Re: [unschoolingbasics] Typical day/cleaning/meals & unschooling
[email protected]
In a message dated 6/6/2004 8:27:29 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
[email protected] writes:
I am asking that as intelligent adults that we can agree that unschooling is
just one form of homeschooling and that some people will try this method and
others will not.
-
I wish I had any sense that others have the same hands-off attitude.
But then Helen posts things like this:
"Unschooling.com will probably change over time, simply because we're
planning to change the way unschooling has recently come to be
defined under certain rigid guidelines."
I suppose, eventually, we'll all learn what Helen's new definition of
unschooling is, or homeschooling, or whatever it is that she and HEM are planning and
arranging for all of us. For now, to me, it looks like quite a muddled
attempt to steer me -- as an unschooler -- and I don't need to be steered. Not by
HEM and not by any other organization or group or individual that takes it into
its head to start defining things.
For those newbies here trying to get their heads around unschooling -- enjoy!
:) It's a great way to live and learn.
For those of us who hear (too much) about how other people think we should be
doing things, I guess I'll give up even trying to understand what HEM is up
to and put this in the category of "people I smile at while walking away."
Eventually I'll hear what the new definition is and be informed whether I've been
doing it right all along. :)
Meals -- we eat at vaguely set times but all over the house. I get a chuckle
out of the TV ads urging us to be sure to have dinner together so we can spend
time together. Gad -- I see them 24/7 -- I want to have my spaghetti and turn
off my brain for a few minutes at dinner time! :)
Neatening up -- DD does it, DS doesn't. But he has a door. We impose health
standards -- and towel standards -- he has to bring dishes and laundry out or I
run out of towels. :) Or I go get them. Either way, it works.
OTOH, I'm no Martha Stewart. I read about scrapbooking in our local paper the
other day. Women spending thousands on these wonderful looking photo albums.
I had just gone to the dollar store and bought 3 storage bins and was so proud
of myself for getting our photos out of the garbage bags they were in and
sorted into the storage bins. Hey, I have standards -- just not very high ones! :)
OK -- off to a day of bill paying and Tae Kwon Do (DS getting ready to test
for his 2nd degree black belt -- a big deal) and library and who knows what
else. It's hard for me to think of a "typical day" story -- I guess our days are
all the same, in a way. But so full of little things -- like the cool forensic
science site I just saw -- have to tell the kids about that.
Happy unschooling! :)
Nance
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected] writes:
I am asking that as intelligent adults that we can agree that unschooling is
just one form of homeschooling and that some people will try this method and
others will not.
-
I wish I had any sense that others have the same hands-off attitude.
But then Helen posts things like this:
"Unschooling.com will probably change over time, simply because we're
planning to change the way unschooling has recently come to be
defined under certain rigid guidelines."
I suppose, eventually, we'll all learn what Helen's new definition of
unschooling is, or homeschooling, or whatever it is that she and HEM are planning and
arranging for all of us. For now, to me, it looks like quite a muddled
attempt to steer me -- as an unschooler -- and I don't need to be steered. Not by
HEM and not by any other organization or group or individual that takes it into
its head to start defining things.
For those newbies here trying to get their heads around unschooling -- enjoy!
:) It's a great way to live and learn.
For those of us who hear (too much) about how other people think we should be
doing things, I guess I'll give up even trying to understand what HEM is up
to and put this in the category of "people I smile at while walking away."
Eventually I'll hear what the new definition is and be informed whether I've been
doing it right all along. :)
Meals -- we eat at vaguely set times but all over the house. I get a chuckle
out of the TV ads urging us to be sure to have dinner together so we can spend
time together. Gad -- I see them 24/7 -- I want to have my spaghetti and turn
off my brain for a few minutes at dinner time! :)
Neatening up -- DD does it, DS doesn't. But he has a door. We impose health
standards -- and towel standards -- he has to bring dishes and laundry out or I
run out of towels. :) Or I go get them. Either way, it works.
OTOH, I'm no Martha Stewart. I read about scrapbooking in our local paper the
other day. Women spending thousands on these wonderful looking photo albums.
I had just gone to the dollar store and bought 3 storage bins and was so proud
of myself for getting our photos out of the garbage bags they were in and
sorted into the storage bins. Hey, I have standards -- just not very high ones! :)
OK -- off to a day of bill paying and Tae Kwon Do (DS getting ready to test
for his 2nd degree black belt -- a big deal) and library and who knows what
else. It's hard for me to think of a "typical day" story -- I guess our days are
all the same, in a way. But so full of little things -- like the cool forensic
science site I just saw -- have to tell the kids about that.
Happy unschooling! :)
Nance
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
G&M Contracting Inc., Kenneth Gillilan
This is just my personal opinion, and you can throw it out with the bath
water, but I can't see being so hard on Helen for the decisions she is
making. We have so much to learn from her, being Unschooled herself as well
as Unschooling her child/ren which is something VERY few of us can say. I
think Helen has excellent views on Unschooling and wants just as much as the
rest of us to sing the praises of it, but Helen(and correct me if I'm wrong
Helen) just seems to be pointing out that Homeschooling is the general term
we all fall under. I don't see how, for myself, I lose anything as a
believer in Unschooling by also supporting Homeschooling. When I began to
research about keeping my kids out of school it was HEM magazine that
introduced me to it and it brought me directly to Unschooling. I wouldn't
have known shit, to put it bluntly if it wasn't for that magazine. I didn't
fall in to Unschooling, I wasn't naturally doing it and just not having a
name for it and it did and still does take work for me. I gain comfort from
people such as Helen and yourselves which have the experience and the years
behind them to back up what they are saying.
