Differing opinions about nudity
Bekki Kirby
My mother, who lives nearby, is really getting tired of seeing my 4
1/2 year old naked. She thinks it's inappropriate, that he's too old
to get by with it now, and that it's unfair to make my
almost-11-year-old uncomfortable with it. Part of the problem is that
my son really likes to mess with his penis when he's naked... grab it,
shake it, it's just the best thing ever and he has no inkling that it
makes others uncomfortable. I've tried very hard to NOT attach shame
and dirtiness and other bad feelings toward the parts that are usually
clothed. My mom was raised differently. She attempted to raise me
differently, but it didn't really stick. While I'm no nudist, I don't
think there's anything WRONG with any parts of my body.
Anyway... she's right that it bothers my daughter. My daughter has
reached the age where she's very modest and wants to not see anyone
else naked... doesn't want anyone to see her naked, either. My son
generally only plays naked in the backyard... if he wants to play with
water or mud he takes his clothes off. He HATES having wet clothes
on... even a dribble of water makes him strip. So, to make him stay
clothed all the time seems very unfair. Making her see him naked also
seems unfair. Although, she does her best to avoid looking at him even
when he's clothed, but that's a whole other issue.
I'd love to brainstorm some ideas to get everyone involved some sort
of solution.
Bekki
--
The true test of intelligence is not how much we know how to do, but
how we behave when we don't know what to do.
-John Holt
Education is the ability to listen to almost anything without losing
your temper or your self-confidence.
-Robert Frost
Mother of four angels, two pirates, and one TBD
Kayla (10)
Hunter (b. 8/9/03, d. 8/22/03)
Jo (misc 1/15/04)
Jared (4)
Camelia (b. 12/16/07, d. 12/10/07)
Hope/Chance (misc 11/25/08)
Capt. Jack arriving end of Dec. 2009
1/2 year old naked. She thinks it's inappropriate, that he's too old
to get by with it now, and that it's unfair to make my
almost-11-year-old uncomfortable with it. Part of the problem is that
my son really likes to mess with his penis when he's naked... grab it,
shake it, it's just the best thing ever and he has no inkling that it
makes others uncomfortable. I've tried very hard to NOT attach shame
and dirtiness and other bad feelings toward the parts that are usually
clothed. My mom was raised differently. She attempted to raise me
differently, but it didn't really stick. While I'm no nudist, I don't
think there's anything WRONG with any parts of my body.
Anyway... she's right that it bothers my daughter. My daughter has
reached the age where she's very modest and wants to not see anyone
else naked... doesn't want anyone to see her naked, either. My son
generally only plays naked in the backyard... if he wants to play with
water or mud he takes his clothes off. He HATES having wet clothes
on... even a dribble of water makes him strip. So, to make him stay
clothed all the time seems very unfair. Making her see him naked also
seems unfair. Although, she does her best to avoid looking at him even
when he's clothed, but that's a whole other issue.
I'd love to brainstorm some ideas to get everyone involved some sort
of solution.
Bekki
--
The true test of intelligence is not how much we know how to do, but
how we behave when we don't know what to do.
-John Holt
Education is the ability to listen to almost anything without losing
your temper or your self-confidence.
-Robert Frost
Mother of four angels, two pirates, and one TBD
Kayla (10)
Hunter (b. 8/9/03, d. 8/22/03)
Jo (misc 1/15/04)
Jared (4)
Camelia (b. 12/16/07, d. 12/10/07)
Hope/Chance (misc 11/25/08)
Capt. Jack arriving end of Dec. 2009
plaidpanties666
--- In [email protected], Bekki Kirby <junegoddess@...> wrote:
My son
And let him know some people don't like to see naked bodies. Its a fact. It doesn't have to be about him at all, or about shame or whatever. Its pretty normal for kids to go through a stage of not wanting to see naked bodies, after all, so tell him about that. If his sister wants to play in the back yard at the same time as him, make some plans before hand. Get him a swimsuit he likes or some fancy undies to run around in, whatever is more comfortable wet.
