Karen Swanay

OK...

Just the facts...

boy DOB 15 Oct 96 so just about 12. Rarely showers. Is in puberty.
Owns deodorant. Rarely uses it. Has BO. What do I do?

I *mostly* leave him alone about it. Can't figure out a way to say "hey I
can smell you" without hurting or embarrassing him. (That kind of thing
would upset me.) BUT I don't want to smell BO either. He showered today
because I had to say something. The smell was bad. I don't know how long
it's been since he's showered last but it's been weeks at least. But like I
said I've been leaving him to his own body ownership.

SO....I can pull out the "my house my rules" crap and "make" him shower and
use deodorant. Leave him alone and we all have to smell the BO. OR? I'm
SURE there are more options but I'm unable to see them...likely because this
is my issue. But by the same token, puberty is different for him and what
worked before does not work now.

That's what I told him today. That puberty does funky stuff to the body
beyond things he could see and that one of the things is a stronger odor.
Could be that he will take the initiative and shower daily now but I doubt
it. That's not really on his radar yet.

So, help me see the way to honor him as a person but also to honor the way
we want to live.

Thanks
Karen


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

christina abbott

Maybe you could offer to buy some "cool" body wash like Ax when you are out shopping with him?

Christina, Luke & Kara
myspace.com/lukesmyboy
"A characteristic of the normal child is that he doesn't act that way very often."


EMAILING FOR THE GREATER GOOD
Join me

To: [email protected]
From: luvbullbreeds@...
Date: Sat, 13 Sep 2008 19:38:11 -0500
Subject: [unschoolingbasics] Help me not fall back into old ways!




















OK...



Just the facts...



boy DOB 15 Oct 96 so just about 12. Rarely showers. Is in puberty.

Owns deodorant. Rarely uses it. Has BO. What do I do?



I *mostly* leave him alone about it. Can't figure out a way to say "hey I

can smell you" without hurting or embarrassing him. (That kind of thing

would upset me.) BUT I don't want to smell BO either. He showered today

because I had to say something. The smell was bad. I don't know how long

it's been since he's showered last but it's been weeks at least. But like I

said I've been leaving him to his own body ownership.



SO....I can pull out the "my house my rules" crap and "make" him shower and

use deodorant. Leave him alone and we all have to smell the BO. OR? I'm

SURE there are more options but I'm unable to see them...likely because this

is my issue. But by the same token, puberty is different for him and what

worked before does not work now.



That's what I told him today. That puberty does funky stuff to the body

beyond things he could see and that one of the things is a stronger odor.

Could be that he will take the initiative and shower daily now but I doubt

it. That's not really on his radar yet.



So, help me see the way to honor him as a person but also to honor the way

we want to live.



Thanks

Karen



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

























[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Kimberlee

I'm interested in this topic as well. My son is not yet 7 so it's
hardly an issue yet, but lately he's not been bathing as often as he
once did. (All behaviour subject to change with age and time I'm
sure). Unfortunately, I would have a problem with scented body washes,
soaps, perfumes etc. (they make me ill) so this option wouldn't work
for me. I'm keen to hear how to otherwise address this issue. I once
had to tell a dear friend that she had BO, and I found it very
stressful to approach her. Happily, she was very receptive to knowing,
and asked me to please tell her any time I noticed; she bathed daily
and was unaware of her own BO.

Kimberlee

On 13-Sep-08, at 9:48 PM, christina abbott wrote:

