Help with Food Limits
Susan
Does anyone have kids with special dietary needs? My two kiddos are on
a gfcf diet and I'm struggling with how to handle their access to the
special foods we buy each week because they are *so* darn expensive
that we can't afford to buy all that they would prefer to eat each
week.
So... should I just buy whatever we can afford, not limit it at all
and then when it's gone it's gone? My concern (the hump I haven't been
able to get over) is that it means this specialty food is usually
consumed within the first 2-3 days which leaves no bread (or other
grain items like muffins, pancakes, cookies, etc) for the rest of the
week. This leaves them eating protein, veggies, and fruit for the
remaining 4-5 days and while I realize that sounds like a strange
thing to be concerned about, lol, both kids need lots of carbs in
their diet or they get irritable pretty quickly and tend to "search"
for food all day as if they aren't satisfied, even after eating (which
they might not be if the meal was lacking in carbs).
I also think this has set up a cycle of binging and then doing without
which leads to binging again the next time the food's available and
then doing without again for many days. I have a feeling that if we
could afford to fill the house with an abundant supply, they would
eventually relax and not feel the urge to eat it all up in 2 days
flat. I see that this is the hording thing that happens when kids (and
adults) feel like they might not get more. Unfortunately, we can't
afford to buy this much. I'm thinking that if, day after day, there
was some available they might realize there will always be more
tomorrow and this would help them relax. Right now it's binge,
nothing, binge, nothing. This is the only food they do this with btw,
but of course they are not limited in quantity on any other items,
either.
What to do? While I don't want to set restrictions or limits, I'm
seeing that it might be necessary to plan a certain allotment for each
day and make that available each morning and then not set restrictions
or limits on when/where/how they eat it. But this is still restricting
in a sense, but they don't have access to the whole supply in the
house, so I'm just not sure how to make peace with this.
-- Susan
a gfcf diet and I'm struggling with how to handle their access to the
special foods we buy each week because they are *so* darn expensive
that we can't afford to buy all that they would prefer to eat each
week.
So... should I just buy whatever we can afford, not limit it at all
and then when it's gone it's gone? My concern (the hump I haven't been
able to get over) is that it means this specialty food is usually
consumed within the first 2-3 days which leaves no bread (or other
grain items like muffins, pancakes, cookies, etc) for the rest of the
week. This leaves them eating protein, veggies, and fruit for the
remaining 4-5 days and while I realize that sounds like a strange
thing to be concerned about, lol, both kids need lots of carbs in
their diet or they get irritable pretty quickly and tend to "search"
for food all day as if they aren't satisfied, even after eating (which
they might not be if the meal was lacking in carbs).
I also think this has set up a cycle of binging and then doing without
which leads to binging again the next time the food's available and
then doing without again for many days. I have a feeling that if we
could afford to fill the house with an abundant supply, they would
eventually relax and not feel the urge to eat it all up in 2 days
flat. I see that this is the hording thing that happens when kids (and
adults) feel like they might not get more. Unfortunately, we can't
afford to buy this much. I'm thinking that if, day after day, there
was some available they might realize there will always be more
tomorrow and this would help them relax. Right now it's binge,
nothing, binge, nothing. This is the only food they do this with btw,
but of course they are not limited in quantity on any other items,
either.
What to do? While I don't want to set restrictions or limits, I'm
seeing that it might be necessary to plan a certain allotment for each
day and make that available each morning and then not set restrictions
or limits on when/where/how they eat it. But this is still restricting
in a sense, but they don't have access to the whole supply in the
house, so I'm just not sure how to make peace with this.
-- Susan
Nicole Willoughby
we did gfcf for a little while but it just wasnt seeming to help my son and you are right it is soooo expensive.
Do you buy premade stuff and mixes ? If so buying bulf flours ...rice, buckwheat, etc and making your own things could be an option to get more food for a lower cost.
Also not saying cut out all of say the tapioca, brown rice ect bread but you can get 2-3 packages of plain rice cakes for the cost of 1 loaf of pre-made bread. The rice spaghetti is high but cheap compared to a lot of other things ..and a good source of carbs. Potato chips, baked potatoes toped with a variety of things , hash browns and french fries. You can get a jar of loose popcorn for like $2 and a microwave popping bowl..then use ghee or a bit of the fleshmans light instead of butter...most mcormic seasonings are gfcf so a good way to experiemnt with different flavorings for the popcorn.
www.allergygrocer.com may have better prices than those charged at local health food stores if you havent tried it before.
