also camp, sending parents off to work, hospitals, make them
wacky eccentrics and so on.)
Even unschooling parents would be obstacles to a good story because
they'd be in there helping, not letting the child risk life and limb
on their own. *I* didn't want to read about parents and their kids
when I was a kid. I wanted to read about strong competent kids
solving their own problems.
> What ever makes them make more money...So if making money is bad, I hope your family is self sufficient and
off the grid. Even if your computer and internet access is from the
library you're using resources provided by others who've made money.
> That is part of the reason we don't watch tv at home. I watchSo you sneak it.
> netflix and you tube at night when my baby is asleep.
Not much different than sneaking a drink or a smoke or other thing
you think it's bad for kids. It's not only hypocritical but it sets
up an "okay for adults/bad for kids" dichotomy that increases the
value of that commodity, makes it a right of passage from being a
controlled kid to a free adult.
> This way I am the one who shapes and expose him to the real world.We're discussing stories.
But, even so, shaping isn't a good image for unschoolers to hold. Nor
is casting oneself as the gateway to the world.
While it is true unschooling parents are the gateway, that's just the
way life is set up and to expand our children's worlds, help them
explore what interests them, it's helpful to be aware of that power
and do what we can to step back and open the doors that intrigue them
rather than just the doors we want them to have.
> Tv gives children the idea that whatever they are watching is realThat statement's painted with too broad of a brush. While there were
> they don't know the difference.
several fantasies my daughter held onto for a long time because she
wanted them to be true (Pokemon :-) it won't help parents relate to
their children to see their kids as easily fooled by the difference
between reality and fantasy.
In fact it's often *parents* that have a problem telling reality from
fantasy when they claim violent video games and TV will cause kids to
be violent. *Kids* know they aren't killing anyone in a video game.
They can restart it and the "dead" character and "destroyed"
buildings will be back. It's confusing to kids to call that violence.
(Especially if the parent is using real life strong arm controlling
tactics to stop the child from pretend violence!)
> Even adults cry with sad movies...why do we cry if it is not real,If we couldn't care about fictional characters, what would be the
> nobody got killed or hurt for real....but it gives you a sense of
> reality when you see the characters in the movie, because they are
> real.
point of story telling? Story telling evolved *because* we can care
about people and animals and things who aren't real.
> Anyway, I won't let my son watch tv until he can spell it and writeThis is not an unschooling perspective. It's the same old, same old
> the whole word and even then it won't be tv, maybe some
> educational videos.
just wrapped in different clothing. (Can't watch until he can spell
it?? Maybe?? So if you change your mind when he can spell it, it'll
be "Oops, didn't really mean it!")
A lot of the words spent explaining unschooling are about how to
build relationships. This is about control and fear, the antithesis
of what we're trying to help parents get. It's advice parents can get
from any parenting board. This site offers ways to help parents deal
with their fears and partner with their child to explore the world.
Make their worlds bigger, not smaller with walls against the scary
monsters of TV and sugar and unnatural cotton.
Joyce
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
BRIAN POLIKOWSKY
Little Bear has great parents!
Alex Polikowsky
http://polykow.blogspot.com/
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/unschoolingmn/
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Alex Polikowsky
http://polykow.blogspot.com/
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/unschoolingmn/
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
NCMama
> Little Bear has great parents!He does - but a lot of his adventures have to do with when his parent's *aren't* there. Going fishing and telling the story of catching a mermaid, making his own birthday party, even the space story was in his imagination - his mom was at home while he was outside.
This is my perspective with the books - we've never watched the show!
Caren
Krisula Moyer
My son and I watched The Land before time (the first one, by Spielberg) when he was 3. He sobbed and grieved for hours the first time he saw it. I had no idea before we watched it (at Grandma's house) that it would be so emotional. He strongly identified with the little dinosaur and said "why did the mommy have to die" many times.
I thought he would never want to watch it again but the next time we visited my parents it was the first thing he asked for. He watched it many many times, usually asking to sit on my lap and hold on to me as he watched. I asked my parents not to bring it out when I wasn't there because my being there seemed so important to him at certain points during the film and I wasn't sure he'd remember that at the beginning, just that he liked the movie.