>
> Maybe you could offer to buy some "cool" body wash like Ax when you
> are out shopping with him?
>
> Christina, Luke & Kara
> myspace.com/lukesmyboy
> "A characteristic of the normal child is that he doesn't act that
> way very often."
>
> EMAILING FOR THE GREATER GOOD
> Join me
>
> To: [email protected]
> From: luvbullbreeds@...
> Date: Sat, 13 Sep 2008 19:38:11 -0500
> Subject: [unschoolingbasics] Help me not fall back into old ways!
>
> OK...
>
> Just the facts...
>
> boy DOB 15 Oct 96 so just about 12. Rarely showers. Is in puberty.
>
> Owns deodorant. Rarely uses it. Has BO. What do I do?
>
> I *mostly* leave him alone about it. Can't figure out a way to say
> "hey I
>
> can smell you" without hurting or embarrassing him. (That kind of
> thing
>
> would upset me.) BUT I don't want to smell BO either. He showered
> today
>
> because I had to say something. The smell was bad. I don't know how
> long
>
> it's been since he's showered last but it's been weeks at least. But
> like I
>
> said I've been leaving him to his own body ownership.
>
> SO....I can pull out the "my house my rules" crap and "make" him
> shower and
>
> use deodorant. Leave him alone and we all have to smell the BO. OR?
> I'm
>
> SURE there are more options but I'm unable to see them...likely
> because this
>
> is my issue. But by the same token, puberty is different for him and
> what
>
> worked before does not work now.
>
> That's what I told him today. That puberty does funky stuff to the
> body
>
> beyond things he could see and that one of the things is a stronger
> odor.
>
> Could be that he will take the initiative and shower daily now but I
> doubt
>
> it. That's not really on his radar yet.
>
> So, help me see the way to honor him as a person but also to honor
> the way
>
> we want to live.
>
> Thanks
>
> Karen
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Pamela Sorooshian

On Sep 13, 2008, at 5:38 PM, Karen Swanay wrote:

> SO....I can pull out the "my house my rules" crap and "make" him
> shower and
> use deodorant. Leave him alone and we all have to smell the BO. OR?

"Hey, sweetie, I'm thinking you're needing a shower. What do you
think?"

"We're getting ready to go out so you'll need to get into the shower
pretty soon, don't you think?"


"I've noticed you're going through a period of having strong body
odor, so just wanted you to think about that because you'll probably
want to shower more often."

"I've noticed you don't seem to like to shower. What do you think
about that?"

-pam

Karen Swanay

AH!
TYVM!!!!

Karen

On Sun, Sep 14, 2008 at 4:10 AM, Pamela Sorooshian <pamsoroosh@...>wrote:

>
> On Sep 13, 2008, at 5:38 PM, Karen Swanay wrote:
>
> > SO....I can pull out the "my house my rules" crap and "make" him
> > shower and
> > use deodorant. Leave him alone and we all have to smell the BO. OR?
>
> "Hey, sweetie, I'm thinking you're needing a shower. What do you
> think?"
>
> "We're getting ready to go out so you'll need to get into the shower
> pretty soon, don't you think?"
>
> "I've noticed you're going through a period of having strong body
> odor, so just wanted you to think about that because you'll probably
> want to shower more often."
>
> "I've noticed you don't seem to like to shower. What do you think
> about that?"
>
> -pam
>
>
>



--
Karen

http://temptabo.blogspot.com/
http://theazoy.blogspot.com/


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

hbmccarty

My daughter about the same age doesn't want to shower often but she
likes sponge baths, after which deodorant can be applied. I liked Pam's
suggestions about phrasing. Usually I just say, we're going out soon,
did you want to wash up? She does it on her own now.




Karen Swanay wrote:
>
> OK...
>
> Just the facts...
>
> boy DOB 15 Oct 96 so just about 12. Rarely showers. Is in puberty.
> Owns deodorant. Rarely uses it. Has BO. What do I do?
>
> .
>
>

RLR

Hi,
Does anyone know of any curricula/resources/books on Poetry appreciation and
analysis for middle - high school level?
TIA,
Rima








Poetry Appreciation & Analysis <xposted>

k

This is an unschooling list. Curriculum isn't something we're likely to
use.

~Katherine




On 9/14/08, RLR <rlr@...> wrote:
>
> Hi,
> Does anyone know of any curricula/resources/books on Poetry appreciation
> and
> analysis for middle - high school level?
> TIA,
> Rima
>
> Poetry Appreciation & Analysis <xposted>
>
>
>


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

hbmccarty

We all use salt block or crystal deodorant, and have had no problems. My
daughter has sensitive skin and perfumes bother most of us. I feel
really sick when my mother in-law visits with her hairspray and perfume.
This comes in different forms- an actual rock, one that looks like a
stick deodorant, and a spray. We buy soaps and shampoos, etc without
fragrance at our coop. I know this might not be as fun, but the salt
block is kind of cool and works really well. There are SO many products
out there- maybe you could find something fun that didn't bother you?

