Re: Please help me get out of this mainstream thinking!
j50yab
Dear Kendrah
I really am not the best person to answer your questions!! ;o) But
the first thing that strikes me is, why ever would your daughter make
any connection between getting kitty and being mean to her brother? I
know this does notin any way answer any of your more important
questions, but it's just one way out of the immediate dilemma.
Sarah
I really am not the best person to answer your questions!! ;o) But
the first thing that strikes me is, why ever would your daughter make
any connection between getting kitty and being mean to her brother? I
know this does notin any way answer any of your more important
questions, but it's just one way out of the immediate dilemma.
Sarah
>
Manisha Kher
--- Kendrah Nilsestuen <carebear-79@...>
wrote:
It makes me
connected to each other. She should be nicer to her
brother because we're all happier being nicer to each
other. The kitten is not a reward for being nice. If
you're getting a kitten, do it as a gift given freely,
not as a reward.
Think about it, would you want her to stop being nice
to her brother if the kitten disappears. "I no longer
have a reward for being nice, so I'll stop being
nice".
Read something by Alfie Kohn - "Unconditional
Parenting" or "Punished by Rewards". He gets a bit too
wordy for my liking, but he has sound ideas. I don't
know if he has shorter articles online.
Manisha
____________________________________________________________________________________
Luggage? GPS? Comic books?
Check out fitting gifts for grads at Yahoo! Search
http://search.yahoo.com/search?fr=oni_on_mail&p=graduation+gifts&cs=bz
wrote:
It makes me
> want to scream "If you can't be nice to yourYou are connecting two things that are in no way
> brother, we aren't
> getting the cat!" Of course I haven't. I feel like
> if I'm doing
> something for her (like taking money out of our
> budget and getting
> her a cat-even though I'm a dog person-lol), she
> should be nicer to
> her brother in return.
> It feels like I'm rewarding
> *bad* behavior.
connected to each other. She should be nicer to her
brother because we're all happier being nicer to each
other. The kitten is not a reward for being nice. If
you're getting a kitten, do it as a gift given freely,
not as a reward.
Think about it, would you want her to stop being nice
to her brother if the kitten disappears. "I no longer
have a reward for being nice, so I'll stop being
nice".
Read something by Alfie Kohn - "Unconditional
Parenting" or "Punished by Rewards". He gets a bit too
wordy for my liking, but he has sound ideas. I don't
know if he has shorter articles online.
Manisha
____________________________________________________________________________________
Luggage? GPS? Comic books?
Check out fitting gifts for grads at Yahoo! Search
http://search.yahoo.com/search?fr=oni_on_mail&p=graduation+gifts&cs=bz
Deb
If she were behaving badly to other animals you already have (her
brother may ACT like an animal occasionally lol but I'm talking
about the non-human types) then I'd definitely put the kitten on
hold. Otherwise, I'd want to, as you indicate, get to the root of
the behavior. Is there a real life connection between kitten and
sibling? Probably not. If there's not, how does withholding the
kitten help her live more peaceably with her brother? It would
likely change her outward behavior for a time to get her 'reward'
and it would also likely develop a bit of resentment toward sibling
for delaying her kitten. She doesn't connect taking money out of the
budget to being nice to brother. She probably doesn't even know what
a 'budget' is in much detail. Do you hold your partner to the same
standard of "I cooked dinner for you so you "should" do this for
me?" "I bought your favorite cookies at the store even though they
cost $2.39 per box so you 'owe' me?" I doubt it. If you stop and
think it through when the thought pops up (take a breath, relax,
recognize the thought, consciously choose your next action) you'll
likely recognize that it's not what you want (you indicate as much)
and that small pause gives you time to make a conscious choice of
what you want to do, not the autopilot response that we've been
trained to as a society.
Reconnecting with her is what your heart says is the key to the
situation. Do that first - maybe make kitten related activities part
of it - there's a cat carrier to get, a food dish, maybe a cat bed,
some climbing toys, other toys and treats, etc. Make it a 'date' for
the two of you while your partner or a friend or someone watches
sibling.
Something I've done at times when my DS is really on my nerves, I'll
ask him for a hug "My hug meter is running a little low, can I have
a hug?" It breaks the cycle and let's us connect so we can work out
what's happening - gives me a chance to breathe and think instead of
react, reconnects with him, changes the whole dynamic.