There is something about the deep fear of losing one's parents that is at the heart of the pervasive "orphan" theme, I think. But also, the idea that the hero must go through some kind of challenge or solve a difficult problem which, if he has no parents he must face it / grow / prove himself to succeed. If the parents are in the film they would of course rescue, protect, help. Another way to achieve this hero's autonomy is to make the parent really mean (like Matilda) ... or prevent them in some way from helping the little hero. (like teh Chronicles of Narnia) ... This kind of fantasy is appealing because it explores the idea of "am I strong enough,? am I big enough? good enough, smart enough, etc to solve life's problems?"
Themes where friends or groups are on a quest together (Lord of the Rings type) could be achieved in a family setting though. I'm thinking "The Incredibles" where every part of the family was important to succeeding against the evil antagonist.
Krisula Moyer
The Seer, the novel
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
I thought he would never want to watch it again but the next time we visited my parents it was the first thing he asked for. He watched it many many times, usually asking to sit on my lap and hold on to me as he watched. I asked my parents not to bring it out when I wasn't there because my being there seemed so important to him at certain points during the film and I wasn't sure he'd remember that at the beginning, just that he liked the movie.
There is something about the deep fear of losing one's parents that is at the heart of the pervasive "orphan" theme, I think. But also, the idea that the hero must go through some kind of challenge or solve a difficult problem which, if he has no parents he must face it / grow / prove himself to succeed. If the parents are in the film they would of course rescue, protect, help. Another way to achieve this hero's autonomy is to make the parent really mean (like Matilda) ... or prevent them in some way from helping the little hero. (like teh Chronicles of Narnia) ... This kind of fantasy is appealing because it explores the idea of "am I strong enough,? am I big enough? good enough, smart enough, etc to solve life's problems?"
Themes where friends or groups are on a quest together (Lord of the Rings type) could be achieved in a family setting though. I'm thinking "The Incredibles" where every part of the family was important to succeeding against the evil antagonist.
Krisula Moyer
The Seer, the novel
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
VickiJ
My daughter experienced "The Land Before Time" the same way as your son did, and at the same age or younger. I had no idea she would be so overwhelmed by the loss of the character's parents. It was heartbreaking for me how she grieved, so much so that she could not continue to watch the movie.
There was a lot of talking about movies after that, about how sometimes there are sad parts, and if you can feel sad but keep watching the movie, then the sad parts change to happier times, and things work out better. Many movies were watched with her sitting right on my lap in case she needed to be comforted, and we'd turn off the movie for awhile and maybe cry, maybe talk about the story, then at some point turn it back on and watch the rest. Those movies gave us reasons "in the moment" to talk about issues like loss, especially of parents.
I'll never forget that tiny girl curled up on her "nest" where she liked to watch tv, sobbing. She's 25 now, kind, sensitive, smart, and funny. I think that times like those, times it was so clear what she needed, times it was so natural to speak to her feelings, helped her become the person she is.
There was a lot of talking about movies after that, about how sometimes there are sad parts, and if you can feel sad but keep watching the movie, then the sad parts change to happier times, and things work out better. Many movies were watched with her sitting right on my lap in case she needed to be comforted, and we'd turn off the movie for awhile and maybe cry, maybe talk about the story, then at some point turn it back on and watch the rest. Those movies gave us reasons "in the moment" to talk about issues like loss, especially of parents.
I'll never forget that tiny girl curled up on her "nest" where she liked to watch tv, sobbing. She's 25 now, kind, sensitive, smart, and funny. I think that times like those, times it was so clear what she needed, times it was so natural to speak to her feelings, helped her become the person she is.
--- In [email protected], Krisula Moyer <krisula@...> wrote:
>
> My son and I watched The Land before time (the first one, by Spielberg) when he was 3. He sobbed and grieved for hours the first time he saw it. I had no idea before we watched it (at Grandma's house) that it would be so emotional. He strongly identified with the little dinosaur and said "why did the mommy have to die" many times.
