Elly

hi all,

i'm mostly a lurker here with two little ones (my son is 1 and my daughter just turned 4),
and love reading everyone's posts. in part thanks you guys, over the last couple of months
we've successfully and happily moved to unschooling bedtimes. everyone is much happier
about sleep these days. thank goodness! please help me further along on our journey into
unschooling with my latest question about----limits!

hah! i know the right answer (before i even ask the question) is "none", but bear with me.
i'd really like to 'unschool' food, for example, but realistically, it would be bad for *me*, as
would unschooling tv. i can buy that kids who grow up with full access to everything would
learn to self-regulate really well, but i'm pretty sure that i would balloon out if there were
always candy and chips and cookies in my house (it happens when i go on vacation; i love
food, including desserts and chips and etc). not that we don't eat "treat" foods sometimes
(we just had both fries and cake tonight!), but just that we don't have them around all the
time; we fill the refrigerator with what i guess i'd call "whole foods"---the raw ingredients
with which to make a lot of things. we don't buy much processed food, and usually DIY our
treats. i'd prefer not to have them around nonstop, though. *i* wasn't unschooled around
food, and i know i gain weight when those foods are always available, especially processed
foods that i buy in packages and don't make myself. i can't be the only one with this
problem, can i? i'm not overweight currently, but man, if there were delicious chocolate
bars, ice creams, cakes and donuts available nonstop, i might well be (seriously, i think i
could never get sick of chocolate!). what do people do??

i feel the same about t.v.. i'm so much happier in my life when i don't watch it. i find more
time to do so many more things that feel to me more valuable and more productive (i can
already hear the responses, but again, bear with me!). i sew more, knit more, crochet
more, read more, talk with my husband and friends more, create more... and just feel
better at the end of the day if i haven't spent it sitting and staring at the t.v.. maybe i use it
poorly, whatever. but if it's on (if dh is watching it, for instance) i usually end up watching
it, too. we're so happy right now (kids and i) with our life---doing, building, playing,
running, going outside, etc, that i'm loathe to add t.v. to it. i seriously watch NO t.v. by
myself, so don't even know how to introduce it in a natural way (there is a t.v. sitting in
our living room, but it's behind a pile of stuff we actually use). dh watches sports every
once in a while, and the kids see it, but aren't particularly interested as of yet. but
seriously, watching football seems like it's designed to be boring ;) so i'm not surprised
she's not interested. but she doesn't even know there are cartoons etc on, because i just
haven't turned them on for her (i don't even know what there are and when and on what
channel); we do other things. is it bad not to introduce it? i guess the policy i'd like to take
is "if my daughter asks about it and wants to use it, she's welcome to, but i don't feel like
introducing it to her". is that just disguised withholding? any other low-tv unschooling
households?

thanks for your thoughts!

elly

Joyce Fetteroll

On Sep 18, 2007, at 10:34 PM, Elly wrote:

> but i'm pretty sure that i would balloon out if there were
> always candy and chips and cookies in my house

I was pretty sure of that too. In fact I had good solid evidence that
I couldn't stop once I started by polishing off 3 bags of Halloween
candy before Halloween ;-) I would often eat entire rows of Oreos
from the package, then of course feel yucky a little later and swear
I'd never have another, then later in the day have more.

But what I had evidence of is how I reacted to limits. When anything
we like is doled out and controlled it becomes greatly desired and we
want to get as much as we can before the limits return.

Give yourself permission to have as much as you want. Tell yourself
that when the bag is gone, you can have two more bags. I guarantee
you'll get tired of it. It took me 3 bags of almond M&Ms but I can
pass a bag in the store with no interest at all. In fact Dunkin'
Donuts is so well aware of that phenomenon that their employees are
allowed to have as many donuts as they want. They know that after a
couple of days they won't want any at all ;-)

We now have a constant supply of Ghirardelli chocolate bits in the
freezer and Dove miniatures and I might have one Dove a day. (After I
dip into the bits a couple of times, it makes me wonder if it's
almost time for my period and almost always it is ;-) Otherwise it
doesn't even occur to me that they're there.)

> if my daughter asks about it and wants to use it, she's welcome to,
> but i don't feel like
> introducing it to her"
>

What if someone made the above statement about books? Would it sound
reasonable?

While it's been said recently that it's possible to unschool without
TV (or libraries or the internet or bulldozers or trips to France),
if we're withholding part of life from kids because of our own issues
with it, it needs to be examined.