I don't condone School at home, but for me that's not what
homeschooling even is. Through HEM I could see that it was many things and
I had a choice, thankfully I chose Unschooling.
It just makes me a little sad to see such bashing of people who have
been at Unschooling for so much longer than the majority of us. They are
our foundation and we continue to learn from what they have been, and still
are going through.
Just my opinion.
AnnMarie
-----Original Message-----
From: marbleface@... [mailto:marbleface@...]
Sent: Monday, June 07, 2004 9:11 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [unschoolingbasics] Typical day/cleaning/meals & unschooling
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
water, but I can't see being so hard on Helen for the decisions she is
making. We have so much to learn from her, being Unschooled herself as well
as Unschooling her child/ren which is something VERY few of us can say. I
think Helen has excellent views on Unschooling and wants just as much as the
rest of us to sing the praises of it, but Helen(and correct me if I'm wrong
Helen) just seems to be pointing out that Homeschooling is the general term
we all fall under. I don't see how, for myself, I lose anything as a
believer in Unschooling by also supporting Homeschooling. When I began to
research about keeping my kids out of school it was HEM magazine that
introduced me to it and it brought me directly to Unschooling. I wouldn't
have known shit, to put it bluntly if it wasn't for that magazine. I didn't
fall in to Unschooling, I wasn't naturally doing it and just not having a
name for it and it did and still does take work for me. I gain comfort from
people such as Helen and yourselves which have the experience and the years
behind them to back up what they are saying.
I don't condone School at home, but for me that's not what
homeschooling even is. Through HEM I could see that it was many things and
I had a choice, thankfully I chose Unschooling.
It just makes me a little sad to see such bashing of people who have
been at Unschooling for so much longer than the majority of us. They are
our foundation and we continue to learn from what they have been, and still
are going through.
Just my opinion.
AnnMarie
-----Original Message-----
From: marbleface@... [mailto:marbleface@...]
Sent: Monday, June 07, 2004 9:11 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [unschoolingbasics] Typical day/cleaning/meals & unschooling
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Deb Lewis
***being Unschooled herself as well as Unschooling her child/ren which is
something VERY few of us can say.***
I can say it if we define unschooled as going to public school part of
the time. (left early, farted around a couple of years, became an
emancipated minor at sixteen, left home) I can say my mom was
unschooled if we define that as going to public school part time. I can
say my grandmother was unschooled if we define that as never going to
public school. Maybe my coal miner ancestors were unschooled since most
of the men went to work in the mines in Wales when they were eight or
nine years old. Maybe my moms Jewish ancestors were unschooled since the
girls stayed home with their mamas.
Helen went to public school at least part of the time. Helen herself is
adamant about homeschoolers who use public school programs or charter
schools NOT being called homeschoolers.
We're not interested in this list becoming a forum for anyone's political
agenda. We want to talk unschooling. Anyone who wants to participate in
the homogenizing of unschooling is free to do so, just please move that
discussion to one of Helen's homeschooling lists.
Thanks,
Deb Lewis
mod squad
something VERY few of us can say.***
I can say it if we define unschooled as going to public school part of
the time. (left early, farted around a couple of years, became an
emancipated minor at sixteen, left home) I can say my mom was
unschooled if we define that as going to public school part time. I can
say my grandmother was unschooled if we define that as never going to
public school. Maybe my coal miner ancestors were unschooled since most
of the men went to work in the mines in Wales when they were eight or
nine years old. Maybe my moms Jewish ancestors were unschooled since the
girls stayed home with their mamas.
Helen went to public school at least part of the time. Helen herself is
adamant about homeschoolers who use public school programs or charter
schools NOT being called homeschoolers.
We're not interested in this list becoming a forum for anyone's political
agenda. We want to talk unschooling. Anyone who wants to participate in
the homogenizing of unschooling is free to do so, just please move that
discussion to one of Helen's homeschooling lists.
Thanks,
Deb Lewis
mod squad
G&M Contracting Inc., Kenneth Gillilan
Deb,
So let me get this straight and I am honestly asking not being a smart
ass here. Is it acceptable to go against what Helen believes in and state
that on this list, but not support her and do the same? My defense to Helen
was in response to a bash against her and what HEM stood for. I don't
honestly remember someone telling that person to take it off list or move to
another one. I realize that all discussions of why this list was formed was
agreed to be discussed in a different arena, so should I just ignore the
comments I don't agree with or what would be the proper procedure? Please
let me know so that I can be appropriate in the future.
-----Original Message-----
From: Deb Lewis [mailto:ddzimlew@...]