In the past we found natural bubble bath, and gone swimming often,
played in the hose, all those things get you clean, too. The kids pretty
much take care of their own cleanliness now, they are 11 and 15, and
don't even need reminders very often any more. I just make sure I wake
them up early enough so they have time to bathe if they feel they need
to before we go out.

Heather (in NY)

this is a link to one brand.


http://www.alibaba.com/product-free/100423343/Natural_Crystal_Deodorant_Stone.html

.Kimberlee wrote:
>
> I'm interested in this topic as well. My son is not yet 7 so it's
> hardly an issue yet, but lately he's not been bathing as often as he
> once did. (All behaviour subject to change with age and time I'm
> sure). Unfortunately, I would have a problem with scented body washes,
> soaps, perfumes etc. (they make me ill) so this option wouldn't work
> for me.
>

amberlee_b

These are all great! I have a puberty hating child right now (he dislikes it, not me). We call
it PMS--pre-manhood syndrome. It has been quite painful for him as he is growing too
fast for his bones, muscles, etc to keep up. He will be 13 in November and is almost as
tall as I am. (5' 11" for those curious).

I don't pester him, but I have mentioned a couple times that oh we are going to do
something out soon, did you want to shower first? We let him pick his deodorant (as I
didn't think the baby powder fresh scent was what he was looking for....)

As for body wash he picked some out at Bath and Body works (if I did the Axe thing for
him he would turn bright red!). His main issue with puberty is something I never had,
acne! He is really embarrassed by it. We have tried a few different things, but nothing
seems to really help, or he just forgets to use it. I don't pester him about that either and
he usually chooses to wash his face once a day or so...which is better than I would have
done at that age. It isn't severe acne, but enough to be a bother. Mostly on the forehead.
He wants to have his hair long, but when it is the acne gets worse, so he usually chooses
to cut it.

He is so quiet about these things and rarely has questions.....we do try to bring things up
for him and if he is interested in discussion fine. So as they get used to all the new odors
and body hair we get used to finding new ways to say things without making them want to
hide and become hermits! (Yes mine got his moustache the beginning of spring this
year....aurgh! He hasn't shaved yet.....and he wants to get rid of the unibrow that is
sprouting....*sigh*)

Thanks again!
>
> "Hey, sweetie, I'm thinking you're needing a shower. What do you
> think?"
>
> "We're getting ready to go out so you'll need to get into the shower
> pretty soon, don't you think?"
>
>
> "I've noticed you're going through a period of having strong body
> odor, so just wanted you to think about that because you'll probably
> want to shower more often."
>
> "I've noticed you don't seem to like to shower. What do you think
> about that?"
>
> -pam
>

amberlee_b

Oh I should state our 2nd son, just turned 10, is a Calvin (you know like the comic strip)
and might take a bath once a week if you remind him a couple times. LOL He took one
last night and said it "hurt his hair"....hum He wants to learn to make his own organic soap
and use organic materials to scent them. Lavender is a great one. Maybe you could make
soap together? Soap molds are inexpensive, sometimes found at garage sales. Lots of
info on the internet with recipes and ideas. Just a thought.

I have a dear friend who doesn't/can't use deodorant. The chemicals in it react with her
skin. She uses lavender water and things from the middle ages/days before chemical
*enhancement*...you'd be surprised what they used to keep the smell down. Most people
didn't take baths all winter long so they wouldn't catch cold. Can't imagine the Knights in
their armor smelled very well either. So there are other options that aren't chemical...Rose
water smells lovely! :) And not in the strong perfumed way either.