I don't remember my daughter watching much at 4. Videos occasionally.
By the time she was 7, though, she definitely was into Pokemon and
that has fueled friendships and creativity that still impacts her
life today at 16. (She just met another 16 yo girl who enjoys playing
the Pokemon games and she's absolutely delighted :-) She began
drawing comics based on Pokemon (one that originally was a direct
ripoff is still going on), and now has, she estimates, over 1000
pages of comics.

> and just feel
> better at the end of the day if i haven't spent it sitting and
> staring at the t.v.
>
Again, what if it were reading books? Would you ban books and ban
your daughter from books?

If you're choosing to do something that you don't want to do, then
there are other issues than TV. TV *is* an easy way to relax. But
it's not TV's fault if you're stressed! I used to watch TV after
school and after working. It does take energy to be creative.

I huge boon to being more selective about TV is TiVo (or other DVR).
You can set it to record only the programs you like and then watch
just those when you choose.

One problem with TV and kids is their own feeling that they're slaves
to the programming schedule. The kids need to watch now while a
program is on since they can't watch later. What helped is putting a
tape in to record a show so we could do something else during that
time. Often, since she had the option of watching it anytime she
wanted, she didn't watch the tape at all.

> i seriously watch NO t.v. by
> myself, so don't even know how to introduce it in a natural way
>

How do you introduce books? You find shows you think she'll like and
watch some with her.

Joyce

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

carenkh

--- In [email protected], Joyce Fetteroll
<jfetteroll@...> wrote:
>

> But what I had evidence of is how I reacted to limits. <snip>
>
> Give yourself permission to have as much as you want.

I second this. My "inner child" has grown right along with my own
kids, in terms of realizing "You really are free. It is *really* up to
you." When I'm in a not-so-good space, I'll be reaching for the Krispy
Kremes and junk until I feel *awful*, but that has happened less and
less as I've gained more and more self-worth. Just like my house - I
take care of it now because *I* deserve a peaceful, welcoming space -
not because I think I "should" keep it tidy. It's been a long process
of growth - it certainly hasn't happened overnight! But well worth
giving myself those freedoms, and trusting it would all be OK.

peace,
Caren

Debra Rossing

Elly

Oddly enough, by not limiting our DS (he's 9, never had food limits,
"good food"/"bad food", etc), DH and I have been able to (mostly)
improve the way we eat. Simply by learning from DS and providing
information to him as he asks ("what does potassium do?" "what
<nutritionally> is in ice cream?" and so on). We've seen him *consider*
whether he wants another ice pop or another chocolate or another <fill
in the blank>. Something totally unforeseen happened in our house: when
DH and I married, a half gallon of ice cream would be gone in a matter
of days. A few years ago, we realized that the ice cream in the freezer
had actually gone 'bad' all ice crusted and nasty - and it's happened
more than once since, so instead of being a standard item, ice cream is
now on a request basis - if someone wants some, we get it. How in the
world did that happen? We didn't have it off limits, we ate it whenever
we wanted it, BUT since we didn't have limits on it and we could have it
whenever, we consciously CHOSE when/whether to eat it or not. Instead of
mindlessly just grabbing a big bowl of ice cream after dinner because it
was there, we'd consider if we wanted it, how much we wanted, whether we
might want to wait a bit before having any, and even IF the others in
the household had some, I might not (or I might and DH might not or DH
and I might have some and DS might not). We've been re-learning how to
eat by listening to our own selves because that's how kids are designed
from the get go and it doesn't change if they are able to freely,
without the mental baggage most of us adults have, choose what and when
and how to eat. We don't simply pile in the sweets and chips (they're
expensive!) but we don't avoid them if someone wants some. We also make
much of what we eat from basic ingredients ourselves BUT if DH wants
chips or DS wants a particular type of snack cake or I want some ice
cream, we add it to the shopping list. We compare ingredients and try to
make the best choice we can ... and sometimes we just buy the Twinkies
because that's what we want. We've got two packages of DS' favorite
organic chocolate creme filled "Oreo" substitutes (he likes them better
than Oreos because he says the creme is creamier). They've been in the
cupboard, unopened, for about a month or so now. Not hidden, not
limited, not tucked away somewhere, one package in plain sight in a
glass fronted cabinet (the other in the pantry closet which DS is in and
out of regularly). It's just that no one has wanted to eat them
recently. And that's okay. They'll keep. At other times, packages of the
very self-same cookies have been gone in two or three days. And that's
okay too.

