Another money "problem"
Steven Cox
Hi All,
This may seem like a no-brainer, but what if resources are not so limited?
What if there is plenty of money? For example you've gotten an inheritance
of $500,000. And your 4 year old wants to buy maybe $5000 worth of toys
asap? (he's looking at all the catalogs coming in pre-xmas and just so
happens to want ALOT in coincidence with this money coming in) What would
you do?
Leslie in Mass.
This may seem like a no-brainer, but what if resources are not so limited?
What if there is plenty of money? For example you've gotten an inheritance
of $500,000. And your 4 year old wants to buy maybe $5000 worth of toys
asap? (he's looking at all the catalogs coming in pre-xmas and just so
happens to want ALOT in coincidence with this money coming in) What would
you do?
Leslie in Mass.
Virginia Glasser
I believe that is a very valid question and I'm curious as to the different
responses from the list. I for one would not indulge my child that way. It's
important for kids to learn the value of money and if they get what they
want when they want it, too much, it is teaching instant gratification which
I can't think of one instance where that is really a good thing. Instant
gratification gets us all into trouble.
Virginia Glasser
StampinUp! Demonstrator
http://www.virginiaglasser.stampinup.net
I'm proud to be a Stampin' Up demonstrator!
Ask me how you can earn free stamping or scrapbooking supplies!
-----Original Message-----
From: Steven Cox [mailto:slclsc@...]
Sent: Thursday, October 07, 2004 9:41 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: [unschoolingbasics] Another money "problem"
Hi All,
This may seem like a no-brainer, but what if resources are not so limited?
What if there is plenty of money? For example you've gotten an inheritance
of $500,000. And your 4 year old wants to buy maybe $5000 worth of toys
asap? (he's looking at all the catalogs coming in pre-xmas and just so
happens to want ALOT in coincidence with this money coming in) What would
you do?
Leslie in Mass.
Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
ADVERTISEMENT
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
--
Yahoo! Groups Links
a.. To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/unschoolingbasics/
b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
[email protected]
c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
responses from the list. I for one would not indulge my child that way. It's
important for kids to learn the value of money and if they get what they
want when they want it, too much, it is teaching instant gratification which
I can't think of one instance where that is really a good thing. Instant
gratification gets us all into trouble.
Virginia Glasser
StampinUp! Demonstrator
http://www.virginiaglasser.stampinup.net
I'm proud to be a Stampin' Up demonstrator!
Ask me how you can earn free stamping or scrapbooking supplies!
-----Original Message-----
From: Steven Cox [mailto:slclsc@...]
Sent: Thursday, October 07, 2004 9:41 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: [unschoolingbasics] Another money "problem"
Hi All,
This may seem like a no-brainer, but what if resources are not so limited?
What if there is plenty of money? For example you've gotten an inheritance
of $500,000. And your 4 year old wants to buy maybe $5000 worth of toys
asap? (he's looking at all the catalogs coming in pre-xmas and just so
happens to want ALOT in coincidence with this money coming in) What would
you do?
Leslie in Mass.
Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
ADVERTISEMENT
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
--
Yahoo! Groups Links
a.. To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/unschoolingbasics/
b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
[email protected]
c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Angela S
This may seem like a no-brainer, but what if resources are not so limited?
------------------------------
I guess if I could afford it and I really thought the item they wanted was
something they would use a lot and get a lot of pleasure out of, I would buy
it. But if your kids tend to think they will like stuff and the novelty
wears off fast, then I would be very careful about how I spent my money.
Angela ~ Maine
game-enthusiast@...
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
------------------------------
I guess if I could afford it and I really thought the item they wanted was
something they would use a lot and get a lot of pleasure out of, I would buy
it. But if your kids tend to think they will like stuff and the novelty
wears off fast, then I would be very careful about how I spent my money.
Angela ~ Maine
game-enthusiast@...
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Robyn Coburn
<<<This may seem like a no-brainer, but what if resources are not so
limited?
What if there is plenty of money? For example you've gotten an inheritance
of $500,000. And your 4 year old wants to buy maybe $5000 worth of toys
asap? (he's looking at all the catalogs coming in pre-xmas and just so
happens to want ALOT in coincidence with this money coming in) What would
you do?>>>>
Is it really adding up to $5000 worth?
The second limiting factor we have in our apartment is space. We have told
Jayn that there are certain toys we just don't have room for. These are
things like big doll's houses that we are talking about having in the future
when she has her own room. Maybe by the time we actually do have a house she
will have changed her desires.
Robyn L. Coburn
---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.773 / Virus Database: 520 - Release Date: 10/5/2004
limited?
What if there is plenty of money? For example you've gotten an inheritance
of $500,000. And your 4 year old wants to buy maybe $5000 worth of toys
asap? (he's looking at all the catalogs coming in pre-xmas and just so
happens to want ALOT in coincidence with this money coming in) What would
you do?>>>>
Is it really adding up to $5000 worth?
The second limiting factor we have in our apartment is space. We have told
Jayn that there are certain toys we just don't have room for. These are
things like big doll's houses that we are talking about having in the future
when she has her own room. Maybe by the time we actually do have a house she
will have changed her desires.
Robyn L. Coburn
---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.773 / Virus Database: 520 - Release Date: 10/5/2004
[email protected]
This may seem like a no-brainer, but what if resources are not so limited?
What if there is plenty of money? For example you've gotten an inheritance
of $500,000. And your 4 year old wants to buy maybe $5000 worth of toys
asap? (he's looking at all the catalogs coming in pre-xmas and just so
happens to want ALOT in coincidence with this money coming in) What would
you do?<<<<
I'd send at least $10,000 to the following address:
Kelly Lovejoy
118 Steeplechase South
Columbia, SC 29209
<g>
How are you and your husband dealing with "your shares"? Are you each
getting $5,000 to spend any way you'd like?
I'd consider giving him a more reasonable amount to play with---and help him
make his decisions---like how much use he would get out of it, etc. Just
like buying a smaller item with less money. Talk about putting the rest (if he
*does* get $5000) in the bank for more stuff later.
Congratulations!
~Kelly
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
What if there is plenty of money? For example you've gotten an inheritance
of $500,000. And your 4 year old wants to buy maybe $5000 worth of toys
asap? (he's looking at all the catalogs coming in pre-xmas and just so
happens to want ALOT in coincidence with this money coming in) What would
you do?<<<<
I'd send at least $10,000 to the following address:
Kelly Lovejoy
118 Steeplechase South
Columbia, SC 29209
<g>
How are you and your husband dealing with "your shares"? Are you each
getting $5,000 to spend any way you'd like?
I'd consider giving him a more reasonable amount to play with---and help him
make his decisions---like how much use he would get out of it, etc. Just
like buying a smaller item with less money. Talk about putting the rest (if he
*does* get $5000) in the bank for more stuff later.
Congratulations!
~Kelly
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Rachel and Carson Milgroom
This is one I have thought about a lot. Our resources are not unlimited,
but we can support a fair-sized toy buying habit. I used to arbitrarily
control what toys we bought, and have gradually come to understand how
completely dh and I are the 'gateway' for our kids to get things, and that
generally dh and I were just buying whatever we wanted and then being
judgmental when ds wanted things that we didn't see "value" in.
First off, I'd say that my ds (now 5) definitely goes through periods where
he wants a lot more toys all of a sudden. This happened over the summer
with Lego. Every day he wanted more lego. And now he has enough that he
can actually really enjoy building with it, and he hasn't mentioned new lego
in months. I firmly believe toys are tools, and that we may not be able to
ascertain from our perspective what the project is that they need the new
tools for. For a year or more he asked for new playmobil every day, and now
he's pretty much happy to just play with the playmobil he has. I'd never
have imagined that he'd need so much of it to reach the place where he could
play the way he wanted, but apparently he did need that much.
That said, I really grappled with how to both support his need for new toys
and deal with the issues I had about buying so many toys. The things I
found out were that I had old messages running inside of me about how kids
need to learn the value of money, how he'd be 'spoiled' if we kept buying
him things, etc. And I realized that I felt overwhelmed by the quantity of
stuff coming in and needed a way to keep the toys better organized.
The best thing I did was the process of uncovering my fears about buying him
the things he wanted, and how that related to my own money issues. Also, I
explained to him a lot about relative costs of things, using trips to the
toy store as an opportunity to explore how much things cost. We took Lego
sets off the shelf and compared them, looking at the unique pieces and
seeing how their play value related to their cost. We spent a long time
choosing. We had FUN at the store, instead of him whining and me being
uptight.
So, I'd say yes, buy him some stuff. If it were me and my ds I would
probably figure out an amount that made sense in terms of what else we as a
family wanted to use the money for. I might also work with him to set up a
schedule that made sense for making purchases, so he'd have time to
integrate the new stuff into his world and see what he really wanted next.
I really do believe that it is OK for kids to have lots of stuff, especially
the stuff they really want. It just needs to make sense in the scheme of
the rest of the family.
Rachel (also in MA :-))
_________________________
My baby is a DiaperFreeBaby!!!
www.DiaperFreeBaby.org
but we can support a fair-sized toy buying habit. I used to arbitrarily
control what toys we bought, and have gradually come to understand how
completely dh and I are the 'gateway' for our kids to get things, and that
generally dh and I were just buying whatever we wanted and then being
judgmental when ds wanted things that we didn't see "value" in.
First off, I'd say that my ds (now 5) definitely goes through periods where
he wants a lot more toys all of a sudden. This happened over the summer
with Lego. Every day he wanted more lego. And now he has enough that he
can actually really enjoy building with it, and he hasn't mentioned new lego
in months. I firmly believe toys are tools, and that we may not be able to
ascertain from our perspective what the project is that they need the new
tools for. For a year or more he asked for new playmobil every day, and now
he's pretty much happy to just play with the playmobil he has. I'd never
have imagined that he'd need so much of it to reach the place where he could
play the way he wanted, but apparently he did need that much.