--- In [email protected], Kimberlee <kimmybird@...> wrote:
>
> I'm interested in this topic as well. My son is not yet 7 so it's
> hardly an issue yet, but lately he's not been bathing as often as he
> once did. (All behaviour subject to change with age and time I'm
> sure). Unfortunately, I would have a problem with scented body washes,
> soaps, perfumes etc. (they make me ill) so this option wouldn't work
> for me. I'm keen to hear how to otherwise address this issue. I once
> had to tell a dear friend that she had BO, and I found it very
> stressful to approach her. Happily, she was very receptive to knowing,
> and asked me to please tell her any time I noticed; she bathed daily
> and was unaware of her own BO.
>
> Kimberlee
>
> On 13-Sep-08, at 9:48 PM, christina abbott wrote:
>
> >
> > Maybe you could offer to buy some "cool" body wash like Ax when you
> > are out shopping with him?
> >
> > Christina, Luke & Kara
> > myspace.com/lukesmyboy
> > "A characteristic of the normal child is that he doesn't act that
> > way very often."
> >
> > EMAILING FOR THE GREATER GOOD
> > Join me
> >
> > To: [email protected]
> > From: luvbullbreeds@...
> > Date: Sat, 13 Sep 2008 19:38:11 -0500
> > Subject: [unschoolingbasics] Help me not fall back into old ways!
> >
> > OK...
> >
> > Just the facts...
> >
> > boy DOB 15 Oct 96 so just about 12. Rarely showers. Is in puberty.
> >
> > Owns deodorant. Rarely uses it. Has BO. What do I do?
> >
> > I *mostly* leave him alone about it. Can't figure out a way to say
> > "hey I
> >
> > can smell you" without hurting or embarrassing him. (That kind of
> > thing
> >
> > would upset me.) BUT I don't want to smell BO either. He showered
> > today
> >
> > because I had to say something. The smell was bad. I don't know how
> > long
> >
> > it's been since he's showered last but it's been weeks at least. But
> > like I
> >
> > said I've been leaving him to his own body ownership.
> >
> > SO....I can pull out the "my house my rules" crap and "make" him
> > shower and
> >
> > use deodorant. Leave him alone and we all have to smell the BO. OR?
> > I'm
> >
> > SURE there are more options but I'm unable to see them...likely
> > because this
> >
> > is my issue. But by the same token, puberty is different for him and
> > what
> >
> > worked before does not work now.
> >
> > That's what I told him today. That puberty does funky stuff to the
> > body
> >
> > beyond things he could see and that one of the things is a stronger
> > odor.
> >
> > Could be that he will take the initiative and shower daily now but I
> > doubt
> >
> > it. That's not really on his radar yet.
> >
> > So, help me see the way to honor him as a person but also to honor
> > the way
> >
> > we want to live.
> >
> > Thanks
> >
> > Karen
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

RLR

Yes, I know, which is why I also have "resources" as a choice.
~Rima


<<
This is an unschooling list. Curriculum isn't something we're likely to
use.

~Katherine
>>

Pamela Sorooshian

Do some research on acne - there are lots of "acne legends" that have
floated around for years that aren't true. There are some over-the-
counter products that are way way better than others and for severe
cases there is acutane, which is a strong drug available prescription.

Maybe start here: <http://www.acneinfo.org/main.html>

-pam

On Sep 14, 2008, at 9:19 AM, amberlee_b wrote:

> His main issue with puberty is something I never had,
> acne! He is really embarrassed by it. We have tried a few
> different things, but nothing
> seems to really help, or he just forgets to use it. I don't pester
> him about that either and
> he usually chooses to wash his face once a day or so..

Ren Allen

--- In [email protected], "RLR" <rlr@...> wrote:
>
> Yes, I know, which is why I also have "resources" as a choice.
> ~Rima
>
>

But we're not here to help people GET information into other people.
We're here to tell people to chill out and enjoy learning.:)

Is the person you want poetry resources for searching for their very
own purposes and doing it out of interest? If you're simply looking
for resources for a person who has requested that specifically, that's
a very different thing than what you asked.

Many of us have a love of poetry. We're willing to share that passion
with others. But I would need a more specific question because the
world of poetry is HUGE and I am not here to help a parent teach a
child anything. Sharing passions is different.

If you're looking for us to share our favorite poems or writers, we
can do that. But that isn't what was asked.