So, I guess what I'm long windedly saying is that you CAN re-learn how
to listen to your self regarding how you eat by learning from your kids
who've never NOT known that at this point. It's a choice - you can learn
from them to better tune to yourself or they can learn from you that
there are "Good" foods and "Bad" foods and if you eat the 'Bad' foods
then you "lack willpower" or whatever. By providing information to your
kids as they grow, you'll be learning too. I've spent many a long 10 or
15 minutes at the pasta sauce aisle as DS checked *every* brand of sauce
for the one with the least sodium (DH is hypertensive) and that had the
least sugar added and no HFCS. Didn't have to. BUT he knows that sodium
is not good for DH's blood pressure (unless it's balanced by potassium)
and too much sugar is not great for me and HFCS is generally not a great
thing (nor is MSG). It's not something he HAS TO do, as a 'lesson' or
something. It's something he's seen us model over time, something we've
talked about as he raised questions. So now, we get comments from others
on how well versed in nutrition DS is and what a wide palate he has
(from mac & cheese to sushi) and how did we 'get' him to eat broccoli
(or whatever). We didn't - it was available for him to choose; stuff he
likes, he eats, stuff he doesn't want, he doesn't eat. If we had
something new, he could taste a bite from my plate and decide if he
wanted any on his plate. His choice. Pretty simple if you ask me.

Oh, BTW, I'm a recently diagnosed type 2 diabetic so I *could* easily
rationalize limiting everything coming into the house to stuff that is
okay for me to eat (no sweets, limited types of carbs, etc). I don't -
it's *my Choice* of what to eat and how much, some choices are better
and some not as good, but it's not a "rule", it's a "Choice" and that
makes all the difference. If I thought "I *can't* have that" it would
develop an instant allure (IME YMMV) but if I think "I choose not to
have that right now" it's no big deal - I might choose it later, I might
not. And what my best choice is should NOT dictate what everyone around
me can choose to eat.

Deb

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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[email protected]

I have a challenge for you:

Go to Sam's and buy 20 of the biggest bags of M&Ms you can find. Pour
two bags in a large bowl that you keep in the den or foyer. Keep the
other 18 bags in a drawer. Eat as many as you want---NO GUILT!!! Eat
'em--as much as you want, any time you want. All day. Every day. Eat
M&Ms instead of breakfast. Instead of lunch. Instead of supper. Refill
before the giant bowl gets empty---Never EVER let it get empty!

I GUARANTEE you will eventually avoid them.

I do.

I thought it was impossible.

Now...JellyBelly jellybeans are a different story. I *still* love
those! <G> I need to fill another bottomless bowl with them! <BWG>

But having M&Ms available at all times has made them less
"magical"---and even *all* chocolate! Not that I don't eat it any more.
I do, but the immediate "need" I used to have for chocolate is gone.
The passion/need/desire is gone. The scarcity doesn't exist. I have a
abundance of chocolate. More than I can ever eat.

It's changed my life. Seriously. It's changed how I look at a lot of
things.

Ben used to wang out about how much the boys liked McDonald's. I took
them there a lot when they were little. Neither chooses McD's much any
more---nor much fast food at all. They have much more sophisticated
(and expensive! <G>) tastes. Sometimes I wish they would choose
cheapMcDs instead of the sushi places they love now! <G> Easier on my
pocketbook!

It's also fascinating to watch visitors when they see the bottomless
M&M bowl. Not just children, who are amazed! But the adults too, who
"sneak" a handful here and there. <G> It's as if it's
"off-limits"---It's NOT, but that's how they act.

So...that's my challenge. Are you up for it? Do you trust me?

~Kelly

Kelly Lovejoy
Conference Coordinator
Live and Learn Unschooling Conference
http://www.LiveandLearnConference.org

________________________________________________________________________
Email and AIM finally together. You've gotta check out free AOL Mail! -
http://mail.aol.com

Meredith

--- In [email protected], "Elly" <ellyzoe@...> wrote:
>> i'd prefer not to have them around nonstop, though. *i* wasn't
unschooled around
> food, and i know i gain weight when those foods are always
available, especially processed
> foods that i buy in packages and don't make myself. i can't be the
only one with this
> problem, can i? i'm not overweight currently, but man, if there
were delicious chocolate
> bars, ice creams, cakes and donuts available nonstop, i might well
be (seriously, i think i
> could never get sick of chocolate!). what do people do??