Sent: Monday, June 07, 2004 12:04 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: [unschoolingbasics] Re: Just my opinion
***being Unschooled herself as well as Unschooling her child/ren which is
something VERY few of us can say.***
I can say it if we define unschooled as going to public school part of
the time. (left early, farted around a couple of years, became an
emancipated minor at sixteen, left home) I can say my mom was
unschooled if we define that as going to public school part time. I can
say my grandmother was unschooled if we define that as never going to
public school. Maybe my coal miner ancestors were unschooled since most
of the men went to work in the mines in Wales when they were eight or
nine years old. Maybe my moms Jewish ancestors were unschooled since the
girls stayed home with their mamas.
Helen went to public school at least part of the time. Helen herself is
adamant about homeschoolers who use public school programs or charter
schools NOT being called homeschoolers.
We're not interested in this list becoming a forum for anyone's political
agenda. We want to talk unschooling. Anyone who wants to participate in
the homogenizing of unschooling is free to do so, just please move that
discussion to one of Helen's homeschooling lists.
Thanks,
Deb Lewis
mod squad
Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
ADVERTISEMENT
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a.. To visit your group on the web, go to:
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b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
[email protected]
c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
So let me get this straight and I am honestly asking not being a smart
ass here. Is it acceptable to go against what Helen believes in and state
that on this list, but not support her and do the same? My defense to Helen
was in response to a bash against her and what HEM stood for. I don't
honestly remember someone telling that person to take it off list or move to
another one. I realize that all discussions of why this list was formed was
agreed to be discussed in a different arena, so should I just ignore the
comments I don't agree with or what would be the proper procedure? Please
let me know so that I can be appropriate in the future.
-----Original Message-----
From: Deb Lewis [mailto:ddzimlew@...]
Sent: Monday, June 07, 2004 12:04 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: [unschoolingbasics] Re: Just my opinion
***being Unschooled herself as well as Unschooling her child/ren which is
something VERY few of us can say.***
I can say it if we define unschooled as going to public school part of
the time. (left early, farted around a couple of years, became an
emancipated minor at sixteen, left home) I can say my mom was
unschooled if we define that as going to public school part time. I can
say my grandmother was unschooled if we define that as never going to
public school. Maybe my coal miner ancestors were unschooled since most
of the men went to work in the mines in Wales when they were eight or
nine years old. Maybe my moms Jewish ancestors were unschooled since the
girls stayed home with their mamas.
Helen went to public school at least part of the time. Helen herself is
adamant about homeschoolers who use public school programs or charter
schools NOT being called homeschoolers.
We're not interested in this list becoming a forum for anyone's political
agenda. We want to talk unschooling. Anyone who wants to participate in
the homogenizing of unschooling is free to do so, just please move that
discussion to one of Helen's homeschooling lists.
Thanks,
Deb Lewis
mod squad
Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
ADVERTISEMENT
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
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a.. To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/unschoolingbasics/
b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
[email protected]
c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Deb Lewis
*** I don't honestly remember someone telling that person to take it off
list or move to
another one. ***
Ren, list owner has asked for discussions of other lists and Helen's
changes to her lists to be taken elsewhere. Kelly, list owner, recently
asked people to take it off list.
I know new people are joining everyday and not everyone has time to
plough through the archives.
I know there will be questions about the changes. That's normal. And I
think we're all willing to mash through some of those because we know
it's going to calm down shortly and move on, as these things always do.
It's ok if you support Helen, I just don't want to see Helen as the
repeated topic on a list which is intended to provide information to new
unschoolers. Helen can be a topic on her own lists <g>
***so should I just ignore the comments I don't agree with or what would
be the proper procedure?***
If you can. <g> I know unschoolers can be passionate. I think it's good
to speak up when we feel we've seen an injustice. But I also know this
is one little ripple that won't change the way you or I live with our
kids. This topic is going to fade away and we are still going to have a
list of new people who want to talk about unschooling. If we can all
focus there, that would be so cool.
If there is a real need to discuss this HEM list change stuff, and
Helen's lists aren't meeting the needs of the people who want to, maybe
we can open a temporary list at yahoo and anyone who wants can go get it
off their chest.
We have lots of options. Lets do our best to keep this list busy with
unschooly stuff.
I'm glad you're here AnnMarie. I always enjoyed your posts so much at
-101.
Deb Lewis
list or move to
another one. ***
Ren, list owner has asked for discussions of other lists and Helen's
changes to her lists to be taken elsewhere. Kelly, list owner, recently
asked people to take it off list.
I know new people are joining everyday and not everyone has time to
plough through the archives.
I know there will be questions about the changes. That's normal. And I
think we're all willing to mash through some of those because we know
it's going to calm down shortly and move on, as these things always do.
It's ok if you support Helen, I just don't want to see Helen as the
repeated topic on a list which is intended to provide information to new
unschoolers. Helen can be a topic on her own lists <g>
***so should I just ignore the comments I don't agree with or what would
be the proper procedure?***
If you can. <g> I know unschoolers can be passionate. I think it's good
to speak up when we feel we've seen an injustice. But I also know this
is one little ripple that won't change the way you or I live with our
kids. This topic is going to fade away and we are still going to have a
list of new people who want to talk about unschooling. If we can all
focus there, that would be so cool.
If there is a real need to discuss this HEM list change stuff, and
Helen's lists aren't meeting the needs of the people who want to, maybe
we can open a temporary list at yahoo and anyone who wants can go get it
off their chest.
