[email protected]

Hi, I mostly lurk here, but now I need some input. My ds is 8yrs10mos, and is
5'2" and 185 lbs. Big kid, always unschooled, att. parented, nursed till
5.5yrs, still sleeps in our bedroom. He is sensitive, and has a really big energy.
This summer he has been playing with kids in our rural neighborhood. 2of the
boys live down the street, they are 13 and 15yr old brothers, and one other
friend that he sees sometimes is 11. They get rough, and there is teasing, and
sometimes there is anger about it. Tommy is quick to get hot under his
collar,and still will hit or lash out if he is really ticked off. We dont' spank, did
3 times when he was a toddler, then I learned better ways.
Today he was at a friend's house, and a new boy was there he did not know,
they were playing tag, and got into a physical tussle, no adults there to see
how it started. I am mortified and embarassed that he would use physical force,
I am told it is normal, I feel very upset that he would do this,and am worried
that he will hurt someone because of his size. How can I help him find
alternative ways of solving problems? And working with his temper?
I will be glad when all these boys go back to school, and we can be a bit
more peaceful and hang out with some other kids.
Any help appreciated
Nancy


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Joan Labbe & Salvatore Genovese

I just finished reading "Living Joyfully With Children" and sort of winced
through the whole section on taking care of Mom. This is an area where I
tend to fall short and I do pay by going through times of exhaustion. So
I'm looking for inspiration and encouragement. What do all of you do to
renew yourselves and take care of yourselves so that your children have a
joyful and energetic parent? I am particularly interested in any input from
anyone whose children still have difficulty separating a lot.

Thanks....

Joan

Joan Labbe & Salvatore Genovese

Hi, Nancy,

Sorry to hear about your situation which sounds very challenging. Two main
thoughts came to me reading your post. One was that I was wondering about
the character of your son's friendships with these boys, especially since
you wrote "I will be glad when all these boys go back to school, and we can
be a bit more peaceful and hang out with some other kids." That sounds like
perhaps the friendships you are describing in this email are not overall
positive ones for your son? I'm wondering if they are overall positive
friendships which sometimes denigrate into tussles and hard feelings, or if
the tussles and hard feelings and teasing pretty much define the
friendships. If the former is the case, then it makes sense to me to
support your son's hanging out with them and work on the times hard feelings
happen. If the latter is the case, then it makes more sense to me to talk
to your son about the character of the friendships, help him identify
whether they are ones he wants to continue or whether he'd like to break
them off (perhaps with your help) and hang out with the "other kids" to whom
you refer now. Is there a reason he has to wait till they go back to
school? That sort of sounds like they are initiating things right now and
perhaps your son could use your help thinking things through and breaking
things off with them.

For friendships that are positive overall and that your son values and wants
to keep but where he tends to sometimes lose his temper over things and lash
out, in addition to talking about other ways to handle anger, my other
thought is that you could try role playing situations your son finds
inflamatory with him so that he can practice handling it a different way.
This could be done yourselves or with puppets (I had a friend with a
daughter your son's age who was amazed at how her daughter responded to
discussing and working things out through puppet play and swore by it).
This way he'll have practiced doing things a different way and this may help
him interrupt his own process of coming to physical blows when the next
situation happens.

Good for you for not listening to those telling you it's "normal" and
implying you should ignore it! Good luck getting it resolved....

Joan

************************
"I would rather live in a world where my life is surrounded by mystery than
live in a world so small that my mind could comprehend it." ... Harry
Emerson Fosdick


-----Original Message-----
From: LOWRIEK@... [mailto:LOWRIEK@...]
Sent: Wednesday, September 01, 2004 7:03 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: [unschoolingbasics] Son is Having Trouble