One thing that helps is to own your issues as yours, not your kids' -
that's where a Lot of parents get stuck in deschooling limits of
all kinds. I'm afraid that *I* would xyz, so I'm doubly afraid my
kids will be the same way. Several others have talked about that, so
I'm going to go in a different direction....

Something that may help you right now is understanding that "full
autonomy" for a one yr old looks very very different from autonomy
for a 4yo and both of those look very very different from a 10yo or
a teen.

For a kid who is just starting to be mobile, autonomy around food
has more to do with food-on-demand (whether nursing or other or some
combination) and a chance to explore foods to the extent that he
wants. Its still totally possible with a baby or toddler to have
almost entirely healthy options available without there being any
sense of "limits" on the part of the child.

A 4yo, though, is going to be substantially more aware of her
environment. Even without a tv, if you take her shopping, its
possible she'll be wanting to try lots of things she sees based on
the attractivenss of the packaging. That's where unschooling food
gets tricky for many many parents - OMG my kids want to eat "junk
food"!!! Even then, its possible to say "yes" to many foods and
still have more nutritious options around. One of the "tricks" for
leveling the playing field, as it were, is to make sure those
nutritious options are just as attractive and convenient as packaged
foods.

Strategies for unschooling food with a 4yo include putting effort in
presentation, creating easy-to-grab small portions, making mixed
platters for sampling, and arranging shelves, etc so the child has
easy access to foods all the time.

> we fill the refrigerator with what i guess i'd call "whole foods"--
-the raw ingredients
> with which to make a lot of things. we don't buy much processed
food, and usually DIY our
> treats.

One thing to check for is availability. Can your 4yo, in particular,
go and grab a bite *right now* without having to ask - or if she
likes to ask, without having to wait while you prepare something?
There's an autonomy check. Can she grab a bite of something that's
not only good for her but appealing in color, texture and shape?
Those are important considerations for young children, in
particular, and can effect their sense of autonomy around food.

The nuts and bolts of this issue is something that gets rather more
discussion over on Always Unschooled, with its focus on younger
children, so I'm tossing out a link to that group, if you're
intereseted:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AlwaysUnschooled

> i feel the same about t.v.. i'm so much happier in my life when i
don't watch it.

George and I had no tv for years before we had Mo, and only
videos/dvds until almost a year ago. I'm happy to report the
satellite dish not only hasn't ruined our life, but enriched it far
more than we expected.

I was content to go the "don't offer don't refuse" route with her
wrt tv, but my stepson moving in changed the dynamics. I've ended up
wishing we'd gotten the satellite sooner. Although I don't think Mo
felt any sense of lack when we didn't have it, she clearly gets a
whole lot of enjoyment and learning from watching tv, and has more
autonomy wrt what she's going to watch at any given time (including
nothing at all!). TV is a vastly useful resource for kids who don't
read, kids who are really visual, kids who are really verbal, kids
who are interested in *everything*, kids who like a lot of
repetition, kids who like to explore and kids who like to snuggle,
among others ;) I'm now just as amazed at my own previous stance
about tv as if I'd never taken my child to a library or zoo or
museum bc "she hasn't asked for it yet".

---Meredith (Mo 6, Ray 13 for a few more days!)

Melissa

Amen! I can honestly say I have not gained weight since we went
limitless. I am slightly overweight, however, from ten years of
'sneaking treats'! Because I could never just eat my fill and be done
with it, I eventually ate more and more, because I never felt like I
got what I needed! This after a childhood of never being allowed
treats of any sort. My kids have no limits, and while I had to work
through my own issues, it wasn't fair to create additional ones for
them because of mine.
Same for the TV. I have seven kids, who go through stages. Sometimes
we watch a lot of TV, sometimes we don't. When I finally allowed
myself to sit and watch a show without 'shoulding' myself to death
about chores, more intellectual things, etc, I could ENJOY the show,
and then reach a point where it wasn't appealing. Again coming from a
childhood where TV was limited.
Melissa
Mom to Josh (12), Breanna (10), Emily (8), Rachel (7), Sam (6), Dan
(4), and Avari Rose (19 months)

share our lives at
http://360.yahoo.com/multimomma



On Sep 19, 2007, at 9:44 AM, kbcdlovejo@... wrote:

