Unschooling Clarification
Marni Hall
I was just reading the 'unschooling myself' post that gave me a lot of
questions. I've heard that definitions of unschooling are different
depending on every person you ask, and I joined this to get more of an idea.
We're new to homeschooling so I'm still deciding where we fit in the whole
spectrum.
Anyway, unschooling doesn't mean just letting your kids go, leaving them to
their own devices entirely does it? Or does it?
Marni
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
questions. I've heard that definitions of unschooling are different
depending on every person you ask, and I joined this to get more of an idea.
We're new to homeschooling so I'm still deciding where we fit in the whole
spectrum.
Anyway, unschooling doesn't mean just letting your kids go, leaving them to
their own devices entirely does it? Or does it?
Marni
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
wisdomalways5
--- In [email protected], "Marni Hall" <marni@...>
wrote:
but the child is in charge of how and where and when they "learn"
Radical unschooling applies this to all areas of life where the
same "trust" is given to eating/ sleeping/ chores/ manners- in other
words to ALL of life
SO yes some people unschool by not using textbooks but letting the
child lead the way but they remain "in charge" of kids so to speak
and still traditionally parent
unschooling in all areas of life is VERY hand on parenting because
there is not a list of RULES to follow or break and be punished for
but chances to learn something. It is working together and finding a
way to meet EVERYONES needs and wants and not just the parents
It means being REAL and not arbitrary- for instance kids will go to
slepp when they are tired and not at an 8:00 bedtime. They will eat
what and when they want to - not just junk but good stuff too. It
means helping out because they can NOT because someone forces them
too.
hope that helps
JulieH
wrote:
>lot of
> I was just reading the 'unschooling myself' post that gave me a
> questions. I've heard that definitions of unschooling aredifferent
> depending on every person you ask, and I joined this to get moreof an idea.
> We're new to homeschooling so I'm still deciding where we fit inthe whole
> spectrum.leaving them to
>
>
>
> Anyway, unschooling doesn't mean just letting your kids go,
> their own devices entirely does it? Or does it?unschooling refers to education without a school or school at home
>
but the child is in charge of how and where and when they "learn"
Radical unschooling applies this to all areas of life where the
same "trust" is given to eating/ sleeping/ chores/ manners- in other
words to ALL of life
SO yes some people unschool by not using textbooks but letting the
child lead the way but they remain "in charge" of kids so to speak
and still traditionally parent
unschooling in all areas of life is VERY hand on parenting because
there is not a list of RULES to follow or break and be punished for
but chances to learn something. It is working together and finding a
way to meet EVERYONES needs and wants and not just the parents
It means being REAL and not arbitrary- for instance kids will go to
slepp when they are tired and not at an 8:00 bedtime. They will eat
what and when they want to - not just junk but good stuff too. It
means helping out because they can NOT because someone forces them
too.
hope that helps
JulieH
Joyce Fetteroll
On Oct 24, 2007, at 10:04 PM, Marni Hall wrote:
Unschooling is the way they learned to speak English. You did things
they enjoyed with them exposed them to new things they might enjoy
and they learned English as a side effect. You didn't -- I assume! --
approach learning English with the attitude "They need to do this or
they won't learn how to speak!" English just got learned organically
by living life with an engaged mom.
Joyce
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> Anyway, unschooling doesn't mean just letting your kids go, leavingNo, of course not.
> them to
> their own devices entirely does it? Or does it?
Unschooling is the way they learned to speak English. You did things
they enjoyed with them exposed them to new things they might enjoy
and they learned English as a side effect. You didn't -- I assume! --
approach learning English with the attitude "They need to do this or
they won't learn how to speak!" English just got learned organically
by living life with an engaged mom.
Joyce
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Debra Rossing
Actually, it means being more involved with the kids, becoming students
of your children. Rather than simply saying "Okay we've done our 2 hours
of 'school' now go play and don't bother me I've got housework to do"
it's full on engagement with them, *including* when you're doing
housework and errands and when they're playing videogames or watching
TV. It's more akin to what you might term "courtship" - back in The Day
when you and your beloved were dating, you wanted to know everything
about that person. You found their likes, dislikes, interests, etc. When
you noticed in the paper that a concert by their favorite artist is
coming to your town, you offer to get tickets. They may say yes, great;
no thanks; or anything in between - it's an offer with no strings
attached simply because you noticed something you thought they might
like. And, you might equally say "Hey I know you like spicy foods. Wanna
try Thai this week?" and see if it's a yes, no, maybe or whatever -
again, no strings, just offering something they might like. And too you
might also say "There's a Renaissance Faire next weekend. I love them
and I'd love to go to this one with you. How about it?" and introduce
your Beloved to something you enjoy. You don't even think twice about it
in that situation. Do the same with your kids - find out what they like
and look for ways to facilitate that, notice things that are similar and
offer them, bring into their orbit things that you like.