--Deb
brother may ACT like an animal occasionally lol but I'm talking
about the non-human types) then I'd definitely put the kitten on
hold. Otherwise, I'd want to, as you indicate, get to the root of
the behavior. Is there a real life connection between kitten and
sibling? Probably not. If there's not, how does withholding the
kitten help her live more peaceably with her brother? It would
likely change her outward behavior for a time to get her 'reward'
and it would also likely develop a bit of resentment toward sibling
for delaying her kitten. She doesn't connect taking money out of the
budget to being nice to brother. She probably doesn't even know what
a 'budget' is in much detail. Do you hold your partner to the same
standard of "I cooked dinner for you so you "should" do this for
me?" "I bought your favorite cookies at the store even though they
cost $2.39 per box so you 'owe' me?" I doubt it. If you stop and
think it through when the thought pops up (take a breath, relax,
recognize the thought, consciously choose your next action) you'll
likely recognize that it's not what you want (you indicate as much)
and that small pause gives you time to make a conscious choice of
what you want to do, not the autopilot response that we've been
trained to as a society.
Reconnecting with her is what your heart says is the key to the
situation. Do that first - maybe make kitten related activities part
of it - there's a cat carrier to get, a food dish, maybe a cat bed,
some climbing toys, other toys and treats, etc. Make it a 'date' for
the two of you while your partner or a friend or someone watches
sibling.
Something I've done at times when my DS is really on my nerves, I'll
ask him for a hug "My hug meter is running a little low, can I have
a hug?" It breaks the cycle and let's us connect so we can work out
what's happening - gives me a chance to breathe and think instead of
react, reconnects with him, changes the whole dynamic.
--Deb
wisdomalways5
It feels like I'm rewarding *bad* behavior.
she is hitting her brother- find out what she needs and deal with
that. She really wants a kitten- deal with that different thing. She
she hitting brother because you won't get a kitten? Probably not.
Maybe she just needs something to give her attention to and that may
be a kitten. I find myself bitting my tounge a lot when I am about to
say these things. ahhhhh. Hard to break the habit. Just think brothers
nad kittens are two different things. maybe talk about how to involve
brother in caring for the kitten too.
> Oh, did I just say that? Sounds so mainstream.toward
>
> I know I need to get to the root of why she is acting this way
> her brother. Obviously, she needs more connection.I think you should try to see it as two different issues. One is that
she is hitting her brother- find out what she needs and deal with
that. She really wants a kitten- deal with that different thing. She
she hitting brother because you won't get a kitten? Probably not.
Maybe she just needs something to give her attention to and that may
be a kitten. I find myself bitting my tounge a lot when I am about to
say these things. ahhhhh. Hard to break the habit. Just think brothers
nad kittens are two different things. maybe talk about how to involve
brother in caring for the kitten too.
Ren Allen
~~Would getting her the kitten now be a bad
thing?~~
I don't think a kitten for a four year old is usually a great idea
anyway. Especially when she's already being physical with something
smaller than her. Now you'll just have two smaller things to protect.
Not fun.
BUT, it has nothing to do with punishment. It has everything to do
with maturity and development. I doubt she's really ready for a
kitten. There are lots of ways to meet her need for kitten/cat play
without adopting one yourself...until she's ready.
And yes, finding ways to connect with her and be proactive about her
play so it doesn't become hurtful is important.
Ren
learninginfreedom.com
thing?~~
I don't think a kitten for a four year old is usually a great idea
anyway. Especially when she's already being physical with something
smaller than her. Now you'll just have two smaller things to protect.
Not fun.
BUT, it has nothing to do with punishment. It has everything to do
with maturity and development. I doubt she's really ready for a
kitten. There are lots of ways to meet her need for kitten/cat play
without adopting one yourself...until she's ready.
And yes, finding ways to connect with her and be proactive about her
play so it doesn't become hurtful is important.
Ren
learninginfreedom.com
Ren Allen
~~I
realize the kitten should be given as a loving gift free of condition
or not at all. I've since cooled off and listened to my heart, we're
getting the kitten. ~~
Absolutely it should. BUT are you considering your own needs here too?
Because a kitten and young children are not a great mix in my book.