That said, I really grappled with how to both support his need for new toys
and deal with the issues I had about buying so many toys. The things I
found out were that I had old messages running inside of me about how kids
need to learn the value of money, how he'd be 'spoiled' if we kept buying
him things, etc. And I realized that I felt overwhelmed by the quantity of
stuff coming in and needed a way to keep the toys better organized.
The best thing I did was the process of uncovering my fears about buying him
the things he wanted, and how that related to my own money issues. Also, I
explained to him a lot about relative costs of things, using trips to the
toy store as an opportunity to explore how much things cost. We took Lego
sets off the shelf and compared them, looking at the unique pieces and
seeing how their play value related to their cost. We spent a long time
choosing. We had FUN at the store, instead of him whining and me being
uptight.
So, I'd say yes, buy him some stuff. If it were me and my ds I would
probably figure out an amount that made sense in terms of what else we as a
family wanted to use the money for. I might also work with him to set up a
schedule that made sense for making purchases, so he'd have time to
integrate the new stuff into his world and see what he really wanted next.
I really do believe that it is OK for kids to have lots of stuff, especially
the stuff they really want. It just needs to make sense in the scheme of
the rest of the family.
Rachel (also in MA :-))
_________________________
My baby is a DiaperFreeBaby!!!
www.DiaperFreeBaby.org
Sherri-Lee Pressman
Sort of in line with the current money conversation which I am finding very
helpful as we are in a similar situation.
How would/do you handle allowances? Do you give them to your kids? How do
you handle it? I am wanting to start giving my daughter her own
discretionary money to use each week. She is 4.5 so we aren't talking a lot,
maybe a couple of bucks, but my thought was this was money she would just
use how ever she wanted with no need to ask us about it. My dh feels that if
we are going to be giving allowances, then she should have half of it to
spend and half must be put in a piggy bank to save, the point being somehow
she will learn how to save money from this enforced savings plan. Obviously
I don't agree. We had a very civil conversation and have agreed to disagree
and to do nothing at this time, but since I am the one that is out with her
on a more regular basis it does affect me more than him. So I am curious how
other "unschoolers" handle this.
I do get tired of the constant "mommy will you buy me" I mean I really
couldn't afford to buy her everything she asks for and I don't agree with
buying everything she asks for. Sometimes it is just buy me a toy for the
sake of buying a toy, not that she wants one in particular (although that
isn't hard to find either). And I am wondering if this would help at all.
I have even thought of going so far as to give her the 2 bucks each week
without telling dh but that feels deceptive so I can't do that... any
thoughts on allowances? Or maybe I should just not bother and keep going the
way we are. I just get the sense, she is looking to control some of her own
money and think that is a good thing for her to do. I think she will learn
the saving thing on her own when she needs to....
Ok rambling... any thoughts? Thanks,
Sherri-Lee
Need safe and natural health products?
http://www.aloeessence.com
helpful as we are in a similar situation.
How would/do you handle allowances? Do you give them to your kids? How do
you handle it? I am wanting to start giving my daughter her own
discretionary money to use each week. She is 4.5 so we aren't talking a lot,
maybe a couple of bucks, but my thought was this was money she would just
use how ever she wanted with no need to ask us about it. My dh feels that if
we are going to be giving allowances, then she should have half of it to
spend and half must be put in a piggy bank to save, the point being somehow
she will learn how to save money from this enforced savings plan. Obviously
I don't agree. We had a very civil conversation and have agreed to disagree
and to do nothing at this time, but since I am the one that is out with her
on a more regular basis it does affect me more than him. So I am curious how
other "unschoolers" handle this.
I do get tired of the constant "mommy will you buy me" I mean I really
couldn't afford to buy her everything she asks for and I don't agree with
buying everything she asks for. Sometimes it is just buy me a toy for the
sake of buying a toy, not that she wants one in particular (although that
isn't hard to find either). And I am wondering if this would help at all.
I have even thought of going so far as to give her the 2 bucks each week
without telling dh but that feels deceptive so I can't do that... any
thoughts on allowances? Or maybe I should just not bother and keep going the
way we are. I just get the sense, she is looking to control some of her own
money and think that is a good thing for her to do. I think she will learn
the saving thing on her own when she needs to....
Ok rambling... any thoughts? Thanks,
Sherri-Lee
Need safe and natural health products?
http://www.aloeessence.com
Lea Eaton
We've tried to be very up front with our kiddos about money.. They ahve not gotten allowances but from the time they were little we allowed them to tell us what they would like and then shared with them the amount of money we had, what bills needed to be paid and then decide whether or not it was something we could do... When my oldest ds( now 23) wanted a Ninetendo, as a family we decided on a budget amount he could have in an envelope until we reached that amount... We all agreed that Jamie would ahve any extra monies for a certain amount of time... I remember my next ds ( who is now 21) mowed a lawn and chipped in his money to Jamies cause, by the same token whne Jeremy wanted to go on a trip to the Honduras a few years later, Jamie gave almost one whole paycheck to his brother to help make the trip possible. we stil work that way...One of my guys got a scholarship and grant money for school and was more then happy to share with the brother who didn't quite have enough for
tuition... Our youngest ds is 13 and he usually knows what a safe amount to save, spned ongroceries and what bills need to be paid... I'm not saying he's not a kid and has his wants as soon as he sees an opening... Last year when dh got a large bonus check.. we allowed each of the boys a certain amount of money from it.. they all bought personal things... the year before when the bonus came in, they choose to take a family vacation...
So I guess my opinion would be to let them know up front if you have the money or if you don't.. what you can all do to ge the money or save up for it...
In our family we just believe that if I have 10 cents.. 5 of it is yours...
Lea
http://minwifeof4boys.bravejournal.com/
---------------------------------
Do you Yahoo!?
Read only the mail you want - Yahoo! Mail SpamGuard.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
tuition... Our youngest ds is 13 and he usually knows what a safe amount to save, spned ongroceries and what bills need to be paid... I'm not saying he's not a kid and has his wants as soon as he sees an opening... Last year when dh got a large bonus check.. we allowed each of the boys a certain amount of money from it.. they all bought personal things... the year before when the bonus came in, they choose to take a family vacation...
So I guess my opinion would be to let them know up front if you have the money or if you don't.. what you can all do to ge the money or save up for it...
In our family we just believe that if I have 10 cents.. 5 of it is yours...
Lea
http://minwifeof4boys.bravejournal.com/
---------------------------------
Do you Yahoo!?
Read only the mail you want - Yahoo! Mail SpamGuard.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Kate Sitzman
>>How would/do you handle allowances?I just started giving my 4yo son an allowance. He gets $4 per week because I
just figured I would tie the amount to his age, and give him more as he gets
older. He does not have to do anything to earn the money - he just gets it
as our way letting him participate in the prosperity of the family. He can
spend it on anything he chooses even if I don't approve of it, and that's
kind of the point. I periodically invest other money on his behalf for
potential future purposes, but that's my choice, and I don't require him to
do it. If he wants to save his money, that is entirely up to him. We talk
about saving up for things - as in, it will take so many weeks to get enough
money to buy that toy, but if he wants to blow it on something right now, he
can. I have no doubt that one day he will realize he can do more with his
money if he saves it up.
In regards to savings, I would ask your husband, what exactly are you saving
it for? Can she ever spend it? Should she be expected to save money without
a clear purpose? If there is a purpose, is it something that is important to
her, or something that is important to you? If it is important to you, why
should she be the one saving for it? My feeling is that enforcing savings is
like enforcing anything else - you are depriving the child of the
opportunity to find out the value of out on her own, and really take it to
heart. But - the bottom line for me is ownership. I am giving my child
money, and if I am truly giving it, then he truly owns it, and I have no
business telling him what to do with it. The whole point of the exercise is
to give him a sense of control, and that purpose is diminished, in my
opinion, if there are strings attached.
Kate
Virginia Glasser
I don't think instant gratification on hugs and love or feeding our bodies
is a problem. I'm not so sure that is the same thing though as buying a
child 5000.00 worth of toys.
Virginia Glasser
StampinUp! Demonstrator
http://www.virginiaglasser.stampinup.net
I'm proud to be a Stampin' Up demonstrator!
Ask me how you can earn free stamping or scrapbooking supplies!
-----Original Message-----
From: Rachel and Carson Milgroom [mailto:rachelcarson@...]
Sent: Thursday, October 07, 2004 7:20 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [unschoolingbasics] Another money "problem"
was
passed down, not something that really is true. A few examples of
"instant
gratification": I feel hungry for an apple, go to the fridge, get one and
eat it. My son wants to give me a hug, so I stop and hug him. My husband
comes home from work, so I go over and give him a kiss. My son asks me
"What's 6 and 6 make?" so I say "12".
Everyone gets a little wiggy when it comes to money, but why is it any
different to do any of the above than it is to buy someone something they
really want when the money is readily available? Should I, on principle,
make myself wait another 15 minutes before eating the apple? Should I
force
my family to wait for hugs and kisses? Should I tell my son I can tell
him
"what 6 and 6 makes" after lunch, just so he has to wait for an answer?
I am sure that when the family inherited the money, the adults started
thinking and planning and dreaming and getting excited about what they
could
do with the money. Why is it dangerous for a child to be allowed the same
freedom to dream and have those dreams come true?
Does keeping a child artificially 'poor' teach him the value of money? Or
does really examining all the things the family could use the money for
teach him the value of money (like Lea talked about in her response).
Does instant gratification get us into trouble or does the repeated
arbitrary denial of what we want (in favor of a supposed principle) cause
us
to constantly feel like we have to fight for what we want?
Just thinking I'd much rather live in a world where people help each other
get what they want, rather than one where people try to keep each other
from
having what they want.