Hi, I mostly lurk here, but now I need some input. My ds is 8yrs10mos, and
is
5'2" and 185 lbs. Big kid, always unschooled, att. parented, nursed till
5.5yrs, still sleeps in our bedroom. He is sensitive, and has a really big
energy.
This summer he has been playing with kids in our rural neighborhood. 2of
the
boys live down the street, they are 13 and 15yr old brothers, and one other
friend that he sees sometimes is 11. They get rough, and there is teasing,
and
sometimes there is anger about it. Tommy is quick to get hot under his
collar,and still will hit or lash out if he is really ticked off. We dont'
spank, did
3 times when he was a toddler, then I learned better ways.
Today he was at a friend's house, and a new boy was there he did not know,
they were playing tag, and got into a physical tussle, no adults there to
see
how it started. I am mortified and embarassed that he would use physical
force,
I am told it is normal, I feel very upset that he would do this,and am
worried
that he will hurt someone because of his size. How can I help him find
alternative ways of solving problems? And working with his temper?
I will be glad when all these boys go back to school, and we can be a bit
more peaceful and hang out with some other kids.
Any help appreciated
Nancy

[email protected]

In a message dated 02/09/2004 06:46:41 Pacific Daylight Time,
salgenovese@... writes:


> I'm wondering if they are overall positive
> friendships which sometimes denigrate into tussles and hard feelings, or if
>

This would be mostly how I would describe this relationship. These boys are
brothers, and sometimes are here at the same time, sometimes separately.
Thereis a lot of teasing, in schooly way, they are from a very fundamentalist
family, and I believe they come here because things are just not as tough as at
home. They get "the belt" when punished, and I even had a lecture from the older
one once that Tommy should be punished more. I t hink that they are very
wrapped ina struggle for power in everything they do as they have less than none at
home. So even play is used to get power. I really love these kids, and I see
Tommy drawn to the big excitement, fast paced play with them. He gets to do
big guy rough play, and do x-box and watch movies, we float down our river with
them, etc. But I really think that they are attracted to Tommy because they so
often get the upper hand by virtue of his age, and because I am so easy going
compared to home. I tend to do stuff with them, playing games, bikes,
swimming etc, where their mom is very busy.
Ds and I have talked about the nature of the friendship, and he knows he is
more relaxed without them , yet he really feels called to their energy, and the
good times they do have. It is almost like they are older brothers to him, so
I try to support him thru this, as I won't make the choice for him.
thanks for your reply, Joan. I have calmed down now, and we talked last night
about using physical force, and walking away to get help. I realize he really
is very young, just in a big package. He is the same size as the two
teenagers. I suggested maybe the kid he had the tussle with was intimidated by his
size, we have experienced that iwth other kids, who go out of their way to pick
on him because he is soo big.
Nancy in BC


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

jenneferh2000

I have a big son too, but he's only 3years and 40pounds (20pounds at
4 months! *ouch* my back!)

The first thing that comes to my mind is: Is there a way that you can
channel his physical energy? Is there someone who he can wrestle
with? Father, uncle, you? This would be a good outlet for him to be
physical, and learn when to stop. Perhaps he is interested in
getting involved in some type of sports to get out all that energy?
Bike riding? Soccer? Baseball?

>>Tommy is quick to get hot under his collar

Is this because he is self conscious about his size? I know having a
big kid for his age, some people 'expect' more from him because he is
so big, but he is really young. This can be frustrating for the boy.

>>will hit or lash out if he is really ticked off.

This should be addressed. Perhaps you can dialogue with him about
nonviolent alternatives- just walking away, using words
Maybe talk about why he is *really* angry. Do kids call him 'fat' or
tease him? This may cause him to be angry. Sounds like it would
also help for him to have friends who's parent do not hit them.

Good Luck!
Jennefer
*********************************************************************

My ds is 8yrs10mos, and is
> 5'2" and 185 lbs. Big kid, always unschooled, att. parented, nursed
till
> 5.5yrs, still sleeps in our bedroom. He is sensitive, and has a
really big energy.
They get rough, and there is teasing, and
> sometimes there is anger about it. Tommy is quick to get hot under
his
> collar,and still will hit or lash out if he is really ticked off. >
Today he was at a friend's house, and a new boy was there he did not
know,
> they were playing tag, and got into a physical tussle
I am mortified and embarassed that he would use physical force,
> I am told it is normal, I feel very upset that he would do this,and
am worried
> that he will hurt someone because of his size. How can I help him
find
> alternative ways of solving problems? And working with his temper?
and we can be a bit
> more peaceful and hang out with some other kids.
> Any help appreciated
> Nancy

[email protected]

In a message dated 02/09/2004 10:06:58 Pacific Daylight Time,
jenneferh2000@... writes:


> Is there a way that you can
> channel his physical energy?

