Re:question about limits---thanks and more questions!
Elly Winner
thanks for all the responses!
i guess i knew it could happen to one food---i made myself sick of
donuts for almost 10 years when i sold them for the lit mag in high
school (not anymore! i LOVED krispy kreams when pregnant with my
daughter!). and i actually DON'T gorge on M&Ms, oddly enough, but i
think i might on hershey's kisses. ;)
it's good to hear that we old folks ;) can catch up and learn to eat
without limits, too.
i'm still not clear on how to (or even really whether to) bring TV
into our lives.
oh, and i had one other limits question. what do you do when your kids
want everything they see? it'd almost be easier if we didn't have any
money to spend. we're not rolling in dough, IYKWIM, but we're doing
okay, and i can't honestly say we can't spend more than $X amount on
toys in a given month. at the same time, on behalf of our savings
account and our food and entertainment fund, i don't feel that i can
buy *everything* my daughter asks for. the kids aren't short on toys
at all, and in fact have something on the order of 8 dolls alone, but
my daughter really wants the doll (literally all but identical to the
one she has at home---i think that under the clothes of the one she
has at home there is printed the name of the doll, and the one at the
store doesn't have it printed there---but it is the same brand etc!)
that she plays with when we visit the toy store. (i suggested to her
that what she might really be interested in with that doll is the
clothes she has, and that perhaps we could make some clothes for her
doll so she could dress her up, but she disagreed and said, no, it was
the other doll she wanted.)
she also wants nearly every toy she touches at other folks' houses.
i'd like to let go of making the toy-buying decisions for her but am
not clear on how to avoid either a) giving her a budget (which would
by necessity have to be "manufactured"---i don't give myself a
clothing budget, for example, i just self-regulate---if i purchase a
lot one month, i don't for the next little while) or b) buying
everything we see (which would not only blow a lot of $ we could use
for other things, but also make a huge amount of clutter; we've
already found it necessary to put some less-used toys in the basement
to make space for playing with the ones that are out). is it time for
allowance? do other unschoolers do allowance?
we've talked about why she wants one toy or the other, and what
similar things she has at home, and how she would play with the new
toy, and at what point she would not feel that she needed another of
whatever item X, say, and we've talked about how her dad works to make
money for us to use for our house and our food and our clothes and our
toys (etc), and that if we spend money on one thing, there will be
less to use for other things, but it seems like it's too early to
introduce her to our household budget via microsoft money---she's
still fuzzy on quantities greater than 4. ;)
pardon my incoherence; it's been a tough day. thanks in advance for
all your thoughtful answers, and for helping us wander our way towards
full unschooling.
elly
i guess i knew it could happen to one food---i made myself sick of
donuts for almost 10 years when i sold them for the lit mag in high
school (not anymore! i LOVED krispy kreams when pregnant with my
daughter!). and i actually DON'T gorge on M&Ms, oddly enough, but i
think i might on hershey's kisses. ;)
it's good to hear that we old folks ;) can catch up and learn to eat
without limits, too.
i'm still not clear on how to (or even really whether to) bring TV
into our lives.
oh, and i had one other limits question. what do you do when your kids
want everything they see? it'd almost be easier if we didn't have any
money to spend. we're not rolling in dough, IYKWIM, but we're doing
okay, and i can't honestly say we can't spend more than $X amount on
toys in a given month. at the same time, on behalf of our savings
account and our food and entertainment fund, i don't feel that i can
buy *everything* my daughter asks for. the kids aren't short on toys
at all, and in fact have something on the order of 8 dolls alone, but
my daughter really wants the doll (literally all but identical to the
one she has at home---i think that under the clothes of the one she
has at home there is printed the name of the doll, and the one at the
store doesn't have it printed there---but it is the same brand etc!)
that she plays with when we visit the toy store. (i suggested to her
that what she might really be interested in with that doll is the
clothes she has, and that perhaps we could make some clothes for her
doll so she could dress her up, but she disagreed and said, no, it was
the other doll she wanted.)
she also wants nearly every toy she touches at other folks' houses.
i'd like to let go of making the toy-buying decisions for her but am
not clear on how to avoid either a) giving her a budget (which would
by necessity have to be "manufactured"---i don't give myself a
clothing budget, for example, i just self-regulate---if i purchase a
lot one month, i don't for the next little while) or b) buying
everything we see (which would not only blow a lot of $ we could use
for other things, but also make a huge amount of clutter; we've
already found it necessary to put some less-used toys in the basement
to make space for playing with the ones that are out). is it time for
allowance? do other unschoolers do allowance?
we've talked about why she wants one toy or the other, and what
similar things she has at home, and how she would play with the new
toy, and at what point she would not feel that she needed another of
whatever item X, say, and we've talked about how her dad works to make
money for us to use for our house and our food and our clothes and our
toys (etc), and that if we spend money on one thing, there will be
less to use for other things, but it seems like it's too early to
introduce her to our household budget via microsoft money---she's
still fuzzy on quantities greater than 4. ;)
pardon my incoherence; it's been a tough day. thanks in advance for
all your thoughtful answers, and for helping us wander our way towards
full unschooling.