Nicole
---------------------------------
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Do you buy premade stuff and mixes ? If so buying bulf flours ...rice, buckwheat, etc and making your own things could be an option to get more food for a lower cost.
Also not saying cut out all of say the tapioca, brown rice ect bread but you can get 2-3 packages of plain rice cakes for the cost of 1 loaf of pre-made bread. The rice spaghetti is high but cheap compared to a lot of other things ..and a good source of carbs. Potato chips, baked potatoes toped with a variety of things , hash browns and french fries. You can get a jar of loose popcorn for like $2 and a microwave popping bowl..then use ghee or a bit of the fleshmans light instead of butter...most mcormic seasonings are gfcf so a good way to experiemnt with different flavorings for the popcorn.
www.allergygrocer.com may have better prices than those charged at local health food stores if you havent tried it before.
Nicole
---------------------------------
Bored stiff? Loosen up...
Download and play hundreds of games for free on Yahoo! Games.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Susan
> they get irritable pretty quickly and tend to "search"Oops! I meant to write "which they *might be* (unsatisfied) if the
> for food all day as if they aren't satisfied, even after eating (which
> they might not be if the meal was lacking in carbs).
meal was lacking in carbs."
luana
They might need more fats in their diet like butter and coconut oil.
These fats help keep you full for a long time. I was diagnosed with
hypoglycemia when I was a kid. I was starving all the time and very
grumpy when hungry. I no longer have sugar crashes because I always eat
fat with my meals. I'm 36, have three kids and feel better than I ever
did in my teens and twenties. Thanks, Luana
-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected]
[mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Susan
Sent: Friday, June 08, 2007 5:46 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: [unschoolingbasics] Re: Help with Food Limits
meal was lacking in carbs."
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
These fats help keep you full for a long time. I was diagnosed with
hypoglycemia when I was a kid. I was starving all the time and very
grumpy when hungry. I no longer have sugar crashes because I always eat
fat with my meals. I'm 36, have three kids and feel better than I ever
did in my teens and twenties. Thanks, Luana
-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected]
[mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Susan
Sent: Friday, June 08, 2007 5:46 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: [unschoolingbasics] Re: Help with Food Limits
> they get irritable pretty quickly and tend to "search"Oops! I meant to write "which they *might be* (unsatisfied) if the
> for food all day as if they aren't satisfied, even after eating (which
> they might not be if the meal was lacking in carbs).
meal was lacking in carbs."
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Schuyler
I don't know anything about gfcf diets, I just googled so I know a few more
things than I did a few minutes ago, but could you bake things instead of
buying them? Here's a site with recipes: http://www.gfcfrecipes.com/ Maybe
if you baked things you could afford to have more of the foods they love
around.
Schuyler
www.waynforth.blogspot.com
things than I did a few minutes ago, but could you bake things instead of
buying them? Here's a site with recipes: http://www.gfcfrecipes.com/ Maybe
if you baked things you could afford to have more of the foods they love
around.
Schuyler
www.waynforth.blogspot.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Susan" <SusanYvonne@...>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Friday, June 08, 2007 9:57 PM
Subject: [unschoolingbasics] Help with Food Limits
> Does anyone have kids with special dietary needs? My two kiddos are on
> a gfcf diet and I'm struggling with how to handle their access to the
> special foods we buy each week because they are *so* darn expensive
> that we can't afford to buy all that they would prefer to eat each
> week.
>
> So... should I just buy whatever we can afford, not limit it at all
> and then when it's gone it's gone? My concern (the hump I haven't been
> able to get over) is that it means this specialty food is usually
> consumed within the first 2-3 days which leaves no bread (or other
> grain items like muffins, pancakes, cookies, etc) for the rest of the
> week. This leaves them eating protein, veggies, and fruit for the
> remaining 4-5 days and while I realize that sounds like a strange
> thing to be concerned about, lol, both kids need lots of carbs in
> their diet or they get irritable pretty quickly and tend to "search"
> for food all day as if they aren't satisfied, even after eating (which
> they might not be if the meal was lacking in carbs).
