Patent?
trektheory
Has anyone got any experience with patenting a game/puzzle concept?
My ds has an idea, made a prototype, and ultimately wants to market
this idea. (I think it has possibilities.) But I don't have any
experience in any of this sort of thing, and don't know how best to
guide him.
Linda
My ds has an idea, made a prototype, and ultimately wants to market
this idea. (I think it has possibilities.) But I don't have any
experience in any of this sort of thing, and don't know how best to
guide him.
Linda
Alysia
I used to work as a Patent Examiner for the USPTO. My mother is still there. We were both in chemistry/biology so I can't help you with the technical side but applying is all the same. You can file an application yourself, which is much cheaper, but because of the atmosphere in the office you'll have way more luck getting a patent if you have an agent or attorney. Agenst are generally cheaper because they don't have law degrees and can't give legal advice. They've put a lot of stuff online since I left. I think you can file all your papers electronically now. Check out their website.
I can give you more practical info about the process and what you'll need to do to actually get a patent (which is a lot more complicated than just disclosing your invention).
Alysia
---------------------------------
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
I can give you more practical info about the process and what you'll need to do to actually get a patent (which is a lot more complicated than just disclosing your invention).
Alysia
---------------------------------
Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
trektheory
Thanks for the insider view! I relayed that to my ds (or rather,
showed him, as he is at the 'puter next to me!)
Also, I found some books at the library earlier today, which he curled
up with for a while. Learning new things all the time!
Linda
showed him, as he is at the 'puter next to me!)
Also, I found some books at the library earlier today, which he curled
up with for a while. Learning new things all the time!
Linda
--- In [email protected], Alysia <keetry@...> wrote:
>
> I used to work as a Patent Examiner for the USPTO. My mother is
still there. We were both in chemistry/biology so I can't help you
with the technical side but applying is all the same. You can file an
application yourself, which is much cheaper, but because of the
atmosphere in the office you'll have way more luck getting a patent if
you have an agent or attorney. Agenst are generally cheaper because
they don't have law degrees and can't give legal advice. They've put a
lot of stuff online since I left. I think you can file all your papers
electronically now. Check out their website.
>
> I can give you more practical info about the process and what
you'll need to do to actually get a patent (which is a lot more
complicated than just disclosing your invention).
>
> Alysia
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile.
Try it now.
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
jmarkoski
I believe it was Caren on this or another list that was asking about
patents and we emailed privately and I'll paste here what I emailed
her about. I tried to email you this directly, but your email was
private...
I was discussing your patent question with my husband and had some
more insight. The U.S. is a "first to invent" country with respect
to intellectual property. Some other countries are "first to file".
In the ftf countries, your idea can get "stolen" by someone simply
beating you to the country's patent office. This can't happen in the
U.S and other fti countries, as long as you do basic things to
protect your idea.
The first is documentation. If you have not already done so, write
down as explicitly as possible how and when you came up with this
idea. Your "priority date" won't be that day that you "invented" the
idea, but the day you document it. (As long as your priority date is
before anyone else claiming the same idea, you win out). Make the
document complete, sign it, and have someone (anyone who can
understand the idea) read over it and date and sign it too. For
added oomph, you can have the document notarized.
Now there is the issue of "diligence". This means that you can't
come up with an idea, document it, put it in a drawer and do nothing
for 10 years and sue someone who patents the same idea and makes
money later, even if you had an earlier priority date. The purpose
of the U.S. patent system is to encourage innovation for the
production of products/services that will better our society, so you
get protection, but only on the condition you don't shelve it to look
for an opportunity to prey on someone who went beyond just thinking
about the idea. Diligence means that you are regularly (not
necessarily exhaustively or constantly, but regularly) pursuing your
idea. This could be by refining or making improvements, phone calls
to potential companies to market it, off shoots of the idea, business
contacts, etc. You should document any time you make any forward
progress on the invention or the pursuit of its commercialization or
improvement and always date, sign and witness. As long as you
practice original documentation of the idea and diligence your idea
is protected--until disclosure.