Rachel
_________________________
My baby is a DiaperFreeBaby!!!
www.DiaperFreeBaby.org
Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
ADVERTISEMENT
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
--
Yahoo! Groups Links
a.. To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/unschoolingbasics/
b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
[email protected]
c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
is a problem. I'm not so sure that is the same thing though as buying a
child 5000.00 worth of toys.
Virginia Glasser
StampinUp! Demonstrator
http://www.virginiaglasser.stampinup.net
I'm proud to be a Stampin' Up demonstrator!
Ask me how you can earn free stamping or scrapbooking supplies!
-----Original Message-----
From: Rachel and Carson Milgroom [mailto:rachelcarson@...]
Sent: Thursday, October 07, 2004 7:20 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [unschoolingbasics] Another money "problem"
> I believe that is a very valid question and I'm curious as to thedifferent
> responses from the list. I for one would not indulge my child that way.It's
> important for kids to learn the value of money and if they get what theywhich
> want when they want it, too much, it is teaching instant gratification
> I can't think of one instance where that is really a good thing. InstantHmm, from my perspective this sounds like one of those old beliefs that
> gratification gets us all into trouble.
>
> Virginia Glasser
was
passed down, not something that really is true. A few examples of
"instant
gratification": I feel hungry for an apple, go to the fridge, get one and
eat it. My son wants to give me a hug, so I stop and hug him. My husband
comes home from work, so I go over and give him a kiss. My son asks me
"What's 6 and 6 make?" so I say "12".
Everyone gets a little wiggy when it comes to money, but why is it any
different to do any of the above than it is to buy someone something they
really want when the money is readily available? Should I, on principle,
make myself wait another 15 minutes before eating the apple? Should I
force
my family to wait for hugs and kisses? Should I tell my son I can tell
him
"what 6 and 6 makes" after lunch, just so he has to wait for an answer?
I am sure that when the family inherited the money, the adults started
thinking and planning and dreaming and getting excited about what they
could
do with the money. Why is it dangerous for a child to be allowed the same
freedom to dream and have those dreams come true?
Does keeping a child artificially 'poor' teach him the value of money? Or
does really examining all the things the family could use the money for
teach him the value of money (like Lea talked about in her response).
Does instant gratification get us into trouble or does the repeated
arbitrary denial of what we want (in favor of a supposed principle) cause
us
to constantly feel like we have to fight for what we want?
Just thinking I'd much rather live in a world where people help each other
get what they want, rather than one where people try to keep each other
from
having what they want.
Rachel
_________________________
My baby is a DiaperFreeBaby!!!
www.DiaperFreeBaby.org
Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
ADVERTISEMENT
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
--
Yahoo! Groups Links
a.. To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/unschoolingbasics/
b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
[email protected]
c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Rachel and Carson Milgroom
> I believe that is a very valid question and I'm curious as to thedifferent
> responses from the list. I for one would not indulge my child that way.It's
> important for kids to learn the value of money and if they get what theywhich
> want when they want it, too much, it is teaching instant gratification
> I can't think of one instance where that is really a good thing. InstantHmm, from my perspective this sounds like one of those old beliefs that was
> gratification gets us all into trouble.
>
> Virginia Glasser
passed down, not something that really is true. A few examples of "instant
gratification": I feel hungry for an apple, go to the fridge, get one and
eat it. My son wants to give me a hug, so I stop and hug him. My husband
comes home from work, so I go over and give him a kiss. My son asks me
"What's 6 and 6 make?" so I say "12".
Everyone gets a little wiggy when it comes to money, but why is it any
different to do any of the above than it is to buy someone something they
really want when the money is readily available? Should I, on principle,
make myself wait another 15 minutes before eating the apple? Should I force
my family to wait for hugs and kisses? Should I tell my son I can tell him
"what 6 and 6 makes" after lunch, just so he has to wait for an answer?
I am sure that when the family inherited the money, the adults started
thinking and planning and dreaming and getting excited about what they could
do with the money. Why is it dangerous for a child to be allowed the same
freedom to dream and have those dreams come true?
Does keeping a child artificially 'poor' teach him the value of money? Or
does really examining all the things the family could use the money for
teach him the value of money (like Lea talked about in her response).
Does instant gratification get us into trouble or does the repeated
arbitrary denial of what we want (in favor of a supposed principle) cause us
to constantly feel like we have to fight for what we want?
Just thinking I'd much rather live in a world where people help each other
get what they want, rather than one where people try to keep each other from
having what they want.
Rachel
_________________________
My baby is a DiaperFreeBaby!!!
www.DiaperFreeBaby.org
Steven Cox
Thank you, Kelly, Angela, Virginia, and Rachel for your responses,
To clarify: it was sort of a hypothetical; I did say "what if" :-). I inflated the amount of the money to stretch my thinking even further: how does one respond to "abundance", how does a person, no matter what the age, know when they have enough? Why does it always seem that the more I get, the more I want? Would a child when given his equal or desired share, beable to figure out better what he wants if his desires are met? The child will likely make mistakes about what he wants. Why are mistakes with money, somehow seem worse than other kinds of mistakes? What if he spends $5000 on drum sets, archery stuff, ride on toys (like a car or tractor that they can drive around the yard), a cotton candy maker, a large trampoline, gumball and pinball machines, computer and video games, a swing set, lots of rokenbok and marble runs and all sorts of kinetic building toys (Those Back to Basic Toys really add up quickly :-)). Perhaps at a later age the child may say "Why did you let me waste so much money?" Or perhaps they might say, "You trusted me to figure out what I like."
Then there's my stuff: I would feel guilty that so many resources are used up by one child. Although I also know that whatever is not used could be donated to others. I grew up pretty poor and given that I didn't have parents who had the belief that they could take my desires seriously, I want to give my kids what they ask for. Not without discussion, but perhaps without this panic feeling I have that all is going out of control when he has so many enthusiastic interests and desires!
Rachel, what you said below helps me. I'm really irrational about money. Wiggy is a good word for it ;-).
Leslie
Hmm, from my perspective this sounds like one of those old beliefs that was
passed down, not something that really is true. A few examples of "instant
gratification": I feel hungry for an apple, go to the fridge, get one and
eat it. My son wants to give me a hug, so I stop and hug him. My husband
comes home from work, so I go over and give him a kiss. My son asks me
"What's 6 and 6 make?" so I say "12".
Everyone gets a little wiggy when it comes to money, but why is it any
different to do any of the above than it is to buy someone something they
really want when the money is readily available? Should I, on principle,
make myself wait another 15 minutes before eating the apple? Should I force
my family to wait for hugs and kisses? Should I tell my son I can tell him
"what 6 and 6 makes" after lunch, just so he has to wait for an answer?
I am sure that when the family inherited the money, the adults started
thinking and planning and dreaming and getting excited about what they could
do with the money. Why is it dangerous for a child to be allowed the same
freedom to dream and have those dreams come true?
Does keeping a child artificially 'poor' teach him the value of money? Or
does really examining all the things the family could use the money for
teach him the value of money (like Lea talked about in her response).
Does instant gratification get us into trouble or does the repeated
arbitrary denial of what we want (in favor of a supposed principle) cause us
to constantly feel like we have to fight for what we want?
Just thinking I'd much rather live in a world where people help each other
get what they want, rather than one where people try to keep each other from
having what they want.
Rachel
_________________________
My baby is a DiaperFreeBaby!!!
www.DiaperFreeBaby.org
Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
ADVERTISEMENT
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Yahoo! Groups Links
a.. To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/unschoolingbasics/
b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
[email protected]
c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
To clarify: it was sort of a hypothetical; I did say "what if" :-). I inflated the amount of the money to stretch my thinking even further: how does one respond to "abundance", how does a person, no matter what the age, know when they have enough? Why does it always seem that the more I get, the more I want? Would a child when given his equal or desired share, beable to figure out better what he wants if his desires are met? The child will likely make mistakes about what he wants. Why are mistakes with money, somehow seem worse than other kinds of mistakes? What if he spends $5000 on drum sets, archery stuff, ride on toys (like a car or tractor that they can drive around the yard), a cotton candy maker, a large trampoline, gumball and pinball machines, computer and video games, a swing set, lots of rokenbok and marble runs and all sorts of kinetic building toys (Those Back to Basic Toys really add up quickly :-)). Perhaps at a later age the child may say "Why did you let me waste so much money?" Or perhaps they might say, "You trusted me to figure out what I like."
Then there's my stuff: I would feel guilty that so many resources are used up by one child. Although I also know that whatever is not used could be donated to others. I grew up pretty poor and given that I didn't have parents who had the belief that they could take my desires seriously, I want to give my kids what they ask for. Not without discussion, but perhaps without this panic feeling I have that all is going out of control when he has so many enthusiastic interests and desires!
Rachel, what you said below helps me. I'm really irrational about money. Wiggy is a good word for it ;-).
Leslie
Hmm, from my perspective this sounds like one of those old beliefs that was
passed down, not something that really is true. A few examples of "instant
gratification": I feel hungry for an apple, go to the fridge, get one and
eat it. My son wants to give me a hug, so I stop and hug him. My husband
comes home from work, so I go over and give him a kiss. My son asks me
"What's 6 and 6 make?" so I say "12".
Everyone gets a little wiggy when it comes to money, but why is it any
different to do any of the above than it is to buy someone something they
really want when the money is readily available? Should I, on principle,
make myself wait another 15 minutes before eating the apple? Should I force
my family to wait for hugs and kisses? Should I tell my son I can tell him
"what 6 and 6 makes" after lunch, just so he has to wait for an answer?
I am sure that when the family inherited the money, the adults started
thinking and planning and dreaming and getting excited about what they could
do with the money. Why is it dangerous for a child to be allowed the same
freedom to dream and have those dreams come true?