>
> I also think this has set up a cycle of binging and then doing without
> which leads to binging again the next time the food's available and
> then doing without again for many days. I have a feeling that if we
> could afford to fill the house with an abundant supply, they would
> eventually relax and not feel the urge to eat it all up in 2 days
> flat. I see that this is the hording thing that happens when kids (and
> adults) feel like they might not get more. Unfortunately, we can't
> afford to buy this much. I'm thinking that if, day after day, there
> was some available they might realize there will always be more
> tomorrow and this would help them relax. Right now it's binge,
> nothing, binge, nothing. This is the only food they do this with btw,
> but of course they are not limited in quantity on any other items,
> either.
>
> What to do? While I don't want to set restrictions or limits, I'm
> seeing that it might be necessary to plan a certain allotment for each
> day and make that available each morning and then not set restrictions
> or limits on when/where/how they eat it. But this is still restricting
> in a sense, but they don't have access to the whole supply in the
> house, so I'm just not sure how to make peace with this.
>
> -- Susan
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
Susan
> I don't know anything about gfcf diets, I just googled so I know a few moreHi Schuyler,
> things than I did a few minutes ago, but could you bake things instead of
> buying them? Here's a site with recipes: http://www.gfcfrecipes.com/ Maybe
> if you baked things you could afford to have more of the foods they love
> around.
That's a great site. We actually do bake quite a bit to keep costs
down. Buying a pack of 5 cookies in the specialty food store is $3.99
(ridiculous). It IS cheaper to make certain things at home but
unfortunately, even the alternative flour and other ingredients needed
are still about 3-5 times more expensive than their regular
counterparts, mostly because they are uncommon and not purchased by
lots of people.
I don't think anyone needs to have experience with this specific diet
to offer their thoughts on this (although I appreciate you going to
the trouble to look it up). I know there are families dealing with
many types of diets that require expensive foods. Just wondering how
to meet their needs within our budget. Traditional thinking says to
limit and restrict. Right now they have free access to their special
foods but that's not working well because the supply runs out pretty
fast and it's set up an unhealthy pattern.
-- Susan
Susan
> baked potatoes toped with a variety of things , hash browns and french fries. You can get a jar of loose popcorn for like $2 and a microwave popping bowl..then use ghee or a bit of the fleshmans light instead of butter...most mcormic seasonings are gfcf so a good way to experiment with different flavorings for the popcorn.Thank you Nicole, I'll look up that site. I used to order online but
> www.allergygrocer.com may have better prices than those charged at local health food stores if you havent tried it before.
the prices weren't phenomenal. It's been a few years so I'll check it
out again. Yes, I suppose we could find other sources of (cheaper)
carbs for them. They love baked sweet potatoes and speaking of
popcorn, I made a bunch today at the suggestion of the kids :)
-- Susan
Melissa
We have a GF kid, a CF kid and a corn-free kid. We don't buy the specialty stuff except for
one or two packages. One, they go bad quite quickly, two, they usually taste funny and
three, they are very expensive. We also do not buy the ingredients at the health food store,
where rice flour is $5 a pound. We buy it at a Chinese supermarket,(its an hour drive from
here but worth it), where it's 50¢ for two pounds. We also buy rice noodles there, they are
usually 75¢ a pound. For the most part, we don't eat breads. We usually don't eat pasta
either, but have a lot of rice, mashed potatoes or sweet potato cubes under our sauces.
Sandwiches are just as good separated on the plate, or wrapped in a warm corn tortilla,
and usually taste better than the rice bread.
Because we buy rice flour, tapioca starch and whatever else we need there, we save a lot of
money and make our own muffins, cookies, etc. We also save a fortune on not buying
regular snack foods, that are not safe. So I feel pretty good about buying snacks that are
safe because of all the money we have saved in not buying Oreo's, doritos, etc. You can
buy a lot of chips, a LOT of frito lays stuff is GFCF. that's about as carby as it gets. There's
a website that's good for what you can buy, alot of it is specialty, but alot not.
http://www.tacanow.com/foodlist.htm
anyway, kids get a lot of carbs from fruits and veggies, my kids do seek snack foods
because they fulfill a niche, their sweet tooth and salty tongue etc etc. :-) That regular
food just does NOT hit.