I'm sure I'll hear other views but I'm saying this as someone raised
with kittens and five siblings and with four baby kittens in my house
right now. My 6y.o. has a very hard time treating them all gently
enough. While every child is different I am personally very leary of
wee children and cats being together. That's just me.
It's a lot more for you to deal with too, when you're already trying
to foster peaceful relationships between siblings.
Ren
learninginfreedom.com
realize the kitten should be given as a loving gift free of condition
or not at all. I've since cooled off and listened to my heart, we're
getting the kitten. ~~
Absolutely it should. BUT are you considering your own needs here too?
Because a kitten and young children are not a great mix in my book.
I'm sure I'll hear other views but I'm saying this as someone raised
with kittens and five siblings and with four baby kittens in my house
right now. My 6y.o. has a very hard time treating them all gently
enough. While every child is different I am personally very leary of
wee children and cats being together. That's just me.
It's a lot more for you to deal with too, when you're already trying
to foster peaceful relationships between siblings.
Ren
learninginfreedom.com
Ren Allen
~~It is hard to want to do something for
somebody without expecting something in return. ~~
I know you're logically realizing these are two very separate issues,
but are having emotional reactions here. That's really normal in our
growth I think.
This is an opportunity to examine where those feelings are coming
from. For me, it's usually some message MY parents sent me and it's
helpful to sort them out and see what it's really about. It's never
about my kids....it's about my own baggage.
An emotional response that dredges up our own raising is pretty
common.:) I think just writing it down probably helped bring some
clarity to the issue? Writing it down or talking about it usually
helps me realize where the issue is really rooted.
It helps me to realize that with friends, nobody should "owe" anybody.
We just do nice things for each other because life is better that way
and it makes us feel good.
Ren
learninginfreedom.com
somebody without expecting something in return. ~~
I know you're logically realizing these are two very separate issues,
but are having emotional reactions here. That's really normal in our
growth I think.
This is an opportunity to examine where those feelings are coming
from. For me, it's usually some message MY parents sent me and it's
helpful to sort them out and see what it's really about. It's never
about my kids....it's about my own baggage.
An emotional response that dredges up our own raising is pretty
common.:) I think just writing it down probably helped bring some
clarity to the issue? Writing it down or talking about it usually
helps me realize where the issue is really rooted.
It helps me to realize that with friends, nobody should "owe" anybody.
We just do nice things for each other because life is better that way
and it makes us feel good.
Ren
learninginfreedom.com
nanceconfer
I'm glad you are getting the kitten.
I also hope you are talking to your daughter and son about ALL of you
helping to take care of the kitten.
A 4 yo cannot be expected to fully be responsible for a pet and yet
may want to feel she is in charge -- when she's in the mood.
And there's no reason little brother should be left out -- kittens
need hugs too.
And maybe this is something you can all enjoy together.
Nance
--- In [email protected], Kendrah Nilsestuen
<carebear-79@...> wrote:
I also hope you are talking to your daughter and son about ALL of you
helping to take care of the kitten.
A 4 yo cannot be expected to fully be responsible for a pet and yet
may want to feel she is in charge -- when she's in the mood.
And there's no reason little brother should be left out -- kittens
need hugs too.
And maybe this is something you can all enjoy together.
Nance
--- In [email protected], Kendrah Nilsestuen
<carebear-79@...> wrote:
>
> <<Read something by Alfie Kohn - "Unconditional
> Parenting" or "Punished by Rewards".>>
>
> I have read Unconditional Parenting. I understand the reward/
> punishment mentality, and how it doesn't work. That is why I wrote in
> because I knew it was a ridiculous feeling. I knew it didn't make any
> sense, but I kept feeling that way. Anyway, I wrote the post in a
> moment of self doubt, a moment of unconscious parenting. It was
> either write the post to vent or say something out loud that I'd
> regret like "we're not getting the kitten", so I went for the post. I
> realize the kitten should be given as a loving gift free of condition
> or not at all. I've since cooled off and listened to my heart, we're
> getting the kitten. Thank you for your thoughts.
>
> Kendrah
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
elodyb
I think at this point you should be thinking about the kitten. Do you
really think that your daughter will treat it right if she is being so
physical with her brother? (You may think she will treat the kitten
differently- that's for you to decide) I'm just saying that this goes
beyond 'should her getting something be dependant on her behavior'.