> I have a challenge for you:
>
> Go to Sam's and buy 20 of the biggest bags of M&Ms you can find. Pour
> two bags in a large bowl that you keep in the den or foyer. Keep the
> other 18 bags in a drawer. Eat as many as you want---NO GUILT!!! Eat
> 'em--as much as you want, any time you want. All day. Every day. Eat
> M&Ms instead of breakfast. Instead of lunch. Instead of supper. Refill
> before the giant bowl gets empty---Never EVER let it get empty!
>
> I GUARANTEE you will eventually avoid them.
>
> I do.
>
> I thought it was impossible.
>
> .
>
>



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

rn9302000

LOL.......this reminds me of something.
Beginning of summer back in June the kids and I were at BJ's ( its
like Sams Club) and they spotted this giant box of giant sized pixie
sticks, they wanted it, so I got it.........hubby was appalled "omg
you can't let them have all those pixie sticks, thats crazy, why did
you get that"
me " they will not eat them all in one day you will see"
so in the beginning they were having fun with the giant pixie sticks
wanted a couple a day........they would bring some along for friends
when we would go to the beach........

so hubby decided he had to "hide" the pixie sticks, my 7 yo being the
clever child that she is showed me where "daddy hid the pixie
sticks"........LOL........
the pixie sticks are still where daddy hid them and the kids get one
when they want it ( they both know where the box is), which now is not
even one pixie stick a week, its more like one a MONTH.........so to
me it just proves what I didn't think would happen either. I was
skeptical in the past, ( I admit it) and have loosened up completely
to absolutely no limits or rules about food at all.
We have healthy food in the house, we eat healthy meals, but I do let
the kids have things they want, they shop with me, so they can pick
things out. Last night we had "breakfast for dinner", so they wanted
cookie crisp cereal, which we had none in the house, so since i needed
other stuff for the meal I also got them the cookie crisp cereal. so
yep they eat cookie crisp cereal, and they will also eat raisen
bran.......they get to choose.
Diane















--- In [email protected], kbcdlovejo@... wrote:
>
> I have a challenge for you:
>
> Go to Sam's and buy 20 of the biggest bags of M&Ms you can find. Pour
> two bags in a large bowl that you keep in the den or foyer. Keep the
> other 18 bags in a drawer. Eat as many as you want---NO GUILT!!! Eat
> 'em--as much as you want, any time you want. All day. Every day. Eat
> M&Ms instead of breakfast. Instead of lunch. Instead of supper. Refill
> before the giant bowl gets empty---Never EVER let it get empty!
>
> I GUARANTEE you will eventually avoid them.
>
> I do.
>
> I thought it was impossible.
>
> Now...JellyBelly jellybeans are a different story. I *still* love
> those! <G> I need to fill another bottomless bowl with them! <BWG>
>
> But having M&Ms available at all times has made them less
> "magical"---and even *all* chocolate! Not that I don't eat it any more.
> I do, but the immediate "need" I used to have for chocolate is gone.
> The passion/need/desire is gone. The scarcity doesn't exist. I have a
> abundance of chocolate. More than I can ever eat.
>
> It's changed my life. Seriously. It's changed how I look at a lot of
> things.
>
> Ben used to wang out about how much the boys liked McDonald's. I took
> them there a lot when they were little. Neither chooses McD's much any
> more---nor much fast food at all. They have much more sophisticated
> (and expensive! <G>) tastes. Sometimes I wish they would choose
> cheapMcDs instead of the sushi places they love now! <G> Easier on my
> pocketbook!
>
> It's also fascinating to watch visitors when they see the bottomless
> M&M bowl. Not just children, who are amazed! But the adults too, who
> "sneak" a handful here and there. <G> It's as if it's
> "off-limits"---It's NOT, but that's how they act.
>
> So...that's my challenge. Are you up for it? Do you trust me?
>
> ~Kelly
>
> Kelly Lovejoy
> Conference Coordinator
> Live and Learn Unschooling Conference
> http://www.LiveandLearnConference.org
>
> ________________________________________________________________________
> Email and AIM finally together. You've gotta check out free AOL Mail! -
> http://mail.aol.com
>

Emilie

I love your idea!
The problem is...I can't stand M&Ms! I'm a total snob about
chocolate, but I also seem to have a deep and ongoing need for lots
of it. If I could afford it, which unfortunately, I can't, do you
think this would work with really good chocolate? I have noticed that
good dark chocolate seems to self regulate. But I can eat seemingly
endless quantities of good milk chocolate without ever feeling sick
of it. Now I know many think milk chocolate can never high quality,
so I am not trying to spark that debate. But I am wondering a lot
lately about boosting natural self regulation of foods in adults. Any
more ideas?