Melissa
one or two packages. One, they go bad quite quickly, two, they usually taste funny and
three, they are very expensive. We also do not buy the ingredients at the health food store,
where rice flour is $5 a pound. We buy it at a Chinese supermarket,(its an hour drive from
here but worth it), where it's 50¢ for two pounds. We also buy rice noodles there, they are
usually 75¢ a pound. For the most part, we don't eat breads. We usually don't eat pasta
either, but have a lot of rice, mashed potatoes or sweet potato cubes under our sauces.
Sandwiches are just as good separated on the plate, or wrapped in a warm corn tortilla,
and usually taste better than the rice bread.
Because we buy rice flour, tapioca starch and whatever else we need there, we save a lot of
money and make our own muffins, cookies, etc. We also save a fortune on not buying
regular snack foods, that are not safe. So I feel pretty good about buying snacks that are
safe because of all the money we have saved in not buying Oreo's, doritos, etc. You can
buy a lot of chips, a LOT of frito lays stuff is GFCF. that's about as carby as it gets. There's
a website that's good for what you can buy, alot of it is specialty, but alot not.
http://www.tacanow.com/foodlist.htm
anyway, kids get a lot of carbs from fruits and veggies, my kids do seek snack foods
because they fulfill a niche, their sweet tooth and salty tongue etc etc. :-) That regular
food just does NOT hit.
Melissa
--- In [email protected], Susan <SusanYvonne@...> wrote:
>
> Does anyone have kids with special dietary needs? My two kiddos are on
> a gfcf diet and I'm struggling with how to handle their access to the
> special foods we buy each week because they are *so* darn expensive
> that we can't afford to buy all that they would prefer to eat each
> week.
>
> So... should I just buy whatever we can afford, not limit it at all
> and then when it's gone it's gone?
[email protected]
In a message dated 6/8/2007 2:01:10 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time,
SusanYvonne@... writes:
What to do? While I don't want to set restrictions or limits, I'm
seeing that it might be necessary to plan a certain allotment for each
day and make that available each morning and then not set restrictions
or limits on when/where/how they eat it. But this is still restricting
in a sense, but they don't have access to the whole supply in the
house, so I'm just not sure how to make peace with this.
-- Susan
hi, Susan! could you budget their items *with* them, and menu plan too, with
them? Possibly cook/bake/make some items, rather than purchasing them
pre-made? Also, do you have a Trader Joe's near you? The costs there are a pretty
good and have a fair amount of both gf and cf items _www.traderjoes.com_
(http://www.traderjoes.com) just in case. I am just thinking that the added
participation might help slow the binge cycle you're concerned about. and forgive
me please if I said anything that has been said or that is useless, I'm too
new to know many here, yet :)
Karen
************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
SusanYvonne@... writes:
What to do? While I don't want to set restrictions or limits, I'm
seeing that it might be necessary to plan a certain allotment for each
day and make that available each morning and then not set restrictions
or limits on when/where/how they eat it. But this is still restricting
in a sense, but they don't have access to the whole supply in the
house, so I'm just not sure how to make peace with this.
-- Susan
hi, Susan! could you budget their items *with* them, and menu plan too, with
them? Possibly cook/bake/make some items, rather than purchasing them
pre-made? Also, do you have a Trader Joe's near you? The costs there are a pretty
good and have a fair amount of both gf and cf items _www.traderjoes.com_
(http://www.traderjoes.com) just in case. I am just thinking that the added
participation might help slow the binge cycle you're concerned about. and forgive
me please if I said anything that has been said or that is useless, I'm too
new to know many here, yet :)
Karen
************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Susan
> hi, Susan! could you budget their items *with* them, and menu plan too, withYou touched on one of the downfalls of living in a rural area - we
> them? Possibly cook/bake/make some items, rather than purchasing them
> pre-made? Also, do you have a Trader Joe's near you? The costs there are a pretty
> good and have a fair amount of both gf and cf items _www.traderjoes.com_
> (http://www.traderjoes.com) just in case. I am just thinking that the added
> participation might help slow the binge cycle you're concerned about. and forgive
> me please if I said anything that has been said or that is useless, I'm too
> new to know many here, yet :)
don't have stores like Trader Joe's or Whole Foods Market (which I
love to shop at when I'm visiting other areas). The nearest is about 2
hrs away. We are fortunate to have *any* specialty stores here, so for
that I'm thankful, but they are very pricey. I might start shopping
online again.
