August blog carnival
Meredith
Egads! I'm late pulling this together! If you have blog posts you'd like to share on the subject of Learn Nothing day _ or learning in general, or just to share, email them to me so I can get this out in the next couple days. They can be new or old.
Next month's topic is food! So think about, blog about what and how you eat, what's in the garden, maybe, heck, share some recipes if you like. Again, old and new posts are fine.
Thanks, y'all.
Meredith
Next month's topic is food! So think about, blog about what and how you eat, what's in the garden, maybe, heck, share some recipes if you like. Again, old and new posts are fine.
Thanks, y'all.
Meredith
amandabpearl
We are practicing an unschooling life philosophy with our soon to be three year old. With that in mind, when she asks for something (material or otherwise) that is reasonable (from our budget's standpoint) and accessible, we always try to meet the need in a very timely fashion...luckily our toddler doesn't have terribly expensive needs! Additionally, in our personal lives, we try to model fairly non-consumerist behaviors...we rarely acquire new stuff (though we love freecycle) and do most of our cooking, crafting, and gift giving from scratch/ make-at-home type things. Also, my husband and I do not give each other birthday or holiday gifts...never have except maybe our first year dating.
When I was growing up, birthdays were always about going to eat out, getting the gifts you had been wanting for a while, and a big party...none of which fits our budget or her desires. I'm searching around for a special tradition that we can have as a family to mark birthdays, and was wondering what the rest of you did. Also, what do people do with the "birthday gift" issue (from parents to children) when kids are already getting the things they want "just because".
Last year we were in the middle of 5 months of travel when her birthday came along, and she was not really aware of it as an "event"... an uncle whom we were visiting got a cake, and some plastic leis and we sang...it made a big impression on maya and she now asks for birthday songs all the time....so we do lots of "pretend birthdays"...sticking a candle in a pancake, piece of bread or whatever is around and singing...
Looking for a way to make this special and different, also I will be giving birth about 2 weeks before her birthday so whatever we do needs to be fairly low key...probably a gathering of 4 or 5 close friends in a park.
Lastly, for families who do not do a big gift thing, how do your kids feel when they go to big parties with tons of gifts....or do i just cross that bridge when i get there? Thanks for the input and ideas!
When I was growing up, birthdays were always about going to eat out, getting the gifts you had been wanting for a while, and a big party...none of which fits our budget or her desires. I'm searching around for a special tradition that we can have as a family to mark birthdays, and was wondering what the rest of you did. Also, what do people do with the "birthday gift" issue (from parents to children) when kids are already getting the things they want "just because".
Last year we were in the middle of 5 months of travel when her birthday came along, and she was not really aware of it as an "event"... an uncle whom we were visiting got a cake, and some plastic leis and we sang...it made a big impression on maya and she now asks for birthday songs all the time....so we do lots of "pretend birthdays"...sticking a candle in a pancake, piece of bread or whatever is around and singing...
Looking for a way to make this special and different, also I will be giving birth about 2 weeks before her birthday so whatever we do needs to be fairly low key...probably a gathering of 4 or 5 close friends in a park.
Lastly, for families who do not do a big gift thing, how do your kids feel when they go to big parties with tons of gifts....or do i just cross that bridge when i get there? Thanks for the input and ideas!
Meredith
--- In [email protected], "amandabpearl" <amanda@...> wrote:
Mo enjoys this sort of thing, too. For years we had "birthdays" once or twice a week! But her actual birthday we didn't do really do anything different than a pretend birthday, other than know it was coming more than a day in advance. We were always wrapping and unwrapping things around the house - pretend presents, fancy snack packs that I created, whatever. She went to others' parties, but never wanted a party with friends, just our usual , everyday sort of party.
What did you like about those family traditions? On an emotional level I mean. Probably you are working a lot of that into your daily life, making every day a celebration! So the idea of family traditions may be something that's about you, about your memories and needs, but not your kids needs. I'm not saying to ditch the idea, but if you see that its about you, not your kids, you can look for ways to meet your own needs, perhaps differently than you'd otherwise envisioned. You might also look at the traditions that are forming, slowly and naturally, in your own family. My family traditions don't look anything like what I might have imagined beforehand, because I couldn't have guessed how my family would grow and change. More of my family traditions are kid-driven and transitory, too. They last until the kid who starts the tradition outgrows it, and by then we have new traditions. Its not what I was raised to expect of Tradition! but it fits our family well.
Does it even need to be that much? A gf of mine took her dd to McD's for her third and 4th bdays, and simply passed out party hats to anyone who wanted one, and folks joined in singing Happy Birthday over an ice-cream treat. It was enough of a "party" for her dd, and took a minimum of prep and stress. Her dd actively wanted a party, though.
You could also plan a party before the birth, rather than fuss over the exact day - or have a party before and after if you like! Whatever suits your family best. Have a month long celebration of Birth, talking about your dd's birth and infancy and helping her connect with the new baby.
Morgan has never been upset about any of that - why would she be? We have birthdays all the time around here ;) And she gets "big gifts" when we have the finances available. She got a new bike at the beginning of the summer, without having to wait, and a new Gameboy just today, even though her bday is weeks away. Ray still gets certain sorts of gifts from his bio mom's family only on bdays and xmas, but those gifts aren't what makes those days special to him - if anything, they leave him feeling slightly jaded about his relationship with certain relatives.
---Meredith (Mo 7, Ray 15)
>> Last year we were in the middle of 5 months of travel when her birthday came along, and she was not really aware of it as an "event"... an uncle whom we were visiting got a cake, and some plastic leis and we sang...it made a big impression on maya and she now asks for birthday songs all the time....so we do lots of "pretend birthdays"...sticking a candle in a pancake, piece of bread or whatever is around and singing...**************************
Mo enjoys this sort of thing, too. For years we had "birthdays" once or twice a week! But her actual birthday we didn't do really do anything different than a pretend birthday, other than know it was coming more than a day in advance. We were always wrapping and unwrapping things around the house - pretend presents, fancy snack packs that I created, whatever. She went to others' parties, but never wanted a party with friends, just our usual , everyday sort of party.
> When I was growing up, birthdays were always about going to eat out, getting the gifts you had been wanting for a while, and a big party...none of which fits our budget or her desires. I'm searching around for a special tradition that we can have as a family to mark birthdays, and was wondering what the rest of you did. Also, what do people do with the "birthday gift" issue (from parents to children) when kids are already getting the things they want "just because".****************************
What did you like about those family traditions? On an emotional level I mean. Probably you are working a lot of that into your daily life, making every day a celebration! So the idea of family traditions may be something that's about you, about your memories and needs, but not your kids needs. I'm not saying to ditch the idea, but if you see that its about you, not your kids, you can look for ways to meet your own needs, perhaps differently than you'd otherwise envisioned. You might also look at the traditions that are forming, slowly and naturally, in your own family. My family traditions don't look anything like what I might have imagined beforehand, because I couldn't have guessed how my family would grow and change. More of my family traditions are kid-driven and transitory, too. They last until the kid who starts the tradition outgrows it, and by then we have new traditions. Its not what I was raised to expect of Tradition! but it fits our family well.
> Looking for a way to make this special and different, also I will be giving birth about 2 weeks before her birthday so whatever we do needs to be fairly low key...probably a gathering of 4 or 5 close friends in a park.****************************
Does it even need to be that much? A gf of mine took her dd to McD's for her third and 4th bdays, and simply passed out party hats to anyone who wanted one, and folks joined in singing Happy Birthday over an ice-cream treat. It was enough of a "party" for her dd, and took a minimum of prep and stress. Her dd actively wanted a party, though.
You could also plan a party before the birth, rather than fuss over the exact day - or have a party before and after if you like! Whatever suits your family best. Have a month long celebration of Birth, talking about your dd's birth and infancy and helping her connect with the new baby.
> Lastly, for families who do not do a big gift thing, how do your kids feel when they go to big parties with tons of gifts....or do i just cross that bridge when i get there? Thanks for the input and ideas!**************************
Morgan has never been upset about any of that - why would she be? We have birthdays all the time around here ;) And she gets "big gifts" when we have the finances available. She got a new bike at the beginning of the summer, without having to wait, and a new Gameboy just today, even though her bday is weeks away. Ray still gets certain sorts of gifts from his bio mom's family only on bdays and xmas, but those gifts aren't what makes those days special to him - if anything, they leave him feeling slightly jaded about his relationship with certain relatives.
---Meredith (Mo 7, Ray 15)
Meredith
Here's an older blog carnival, more holidays than birthdays, but it might give you some ideas of the kinds of traditions other families have:
http://familyrun.ning.com/forum/topics/november-2008-share-the-fun
here's an April Fools day tradition that's just Sooooooooo Much Fun:
http://3mommies.blogspot.com/2009_04_01_archive.html
and a specific bday blog post of Faiths that I think she posted here pretty recently:
http://faithvoid.blogspot.com/2008/11/amazing-6-years-old-pix-words-to-follow.html
http://familyrun.ning.com/forum/topics/november-2008-share-the-fun
here's an April Fools day tradition that's just Sooooooooo Much Fun:
http://3mommies.blogspot.com/2009_04_01_archive.html
and a specific bday blog post of Faiths that I think she posted here pretty recently:
http://faithvoid.blogspot.com/2008/11/amazing-6-years-old-pix-words-to-follow.html
Pam Sorooshian
When my kids were little, we very often invited one friend to go
someplace with us -out to dinner and then maybe to some kind of fair or
a movie or, starting around age 5 or 6, to a live performance - usually
a musical.