Emilie (Felicity 6, Cecilia 3, Charlotte 1)

At 10:44 AM 19/09/2007, you wrote:

>I have a challenge for you:
>
>Go to Sam's and buy 20 of the biggest bags of M&Ms you can find. Pour
>two bags in a large bowl that you keep in the den or foyer. Keep the
>other 18 bags in a drawer. Eat as many as you want---NO GUILT!!! Eat
>'em--as much as you want, any time you want. All day. Every day. Eat
>M&Ms instead of breakfast. Instead of lunch. Instead of supper. Refill
>before the giant bowl gets empty---Never EVER let it get empty!
>
>I GUARANTEE you will eventually avoid them.
>
>I do.
>
>I thought it was impossible.
>
>Now...JellyBelly jellybeans are a different story. I *still* love
>those! <G> I need to fill another bottomless bowl with them! <BWG>
>
>But having M&Ms available at all times has made them less
>"magical"---and even *all* chocolate! Not that I don't eat it any more.
>I do, but the immediate "need" I used to have for chocolate is gone.
>The passion/need/desire is gone. The scarcity doesn't exist. I have a
>abundance of chocolate. More than I can ever eat.
>
>It's changed my life. Seriously. It's changed how I look at a lot of
>things.
>
>Ben used to wang out about how much the boys liked McDonald's. I took
>them there a lot when they were little. Neither chooses McD's much any
>more---nor much fast food at all. They have much more sophisticated
>(and expensive! <G>) tastes. Sometimes I wish they would choose
>cheapMcDs instead of the sushi places they love now! <G> Easier on my
>pocketbook!
>
>It's also fascinating to watch visitors when they see the bottomless
>M&M bowl. Not just children, who are amazed! But the adults too, who
>"sneak" a handful here and there. <G> It's as if it's
>"off-limits"---It's NOT, but that's how they act.
>
>So...that's my challenge. Are you up for it? Do you trust me?
>
>~Kelly
>
>Kelly Lovejoy
>Conference Coordinator
>Live and Learn Unschooling Conference
><http://www.LiveandLearnConference.org>http://www.LiveandLearnConference.org
>
>__________________________________________________________
>Email and AIM finally together. You've gotta check out free AOL Mail! -
><http://mail.aol.com>http://mail.aol.com
>



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Deb Lewis

***Pour two bags in a large bowl that you keep in the den or foyer.***

You have a den and a foyer? Both?
I have neither and no M&Ms. But I have a table with a bowl of Smarties
and a stash of Smarties in the cupboard.

I wish I had a den. A BEAR den! OR! A den of iniquity... (Oh, wait,
I can have that!) - Or a bear den of iniquity! Ok, I stole that from
the cartoonist, was it Chad Carpenter of "Tundra" fame? The cartoon
was buxom, floozy, scantily clad bears in lipstick, soliciting in the
doorway of their den.

Deb Lewis

Deb

--- In [email protected], kbcdlovejo@... wrote:
>
>
> Now...JellyBelly jellybeans are a different story. I *still* love
> those! <G> I need to fill another bottomless bowl with them! <BWG>
MMM jelly bellies - alas a bottomless bowl of them is one of my not-
so-good-choices but there are occasions where I keep them around
(they are really good for sudden blood sugar drops and they're
readily accessible in lots of places)
>
> Neither chooses McD's much any
> more---nor much fast food at all. They have much more ophisticated
> (and expensive! <G>) tastes. Sometimes I wish they would choose
> cheapMcDs instead of the sushi places they love now! <G>
LOL I hear ya! DS is only 9 and he prefers sushi and Starbucks chai
to most anything. Even as far as fast food goes, McD's is on the
bottom of his list - he'd rather go to BK or Subway.