Public disclosure means telling someone (especially an interested
company) about your idea without a non-disclosure agreement (which
would be private). Most companies wouldn't sign a non-disclosure
agreement because of the legal hassle that would arise if they
previously had the same idea. So, a company you approach may listen
to your idea, but not under a secrecy agreement. Once a disclosure
of this nature occurs (or, in science you give a talk at a conference
or write a paper, which is the most common example of public
disclosure), you have ONE YEAR to file a patent. This could be a
cheap short provisional patent filed by you, a patent agent (cheaper
than an attorney), or attorney. After a provisional is filed, you
have one year to file a full patent that would be reviewed by the
USPTO. Provisionals aren't reviewed by the USPTO, they are basically
a placeholder that sets a priority date and provides documentation of
the invention, but as I said above, less formal documentation is just
as powerful as long as you sign, date, and witness everything.
Hopefully this all makes sense. My husband and I would do the
following in your situation:
1. Document your idea as clearly and completely as possible.
Include dates and the reasoning and motivation behind the idea. Date
the document (don't backdate it to when you had the idea--it would be
the first thing that would invalidate your protection if it ever
could be proven). Sign and have a witness read, sign and date. A
patent attorney would ask for any of this documentation if you were
to file anyways, so it'll save you trouble.
2. Keep the idea a secret from everyone to avoid starting the
disclosure clock ticking. You have one year to file a patent from
when you tell someone about it, although competitors and business
folks are the only ones you'd really have to worry about, since they
would be the only ones that may try to invalidate your patent for
breaking that rule.
3. Document all improvements, additions, changes to your idea as
well as dates of disclosure, meetings, any time you read something or
find more information. The easiest thing to do is to have a kind
of "lab notebook" with permanently bound pages (not spiral) and don't
skip or tear out pages. This proves dates, sequentiality, etc for
documentation.
If you approach a company with your idea, as I said before, they
probably won't agree to secrecy, so that would start the one year
clock ticking FOR SURE. Approaching the company with an idea for
their product is a reasonable idea and sometimes is fruitful. Just
have all your documentation and make sure they know how diligent you
have been in your documentation and pursuit--simply be organized. If
they love your idea, they may offer to "buy" it off you by helping
you patent it (where you are listed as an inventor and they are
listed as the owner) and then offering you payment or even a royalty
of x% of sales of the repackaged product.
My husband is named as inventor on over a dozen patents. He has lots
of experience, but we have learned a valuable lesson. Running out to
file a patent before all else is a "rookie mistake" for inventors.
99.5+% of all granted patents don't make any money (doesn't even
include ones filed and not pursued further or those rejected). The
only people getting rich in the patent game are patent lawyers! Most
people don't know any of the above and don't realize that appropriate
documentation and diligence give you just as much protection, without
having to go out on a personal financial limb for something that may
not be marketable or practical or of interest to anyone, etc.
If you go to a patent agent/lawyer, they are naturally going to tell
you to file a patent, their bread and butter. If you take this
route, I wouldn't do more than a provisional before getting better
indications that there are companies interested. You'd then have a
year after a provisional to file a full patent and spend the big $$.
Hope this clears the waters more than muddying them for you,
Julie M
--- In [email protected], "trektheory"
<trektheory@...> wrote:
patents and we emailed privately and I'll paste here what I emailed
her about. I tried to email you this directly, but your email was
private...
I was discussing your patent question with my husband and had some
more insight. The U.S. is a "first to invent" country with respect
to intellectual property. Some other countries are "first to file".
In the ftf countries, your idea can get "stolen" by someone simply
beating you to the country's patent office. This can't happen in the
U.S and other fti countries, as long as you do basic things to
protect your idea.
The first is documentation. If you have not already done so, write
down as explicitly as possible how and when you came up with this
idea. Your "priority date" won't be that day that you "invented" the
idea, but the day you document it. (As long as your priority date is
before anyone else claiming the same idea, you win out). Make the
document complete, sign it, and have someone (anyone who can
understand the idea) read over it and date and sign it too. For
added oomph, you can have the document notarized.