We don't celebrate Christmas and we almost never had birthday parties,
so my kids never really got into getting a bunch of gifts at once. That
just wasn't part of their expectations....but we did use birthdays as a
time to get that big item they'd been wanting. That was usually the time
we got them the videogame console or the little tv for their bedroom -
but that was when they were older. When they were younger, we got them
something that they'd never asked for because they probably had never
even seen it.
When they were younger, that was the time I'd buy the super big box of
crayons for them and, when they were just a little older, the big box of
really good colored pencils.
Every year there was always something cool that I knew they'd love. When
they're little, just wrapping it in pretty paper with ribbon is enough
to make whatever it is really special.
Now that they are older, I'm really glad we have the go out to dinner
together routine - my kids are super busy at 18, 21, and 24, but we
still manage to all get together for dinner on each of our birthdays. We
REALLY enjoy it and it is well worth the money.
We have a holiday that is four days (five days in leap year) that is
devoted to hospitality and service. When the kids were little, we
started a very cool tradition. Each night, we draw names. The next day,
we try to do nice things for the person whose name we've drawn, but
without them figuring out who is doing these nice things. The next
night, we try to each guess who had our name that day. We also gave
little small presents to the kids each night - I'm talking about little
tiny gifts - a few dollars at most. We also found special ways to be
helpful to other people during those days, too.
Another holiday we have is the longest night of the year - we stay up
all night, have a fire in the fireplace, don't have computers or tv on,
and my husband tells stories (the old legends of Iran). We eat dried
fruits, nuts and seeds, and potatoes baked in the fireplace. We bring
blankets and pillows out to the living room and all fall asleep there.
Sometimes we have some artsy crafty stuff to do during the night, too.
All that said, at 10 years old, Roya wanted a big birthday part --- so
we invited everybody we knew to the park, ordered cheap pizza, and I put
together a whole bunch of games. Rosie had birthday parties at a little
kiddy amusement park near us, a few times. The cute thing about that
was that all the kids at her birthday party were much older than the
targeted age of the kiddy amusement park - but they were all
unschoolers, and they had a great time. The people running it were quite
impressed with how sweet they were and how imaginative.
Sorry - scattered, but maybe some ideas in there for you, somewhere.
-pam
someplace with us -out to dinner and then maybe to some kind of fair or
a movie or, starting around age 5 or 6, to a live performance - usually
a musical.
We don't celebrate Christmas and we almost never had birthday parties,
so my kids never really got into getting a bunch of gifts at once. That
just wasn't part of their expectations....but we did use birthdays as a
time to get that big item they'd been wanting. That was usually the time
we got them the videogame console or the little tv for their bedroom -
but that was when they were older. When they were younger, we got them
something that they'd never asked for because they probably had never
even seen it.
When they were younger, that was the time I'd buy the super big box of
crayons for them and, when they were just a little older, the big box of
really good colored pencils.
Every year there was always something cool that I knew they'd love. When
they're little, just wrapping it in pretty paper with ribbon is enough
to make whatever it is really special.
Now that they are older, I'm really glad we have the go out to dinner
together routine - my kids are super busy at 18, 21, and 24, but we
still manage to all get together for dinner on each of our birthdays. We
REALLY enjoy it and it is well worth the money.
We have a holiday that is four days (five days in leap year) that is
devoted to hospitality and service. When the kids were little, we
started a very cool tradition. Each night, we draw names. The next day,
we try to do nice things for the person whose name we've drawn, but
without them figuring out who is doing these nice things. The next
night, we try to each guess who had our name that day. We also gave
little small presents to the kids each night - I'm talking about little
tiny gifts - a few dollars at most. We also found special ways to be
helpful to other people during those days, too.
Another holiday we have is the longest night of the year - we stay up
all night, have a fire in the fireplace, don't have computers or tv on,
and my husband tells stories (the old legends of Iran). We eat dried
fruits, nuts and seeds, and potatoes baked in the fireplace. We bring
blankets and pillows out to the living room and all fall asleep there.
Sometimes we have some artsy crafty stuff to do during the night, too.
All that said, at 10 years old, Roya wanted a big birthday part --- so
we invited everybody we knew to the park, ordered cheap pizza, and I put
together a whole bunch of games. Rosie had birthday parties at a little
kiddy amusement park near us, a few times. The cute thing about that
was that all the kids at her birthday party were much older than the
targeted age of the kiddy amusement park - but they were all
unschoolers, and they had a great time. The people running it were quite
impressed with how sweet they were and how imaginative.
Sorry - scattered, but maybe some ideas in there for you, somewhere.
-pam
Sacha Davis
Hi all - I'm new to this group and have been enjoying lurking and
reading the discussion. My wife and I have an almost 2.5 y/o little
boy and we're exploring unschooling. At this point I'm positive we at
least won't be doing preschool, and maybe beyond.
My concern is about reading. Personally I read very very young and
voraciously, and I have some of those same expectations for Finn.
I've adjusted them to expect him to read around 5 or 6 or 7, but I
feel I would be concerned if he went much longer without learning to
read. I was taught to read in Montessori and traditional schools and
it's something that I truly loved and never felt forced to do, and I
am excited for my son to have access to that same world of learning
and imagination.
Here's my question: I'd like to get some sort of grip on when
unschooled kids typically start reading. I need some reassurance that
letting Finn read when he's ready won't result in him simply never
being ready. I know there are no studies, so just anecdotally, when
did your unschooled kid read?
Thanks so much!
__________________________________
Sacha, mommy to Finn and wife to Megan
Livin' la vida loca in Georgetown, Seattle
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
reading the discussion. My wife and I have an almost 2.5 y/o little
boy and we're exploring unschooling. At this point I'm positive we at
least won't be doing preschool, and maybe beyond.
My concern is about reading. Personally I read very very young and
voraciously, and I have some of those same expectations for Finn.
I've adjusted them to expect him to read around 5 or 6 or 7, but I
feel I would be concerned if he went much longer without learning to
read. I was taught to read in Montessori and traditional schools and
it's something that I truly loved and never felt forced to do, and I
am excited for my son to have access to that same world of learning
and imagination.
Here's my question: I'd like to get some sort of grip on when
unschooled kids typically start reading. I need some reassurance that
letting Finn read when he's ready won't result in him simply never
being ready. I know there are no studies, so just anecdotally, when
did your unschooled kid read?
Thanks so much!
__________________________________
Sacha, mommy to Finn and wife to Megan
Livin' la vida loca in Georgetown, Seattle
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Meredith
--- In [email protected], Sacha Davis <sacha@...> wrote:
It might be more helpful to you, personally, to poll members of your family and find out how many read early and how many struggled with reading in school - a certain amount of what you're asking is based on genetic makeup. The "normal" range for learning to read is really wide: anywhere from 4 to 13 - seriously. Reading requires an assortment of skills, and not all of those will develop at the same time/rate. Looking around your family can give you some clues as to what to expect.
As to never being ready - reading, in many ways, is an "adult" skill. Its not the sort of thing that's learned better for learning early, if anything, the opposite is more likely true. What hampers people who read later is years of being told there's something wrong with them for not being able to read. I used to teach reading to adults, and self esteem was The biggest hurdle. So the best thing you can do for a later reader is reassure him or her that s/he Will one day read, while being available to read anything at all for him/her.
---Meredith (Mo 7, Ray 15)
>> Here's my question: I'd like to get some sort of grip on when***********************************
> unschooled kids typically start reading. I need some reassurance that
> letting Finn read when he's ready won't result in him simply never
> being ready. I know there are no studies, so just anecdotally, when
> did your unschooled kid read?
It might be more helpful to you, personally, to poll members of your family and find out how many read early and how many struggled with reading in school - a certain amount of what you're asking is based on genetic makeup. The "normal" range for learning to read is really wide: anywhere from 4 to 13 - seriously. Reading requires an assortment of skills, and not all of those will develop at the same time/rate. Looking around your family can give you some clues as to what to expect.
As to never being ready - reading, in many ways, is an "adult" skill. Its not the sort of thing that's learned better for learning early, if anything, the opposite is more likely true. What hampers people who read later is years of being told there's something wrong with them for not being able to read. I used to teach reading to adults, and self esteem was The biggest hurdle. So the best thing you can do for a later reader is reassure him or her that s/he Will one day read, while being available to read anything at all for him/her.
---Meredith (Mo 7, Ray 15)
The Coffee Goddess
I have the two extremes...My son, Otto, read spontaneously at 2.5 - 3....I was nursing him and reading a book silently to myself, and he suddenly asked me "What's decapitate mean, mommy?" I was shocked, and asked where he had heard THAT word....and he pointed to it in my book. I had no idea he was reading before this.
My daughter, Lauren, could sound out 3-letter words at 5...but really didn't get the hang out reading until more like 10. Again, it wasn't like she could read nothing--she could read very simple books and words, but wasn't able to sit down and read a "chapter book" independently until about 10. She also spelled very poorly and is finally catching up in that area as she writes more. She's 17 now, and reads and writes--well, basically that's all she does--in English AND japanese, and it's obvious to us that not pushing reading and writing does not make an adult who can do neither ;)
Dana
My daughter, Lauren, could sound out 3-letter words at 5...but really didn't get the hang out reading until more like 10. Again, it wasn't like she could read nothing--she could read very simple books and words, but wasn't able to sit down and read a "chapter book" independently until about 10. She also spelled very poorly and is finally catching up in that area as she writes more. She's 17 now, and reads and writes--well, basically that's all she does--in English AND japanese, and it's obvious to us that not pushing reading and writing does not make an adult who can do neither ;)
Dana
--- On Mon, 8/3/09, Sacha Davis <sacha@...> wrote:
From: Sacha Davis <sacha@...>
Subject: [unschoolingbasics] Reading
To: [email protected]
Date: Monday, August 3, 2009, 7:28 AM
Hi all - I'm new to this group and have been enjoying lurking and
reading the discussion. My wife and I have an almost 2.5 y/o little
boy and we're exploring unschooling. At this point I'm positive we at
least won't be doing preschool, and maybe beyond.