Does keeping a child artificially 'poor' teach him the value of money? Or
does really examining all the things the family could use the money for
teach him the value of money (like Lea talked about in her response).
Does instant gratification get us into trouble or does the repeated
arbitrary denial of what we want (in favor of a supposed principle) cause us
to constantly feel like we have to fight for what we want?
Just thinking I'd much rather live in a world where people help each other
get what they want, rather than one where people try to keep each other from
having what they want.
Rachel
_________________________
My baby is a DiaperFreeBaby!!!
www.DiaperFreeBaby.org
Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
ADVERTISEMENT
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Yahoo! Groups Links
a.. To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/unschoolingbasics/
b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
[email protected]
c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Steven Cox
Hi Virginia,
What if it was the father who wanted a small boat. He had always wanted a small boat. Or maybe the mother wanted a flatscreen tv. She saw one at the store recently and thought it was really fabulous. Or they both wanted to take the family on vacation to Disney (that could easily cost $5,000 for a family of 4, with flights and accomodations); or to Australia or something? All these things might be great, or awful, or receive thoroughly mixed reviews by family members. Why is it that when a child wants to spend that much on toys, it does not seem legitimate? In my example, $5000, is only 1% of $500,000. In any given family, who gets to decide how to spend the money and why? Is it the parents because they make the money? Is it the parents because they are more rational? (When I was looking at the catalog with my child, the things I liked or thought were interesting were much easier to consider buying then something like a movie theatre size popcorn popper) So much rich discussion can happen about these desired things and if the money is really not a problem, why not buy things the child insists they want and see what happens? We can never know what might be learned if we think we already possess the answer.
Leslie
I don't think instant gratification on hugs and love or feeding our bodies
is a problem. I'm not so sure that is the same thing though as buying a
child 5000.00 worth of toys.
Virginia Glasser
StampinUp! Demonstrator
http://www.virginiaglasser.stampinup.net
I'm proud to be a Stampin' Up demonstrator!
Ask me how you can earn free stamping or scrapbooking supplies!
-----Original Message-----
From: Rachel and Carson Milgroom [mailto:rachelcarson@...]
Sent: Thursday, October 07, 2004 7:20 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [unschoolingbasics] Another money "problem"
was
passed down, not something that really is true. A few examples of
"instant
gratification": I feel hungry for an apple, go to the fridge, get one and
eat it. My son wants to give me a hug, so I stop and hug him. My husband
comes home from work, so I go over and give him a kiss. My son asks me
"What's 6 and 6 make?" so I say "12".
Everyone gets a little wiggy when it comes to money, but why is it any
different to do any of the above than it is to buy someone something they
really want when the money is readily available? Should I, on principle,
make myself wait another 15 minutes before eating the apple? Should I
force
my family to wait for hugs and kisses? Should I tell my son I can tell
him
"what 6 and 6 makes" after lunch, just so he has to wait for an answer?
I am sure that when the family inherited the money, the adults started
thinking and planning and dreaming and getting excited about what they
could
do with the money. Why is it dangerous for a child to be allowed the same
freedom to dream and have those dreams come true?
Does keeping a child artificially 'poor' teach him the value of money? Or
does really examining all the things the family could use the money for
teach him the value of money (like Lea talked about in her response).
Does instant gratification get us into trouble or does the repeated
arbitrary denial of what we want (in favor of a supposed principle) cause
us
to constantly feel like we have to fight for what we want?
Just thinking I'd much rather live in a world where people help each other
get what they want, rather than one where people try to keep each other
from
having what they want.
Rachel
_________________________
My baby is a DiaperFreeBaby!!!
www.DiaperFreeBaby.org
Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
ADVERTISEMENT
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
--
Yahoo! Groups Links
a.. To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/unschoolingbasics/
b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
[email protected]
c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
ADVERTISEMENT
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Yahoo! Groups Links
a.. To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/unschoolingbasics/
b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
[email protected]
c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
What if it was the father who wanted a small boat. He had always wanted a small boat. Or maybe the mother wanted a flatscreen tv. She saw one at the store recently and thought it was really fabulous. Or they both wanted to take the family on vacation to Disney (that could easily cost $5,000 for a family of 4, with flights and accomodations); or to Australia or something? All these things might be great, or awful, or receive thoroughly mixed reviews by family members. Why is it that when a child wants to spend that much on toys, it does not seem legitimate? In my example, $5000, is only 1% of $500,000. In any given family, who gets to decide how to spend the money and why? Is it the parents because they make the money? Is it the parents because they are more rational? (When I was looking at the catalog with my child, the things I liked or thought were interesting were much easier to consider buying then something like a movie theatre size popcorn popper) So much rich discussion can happen about these desired things and if the money is really not a problem, why not buy things the child insists they want and see what happens? We can never know what might be learned if we think we already possess the answer.
Leslie
I don't think instant gratification on hugs and love or feeding our bodies
is a problem. I'm not so sure that is the same thing though as buying a
child 5000.00 worth of toys.
Virginia Glasser
StampinUp! Demonstrator
http://www.virginiaglasser.stampinup.net
I'm proud to be a Stampin' Up demonstrator!
Ask me how you can earn free stamping or scrapbooking supplies!
-----Original Message-----
From: Rachel and Carson Milgroom [mailto:rachelcarson@...]
Sent: Thursday, October 07, 2004 7:20 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [unschoolingbasics] Another money "problem"
> I believe that is a very valid question and I'm curious as to thedifferent
> responses from the list. I for one would not indulge my child that way.It's
> important for kids to learn the value of money and if they get what theywhich
> want when they want it, too much, it is teaching instant gratification
> I can't think of one instance where that is really a good thing. InstantHmm, from my perspective this sounds like one of those old beliefs that
> gratification gets us all into trouble.
>
> Virginia Glasser
was
passed down, not something that really is true. A few examples of
"instant
gratification": I feel hungry for an apple, go to the fridge, get one and
eat it. My son wants to give me a hug, so I stop and hug him. My husband
comes home from work, so I go over and give him a kiss. My son asks me
"What's 6 and 6 make?" so I say "12".
Everyone gets a little wiggy when it comes to money, but why is it any
different to do any of the above than it is to buy someone something they
really want when the money is readily available? Should I, on principle,
make myself wait another 15 minutes before eating the apple? Should I
force
my family to wait for hugs and kisses? Should I tell my son I can tell
him
"what 6 and 6 makes" after lunch, just so he has to wait for an answer?
I am sure that when the family inherited the money, the adults started
thinking and planning and dreaming and getting excited about what they
could
do with the money. Why is it dangerous for a child to be allowed the same
freedom to dream and have those dreams come true?
Does keeping a child artificially 'poor' teach him the value of money? Or
does really examining all the things the family could use the money for
teach him the value of money (like Lea talked about in her response).
Does instant gratification get us into trouble or does the repeated
arbitrary denial of what we want (in favor of a supposed principle) cause
us
to constantly feel like we have to fight for what we want?
Just thinking I'd much rather live in a world where people help each other
get what they want, rather than one where people try to keep each other
from
having what they want.
Rachel
_________________________
My baby is a DiaperFreeBaby!!!
www.DiaperFreeBaby.org
Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
ADVERTISEMENT
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
--
Yahoo! Groups Links
a.. To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/unschoolingbasics/
b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
[email protected]
c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
ADVERTISEMENT
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Yahoo! Groups Links
a.. To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/unschoolingbasics/
b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
[email protected]
c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Steven Cox
Hi Rachel,
Where in Mass are you?
Leslie in Sharon
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Where in Mass are you?
Leslie in Sharon
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Virginia Glasser
Leslie you could be right...I don't know. I'm on the fence at this point. I
wish I had more time to write but I don't. Sorry this was so short in
response to your well thought out post.
Virginia Glasser
StampinUp! Demonstrator
http://www.virginiaglasser.stampinup.net
I'm proud to be a Stampin' Up demonstrator!
Ask me how you can earn free stamping or scrapbooking supplies!
-----Original Message-----
From: Steven Cox [mailto:slclsc@...]
Sent: Thursday, October 07, 2004 11:04 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [unschoolingbasics] Another money "problem"
Hi Virginia,
What if it was the father who wanted a small boat. He had always wanted a
small boat. Or maybe the mother wanted a flatscreen tv. She saw one at the
store recently and thought it was really fabulous. Or they both wanted to
take the family on vacation to Disney (that could easily cost $5,000 for a
family of 4, with flights and accomodations); or to Australia or something?
All these things might be great, or awful, or receive thoroughly mixed
reviews by family members. Why is it that when a child wants to spend that
much on toys, it does not seem legitimate? In my example, $5000, is only 1%
of $500,000. In any given family, who gets to decide how to spend the money
and why? Is it the parents because they make the money? Is it the parents
because they are more rational? (When I was looking at the catalog with my
child, the things I liked or thought were interesting were much easier to
consider buying then something like a movie theatre size popcorn popper) So
much rich dis cussion can happen about these desired things and if the money
is really not a problem, why not buy things the child insists they want and
see what happens? We can never know what might be learned if we think we
already possess the answer.
Leslie
I don't think instant gratification on hugs and love or feeding our
bodies
is a problem. I'm not so sure that is the same thing though as buying a
child 5000.00 worth of toys.
Virginia Glasser
StampinUp! Demonstrator
http://www.virginiaglasser.stampinup.net
I'm proud to be a Stampin' Up demonstrator!
Ask me how you can earn free stamping or scrapbooking supplies!
-----Original Message-----
From: Rachel and Carson Milgroom [mailto:rachelcarson@...]
Sent: Thursday, October 07, 2004 7:20 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [unschoolingbasics] Another money "problem"
It's
which
that
was
passed down, not something that really is true. A few examples of
"instant
gratification": I feel hungry for an apple, go to the fridge, get one
and
eat it. My son wants to give me a hug, so I stop and hug him. My
husband
comes home from work, so I go over and give him a kiss. My son asks
me
"What's 6 and 6 make?" so I say "12".