It's really a matter of safety for a innocent kitten AND for your
daughter.
Elody
really think that your daughter will treat it right if she is being so
physical with her brother? (You may think she will treat the kitten
differently- that's for you to decide) I'm just saying that this goes
beyond 'should her getting something be dependant on her behavior'.
It's really a matter of safety for a innocent kitten AND for your
daughter.
Elody
Elenita Santaballa
I am a cat/kitten person raised around cats all my
life, and IMHO I think that a 4-yr. old is too young
for a kitten.
Check into the cat adoption organizations near you.
There are lots of cats and kittens waiting to be
adopted that need affection. You and DD could go
"volunteer" to spend time with some lonely cats rather
than bringing one home until she is a bit older.
Elena
-------------------------------------
Wife to Mark.
Mama to 4 beloved boys:
Xavier Rinchen b. 12-3-06, in my arms 2-27-07.
Triplet sons Carlos Leo, Rafael George, Loran Jose (Rafi's identical twin) born/died 3/9/05 & greatly loved
http://www.cubanayogini.com/
____________________________________________________________________________________
Be a better Globetrotter. Get better travel answers from someone who knows. Yahoo! Answers - Check it out.
http://answers.yahoo.com/dir/?link=list&sid=396545469
life, and IMHO I think that a 4-yr. old is too young
for a kitten.
Check into the cat adoption organizations near you.
There are lots of cats and kittens waiting to be
adopted that need affection. You and DD could go
"volunteer" to spend time with some lonely cats rather
than bringing one home until she is a bit older.
Elena
-------------------------------------
Wife to Mark.
Mama to 4 beloved boys:
Xavier Rinchen b. 12-3-06, in my arms 2-27-07.
Triplet sons Carlos Leo, Rafael George, Loran Jose (Rafi's identical twin) born/died 3/9/05 & greatly loved
http://www.cubanayogini.com/
____________________________________________________________________________________
Be a better Globetrotter. Get better travel answers from someone who knows. Yahoo! Answers - Check it out.
http://answers.yahoo.com/dir/?link=list&sid=396545469
Fetteroll
On Jul 19, 2007, at 12:59 AM, Kendrah Nilsestuen wrote:
All kittens need a lot of play time. (Same with puppies.) We've found
it best to get two kittens. (Not necessarily the answer you were
looking for ;-) *Some* kittens, depending on personality, will demand
interaction with people.
We've been volunteering at an animal shelter for the past 5 years and
we'd never get a kitten again. The main reason being is that you
don't know what personality the cat the kitten will develop into will
have. With cats you know what you're getting.
It's helpful not to picture cats at shelters as being there because
they're unpleasant and no one wants them. 80% of the cats we've met
at the shelter have been wonderful animals. All have their own
personalities: some like to do little more than lay in the sun, some
are kitten-like even as adults, some will wrap their arms around you
and let you carry them anywhere, some have purr fests as soon as you
touch them. Just a wide range of personalities that it's impossible
to know in a kitten. If you make friends with the shelter people,
they'll love to tell you about their favorites :-)
Joyce
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> I've gotten a mix of responses of how much work they are when I wasWe've owned quite a few cats and have fostered several litters.
> researching getting one. Some people don't seem to think they are
> much at all. Others compare them to babies they can be so needy.
> Maybe we should start out with a cat vs. a small kitten?
All kittens need a lot of play time. (Same with puppies.) We've found
it best to get two kittens. (Not necessarily the answer you were
looking for ;-) *Some* kittens, depending on personality, will demand
interaction with people.
We've been volunteering at an animal shelter for the past 5 years and
we'd never get a kitten again. The main reason being is that you
don't know what personality the cat the kitten will develop into will
have. With cats you know what you're getting.
It's helpful not to picture cats at shelters as being there because
they're unpleasant and no one wants them. 80% of the cats we've met
at the shelter have been wonderful animals. All have their own
personalities: some like to do little more than lay in the sun, some
are kitten-like even as adults, some will wrap their arms around you
and let you carry them anywhere, some have purr fests as soon as you
touch them. Just a wide range of personalities that it's impossible
to know in a kitten. If you make friends with the shelter people,
they'll love to tell you about their favorites :-)
Joyce
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Emilie
One great thing about getting a cat is that you know what kind of
animal you are adopting much more so than with a kitten. And they are
more hardy to escape your toddler :-). Shelters are full of 1 year
old cats that people got rid of when they stopped being kittens. A
good shelter will know which particular cats are very easy going and
gentle and would be best suited to your young family. A kitten is a
real unknown as many grow up to be intolerant of kids even when kids
live with them from the beginning. I grew up in an informal animal
shelter and knew many kittens who became quite nasty to kids when
they grew up even though we were always kind and gentle with them.