Now there is the issue of "diligence". This means that you can't
come up with an idea, document it, put it in a drawer and do nothing
for 10 years and sue someone who patents the same idea and makes
money later, even if you had an earlier priority date. The purpose
of the U.S. patent system is to encourage innovation for the
production of products/services that will better our society, so you
get protection, but only on the condition you don't shelve it to look
for an opportunity to prey on someone who went beyond just thinking
about the idea. Diligence means that you are regularly (not
necessarily exhaustively or constantly, but regularly) pursuing your
idea. This could be by refining or making improvements, phone calls
to potential companies to market it, off shoots of the idea, business
contacts, etc. You should document any time you make any forward
progress on the invention or the pursuit of its commercialization or
improvement and always date, sign and witness. As long as you
practice original documentation of the idea and diligence your idea
is protected--until disclosure.
Public disclosure means telling someone (especially an interested
company) about your idea without a non-disclosure agreement (which
would be private). Most companies wouldn't sign a non-disclosure
agreement because of the legal hassle that would arise if they
previously had the same idea. So, a company you approach may listen
to your idea, but not under a secrecy agreement. Once a disclosure
of this nature occurs (or, in science you give a talk at a conference
or write a paper, which is the most common example of public
disclosure), you have ONE YEAR to file a patent. This could be a
cheap short provisional patent filed by you, a patent agent (cheaper
than an attorney), or attorney. After a provisional is filed, you
have one year to file a full patent that would be reviewed by the
USPTO. Provisionals aren't reviewed by the USPTO, they are basically
a placeholder that sets a priority date and provides documentation of
the invention, but as I said above, less formal documentation is just
as powerful as long as you sign, date, and witness everything.
Hopefully this all makes sense. My husband and I would do the
following in your situation:
1. Document your idea as clearly and completely as possible.
Include dates and the reasoning and motivation behind the idea. Date
the document (don't backdate it to when you had the idea--it would be
the first thing that would invalidate your protection if it ever
could be proven). Sign and have a witness read, sign and date. A
patent attorney would ask for any of this documentation if you were
to file anyways, so it'll save you trouble.
2. Keep the idea a secret from everyone to avoid starting the
disclosure clock ticking. You have one year to file a patent from
when you tell someone about it, although competitors and business
folks are the only ones you'd really have to worry about, since they
would be the only ones that may try to invalidate your patent for
breaking that rule.
3. Document all improvements, additions, changes to your idea as
well as dates of disclosure, meetings, any time you read something or
find more information. The easiest thing to do is to have a kind
of "lab notebook" with permanently bound pages (not spiral) and don't
skip or tear out pages. This proves dates, sequentiality, etc for
documentation.
If you approach a company with your idea, as I said before, they
probably won't agree to secrecy, so that would start the one year
clock ticking FOR SURE. Approaching the company with an idea for
their product is a reasonable idea and sometimes is fruitful. Just
have all your documentation and make sure they know how diligent you
have been in your documentation and pursuit--simply be organized. If
they love your idea, they may offer to "buy" it off you by helping
you patent it (where you are listed as an inventor and they are
listed as the owner) and then offering you payment or even a royalty
of x% of sales of the repackaged product.
My husband is named as inventor on over a dozen patents. He has lots
of experience, but we have learned a valuable lesson. Running out to
file a patent before all else is a "rookie mistake" for inventors.
99.5+% of all granted patents don't make any money (doesn't even
include ones filed and not pursued further or those rejected). The
only people getting rich in the patent game are patent lawyers! Most
people don't know any of the above and don't realize that appropriate
documentation and diligence give you just as much protection, without
having to go out on a personal financial limb for something that may
not be marketable or practical or of interest to anyone, etc.
If you go to a patent agent/lawyer, they are naturally going to tell
you to file a patent, their bread and butter. If you take this
route, I wouldn't do more than a provisional before getting better
indications that there are companies interested. You'd then have a
year after a provisional to file a full patent and spend the big $$.
Hope this clears the waters more than muddying them for you,
Julie M
--- In [email protected], "trektheory"
<trektheory@...> wrote:
>
> Has anyone got any experience with patenting a game/puzzle concept?
> My ds has an idea, made a prototype, and ultimately wants to market
> this idea. (I think it has possibilities.) But I don't have any
> experience in any of this sort of thing, and don't know how best to
> guide him.
>
> Linda
>