Everyone gets a little wiggy when it comes to money, but why is it any
different to do any of the above than it is to buy someone something
they
really want when the money is readily available? Should I, on
principle,
make myself wait another 15 minutes before eating the apple? Should I
force
my family to wait for hugs and kisses? Should I tell my son I can
tell
him
"what 6 and 6 makes" after lunch, just so he has to wait for an
answer?
I am sure that when the family inherited the money, the adults started
thinking and planning and dreaming and getting excited about what they
could
do with the money. Why is it dangerous for a child to be allowed the
same
freedom to dream and have those dreams come true?
Does keeping a child artificially 'poor' teach him the value of money?
Or
does really examining all the things the family could use the money
for
teach him the value of money (like Lea talked about in her response).
Does instant gratification get us into trouble or does the repeated
arbitrary denial of what we want (in favor of a supposed principle)
cause
us
to constantly feel like we have to fight for what we want?
Just thinking I'd much rather live in a world where people help each
other
get what they want, rather than one where people try to keep each
other
from
having what they want.
Rachel
_________________________
My baby is a DiaperFreeBaby!!!
www.DiaperFreeBaby.org
Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
ADVERTISEMENT
------------------------------------------------------------------------
----
--
Yahoo! Groups Links
a.. To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/unschoolingbasics/
b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
[email protected]
c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
Service.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
ADVERTISEMENT
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
----
Yahoo! Groups Links
a.. To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/unschoolingbasics/
b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
[email protected]
c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
Service.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
ADVERTISEMENT
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
--
Yahoo! Groups Links
a.. To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/unschoolingbasics/
b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
[email protected]
c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
wish I had more time to write but I don't. Sorry this was so short in
response to your well thought out post.
Virginia Glasser
StampinUp! Demonstrator
http://www.virginiaglasser.stampinup.net
I'm proud to be a Stampin' Up demonstrator!
Ask me how you can earn free stamping or scrapbooking supplies!
-----Original Message-----
From: Steven Cox [mailto:slclsc@...]
Sent: Thursday, October 07, 2004 11:04 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [unschoolingbasics] Another money "problem"
Hi Virginia,
What if it was the father who wanted a small boat. He had always wanted a
small boat. Or maybe the mother wanted a flatscreen tv. She saw one at the
store recently and thought it was really fabulous. Or they both wanted to
take the family on vacation to Disney (that could easily cost $5,000 for a
family of 4, with flights and accomodations); or to Australia or something?
All these things might be great, or awful, or receive thoroughly mixed
reviews by family members. Why is it that when a child wants to spend that
much on toys, it does not seem legitimate? In my example, $5000, is only 1%
of $500,000. In any given family, who gets to decide how to spend the money
and why? Is it the parents because they make the money? Is it the parents
because they are more rational? (When I was looking at the catalog with my
child, the things I liked or thought were interesting were much easier to
consider buying then something like a movie theatre size popcorn popper) So
much rich dis cussion can happen about these desired things and if the money
is really not a problem, why not buy things the child insists they want and
see what happens? We can never know what might be learned if we think we
already possess the answer.
Leslie
I don't think instant gratification on hugs and love or feeding our
bodies
is a problem. I'm not so sure that is the same thing though as buying a
child 5000.00 worth of toys.
Virginia Glasser
StampinUp! Demonstrator
http://www.virginiaglasser.stampinup.net
I'm proud to be a Stampin' Up demonstrator!
Ask me how you can earn free stamping or scrapbooking supplies!
-----Original Message-----
From: Rachel and Carson Milgroom [mailto:rachelcarson@...]
Sent: Thursday, October 07, 2004 7:20 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [unschoolingbasics] Another money "problem"
> I believe that is a very valid question and I'm curious as to thedifferent
> responses from the list. I for one would not indulge my child thatway.
It's
> important for kids to learn the value of money and if they get whatthey
> want when they want it, too much, it is teaching instantgratification
which
> I can't think of one instance where that is really a good thing.Instant
> gratification gets us all into trouble.Hmm, from my perspective this sounds like one of those old beliefs
>
> Virginia Glasser
that
was
passed down, not something that really is true. A few examples of
"instant
gratification": I feel hungry for an apple, go to the fridge, get one
and
eat it. My son wants to give me a hug, so I stop and hug him. My
husband
comes home from work, so I go over and give him a kiss. My son asks
me
"What's 6 and 6 make?" so I say "12".
Everyone gets a little wiggy when it comes to money, but why is it any
different to do any of the above than it is to buy someone something
they
really want when the money is readily available? Should I, on
principle,
make myself wait another 15 minutes before eating the apple? Should I
force
my family to wait for hugs and kisses? Should I tell my son I can
tell
him
"what 6 and 6 makes" after lunch, just so he has to wait for an
answer?
I am sure that when the family inherited the money, the adults started
thinking and planning and dreaming and getting excited about what they
could
do with the money. Why is it dangerous for a child to be allowed the
same
freedom to dream and have those dreams come true?
Does keeping a child artificially 'poor' teach him the value of money?
Or
does really examining all the things the family could use the money
for
teach him the value of money (like Lea talked about in her response).
Does instant gratification get us into trouble or does the repeated
arbitrary denial of what we want (in favor of a supposed principle)
cause
us
to constantly feel like we have to fight for what we want?
Just thinking I'd much rather live in a world where people help each
other
get what they want, rather than one where people try to keep each
other
from
having what they want.
Rachel
_________________________
My baby is a DiaperFreeBaby!!!
www.DiaperFreeBaby.org
Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
ADVERTISEMENT
------------------------------------------------------------------------
----
--
Yahoo! Groups Links
a.. To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/unschoolingbasics/
b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
[email protected]
c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
Service.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
ADVERTISEMENT
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
----
Yahoo! Groups Links
a.. To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/unschoolingbasics/
b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
[email protected]
c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
Service.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
ADVERTISEMENT
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
--
Yahoo! Groups Links
a.. To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/unschoolingbasics/
b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
[email protected]
c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
In a message dated 10/7/2004 10:24:59 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
slclsc@... writes:
To clarify: it was sort of a hypothetical; I did say "what if" :-). I
inflated the amount of the money to stretch my thinking even further<<<
Ooooooh, I HATE hypotheticals!
You also said that he was already perusing catalogues and picking out what
he wanted. It didn't sound hypothetical.
How much REALLY does he have to spend? What kinds of things is he REALLY
looking into buying for himself? For others? What are YOU thinking of spending
your money on?
A huge part of allowing our children to make mistakes---we call them
learning-takes---is actually ALLOWING them to do it. It's better to make a $5
learning-take NOW than a $50,000 MIStake later.
I would spend a lot of time talking with him about purchases and
values----but, we do a lot of that already----so it wouldn't seem that I was trying to
persuade him one way or another.
Cameron, at 16, is very good about putting $$ away for special, expensive
purchases. He also has to save up to pay his car insurance (while *spending* $$
on gas and oil, etc.). He struggles (and borrows) some months. He has money
to burn other months. He's figuring it out. Again---better now with smallish
amounts than later with big bucks!
~Kelly
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
slclsc@... writes:
To clarify: it was sort of a hypothetical; I did say "what if" :-). I
inflated the amount of the money to stretch my thinking even further<<<
Ooooooh, I HATE hypotheticals!
You also said that he was already perusing catalogues and picking out what
he wanted. It didn't sound hypothetical.
How much REALLY does he have to spend? What kinds of things is he REALLY
looking into buying for himself? For others? What are YOU thinking of spending
your money on?
A huge part of allowing our children to make mistakes---we call them
learning-takes---is actually ALLOWING them to do it. It's better to make a $5
learning-take NOW than a $50,000 MIStake later.
I would spend a lot of time talking with him about purchases and
values----but, we do a lot of that already----so it wouldn't seem that I was trying to
persuade him one way or another.
Cameron, at 16, is very good about putting $$ away for special, expensive
purchases. He also has to save up to pay his car insurance (while *spending* $$
on gas and oil, etc.). He struggles (and borrows) some months. He has money
to burn other months. He's figuring it out. Again---better now with smallish
amounts than later with big bucks!
~Kelly
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
In a message dated 10/7/2004 4:42:40 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
virginia@... writes:
I for one would not indulge my child that way. It's
important for kids to learn the value of money <<<<<
I'm all for indulging! My kids are worth it! <g> I indulge them whenever I
can. I indulge my husband. And myself. My friends, sometimes, too! <g>
They learn the value of money by being able to play with it, earn it, spend
it, save it, learn with it. Never having the opportunity to make real
decisions with it won't make it any easier when they DO have it. They need real life
experiences with money----otherwise, they're just like many other adults
whose money, as a child, was monitored and doled out when the parent agreed to.
I can't think of one instance where that is really a good thing. Instant
gratification gets us all into trouble.<<<<
I can't think of one person who gets everything he wants exactly when he
wants it.
I'm an instant gratification junkie----I want it all yesterday. But it's not
possible. But I DO think about ways to make it happen! If I save a bit here
and there, then I have a larger amount tucked away so that I CAN instantly
gratify myself---when that thing comes along. And I can instantly gratify myself
with something small (a Snickers bar) while I wait for that $$$ to accrue
to buy something bigger than will instantly gratify me. <g>
Do you think that allowing a child to spend $5000 at one sitting will make
him think that everything will happen that way all his life? It's a windfall.
Even if he DID spend it all on one toy that will make him "instantly" happy
for a month or two (I might spend mine on a vacation to Alaska that would last
only a week!). So? Did he learn something?
Childhood, while under our protection, is the time to make learning-takes.