My concern is about reading. Personally I read very very young and
voraciously, and I have some of those same expectations for Finn.
I've adjusted them to expect him to read around 5 or 6 or 7, but I
feel I would be concerned if he went much longer without learning to
read. I was taught to read in Montessori and traditional schools and
it's something that I truly loved and never felt forced to do, and I
am excited for my son to have access to that same world of learning
and imagination.
Here's my question: I'd like to get some sort of grip on when
unschooled kids typically start reading. I need some reassurance that
letting Finn read when he's ready won't result in him simply never
being ready. I know there are no studies, so just anecdotally, when
did your unschooled kid read?
Thanks so much!
__________________________________
Sacha, mommy to Finn and wife to Megan
Livin' la vida loca in Georgetown, Seattle
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
------------------------------------
Yahoo! Groups Links
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Pam Sorooshian
On 8/3/2009 7:28 AM, Sacha Davis wrote:
reading at 4 1/2 years old; the 21 year old started reading before she
was 3 years old, the 18 year old started reading at 8 years old.
All three read voraciously.
Each child develops according to their own internal timetable. I just
looked up the normal age for children to begin walking - the charts say
9 months to 18 months. That is a HUGE range (a kid walking at 18 months
old is TWICE as old as a kid walking at 7 months), and it isn't even big
enough. My youngest daughter started walking when she was 7 months old -
and I mean really walking, not holding onto anything, not just taking a
step or two.
The same thing is true of reading - when kids are allowed to learn on
their own internal timetable, the range of normal development is huge -
3 years old to 16 years old are the most extreme ends I've heard of. It
is my impression that most unschooled kids learn to read between 5 and
10, which is pretty much the same as when most kids in school learn to
read. But MANY learn to read earlier or later than that and the
difference between unschoolers and school is that we support that
learning WHEN it happens instead of trying to force it to happen on our
schedule.
As unschoolers, we aren't trying to delay or speed up reading, but it is
helpful to recognize the advantages of delayed reading.
Not-yet-reading does NOT mean not-yet-learning, of course, and it
doesn't have to even mean not-yet-learning from books, right? Kids can
be read to and can listen to books long before they start reading
independently. My own observation of a number of much-later readers is
that they develop listening skills that are extremely valuable.
One always-unschooled young man I know did not read independently until
he was about 12 or 13 years old. He recently took my college economics
courses and he was the first student ever (in my 35 years of college
teaching) to completely ace one of my classes - 100 percent on every
exam. He was able to sit and listen to lectures and absorb and
understand it all. The contrast between his ability to learn by
listening versus that of other college students was very great! When he
was growing up, not-yet-reading, he was read to by the hour, listened to
books on tape/cd a lot, and watched probably hundreds of videos of all
kinds. By the time he started reading independently, he was already
extremely "well read."
Consider not putting so much emphasis on reading books independently -
it isn't as big a deal as the educational experts have convinced us it is.
I, by the way, haven't read many books in the last few years because my
eyesight is very poor. I have listened to hundreds of books, however,
and I have discovered that I get much more out of listening to books
than reading them in print. The reason is that I am a very fast reader
and I tend to skim when reading in print, which I can't really do when
listening.
There are also GREAT advantages - major huge gigantic wonderful exciting
amazing advantages - to giving the child the gift of learning to read
in their own way and their own time. Turns out, reading is such a big
deal in this society that once a kid has learned to read without
instruction, lessons, assignments, modules, drills, tests, and grades -
that child will always know that he/she learned to read without being
taught. It is incredibly powerful - it carries over into everything - it
gives kids a kind of confidence and sense of self that is incredibly
valuable.
-pam
There are advantages to later reading that you may not have considered
> Here's my question: I'd like to get some sort of grip on whenI have three grown kids - 18, 21, and 24. The 24 year old started
> unschooled kids typically start reading. I need some reassurance that
> letting Finn read when he's ready won't result in him simply never
> being ready. I know there are no studies, so just anecdotally, when
> did your unschooled kid read?
>
reading at 4 1/2 years old; the 21 year old started reading before she
was 3 years old, the 18 year old started reading at 8 years old.
All three read voraciously.
Each child develops according to their own internal timetable. I just
looked up the normal age for children to begin walking - the charts say
9 months to 18 months. That is a HUGE range (a kid walking at 18 months
old is TWICE as old as a kid walking at 7 months), and it isn't even big
enough. My youngest daughter started walking when she was 7 months old -
and I mean really walking, not holding onto anything, not just taking a
step or two.
The same thing is true of reading - when kids are allowed to learn on
their own internal timetable, the range of normal development is huge -
3 years old to 16 years old are the most extreme ends I've heard of. It
is my impression that most unschooled kids learn to read between 5 and
10, which is pretty much the same as when most kids in school learn to
read. But MANY learn to read earlier or later than that and the
difference between unschoolers and school is that we support that
learning WHEN it happens instead of trying to force it to happen on our
schedule.
As unschoolers, we aren't trying to delay or speed up reading, but it is
helpful to recognize the advantages of delayed reading.
Not-yet-reading does NOT mean not-yet-learning, of course, and it
doesn't have to even mean not-yet-learning from books, right? Kids can
be read to and can listen to books long before they start reading
independently. My own observation of a number of much-later readers is
that they develop listening skills that are extremely valuable.
One always-unschooled young man I know did not read independently until
he was about 12 or 13 years old. He recently took my college economics
courses and he was the first student ever (in my 35 years of college
teaching) to completely ace one of my classes - 100 percent on every
exam. He was able to sit and listen to lectures and absorb and
understand it all. The contrast between his ability to learn by
listening versus that of other college students was very great! When he
was growing up, not-yet-reading, he was read to by the hour, listened to
books on tape/cd a lot, and watched probably hundreds of videos of all
kinds. By the time he started reading independently, he was already
extremely "well read."
Consider not putting so much emphasis on reading books independently -
it isn't as big a deal as the educational experts have convinced us it is.
I, by the way, haven't read many books in the last few years because my
eyesight is very poor. I have listened to hundreds of books, however,
and I have discovered that I get much more out of listening to books
than reading them in print. The reason is that I am a very fast reader
and I tend to skim when reading in print, which I can't really do when
listening.
There are also GREAT advantages - major huge gigantic wonderful exciting
amazing advantages - to giving the child the gift of learning to read
in their own way and their own time. Turns out, reading is such a big
deal in this society that once a kid has learned to read without
instruction, lessons, assignments, modules, drills, tests, and grades -
that child will always know that he/she learned to read without being
taught. It is incredibly powerful - it carries over into everything - it
gives kids a kind of confidence and sense of self that is incredibly
valuable.
-pam
There are advantages to later reading that you may not have considered
Pam Sorooshian
On 8/3/2009 8:41 AM, Pam Sorooshian wrote:
walking at 9 months).
Sorry.
-pam
> (a kid walking at 18 monthsI meant to say (a kid walking at 18 months old is TWICE as old as a kid
> old is TWICE as old as a kid walking at 7 months),
walking at 9 months).
Sorry.
-pam
BRIAN POLIKOWSKY
You loved reading because it came easy to you. If it did not and you were labeled and called learning disable then things could have been a lot different.
I too learned to read early and loved it.
I know several unschooled kids. ALL of them learned to read. Some as early as 3-4 others a lot later at 11-14.
My son started reading at 6 . He started his jorney into reading a lot earlier at 3 when he used to love to write words.
He never liked or got anything out of phonics. He never had reading lessons.
For you to be able to unschool you will need to let go of expectations.
Read more here:
http://sandradodd.com/expectations
http://sandradodd.com/reading
http://joyfullyrejoycing.com/
Alex Polikowsky
http://polykow.blogspot.com/
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/unschoolingmn/
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
I too learned to read early and loved it.
I know several unschooled kids. ALL of them learned to read. Some as early as 3-4 others a lot later at 11-14.
My son started reading at 6 . He started his jorney into reading a lot earlier at 3 when he used to love to write words.
He never liked or got anything out of phonics. He never had reading lessons.
For you to be able to unschool you will need to let go of expectations.
Read more here:
http://sandradodd.com/expectations
http://sandradodd.com/reading
http://joyfullyrejoycing.com/
Alex Polikowsky
http://polykow.blogspot.com/
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/unschoolingmn/
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
One started at 4 and the other at 6.
I have no idea when I started reading. :)
They are both excellent readers and, more importantly, thinkers.
With a house full of books, computers, games, magazines and just real life, it never occurred to me that they wouldn't read. Maybe not what I read and certainly not on a schedule but they read just fine.
They are now 14 and 16 and the biggest favor I think I have done so far is to get out of their way.
Relax. :)
Nance
**********
I have no idea when I started reading. :)
They are both excellent readers and, more importantly, thinkers.
With a house full of books, computers, games, magazines and just real life, it never occurred to me that they wouldn't read. Maybe not what I read and certainly not on a schedule but they read just fine.
