weaning off pacifier
trewhittjoy
Hi,
I am not sure how to handle my (just turned) three year old and her
constant pacifier usage. The pediatrician and pediatric dentist
have told me to get rid of it. The dentist said that her palate
will begin to harden soon and we will have major problems later if
she doesn't get rid of it before then. I wish that I had not used a
pacifier, but I was had read that the AAP said it helped reduce SIDS
risk. My one year old ds only takes his when he goes to sleep, so I
am going to try to get rid of his slowly (He is still nursing). My
dd weaned at 17 months and she has always liked taking the
pacifier. I feel like I am causing her stress by pressuring her to
give it up. The pediatrician said to cut the nipple off and she
would lose interest in the plastic handle--I mentioned this to her
and big tears welled up in her eyes at the thought of cutting the
nipple off. I wonder if she will give it up on her own? Do I keep
pressuring her? Do I hide it and pretend that it is lost? Is this
a big deal? I know sometimes the doctors' make things sound worse
than they are. Please let me know what you think.
Thanks!
Joy
I am not sure how to handle my (just turned) three year old and her
constant pacifier usage. The pediatrician and pediatric dentist
have told me to get rid of it. The dentist said that her palate
will begin to harden soon and we will have major problems later if
she doesn't get rid of it before then. I wish that I had not used a
pacifier, but I was had read that the AAP said it helped reduce SIDS
risk. My one year old ds only takes his when he goes to sleep, so I
am going to try to get rid of his slowly (He is still nursing). My
dd weaned at 17 months and she has always liked taking the
pacifier. I feel like I am causing her stress by pressuring her to
give it up. The pediatrician said to cut the nipple off and she
would lose interest in the plastic handle--I mentioned this to her
and big tears welled up in her eyes at the thought of cutting the
nipple off. I wonder if she will give it up on her own? Do I keep
pressuring her? Do I hide it and pretend that it is lost? Is this
a big deal? I know sometimes the doctors' make things sound worse
than they are. Please let me know what you think.
Thanks!
Joy
Fetteroll
On Jun 9, 2007, at 11:33 AM, trewhittjoy wrote:
irritating that doctors can present best guesses with the same parent-
guilting conviction as things that have been heavily studied.
Here's an article:
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2001/12/011224083205.htm
Baby teeth *can* get misalign, not will get misaligned. And they
don't know if the misalignment, if it happens, carries over to adult
teeth.
*And* what if it does carry over? What you're saying to her by trying
to take it away is that her comfort isn't as important as straight
teeth (which can be fixed with orthodontia.)
Joyce
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> The pediatrician and pediatric dentistIn truth doctors are just guessing at what seems right. It's
> have told me to get rid of it.
irritating that doctors can present best guesses with the same parent-
guilting conviction as things that have been heavily studied.
Here's an article:
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2001/12/011224083205.htm
Baby teeth *can* get misalign, not will get misaligned. And they
don't know if the misalignment, if it happens, carries over to adult
teeth.
*And* what if it does carry over? What you're saying to her by trying
to take it away is that her comfort isn't as important as straight
teeth (which can be fixed with orthodontia.)
Joyce
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[email protected]
In a message dated 6/9/2007 12:15:57 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time,
trewhittjoy@... writes:
The pediatrician said to cut the nipple off and she
would lose interest in the plastic handle--I mentioned this to her
and big tears welled up in her eyes at the thought of cutting the
nipple off. I wonder if she will give it up on her own? Do I keep
pressuring her? Do I hide it and pretend that it is lost? Is this
a big deal? I know sometimes the doctors' make things sound worse
than they are. Please let me know what you think.
Oh, what a tough time! I can understand your tension and the issues at hand.
Poor gal, made me cry too, thinking of that. I looked up Dr. Sears, while
mainstream - is also a great and sensitive person (practice, actually) So here
is the link on all things pacifiers. I hope it helps!
_http://askdrsears.com/html/10/t104600.asp_ (http://askdrsears.com/html/10/t104600.asp)
Good luck.
Karen
************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
trewhittjoy@... writes:
The pediatrician said to cut the nipple off and she
would lose interest in the plastic handle--I mentioned this to her
and big tears welled up in her eyes at the thought of cutting the
nipple off. I wonder if she will give it up on her own? Do I keep
pressuring her? Do I hide it and pretend that it is lost? Is this
a big deal? I know sometimes the doctors' make things sound worse
than they are. Please let me know what you think.
Oh, what a tough time! I can understand your tension and the issues at hand.
Poor gal, made me cry too, thinking of that. I looked up Dr. Sears, while
mainstream - is also a great and sensitive person (practice, actually) So here
is the link on all things pacifiers. I hope it helps!
_http://askdrsears.com/html/10/t104600.asp_ (http://askdrsears.com/html/10/t104600.asp)
Good luck.
Karen
************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Ren Allen
~~I am not sure how to handle my (just turned) three year old and her
constant pacifier usage. The pediatrician and pediatric dentist
have told me to get rid of it. ~~
Your child is more important than some "experts" opinion. Pacifiers
should never be started in my opinion, because children need the
breast, not a plastic thing, but at this point that's irrelevant.
She needs it. She wants it. That's all that matters in my mind. There
is no long term damage for many, many people I know of that sucked
thumbs, including my oldest child. He had his thumb until 11 years of
age, as far as I know and his teeth are pretty dang straight.
I'd rather pay for some dental/ortho work later than harm my childs
psyche. If it is a comfort to her, then she needs it.
Ren
learninginfreedom.com
constant pacifier usage. The pediatrician and pediatric dentist
have told me to get rid of it. ~~
Your child is more important than some "experts" opinion. Pacifiers
should never be started in my opinion, because children need the
breast, not a plastic thing, but at this point that's irrelevant.
She needs it. She wants it. That's all that matters in my mind. There
is no long term damage for many, many people I know of that sucked
thumbs, including my oldest child. He had his thumb until 11 years of
age, as far as I know and his teeth are pretty dang straight.
I'd rather pay for some dental/ortho work later than harm my childs
psyche. If it is a comfort to her, then she needs it.
Ren
learninginfreedom.com
riasplace3
> ~~I am not sure how to handle my (just turned) three year old and herFWIW, my almost 10 yr. old still has one and uses it sometimes.
> constant pacifier usage.
She did stop using it<mostly>at about 4 1/2, but still, when she comes
across it, she'll pop it in. : )
She has some sort of need to have something in her mouth...personally,
I prefer a pacifier or gum to chewing her fingernails off.
(BTW, her teeth are lovely...I think it has more to do with good genes
than a pacifier.)
Ria
Su Penn
1.
From Early childhood pacifier use in relation to breastfeeding,
SIDS, infection and dental malocclusion.(sudden infant death syndrome)
(Clinical report). Joanna Briggs. Nursing Standard 20.38 (May 31,
2006): p52(4). A survey of existing research on the subject:
Pacifier use and dental malocclusion
The relationship of pacifier use and dental malocclusion has been a
subject of great interest to dentists and child health professionals
for many years. Forty-seven articles were identified that purported
to investigate this relationship. Six studies met the inclusion
criteria, of which five were cohort studies (Bowden 1966, Larsson
1986, Bishara et al 1987, Paunio et al 1993, Warren and Bishara 2002)
and one was a case-control study (Meyers and Hertzberg 1988). There
were no RCTs and the excluded articles were mostly case-series and
cross-sectional designs. Not one of the cohort or case-control
studies reported a measure of association, such as an estimate of
relative risk. It was therefore not possible to include these studies
in the final review.
Summary of findings: Because of the absence of adequate studies, no
conclusions could be made.
Implications for practice: Dental malocclusion: it was found that
because of the paucity of adequate epidemiological studies, no
conclusions could be made.
2.
On the other hand, Effects of nonnutritive sucking habits on occlusal
characteristics in the mixed dentition in Pediatric dentistry
(Pediatr Dent) 2005 Nov-Dec; 27(6): 445-50, says that "Sustained
pacifier habits, including those of 24 to 47 months, were associated
with anterior open bite and Class II molar relationships, while digit
habits were associated with anterior open bite when sustained for 60
months or longer. CONCLUSIONS: Malocclusions are quite prevalent in
the mixed dentition, and anterior open bite and posterior crossbite
may be preventable by modifying nonnutritive sucking behaviors.,"
which seems to mean that yes, bite problems are more common in kids
who use pacifiers long-term.