The time to fall and find the rope. To slip and be caught. It should be a safe
environment in which you can take a few hard knocks and not lose
*everything*. To LEARN without serious repercussions. To know there's someone who will
make it all right if you screw up.
That's what childhood is FOR. Stopping those mistakes because you "know
better" does not help. It hinders. A parent's job is to show a better
route---with better footing. And if the child chooses to take another, more difficult,
route, to cheer for a better outcome than you would have imagined----or to
make the landing softer.
Learning the value of money WON'T happen if the child doesn't have the
opportunity to experiment with it.
~Kelly
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
virginia@... writes:
I for one would not indulge my child that way. It's
important for kids to learn the value of money <<<<<
I'm all for indulging! My kids are worth it! <g> I indulge them whenever I
can. I indulge my husband. And myself. My friends, sometimes, too! <g>
They learn the value of money by being able to play with it, earn it, spend
it, save it, learn with it. Never having the opportunity to make real
decisions with it won't make it any easier when they DO have it. They need real life
experiences with money----otherwise, they're just like many other adults
whose money, as a child, was monitored and doled out when the parent agreed to.
>>>>and if they get what theywant when they want it, too much, it is teaching instant gratification which
I can't think of one instance where that is really a good thing. Instant
gratification gets us all into trouble.<<<<
I can't think of one person who gets everything he wants exactly when he
wants it.
I'm an instant gratification junkie----I want it all yesterday. But it's not
possible. But I DO think about ways to make it happen! If I save a bit here
and there, then I have a larger amount tucked away so that I CAN instantly
gratify myself---when that thing comes along. And I can instantly gratify myself
with something small (a Snickers bar) while I wait for that $$$ to accrue
to buy something bigger than will instantly gratify me. <g>
Do you think that allowing a child to spend $5000 at one sitting will make
him think that everything will happen that way all his life? It's a windfall.
Even if he DID spend it all on one toy that will make him "instantly" happy
for a month or two (I might spend mine on a vacation to Alaska that would last
only a week!). So? Did he learn something?
Childhood, while under our protection, is the time to make learning-takes.
The time to fall and find the rope. To slip and be caught. It should be a safe
environment in which you can take a few hard knocks and not lose
*everything*. To LEARN without serious repercussions. To know there's someone who will
make it all right if you screw up.
That's what childhood is FOR. Stopping those mistakes because you "know
better" does not help. It hinders. A parent's job is to show a better
route---with better footing. And if the child chooses to take another, more difficult,
route, to cheer for a better outcome than you would have imagined----or to
make the landing softer.
Learning the value of money WON'T happen if the child doesn't have the
opportunity to experiment with it.
~Kelly
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Steven Cox
Sorry Kelly, I sort of mixed things up! It would be much easier for me to write to this list saying I have no money and want to do x, y, or z and get ideas. Its much harder to say we actually will have "x" amount. When I was a child it was a taboo subject to ask my father how much money we had because it was "none of my business", so I don't want anyone to really know if its $50,000 or $500,000 ;-). I'm actually kind of ashamed to have money. I think I need to dig out those money/spirtuality books I bought a while ago. Lets just say its alot for us and that my son really does want lots of things from catalogs--and we can buy them if we choose to :-).
Leslie
Leslie
----- Original Message -----
From: kbcdlovejo@...
To: [email protected]
Sent: Friday, October 08, 2004 9:09 AM
Subject: Re: [unschoolingbasics] Another money "problem"
In a message dated 10/7/2004 10:24:59 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
slclsc@... writes:
To clarify: it was sort of a hypothetical; I did say "what if" :-). I
inflated the amount of the money to stretch my thinking even further<<<
Ooooooh, I HATE hypotheticals!
You also said that he was already perusing catalogues and picking out what
he wanted. It didn't sound hypothetical.
How much REALLY does he have to spend? What kinds of things is he REALLY
looking into buying for himself? For others? What are YOU thinking of spending
your money on?
A huge part of allowing our children to make mistakes---we call them
learning-takes---is actually ALLOWING them to do it. It's better to make a $5
learning-take NOW than a $50,000 MIStake later.
I would spend a lot of time talking with him about purchases and
values----but, we do a lot of that already----so it wouldn't seem that I was trying to
persuade him one way or another.
Cameron, at 16, is very good about putting $$ away for special, expensive
purchases. He also has to save up to pay his car insurance (while *spending* $$
on gas and oil, etc.). He struggles (and borrows) some months. He has money
to burn other months. He's figuring it out. Again---better now with smallish
amounts than later with big bucks!
~Kelly
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
ADVERTISEMENT
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Yahoo! Groups Links
a.. To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/unschoolingbasics/
b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
[email protected]
c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Virginia Glasser
Ok, you are starting to convince me that I was wrong. :)
Virginia Glasser
StampinUp! Demonstrator
http://www.virginiaglasser.stampinup.net
I'm proud to be a Stampin' Up demonstrator!
Ask me how you can earn free stamping or scrapbooking supplies!
-----Original Message-----
From: kbcdlovejo@... [mailto:kbcdlovejo@...]
Sent: Friday, October 08, 2004 8:32 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [unschoolingbasics] Another money "problem"
In a message dated 10/7/2004 4:42:40 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
virginia@... writes:
I for one would not indulge my child that way. It's
important for kids to learn the value of money <<<<<
I'm all for indulging! My kids are worth it! <g> I indulge them whenever
I
can. I indulge my husband. And myself. My friends, sometimes, too! <g>
They learn the value of money by being able to play with it, earn it,
spend
it, save it, learn with it. Never having the opportunity to make real
decisions with it won't make it any easier when they DO have it. They
need real life
experiences with money----otherwise, they're just like many other adults
whose money, as a child, was monitored and doled out when the parent
agreed to.
which
I can't think of one instance where that is really a good thing. Instant
gratification gets us all into trouble.<<<<
I can't think of one person who gets everything he wants exactly when he
wants it.
I'm an instant gratification junkie----I want it all yesterday. But it's
not
possible. But I DO think about ways to make it happen! If I save a bit
here
and there, then I have a larger amount tucked away so that I CAN instantly
gratify myself---when that thing comes along. And I can instantly gratify
myself
with something small (a Snickers bar) while I wait for that $$$ to accrue
to buy something bigger than will instantly gratify me. <g>
Do you think that allowing a child to spend $5000 at one sitting will
make
him think that everything will happen that way all his life? It's a
windfall.
Even if he DID spend it all on one toy that will make him "instantly"
happy
for a month or two (I might spend mine on a vacation to Alaska that would
last
only a week!). So? Did he learn something?
Childhood, while under our protection, is the time to make
learning-takes.
The time to fall and find the rope. To slip and be caught. It should be a
safe
environment in which you can take a few hard knocks and not lose
*everything*. To LEARN without serious repercussions. To know there's
someone who will
make it all right if you screw up.
That's what childhood is FOR. Stopping those mistakes because you "know
better" does not help. It hinders. A parent's job is to show a better
route---with better footing. And if the child chooses to take another,
more difficult,
route, to cheer for a better outcome than you would have imagined----or
to
make the landing softer.
Learning the value of money WON'T happen if the child doesn't have the
opportunity to experiment with it.
~Kelly
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
ADVERTISEMENT
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
--
Yahoo! Groups Links
a.. To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/unschoolingbasics/
b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
[email protected]
c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Virginia Glasser
StampinUp! Demonstrator
http://www.virginiaglasser.stampinup.net
I'm proud to be a Stampin' Up demonstrator!
Ask me how you can earn free stamping or scrapbooking supplies!
-----Original Message-----
From: kbcdlovejo@... [mailto:kbcdlovejo@...]
Sent: Friday, October 08, 2004 8:32 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [unschoolingbasics] Another money "problem"
In a message dated 10/7/2004 4:42:40 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
virginia@... writes:
I for one would not indulge my child that way. It's
important for kids to learn the value of money <<<<<
I'm all for indulging! My kids are worth it! <g> I indulge them whenever
I
can. I indulge my husband. And myself. My friends, sometimes, too! <g>
They learn the value of money by being able to play with it, earn it,
spend
it, save it, learn with it. Never having the opportunity to make real
decisions with it won't make it any easier when they DO have it. They
need real life
experiences with money----otherwise, they're just like many other adults
whose money, as a child, was monitored and doled out when the parent
agreed to.
>>>>and if they get what theywant when they want it, too much, it is teaching instant gratification
which
I can't think of one instance where that is really a good thing. Instant
gratification gets us all into trouble.<<<<
I can't think of one person who gets everything he wants exactly when he
wants it.
I'm an instant gratification junkie----I want it all yesterday. But it's
not
possible. But I DO think about ways to make it happen! If I save a bit
here
and there, then I have a larger amount tucked away so that I CAN instantly
gratify myself---when that thing comes along. And I can instantly gratify
myself
with something small (a Snickers bar) while I wait for that $$$ to accrue
to buy something bigger than will instantly gratify me. <g>
Do you think that allowing a child to spend $5000 at one sitting will
make
him think that everything will happen that way all his life? It's a
windfall.
Even if he DID spend it all on one toy that will make him "instantly"
happy
for a month or two (I might spend mine on a vacation to Alaska that would
last
only a week!). So? Did he learn something?
Childhood, while under our protection, is the time to make
learning-takes.
The time to fall and find the rope. To slip and be caught. It should be a
safe
environment in which you can take a few hard knocks and not lose
*everything*. To LEARN without serious repercussions. To know there's
someone who will
make it all right if you screw up.
That's what childhood is FOR. Stopping those mistakes because you "know
better" does not help. It hinders. A parent's job is to show a better
route---with better footing. And if the child chooses to take another,
more difficult,
route, to cheer for a better outcome than you would have imagined----or
to
make the landing softer.
Learning the value of money WON'T happen if the child doesn't have the
opportunity to experiment with it.