Way back when, DS was maybe 5ish, he suddenly noticed this one
particular snack cake at the grocery store. So I got a box. They
disappeared pretty quickly. Next shopping trip, got another box.
Disappeared. Ditto for about a month of shopping. Then, ta da, they
went on sale 5 boxes/$5 (I knew we'd hit a sale eventually). So,
that week I parked the cart next to them and told DS to get 5 boxes.
His whole face got happy as he busily loaded the cart. First box was
open before we got home. Disappeared rapidly. Second box lasted
several days. That last box just took forever to Go Away even though
DH and I were eating them as well. Once they were gone, I asked DS
if he wanted any while we were standing right there by them at the
market. He said "no thanks, where's the cottage cheese aisle?" He's
occasionally asked for and gotten them since but that one event
cemented in him a spirit of abundance instead of want. He CAN eat
just one potato chip - if that's all he wants.

--Deb

Deb

I love cereal any time of day - it's one of those comfy foods. We've
decided, as a family, that we prefer to get either plain multigrain
flakes or plain multigrain Os so we can 'decorate' as we choose with
nuts, dried fruit, *chocolate chips*, chocolate milk, mini
marhsmallows, whatever happens to strike a fancy. Ditto for oatmeal -
LOL you should *see* the table when we all sit down to oatmeal. We've
got honey, brown sugar, white sugar, maple syrup, cinnamon, peanut
butter, jam, margarine, chocolate chips (and maybe assorted other
chips like white chocolate or cinnamon chips or white/dark swirl
chips), nuts, ... anything in the pantry is fair game for a try.

--Deb

riasplace3

--- In [email protected], kbcdlovejo@... wrote:

> Go to Sam's and buy 20 of the biggest bags of M&Ms you can find. Pour
> two bags in a large bowl that you keep in the den or foyer.



My cats would eat them, or play in them, before we ever got to them. : )
lol
Ria

Debra Rossing

Okay so put them in an easily accessible for humans ziplock bag or
container - maybe use a plastic file card box as a treasure chest!

Deb

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riasplace3

--- In [email protected], "Debra Rossing"
<debra.rossing@...> wrote:
>
> Okay so put them in an easily accessible for humans ziplock bag

LOL!!! That fits in more with our *decor* anyway!
; )
Ria

Ren Allen

~~Beginning of summer back in June the kids and I were at BJ's ( its
like Sams Club) and they spotted this giant box of giant sized pixie
sticks, they wanted it, so I got it.........hubby was appalled "omg
you can't let them have all those pixie sticks, thats crazy, why did
you get that"~~


Trevor used to loooove Twix bars. He had me buy them every time I went
to the grocery store. I finally bought the 36 bar box from Sam's Club.
That happened twice and he was done for a while. :)

After a two year hiatus from Twix, he recently started asking for them
occasionally. I offered to pick up several last month and he said
"nah, just one is fine".

Ciara has recently decided gelatin is disgusting and reads labels like
mad to make sure there isn't any in her food. She also asked me to
print out a list of ingredients that are from animal sources so she
can avoid all of them. They'll find their own balance, with loving
assistance not control.

Ren
learninginfreedom.com

[email protected]

-----Original Message-----
From: Emilie <erugard@...>

I love your idea!
The problem is...I can't stand M&Ms! I'm a total snob about
chocolate, but I also seem to have a deep and ongoing need for lots
of it. If I could afford it, which unfortunately, I can't, do you
think this would work with really good chocolate? I have noticed that
good dark chocolate seems to self regulate. But I can eat seemingly
endless quantities of good milk chocolate without ever feeling sick
of it. Now I know many think milk chocolate can never high quality,
so I am not trying to spark that debate. But I am wondering a lot
lately about boosting natural self regulation of foods in adults. Any
more ideas?

-=-=-=-=-

Do you think it's just limited to M&Ms???

Whatever you think you can't keep your hands off. Doesn't matter.

If there's abundance, there won't be need.

It's really simple.

Favorite fruit? Favorite cake? Favorite cookie? Favorite vegie?
Favorite meal?

If you can have it anytime, anywhere, as much as you want---you won't
desire it as much. It won't be as "special." You won't gorge.

There are still some things I *want* to desire, that I want to be
special. A lot of our holiday meals are only served on those holidays.
That way they reserve their "specialness."

M&Ms don't really deserve to be special. <g>

...and M&Ms are now made in dark chocolate. <bwg>


~Kelly

Kelly Lovejoy
Conference Coordinator
Live and Learn Unschooling Conference
http://www.LiveandLearnConference.org


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