On the other hand, I can't seem to find anything that lays out what
sorts of dire things happen to people with bite problems. Just how
big a problem is it? I'm not sure.
3.
Do pacifiers reduce the risk of sudden infant death syndrome? A meta-
analysis.
Source:
Pediatrics (Pediatrics) 2005 Nov; 116(5): e716-23
Says: "Published case-control studies demonstrate a significant
reduced risk of SIDS with pacifier use, particularly when placed for
sleep.... Therefore, we recommend that pacifiers be offered to
infants as a potential method to reduce the risk of SIDS. The
pacifier should be offered to the infant when being placed for all
sleep episodes, including daytime naps and nighttime sleeps. This is
a US Preventive Services Task Force level B strength of
recommendation based on the consistency of findings and the
likelihood that the beneficial effects will outweigh any potential
negative effects."
4.
I have found estimates ranging from 30% to 75% of how many children
eventually get braces. It varies by economic class and other factors.
I have a son who still sucks his thumb at age 6. He does it much less
than he did when he was younger; he used to suck all night, and now
only sucks to fall asleep, and rarely during the day. He has created
a big gap between two teeth in front by thumb-sucking--a perfect
thumb-sized opening. After some initial panic when he was 3 or so, I
have gotten really comfortable with it. I think that when his adult
teeth start to come in, if he is still thumb-sucking, I'll talk to
him about the possible effects. I remember reading in my earlier
research that most bite problems caused by thumb-sucking self-correct
by age 10 if the child stops sucking, and the remainder were
corrected during orthodontia the child probably would have needed
anyway. Our dentist commented at Eric's last checkup that his front
teeth have moved back from the pressure of his lip since he has cut
back on thumbsucking.
When Eric was a toddler, the dentist and especially the hygenist were
almost rabid about the horrors of thumbsucking. But at Eric's last
checkup, the dentist told me that Eric's teeth had moved since he had
"quit thumbsucking." I said, "Actually, he is still thumbsucking,
just much less often and for much less time." And the dentist said
something mellow like, "Oh, well, most kids quit on their own by the
time they could do any real damage." Not what he said three years
ago! Did we get him on a bad day back then? Did he want to scare me
into making thumbsucking a big issue? Is he mellower because Eric's
bite isn't as bad as he expected? Who can say.
I always thought that the stress we'd all suffer if we tried to make
Eric stop sucking his thumb--and the inevitable failure of such
efforts, and him feeling shamed, and driving the behavior
underground--were not worth any possible benefit to his teeth.
I always try to remember with doctors and dentists that they're
usually giving advice based on one aspect of the whole person. Their
concern is, rightly, with the teeth--but they're not always putting
their recommendation re: teeth in a context of a person's overall
well-being. There may very well be other factors that outweigh their
specific advice.
With Eric,and with my son Carl, who is still nursing at 3, I have
very mellowly commented on occasion, "Someday you won't suck your
thumb anymore." or "Someday you'll be all done nursing!"
From Early childhood pacifier use in relation to breastfeeding,
SIDS, infection and dental malocclusion.(sudden infant death syndrome)
(Clinical report). Joanna Briggs. Nursing Standard 20.38 (May 31,
2006): p52(4). A survey of existing research on the subject:
Pacifier use and dental malocclusion
The relationship of pacifier use and dental malocclusion has been a
subject of great interest to dentists and child health professionals
for many years. Forty-seven articles were identified that purported
to investigate this relationship. Six studies met the inclusion
criteria, of which five were cohort studies (Bowden 1966, Larsson
1986, Bishara et al 1987, Paunio et al 1993, Warren and Bishara 2002)
and one was a case-control study (Meyers and Hertzberg 1988). There
were no RCTs and the excluded articles were mostly case-series and
cross-sectional designs. Not one of the cohort or case-control
studies reported a measure of association, such as an estimate of
relative risk. It was therefore not possible to include these studies
in the final review.
Summary of findings: Because of the absence of adequate studies, no
conclusions could be made.
Implications for practice: Dental malocclusion: it was found that
because of the paucity of adequate epidemiological studies, no
conclusions could be made.
2.
On the other hand, Effects of nonnutritive sucking habits on occlusal
characteristics in the mixed dentition in Pediatric dentistry
(Pediatr Dent) 2005 Nov-Dec; 27(6): 445-50, says that "Sustained
pacifier habits, including those of 24 to 47 months, were associated
with anterior open bite and Class II molar relationships, while digit
habits were associated with anterior open bite when sustained for 60
months or longer. CONCLUSIONS: Malocclusions are quite prevalent in
the mixed dentition, and anterior open bite and posterior crossbite
may be preventable by modifying nonnutritive sucking behaviors.,"
which seems to mean that yes, bite problems are more common in kids
who use pacifiers long-term.
On the other hand, I can't seem to find anything that lays out what
sorts of dire things happen to people with bite problems. Just how
big a problem is it? I'm not sure.
3.
Do pacifiers reduce the risk of sudden infant death syndrome? A meta-
analysis.
Source:
Pediatrics (Pediatrics) 2005 Nov; 116(5): e716-23
Says: "Published case-control studies demonstrate a significant
reduced risk of SIDS with pacifier use, particularly when placed for
sleep.... Therefore, we recommend that pacifiers be offered to
infants as a potential method to reduce the risk of SIDS. The
pacifier should be offered to the infant when being placed for all
sleep episodes, including daytime naps and nighttime sleeps. This is
a US Preventive Services Task Force level B strength of
recommendation based on the consistency of findings and the
likelihood that the beneficial effects will outweigh any potential
negative effects."
4.
I have found estimates ranging from 30% to 75% of how many children
eventually get braces. It varies by economic class and other factors.
I have a son who still sucks his thumb at age 6. He does it much less
than he did when he was younger; he used to suck all night, and now
only sucks to fall asleep, and rarely during the day. He has created
a big gap between two teeth in front by thumb-sucking--a perfect
thumb-sized opening. After some initial panic when he was 3 or so, I
have gotten really comfortable with it. I think that when his adult
teeth start to come in, if he is still thumb-sucking, I'll talk to
him about the possible effects. I remember reading in my earlier
research that most bite problems caused by thumb-sucking self-correct
by age 10 if the child stops sucking, and the remainder were
corrected during orthodontia the child probably would have needed
anyway. Our dentist commented at Eric's last checkup that his front
teeth have moved back from the pressure of his lip since he has cut
back on thumbsucking.
When Eric was a toddler, the dentist and especially the hygenist were
almost rabid about the horrors of thumbsucking. But at Eric's last
checkup, the dentist told me that Eric's teeth had moved since he had
"quit thumbsucking." I said, "Actually, he is still thumbsucking,
just much less often and for much less time." And the dentist said
something mellow like, "Oh, well, most kids quit on their own by the
time they could do any real damage." Not what he said three years
ago! Did we get him on a bad day back then? Did he want to scare me
into making thumbsucking a big issue? Is he mellower because Eric's
bite isn't as bad as he expected? Who can say.
I always thought that the stress we'd all suffer if we tried to make
Eric stop sucking his thumb--and the inevitable failure of such
efforts, and him feeling shamed, and driving the behavior
underground--were not worth any possible benefit to his teeth.
I always try to remember with doctors and dentists that they're
usually giving advice based on one aspect of the whole person. Their
concern is, rightly, with the teeth--but they're not always putting
their recommendation re: teeth in a context of a person's overall
well-being. There may very well be other factors that outweigh their
specific advice.
With Eric,and with my son Carl, who is still nursing at 3, I have
very mellowly commented on occasion, "Someday you won't suck your
thumb anymore." or "Someday you'll be all done nursing!"
On Jun 9, 2007, at 11:33 AM, trewhittjoy wrote:
> The dentist said that her palate
> will begin to harden soon and we will have major problems later if
> she doesn't get rid of it before then.