Deb
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of your children. Rather than simply saying "Okay we've done our 2 hours
of 'school' now go play and don't bother me I've got housework to do"
it's full on engagement with them, *including* when you're doing
housework and errands and when they're playing videogames or watching
TV. It's more akin to what you might term "courtship" - back in The Day
when you and your beloved were dating, you wanted to know everything
about that person. You found their likes, dislikes, interests, etc. When
you noticed in the paper that a concert by their favorite artist is
coming to your town, you offer to get tickets. They may say yes, great;
no thanks; or anything in between - it's an offer with no strings
attached simply because you noticed something you thought they might
like. And, you might equally say "Hey I know you like spicy foods. Wanna
try Thai this week?" and see if it's a yes, no, maybe or whatever -
again, no strings, just offering something they might like. And too you
might also say "There's a Renaissance Faire next weekend. I love them
and I'd love to go to this one with you. How about it?" and introduce
your Beloved to something you enjoy. You don't even think twice about it
in that situation. Do the same with your kids - find out what they like
and look for ways to facilitate that, notice things that are similar and
offer them, bring into their orbit things that you like.
Deb
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Meredith
--- In [email protected], "Marni Hall" <marni@...>
wrote:
between "telling them what to do" and "leaving them to their own
devices". Some times my kids don't need a whole lot from me -
finding the scissors, making snacks, answering the occasional
question. Other times they need/want a whole lot of interaction.
Playing, facilitating, bouncing ideas (or small objects) off me,
suggesting games or activities or walks or trips or or or....
In some ways its not all that different from what *any* interested,
engaged parent does, except that the kids have Vastly more input
into the process. *Getting* to the point where the kids have that
much input involves a lot of watching and listening and waiting at
first - and most especially not placing judgements like
educational/non-educational or too old/too young for that - or as
someone else suggested, worthwhile/crappy.
Oh, that reminds me of a suggestion I had for the mom who was
looking for things to do with herself - do you like to color? I'm
totally serious! That was one of the "humps" I had to get over,
myself, that its really okay to do "pointlessly childish activities"
(to paraphrase some adult or other from my childhood) for my own
enjoyment. Like coloring.
Getting over that for *myself* helped me step away from making
judgements against what my kids are interested in doing - and *that*
freed us all up to communicate more openly about what we want to be
doing. You wanna watch tv today? Great! You wanna bake six different
kinds of cake? Alright! Wanna learn to juggle fire? Right on!
The "really cool" stuff happens *because* we're open to the
possibility of days or weeks spent watching reruns of Buffy the
Vampire Slayer and Go! Diego Go!
---Meredith (Mo 6, watcing Blues Clues, Ray 14, on his way to use a
bigger, faster computer to play Runescape for six hours or so)
wrote:
> Anyway, unschooling doesn't mean just letting your kids go,leaving them to
> their own devices entirely does it? Or does it?Good heavens no! But there are worlds of possibility in
between "telling them what to do" and "leaving them to their own
devices". Some times my kids don't need a whole lot from me -
finding the scissors, making snacks, answering the occasional
question. Other times they need/want a whole lot of interaction.
Playing, facilitating, bouncing ideas (or small objects) off me,
suggesting games or activities or walks or trips or or or....
In some ways its not all that different from what *any* interested,
engaged parent does, except that the kids have Vastly more input
into the process. *Getting* to the point where the kids have that
much input involves a lot of watching and listening and waiting at
first - and most especially not placing judgements like
educational/non-educational or too old/too young for that - or as
someone else suggested, worthwhile/crappy.
Oh, that reminds me of a suggestion I had for the mom who was
looking for things to do with herself - do you like to color? I'm
totally serious! That was one of the "humps" I had to get over,
myself, that its really okay to do "pointlessly childish activities"
(to paraphrase some adult or other from my childhood) for my own
enjoyment. Like coloring.
Getting over that for *myself* helped me step away from making
judgements against what my kids are interested in doing - and *that*
freed us all up to communicate more openly about what we want to be
doing. You wanna watch tv today? Great! You wanna bake six different
kinds of cake? Alright! Wanna learn to juggle fire? Right on!
The "really cool" stuff happens *because* we're open to the
possibility of days or weeks spent watching reruns of Buffy the
Vampire Slayer and Go! Diego Go!
---Meredith (Mo 6, watcing Blues Clues, Ray 14, on his way to use a
bigger, faster computer to play Runescape for six hours or so)
[email protected]
-----Original Message-----
From: Joyce Fetteroll <jfetteroll@...>
From: Joyce Fetteroll <jfetteroll@...>
On Oct 24, 2007, at 10:04 PM, Marni Hall wrote:
> Anyway, unschooling doesn't mean just letting your kids go, leaving
> them to
> their own devices entirely does it? Or does it?