Best,
Emilie
At 12:59 AM 19/07/2007, you wrote:
animal you are adopting much more so than with a kitten. And they are
more hardy to escape your toddler :-). Shelters are full of 1 year
old cats that people got rid of when they stopped being kittens. A
good shelter will know which particular cats are very easy going and
gentle and would be best suited to your young family. A kitten is a
real unknown as many grow up to be intolerant of kids even when kids
live with them from the beginning. I grew up in an informal animal
shelter and knew many kittens who became quite nasty to kids when
they grew up even though we were always kind and gentle with them.
Best,
Emilie
At 12:59 AM 19/07/2007, you wrote:
>Yes I agree. I've never had kittens. We were a dog family growing up.
>I've gotten a mix of responses of how much work they are when I was
>researching getting one. Some people don't seem to think they are
>much at all. Others compare them to babies they can be so needy.
>Maybe we should start out with a cat vs. a small kitten?
Deb Lewis
***My attention
has to be on him almost constantly. He is quite an explorer. In
addition he still needs held a lot. My dad is real sick. My husband
is looking at a possible job transfer.***
Be kind to yourself and the cat and wait until your life is settled
out a bit before you get a kitten.
It doesn't sound like you need to add cleaning food and water bowls,
cleaning litter pans, cleaning up barfy or potty accidents and
cleaning up cat hair to your already busy schedule.
Moving with pets makes moving even trickier than it already is.
Moving is stressful on most pets. If your husbands potential job
transfer takes you to another place would you be renting or buying?
Pet deposits on rentals can be expensive.
Let things settle a bit.
But you could spend some nice time with your daughter looking at
pictures of cats and kittens and talking about what kind she'd like
to have and just fill her up with kitten pretend play and stories and
fun until your life is more ready for the reality of a new and busy
kitten around the house.
Deb Lewis
has to be on him almost constantly. He is quite an explorer. In
addition he still needs held a lot. My dad is real sick. My husband
is looking at a possible job transfer.***
Be kind to yourself and the cat and wait until your life is settled
out a bit before you get a kitten.
It doesn't sound like you need to add cleaning food and water bowls,
cleaning litter pans, cleaning up barfy or potty accidents and
cleaning up cat hair to your already busy schedule.
Moving with pets makes moving even trickier than it already is.
Moving is stressful on most pets. If your husbands potential job
transfer takes you to another place would you be renting or buying?
Pet deposits on rentals can be expensive.
Let things settle a bit.
But you could spend some nice time with your daughter looking at
pictures of cats and kittens and talking about what kind she'd like
to have and just fill her up with kitten pretend play and stories and
fun until your life is more ready for the reality of a new and busy
kitten around the house.
Deb Lewis
wisdomalways5
--- In [email protected], Kendrah Nilsestuen
<carebear-79@...> wrote:
will say so you are rewarding bad behavior. AHHHHHHHHH. I have been
readin punished my rewards and it will be helpful in explaining why
rewards are punishments.
<carebear-79@...> wrote:
>thought
> <<why ever would your daughter make
> any connection between getting kitty and being mean to her brother?
>>
>
> I don't know. In my lapse of good judgement I guess I must of
> she would think "oh, I never got a kitten before, what have Ibeen
> doing recently that has been different to deserve getting akitten?
> Ah yes, hitting my brother! Better keep that up since it hasworked
> out so splendidly for me." Crazy I know. It was how my parentswere
> though (and I love my parents very much, they did the best theyknew
> at the time) but if I was acting out, the last thing I would ofnot.
> gotten was something I really wanted. Whether it was related or
> KendrahHa Ha Ha- I know I get hte same when my siter comes over and she
>
will say so you are rewarding bad behavior. AHHHHHHHHH. I have been
readin punished my rewards and it will be helpful in explaining why
rewards are punishments.
wisdomalways5
--- In [email protected], Kendrah Nilsestuen <carebear-
79@...> wrote:
was too rough than a dog bite her. Not sure if that matters to this
discussion but I thought I would add that in.