I have been giving this food issue a lot of thought and I think I'm
going to be able to work it out. Involving the kids in the budgeting &
menu planning is a great idea (I don't know why this it never occurred
to me).
Thanks!
-- Susan
[email protected]
In a message dated 6/9/2007 12:44:44 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time,
SusanYvonne@... writes:
Thanks!
-- Susan
You're welcome...I often wish *I* lived in a rural area! :)
Love,
Karen
************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
SusanYvonne@... writes:
Thanks!
-- Susan
You're welcome...I often wish *I* lived in a rural area! :)
Love,
Karen
************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Anne Marie Shotwell
>>>>can you bake things instead ofbuying them?
I just started doing this with my sons. Not because of a special diet
per se but to save money, make things last longer as well as be more
nutritious than the snacks we were buying. They have all had a great
time and it has inspired my sons to learn more about the kitchen,
measuring, what different ingredients they can use etc. He likes to bake
once or twice a week now. I will be stocking up on bread ingredients now
because he wants to try the bread machine that has been collecting dust
for 5 years.
Anne Marie
Cameron Parham
Re: budgeting food. A related problem that we have is this: I buy some treats that one of 3 kids requested. Recently it has been twinkies, Hi-C juice boxes, etc. And the 13 yo consumes all of it in 1-2 days, distressing the other kids. Buying more may sometimes be possible but the same thing happens again. Also, I sometimes don't have the time (for a few days) or the $$ to immediately buy more. The 13yo has so far been immune to discussions regarding the fairness of this. I did mention once an amount of ginger ale that seemed fair for him to have but he had all of it. We are still deschooling...maybe it's just that. I have planned a family meeting to allow all of us to discuss these and other concerns. But so far the only thing I've really found it makes me want to do is not buy the stuff (although mostly I still do). We do cook together when we can, but these are specially requested items. Any ideas how to balance this while recognizing everybody's needs? And not
making the 13yo seem selfish. He really isn't. Cameron
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
making the 13yo seem selfish. He really isn't. Cameron
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Meredith
--- In [email protected], Cameron Parham
<acsp2205@...> wrote:
names on foods or storing them on separate shelves? In our house Mo
has a shelf in the pantry where she sometimes stores foods and Ray
keeps some snacks in his room. They are both willing to share their
treats when asked.
Sharing consumables can be really challenging - there's something
unsettling about having an expectation of eating or using something
only to find *someone else* has eaten or used the last of whatever-
it-is. George and Mo both tend to binge on cookies when they think
the other is going to "get" the last - I call it "competitive
eating". Ray's less likely to do this, and I don't do it at all, so
its not *just* a matter of un/deschooling. There's some personality
issues involved.
---Meredith (Mo 5.5, Ray 13)
<acsp2205@...> wrote:
> We do cook together when we can, but these are specially requestedWhat about individuals "claiming" specific foods either by writing
>items. Any ideas how to balance this while recognizing everybody's
>needs?
names on foods or storing them on separate shelves? In our house Mo
has a shelf in the pantry where she sometimes stores foods and Ray
keeps some snacks in his room. They are both willing to share their
treats when asked.
Sharing consumables can be really challenging - there's something
unsettling about having an expectation of eating or using something
only to find *someone else* has eaten or used the last of whatever-
it-is. George and Mo both tend to binge on cookies when they think
the other is going to "get" the last - I call it "competitive
eating". Ray's less likely to do this, and I don't do it at all, so
its not *just* a matter of un/deschooling. There's some personality
issues involved.