Ask your dentist to quantify the "major problems" and provide
citations. I've had doctors be very happy to help me find literature.
And then I feel like i have good information for making a decision.
> Do I keep
> pressuring her?
> Do I hide it and pretend that it is lost?
I wouldn't do either of these things. With Eric and his thumb-
sucking, I always think that any damage to his teeth is much less
important than any damage I might to do our relationship or to his
self-esteem. I could never think of any way to discourage his thumb-
sucking that wouldn't be stressful and conflict-laden, so I never
tried to discourage it. I have only recently mentioned to him in
passing that the dentist is concerned that it might cause problems
with his teeth.
Good luck.
Su
mom of Eric, 6, and Carl, 3
bobcatpris2000
--- In [email protected], "trewhittjoy"
<trewhittjoy@...> wrote:
When dd14 was a baby with a thumb or pacifier in her mouth all the
time, people bugged me about crooked teeth. I quoted childcare expert
Dr. Barry Brazelton who said something like, "Braces are cheaper that
psychotherapy". That shut them up. Her teeth are perfectly straight.
Genetics? I don't know.
I think the sensory need will surface somewhere else that might be
even more irritating to controlling adults. After dd was born, the
nurses saw her trying to find her thumb and said, "Ahhhh, self-
comforting behavior." They thought it was a good thing. Lots of teens
and moms told me they had sucked their thumbs secretly til about age
16. I think what really bothered people was that she wasn't bothered
by other kids teasing or adults staring (we were still in public
school).
Priscilla
<trewhittjoy@...> wrote:
>Joy,
> Hi ,
> I am not sure how to handle my (just turned) three year old and her
> constant pacifier usage.
When dd14 was a baby with a thumb or pacifier in her mouth all the
time, people bugged me about crooked teeth. I quoted childcare expert
Dr. Barry Brazelton who said something like, "Braces are cheaper that
psychotherapy". That shut them up. Her teeth are perfectly straight.
Genetics? I don't know.
I think the sensory need will surface somewhere else that might be
even more irritating to controlling adults. After dd was born, the
nurses saw her trying to find her thumb and said, "Ahhhh, self-
comforting behavior." They thought it was a good thing. Lots of teens
and moms told me they had sucked their thumbs secretly til about age
16. I think what really bothered people was that she wasn't bothered
by other kids teasing or adults staring (we were still in public
school).
Priscilla
[email protected]
Tell you what: if he's still sucking on a pacifier at 16, let us know.
<g>
Seriously, he WON'T be sucking on a pacifier much longer. Let him enjoy
it.
The more you worry, the more anxiety he'll feel, the more comfort he'll
need, so the more he'll want that plug.
Relax. Know it's not a permanent fixture.
Same as for family bed and nursing. They will NOT be sleeping with you
at 16 (not much, anyway---when Cam's sick, he'll still crawl in with me
sometimes). They don't still nurse at 13. <g>
Relax. He'll be done when he's done.
~Kelly
Kelly Lovejoy
Conference Coordinator
Live and Learn Unschooling Conference
http://www.LiveandLearnConference.org
________________________________________________________________________
AOL now offers free email to everyone. Find out more about what's free
from AOL at AOL.com.
<g>
Seriously, he WON'T be sucking on a pacifier much longer. Let him enjoy
it.
The more you worry, the more anxiety he'll feel, the more comfort he'll
need, so the more he'll want that plug.
Relax. Know it's not a permanent fixture.
Same as for family bed and nursing. They will NOT be sleeping with you
at 16 (not much, anyway---when Cam's sick, he'll still crawl in with me
sometimes). They don't still nurse at 13. <g>
Relax. He'll be done when he's done.
~Kelly
Kelly Lovejoy
Conference Coordinator
Live and Learn Unschooling Conference
http://www.LiveandLearnConference.org
________________________________________________________________________
AOL now offers free email to everyone. Find out more about what's free
from AOL at AOL.com.
Melissa
My daughter used hers until six, and my son until four, and they both have wonderful
teeth. I think it's pretty random, on who's palate blahblahblah. They were both very
needing to suck, and even when full up and done breastfeeding would need to suckle on.
Just leave it alone (which I think everyone said lol!) She really will outgrow it. And yes,
doctors really do try to emphasize their personal opinions to get you to 'join the dark
side'. When i wanted a vbac, my OB told me she had literally seen 'hundreds' of women die
from ruptures. I was like, "Really, where else do you practice, because numbers aren't that
high in our area of the state." And never went back. I don't trust professionals who
exaggerate to get their point across.
Melissa
teeth. I think it's pretty random, on who's palate blahblahblah. They were both very
needing to suck, and even when full up and done breastfeeding would need to suckle on.
Just leave it alone (which I think everyone said lol!) She really will outgrow it. And yes,
doctors really do try to emphasize their personal opinions to get you to 'join the dark
side'. When i wanted a vbac, my OB told me she had literally seen 'hundreds' of women die
from ruptures. I was like, "Really, where else do you practice, because numbers aren't that
high in our area of the state." And never went back. I don't trust professionals who
exaggerate to get their point across.
Melissa
--- In [email protected], "trewhittjoy" <trewhittjoy@...> wrote:
>
> Hi,
> I am not sure how to handle my (just turned) three year old and her
> constant pacifier usage. The pediatrician and pediatric dentist
> have told me to get rid of it. The dentist said that her palate
> will begin to harden soon and we will have major problems later if
> she doesn't get rid of it before then. I wish that I had not used a
> pacifier, but I was had read that the AAP said it helped reduce SIDS
> risk. My one year old ds only takes his when he goes to sleep, so I
> am going to try to get rid of his slowly (He is still nursing). My
> dd weaned at 17 months and she has always liked taking the
> pacifier. I feel like I am causing her stress by pressuring her to
> give it up. The pediatrician said to cut the nipple off and she
> would lose interest in the plastic handle--I mentioned this to her
> and big tears welled up in her eyes at the thought of cutting the
> nipple off. I wonder if she will give it up on her own? Do I keep
> pressuring her? Do I hide it and pretend that it is lost? Is this
> a big deal? I know sometimes the doctors' make things sound worse
> than they are. Please let me know what you think.
> Thanks!
> Joy
>
Brian & Alexandra Polikowsky
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>I looked up Dr. Sears, whilemainstream - is also a great and sensitive person (practice, actually) So here
is the link on all things pacifiers. I hope it helps! <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
As much as I have loved Dr Sears when my first ds was an infant I find him NOT very sensitive at all compared to mindful parents...so beware of his advice.
The Discipline Book is pretty ...shall I say.....NOT good.
Alex
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Lisa
My almost 17 yr old was a committed pacifier user when she was a wee
one....she would have one in her mouth and several in each hand at all
times! She LOVED IT!! We were concerned about her teeth and
asked our dentist if it would cause problems with her teeth. He said
that kids who have orthodontic problems typically have them because of
crowded teeth (which isn't caused by a paci) or from tongue thrust
(not caused by a paci and actually the paci forces the tongue into a
healthier position ..probably why it helps with SIDS) and from the
pressure that some kids put on their front teeth when they suck
fingers... some finger suckers do not exert pressure and some do.
His opinion was basically that kids who end up with braces will end up
with braces whether they suck a paci, their fingers or nothing
additionally (aside from nursing from breast or bottle). His opinion
was give her the damn paci if I am wrong we can fix her teeth but we
can't fix her psyche if we forbid her natural need to suck!! For
the record she did give up her pacifier at around 4 1/2 yrs old on her
own.... she also had braces because her mouth was small and her teeth
were crowded.... her projected 24 month treatment plan took only 14
months and she has beautiful teeth!
I have a friend who refused to let her child have a paci because she
didn't want to ruin her teeth or have to fight to take it away at a
certain time.... this child became a committed finger sucker, chewed
on everything, mouthed everything and so forth. Every time this
child found a way to soothe herself her mother took it away. This
same child is now 14 yrs old and doesn't trust her mother to meet her
emotional needs and never has. She has never developed the skills to
calm herself down when she's upset either.