---Meredith (Mo 8, Ray 16)
><snip>
> My mother, who lives nearby, is really getting tired of seeing my 4
> 1/2 year old naked.
My son
> generally only plays naked in the backyard... if he wants to play withHow often is your mom in the backyard? Can you hang a curtain over any doors or windows facing that direction? Put up a privacy fence? Those things could help you dd, too.
> water or mud he takes his clothes off.
>>Part of the problem is thatIt might help to think about why it makes others uncomfortable. Touching a body part can be a kind of communication - what do you think when a woman rubs both hands over her belly? Wonder if she's pregnant? Its a commom assumption for the gesture. So what does it mean to touch one's penis? Something a 4yo can understand! It means: I need to pee, or: I have an itch. So talk about that. Ask him if he needs to pee or if he's itchy. Let him know he's communicating via his behavior!
> my son really likes to mess with his penis when he's naked... grab it,
> shake it, it's just the best thing ever and he has no inkling that it
> makes others uncomfortable.
And let him know some people don't like to see naked bodies. Its a fact. It doesn't have to be about him at all, or about shame or whatever. Its pretty normal for kids to go through a stage of not wanting to see naked bodies, after all, so tell him about that. If his sister wants to play in the back yard at the same time as him, make some plans before hand. Get him a swimsuit he likes or some fancy undies to run around in, whatever is more comfortable wet.
---Meredith (Mo 8, Ray 16)
Bekki Kirby
> How often is your mom in the backyard? Can you hang a curtain over any doors or windows facing that direction? Put up a privacy fence? Those things could help you dd, too.She plays out there with him a lot, actually. She's babysitting a lot
for me these days, as I have tons of appointments due to a high risk
pregnancy. She blows bubbles and they make mud soups and all sorts of
things. We have a privacy fence, and there are only two windows that
face the backyard. One can't have a curtain because it's an odd
window, and the other is a patio door that is usually half-covered
with a curtain. Can't cover it more or else he'd have to push it
aside with potentially muddy hands when he comes in. He comes in and
goes out a lot during one play session.
> So talk about that. Ask him if he needs to pee or if he's itchy. Let him know he's communicating via his behavior!I've tried! He is not easily-influenced. Just because it means
something to others doesn't seem to be a compelling reason why he
should care or change. He grabs himself a lot even when dressed...
just can't resist, I guess.
>> And let him know some people don't like to see naked bodies. Its a fact. It doesn't have to be about him at all, or about shame or whatever. Its pretty normal for kids to go through a stage of not wanting to see naked bodies, after all, so tell him about that. If his sister wants to play in the back yard at the same time as him, make some plans before hand. Get him a swimsuit he likes or some fancy undies to run around in, whatever is more comfortable wet.I'll try talking to him about how other people don't like nudity. He
absolutely won't wear a swimsuit or undies... he doesn't even wear
undies at all. LOL And I'll bring up the swimsuit idea again, but I
have the feeling I'd need to have a LOT of them on hand. He's very
particular about not wearing dirty clothes, so every time they got
muddy he'd want fresh ones.
Bekki
--
The true test of intelligence is not how much we know how to do, but
how we behave when we don't know what to do.
-John Holt
Education is the ability to listen to almost anything without losing
your temper or your self-confidence.
-Robert Frost
Mother of four angels, two pirates, and one TBD
Kayla (10)
Hunter (b. 8/9/03, d. 8/22/03)
Jo (misc 1/15/04)
Jared (4)
Camelia (b. 12/16/07, d. 12/10/07)
Hope/Chance (misc 11/25/08)
Capt. Jack arriving end of Dec. 2009
Deb Lewis
***My mother, who lives nearby, is really getting tired of seeing my 4
1/2 year old naked. She thinks it's inappropriate, that he's too old
to get by with it now, and that it's unfair to make my
almost-11-year-old uncomfortable with it. ***
I have a friend who made loincloths for her boys when they were in naked boy stage. It doesn't prevent naked little butt on furniture<g> but it might work for outside play. Maybe people who sew could recommend fabrics that shed water.