Ren

Ren Allen

--- In [email protected], "RLR" <rlr@...> wrote:
>
> Hi,
> Does anyone know of any curricula/resources/books on Poetry
appreciation and
> analysis for middle - high school level?
> TIA,
> Rima
>

Let's get some answers here.
Why do the resources need to be age discriminatory? Why poetry
appreciation (you gain appreciation for poetry by reading it and
exploring it in your own way and time...just like anything) rather
than just finding favorite poetry?

Ren

RLR

Ren,


<<But we're not here to help people GET information into other people.
We're here to tell people to chill out and enjoy learning.:)
>>
Which is what my kids and I have always done.:)


<<
Is the person you want poetry resources for searching for their very
own purposes and doing it out of interest?
>>
The "person" is my 8 yo dd who writes beautiful poetry.


<<
If you're simply looking for resources for a person who has requested that
specifically, that's a very different thing than what you asked.
>>
Not really -- I currently am her mentor/guide/mother/teacher/friend rolled
into one and am looking for resources to fulfill her passion, and really,
quite irrelevant here, but I should mention that it was her request.


<<
Many of us have a love of poetry. We're willing to share that passion
with others. But I would need a more specific question because the
world of poetry is HUGE and I am not here to help a parent teach a
child anything.
>>
Oops, guess I knocked at the wrong door. I thought sharing was just...plain
old sharing irrespective of whether it was a parent seeking info or a kid
(for whom an email list would be inappropriate) wanting it.


<<
Sharing passions is different.
>>
No I wasn't looking to share in that, just for some pointers to guide my
kid.


<<If you're looking for us to share our favorite poems or writers, we
can do that. But that isn't what was asked.>>
Right.

Thanks anyway.

~Rima

RLR

<<Let's get some answers here.>>


<<Why do the resources need to be age discriminatory?>>

<<Why poetry appreciation (you gain appreciation for poetry by reading it
and exploring it in your own way and time...just like anything) rather
than just finding favorite poetry? >>

Not sure I should be answering this but I will anyway -- I *studied* poetry,
loved *studying* it, but don't feel qualified enough to teach it. I do
think there is a reason why books are written and sold and bought and used.

~Rima

RLR

Forgot this one:

<<Why do the resources need to be age discriminatory? >>
The levels indicated would be more appropriate starting points.

~Rima

Ren Allen

~~<<
If you're simply looking for resources for a person who has requested
that specifically, that's a very different thing than what you asked.

>>Not really -- I currently am her mentor/guide/mother/teacher/friend
rolled into one and am looking for resources to fulfill her passion,
and really, quite irrelevant here, but I should mention that it was
her request.~~

It's absolutely relevant at an unschooling discussion list. You'll
hear a lot about how being your child's "teacher" is absolutely
unecessary. Learning happens best when the idea of "teaching" is less
important than the idea of learning.

A child that is passionate about poetry will continue to joyfully
explore it if the parent isn't intent on "teaching" or helping them
study a thing as much as they are intent on simply sharing the passion
WITH the child. That's a very different thing than studying or curriculum.

I highly recommend reading for a couple of weeks to get a feel for the
list and why we're here.

Ren

Ren Allen

~~I *studied* poetry,
loved *studying* it, but don't feel qualified enough to teach it~~

I hope you won't teach it. That might ruin her interest.

Why is it that if you loved studying poetry (sounds like maybe you
learned it without undue pressure?) you don't feel qualified to simply
share that with your child and seek out resources SHE desires?

That's what unschooling is all about. Not teaching. Not studying.
Unless that's what the LEARNER (rather than the parents) decide is
important for themselves.

Your child needs a person who can access resources, certainly. She
doesn't need a teacher.

Ren

Joyce Fetteroll

On Sep 14, 2008, at 11:29 PM, RLR wrote:

> Not sure I should be answering this but I will anyway


Some lists are for sharing resources.

Some lists are for discussion.

I think if you walked into a curriculum recovery group and
interrupted an ongoing discussion to demand everyone drop what
they're doing and make a list of poetry analysis books for you, you
shouldn't be shocked when the long time members protect the group
with "Why are you asking?"