~Kelly
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
ADVERTISEMENT
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
--
Yahoo! Groups Links
a.. To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/unschoolingbasics/
b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
[email protected]
c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
J. Stauffer
<<<< Lets just say its alot for us and that my son really does want lots of things from catalogs--and we can buy them if we choose to :-).>>>>>>
I think of money as just a tool, no more, no less. I wouldn't be ashamed if I were a gardener and had a huge bunch of rakes and hoes.
I think the point of the tool is to bring joy, whether that be through toys, activities, work, giving to charity, taking classes, etc..
I think if I had enough money to buy all the things my kid wanted, I don't know if I would. I think I would give him a quite generous amount that he could spend however he chose each month....and I think I would make sure that my son saw me giving another generous amount to someone who truly needed it....perhaps "adopt" financially, a child living on a reservation for example.
Just my thoughts.
Julie---who really has never had to worry about this <sigh>
I think of money as just a tool, no more, no less. I wouldn't be ashamed if I were a gardener and had a huge bunch of rakes and hoes.
I think the point of the tool is to bring joy, whether that be through toys, activities, work, giving to charity, taking classes, etc..
I think if I had enough money to buy all the things my kid wanted, I don't know if I would. I think I would give him a quite generous amount that he could spend however he chose each month....and I think I would make sure that my son saw me giving another generous amount to someone who truly needed it....perhaps "adopt" financially, a child living on a reservation for example.
Just my thoughts.
Julie---who really has never had to worry about this <sigh>
----- Original Message -----
From: Steven Cox
To: [email protected]
Sent: Friday, October 08, 2004 9:24 AM
Subject: Re: [unschoolingbasics] Another money "problem"
Sorry Kelly, I sort of mixed things up! It would be much easier for me to write to this list saying I have no money and want to do x, y, or z and get ideas. Its much harder to say we actually will have "x" amount. When I was a child it was a taboo subject to ask my father how much money we had because it was "none of my business", so I don't want anyone to really know if its $50,000 or $500,000 ;-). I'm actually kind of ashamed to have money. I think I need to dig out those money/spirtuality books I bought a while ago. Lets just say its alot for us and that my son really does want lots of things from catalogs--and we can buy them if we choose to :-).
Leslie
----- Original Message -----
From: kbcdlovejo@...
To: [email protected]
Sent: Friday, October 08, 2004 9:09 AM
Subject: Re: [unschoolingbasics] Another money "problem"
In a message dated 10/7/2004 10:24:59 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
slclsc@... writes:
To clarify: it was sort of a hypothetical; I did say "what if" :-). I
inflated the amount of the money to stretch my thinking even further<<<
Ooooooh, I HATE hypotheticals!
You also said that he was already perusing catalogues and picking out what
he wanted. It didn't sound hypothetical.
How much REALLY does he have to spend? What kinds of things is he REALLY
looking into buying for himself? For others? What are YOU thinking of spending
your money on?
A huge part of allowing our children to make mistakes---we call them
learning-takes---is actually ALLOWING them to do it. It's better to make a $5
learning-take NOW than a $50,000 MIStake later.
I would spend a lot of time talking with him about purchases and
values----but, we do a lot of that already----so it wouldn't seem that I was trying to
persuade him one way or another.
Cameron, at 16, is very good about putting $$ away for special, expensive
purchases. He also has to save up to pay his car insurance (while *spending* $$
on gas and oil, etc.). He struggles (and borrows) some months. He has money
to burn other months. He's figuring it out. Again---better now with smallish
amounts than later with big bucks!
~Kelly
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
ADVERTISEMENT
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Yahoo! Groups Links
a.. To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/unschoolingbasics/
b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
[email protected]
c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
ADVERTISEMENT
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Yahoo! Groups Links
a.. To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/unschoolingbasics/
b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
[email protected]
c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Deb Lewis
>>>I for one would not indulge my child that way. It'simportant for kids to learn the value of money <<<
***I'm all for indulging! ***
I think because we've been as generous as we can be Dylan is generous.
My feeling is if we had been stingy he would be too.
I don't see anything wrong with doing my best to give my child the things
he wants. He doesn't want anything unreasonable and he's kind and
generous to others. He seems exactly the kind of person I should lavish
kindness on. I don't think kids can be harmed by kindness and
generosity.
Deb Lewis
Robyn Coburn
<<<<Lets just say its alot for us and that my son really does want lots of
things from catalogs--and we can buy them if we choose to :-).>>>>
Jayn looks at catalogs a lot, as do I. She and I turn over the corner of the
page where the item is featured that either of us are interested in. However
it doesn't always translate to continuing to want the item after the
catalogue has been closed. Often I will go online to look at the item, ready
to order it, and Jayn will look again at the larger photo and change her
mind. Also if something seems overpriced for what it is, we will wait for
the clearance sale. Occasionally we will go to the actual store (if the
catalog company has one) to check out the item in person. At the end of the
day we actually purchase many fewer either toys or clothes than how many
Jayn expressed initial interest in, without even getting into the "too
expensive" conversation.
To be honest I felt a little put upon that the number $5000 turned out to be
a hypothetical, but also not surprised that it was an exaggeration. After
all that would be fifty $100 toys - and most of the toys that Jayn looks at
are between $10-30 - rarely getting up to $100 (see my previous post about
space in the home). It was hard to believe you’re your 4yo really wanted
that much small stuff. However that $ amount would not be unreasonable if he
was asking for a cedar gym, swing and slide set with treehouse, an above
ground pool and a full size trampoline for your backyard, all of which would
give years of ongoing enjoyment to the entire family.
This idea that children have to be "taught the value of money" is one that
bears examination. To me money has no value in itself - only in terms of
what it can purchase - all the material goods and services that we need to
live, as well as luxuries to make life more pleasant for us and others. How
far a dollar will go depends also on where one lives - housing costs,
gasoline, utilities, health insurance, various kinds of taxes - all these
vary tremendously by State, county, city. What I do with Jayn is try to show
her relative monetary values - like saying something like, "This toy costs
the same as three Barbies." It seems that "value" is something that can be
unschooled by the simple expedient of giving an allowance string-free.
Dh and I keep talking about formulating a budget for the year, and
allocating a certain amount to Jayn's toy purchases, along with the other
categories. At the moment these things go under "miscellaneous", and I am
only rigorous about filing tax deductible and business expenses in separate
categories. For this reason I can't tell you how much we spend in a year or
a "typical" month on toys. Someone else mentioned the cyclic nature of their
kid's desires. It felt familiar to me; I think Jayn is the same - especially
when a new interest is first flowering. At the moment it is Winx Club (Fox).
Sometimes I start to feel uncomfortable about Jayn seeming acquisitive. It
is probably a residual feeling similar to that which another poster is
evidently in the full grip of - that giving your kids what they want is
"indulging" them. I have come to the conclusion that when I am feeling that
way it is because *I* am feeling martyred - *I* have not allowed *myself*
some indulgence of object or maybe time (eg to read for myself). It is a
sense of it not being fair that I can't have all I want - although I
actually can have *most* of what I want. Did I mention that those doubts are
about *ME*, not Jayn's character or desires? At these times I realize that I
need to engage in a little self care, and also to do some conscious blessing
counting.
Then Jayn will do some selfless act that puts my mind at rest. Like choosing
to give one of her dolls away to her friend for her birthday, a special doll
no longer available in the stores that her friend has been admiring
wistfully for months. Jayn's excitement and eagerness at the prospect of
giving the doll was only matched by the recipient's evident delight.
Robyn L. Coburn
---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.773 / Virus Database: 520 - Release Date: 10/5/2004
things from catalogs--and we can buy them if we choose to :-).>>>>
Jayn looks at catalogs a lot, as do I. She and I turn over the corner of the
page where the item is featured that either of us are interested in. However
it doesn't always translate to continuing to want the item after the
catalogue has been closed. Often I will go online to look at the item, ready
to order it, and Jayn will look again at the larger photo and change her
mind. Also if something seems overpriced for what it is, we will wait for
the clearance sale. Occasionally we will go to the actual store (if the
catalog company has one) to check out the item in person. At the end of the
day we actually purchase many fewer either toys or clothes than how many
Jayn expressed initial interest in, without even getting into the "too
expensive" conversation.
To be honest I felt a little put upon that the number $5000 turned out to be
a hypothetical, but also not surprised that it was an exaggeration. After
all that would be fifty $100 toys - and most of the toys that Jayn looks at
are between $10-30 - rarely getting up to $100 (see my previous post about
space in the home). It was hard to believe you’re your 4yo really wanted
that much small stuff. However that $ amount would not be unreasonable if he
was asking for a cedar gym, swing and slide set with treehouse, an above
ground pool and a full size trampoline for your backyard, all of which would
give years of ongoing enjoyment to the entire family.
This idea that children have to be "taught the value of money" is one that
bears examination. To me money has no value in itself - only in terms of
what it can purchase - all the material goods and services that we need to
live, as well as luxuries to make life more pleasant for us and others. How
far a dollar will go depends also on where one lives - housing costs,
gasoline, utilities, health insurance, various kinds of taxes - all these
vary tremendously by State, county, city. What I do with Jayn is try to show
her relative monetary values - like saying something like, "This toy costs
the same as three Barbies." It seems that "value" is something that can be
unschooled by the simple expedient of giving an allowance string-free.
Dh and I keep talking about formulating a budget for the year, and
allocating a certain amount to Jayn's toy purchases, along with the other
categories. At the moment these things go under "miscellaneous", and I am
only rigorous about filing tax deductible and business expenses in separate
categories. For this reason I can't tell you how much we spend in a year or
a "typical" month on toys. Someone else mentioned the cyclic nature of their
kid's desires. It felt familiar to me; I think Jayn is the same - especially
when a new interest is first flowering. At the moment it is Winx Club (Fox).