Thanks Jennefer, yes we do al ot of physical stuff, we live on a small
acreage with horses, bikes, dogs, we built a climber for him, he is very much a
physical child. I have always had to work to help him find good outlets for that.
Wea re planning to start martial arts this fall, hoping that will help.
<<<<Is this because he is self conscious about his size? >>>>>>>>>>

He has a great attitude about his size, he sometimes gets angry that he can't
move as fast as the little skinny kids, but he can do a lot of powerful stuff
they can't. He has just always had a bit of a quick temper, he hates to be
controlled, I think I was way too controlling when he was little, but have been
changing over that last number of years.

I have worked hard at this for a long time, I think perhaps too hard? I am
really uptight about it, and I think I have come down too tough on him
sometimes, his personality is very sweet and kind, he is very social, and I think other
kids don't understand why he is not the same as other 13-14 year old kids his
size. He is only 8almost9, and it looks like he is just a weird older kid.
I appreciate your reply, Jennefer, we do try to find kids from similar
situations, but they are hard to come by. In our town, there are only 2 other
families of unschoolers that we see, and that is hard to orchestrate sometimes.
tommy doesn't get teased by anyone about his appearance, he is never in that
type of situation. Only one neighborhood kid ever tried that with him, and all
the other kids stuck up for ds, and caused it to end.
Certainly dialoguing about alternatives would be great to do again, I just
have to wait till I am not so upset, or I tend to moralize with him, and get
worked up myself. Yikes, some work to do on myself obviously. This always
happens, when something comes up that is difficult, it turns out ot be me with real
problem, then everything else seems to fall into place.
Thanks again
Nancy in BC



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

jnjstau

<<We are planning on starting martial arts hoping that will help>>>

Just be careful of the instructor you get. I would stay away from
sports karate and focus on old time self-defense. That way your son
will at times be confronted with his anger and will be forced to
learn to control his responses incrementally (if you don't, it tends
to cause pain to your partner....and then its their turn to practice
on you <grin>).

Sports karate uses extreme motion control but doesn't tend to
develop the intra-personal emotional control.

Just my .02

Julie S.---who ran a karate school for 2 years



--- In [email protected], LOWRIEK@a... wrote:
> In a message dated 02/09/2004 10:06:58 Pacific Daylight Time,
> jenneferh2000@y... writes:
>
>
> > Is there a way that you can
> > channel his physical energy?
>
> Thanks Jennefer, yes we do al ot of physical stuff, we live on a
small
> acreage with horses, bikes, dogs, we built a climber for him, he
is very much a
> physical child. I have always had to work to help him find good
outlets for that.
> Wea re planning to start martial arts this fall, hoping that will
help.
> <<<<Is this because he is self conscious about his size? >>>>>>>>>>
>
> He has a great attitude about his size, he sometimes gets angry
that he can't
> move as fast as the little skinny kids, but he can do a lot of
powerful stuff
> they can't. He has just always had a bit of a quick temper, he
hates to be
> controlled, I think I was way too controlling when he was little,
but have been
> changing over that last number of years.
>
> I have worked hard at this for a long time, I think perhaps too
hard? I am
> really uptight about it, and I think I have come down too tough on
him
> sometimes, his personality is very sweet and kind, he is very
social, and I think other
> kids don't understand why he is not the same as other 13-14 year
old kids his
> size. He is only 8almost9, and it looks like he is just a weird
older kid.
> I appreciate your reply, Jennefer, we do try to find kids from
similar
> situations, but they are hard to come by. In our town, there are
only 2 other
> families of unschoolers that we see, and that is hard to
orchestrate sometimes.
> tommy doesn't get teased by anyone about his appearance, he is
never in that
> type of situation. Only one neighborhood kid ever tried that with
him, and all
> the other kids stuck up for ds, and caused it to end.
> Certainly dialoguing about alternatives would be great to do
again, I just
> have to wait till I am not so upset, or I tend to moralize with
him, and get
> worked up myself. Yikes, some work to do on myself obviously. This
always
> happens, when something comes up that is difficult, it turns out
ot be me with real
> problem, then everything else seems to fall into place.
> Thanks again
> Nancy in BC
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]