I'm betting reading your question asking for resources for poetry
analysis stirred up fears in some members that they've been
neglecting their children's poetry education. That's not fair to them
when we're trying to help them let go of those fears and see learning
more holistically.

Responses to posts support the purpose of the list even if they
aren't what you wanted.

Now, if someone had said "My daughter has gotten interested in poetry
and wants to delve into understanding it better and has asked for
some resources. Can you help me help her?" the responses would have
been more straightforward.

But as it was, it's not fair to the other members to support one
parent's demand for "curricula" when it would interfere with those
hoping for help letting go.

And it's rude to cross post. It treats list members as though they're
at the beck and call of whoever can click Send.

Joyce

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

k

Ok. I see the point by point rebuttal and some bids for debate.. the
biggest: "really, quite irrelevant here, but I should mention that it was
her request." Almost guaranteed to get a rise out of unschoolers on a
radical list.

However. What poetry exactly is your daughter into?

I love the really minimalist stuff in poetry such as:
so much depends
upon a red wheel
barrow glazed with rain
water beside the white
chickens By William Carlos Williams. Awesome. Thought provoking.
Reflective (almost literally) as I think all poems should be. LUV it. I
also think of much prose as highly poetic, such as *anything* by Rumi.

What are your daughter's tastes in poetry at the moment?

~Katherine




On 9/14/08, RLR <rlr@...> wrote:
>
> Ren,
>
> <<But we're not here to help people GET information into other people.
> We're here to tell people to chill out and enjoy learning.:)
> >>
> Which is what my kids and I have always done.:)
>
> <<
> Is the person you want poetry resources for searching for their very
> own purposes and doing it out of interest?
> >>
> The "person" is my 8 yo dd who writes beautiful poetry.
>
> <<
> If you're simply looking for resources for a person who has requested that
> specifically, that's a very different thing than what you asked.
> >>
> Not really -- I currently am her mentor/guide/mother/teacher/friend rolled
> into one and am looking for resources to fulfill her passion, and really,
> quite irrelevant here, but I should mention that it was her request.
>
> <<
> Many of us have a love of poetry. We're willing to share that passion
> with others. But I would need a more specific question because the
> world of poetry is HUGE and I am not here to help a parent teach a
> child anything.
> >>
> Oops, guess I knocked at the wrong door. I thought sharing was just...plain
> old sharing irrespective of whether it was a parent seeking info or a kid
> (for whom an email list would be inappropriate) wanting it.
>
> <<
> Sharing passions is different.
> >>
> No I wasn't looking to share in that, just for some pointers to guide my
> kid.
>
> <<If you're looking for us to share our favorite poems or writers, we
> can do that. But that isn't what was asked.>>
> Right.
>
> Thanks anyway.
>
> ~Rima
>
>
>


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

k

>
> Not sure I should be answering this but I will anyway -- I *studied*
> poetry,
> loved *studying* it, but don't feel qualified enough to teach it.


In unschooling, *nobody* is qualified to teach but everybody can share and
learn. "Share" really is not at all the same as "teach".


> I do think there is a reason why books are written and sold and bought and
> used.


To sell them mostly and also to share ideas. They are *not* in the best
sense just another "teacher" in disguise. Please don't talk about books
that way. <BWG> They might *hear* you. They have been my companions and
friends for years, and I know they have *never* tried to teach me anything.
That's one of the beauties of books in my opinion. A great author, C.S.
Lewis, once said something on the same order about books not being
teachers. I can glean what I want from books. The ideas and words that
appeal to me stick with me and those that don't are promptly dropped and
dismissed! Just like the words of any friend who isn't trying to be
didactic. If anything I've said sticks with you here, take them as the
words of a friend who won't hold you to them. I don't know how my words
work for anybody. They might not be valuable to anyone but me. :)

~Katherine




On 9/14/08, RLR <rlr@...> wrote:
>
> <<Let's get some answers here.>>
>
> <<Why do the resources need to be age discriminatory?>>
>
> <<Why poetry appreciation (you gain appreciation for poetry by reading it
> and exploring it in your own way and time...just like anything) rather
> than just finding favorite poetry? >>
>
> Not sure I should be answering this but I will anyway -- I *studied*
> poetry,
> loved *studying* it, but don't feel qualified enough to teach it. I do
> think there is a reason why books are written and sold and bought and used.
>
> ~Rima
>
>
>


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

RLR

Joyce,

<<
I think if you walked into a curriculum recovery group and
interrupted an ongoing discussion to demand everyone drop what
they're doing and make a list of poetry analysis books >>

It was a mere question, a mere request -- and really, it's all at the
discretion of the moderator to let a post through or not.