We have lots of options. Lets do our best to keep this list busy with
unschooly stuff.
I'm glad you're here AnnMarie. I always enjoyed your posts so much at
-101.
Deb Lewis
G&M Contracting Inc., Kenneth Gillilan
Deb,
Thanks for the answer. And FYI I love this list and am very happy to be
here. I am passionate, too passionate sometimes, but I wouldn't be here if
I didn't believe that Unschooling is a notch above the rest.
I really don't feel like I have anything on my chest. I feel good about
the changes all the way around. It is more clearly defined now and I am
thankful for it.
I truthfully was wanting to know what the procedure should be and now
that I know I will definitely be ignoring those remarks directed towards the
past.
Thanks again for the clarification.
AnnMarie
-----Original Message-----
From: Deb Lewis [mailto:ddzimlew@...]
Sent: Monday, June 07, 2004 1:33 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [unschoolingbasics] Re: Just my opinion
*** I don't honestly remember someone telling that person to take it off
list or move to
another one. ***
Ren, list owner has asked for discussions of other lists and Helen's
changes to her lists to be taken elsewhere. Kelly, list owner, recently
asked people to take it off list.
I know new people are joining everyday and not everyone has time to
plough through the archives.
I know there will be questions about the changes. That's normal. And I
think we're all willing to mash through some of those because we know
it's going to calm down shortly and move on, as these things always do.
It's ok if you support Helen, I just don't want to see Helen as the
repeated topic on a list which is intended to provide information to new
unschoolers. Helen can be a topic on her own lists <g>
***so should I just ignore the comments I don't agree with or what would
be the proper procedure?***
If you can. <g> I know unschoolers can be passionate. I think it's good
to speak up when we feel we've seen an injustice. But I also know this
is one little ripple that won't change the way you or I live with our
kids. This topic is going to fade away and we are still going to have a
list of new people who want to talk about unschooling. If we can all
focus there, that would be so cool.
If there is a real need to discuss this HEM list change stuff, and
Helen's lists aren't meeting the needs of the people who want to, maybe
we can open a temporary list at yahoo and anyone who wants can go get it
off their chest.
We have lots of options. Lets do our best to keep this list busy with
unschooly stuff.
I'm glad you're here AnnMarie. I always enjoyed your posts so much at
-101.
Deb Lewis
Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
ADVERTISEMENT
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
--
Yahoo! Groups Links
a.. To visit your group on the web, go to:
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b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
[email protected]
c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Thanks for the answer. And FYI I love this list and am very happy to be
here. I am passionate, too passionate sometimes, but I wouldn't be here if
I didn't believe that Unschooling is a notch above the rest.
I really don't feel like I have anything on my chest. I feel good about
the changes all the way around. It is more clearly defined now and I am
thankful for it.
I truthfully was wanting to know what the procedure should be and now
that I know I will definitely be ignoring those remarks directed towards the
past.
Thanks again for the clarification.
AnnMarie
-----Original Message-----
From: Deb Lewis [mailto:ddzimlew@...]
Sent: Monday, June 07, 2004 1:33 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [unschoolingbasics] Re: Just my opinion
*** I don't honestly remember someone telling that person to take it off
list or move to
another one. ***
Ren, list owner has asked for discussions of other lists and Helen's
changes to her lists to be taken elsewhere. Kelly, list owner, recently
asked people to take it off list.
I know new people are joining everyday and not everyone has time to
plough through the archives.
I know there will be questions about the changes. That's normal. And I
think we're all willing to mash through some of those because we know
it's going to calm down shortly and move on, as these things always do.
It's ok if you support Helen, I just don't want to see Helen as the
repeated topic on a list which is intended to provide information to new
unschoolers. Helen can be a topic on her own lists <g>
***so should I just ignore the comments I don't agree with or what would
be the proper procedure?***
If you can. <g> I know unschoolers can be passionate. I think it's good
to speak up when we feel we've seen an injustice. But I also know this
is one little ripple that won't change the way you or I live with our
kids. This topic is going to fade away and we are still going to have a
list of new people who want to talk about unschooling. If we can all
focus there, that would be so cool.
If there is a real need to discuss this HEM list change stuff, and
Helen's lists aren't meeting the needs of the people who want to, maybe
we can open a temporary list at yahoo and anyone who wants can go get it
off their chest.
We have lots of options. Lets do our best to keep this list busy with
unschooly stuff.
I'm glad you're here AnnMarie. I always enjoyed your posts so much at
-101.
Deb Lewis
Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
ADVERTISEMENT
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
--
Yahoo! Groups Links
a.. To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/unschoolingbasics/
b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
[email protected]
c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
In a message dated 6/7/2004 1:20:42 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
gmcontractinginc@... writes:
So let me get this straight and I am honestly asking not being a smart
ass here. <<<<<
Nah, That's Deb's job: resident smart-ass! And we pay her well for it! <g>
Is it acceptable to go against what Helen believes in and state
that on this list, but not support her and do the same? My defense to Helen
was in response to a bash against her and what HEM stood for. I don't
honestly remember someone telling that person to take it off list or move to
another one. I realize that all discussions of why this list was formed was
agreed to be discussed in a different arena, so should I just ignore the
comments I don't agree with or what would be the proper procedure? Please
let me know so that I can be appropriate in the future.<<<<
Mostly, I don't want us to argue about another list or its politics. We left
that one because it was becoming something different than what it was
originally intended to be----a list for beginning unschoolers.