They are now 14 and 16 and the biggest favor I think I have done so far is to get out of their way.
Relax. :)
Nance
**********
> Here's my question: I'd like to get some sort of grip on when
> unschooled kids typically start reading. I need some reassurance that
> letting Finn read when he's ready won't result in him simply never
> being ready. I know there are no studies, so just anecdotally, when
> did your unschooled kid read?
>
> Thanks so much!
>
>
akgths
I thought I'd have a hard time with this as well, but as I've learned more (not technically about unschooling, either) and gotten to the point of "School age" with my oldest and now my second child, I've found that unschooling just comes more naturally and I the wrote workbooks and busywork of even the homeschooling texts was so absurdly unnecessary (Saxon Math, for example!).
There are two books that I'd suggest that talk specifically to this concern about reading. You should be able to find both at the public library or on amazon for a decent price.
The first is "Dumbing us Down" by John Taylor Ghatto. He talks about what public school is really teaching our children (it works, it just doesn't do what everyone wants it to do --scary) and has a section in there where talks about how, when a child is ready to learn reading, writing and arithematic (not a set age by his standards either), that learning ALL of the above takes less than 100 hours total time as opposed to 6-12+ years of schooling. Very interesting book and a good read.
The second doesn't follow the unschooling style outright, but is a method that starts out VERY unschool-ish and even when it progresses to higher levels (or more hours) of learning, is still VERY much child-led and mentor-ship based. Lots of parental modelling, and it explains that children have to learn to understand and use language first, that the formal reading and writing can come later when they are ready or need that, and as long as they can think and speak appropriately, it'll come at whatever age they are ready. Here I am going on and on about a book I haven't told you the title of! It's called "A Thomas Jefferson Education" by Oliver DeMille. It is actually the style of homeschooling we will be following, but in our society, I need the "Unschooling" reinforcement to let go of the nonesense that's been pushed upon me for years and we truly are unschooling right now with lots of parental modeling (which is what it is!).
Best of luck! I honestly wouldn't worry about it. Having come from the situation of having a bad reading experience in school early on (and I never had a problem reading) and then not reading a from 2nd grade through to my Junior Year of high school, I'm more concerned about forcing the issue or causing negative feelings in my children. They love audio books, love for me to read books that are WAY above their leve, etc.
Catherine
There are two books that I'd suggest that talk specifically to this concern about reading. You should be able to find both at the public library or on amazon for a decent price.
The first is "Dumbing us Down" by John Taylor Ghatto. He talks about what public school is really teaching our children (it works, it just doesn't do what everyone wants it to do --scary) and has a section in there where talks about how, when a child is ready to learn reading, writing and arithematic (not a set age by his standards either), that learning ALL of the above takes less than 100 hours total time as opposed to 6-12+ years of schooling. Very interesting book and a good read.
The second doesn't follow the unschooling style outright, but is a method that starts out VERY unschool-ish and even when it progresses to higher levels (or more hours) of learning, is still VERY much child-led and mentor-ship based. Lots of parental modelling, and it explains that children have to learn to understand and use language first, that the formal reading and writing can come later when they are ready or need that, and as long as they can think and speak appropriately, it'll come at whatever age they are ready. Here I am going on and on about a book I haven't told you the title of! It's called "A Thomas Jefferson Education" by Oliver DeMille. It is actually the style of homeschooling we will be following, but in our society, I need the "Unschooling" reinforcement to let go of the nonesense that's been pushed upon me for years and we truly are unschooling right now with lots of parental modeling (which is what it is!).
Best of luck! I honestly wouldn't worry about it. Having come from the situation of having a bad reading experience in school early on (and I never had a problem reading) and then not reading a from 2nd grade through to my Junior Year of high school, I'm more concerned about forcing the issue or causing negative feelings in my children. They love audio books, love for me to read books that are WAY above their leve, etc.
Catherine
Heather
My kids both started reading at about age 7-8. They are 12 and 16 now.
I started reading at 5 and my mom says she regrets pushing it.
Heather (in NY)
I started reading at 5 and my mom says she regrets pushing it.
Heather (in NY)
> > Here's my question: I'd like to get some sort of grip on when
> > unschooled kids typically start reading. I need some reassurance that
> > letting Finn read when he's ready won't result in him simply never
> > being ready. I know there are no studies, so just anecdotally, when
> > did your unschooled kid read?
> >
> > Thanks so much!
> >
> >
>
>
> .
>
>
Bekki Kirby
My daughter taught herself to read at the age of 4, using the Leap Pad
phonics books. SHE wanted them and SHE spent hours sitting there,
working through the books. I never did more than buy them for her.
We reinforced it brilliantly (if I do say so myself) and
unintentionally by reading Magic Tree House books to her at bedtime.
We'd read a couple of chapters, with her able to see the pages, if she
wished, and then she'd stay up another hour or so, reading over them
again. She apparently could remember what she'd heard, so if she came
to a difficult word, she could figure it out.
She is 10 1/2 now and a voracious reader.
My son taught himself to read starting at the age of 2... just by
decoding all the symbols in his life. It started with Wal-Mart. See
the sign, remember what it says. Went on to the names of all the
stores we went to regularly, then stuff in video games like "play" and
"pause." He can now read quite a bit, but accepts NO help or
correction whatsoever, so he gets some words wrong. :-) And he
doesn't give a fig about books. He's a gamer. He likes to be able to
read instructions, play the games, and do stuff on the internet.
Books? Too dull. Not interactive. He's 4 1/2, so I'm still hoping
the book bug will bite him later. We have so many great books that I
think he'd love if he gave 'em a chance. But, he's got a different
world that he's interested in. He doesn't even like most TV shows or
movies, because of the lack of interaction. So... it's a personality
thing with some kids.
I am pregnant again, and I have to confess that I probably will panic
if this next one doesn't learn to read until later... Having reading
kids has really helped smooth over all the relatives who are opposed
to homeschooling. I'm so grateful for this list, because I know it
will help keep me sane. :-)
Oh, for what it's worth, my husband learned to read at 2, thanks to
intensive teaching from a much-older sister. And I learned at 4,
because my grandma/babysitter was a reading tutor.
Bekki
phonics books. SHE wanted them and SHE spent hours sitting there,
working through the books. I never did more than buy them for her.
We reinforced it brilliantly (if I do say so myself) and
unintentionally by reading Magic Tree House books to her at bedtime.
We'd read a couple of chapters, with her able to see the pages, if she
wished, and then she'd stay up another hour or so, reading over them
again. She apparently could remember what she'd heard, so if she came
to a difficult word, she could figure it out.
She is 10 1/2 now and a voracious reader.
My son taught himself to read starting at the age of 2... just by
decoding all the symbols in his life. It started with Wal-Mart. See
the sign, remember what it says. Went on to the names of all the
stores we went to regularly, then stuff in video games like "play" and
"pause." He can now read quite a bit, but accepts NO help or
correction whatsoever, so he gets some words wrong. :-) And he
doesn't give a fig about books. He's a gamer. He likes to be able to
read instructions, play the games, and do stuff on the internet.
Books? Too dull. Not interactive. He's 4 1/2, so I'm still hoping
the book bug will bite him later. We have so many great books that I
think he'd love if he gave 'em a chance. But, he's got a different
world that he's interested in. He doesn't even like most TV shows or
movies, because of the lack of interaction. So... it's a personality
thing with some kids.
I am pregnant again, and I have to confess that I probably will panic
if this next one doesn't learn to read until later... Having reading
kids has really helped smooth over all the relatives who are opposed
to homeschooling. I'm so grateful for this list, because I know it
will help keep me sane. :-)
Oh, for what it's worth, my husband learned to read at 2, thanks to
intensive teaching from a much-older sister. And I learned at 4,
because my grandma/babysitter was a reading tutor.
Bekki
Pam Sorooshian
On 8/4/2009 4:44 AM, Heather wrote:
50th anniversary of year for reading). Back in my early school days, it
was considered bad for children for them to read earlier than 7, so I
was actively prevented from learning to read. I remember asking my mom
and dad questions (what is this word?) and them exchanging a "look" and
putting me off. I remember sitting outside, kind of hidden away from the
house, with a picture book that had just one picture and a word on each
page and I was trying to figure out the code. I had figured out "P" and
"A" and "M" because of my name and, after "A is for Apple" the next word
wsa "B is for Book." I remember the feeling of "I GOT IT!!!" I
understood that each letter was going to have its own sound and I
thought I just had to learn all those sounds in order to read. So I sat
out there in the sun, feeling guilty, learning the sounds of all the
letters. Interestingly, I still couldn't read. They didn't used to
actually teach reading until 2nd grade and the very first day of second
grade I thought the teacher would FINALLY explain it. But, no, a few
weeks went by while all we did was letter sounds, again (did it in 1st
grade, too). FINALLY the big books came out and Dick and Jane became my
favorite people in the world. Talk about ready to read - I was so happy
that it was "legal" for me to learn!!!
My daughters each learned in their own way, at their own time. None of
them ever read in that "I'm-sounding-this-out" kind of drawl. They read
the whole word, not the parts of the word, from the beginning. They also
read, from the beginning with great expression when reading aloud. So,
when I say the age they learned to read, I mean the age at which they
could read fluently.