79@...> wrote:
>I must say that I would rather have a cat scratch my child when she
> <<BUT, it has nothing to do with punishment. It has everything to do
> with maturity and development. I doubt she's really ready for a
> kitten. There are lots of ways to meet her need for kitten/cat play
> without adopting one yourself...until she's ready.>>
>
was too rough than a dog bite her. Not sure if that matters to this
discussion but I thought I would add that in.
wisdomalways5
--- In [email protected], Elenita Santaballa
<esantaballa@...> wrote:
I do not hear her saying she is going to turn the cat lose with her
daughter I hear her saying it will be a family cat. I think it great
that cats can climb and hide when they want to get away from
children.
<esantaballa@...> wrote:
>Adoption cats can be much meaner and skitish around children though.
> I am a cat/kitten person raised around cats all my
> life, and IMHO I think that a 4-yr. old is too young
> for a kitten.
>
> Check into the cat adoption organizations near you.
> There are lots of cats and kittens waiting to be
> adopted that need affection. You and DD could go
> "volunteer" to spend time with some lonely cats rather
> than bringing one home until she is a bit older.
>
> Elena
>
I do not hear her saying she is going to turn the cat lose with her
daughter I hear her saying it will be a family cat. I think it great
that cats can climb and hide when they want to get away from
children.
Brian & Alexandra Polikowsky
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<I think it great
that cats can climb and hide when they want to get away from
children. <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
Not all cats do that. I have two that do not. They just put up with my toddler and I have to go save them. I also have one that will just scratch and lightly bite my toddler.
All them were raised with kids but my (now 5 year old) DS was very gentle. Its my 17 mo DD that drags them by the neck and they let her ( well Nene does not).
So I have to be there at all times to facilitate.
Alex
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
that cats can climb and hide when they want to get away from
children. <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
Not all cats do that. I have two that do not. They just put up with my toddler and I have to go save them. I also have one that will just scratch and lightly bite my toddler.
All them were raised with kids but my (now 5 year old) DS was very gentle. Its my 17 mo DD that drags them by the neck and they let her ( well Nene does not).
So I have to be there at all times to facilitate.
Alex
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
i only read the first few replies to the thread...
i also have that thinking going that that they will think that the "reward" will make them think the bad behavior is what is being rewarded... my husband helps me get through those "thoughts"... i have found that the act of kindness will spill over on the kids. so if zoe is being extra grumpy or mean and i give her a "gift" of extra time or i'll pull out a craft( her favorite activity) she will get happy and be nice to tommy or get over her grumpiness... also i look at her diet. if she has been fed by my parents, that you usually puts both kids in a bad mood. they dont read labels and buy just about everything with HFCS and PHO... so the kids get wacky.
i think the kids dont have that thinking about "rewards". its something that grown-ups put in their head.
now about the kitten...
we first got two sphynx kittens when zoe was 2. we bought from a bad breeder and they both died within the month. about 4 days after getting the two kittens we got another sphynx from a non breeder. (we were going to start a cattery).. so we were left with one kitten. zoe LOVED her. there was a fair amount of not playing gentle, but the sphynx breed is very kind. we had tommy shortly after. tommy grew up with a cat. the cat got pregnant... she made a hole in the screen and got out. we had four kittens. two went to a friend and two stayed with us. while the kittens were getting old enough to move to their new home with 3 girls, the kids "broke them in". they were the best kitties we have ever had. i had 6 cats in ohio before having kids... my parents moved in and my dad hates cats... the kitties mysteriously disappeared... one by one...
the two kittens that my friend took, one got pregnant. now we have two of her kittens. one was a hairless like their grandma and one fluffy like their mommy. the cats are great for the kids. there is a lot less fighting over the past year. each has their own kitty, and the kitties know who's kitty their are... tommy got the hairless and zoe got the fluffy one. the kids play together a lot more now. the have a common like that they can share. since tommy is 2 yrs younger, they had a hard time finding things they can play together. or things that tommy wouldn't mess up.
i have to say that the cats have been an amazing addition to our family.