Sometimes I start to feel uncomfortable about Jayn seeming acquisitive. It
is probably a residual feeling similar to that which another poster is
evidently in the full grip of - that giving your kids what they want is
"indulging" them. I have come to the conclusion that when I am feeling that
way it is because *I* am feeling martyred - *I* have not allowed *myself*
some indulgence of object or maybe time (eg to read for myself). It is a
sense of it not being fair that I can't have all I want - although I
actually can have *most* of what I want. Did I mention that those doubts are
about *ME*, not Jayn's character or desires? At these times I realize that I
need to engage in a little self care, and also to do some conscious blessing
counting.
Then Jayn will do some selfless act that puts my mind at rest. Like choosing
to give one of her dolls away to her friend for her birthday, a special doll
no longer available in the stores that her friend has been admiring
wistfully for months. Jayn's excitement and eagerness at the prospect of
giving the doll was only matched by the recipient's evident delight.
Robyn L. Coburn
---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.773 / Virus Database: 520 - Release Date: 10/5/2004
catherine aceto
I find this a fascinating question. Here are some observations about what we do.
When I quit an extremely lucrative job to stay home when my oldest daughter was born, I created an account just for me with about 6 months of salary in it. That is my "slush" fund. As it turns out other than to make sizeable loans to my family at different times, I haven't spent any of that money in the 7 years it has been there.
But knowing it is there makes it psychologically much easier for me not to spend money at the rate that I did when we had two professional incomes and no kids. For example, before when an author I liked had a new book out, I bought it immediately. In hardcover. I bought myself expensive jewelry. I ate in restaurants frequently. Now I get books from the libray, rarely wear jewelry, almost never eat out. But knowing that I CAN buy whatever-it-is if I really want to, I think helps me not to want or need to.
Lydia (not quite 7) knows that whatever thing she truly wants, she can have. But it doesn't translate into her wanting everything. In fact, It seems to translate into her not desparately wanting anything.
We do have a lot of toys (that we buy her and that she buys herself) -- but she tends to be content to buy them in small doses. For example, she recently went to the store to buy some fairy-barbies with saved allowance. She decided once she was there that she would only buy one - so she could spread the excitement of getting a new barbie over two outings, rather than just one.
We love to look at catalogs and pick out things we might want to have - but like Robyn's experience, a lot of the things don't last as wants past looking through the catalog. We also discuss things in terms of comparable value -- like that toy is worth 2 barbies or 4 polly pockets. Some things that she likes we look for in thrift stores because she likes them but not at the expense of other things.
I've noticed that she has started asking to do some research on toys that cost more than say $20 to see if she would really like them. I've never really talked about doing that -- but I know that she sees us research things like digital cameras and the like. She recently saw a TV commercial for a toy called a Blinkie and she asked me to see if I could find any reviews on the internet to see if kids really liked them. She read some reviews (and wrote her own) and bought the Blinkie (which she is enjoying).
Her discretionary spending line item on the family budget comes out to $6.00/week (plus we are now starting to pay her interest at 2% compounded weekly on her savings). She currently has about $30 saved.
I'm not sure that I'm doing a good job of explaining what we do -- in practice what happens is that we can buy (as gifts or through her allowance) her everything that she wants -- but her level of wants seems well tailored to our financial abilities. Although now that I think about it - my parents had far less money than my husband and I have -- but I grew up feeling like I had everyting that I wanted and my wants also corresponded to my parents' financial abilities. It just works for us - but I guess the bottom line is that I'm not sure exactly why.
For the original question, though, if we had a windfall of 1/2 million dollars, we would probably not spend any differently than we do now. I guess I woudl tend to base our budgeted spending on our regular income. If we won at least 10M in a lottery, my husband would quit work, but I don't think we'd spend differently. If we won $50M, we'd spend differently. ;- ) I guess for me, it would take a lot of savings in order to trickle down into our spending budget. If, however, I was coming from a situation where my chidlren had rarely been able to get what they wanted, I would use the money to be able to say yes much more frequently - rather than risk creating a situation where a windfall made the rest of their life seem more constricted than before.
I am a great believer in instant gratification and instantly gratify myself and others whenever possible. It doesn't seem to make me (I hope!) or my children selfish or demanding.
-Cat
When I quit an extremely lucrative job to stay home when my oldest daughter was born, I created an account just for me with about 6 months of salary in it. That is my "slush" fund. As it turns out other than to make sizeable loans to my family at different times, I haven't spent any of that money in the 7 years it has been there.
But knowing it is there makes it psychologically much easier for me not to spend money at the rate that I did when we had two professional incomes and no kids. For example, before when an author I liked had a new book out, I bought it immediately. In hardcover. I bought myself expensive jewelry. I ate in restaurants frequently. Now I get books from the libray, rarely wear jewelry, almost never eat out. But knowing that I CAN buy whatever-it-is if I really want to, I think helps me not to want or need to.
Lydia (not quite 7) knows that whatever thing she truly wants, she can have. But it doesn't translate into her wanting everything. In fact, It seems to translate into her not desparately wanting anything.
We do have a lot of toys (that we buy her and that she buys herself) -- but she tends to be content to buy them in small doses. For example, she recently went to the store to buy some fairy-barbies with saved allowance. She decided once she was there that she would only buy one - so she could spread the excitement of getting a new barbie over two outings, rather than just one.
We love to look at catalogs and pick out things we might want to have - but like Robyn's experience, a lot of the things don't last as wants past looking through the catalog. We also discuss things in terms of comparable value -- like that toy is worth 2 barbies or 4 polly pockets. Some things that she likes we look for in thrift stores because she likes them but not at the expense of other things.
I've noticed that she has started asking to do some research on toys that cost more than say $20 to see if she would really like them. I've never really talked about doing that -- but I know that she sees us research things like digital cameras and the like. She recently saw a TV commercial for a toy called a Blinkie and she asked me to see if I could find any reviews on the internet to see if kids really liked them. She read some reviews (and wrote her own) and bought the Blinkie (which she is enjoying).
Her discretionary spending line item on the family budget comes out to $6.00/week (plus we are now starting to pay her interest at 2% compounded weekly on her savings). She currently has about $30 saved.
I'm not sure that I'm doing a good job of explaining what we do -- in practice what happens is that we can buy (as gifts or through her allowance) her everything that she wants -- but her level of wants seems well tailored to our financial abilities. Although now that I think about it - my parents had far less money than my husband and I have -- but I grew up feeling like I had everyting that I wanted and my wants also corresponded to my parents' financial abilities. It just works for us - but I guess the bottom line is that I'm not sure exactly why.
For the original question, though, if we had a windfall of 1/2 million dollars, we would probably not spend any differently than we do now. I guess I woudl tend to base our budgeted spending on our regular income. If we won at least 10M in a lottery, my husband would quit work, but I don't think we'd spend differently. If we won $50M, we'd spend differently. ;- ) I guess for me, it would take a lot of savings in order to trickle down into our spending budget. If, however, I was coming from a situation where my chidlren had rarely been able to get what they wanted, I would use the money to be able to say yes much more frequently - rather than risk creating a situation where a windfall made the rest of their life seem more constricted than before.
I am a great believer in instant gratification and instantly gratify myself and others whenever possible. It doesn't seem to make me (I hope!) or my children selfish or demanding.
-Cat
----- Original Message -----
From: Steven Cox
To: [email protected]
Sent: Friday, October 08, 2004 10:24 AM
Subject: Re: [unschoolingbasics] Another money "problem"
Sorry Kelly, I sort of mixed things up! It would be much easier for me to write to this list saying I have no money and want to do x, y, or z and get ideas. Its much harder to say we actually will have "x" amount.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
In a message dated 10/8/2004 2:58:11 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
aceto3@... writes:
I'm not sure that I'm doing a good job of explaining what we do -- in
practice what happens is that we can buy (as gifts or through her allowance) her
everything that she wants -- but her level of wants seems well tailored to our
financial abilities. Although now that I think about it - my parents had far
less money than my husband and I have -- but I grew up feeling like I had
everyting that I wanted and my wants also corresponded to my parents'
financial abilities. It just works for us - but I guess the _bottom line_
(mip://0238e440/bottom%20line) is that I'm not sure exactly why. <<<
Lack of neediness.
~Kelly
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
aceto3@... writes:
I'm not sure that I'm doing a good job of explaining what we do -- in
practice what happens is that we can buy (as gifts or through her allowance) her
everything that she wants -- but her level of wants seems well tailored to our
financial abilities. Although now that I think about it - my parents had far
less money than my husband and I have -- but I grew up feeling like I had
everyting that I wanted and my wants also corresponded to my parents'
financial abilities. It just works for us - but I guess the _bottom line_
(mip://0238e440/bottom%20line) is that I'm not sure exactly why. <<<
Lack of neediness.
~Kelly
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Andy Holly Clarke
i think i personally would look to the future and invest it for the family
(parent's retirement, children's future needs). even with that much money
it isn't what i would consider unlimited funds. kwim? that way the funds
are really accessible for toys and it is a good example of managing money.
hope this makes sense
holly
(parent's retirement, children's future needs). even with that much money
it isn't what i would consider unlimited funds. kwim? that way the funds
are really accessible for toys and it is a good example of managing money.
hope this makes sense
holly
----- Original Message -----
From: "Steven Cox" <slclsc@...>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Thursday, October 07, 2004 10:40 AM
Subject: [unschoolingbasics] Another money "problem"
>
>
> Hi All,
>
> This may seem like a no-brainer, but what if resources are not so limited?
> What if there is plenty of money? For example you've gotten an inheritance
> of $500,000. And your 4 year old wants to buy maybe $5000 worth of toys
> asap? (he's looking at all the catalogs coming in pre-xmas and just so
> happens to want ALOT in coincidence with this money coming in) What would
> you do?
>
> Leslie in Mass.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>