-pam
> I started reading at 5 and my mom says she regrets pushing it.I forgot to say that "I" started reading at 7. I'm 57 now (so it is my
>
>
50th anniversary of year for reading). Back in my early school days, it
was considered bad for children for them to read earlier than 7, so I
was actively prevented from learning to read. I remember asking my mom
and dad questions (what is this word?) and them exchanging a "look" and
putting me off. I remember sitting outside, kind of hidden away from the
house, with a picture book that had just one picture and a word on each
page and I was trying to figure out the code. I had figured out "P" and
"A" and "M" because of my name and, after "A is for Apple" the next word
wsa "B is for Book." I remember the feeling of "I GOT IT!!!" I
understood that each letter was going to have its own sound and I
thought I just had to learn all those sounds in order to read. So I sat
out there in the sun, feeling guilty, learning the sounds of all the
letters. Interestingly, I still couldn't read. They didn't used to
actually teach reading until 2nd grade and the very first day of second
grade I thought the teacher would FINALLY explain it. But, no, a few
weeks went by while all we did was letter sounds, again (did it in 1st
grade, too). FINALLY the big books came out and Dick and Jane became my
favorite people in the world. Talk about ready to read - I was so happy
that it was "legal" for me to learn!!!
My daughters each learned in their own way, at their own time. None of
them ever read in that "I'm-sounding-this-out" kind of drawl. They read
the whole word, not the parts of the word, from the beginning. They also
read, from the beginning with great expression when reading aloud. So,
when I say the age they learned to read, I mean the age at which they
could read fluently.
-pam
Marina DeLuca-Howard
I don't know when my thirteen year old started reading. I know at 1.5 years
of age he drew a letter "B" I thought it was a bumblebee and praised "the
wings". He told me it was a "B", but it never occurred to me he was drawing
letters. I made buzzing sounds, showed it to my husband...all the usual
things a happy mother does with her firstborn's creations. Two days later
he drew an "A" and it dawned on me he was drawing the alphabet: it was
unexpected. More letters followed the A, though not in any order! Having
laughed at all the parents with alpha-blocks, drawing letters in sidewalk
chalk or with sticks in sand I was really perplexed how he had picked up
letters and their names. I read to him and he loved to sit and have us read
book after book after book...
He could print his own name before age two. At age 6.5 he read the first
Harry Potter book. That was when I knew he could read. My nine year old
and six year old, who are his brothers read later. In fact the six year old
doesn't read, nor write his own name. Although at age two he could
recognize the word "book" in both lower or upper case letters. I think
"trust" is the only word to describe my relationship to their attainments.
I trust they will get it.
Marina
--
Rent our cottage: http://davehoward.ca/cottage/
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
of age he drew a letter "B" I thought it was a bumblebee and praised "the
wings". He told me it was a "B", but it never occurred to me he was drawing
letters. I made buzzing sounds, showed it to my husband...all the usual
things a happy mother does with her firstborn's creations. Two days later
he drew an "A" and it dawned on me he was drawing the alphabet: it was
unexpected. More letters followed the A, though not in any order! Having
laughed at all the parents with alpha-blocks, drawing letters in sidewalk
chalk or with sticks in sand I was really perplexed how he had picked up
letters and their names. I read to him and he loved to sit and have us read
book after book after book...
He could print his own name before age two. At age 6.5 he read the first
Harry Potter book. That was when I knew he could read. My nine year old
and six year old, who are his brothers read later. In fact the six year old
doesn't read, nor write his own name. Although at age two he could
recognize the word "book" in both lower or upper case letters. I think
"trust" is the only word to describe my relationship to their attainments.
I trust they will get it.
Marina
--
Rent our cottage: http://davehoward.ca/cottage/
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Meredith
--- In [email protected], Bekki Kirby <junegoddess@...> wrote:
---Meredith (Mo 7, Ray 15)
>> Oh, for what it's worth, my husband learned to read at 2, thanks toIf y'all hadn't been ready, though, all the teaching in the world would have just left you frustrated. Early teaching doesn't equate to early learning. Y'all happened to be wired such that all the necessary skills developed young. Its great that there were people on hand to support you!
> intensive teaching from a much-older sister. And I learned at 4,
> because my grandma/babysitter was a reading tutor.
> We reinforced it brilliantly (if I do say so myself) andReading to kids is one of the things that can be very helpful to them as they are learning to read. Mo, however, dislikes being read to and always has - and yet she learned to read around 4.5. She did something similar to what Pam describes (although she didn't have to hide it) by looking at a lot of books with limited words, or books where every little thing is labeled and figuring out the letter-sound correspondences. Ray didn't read until around 7, and couldn't wrap his mind around phonics at all until after he was already reading.
> unintentionally by reading Magic Tree House books to her at bedtime.
---Meredith (Mo 7, Ray 15)
Pam Sorooshian
On 8/4/2009 2:43 PM, Meredith wrote:
that it was those lessons that got her reading so well before she was
four. If I'd done the same to Rosie, I might easily have blamed Rosie
for having a reading disability because she didn't read until she was
eight.
As a useful exercise - those who just posted about how someone "taught"
them to read, might try rephrasing it and see how that feels - to take
the credit yourself. The other person may have supported and
facilitated, but who did the actual learning?
-pam
>>> Oh, for what it's worth, my husband learned to read at 2, thanks toIf I had been giving reading lessons to Roxana, I'd probably be sure
>>>
>> > intensive teaching from a much-older sister. And I learned at 4,
>> > because my grandma/babysitter was a reading tutor.
>>
>
> If y'all hadn't been ready, though, all the teaching in the world would have just left you frustrated. Early teaching doesn't equate to early learning.
that it was those lessons that got her reading so well before she was
four. If I'd done the same to Rosie, I might easily have blamed Rosie
for having a reading disability because she didn't read until she was
eight.
As a useful exercise - those who just posted about how someone "taught"
them to read, might try rephrasing it and see how that feels - to take
the credit yourself. The other person may have supported and
facilitated, but who did the actual learning?
-pam
Sacha Davis
Thank you everyone - your stories really help me feel comfortable with
my son being different than me. We're not even close to reading but
we read a lot of books together, and reading will come when it does.
Ultimately it's about his journey not mine.
S.
__________________________________
Sacha, mommy to Finn and wife to Megan
Livin' la vida loca in Georgetown, Seattle
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
my son being different than me. We're not even close to reading but
we read a lot of books together, and reading will come when it does.
Ultimately it's about his journey not mine.
S.
__________________________________
Sacha, mommy to Finn and wife to Megan
Livin' la vida loca in Georgetown, Seattle
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Ren Allen
~~ Reading to kids is one of the things that can be very helpful to them as they are learning to read. Mo, however, dislikes being read to and always has - and yet she learned to read around 4.5.~~
Sierra went through several years of not liking anyone reading to her. She was ready for longer books, but couldn't comprehend when someone read to her. Children's picture books were ok, but nothing else. This year (she's 12, started reading fluently around 6-7) she suddenly discovered reading for pleasure. She read Skellig and LOVED it and is currently reading another chapter book.
My two older boys don't read for pleasure, they read to get information. Jared will read these very complicated manuals and Dungeons and Dragons books that make my head spin...that's fun for him but he doesn't read novels or stories. Trust goes a long way in allowing each person's journey to unfold. Whether we're talking about reading or anything else.
If anyone here need a dose of encouragement that unschooling is absolutely the best thing for your child, just check out this video I posted at my blog. There is NO way you could do worse than this....and no way you can make the argument that teaching equals learning after watching this. Here's proof that teaching a person has NOTHING to do with what they know: http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2009/08/04/Hilarious-Proof-of-How-Bad-U.S.-Educational-System-Really-Is.aspx
Ren
radicalunschooling.blogspot.com
Sierra went through several years of not liking anyone reading to her. She was ready for longer books, but couldn't comprehend when someone read to her. Children's picture books were ok, but nothing else. This year (she's 12, started reading fluently around 6-7) she suddenly discovered reading for pleasure. She read Skellig and LOVED it and is currently reading another chapter book.
My two older boys don't read for pleasure, they read to get information. Jared will read these very complicated manuals and Dungeons and Dragons books that make my head spin...that's fun for him but he doesn't read novels or stories. Trust goes a long way in allowing each person's journey to unfold. Whether we're talking about reading or anything else.
If anyone here need a dose of encouragement that unschooling is absolutely the best thing for your child, just check out this video I posted at my blog. There is NO way you could do worse than this....and no way you can make the argument that teaching equals learning after watching this. Here's proof that teaching a person has NOTHING to do with what they know: http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2009/08/04/Hilarious-Proof-of-How-Bad-U.S.-Educational-System-Really-Is.aspx
Ren
radicalunschooling.blogspot.com
Bekki Kirby
> As a useful exercise - those who just posted about how someone "taught"Wow, thanks Pam.
> them to read, might try rephrasing it and see how that feels - to take
> the credit yourself. The other person may have supported and
> facilitated, but who did the actual learning?
>
> -pam
Growing up as a "smart kid" I learned to reflexively give everyone and
everything else the credit for my successes. It was vitally important
to play down my smartness, in order to make/keep friends at school.
I didn't realize I was still doing it.
I'm almost crying... granted, I'm pregnant and raging with hormones...
but, wow. I never realized how little credit I felt like I deserved.
I learned to read at the age of four. I did it.
Bekki
Faith Void
I am not even pregnant and that made me cry. How incredibly
empowering!!! And that's what we are giving our kids :-)
Faith
Sent from my iPhone
empowering!!! And that's what we are giving our kids :-)
Faith
Sent from my iPhone
On Aug 5, 2009, at 12:25 PM, Bekki Kirby <junegoddess@...> wrote:
> > As a useful exercise - those who just posted about how someone
> "taught"
> > them to read, might try rephrasing it and see how that feels - to
> take
> > the credit yourself. The other person may have supported and
> > facilitated, but who did the actual learning?