I also vote against the snipping the end off the paci... the
suggestion to do this is typically made by dentists and doctors who
want you to do that in secret and then try to convince the child it's
broken! I find it funny that they didn't count on you discussing that
with your daughter! HA! They wanted you to "trick her" but that
isn't really something that non coercive parents do!
So let her have the damn paci (in the words of my lovely now retired
dentist!)
Lisa Blocker
one....she would have one in her mouth and several in each hand at all
times! She LOVED IT!! We were concerned about her teeth and
asked our dentist if it would cause problems with her teeth. He said
that kids who have orthodontic problems typically have them because of
crowded teeth (which isn't caused by a paci) or from tongue thrust
(not caused by a paci and actually the paci forces the tongue into a
healthier position ..probably why it helps with SIDS) and from the
pressure that some kids put on their front teeth when they suck
fingers... some finger suckers do not exert pressure and some do.
His opinion was basically that kids who end up with braces will end up
with braces whether they suck a paci, their fingers or nothing
additionally (aside from nursing from breast or bottle). His opinion
was give her the damn paci if I am wrong we can fix her teeth but we
can't fix her psyche if we forbid her natural need to suck!! For
the record she did give up her pacifier at around 4 1/2 yrs old on her
own.... she also had braces because her mouth was small and her teeth
were crowded.... her projected 24 month treatment plan took only 14
months and she has beautiful teeth!
I have a friend who refused to let her child have a paci because she
didn't want to ruin her teeth or have to fight to take it away at a
certain time.... this child became a committed finger sucker, chewed
on everything, mouthed everything and so forth. Every time this
child found a way to soothe herself her mother took it away. This
same child is now 14 yrs old and doesn't trust her mother to meet her
emotional needs and never has. She has never developed the skills to
calm herself down when she's upset either.
I also vote against the snipping the end off the paci... the
suggestion to do this is typically made by dentists and doctors who
want you to do that in secret and then try to convince the child it's
broken! I find it funny that they didn't count on you discussing that
with your daughter! HA! They wanted you to "trick her" but that
isn't really something that non coercive parents do!
So let her have the damn paci (in the words of my lovely now retired
dentist!)
Lisa Blocker
trewhittjoy
Thank you everyone for the responses. Please note, she was my first
child and I am definitely more informed the second time around. The
nurses at the hospital actually gave her the paci to begin with. I
told the nurses "no" paci when my son was born and gave it to him
when he was a few weeks old (because at the time I heard of the SIDS
risk being lessened). It causes my dd great distress to think of
giving her beloved paci up and that is why I asked everyone here for
advice. In my heart it did not feel right to pressure her. Her
teeth, both top and bottom, do stick out somewhat in the perfect
shape of the pacifier. The dentist said that when the palate
hardens (around this time) that the palate would be permanently
damaged and she would require oral surgery. That is what got my
attention. Definitely not misinformed people who have been so rude
to take the pacifier out of my daughters' mouth (yes, this has
happened). I always tell them to leave her alone and mind there own
business (yes, I would like to sock 'em, but I can't do that).
My dd LOVES ballet. She dresses in her tutu and slippers every day
and dances in front of her instructional video. We are going to let
her take lessons. I have informed her that she would have to put
the paci away for this and she would have to go poohpooh on the
potty (a teacher requirement). She has been wearing panties since
last October. When she feels the urge to do #2, she will run and
put a pull-up on herself, and then ask to be changed. She has not
shown an interest in doing the latter at this time, but she will
hand me her paci and smile when she begins to play dance. I
encourage her "big girl" attitude. I sometimes tell her that I
can't understand what she is saying because of the pacifier, and she
will remove it long enough to get her point across. I tell her I
would like to see her pretty smile or teeth and she will show them
to me. Then she pops the pacifier back in.
I am going to stop bugging her about it. She is smart enough to
know that she will have to give it up when she is ready (ballet
lessons). I don't think she is ready yet. I told her that it is
fine to hold off on lessons until next year. She is okay with
that.
I did learn something else I didn't know from the posts, that
according to Dr. Sears, the pacifier should not be used without the
loving presence of the parent (much like the bottle for bottle fed
babies). I never thought of it that way. If I ever do have another
baby I will keep this in mind... if I use it at all. I nursed both
children as long as they desired (son is 1 and still going very
strong). I am always torn on my decision making (like every mom).
I want to do the perfect thing for my children and that is why I
joined this group. You all help me make better, more informed,
decisions. Thanks so much!
Joy
child and I am definitely more informed the second time around. The
nurses at the hospital actually gave her the paci to begin with. I
told the nurses "no" paci when my son was born and gave it to him
when he was a few weeks old (because at the time I heard of the SIDS
risk being lessened). It causes my dd great distress to think of
giving her beloved paci up and that is why I asked everyone here for
advice. In my heart it did not feel right to pressure her. Her
teeth, both top and bottom, do stick out somewhat in the perfect
shape of the pacifier. The dentist said that when the palate
hardens (around this time) that the palate would be permanently
damaged and she would require oral surgery. That is what got my
attention. Definitely not misinformed people who have been so rude
to take the pacifier out of my daughters' mouth (yes, this has
happened). I always tell them to leave her alone and mind there own
business (yes, I would like to sock 'em, but I can't do that).
My dd LOVES ballet. She dresses in her tutu and slippers every day
and dances in front of her instructional video. We are going to let
her take lessons. I have informed her that she would have to put
the paci away for this and she would have to go poohpooh on the
potty (a teacher requirement). She has been wearing panties since
last October. When she feels the urge to do #2, she will run and
put a pull-up on herself, and then ask to be changed. She has not
shown an interest in doing the latter at this time, but she will
hand me her paci and smile when she begins to play dance. I
encourage her "big girl" attitude. I sometimes tell her that I
can't understand what she is saying because of the pacifier, and she
will remove it long enough to get her point across. I tell her I
would like to see her pretty smile or teeth and she will show them
to me. Then she pops the pacifier back in.
I am going to stop bugging her about it. She is smart enough to
know that she will have to give it up when she is ready (ballet
lessons). I don't think she is ready yet. I told her that it is
fine to hold off on lessons until next year. She is okay with
that.
I did learn something else I didn't know from the posts, that
according to Dr. Sears, the pacifier should not be used without the
loving presence of the parent (much like the bottle for bottle fed
babies). I never thought of it that way. If I ever do have another
baby I will keep this in mind... if I use it at all. I nursed both
children as long as they desired (son is 1 and still going very
strong). I am always torn on my decision making (like every mom).
I want to do the perfect thing for my children and that is why I
joined this group. You all help me make better, more informed,
decisions. Thanks so much!
Joy
caradove
I feel like I am causing her stress by pressuring her to
emotions of your child. That is a disgusting thing to say in the same
league as telling someone to rub nasty tasting stuff on the nipple to
stop a toddler breastfeeding.
My daughter is four next month, she still has her pacifier. I never
ever used one for my older three, but when Dharani was newborn she
would go crazy with terror every time we went in the car. Even when we
stopped to nurse she would go wild as soon as she went back in her
seat. The pacifier was a last resort but it worked.
Her two front top teeth have a gap, but then I never had a pacifier
and I had braces for teeth growing in all crazy angles. Our Midwife
says that maternal nutrition has more to do with good dental
positioning and enough room for the teeth.
my fifth was born sucking her two middle fingers and does all the time
now at one year. I wonder if the pediatrician would recommend chopping
the tops off so she cant suck them?
I wonder if she will give it up on her own? Do I keep
time!!!
I know sometimes the doctors' make things sound worse than they are.
They are very good at that!!!!!!!!
Cara
> give it up. The pediatrician said to cut the nipple off and sheFor a pediatrician to say that says to me they have no care for the
> would lose interest in the plastic handle--I mentioned this to her
> and big tears welled up in her eyes at the thought of cutting the
> nipple off.
emotions of your child. That is a disgusting thing to say in the same
league as telling someone to rub nasty tasting stuff on the nipple to
stop a toddler breastfeeding.