Maybe you can make a deal with him to keep some of his clothes on around grandma and sister and then find ways for him to play naked sometimes that won't bother others. Create some other play for him and Grandma that doesn't make him want to take his clothes off. A sandbox, or a gravel pile in the corner of the yard.
Can you divide his outside play area and sister's play area somehow - sheets across a clothes line? Can you enclose his mud/water play place in one of those portable gazebo tents?
Would he move the naked play inside to the bathtub and save it for times Grandma's not there?
It's not a clothing optional society, not without problems or special arrangement, anyway. You can talk about that without attaching shame to body parts. Clothing helps people feel more protected from the spread of germs, protects tender skin, etc. Public nudity is illegal. He might be too young to understand that but you can talk about it. People don't mind so much when kids are little but when people *start* minding then it's time to cover up in public.
Deb Lewis
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
1/2 year old naked. She thinks it's inappropriate, that he's too old
to get by with it now, and that it's unfair to make my
almost-11-year-old uncomfortable with it. ***
I have a friend who made loincloths for her boys when they were in naked boy stage. It doesn't prevent naked little butt on furniture<g> but it might work for outside play. Maybe people who sew could recommend fabrics that shed water.
Maybe you can make a deal with him to keep some of his clothes on around grandma and sister and then find ways for him to play naked sometimes that won't bother others. Create some other play for him and Grandma that doesn't make him want to take his clothes off. A sandbox, or a gravel pile in the corner of the yard.
Can you divide his outside play area and sister's play area somehow - sheets across a clothes line? Can you enclose his mud/water play place in one of those portable gazebo tents?
Would he move the naked play inside to the bathtub and save it for times Grandma's not there?
It's not a clothing optional society, not without problems or special arrangement, anyway. You can talk about that without attaching shame to body parts. Clothing helps people feel more protected from the spread of germs, protects tender skin, etc. Public nudity is illegal. He might be too young to understand that but you can talk about it. People don't mind so much when kids are little but when people *start* minding then it's time to cover up in public.
Deb Lewis
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Deb Lewis
***One can't have a curtain because it's an odd
window,****
Cut some fabric to the shape of the window and put it up with double stick carpet tape, tacks, or velcro.
***the other is a patio door that is usually half-covered
with a curtain. Can't cover it more or else he'd have to push it aside with potentially muddy hands***
Put up a shower curtain, wash mud off with a cloth.
Deb Lewis
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
window,****
Cut some fabric to the shape of the window and put it up with double stick carpet tape, tacks, or velcro.
***the other is a patio door that is usually half-covered
with a curtain. Can't cover it more or else he'd have to push it aside with potentially muddy hands***
Put up a shower curtain, wash mud off with a cloth.
Deb Lewis
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Elli
I love this response!!!! There is always an answer, always a way to meet everyone's needs, we just haven't thought of it yet. This unschooling philosophy is so delicious!!!! And, the ideas and support from this group are so wonderful!!
Love,
elli
Love,
elli
--- In [email protected], "Deb Lewis" <d.lewis@...> wrote:
>
> ***One can't have a curtain because it's an odd
> window,****
>
> Cut some fabric to the shape of the window and put it up with double stick carpet tape, tacks, or velcro.
>
> ***the other is a patio door that is usually half-covered
> with a curtain. Can't cover it more or else he'd have to push it aside with potentially muddy hands***
>
> Put up a shower curtain, wash mud off with a cloth.
>
>
> Deb Lewis
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
amflowers71
not for this reason but for fun once when my son was about your sons age, we bought a new pack of white pants and some fabric pens and he made his own designs on them - a rocket, a car, a sun etc. They were very special to him and he loved to choose them to wear. He never minded wearing pants in the first place though, but maybe this would be fun for your son too?