>
> I thought he would never want to watch it again but the next time we visited my parents it was the first thing he asked for. He watched it many many times, usually asking to sit on my lap and hold on to me as he watched. I asked my parents not to bring it out when I wasn't there because my being there seemed so important to him at certain points during the film and I wasn't sure he'd remember that at the beginning, just that he liked the movie.
>
> There is something about the deep fear of losing one's parents that is at the heart of the pervasive "orphan" theme, I think. But also, the idea that the hero must go through some kind of challenge or solve a difficult problem which, if he has no parents he must face it / grow / prove himself to succeed. If the parents are in the film they would of course rescue, protect, help. Another way to achieve this hero's autonomy is to make the parent really mean (like Matilda) ... or prevent them in some way from helping the little hero. (like teh Chronicles of Narnia) ... This kind of fantasy is appealing because it explores the idea of "am I strong enough,? am I big enough? good enough, smart enough, etc to solve life's problems?"
>
> Themes where friends or groups are on a quest together (Lord of the Rings type) could be achieved in a family setting though. I'm thinking "The Incredibles" where every part of the family was important to succeeding against the evil antagonist.
>
> Krisula Moyer
> The Seer, the novel
>
>
>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
faeriesolstice
--- In [email protected], Joyce Fetteroll <jfetteroll@...> wrote:
Stephanie
> A lot of the words spent explaining unschooling are about how toI just love this, it really spoke to my heart this morning. Thank you.
> build relationships. This is about control and fear, the antithesis
> of what we're trying to help parents get. It's advice parents can get
> from any parenting board. This site offers ways to help parents deal
> with their fears and partner with their child to explore the world.
> Make their worlds bigger, not smaller with walls against the scary
> monsters of TV and sugar and unnatural cotton.
>
> Joyce
>
Stephanie
Debra Rossing
Gotta disagree there - kids are way better at differentiating reality
from fantasy than we give them credit for. Adults cry, get angry, etc
because we RELATE - I cry when I see children in harm's way, I cry happy
tears when families reunite, I cry when ole yeller dies, I get angry
when injustice happens. Not because I believe the situation really
happened in that way to those people but because I know that similar
situations DO happen to REAL people. I cry when the cast on MASH sets up
an 'anniversary' for BJ (a film of his wife going about the things they
would do on that day with a recording of her voice narrating, a kid
playing 'their song' on a harmonica, Margaret dancing with him in lieu
of his wife,...) because I know, just a teeny bit, what it's like to
miss your spouse (and a shout out to all the military spouses who are
holding down the fort solo).
Use media, don't fear it. You are a bigger, stronger influence than any
TV program IF you don't lose your credibility and remain connected to
your child(ren). My DS is now almost 12 and has had full access to TV
since he could toddle (and actually noticed the TV). By 18 months, he
could put in his VHS tapes correctly (we had a combo TV/VCR that would
turn on automatically when a tape was inserted, start playing, auto
rewind and eject at the end, push it back in and it restarted). When we
could finally afford it, we got cable. Rather than fear it and limit it,
we gave him as much access as he desired. We were right there with him
in it - I know more about Pokemon (and other favorites) than I ever
considered possible LOL! We'd mention "this program has X in it, I know
that is something you didn't like before, do you still want to watch it?
We can start and switch if you want whenever" And, because we never
controlled what he watched, when we make a suggestion "Hey, you might
like this" or "I'm going to watch that, do you want to watch with me?"
He's open to considering it - sometimes he says yes, sometimes he says
no, sometimes he wanders in and out. He has no need to watch just to get
in his allotted screen time (gotta make every minute count even if
there's nothing interesting, because I won't get any more until
tomorrow) - he's more likely to put on the weather channel for
background music or just turn it off entirely and do something else if
there's nothing he wants to watch. And, because he trusts our judgment
on it (we're not going to ban anything or limit him or control what he
watches), when we suggest something "Hey you might like this" he has no
reason to suspect "ulterior motives". He's got the entire set of MASH
DVDs (by his request), for example, because DH and I were watching it
and he was interested. Lots of amazing discussion fodder there (war,
violence, prejudice, history, geography, interpersonal relationships,
drug and alcohol use and abuse, sex/sexuality, and so on) - there was no
need to wait until he reaches age 15 (or 18 or 12 or whatever) to touch
on those things as they arise. The parts he was able to understand, he'd
take in, the rest went over his head. He loved watching James Bond
movies for a while - he started watching them at around age 5 or 6.