if you can, try to find a sphynx... they are expensive, but you can find ones that are not from the show quality breeders. also, you can find an f1, f2, f3, or f4 kitten from an out breeding program that is coated... like one of ours... those sell for super cheap as they have hair, but they still have that great sphynx personality. they are little dogs, trapped in a cat.
here is a pic of ours http://www.dashafx.com/photos/DSC09459.jpg
·´`·.(*·.¸(`·.¸ ¸.·´)¸.·*).·´`·
** Dasha **
** Zoeya Ayn 11/17/2002 **
** Tommy Rand III 02/02/2005 **
·´`·.(¸.·´(¸.·* *·.¸)`·.¸).·´`·
Freedom to Fascism by Aaron Russo
http://video.google.com/videosearch?q=freedom+to+fascism
Hope for America
http://www.RonPaul2008.com
i also have that thinking going that that they will think that the "reward" will make them think the bad behavior is what is being rewarded... my husband helps me get through those "thoughts"... i have found that the act of kindness will spill over on the kids. so if zoe is being extra grumpy or mean and i give her a "gift" of extra time or i'll pull out a craft( her favorite activity) she will get happy and be nice to tommy or get over her grumpiness... also i look at her diet. if she has been fed by my parents, that you usually puts both kids in a bad mood. they dont read labels and buy just about everything with HFCS and PHO... so the kids get wacky.
i think the kids dont have that thinking about "rewards". its something that grown-ups put in their head.
now about the kitten...
we first got two sphynx kittens when zoe was 2. we bought from a bad breeder and they both died within the month. about 4 days after getting the two kittens we got another sphynx from a non breeder. (we were going to start a cattery).. so we were left with one kitten. zoe LOVED her. there was a fair amount of not playing gentle, but the sphynx breed is very kind. we had tommy shortly after. tommy grew up with a cat. the cat got pregnant... she made a hole in the screen and got out. we had four kittens. two went to a friend and two stayed with us. while the kittens were getting old enough to move to their new home with 3 girls, the kids "broke them in". they were the best kitties we have ever had. i had 6 cats in ohio before having kids... my parents moved in and my dad hates cats... the kitties mysteriously disappeared... one by one...
the two kittens that my friend took, one got pregnant. now we have two of her kittens. one was a hairless like their grandma and one fluffy like their mommy. the cats are great for the kids. there is a lot less fighting over the past year. each has their own kitty, and the kitties know who's kitty their are... tommy got the hairless and zoe got the fluffy one. the kids play together a lot more now. the have a common like that they can share. since tommy is 2 yrs younger, they had a hard time finding things they can play together. or things that tommy wouldn't mess up.
i have to say that the cats have been an amazing addition to our family.
if you can, try to find a sphynx... they are expensive, but you can find ones that are not from the show quality breeders. also, you can find an f1, f2, f3, or f4 kitten from an out breeding program that is coated... like one of ours... those sell for super cheap as they have hair, but they still have that great sphynx personality. they are little dogs, trapped in a cat.
here is a pic of ours http://www.dashafx.com/photos/DSC09459.jpg
·´`·.(*·.¸(`·.¸ ¸.·´)¸.·*).·´`·
** Dasha **
** Zoeya Ayn 11/17/2002 **
** Tommy Rand III 02/02/2005 **
·´`·.(¸.·´(¸.·* *·.¸)`·.¸).·´`·
Freedom to Fascism by Aaron Russo
http://video.google.com/videosearch?q=freedom+to+fascism
Hope for America
http://www.RonPaul2008.com
elodyb
I realize
kind. But she is a kid. She accidently hits, kicks or headbutts me all
the time. We got a kitten at age 2. Here a year later I really regret
it. She is just too rough with him, just like she is with me. Just
tonight I was having to explain once again that when the cat is yowling
he is not happy and she needs to stop doing what she is doing. (as in
pulling his tail) I often feel like I have to defend the poor cat.
Also, he is not the nicest cat, and I think that is partly because he
has not been handled gently.
I was also trying to get you to think about the cat. Of course no
one wants to see your DD hurt, and no one wants to see a cat hurt
either, but it kind of goes beyond that even. Quite honestly the cat
probably can't kill her. While if she is too rough with the cat she
could actaully kill him. Not intentionally of course! But I have seen
my DD do some things that if we let her continue, could have easily
killed the cat.