My daughter is four next month, she still has her pacifier. I never
ever used one for my older three, but when Dharani was newborn she
would go crazy with terror every time we went in the car. Even when we
stopped to nurse she would go wild as soon as she went back in her
seat. The pacifier was a last resort but it worked.
Her two front top teeth have a gap, but then I never had a pacifier
and I had braces for teeth growing in all crazy angles. Our Midwife
says that maternal nutrition has more to do with good dental
positioning and enough room for the teeth.
my fifth was born sucking her two middle fingers and does all the time
now at one year. I wonder if the pediatrician would recommend chopping
the tops off so she cant suck them?
I wonder if she will give it up on her own? Do I keep
> pressuring her? Do I hide it and pretend that it is lost? Is thisYou dont see ten year olds with pacifiers<bwg> so she will quit some
> a big deal? Please let me know what you think.
> Thanks!
> Joy
>
time!!!
I know sometimes the doctors' make things sound worse than they are.
They are very good at that!!!!!!!!
Cara
Ren Allen
~~You dont see ten year olds with pacifiers<bwg> so she will quit some
time!!!~~
Oh HUH!:)
It's too funny that this topic rolled around when it did. My 10 y.o.
has been wanting to buy a pacifier to play with, so we picked one up
last night. Actually, we picked up two.
Jalen and Sierra (6 and 10) have been walking around with those things
in their mouths constantly. They're playing "babies" and crawling
around...but also running around outside with the paci in their mouth.
I'm sure the neighbors love it. ;)
It's satisfying a need to revisit their babyhood....even though
neither of them ever had a paci! They were both breastfed long-term
(Jalen until 4.5) but maybe the paci is even more interesting because
of that.
It doesn't matter to me. The point is, they are enjoying
them...whether it's a game or fulfilling some need/desire.
I trust my children will get what they need from this activity.
Ren
learninginfreedom.com
time!!!~~
Oh HUH!:)
It's too funny that this topic rolled around when it did. My 10 y.o.
has been wanting to buy a pacifier to play with, so we picked one up
last night. Actually, we picked up two.
Jalen and Sierra (6 and 10) have been walking around with those things
in their mouths constantly. They're playing "babies" and crawling
around...but also running around outside with the paci in their mouth.
I'm sure the neighbors love it. ;)
It's satisfying a need to revisit their babyhood....even though
neither of them ever had a paci! They were both breastfed long-term
(Jalen until 4.5) but maybe the paci is even more interesting because
of that.
It doesn't matter to me. The point is, they are enjoying
them...whether it's a game or fulfilling some need/desire.
I trust my children will get what they need from this activity.
Ren
learninginfreedom.com
Ren Allen
~~
I am going to stop bugging her about it. She is smart enough to
know that she will have to give it up when she is ready (ballet
lessons). ~~
I wouldn't even bring it up in relation to the lessons. She's very,
very little and lessons just aren't necessary to feed her love of
dance. Buy her dance videos for young children. It sounds like she has
the gear...keep nourishing that and fueling it without making any
reference to anything formal. Lessons are really not ideal for young
children in my opinion. Wait until she's older.
Be happy that she has a method to comfort herself. I would never say
anything negative about the paci....just trust that she needs it and
leave it at that. Don't make lessons something worth getting rid of it
for. Lessons are highly overrated most of the time.:)
Ren
learninginfreedom.com
I am going to stop bugging her about it. She is smart enough to
know that she will have to give it up when she is ready (ballet
lessons). ~~
I wouldn't even bring it up in relation to the lessons. She's very,
very little and lessons just aren't necessary to feed her love of
dance. Buy her dance videos for young children. It sounds like she has
the gear...keep nourishing that and fueling it without making any
reference to anything formal. Lessons are really not ideal for young
children in my opinion. Wait until she's older.
Be happy that she has a method to comfort herself. I would never say
anything negative about the paci....just trust that she needs it and
leave it at that. Don't make lessons something worth getting rid of it
for. Lessons are highly overrated most of the time.:)
Ren
learninginfreedom.com
Meredith
--- In [email protected], "trewhittjoy"
<trewhittjoy@...> wrote:
let her have more independence - she could carry her food with her
while exploring, rather than having to stop what she was doing eat.
I can see a pacifier, or other mouth-toy, being used *by the child*
in a similar way to exercise some autonomy on an emotional level.
There's a difference between a parent deciding to use a bottle or
paci and a child deciding to use one.
*more* helpful" rather than "what's the best decision". I find it
helps me be more confident in my parenting and better able to handle
those times when I'm less than perfect ;)
---Meredith (Mo 5.5, Ray 13)
<trewhittjoy@...> wrote:
>> according to Dr. Sears, the pacifier should not be used withoutthe
> loving presence of the parent (much like the bottle for bottle fedMy dd prefferred a bottle once she started learning to walk bc it
> babies). I never thought of it that way.
let her have more independence - she could carry her food with her
while exploring, rather than having to stop what she was doing eat.
I can see a pacifier, or other mouth-toy, being used *by the child*
in a similar way to exercise some autonomy on an emotional level.
There's a difference between a parent deciding to use a bottle or
paci and a child deciding to use one.
> I am always torn on my decision making (like every mom).Personally, I've found it helpful to think in terms of "what will be
> I want to do the perfect thing for my children and that is why I
> joined this group.
*more* helpful" rather than "what's the best decision". I find it
helps me be more confident in my parenting and better able to handle
those times when I'm less than perfect ;)
---Meredith (Mo 5.5, Ray 13)
trewhittjoy
--- In [email protected], "Meredith" <meredith@...>
wrote:
I totally agree! I think Dr. Sears meant a new baby. I am fine
with my toddler running around independently--my one year old won't
nurse if he is busy exploring. My daughter did choose to drink
Danimals yogurt instead of nursing at 17 months. I was 3 months
pregnant at the time so I did not press the nursing issue. It was
pretty painful at that point.
loving household. I am trying to erase everything I know and start
from scratch. It is overwhelming at times. I want to be the mom who
never yells, is always calm, listens to every little word they
utter, and has everything under control (house not a disaster,
supper cooked with a well balanced meal, bills and check book in
order, and my own stress under control) This is asking way to much
I know, but I can't seem to find the right balance to make me happy
with the situation.
wrote:
>fed
> --- In [email protected], "trewhittjoy"
> <trewhittjoy@> wrote:
> >> according to Dr. Sears, the pacifier should not be used without
> the
> > loving presence of the parent (much like the bottle for bottle
> > babies). I never thought of it that way.eat.
>
> My dd prefferred a bottle once she started learning to walk bc it
> let her have more independence - she could carry her food with her
> while exploring, rather than having to stop what she was doing
I totally agree! I think Dr. Sears meant a new baby. I am fine
with my toddler running around independently--my one year old won't
nurse if he is busy exploring. My daughter did choose to drink
Danimals yogurt instead of nursing at 17 months. I was 3 months
pregnant at the time so I did not press the nursing issue. It was
pretty painful at that point.
>be
> > I am always torn on my decision making (like every mom).
> > I want to do the perfect thing for my children and that is why I
> > joined this group.
>
> Personally, I've found it helpful to think in terms of "what will
> *more* helpful" rather than "what's the best decision". I find ithandle
> helps me be more confident in my parenting and better able to
> those times when I'm less than perfect ;)I feel like I am constantly screwing up. I was not raised in a
loving household. I am trying to erase everything I know and start
from scratch. It is overwhelming at times. I want to be the mom who
never yells, is always calm, listens to every little word they
utter, and has everything under control (house not a disaster,
supper cooked with a well balanced meal, bills and check book in
order, and my own stress under control) This is asking way to much
I know, but I can't seem to find the right balance to make me happy
with the situation.
[email protected]
In a message dated 6/9/2007 6:22:54 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time,
polykow@... writes:
here
is the link on all things pacifiers. I hope it helps!
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
As much as I have loved Dr Sears when my first ds was an infant I find him
NOT very sensitive at all compared to mindful parents...so beware of his
advice.
The Discipline Book is pretty ...shall I say.....NOT good.