This list IS for beginning unschoolers, and we want it to stay that way.
We'd appreciate everyone's help in keeping this list focused on unschooling.
Thanks so much!
~Kelly
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
gmcontractinginc@... writes:
So let me get this straight and I am honestly asking not being a smart
ass here. <<<<<
Nah, That's Deb's job: resident smart-ass! And we pay her well for it! <g>
Is it acceptable to go against what Helen believes in and state
that on this list, but not support her and do the same? My defense to Helen
was in response to a bash against her and what HEM stood for. I don't
honestly remember someone telling that person to take it off list or move to
another one. I realize that all discussions of why this list was formed was
agreed to be discussed in a different arena, so should I just ignore the
comments I don't agree with or what would be the proper procedure? Please
let me know so that I can be appropriate in the future.<<<<
Mostly, I don't want us to argue about another list or its politics. We left
that one because it was becoming something different than what it was
originally intended to be----a list for beginning unschoolers.
This list IS for beginning unschoolers, and we want it to stay that way.
We'd appreciate everyone's help in keeping this list focused on unschooling.
Thanks so much!
~Kelly
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Helen Hegener
At 10:49 AM -0400 6/7/04, G&M Contracting Inc., Kenneth Gillilan wrote:
here long after I wondered if it was a hopeless effort. Thanks,
AnnMarie - and thanks also to those who I know feel the same, but
don't want to get into the middle of this (for good reason).
Helen
>This is just my personal opinion, and you can throw it out with the bathAnnMarie, you're the *rightest* person I've read today! <g>
>water, but I can't see being so hard on Helen for the decisions she is
>making. We have so much to learn from her, being Unschooled herself as well
>as Unschooling her child/ren which is something VERY few of us can say. I
>think Helen has excellent views on Unschooling and wants just as much as the
>rest of us to sing the praises of it, but Helen(and correct me if I'm wrong
>Helen) just seems to be pointing out that Homeschooling is the general term
>we all fall under.
> It just makes me a little sad to see such bashing of people who haveThis post has really made my day, and made me glad I kept reading
>been at Unschooling for so much longer than the majority of us. They are
>our foundation and we continue to learn from what they have been, and still
>are going through.
here long after I wondered if it was a hopeless effort. Thanks,
AnnMarie - and thanks also to those who I know feel the same, but
don't want to get into the middle of this (for good reason).
Helen
G&M Contracting Inc., Kenneth Gillilan
Helen,
Your very welcome and it's my pleasure.
AnnMarie
-----Original Message-----
From: Helen Hegener [mailto:HEM-Editor@...]
Sent: Monday, June 07, 2004 3:38 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [unschoolingbasics] Just my opinion
At 10:49 AM -0400 6/7/04, G&M Contracting Inc., Kenneth Gillilan wrote:
here long after I wondered if it was a hopeless effort. Thanks,
AnnMarie - and thanks also to those who I know feel the same, but
don't want to get into the middle of this (for good reason).
Helen
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Your very welcome and it's my pleasure.
AnnMarie
-----Original Message-----
From: Helen Hegener [mailto:HEM-Editor@...]
Sent: Monday, June 07, 2004 3:38 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [unschoolingbasics] Just my opinion
At 10:49 AM -0400 6/7/04, G&M Contracting Inc., Kenneth Gillilan wrote:
>This is just my personal opinion, and you can throw it out with the bathwell
>water, but I can't see being so hard on Helen for the decisions she is
>making. We have so much to learn from her, being Unschooled herself as
>as Unschooling her child/ren which is something VERY few of us can say.I
>think Helen has excellent views on Unschooling and wants just as much asthe
>rest of us to sing the praises of it, but Helen(and correct me if I'mwrong
>Helen) just seems to be pointing out that Homeschooling is the generalterm
>we all fall under.AnnMarie, you're the *rightest* person I've read today! <g>
> It just makes me a little sad to see such bashing of people who havestill
>been at Unschooling for so much longer than the majority of us. They are
>our foundation and we continue to learn from what they have been, and
>are going through.This post has really made my day, and made me glad I kept reading
here long after I wondered if it was a hopeless effort. Thanks,
AnnMarie - and thanks also to those who I know feel the same, but
don't want to get into the middle of this (for good reason).
Helen
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Helen Hegener
I was reading some other incoming mail and found this opening to a
query letter and thought it might be of interest to this list:
Dear Editor,
I have never been a fan of unschooling because I never comprehended
the reasoning behind it. That all changed about a year ago when
I found that one of my children learned best when left to decide
what he wanted to study, not when I forced an issue upon him.