One other thing I don't think has been mentioned is you have another
child to think about too. WHat about your son, and him getting hurt or
hurting the cat? Several people are saying that 4 is too young for a
kitten, what about your 1 1/2 y.o.? Your DD and if she thinks she is
being rewarded for bad behavior is just a small part of this decision.
Anyway, for me, if I had a do over, I would not have gotten a kitten
at the point we did, and probably would not now either. Of course the
right age would depend on each individual child,
Elody
> through email when I'm only asking for advice with one aspect of ourI hope you didn't take what I said wrong. My DD is also very sweet and
> lives it has painted a picture of my daughter that is not entirely
> accurate.
kind. But she is a kid. She accidently hits, kicks or headbutts me all
the time. We got a kitten at age 2. Here a year later I really regret
it. She is just too rough with him, just like she is with me. Just
tonight I was having to explain once again that when the cat is yowling
he is not happy and she needs to stop doing what she is doing. (as in
pulling his tail) I often feel like I have to defend the poor cat.
Also, he is not the nicest cat, and I think that is partly because he
has not been handled gently.
I was also trying to get you to think about the cat. Of course no
one wants to see your DD hurt, and no one wants to see a cat hurt
either, but it kind of goes beyond that even. Quite honestly the cat
probably can't kill her. While if she is too rough with the cat she
could actaully kill him. Not intentionally of course! But I have seen
my DD do some things that if we let her continue, could have easily
killed the cat.
One other thing I don't think has been mentioned is you have another
child to think about too. WHat about your son, and him getting hurt or
hurting the cat? Several people are saying that 4 is too young for a
kitten, what about your 1 1/2 y.o.? Your DD and if she thinks she is
being rewarded for bad behavior is just a small part of this decision.
Anyway, for me, if I had a do over, I would not have gotten a kitten
at the point we did, and probably would not now either. Of course the
right age would depend on each individual child,
Elody
Meredith
--- In [email protected], Kendrah Nilsestuen
<carebear-79@...> wrote:
years ago from a shelter who just died recently. She only ever peed
on the floor if I had been lax about cleaning the catbox. Pretty
clear communication on her part! My gf otoh, has a cat she raised
from a kitten who poos on her bed whenever he gets stressed. Its
such a common occurance since her dd was born that she never leaves
her bed unmade or without a special bedspread. Eeeew.
with families - it saves on returns :( My aunty is part of a kitty
rehab program, where she takes in cats who have been thrown out
rather than brought to a shelter and are a bit stressed-out as a
result. She keeps them until they are ready to go to a home.
Naturally she can then give lots of useful information about the
cats' personalities and temperaments and quirks.
People often get rid of animals for reasons that seem strange or
cruel - my mom took my brother's dog to the shelter when he went to
college! Its by no means the case that animals in shelters are
somehow defective. Often its more a case of the human in question
finding himself in over his head as far as animal care.
---Meredith (Mo 5.5, Ray 13)
<carebear-79@...> wrote:
>I have heard fromproblems.
> numerous people that cats from shelters usually have litter
> I've heard that they tend to pee on the floor.That's really a personality thing, with cats. I got a cat eighteen
years ago from a shelter who just died recently. She only ever peed
on the floor if I had been lax about cleaning the catbox. Pretty
clear communication on her part! My gf otoh, has a cat she raised
from a kitten who poos on her bed whenever he gets stressed. Its
such a common occurance since her dd was born that she never leaves
her bed unmade or without a special bedspread. Eeeew.
>Perhaps, I could speak withwait
> the shelter and tell them my concerns so that they could match me
> with a cat that would fit our family. Even if we would have to
> for it.That's an excellent idea. Many shelters have programs to match pets
with families - it saves on returns :( My aunty is part of a kitty
rehab program, where she takes in cats who have been thrown out
rather than brought to a shelter and are a bit stressed-out as a
result. She keeps them until they are ready to go to a home.
Naturally she can then give lots of useful information about the
cats' personalities and temperaments and quirks.
People often get rid of animals for reasons that seem strange or
cruel - my mom took my brother's dog to the shelter when he went to
college! Its by no means the case that animals in shelters are
somehow defective. Often its more a case of the human in question
finding himself in over his head as far as animal care.
---Meredith (Mo 5.5, Ray 13)