Alex
oh, really? damn...er, darn ;) my only second hand experience with him/them
was via a lovely 19 year old that took her daughter Sunshine there. she was
happy with the ease of their accepting her UA birth in a yurt and her desire
for no vaccinations, so i may jump too easily to dr. sears. perhaps the "best"
of the conventional folks isn't always helpful. maybe drjaygordon.com, lol...
:) he's my son's ped, but i don't remember a thing about pacifier usage.
anyway, good luck with what you decide and how you handle it. i myself, as
many of the contributors here are, a hands off kinda parent in these issues - i
just know too how hard it can be to go up against convention. you've gotten
excellent advice in my opinion!
warmly,
Karen
************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
polykow@... writes:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>I looked up Dr. Sears, whilemainstream - is also a great and sensitive person (practice, actually) So
here
is the link on all things pacifiers. I hope it helps!
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
As much as I have loved Dr Sears when my first ds was an infant I find him
NOT very sensitive at all compared to mindful parents...so beware of his
advice.
The Discipline Book is pretty ...shall I say.....NOT good.
Alex
oh, really? damn...er, darn ;) my only second hand experience with him/them
was via a lovely 19 year old that took her daughter Sunshine there. she was
happy with the ease of their accepting her UA birth in a yurt and her desire
for no vaccinations, so i may jump too easily to dr. sears. perhaps the "best"
of the conventional folks isn't always helpful. maybe drjaygordon.com, lol...
:) he's my son's ped, but i don't remember a thing about pacifier usage.
anyway, good luck with what you decide and how you handle it. i myself, as
many of the contributors here are, a hands off kinda parent in these issues - i
just know too how hard it can be to go up against convention. you've gotten
excellent advice in my opinion!
warmly,
Karen
************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Brian & Alexandra Polikowsky
Don't get me wrong I would LOVE to have him as a ped doctor ( or DR Jay Gordon) but I really draw the line after reading The Discipline Book....
Alex
Alex
----- Original Message -----
From: Kidgie@...
To: [email protected]
Sent: Sunday, June 10, 2007 3:05 PM
Subject: Re: [unschoolingbasics] weaning off pacifier
In a message dated 6/9/2007 6:22:54 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time,
polykow@... writes:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>I looked up Dr. Sears, while
mainstream - is also a great and sensitive person (practice, actually) So
here
is the link on all things pacifiers. I hope it helps!
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
As much as I have loved Dr Sears when my first ds was an infant I find him
NOT very sensitive at all compared to mindful parents...so beware of his
advice.
The Discipline Book is pretty ...shall I say.....NOT good.
Alex
oh, really? damn...er, darn ;) my only second hand experience with him/them
was via a lovely 19 year old that took her daughter Sunshine there. she was
happy with the ease of their accepting her UA birth in a yurt and her desire
for no vaccinations, so i may jump too easily to dr. sears. perhaps the "best"
of the conventional folks isn't always helpful. maybe drjaygordon.com, lol...
:) he's my son's ped, but i don't remember a thing about pacifier usage.
anyway, good luck with what you decide and how you handle it. i myself, as
many of the contributors here are, a hands off kinda parent in these issues - i
just know too how hard it can be to go up against convention. you've gotten
excellent advice in my opinion!
warmly,
Karen
************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Melissa
I just wanted to let you know you are NOT ALONE....lol!
I was raised in a really ugly household, and my first ideas in parenting were to do the
opposite of everything my mom did. Seriously, when something would come up, I would
think, what would my mom do? and do the opposite. Not very mindful of me, that came
later. It was a process. It makes me think of a recent blog article I read (Crystals Daikini
Crossroads, which I love btw). She was writing about 'the process' and had pictures of their
house, how her daughter has Stuff. And it looks like a mess, but it comes together in the
most beautiful way, everything with a purpose, everything where it needs to be. And
growing into an unschooling person looks messy, in our brains. We have to get all that
stuff out, let it have it's purpose, and CREATE the life we choose.
I think everyone struggles, but that is mostly that is self-perception. what helps me the
most is to have a friend of like mindness around, who can say, "I really like how you
handled that!"
I do yell. Not at the kids, but when I'm frustrated I can let out a holler. ARGH...this isn't
working how I planned! Then the kids come up and reassure me, point out suggestions,
and I love it. I love how they are learning that even adults need help, that I'm open to
suggestions, and modeling how to ask for help. It's better than yelling at the kids, and
maybe I'll move to a point where I am not yelling, but I doubt it. I'm an emotional
expressive person, and my joy, sorrow, eagerness are all so intense!
Control is overstated. Our best days are days when the house becomes an absolute wreck,
mostly because we're focused on something else and it's 'okay'. We had a yard sale this
weekend. SO all week the house has been a wreck and it's okay. We expected that, dirty
dishes in the sink, pizza boxes in the floor, toys and dirt and bugs and clothes
everywhere. For everything there is a season (hum with me! I honestly didn't mean that to
happen but now it's stuck in my head) There are days the kids really want the house clean,
and there are days when it's not even part of our thought process. It comes, more and
more. I'm liking it coming more and more, because those days are like floating down a
river, someone asks "Where you been? What'd ya see?" and you're like, "I dunno, but dang,
it was beautiful!"
Random thoughts from a lady who's fixing to make a butterfly cake for one birthday girl,
edible bowls with someone else (he's thinking chocolate chip cookie dough, but maybe
pizza dough), and trying to help yet another little person make a garland of cheezits and
cocoa puffs. Interesting life!
Melissa
I was raised in a really ugly household, and my first ideas in parenting were to do the
opposite of everything my mom did. Seriously, when something would come up, I would
think, what would my mom do? and do the opposite. Not very mindful of me, that came
later. It was a process. It makes me think of a recent blog article I read (Crystals Daikini
Crossroads, which I love btw). She was writing about 'the process' and had pictures of their
house, how her daughter has Stuff. And it looks like a mess, but it comes together in the
most beautiful way, everything with a purpose, everything where it needs to be. And
growing into an unschooling person looks messy, in our brains. We have to get all that
stuff out, let it have it's purpose, and CREATE the life we choose.
I think everyone struggles, but that is mostly that is self-perception. what helps me the
most is to have a friend of like mindness around, who can say, "I really like how you
handled that!"
I do yell. Not at the kids, but when I'm frustrated I can let out a holler. ARGH...this isn't
working how I planned! Then the kids come up and reassure me, point out suggestions,
and I love it. I love how they are learning that even adults need help, that I'm open to
suggestions, and modeling how to ask for help. It's better than yelling at the kids, and
maybe I'll move to a point where I am not yelling, but I doubt it. I'm an emotional
expressive person, and my joy, sorrow, eagerness are all so intense!
Control is overstated. Our best days are days when the house becomes an absolute wreck,
mostly because we're focused on something else and it's 'okay'. We had a yard sale this
weekend. SO all week the house has been a wreck and it's okay. We expected that, dirty
dishes in the sink, pizza boxes in the floor, toys and dirt and bugs and clothes
everywhere. For everything there is a season (hum with me! I honestly didn't mean that to
happen but now it's stuck in my head) There are days the kids really want the house clean,
and there are days when it's not even part of our thought process. It comes, more and
more. I'm liking it coming more and more, because those days are like floating down a
river, someone asks "Where you been? What'd ya see?" and you're like, "I dunno, but dang,
it was beautiful!"
Random thoughts from a lady who's fixing to make a butterfly cake for one birthday girl,
edible bowls with someone else (he's thinking chocolate chip cookie dough, but maybe
pizza dough), and trying to help yet another little person make a garland of cheezits and
cocoa puffs. Interesting life!
Melissa
--- In [email protected], "trewhittjoy" <trewhittjoy@...> wrote:
> I feel like I am constantly screwing up. I was not raised in a
> loving household. I am trying to erase everything I know and start
> from scratch. It is overwhelming at times. I want to be the mom who
> never yells, is always calm, listens to every little word they
> utter, and has everything under control (house not a disaster,
> supper cooked with a well balanced meal, bills and check book in
> order, and my own stress under control) This is asking way to much
> I know, but I can't seem to find the right balance to make me happy
> with the situation.