<<That's not fair to them
when we're trying to help them let go of those fears and see learning
more holistically.
>>

Funnily, I do see a point here.


<<
Now, if someone had said "My daughter has gotten interested in poetry
and wants to delve into understanding it better and has asked for
some resources. Can you help me help her?" the responses would have
been more straightforward.
>>
Again, mere perspective...


<<
And it's rude to cross post. It treats list members as though they're
at the beck and call of whoever can click Send.
>>
Is that a rule on this list, because I've been on listserves for something
like 13 years, and don't believe that I have ever come across this.
Flaming, on the other hand (for no apparent or a misconstrued reason) has
always been condoned.

I do hope the moderator will step in here and put things in the right
perspective.

In the meantime, I am wondering if there is a way to retract a post
previously made.

~Rima

RLR

Katherine, thanks for you insightful reply.

<<In unschooling, *nobody* is qualified to teach but everybody can share and
learn. "Share" really is not at all the same as "teach".
>>

I don't believe that I ever mentioned I was going to "teach".

~Rima

Karen Swanay

Well you wrote this...
"Not really -- I currently am her mentor/guide/mother/teacher/friend rolled
into one and am looking for resources to fulfill her passion, and really,
quite irrelevant here, but I should mention that it was her request."


On Mon, Sep 15, 2008 at 6:30 AM, RLR <rlr@...> wrote:

<<In unschooling, *nobody* is qualified to teach but everybody can share and
>
> learn. "Share" really is not at all the same as "teach".
> >>
>
> I don't believe that I ever mentioned I was going to "teach".
>
> ~Rima
>
>


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Ren Allen

>
> I don't believe that I ever mentioned I was going to "teach".
>
> ~Rima
>

You DID say:
~~I *studied* poetry,
loved *studying* it, but don't feel qualified enough to teach it~~

Which implies that you plan to teach it and that's why you're
requesting curriculum and "resources".

When my child gets excited about something, I don't switch into that
whole "teachable moments" mode that gets bandied about at a lot of
homeschooling groups.

Unschooling is a different world. Have you read any John Holt books?
How much of the unschooling philosophy have you encountered thus far?

My personal interest in poetry is being nourished by an amazing human
being by the name of Stanley Kunitz. I've carried a quote of his in my
head for so many years and finally purchased a book. The quote is this:
"The hard inescapable phenomenon to be faced is that we are living and
dying at once. My commitment is to report that dialogue."

He was a passionate gardener and poet. "The Wild Braid" is an
exploration of his ideas and thoughts as recorded by Genine Lentine,
with a smattering of his amazing poems.

The way I found this poet was through a simple quote, that has defined
so many things for me. It led to questions and research and more
questions...like natural learning does so often.

Ren

k

>
> In the meantime, I am wondering if there is a way to retract a post
> previously made.


No there isn't. You can delete it on the web list. However people who
receive posts by email have an "undeletable by you" post. Are there other
reasons besides the cross posting issue that you would want to retract your
post?

Honestly, though, people here though primarily interested in unschooling
discussion would love to help find resources for your daughter. Are you
interested in doing that? If so, post some of what she's interested in and
see if anyone has something she could use.

~Katherine


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

BRIAN POLIKOWSKY

To the OP;

I rejected your post at the AlwaysUnschooled board as a moderator there and asked you the same question you have been asked here.
I said I would be glad to appove your post if you either edit it or explained why you where asking for the information.
SO this board is not the only one where you are beeing questioned on the post you wrote.

Sincerely,

 
Alex Polikowsky
http://polykow.blogspot.com/

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/unschoolingmn/
 


_,_._,___

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]