> >
> > -pam
>
> Wow, thanks Pam.
>
> Growing up as a "smart kid" I learned to reflexively give everyone and
> everything else the credit for my successes. It was vitally important
> to play down my smartness, in order to make/keep friends at school.
>
> I didn't realize I was still doing it.
>
> I'm almost crying... granted, I'm pregnant and raging with hormones...
> but, wow. I never realized how little credit I felt like I deserved.
>
> I learned to read at the age of four. I did it.
>
> Bekki
>
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Faith Void
Well Meredith already pointed you towards my blog. That's Easy's birthday.
Malila has had a variety of birthday party styles. She is very social and
wanted BIG parties growing up. We had not huge but well attended parties
with themes and bells and whistles (figuratively and literally). We had a
Harry Potter themed party for her 10.5 birthday (Her birthday is new year's
eve...) So we invited a bunch of kids and adults that loved Harry Potter. We
made stations of potions, spells, fortune telling, etc. We had games and a
Umbridge pinata (who wouldn't want to smack the crap out of her) and a
treasure hunt. I seriously went all out. Everyone came in costume. It
rocked.
For her 11th birthday she went to the midnight showing of Rocky Horror with
her papa and two friends. They slept over and had fun food. It was low key.
This year 12th birthday was 3 friends and a sleep over. The biggest request
was spray whip cream :-)
Malila celebration blogs
http://faithvoid.blogspot.com/2009/01/malilas-12th-birthday.html
http://faithvoid.blogspot.com/2008/10/tis-season.html
For the baby we did what the older two wanted. A small but lively party with
a few friends of all ages. Cake, pinata and presents. Not too many but
everyone was happy.
My ds (6) talks about what he is going to do for his birthday ALL year long!
He has elaborate plans that change constantly. It is amazing to hear. Many
we write down :-) This year he didn't really want a party just a "pool full
of candy" so we did what we could! This year he wants a Lamborghini, lol. I
smile and talk about how cool that is. One year he wanted TMNT to come meet
him. His sister dressed up like on and hung out with him. It was really
cool.
We go raspberry picking every year for my husbands birthday. Yum :-)
Faith
Malila has had a variety of birthday party styles. She is very social and
wanted BIG parties growing up. We had not huge but well attended parties
with themes and bells and whistles (figuratively and literally). We had a
Harry Potter themed party for her 10.5 birthday (Her birthday is new year's
eve...) So we invited a bunch of kids and adults that loved Harry Potter. We
made stations of potions, spells, fortune telling, etc. We had games and a
Umbridge pinata (who wouldn't want to smack the crap out of her) and a
treasure hunt. I seriously went all out. Everyone came in costume. It
rocked.
For her 11th birthday she went to the midnight showing of Rocky Horror with
her papa and two friends. They slept over and had fun food. It was low key.
This year 12th birthday was 3 friends and a sleep over. The biggest request
was spray whip cream :-)
Malila celebration blogs
http://faithvoid.blogspot.com/2009/01/malilas-12th-birthday.html
http://faithvoid.blogspot.com/2008/10/tis-season.html
For the baby we did what the older two wanted. A small but lively party with
a few friends of all ages. Cake, pinata and presents. Not too many but
everyone was happy.
My ds (6) talks about what he is going to do for his birthday ALL year long!
He has elaborate plans that change constantly. It is amazing to hear. Many
we write down :-) This year he didn't really want a party just a "pool full
of candy" so we did what we could! This year he wants a Lamborghini, lol. I
smile and talk about how cool that is. One year he wanted TMNT to come meet
him. His sister dressed up like on and hung out with him. It was really
cool.
We go raspberry picking every year for my husbands birthday. Yum :-)
Faith
On Sun, Aug 2, 2009 at 8:23 PM, Meredith <meredith@...> wrote:
>
>
> Here's an older blog carnival, more holidays than birthdays, but it might
> give you some ideas of the kinds of traditions other families have:
>
> http://familyrun.ning.com/forum/topics/november-2008-share-the-fun
>
> here's an April Fools day tradition that's just Sooooooooo Much Fun:
> http://3mommies.blogspot.com/2009_04_01_archive.html
>
> and a specific bday blog post of Faiths that I think she posted here pretty
> recently:
>
>
> http://faithvoid.blogspot.com/2008/11/amazing-6-years-old-pix-words-to-follow.html
>
>
>
--
http://faithvoid.blogspot.com/
www.bearthmama.com
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Faith Void
OP: Also, what do people do with the "birthday gift" issue (from parents to
children) when kids are already getting the things they want "just because".
***Well my kids always want to explore new things. Or they want to expand
something they already have. I rarely hold back if I am able to give them
something that they want. For holidays that are about gifting I hold back
for a little while with a few things. I would surely give them something if
they were really bothered by it. My ds is, so we generally open a gift a day
and stretch the celebrating out quite a bit. It is exciting to get gifts so
they do really love to wait.
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
OP: Last year we were in the middle of 5 months of travel when her birthday
came along, and she was not really aware of it as an "event"... an uncle
whom we were visiting got a cake, and some plastic leis and we sang...it
made a big impression on maya and she now asks for birthday songs all the
time....so we do lots of "pretend birthdays"...sticking a candle in a
pancake, piece of bread or whatever is around and singing...
***excellent fun! We have done that a lot around here too! I am looking
forward to it again as the littlest is nearing her 2nd birthday and may be
swept off her feet :-)
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
OP: Looking for a way to make this special and different, also I will be
giving birth about 2 weeks before her birthday so whatever we do needs to be
fairly low key...probably a gathering of 4 or 5 close friends in a park.
***It can be anything that you and she want. It can be low key or a huge
party. What are you feeling up to, what does she want? Sometimes she might
want to make huge plans but not actually go through with them.
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
OP: Lastly, for families who do not do a big gift thing, how do your kids
feel when they go to big parties with tons of gifts....or do i just cross
that bridge when i get there? Thanks for the input and ideas!
***We don't do a huge slew of gifts. We have once when a child needed that
but it isn't typical. NOne of my children (12, 6 & 22 months) has ever been
bothered by the amount of gifts they received or another child received in
front of them. My ds6 can be sad when he doesn't get things at parties so we
always have something for him too (we give all the kids a small gift to
celebrate a sibs birthday) or talk to him before and make plans with him to
handle it.
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
Faith
--
http://faithvoid.blogspot.com/
www.bearthmama.com
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
children) when kids are already getting the things they want "just because".
***Well my kids always want to explore new things. Or they want to expand
something they already have. I rarely hold back if I am able to give them
something that they want. For holidays that are about gifting I hold back
for a little while with a few things. I would surely give them something if
they were really bothered by it. My ds is, so we generally open a gift a day
and stretch the celebrating out quite a bit. It is exciting to get gifts so
they do really love to wait.
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
OP: Last year we were in the middle of 5 months of travel when her birthday
came along, and she was not really aware of it as an "event"... an uncle
whom we were visiting got a cake, and some plastic leis and we sang...it
made a big impression on maya and she now asks for birthday songs all the
time....so we do lots of "pretend birthdays"...sticking a candle in a
pancake, piece of bread or whatever is around and singing...
***excellent fun! We have done that a lot around here too! I am looking
forward to it again as the littlest is nearing her 2nd birthday and may be
swept off her feet :-)
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
OP: Looking for a way to make this special and different, also I will be
giving birth about 2 weeks before her birthday so whatever we do needs to be
fairly low key...probably a gathering of 4 or 5 close friends in a park.
***It can be anything that you and she want. It can be low key or a huge
party. What are you feeling up to, what does she want? Sometimes she might
want to make huge plans but not actually go through with them.
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
OP: Lastly, for families who do not do a big gift thing, how do your kids
feel when they go to big parties with tons of gifts....or do i just cross
that bridge when i get there? Thanks for the input and ideas!
***We don't do a huge slew of gifts. We have once when a child needed that
but it isn't typical. NOne of my children (12, 6 & 22 months) has ever been
bothered by the amount of gifts they received or another child received in
front of them. My ds6 can be sad when he doesn't get things at parties so we
always have something for him too (we give all the kids a small gift to
celebrate a sibs birthday) or talk to him before and make plans with him to
handle it.
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
Faith
--
http://faithvoid.blogspot.com/
www.bearthmama.com
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Faith Void
OP: My concern is about reading. Personally I read very very young and
voraciously, and I have some of those same expectations for Finn.
I've adjusted them to expect him to read around 5 or 6 or 7, but I
feel I would be concerned if he went much longer without learning to
read. I was taught to read in Montessori and traditional schools and
it's something that I truly loved and never felt forced to do, and I
am excited for my son to have access to that same world of learning
and imagination.
***I learned to read young (2) and had thought that typical. I have always
loved to read and read a great deal. Eventually I learned that it wasn't
typical that everyone learns on their own timetable. That everyones needs
for success in this life is different. I was fortunate that I learned to
read on my own as I am dyslexic. I would have failed in school had I been
pressured by their methods. I learned to compensate on my own, perfectly
tailored to *me*!
My oldest started playing with letters and writing words before she was 4.
She would write voraciously either asking for help or asking me to do it.
She was (and is) full of stories. She needed to get them out. Writing was
very important to her. I support her adventures with and exploration of
them. I read to her when she wanted me to. I got her audio books. She loved
to listen to stories. One day she wanted to hear more of a story that her
papa was reading her but he couldn't read any more. So she picked it up and
read it herself. Once she realized that she COULD read it she took off. She
started with The Neverending Story and then Coraline.