>
[email protected]
-----Original Message-----
From: trewhittjoy <trewhittjoy@...>
The dentist said that when the palate
hardens (around this time) that the palate would be permanently
damaged and she would require oral surgery. That is what got my
attention.
-=-=-=-=-
It probably should have gotten your attention *just* enough to ask what
he meant by that---or to look at it more closely yourself.
Do you think that every child who uses a pacifier requires oral
surgery? Does he?
Scare tactics.
-=-=-=-=-=-
She has not
shown an interest in doing the latter at this time, but she will
hand me her paci and smile when she begins to play dance.
-=-=-=-==-
Just a side-trip to examine vocabulary.
She's NOT "play dancing"---she's REALLY dancing!
They aren't "practicing piano"---they're PLAYING the piano!
Little changes like that can make a lot of head-way quickly in
understanding unschooling.
-=-=-=-=-=-
She is smart enough to know that she will have to give it up when she
is ready (ballet
lessons).
-=-=-=-=-
I don't know that it's that she's "smart enough"---it's more that she
doesn't really care! <g> And you're right---she's not ready. She'll be
done when she's done---and she won't *have* to give it up, she'll
CHOOSE to!
Again---the vocabulary we choose to use makes a big difference in
making the paradigm shift.
-=-=-=-=-
I did learn something else I didn't know from the posts, that
according to Dr. Sears, the pacifier should not be used without the
loving presence of the parent (much like the bottle for bottle fed
babies).
-=-=-=-
I'm not sure I understand this. So, if the child is apart from the
parent (at Grandma's for the afternoon, for instance), she shouldn't be
allowed to have the comfort of her pacifier? That seems like the time
she would want it *more*.
Am I misunderstanding?
~Kelly
Kelly Lovejoy
Conference Coordinator
Live and Learn Unschooling Conference
http://www.LiveandLearnConference.org
________________________________________________________________________
AOL now offers free email to everyone. Find out more about what's free
from AOL at AOL.com.
From: trewhittjoy <trewhittjoy@...>
The dentist said that when the palate
hardens (around this time) that the palate would be permanently
damaged and she would require oral surgery. That is what got my
attention.
-=-=-=-=-
It probably should have gotten your attention *just* enough to ask what
he meant by that---or to look at it more closely yourself.
Do you think that every child who uses a pacifier requires oral
surgery? Does he?
Scare tactics.
-=-=-=-=-=-
She has not
shown an interest in doing the latter at this time, but she will
hand me her paci and smile when she begins to play dance.
-=-=-=-==-
Just a side-trip to examine vocabulary.
She's NOT "play dancing"---she's REALLY dancing!
They aren't "practicing piano"---they're PLAYING the piano!
Little changes like that can make a lot of head-way quickly in
understanding unschooling.
-=-=-=-=-=-
She is smart enough to know that she will have to give it up when she
is ready (ballet
lessons).
-=-=-=-=-
I don't know that it's that she's "smart enough"---it's more that she
doesn't really care! <g> And you're right---she's not ready. She'll be
done when she's done---and she won't *have* to give it up, she'll
CHOOSE to!
Again---the vocabulary we choose to use makes a big difference in
making the paradigm shift.
-=-=-=-=-
I did learn something else I didn't know from the posts, that
according to Dr. Sears, the pacifier should not be used without the
loving presence of the parent (much like the bottle for bottle fed
babies).
-=-=-=-
I'm not sure I understand this. So, if the child is apart from the
parent (at Grandma's for the afternoon, for instance), she shouldn't be
allowed to have the comfort of her pacifier? That seems like the time
she would want it *more*.
Am I misunderstanding?
~Kelly
Kelly Lovejoy
Conference Coordinator
Live and Learn Unschooling Conference
http://www.LiveandLearnConference.org
________________________________________________________________________
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[email protected]
> I feel like I am constantly screwing up. I was not raised in aI read something Pam Sorooshian wrote a while ago (on Sandra's site http://sandradodd.com/peacefulparenting) which might be helpful to you. It resonates with me, still.
> loving household. I am trying to erase everything I know and start
> from scratch. It is overwhelming at times. I want to be the mom who
> never yells, is always calm, listens to every little word they
> utter, and has everything under control (house not a disaster,
> supper cooked with a well balanced meal, bills and check book in
> order, and my own stress under control) This is asking way to much
> I know, but I can't seem to find the right balance to make me happy
> with the situation.
Robin B.
***************
Stop thinking about changing "for good and not just for days or moments." That is just another thing to overwhelm you and you don't need that!
Just change the next interaction you have with the kids.
Stop reading email right now and do something "preventative"� something that helps build your relationship with them. Fix them a little tray of cheese and crackers and take it to them, wherever they are, unasked. Sit down on the floor and play with them. If nothing else, just go and give each of them a little hug and a kiss and say, "I was just thinking about how much I love you."
Okay�so that is one good, positive interaction.
Again�just change the next interaction you have with the kids. Focus on making the next interaction another one that builds up your relationship. If the next one is because the kids are fighting, STILL keep in mind that you want this interaction to do something positive for your relationship with the kids and stretch your thinking as to how you can make that happen. In other words, you kind of think from their point of view about yourself. Consider what thoughts you want going through their head. Do you want them thinking: "She never takes time to even find out what the problem is?" Or "She always blames me?" Or "She's such a hypocrite, doesn't want to hear us yelling, but then she yells at us." "She hates me." And so on. What do you want them to be thinking�what words (articulated or not) do want tumbling around inside their head? Maybe "She understands how I feel." Or "She really cares about helping us solve our problems." Or "She is trying hard to be fair." Or "She's calm even w
hen I'm not." Or "Mom is the best listener in the world." "Mom loves me even when I'm causing problems."
And, eventually, you want them to think like this:
"Mom will help us find a solution."
"I can stay calm like mommy does even when I'm mad."
"I can listen carefully like mommy does when there is a conflict."
"I can recognize feelings, like mommy."
"I can come up with new ideas, like mommy does when we have trouble."
There is no substitute for being authentically "there" for them�for genuinely trying to help them resolve problems. For putting your relationship with them at the forefront of every interaction, whether it is playing together or working together.
None of us are perfect; we'll all have some regrets. But with my kids 19, 16, and 13, I can now say that I will never say anything like, "I wish I'd let them fight it out more," or "I wish I'd punished them more," or "I wish I'd yelled at them more." I will only ever say that I wish I'd been more patient, more attentive, more calm and accepting of the normal stresses of having young children.
One interaction at a time. Just make the next interaction a relationship-building one. Don't worry about the one AFTER that, until IT becomes "the next one."
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Meredith
--- In [email protected], "trewhittjoy"
<trewhittjoy@...> wrote:
*next* interaction more positive and loving. Its less overwhelming
that way.
---Meredith (Mo 5.5, Ray 13)
<trewhittjoy@...> wrote:
>> I feel like I am constantly screwing up. I was not raised in aRather than going for "everything" focus on "next time". Make the
> loving household. I am trying to erase everything I know and start
> from scratch. It is overwhelming at times.
*next* interaction more positive and loving. Its less overwhelming
that way.
---Meredith (Mo 5.5, Ray 13)
kristenhendricks55
My now almost four year old had a binky till she was almost three
years old. She only started wanting ove after we took the bottle away
from her at 20 months old. Her teeth were getting some small spots on
them so we took the bottle and offered the binky.
She would go to her mommy and me tumbling class and everything and
wouldnt take it out of her mouth. She lost it at a cabin we stayed on
vacation and it was about 11pm and we were at least 30 mins from a
store. I told her I would get her one in the morning. She finally
gave up looking for it and went to sleep. I asked her in the morning
if she wanted to go get one, but she wanted to go swimming instead.
She just gave it up on her own.
I really do think there was a point where I was thinking "man, I'm
gonna have to pack this in her bag for her honeymoon" LOL... but I
knew she would give it up when she was ready. They all do...
Now just try telling that to my 19 month old who only will take a
bottle and hates sippy cups!! LOL
--- In [email protected], "Ren Allen"
<starsuncloud@...> wrote:
years old. She only started wanting ove after we took the bottle away
from her at 20 months old. Her teeth were getting some small spots on
them so we took the bottle and offered the binky.