I forwarded the letter and its attachment to our articles editor, but
it got me to wondering what it is that changes peoples' minds about
unschooling. I paired that with the earlier comments on this list
about my own schooling and unschooling. Deb - I think it was Deb -
was right when she pointed out that I've been to public school, and
yet I refer to myself as an unschooler, and having been unschooled. I
think in some ways unschooling is part of a process, or maybe a
destination. Most of us started out in schools of one kind or
another, but read or heard or saw something which opened a door to
other possibilities. I remember many people telling us homeschooling
(never mind UNschooling) was illegal and impossible and would ruin
our kids - I wonder how many people on this list remember what it was
really like 15 or 20 years ago? I remember what it was like almost 40
years ago, when I left school for good, knowing that whatever else
lay in store there had to be something better than teachers telling
me what to do and how to do it and that if I didn't follow the
school's rules I'd end up paying for it for the rest of my life. I
dropped out of seventh grade - and it was one of the smartest things
I ever did.
Mom was dubious at first, and Dad was mad (being a dad), but we got
through it somehow (being in Alaska, where *anything* is possible,
helped I think), and by the time I got through showing them what
*real* learning could be like they'd embraced the idea so completely
that my youngest brother and sister never even set foot inside a
school until my baby sister decided she wanted to attend the
University of Alaska - and then she made the Dean's List every year
she was there. Totally unschooled.
What changes peoples' minds about unschooling (or homeschooling, for
that matter)? Lots of things, I'm sure. What changed mine was having
parents who were willing to trust me to know what was best for myself.
Helen
query letter and thought it might be of interest to this list:
Dear Editor,
I have never been a fan of unschooling because I never comprehended
the reasoning behind it. That all changed about a year ago when
I found that one of my children learned best when left to decide
what he wanted to study, not when I forced an issue upon him.
I forwarded the letter and its attachment to our articles editor, but
it got me to wondering what it is that changes peoples' minds about
unschooling. I paired that with the earlier comments on this list
about my own schooling and unschooling. Deb - I think it was Deb -
was right when she pointed out that I've been to public school, and
yet I refer to myself as an unschooler, and having been unschooled. I
think in some ways unschooling is part of a process, or maybe a
destination. Most of us started out in schools of one kind or
another, but read or heard or saw something which opened a door to
other possibilities. I remember many people telling us homeschooling
(never mind UNschooling) was illegal and impossible and would ruin
our kids - I wonder how many people on this list remember what it was
really like 15 or 20 years ago? I remember what it was like almost 40
years ago, when I left school for good, knowing that whatever else
lay in store there had to be something better than teachers telling
me what to do and how to do it and that if I didn't follow the
school's rules I'd end up paying for it for the rest of my life. I
dropped out of seventh grade - and it was one of the smartest things
I ever did.
Mom was dubious at first, and Dad was mad (being a dad), but we got
through it somehow (being in Alaska, where *anything* is possible,
helped I think), and by the time I got through showing them what
*real* learning could be like they'd embraced the idea so completely
that my youngest brother and sister never even set foot inside a
school until my baby sister decided she wanted to attend the
University of Alaska - and then she made the Dean's List every year
she was there. Totally unschooled.
What changes peoples' minds about unschooling (or homeschooling, for
that matter)? Lots of things, I'm sure. What changed mine was having
parents who were willing to trust me to know what was best for myself.
Helen
G&M Contracting Inc., Kenneth Gillilan
>>> Ithink in some ways unschooling is part of a process, or maybe a
destination.>>>>
This describes what I feel Unschooling really is and how I came to it. I
didn't head out of the starting gates with it all figured out. I'm putting
the pieces together with help from some wonderful people, such as yourself,
as well as, the moderators of this list. I plan to use all the resources
available to me.
AnnMarie
-----Original Message-----
From: Helen Hegener [mailto:HEM-Editor@...]
Sent: Monday, June 07, 2004 4:12 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: [unschoolingbasics] Dear Editor...
I was reading some other incoming mail and found this opening to a
query letter and thought it might be of interest to this list:
Dear Editor,
I have never been a fan of unschooling because I never comprehended
the reasoning behind it. That all changed about a year ago when
I found that one of my children learned best when left to decide
what he wanted to study, not when I forced an issue upon him.
I forwarded the letter and its attachment to our articles editor, but
it got me to wondering what it is that changes peoples' minds about
unschooling. I paired that with the earlier comments on this list
about my own schooling and unschooling. Deb - I think it was Deb -
was right when she pointed out that I've been to public school, and
yet I refer to myself as an unschooler, and having been unschooled. I
think in some ways unschooling is part of a process, or maybe a
destination. Most of us started out in schools of one kind or
another, but read or heard or saw something which opened a door to
other possibilities. I remember many people telling us homeschooling
(never mind UNschooling) was illegal and impossible and would ruin
our kids - I wonder how many people on this list remember what it was
really like 15 or 20 years ago? I remember what it was like almost 40
years ago, when I left school for good, knowing that whatever else
lay in store there had to be something better than teachers telling
me what to do and how to do it and that if I didn't follow the
school's rules I'd end up paying for it for the rest of my life. I
dropped out of seventh grade - and it was one of the smartest things
I ever did.
Mom was dubious at first, and Dad was mad (being a dad), but we got
through it somehow (being in Alaska, where *anything* is possible,
helped I think), and by the time I got through showing them what
*real* learning could be like they'd embraced the idea so completely
that my youngest brother and sister never even set foot inside a
school until my baby sister decided she wanted to attend the
University of Alaska - and then she made the Dean's List every year
she was there. Totally unschooled.