My ds6 is just beginning reading and writing. It is a joy to watch his
discoveries. I have no agenda as to when he can read well on his own. He
will when he is ready. He loves to copy the names of all the skateboard
companies that he likes from his CSS catalogs. He doesn't like to read
stories. He wants non-fiction. He use to want me to read "Arms and Armour"
over and over again.
Learning can and does happen without reading. My kids learn through a
variety of venues, including TV, internet, videos, other people, doing,
experiences, etc. We all do.
And Imagination...that comes from within. Reading doesn't make you more
creative. Imagination comes from creativity and thinking and dreaming among
other places.
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
OP: Here's my question: I'd like to get some sort of grip on when
unschooled kids typically start reading. I need some reassurance that
letting Finn read when he's ready won't result in him simply never
being ready. I know there are no studies, so just anecdotally, when
did your unschooled kid read?
***unschooled kids aren't typical {bwg}
I can tell you about our family. I started at 2 and dh at 3. Our kids dd#1
started around 7 (maybe before maybe after). ds#2 is 6 now. He can read a
few things but isn't fluent. dd#3 is not 2 yet. She recognizes many letters
and a few words!
My grandfather never learned to read. But it was because he didn't have the
opportunity. Because the life he lead didn't require reading. If your son
chooses a path where reading is important than he WILL learn. If you support
his interests he will feel good about whenever that is.
I don't know if Ren chimed in yet. She does a talk about reading. She has
two unschooled teens come up on stage. One read by 6 the other not until 12.
She has then read a few lines. Then you are asked to figure out which one is
which. She never tells :-) There is no difference. Even if you talk to the
kids you would never know. They are both bright, interesting, self-confident
and knowledgeable,.
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
Faith
--
http://faithvoid.blogspot.com/
www.bearthmama.com
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
voraciously, and I have some of those same expectations for Finn.
I've adjusted them to expect him to read around 5 or 6 or 7, but I
feel I would be concerned if he went much longer without learning to
read. I was taught to read in Montessori and traditional schools and
it's something that I truly loved and never felt forced to do, and I
am excited for my son to have access to that same world of learning
and imagination.
***I learned to read young (2) and had thought that typical. I have always
loved to read and read a great deal. Eventually I learned that it wasn't
typical that everyone learns on their own timetable. That everyones needs
for success in this life is different. I was fortunate that I learned to
read on my own as I am dyslexic. I would have failed in school had I been
pressured by their methods. I learned to compensate on my own, perfectly
tailored to *me*!
My oldest started playing with letters and writing words before she was 4.
She would write voraciously either asking for help or asking me to do it.
She was (and is) full of stories. She needed to get them out. Writing was
very important to her. I support her adventures with and exploration of
them. I read to her when she wanted me to. I got her audio books. She loved
to listen to stories. One day she wanted to hear more of a story that her
papa was reading her but he couldn't read any more. So she picked it up and
read it herself. Once she realized that she COULD read it she took off. She
started with The Neverending Story and then Coraline.
My ds6 is just beginning reading and writing. It is a joy to watch his
discoveries. I have no agenda as to when he can read well on his own. He
will when he is ready. He loves to copy the names of all the skateboard
companies that he likes from his CSS catalogs. He doesn't like to read
stories. He wants non-fiction. He use to want me to read "Arms and Armour"
over and over again.
Learning can and does happen without reading. My kids learn through a
variety of venues, including TV, internet, videos, other people, doing,
experiences, etc. We all do.
And Imagination...that comes from within. Reading doesn't make you more
creative. Imagination comes from creativity and thinking and dreaming among
other places.
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
OP: Here's my question: I'd like to get some sort of grip on when
unschooled kids typically start reading. I need some reassurance that
letting Finn read when he's ready won't result in him simply never
being ready. I know there are no studies, so just anecdotally, when
did your unschooled kid read?
***unschooled kids aren't typical {bwg}
I can tell you about our family. I started at 2 and dh at 3. Our kids dd#1
started around 7 (maybe before maybe after). ds#2 is 6 now. He can read a
few things but isn't fluent. dd#3 is not 2 yet. She recognizes many letters
and a few words!
My grandfather never learned to read. But it was because he didn't have the
opportunity. Because the life he lead didn't require reading. If your son
chooses a path where reading is important than he WILL learn. If you support
his interests he will feel good about whenever that is.
I don't know if Ren chimed in yet. She does a talk about reading. She has
two unschooled teens come up on stage. One read by 6 the other not until 12.
She has then read a few lines. Then you are asked to figure out which one is
which. She never tells :-) There is no difference. Even if you talk to the
kids you would never know. They are both bright, interesting, self-confident
and knowledgeable,.
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
Faith
--
http://faithvoid.blogspot.com/
www.bearthmama.com
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Betj
My son and I both test "gifted" and struggled to read. It wasn't concrete like numbers, we could touch 3 and 3 and get 6. We didn't seem to take well to the stillness that went with reading. I think for very active children hands on is easier and reading isn't the most hands on but it does come when something piques their interest.
Beth
Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry
-----Original Message-----
From: Faith Void <littlemsvoid@...>
Date: Wed, 5 Aug 2009 16:18:50
To: <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [unschoolingbasics] Reading
OP: My concern is about reading. Personally I read very very young and
voraciously, and I have some of those same expectations for Finn.
I've adjusted them to expect him to read around 5 or 6 or 7, but I
feel I would be concerned if he went much longer without learning to
read. I was taught to read in Montessori and traditional schools and
it's something that I truly loved and never felt forced to do, and I
am excited for my son to have access to that same world of learning
and imagination.
***I learned to read young (2) and had thought that typical. I have always
loved to read and read a great deal. Eventually I learned that it wasn't
typical that everyone learns on their own timetable. That everyones needs
for success in this life is different. I was fortunate that I learned to
read on my own as I am dyslexic. I would have failed in school had I been
pressured by their methods. I learned to compensate on my own, perfectly
tailored to *me*!
My oldest started playing with letters and writing words before she was 4.
She would write voraciously either asking for help or asking me to do it.
She was (and is) full of stories. She needed to get them out. Writing was
very important to her. I support her adventures with and exploration of
them. I read to her when she wanted me to. I got her audio books. She loved
to listen to stories. One day she wanted to hear more of a story that her
papa was reading her but he couldn't read any more. So she picked it up and
read it herself. Once she realized that she COULD read it she took off. She
started with The Neverending Story and then Coraline.
My ds6 is just beginning reading and writing. It is a joy to watch his
discoveries. I have no agenda as to when he can read well on his own. He
will when he is ready. He loves to copy the names of all the skateboard
companies that he likes from his CSS catalogs. He doesn't like to read
stories. He wants non-fiction. He use to want me to read "Arms and Armour"
over and over again.
Learning can and does happen without reading. My kids learn through a
variety of venues, including TV, internet, videos, other people, doing,
experiences, etc. We all do.
And Imagination...that comes from within. Reading doesn't make you more
creative. Imagination comes from creativity and thinking and dreaming among
other places.
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
OP: Here's my question: I'd like to get some sort of grip on when
unschooled kids typically start reading. I need some reassurance that
letting Finn read when he's ready won't result in him simply never
being ready. I know there are no studies, so just anecdotally, when
did your unschooled kid read?
***unschooled kids aren't typical {bwg}
I can tell you about our family. I started at 2 and dh at 3. Our kids dd#1
started around 7 (maybe before maybe after). ds#2 is 6 now. He can read a
few things but isn't fluent. dd#3 is not 2 yet. She recognizes many letters
and a few words!
My grandfather never learned to read. But it was because he didn't have the
opportunity. Because the life he lead didn't require reading. If your son
chooses a path where reading is important than he WILL learn. If you support
his interests he will feel good about whenever that is.
I don't know if Ren chimed in yet. She does a talk about reading. She has
two unschooled teens come up on stage. One read by 6 the other not until 12.
She has then read a few lines. Then you are asked to figure out which one is
which. She never tells :-) There is no difference. Even if you talk to the
kids you would never know. They are both bright, interesting, self-confident
and knowledgeable,.
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
Faith
--
http://faithvoid.blogspot.com/
www.bearthmama.com
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Beth
Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry
-----Original Message-----
From: Faith Void <littlemsvoid@...>
Date: Wed, 5 Aug 2009 16:18:50
To: <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [unschoolingbasics] Reading
OP: My concern is about reading. Personally I read very very young and
voraciously, and I have some of those same expectations for Finn.
I've adjusted them to expect him to read around 5 or 6 or 7, but I
feel I would be concerned if he went much longer without learning to
read. I was taught to read in Montessori and traditional schools and
it's something that I truly loved and never felt forced to do, and I
am excited for my son to have access to that same world of learning
and imagination.
***I learned to read young (2) and had thought that typical. I have always
loved to read and read a great deal. Eventually I learned that it wasn't
typical that everyone learns on their own timetable. That everyones needs
for success in this life is different. I was fortunate that I learned to
read on my own as I am dyslexic. I would have failed in school had I been
pressured by their methods. I learned to compensate on my own, perfectly
tailored to *me*!
My oldest started playing with letters and writing words before she was 4.
She would write voraciously either asking for help or asking me to do it.