She would go to her mommy and me tumbling class and everything and
wouldnt take it out of her mouth. She lost it at a cabin we stayed on
vacation and it was about 11pm and we were at least 30 mins from a
store. I told her I would get her one in the morning. She finally
gave up looking for it and went to sleep. I asked her in the morning
if she wanted to go get one, but she wanted to go swimming instead.
She just gave it up on her own.
I really do think there was a point where I was thinking "man, I'm
gonna have to pack this in her bag for her honeymoon" LOL... but I
knew she would give it up when she was ready. They all do...
Now just try telling that to my 19 month old who only will take a
bottle and hates sippy cups!! LOL
--- In [email protected], "Ren Allen"
<starsuncloud@...> wrote:
>some
> ~~You dont see ten year olds with pacifiers<bwg> so she will quit
> time!!!~~things
>
> Oh HUH!:)
>
> It's too funny that this topic rolled around when it did. My 10 y.o.
> has been wanting to buy a pacifier to play with, so we picked one up
> last night. Actually, we picked up two.
>
> Jalen and Sierra (6 and 10) have been walking around with those
> in their mouths constantly. They're playing "babies" and crawlingmouth.
> around...but also running around outside with the paci in their
> I'm sure the neighbors love it. ;)because
>
> It's satisfying a need to revisit their babyhood....even though
> neither of them ever had a paci! They were both breastfed long-term
> (Jalen until 4.5) but maybe the paci is even more interesting
> of that.
> It doesn't matter to me. The point is, they are enjoying
> them...whether it's a game or fulfilling some need/desire.
>
> I trust my children will get what they need from this activity.
>
> Ren
> learninginfreedom.com
>
Joy Trewhitt
kbcdlovejo@... wrote:
-----Original Message-----
From: trewhittjoy <trewhittjoy@...>
The dentist said that when the palate
hardens (around this time) that the palate would be permanently
damaged and she would require oral surgery. That is what got my
attention.
-=-=-=-=-
It probably should have gotten your attention *just* enough to ask what
he meant by that---or to look at it more closely yourself.
Do you think that every child who uses a pacifier requires oral
surgery? Does he?
Scare tactics.
-=-=-=-=-=-
You're right. I try not to get sucked in with these. But, that one got me. My pediatrician has said things like, "if the baby cries, just turn the monitor off", or "if the toddler acts up, just put her in a play pen". I overlook these comments, because I am really only there to let him check out their physical well-being. I totally disagree with him on child rearing.
-=-=-=-=-
I did learn something else I didn't know from the posts, that
according to Dr. Sears, the pacifier should not be used without the
loving presence of the parent (much like the bottle for bottle fed
babies).
-=-=-=-
I'm not sure I understand this. So, if the child is apart from the
parent (at Grandma's for the afternoon, for instance), she shouldn't be
allowed to have the comfort of her pacifier? That seems like the time
she would want it *more*.
Am I misunderstanding?
Sorry for the ambiguity on my part. On the Dr. Sears web-site:
"Pacifiers are meant to satisfy intense sucking needs, not to delay or replace nurturing. A person should always be at the other end of a comforting tool. The breast (or the finger) has the built-in advantage of making sure you don't fall into the habit of just plugging up the source of the cries as a mechanical gesture. When baby cries, if you find yourself, by reflex, reaching for the pacifier instead of reaching for your baby, pull the plug and lose it. "
There were times that I found myself doing this. Especially if busy (ie. shopping or driving/riding in the car). Don't get me wrong, I am the first person to leave a shopping trip or stop the car if a baby needs soothing. But, in retrospect I did not have a firm grip on this notion until now. I just mean that in the future I will try harder to "be sure" there is not some other way to satisfy my child before I give up and stick the pacifier in (if I ever use it again). I may just try a snuggly or something next time. There are certain breastfeeding advocates who totally shun the pacifier. I don't know exactly what to think.
I totally agree about the soothing away from Mommy. I stay at home and take them everywhere I go. They have relationships with others (grandparents, cousins, friends) but, they have never been unwillingly left alone for even a minute. Daddy and I only go where we are all able to go. He came up with the motto: "if one goes, we all go". We literally all go into Wal-Mart if that is what they choose to do (they have the option to stay in the vehicle with Daddy to watch movies or play in the back). Most of the time they choose (cry) to go into the store. They have stayed in the vehicle with Grandma and enjoyed it, and sometimes they don't want to, and that is fine too! I have never left them at Grandma's house for obvious reasons (per my other post). All of my family lives in another state (12 hours away).
I guess my point with all of that is that I am very accommodating to my children's requests and I would never intentionally disallow them to self soothe. I questioned whether or not I had failed in that respect (giving a pacifier to hush my child) and that is why I was glad to see that point brought to my attention.
I hope I explained this better:)
Thanks for listening.
Joy
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
-----Original Message-----
From: trewhittjoy <trewhittjoy@...>
The dentist said that when the palate
hardens (around this time) that the palate would be permanently
damaged and she would require oral surgery. That is what got my
attention.
-=-=-=-=-
It probably should have gotten your attention *just* enough to ask what
he meant by that---or to look at it more closely yourself.
Do you think that every child who uses a pacifier requires oral
surgery? Does he?
Scare tactics.
-=-=-=-=-=-
You're right. I try not to get sucked in with these. But, that one got me. My pediatrician has said things like, "if the baby cries, just turn the monitor off", or "if the toddler acts up, just put her in a play pen". I overlook these comments, because I am really only there to let him check out their physical well-being. I totally disagree with him on child rearing.
-=-=-=-=-
I did learn something else I didn't know from the posts, that
according to Dr. Sears, the pacifier should not be used without the
loving presence of the parent (much like the bottle for bottle fed
babies).
-=-=-=-
I'm not sure I understand this. So, if the child is apart from the
parent (at Grandma's for the afternoon, for instance), she shouldn't be
allowed to have the comfort of her pacifier? That seems like the time
she would want it *more*.
Am I misunderstanding?
Sorry for the ambiguity on my part. On the Dr. Sears web-site:
"Pacifiers are meant to satisfy intense sucking needs, not to delay or replace nurturing. A person should always be at the other end of a comforting tool. The breast (or the finger) has the built-in advantage of making sure you don't fall into the habit of just plugging up the source of the cries as a mechanical gesture. When baby cries, if you find yourself, by reflex, reaching for the pacifier instead of reaching for your baby, pull the plug and lose it. "
There were times that I found myself doing this. Especially if busy (ie. shopping or driving/riding in the car). Don't get me wrong, I am the first person to leave a shopping trip or stop the car if a baby needs soothing. But, in retrospect I did not have a firm grip on this notion until now. I just mean that in the future I will try harder to "be sure" there is not some other way to satisfy my child before I give up and stick the pacifier in (if I ever use it again). I may just try a snuggly or something next time. There are certain breastfeeding advocates who totally shun the pacifier. I don't know exactly what to think.
I totally agree about the soothing away from Mommy. I stay at home and take them everywhere I go. They have relationships with others (grandparents, cousins, friends) but, they have never been unwillingly left alone for even a minute. Daddy and I only go where we are all able to go. He came up with the motto: "if one goes, we all go". We literally all go into Wal-Mart if that is what they choose to do (they have the option to stay in the vehicle with Daddy to watch movies or play in the back). Most of the time they choose (cry) to go into the store. They have stayed in the vehicle with Grandma and enjoyed it, and sometimes they don't want to, and that is fine too! I have never left them at Grandma's house for obvious reasons (per my other post). All of my family lives in another state (12 hours away).
I guess my point with all of that is that I am very accommodating to my children's requests and I would never intentionally disallow them to self soothe. I questioned whether or not I had failed in that respect (giving a pacifier to hush my child) and that is why I was glad to see that point brought to my attention.
I hope I explained this better:)
Thanks for listening.
Joy
__________________________________________________________
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from AOL at AOL.com.
---------------------------------
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---------------------------------
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]