elly
Deb
You don't need spreadsheets and budgeting software to explain the
concepts - for us it was Kid's Meals at Burger King. "That toy costs
the same as 3 kid's meals. We can get that now but we'd need to skip
Burger King a few times until next pay day. Or we can get something
that costs less and still do some Burger King" (that is, when Burger
King was a two or three times a week lunch as DH and DS headed to
DH's part time job after going to park days and such). Sometimes,
the toy was the priority and they brown bagged lunches. Sometimes,
the prospect of PBJ and juice boxes wasn't so much fun so the toy
was noted and postponed a little. It's not so much big numbers as it
is a concept of money comes in and has to pay for this and this and
this and that. When I'd pay bills, DS would often sit and be the
stamper (thank heaven for whomever invented the self-adhesive
postage stamp!) and put the return address labels on. We'd look at
the little bar graph of electricity usage and see where we used lots
and where we used less. I'd talk about how I was paying the bank for
the house or the oil company for the oil to heat the house or
whatever. Not lots of numbers and details but the general idea that
I get paid for my work and then the money gets used for all these
things we like to have - house, food, vehicles with fuel to go
places, and so on. Over time, it's gotten more detailed as he's
gotten older and wanted to know "how much does oil cost?" (now
there's a loaded question for you lol). It helps too that he's got
his own spending money free and clear - we pay that when I get paid
just like any other 'bill'. He knows he has x amount of 'income' and
he figures that into what he wants to get and when.
--Deb
concepts - for us it was Kid's Meals at Burger King. "That toy costs
the same as 3 kid's meals. We can get that now but we'd need to skip
Burger King a few times until next pay day. Or we can get something
that costs less and still do some Burger King" (that is, when Burger
King was a two or three times a week lunch as DH and DS headed to
DH's part time job after going to park days and such). Sometimes,
the toy was the priority and they brown bagged lunches. Sometimes,
the prospect of PBJ and juice boxes wasn't so much fun so the toy
was noted and postponed a little. It's not so much big numbers as it
is a concept of money comes in and has to pay for this and this and
this and that. When I'd pay bills, DS would often sit and be the
stamper (thank heaven for whomever invented the self-adhesive
postage stamp!) and put the return address labels on. We'd look at
the little bar graph of electricity usage and see where we used lots
and where we used less. I'd talk about how I was paying the bank for
the house or the oil company for the oil to heat the house or
whatever. Not lots of numbers and details but the general idea that
I get paid for my work and then the money gets used for all these
things we like to have - house, food, vehicles with fuel to go
places, and so on. Over time, it's gotten more detailed as he's
gotten older and wanted to know "how much does oil cost?" (now
there's a loaded question for you lol). It helps too that he's got
his own spending money free and clear - we pay that when I get paid
just like any other 'bill'. He knows he has x amount of 'income' and
he figures that into what he wants to get and when.
--Deb
Pamela Sorooshian
On Sep 19, 2007, at 6:15 PM, Elly Winner wrote:
want everything they see. What you mean is they seem to want lots and
lots of things, often things they hadn't thought of wanting until
they saw them, right?
It sounds like nitpicking over language, but how we think about our
kids makes a HUGE difference in how we perceive what they're doing
and, very often, changing our own perspective a little can help us
see solutions.
There is a lot more to your post, but I just wanted to mention that
changing our own internal thinking is a very very powerful tool. It
helps us in our parenting if we can eliminate all those commonly-said
things about children that have a slight derogatory ring to them.
-pam
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> oh, and i had one other limits question. what do you do when your kidsStart with being careful how you think of it - they don't "really"
> want everything they see?
want everything they see. What you mean is they seem to want lots and
lots of things, often things they hadn't thought of wanting until
they saw them, right?
It sounds like nitpicking over language, but how we think about our
kids makes a HUGE difference in how we perceive what they're doing
and, very often, changing our own perspective a little can help us
see solutions.
There is a lot more to your post, but I just wanted to mention that
changing our own internal thinking is a very very powerful tool. It
helps us in our parenting if we can eliminate all those commonly-said
things about children that have a slight derogatory ring to them.
-pam
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Wildflower Car
>Start with being careful how you think of it - they don't "really"Hey, that is a really great point! I will remember that. My kids do seem like they want everything they see in a toy store or electronic store sometimes, but they certainly don't want to fill the basket in the canned vegetable isle at the store! (And just for the record, neither do I, I just don't like canned vegtables!)
>want everything they see. What you mean is they seem to want lots and
>lots of things, often things they hadn't thought of wanting until
>they saw them, right?
Wildflower
_________________________________________________________________
Can you find the hidden words? Take a break and play Seekadoo!
http://club.live.com/seekadoo.aspx?icid=seek_wlmailtextlink
Meredith
--- In [email protected], Kendrah Nilsestuen <carebear-
79@...> wrote:
didn't jump in whole-hog right from the start. If anything, I started
out saying "these people are Nuts!" but then trying one little
suggestion here, softening up a little there, getting more and more
comfortable and confident that this wacky alternative to conventional
parenting really did have some merit to it....
Now I'm one of the Nuts and fine with that ;)
---Meredith (Mo 6, Ray 13)
79@...> wrote:
>IThis can be true for so many aspects of unschooling - I certainly
> can't really explain it but I had a mental shift somewhere along the
> way where I decided the TV was not a big deal. It was a HUGE mental
> shift for me. Not one that happened overnight.
didn't jump in whole-hog right from the start. If anything, I started
out saying "these people are Nuts!" but then trying one little
suggestion here, softening up a little there, getting more and more
comfortable and confident that this wacky alternative to conventional
parenting really did have some merit to it....
Now I'm one of the Nuts and fine with that ;)
---Meredith (Mo 6, Ray 13)
sylvia057
--- In [email protected], "Meredith" <meredith@...> wrote:
Sylvia>
> Now I'm one of the Nuts and fine with that ;)You are NOT nuts and you've helped me more than you can know!
>
> ---Meredith (Mo 6, Ray 13)
Sylvia>