Loved the villains and gadgets. Took until he was around 10 for him to
notice "he kisses a lot of girls" - that was totally not of interest to
him (I'll admit I was a bit nervous about all the double entendres and
such, e.g. the names of the "Bond girls", but since HE had no knowledge
of the double meanings, a name was just a name). DH and/or I would be
right there with him - helping, discussing, answering, facilitating.
Deb R
**********************************************************************
This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and
intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they
are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify
the system manager.
This footnote also confirms that this email message has been swept by
MIMEsweeper for the presence of computer viruses.
www.mastercam.com
**********************************************************************
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
from fantasy than we give them credit for. Adults cry, get angry, etc
because we RELATE - I cry when I see children in harm's way, I cry happy
tears when families reunite, I cry when ole yeller dies, I get angry
when injustice happens. Not because I believe the situation really
happened in that way to those people but because I know that similar
situations DO happen to REAL people. I cry when the cast on MASH sets up
an 'anniversary' for BJ (a film of his wife going about the things they
would do on that day with a recording of her voice narrating, a kid
playing 'their song' on a harmonica, Margaret dancing with him in lieu
of his wife,...) because I know, just a teeny bit, what it's like to
miss your spouse (and a shout out to all the military spouses who are
holding down the fort solo).
Use media, don't fear it. You are a bigger, stronger influence than any
TV program IF you don't lose your credibility and remain connected to
your child(ren). My DS is now almost 12 and has had full access to TV
since he could toddle (and actually noticed the TV). By 18 months, he
could put in his VHS tapes correctly (we had a combo TV/VCR that would
turn on automatically when a tape was inserted, start playing, auto
rewind and eject at the end, push it back in and it restarted). When we
could finally afford it, we got cable. Rather than fear it and limit it,
we gave him as much access as he desired. We were right there with him
in it - I know more about Pokemon (and other favorites) than I ever
considered possible LOL! We'd mention "this program has X in it, I know
that is something you didn't like before, do you still want to watch it?
We can start and switch if you want whenever" And, because we never
controlled what he watched, when we make a suggestion "Hey, you might
like this" or "I'm going to watch that, do you want to watch with me?"
He's open to considering it - sometimes he says yes, sometimes he says
no, sometimes he wanders in and out. He has no need to watch just to get
in his allotted screen time (gotta make every minute count even if
there's nothing interesting, because I won't get any more until
tomorrow) - he's more likely to put on the weather channel for
background music or just turn it off entirely and do something else if
there's nothing he wants to watch. And, because he trusts our judgment
on it (we're not going to ban anything or limit him or control what he
watches), when we suggest something "Hey you might like this" he has no
reason to suspect "ulterior motives". He's got the entire set of MASH
DVDs (by his request), for example, because DH and I were watching it
and he was interested. Lots of amazing discussion fodder there (war,
violence, prejudice, history, geography, interpersonal relationships,
drug and alcohol use and abuse, sex/sexuality, and so on) - there was no
need to wait until he reaches age 15 (or 18 or 12 or whatever) to touch
on those things as they arise. The parts he was able to understand, he'd
take in, the rest went over his head. He loved watching James Bond
movies for a while - he started watching them at around age 5 or 6.
Loved the villains and gadgets. Took until he was around 10 for him to
notice "he kisses a lot of girls" - that was totally not of interest to
him (I'll admit I was a bit nervous about all the double entendres and
such, e.g. the names of the "Bond girls", but since HE had no knowledge
of the double meanings, a name was just a name). DH and/or I would be
right there with him - helping, discussing, answering, facilitating.
Deb R
**********************************************************************
This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and
intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they
are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify
the system manager.
This footnote also confirms that this email message has been swept by
MIMEsweeper for the presence of computer viruses.
www.mastercam.com
**********************************************************************
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]