No, of course not.
Unschooling is the way they learned to speak English. You did things
they enjoyed with them exposed them to new things they might enjoy
and they learned English as a side effect. You didn't -- I assume! --
approach learning English with the attitude "They need to do this or
they won't learn how to speak!" English just got learned organically
by living life with an engaged mom.
Joyce
-=-=-=-=-=-
"English just got learned organically by living a life with an engaged
mom."
And along with this is understanding that the *more* you talked and
listened and engaged, the better the learning. The better the
vocabulary, the better the grammar, the better the comprehension.
Leaving a child is a sterile room and only speaking through a hole in
the wall in "baby talk" and really bad grammar will not have the same
"results" as taking him to interesting places and meeting lots of
chatty people and watching movies with subtitles and rhyming and
playing words games and speaking with silly accents and talking about
why things sound/mean certain ways.
It's not about "teaching" English---it's about USING it. Playing with
it. Engaging in it.
In school, children are "taught" foreign languages the same way
teachers "teach" everything else: sterile and with no context. *You*
may have been taught a foreign language that way! How much do you
remember?
Do any of you actually speak and understand a second language? How did
you learn *that*? With lectures and textbooks and worksheets and
quizzes?
The best way to learn a second language is the same way you learned the
first! By being surrounded by others who speak that language. By asking
simple questions and having them answered in that language. By starting
with small, simple nouns (juice, cookie, store,...beer <g>) and
gradually adding verbs (drink, go, want, find, look) and then adding
adverbs and adjectives. Slowly making full sentences that make more and
more sense. Hearing different words in different contexts and making
those connections. Making mistakes and learning from them with no major
setbacks or embarassments because your "guide" was right there helping
you navigate the language.
Unschooling works the same way. It's not about" teaching" things out of
context because he *might* need them some day or about dropping a ten
year old in Rome, Italy and saying, "Go learn Italian!"
It's about BEing with him and helping him find his way. About being
WITH him and helping him navigate the world. LOTS of input and
assistance.
~Kelly
Kelly Lovejoy
Conference Coordinator
Live and Learn Unschooling Conference
http://www.LiveandLearnConference.org
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Deb
--- In [email protected], "Meredith" <meredith@...>
wrote:
for my hubby to use - don't remember where I ordered from - the
pages were translucent, kind of like baking parchment but not
exactly the same. It was a book of Celtic type patterns (there were
other pattern sets too, I knew he'd like the Celtic patterns) and he
colored them in with some really nice markers that came with it and
I have them hanging in my office windows - need to remove them now
because they're all faded from a couple years of sunlight but when
they were fresh and crisp, they were awesome!
--Deb
wrote:
> Oh, that reminds me of a suggestion I had for the mom who wasA couple years ago I got some really cool coloring books and markers
> looking for things to do with herself - do you like to color? I'm
> totally serious! That was one of the "humps" I had to get over,
> myself, that its really okay to do "pointlessly childish
>activities"
> (to paraphrase some adult or other from my childhood) for my own
> enjoyment. Like coloring.
for my hubby to use - don't remember where I ordered from - the
pages were translucent, kind of like baking parchment but not
exactly the same. It was a book of Celtic type patterns (there were
other pattern sets too, I knew he'd like the Celtic patterns) and he
colored them in with some really nice markers that came with it and
I have them hanging in my office windows - need to remove them now
because they're all faded from a couple years of sunlight but when
they were fresh and crisp, they were awesome!
--Deb
riasplace3
--- In [email protected], "Deb" <debra.rossing@...>
wrote:
- don't remember where I ordered from - the
somewhere, but I can't find it. It should be easy to google, though.
Ria
wrote:
- don't remember where I ordered from - the
> pages were translucent, kind of like baking parchment but notThat sounds like Dover...I thought I had their web site saved here
> exactly the same.
somewhere, but I can't find it. It should be easy to google, though.
Ria
Debra Rossing
Could be but I don't think I ordered directly from them - we get SO many
cool catalogs, it could have been in any one of them
Deb
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cool catalogs, it could have been in any one of them
Deb
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guideforthree
--- In [email protected], "riasplace3" <riasplace3@...>
wrote:
Michael's and Hobby Lobby also carry them.
Tina
wrote:
>www.mindwareonline.com also has these types of coloring books.
> --- In [email protected], "Deb" <debra.rossing@>
> wrote:
>
> - don't remember where I ordered from - the
> > pages were translucent, kind of like baking parchment but not
> > exactly the same.
>
> That sounds like Dover...I thought I had their web site saved here
> somewhere, but I can't find it. It should be easy to google, though.
> Ria
>
Michael's and Hobby Lobby also carry them.
Tina