What changes peoples' minds about unschooling (or homeschooling, for
that matter)? Lots of things, I'm sure. What changed mine was having
parents who were willing to trust me to know what was best for myself.
Helen
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[email protected]
c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Valerie
Helen said: I remember many people telling us homeschooling
(never mind UNschooling) was illegal and impossible and would ruin
our kids - I wonder how many people on this list remember what it
was really like 15 or 20 years ago?
****** I remember what it was like 20+ years ago:
"You're ruining Laurie's life." "Why do you want a stupid
child?" "You CAN'T keep her out of school." "Are you insane?"
and 10+ years ago:
at a homeschooler's meeting, "You aren't TEACHING her? You're in the
wrong place. This is a homeschool meeting."
and from others,
"Don't you think it's time you gave that child a chance and let her
go to school?"
I remember finding notes in my purse from anonymous people saying
things like "Why are you doing that to your daughter?" "When are you
going to let Laurie be normal?" After a party one time, I found a
note sitting neatly on top of the garbage can explaining to me that
I was misguided and that one day I'd be sorry I used Laurie to get
revenge on my dislike of school.
I also remember 5-6 years ago when one of those people said, "HOW
did you know?" I remember her graduation from college and the lack
of comments about how she had been raised. "It must be boring to be
so intelligent." "It's not fair; college was easy for her." "Her IQ
is the only reason she did so well."
It's almost funny how the naysayers leave the room if someone asks
me about my book, unschooling or Laurie.
I recently attended a large family reunion (guess I was feeling
masochistic) and found out that the reason none of my relatives ever
congratulated Laurie for graduating from college nor congratulated
me on my book was because Mom never passed the word on to them. When
I asked Mom why she hadn't said anything, she said it was because
she was embarrassed by what I'd done.
Ah, the shame of unschooling. :-P
love, Valerie
(never mind UNschooling) was illegal and impossible and would ruin
our kids - I wonder how many people on this list remember what it
was really like 15 or 20 years ago?
****** I remember what it was like 20+ years ago:
"You're ruining Laurie's life." "Why do you want a stupid
child?" "You CAN'T keep her out of school." "Are you insane?"
and 10+ years ago:
at a homeschooler's meeting, "You aren't TEACHING her? You're in the
wrong place. This is a homeschool meeting."
and from others,
"Don't you think it's time you gave that child a chance and let her
go to school?"
I remember finding notes in my purse from anonymous people saying
things like "Why are you doing that to your daughter?" "When are you
going to let Laurie be normal?" After a party one time, I found a
note sitting neatly on top of the garbage can explaining to me that
I was misguided and that one day I'd be sorry I used Laurie to get
revenge on my dislike of school.
I also remember 5-6 years ago when one of those people said, "HOW
did you know?" I remember her graduation from college and the lack
of comments about how she had been raised. "It must be boring to be
so intelligent." "It's not fair; college was easy for her." "Her IQ
is the only reason she did so well."
It's almost funny how the naysayers leave the room if someone asks
me about my book, unschooling or Laurie.
I recently attended a large family reunion (guess I was feeling
masochistic) and found out that the reason none of my relatives ever
congratulated Laurie for graduating from college nor congratulated
me on my book was because Mom never passed the word on to them. When
I asked Mom why she hadn't said anything, she said it was because
she was embarrassed by what I'd done.
Ah, the shame of unschooling. :-P
love, Valerie
Tina
<<This describes what I feel Unschooling really is and how I came to
it. I didn't head out of the starting gates with it all figured out.
I'm putting the pieces together with help from some wonderful people,
such as yourself, as well as, the moderators of this list. I plan to
use all the resources available to me.>>
I doubt you're in the same place that I am, as everyone's journey is
different, but your words describe my situation exactly. You hit the
nail on the head for my way of thinking.
Tina
it. I didn't head out of the starting gates with it all figured out.
I'm putting the pieces together with help from some wonderful people,
such as yourself, as well as, the moderators of this list. I plan to
use all the resources available to me.>>
I doubt you're in the same place that I am, as everyone's journey is
different, but your words describe my situation exactly. You hit the
nail on the head for my way of thinking.
Tina
G&M Contracting Inc., Kenneth Gillilan
Valerie,
Why is it that when it's not their idea it must be a bad one? I have
immediate family that treat me the same way today as yours did then. More
and more distance is coming between my family and I find it's the only way I
can breath and be myself. Isn't that sad??? They are missing out on my 4
wonderful kids because they are too stubborn to see how wonderful
Unschooling is.
Anyway thanks for the post, it's nice to know you can make it through
the negativity and still remain true to your children.
AnnMarie
-----Original Message-----
From: Valerie [mailto:valerie@...]
Sent: Monday, June 07, 2004 5:13 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: [unschoolingbasics] the good ole days of bs
Helen said: I remember many people telling us homeschooling
(never mind UNschooling) was illegal and impossible and would ruin
our kids - I wonder how many people on this list remember what it
was really like 15 or 20 years ago?