She was (and is) full of stories. She needed to get them out. Writing was
very important to her. I support her adventures with and exploration of
them. I read to her when she wanted me to. I got her audio books. She loved
to listen to stories. One day she wanted to hear more of a story that her
papa was reading her but he couldn't read any more. So she picked it up and
read it herself. Once she realized that she COULD read it she took off. She
started with The Neverending Story and then Coraline.
My ds6 is just beginning reading and writing. It is a joy to watch his
discoveries. I have no agenda as to when he can read well on his own. He
will when he is ready. He loves to copy the names of all the skateboard
companies that he likes from his CSS catalogs. He doesn't like to read
stories. He wants non-fiction. He use to want me to read "Arms and Armour"
over and over again.
Learning can and does happen without reading. My kids learn through a
variety of venues, including TV, internet, videos, other people, doing,
experiences, etc. We all do.
And Imagination...that comes from within. Reading doesn't make you more
creative. Imagination comes from creativity and thinking and dreaming among
other places.
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
OP: Here's my question: I'd like to get some sort of grip on when
unschooled kids typically start reading. I need some reassurance that
letting Finn read when he's ready won't result in him simply never
being ready. I know there are no studies, so just anecdotally, when
did your unschooled kid read?
***unschooled kids aren't typical {bwg}
I can tell you about our family. I started at 2 and dh at 3. Our kids dd#1
started around 7 (maybe before maybe after). ds#2 is 6 now. He can read a
few things but isn't fluent. dd#3 is not 2 yet. She recognizes many letters
and a few words!
My grandfather never learned to read. But it was because he didn't have the
opportunity. Because the life he lead didn't require reading. If your son
chooses a path where reading is important than he WILL learn. If you support
his interests he will feel good about whenever that is.
I don't know if Ren chimed in yet. She does a talk about reading. She has
two unschooled teens come up on stage. One read by 6 the other not until 12.
She has then read a few lines. Then you are asked to figure out which one is
which. She never tells :-) There is no difference. Even if you talk to the
kids you would never know. They are both bright, interesting, self-confident
and knowledgeable,.
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
Faith
--
http://faithvoid.blogspot.com/
www.bearthmama.com
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Meredith
--- In [email protected], "Betj" <bkind28@...> wrote:
When Mo was younger she enjoyed stencils of all kinds - shapes and letters and numbers. She also loved those big rubber mat squares and would separate the letters from the background and use them to build words or use them as giant stencils. That was fun for her.
Its good to look for resources that line up well with kids' dispositions and learning styles - but its also good not to hang expectations on those tools "leading" to reading in some obvious, direct manner.
---Meredith (Mo 7, Ray 15)
>************************
> My son and I both test "gifted" and struggled to read. It wasn't concrete like numbers, we could touch 3 and 3 and get 6. We didn't seem to take well to the stillness that went with reading. I think for very active children hands on is easier and reading isn't the most hands on but it does come when something piques their interest.
When Mo was younger she enjoyed stencils of all kinds - shapes and letters and numbers. She also loved those big rubber mat squares and would separate the letters from the background and use them to build words or use them as giant stencils. That was fun for her.
Its good to look for resources that line up well with kids' dispositions and learning styles - but its also good not to hang expectations on those tools "leading" to reading in some obvious, direct manner.
---Meredith (Mo 7, Ray 15)
Ren Allen
~~My concern is about reading. Personally I read very very young and voraciously, and I have some of those same expectations for Finn. ~~
Expectations can really get in the way of the natural unfolding a person needs to do. My suggestion is to work on why that expectation exists and whether or not you're willing to let go of it and BE with what IS.
~~I've adjusted them to expect him to read around 5 or 6 or 7, but I
~~I am excited for my son to have access to that same world of learning and imagination.~~
If he learns to read early, then he loses other kinds of learning and imagination. Some people's learning and imagination are totally tied to reading early, other people have different forms of learning and imagination and it would be stifled if they read "early". Be excited for him to unfold in his own way and time because THAT is a rare gift in this world! Be excited for your child to have access to learning and imagination of his own variety, in which reading will become a part when he's good and ready and not before.
~~Here's my question: I'd like to get some sort of grip on when unschooled kids typically start reading.~~
I'd guess later than most, in general. Because we don't push and prod and say "look, he's reading" when a child reads 2-3 words or stumbles around a simple child-reader book that is dumbed down. Trust means that children read when it's comfortable, in their own unique way at whatever age they become capable of decoding. Out of four children I have one that started at 8-9, one at 12, one at 6-7 and my youngest is currently just beginning to recognize a few letters at age 8.5.
I guarantee you can't tell who read first, or better or fastest when they're 20 years old. Heck, you can't tell with my three reading children and Jared (who started at 12 and is now almost 16) has the least experience yet reads as good as any adult I know.
~~I need some reassurance that letting Finn read when he's ready won't result in him simply never being ready.~~
Find me a grown unschooled kid who is illiterate. Just one. A single ONE would crash all my theories and trust. I don't know of one...anywhere, ever. I know of some schooled kids who think they're dumb and developmentally "delayed" and even some who grow up illiterate. Find me a single illiterate person who did not go to school! Just one. They all started out in school and decided they weren't intelligent, capable human beings at some point and gave up. That's what the system can do to some people.
I imagine Jared (16) would have had tremendous pressure and destructive labels had he struggled with reading in school. Thank goodness he was free to learn in his own time and does not think it weird or strange that he learned to read at 12 instead of 6. Prescribed time tables for learning are false and not based on human development at ALL. Trusting your child means letting go of "norms" and time tables and simply being with them, in their own learning journey.
Ren
radicalunschooling.blogspot.com
Expectations can really get in the way of the natural unfolding a person needs to do. My suggestion is to work on why that expectation exists and whether or not you're willing to let go of it and BE with what IS.
~~I've adjusted them to expect him to read around 5 or 6 or 7, but I
> feel I would be concerned if he went much longer without learning to read.~~Why is that? Messages about when a child "should" learn to read come from schools, one of the most unnatural institutions to ever exist (in their current form). Is the concern that he won't read if it's not by a certain age? Is the concern about judgment from other people? What is the true concern? People don't go around talking about when they started reading or tying their shoes or riding a bike as a method to judge their current capabilities once they're adults.
~~I am excited for my son to have access to that same world of learning and imagination.~~
If he learns to read early, then he loses other kinds of learning and imagination. Some people's learning and imagination are totally tied to reading early, other people have different forms of learning and imagination and it would be stifled if they read "early". Be excited for him to unfold in his own way and time because THAT is a rare gift in this world! Be excited for your child to have access to learning and imagination of his own variety, in which reading will become a part when he's good and ready and not before.
~~Here's my question: I'd like to get some sort of grip on when unschooled kids typically start reading.~~
I'd guess later than most, in general. Because we don't push and prod and say "look, he's reading" when a child reads 2-3 words or stumbles around a simple child-reader book that is dumbed down. Trust means that children read when it's comfortable, in their own unique way at whatever age they become capable of decoding. Out of four children I have one that started at 8-9, one at 12, one at 6-7 and my youngest is currently just beginning to recognize a few letters at age 8.5.
I guarantee you can't tell who read first, or better or fastest when they're 20 years old. Heck, you can't tell with my three reading children and Jared (who started at 12 and is now almost 16) has the least experience yet reads as good as any adult I know.
~~I need some reassurance that letting Finn read when he's ready won't result in him simply never being ready.~~
Find me a grown unschooled kid who is illiterate. Just one. A single ONE would crash all my theories and trust. I don't know of one...anywhere, ever. I know of some schooled kids who think they're dumb and developmentally "delayed" and even some who grow up illiterate. Find me a single illiterate person who did not go to school! Just one. They all started out in school and decided they weren't intelligent, capable human beings at some point and gave up. That's what the system can do to some people.
I imagine Jared (16) would have had tremendous pressure and destructive labels had he struggled with reading in school. Thank goodness he was free to learn in his own time and does not think it weird or strange that he learned to read at 12 instead of 6. Prescribed time tables for learning are false and not based on human development at ALL. Trusting your child means letting go of "norms" and time tables and simply being with them, in their own learning journey.
Ren
radicalunschooling.blogspot.com
Melissa Gray
My son Sam (8 yo) isn't reading yet. However, he does have that same
access because I read with him. He can see the stories that I love
while I read to him.
I know it will happen when he's ready, I have four older children who
have learned to read on their own. The three that did before 'school
age' don't read faster, or remember better, or cross connect more
than Rachel, who was seven (I should say seven when *I* noticed she
was reading a lot. obviously before that she was doing some sight
reading, etc) Pre-emergent reading skills is what schoolies call it!
Melissa
Mom to Joshua, Breanna, Emily, Rachel, Samuel, Daniel, Avari, and
baby Nathan!
Wife to Zane
blog me at
http://startlinglives.blogspot.com/
http://startlinglives365.blogspot.com
access because I read with him. He can see the stories that I love
while I read to him.
I know it will happen when he's ready, I have four older children who
have learned to read on their own. The three that did before 'school
age' don't read faster, or remember better, or cross connect more
than Rachel, who was seven (I should say seven when *I* noticed she
was reading a lot. obviously before that she was doing some sight
reading, etc) Pre-emergent reading skills is what schoolies call it!
Melissa
Mom to Joshua, Breanna, Emily, Rachel, Samuel, Daniel, Avari, and
baby Nathan!
Wife to Zane
blog me at
http://startlinglives.blogspot.com/
http://startlinglives365.blogspot.com
On Aug 6, 2009, at 2:08 PM, Ren Allen wrote:
>
> ~~I am excited for my son to have access to that same world of
> learning and imagination.~~
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]