****** I remember what it was like 20+ years ago:
"You're ruining Laurie's life." "Why do you want a stupid
child?" "You CAN'T keep her out of school." "Are you insane?"
and 10+ years ago:
at a homeschooler's meeting, "You aren't TEACHING her? You're in the
wrong place. This is a homeschool meeting."
and from others,
"Don't you think it's time you gave that child a chance and let her
go to school?"
I remember finding notes in my purse from anonymous people saying
things like "Why are you doing that to your daughter?" "When are you
going to let Laurie be normal?" After a party one time, I found a
note sitting neatly on top of the garbage can explaining to me that
I was misguided and that one day I'd be sorry I used Laurie to get
revenge on my dislike of school.
I also remember 5-6 years ago when one of those people said, "HOW
did you know?" I remember her graduation from college and the lack
of comments about how she had been raised. "It must be boring to be
so intelligent." "It's not fair; college was easy for her." "Her IQ
is the only reason she did so well."
It's almost funny how the naysayers leave the room if someone asks
me about my book, unschooling or Laurie.
I recently attended a large family reunion (guess I was feeling
masochistic) and found out that the reason none of my relatives ever
congratulated Laurie for graduating from college nor congratulated
me on my book was because Mom never passed the word on to them. When
I asked Mom why she hadn't said anything, she said it was because
she was embarrassed by what I'd done.
Ah, the shame of unschooling. :-P
love, Valerie
Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
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a.. To visit your group on the web, go to:
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b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
[email protected]
c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Why is it that when it's not their idea it must be a bad one? I have
immediate family that treat me the same way today as yours did then. More
and more distance is coming between my family and I find it's the only way I
can breath and be myself. Isn't that sad??? They are missing out on my 4
wonderful kids because they are too stubborn to see how wonderful
Unschooling is.
Anyway thanks for the post, it's nice to know you can make it through
the negativity and still remain true to your children.
AnnMarie
-----Original Message-----
From: Valerie [mailto:valerie@...]
Sent: Monday, June 07, 2004 5:13 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: [unschoolingbasics] the good ole days of bs
Helen said: I remember many people telling us homeschooling
(never mind UNschooling) was illegal and impossible and would ruin
our kids - I wonder how many people on this list remember what it
was really like 15 or 20 years ago?
****** I remember what it was like 20+ years ago:
"You're ruining Laurie's life." "Why do you want a stupid
child?" "You CAN'T keep her out of school." "Are you insane?"
and 10+ years ago:
at a homeschooler's meeting, "You aren't TEACHING her? You're in the
wrong place. This is a homeschool meeting."
and from others,
"Don't you think it's time you gave that child a chance and let her
go to school?"
I remember finding notes in my purse from anonymous people saying
things like "Why are you doing that to your daughter?" "When are you
going to let Laurie be normal?" After a party one time, I found a
note sitting neatly on top of the garbage can explaining to me that
I was misguided and that one day I'd be sorry I used Laurie to get
revenge on my dislike of school.
I also remember 5-6 years ago when one of those people said, "HOW
did you know?" I remember her graduation from college and the lack
of comments about how she had been raised. "It must be boring to be
so intelligent." "It's not fair; college was easy for her." "Her IQ
is the only reason she did so well."
It's almost funny how the naysayers leave the room if someone asks
me about my book, unschooling or Laurie.
I recently attended a large family reunion (guess I was feeling
masochistic) and found out that the reason none of my relatives ever
congratulated Laurie for graduating from college nor congratulated
me on my book was because Mom never passed the word on to them. When
I asked Mom why she hadn't said anything, she said it was because
she was embarrassed by what I'd done.
Ah, the shame of unschooling. :-P
love, Valerie
Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
ADVERTISEMENT
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a.. To visit your group on the web, go to:
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[email protected]
c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
In a message dated 6/7/2004 11:06:09 AM US Eastern Standard Time,
ddzimlew@... writes:
<<<with tougne in cheek>>>June
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
ddzimlew@... writes:
> Helen went to public school at least part of the time. Helen herself isoh,gee cant we all just get along,and hold hand and sing cum-bya??
> adamant about homeschoolers who use public school programs or charter
> schools NOT being called homeschoolers.
>
> We're not interested in this list becoming a forum for anyone's political
> agenda. We want to talk unschooling. Anyone who wants to participate in
> the homogenizing of unschooling is free to do so, just please move that
> discussion to one of Helen's homeschooling lists.
>
<<<with tougne in cheek>>>June
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
",with any post that comes on here,,remember..'''keep the meat and through
out the
bones''..use what works and dont worry with the rest.........June"
That's really good advice.
On a list this large, there are going to be disagreements arise at times, it's best to take what you can from the conversation and leave the rest.
'Course, it's always good to examine new information and see if it's something we can use, with an open mind. But beyond that, just use what you can.:)
Ren
Learn about unschooling at:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/unschoolingbasics/
out the
bones''..use what works and dont worry with the rest.........June"
That's really good advice.
On a list this large, there are going to be disagreements arise at times, it's best to take what you can from the conversation and leave the rest.
'Course, it's always good to examine new information and see if it's something we can use, with an open mind. But beyond that, just use what you can.:)
Ren
Learn about unschooling at:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/unschoolingbasics/