---Meredith (Mo 5.5, Ray 13)
Ren Allen
~~Buying more may sometimes be possible but the same thing happens
again. Also, I sometimes don't have the time (for a few days) or the
$$ to immediately buy more. ~~
I've run into this also, with four kids and a sometimes limited
budget, it just happens!:) What I've found over time, is that the
more those items are available, the less any one child hordes or
overconsumes. I ended up buying entire BOXES of Twix bars at one
point, to try and fulfill my oldest child's desire for them. Two (36
count, no less) boxes into it, he decided he didn't want Twix bars
very often. Funny thing.
I don't always have the money for tons of snacky stuff. Last night at
the store, Jalen and Sierra were making many requests.....I finally
reminded them that I needed to buy meal items for everyone and they
were like "OH yeah, that's fine". They trust I will buy them the foods
they want, so when we need to watch the money it makes sense to them.
The older they get, the easier that part is. Small children just can't
understand budget needs very well.
Can you buy the 13 year old some items just for him? I found that if
one child is really consuming a lot, and has a higher need for certain
items, it helps to provide them with some of their own foods they can
stash somewhere away from communal areas. Jared absolutely LOVES
tapioca pudding and likes to have his own tub.
We give him space in the mini-fridge in the basement (dh's little
stash) so nobody gets into his tapioca.:) Once a child knows they'll
have access to the foods they really want, it tends to smooth out some
of the intense desire.
His needs are just different than the other kids, so maybe providing
him with his own stash will help? It will probably be a short lived
thing.
Ren
learninginfreedom.com
again. Also, I sometimes don't have the time (for a few days) or the
$$ to immediately buy more. ~~
I've run into this also, with four kids and a sometimes limited
budget, it just happens!:) What I've found over time, is that the
more those items are available, the less any one child hordes or
overconsumes. I ended up buying entire BOXES of Twix bars at one
point, to try and fulfill my oldest child's desire for them. Two (36
count, no less) boxes into it, he decided he didn't want Twix bars
very often. Funny thing.
I don't always have the money for tons of snacky stuff. Last night at
the store, Jalen and Sierra were making many requests.....I finally
reminded them that I needed to buy meal items for everyone and they
were like "OH yeah, that's fine". They trust I will buy them the foods
they want, so when we need to watch the money it makes sense to them.
The older they get, the easier that part is. Small children just can't
understand budget needs very well.
Can you buy the 13 year old some items just for him? I found that if
one child is really consuming a lot, and has a higher need for certain
items, it helps to provide them with some of their own foods they can
stash somewhere away from communal areas. Jared absolutely LOVES
tapioca pudding and likes to have his own tub.
We give him space in the mini-fridge in the basement (dh's little
stash) so nobody gets into his tapioca.:) Once a child knows they'll
have access to the foods they really want, it tends to smooth out some
of the intense desire.
His needs are just different than the other kids, so maybe providing
him with his own stash will help? It will probably be a short lived
thing.
Ren
learninginfreedom.com
Lisa
-I am really glad that this topic has come up! I have been a little
concerned/disturbed (?) by my kids writing their names on things in
the refrigerator... mostly soft drinks lately. We rarely buy it and
what led to them writing their names on it was that they would put one
in the fridge to chill then come back and someone else has taken it
not realizing someone had put it in for themselves! We did make a
"rule of consideration" (our own little coined phrase for when rules
are necessary for harmony) that if they take out a bottled water they
should make sure to put in a few more for others to have a cold one
when they need it. At any rate my husband bought a large variety
box of Jone's Sodas at Sam's ...because the kids each wanted to try
several flavors they wrote their names on the bottles in the fridge.
At first it struck me as somewhat selfish. Later I saw my 5 yr old
gladly give his 12 yr old sister one he had already claimed that she
decided she might like to try but found there were no more of that
flavor. They have been gladly giving each other a taste of ones they
found especially yummy that their siblings didn't think they would
like but wanted to have a taste later.
We also have food allergies (our 5 yr old) so I do buy specific things
for him that can be expensive. So far I haven't had to limit
anything because the others are rarely interested in his Rice Dream
ice cream or his Rice Dream rice milk. They do occasionally have a
few of his cookies or other things. In our case I have managed to
find recipes for most things so that I can make them more cheaply and
have them readily available in whatever amounts we need them. A
few times I have come across a teen happily munching on the
dairy/wheat free cookies and had a moment of panic (because of the
expense and thinking of the 5 yr olds face when others are having
regular cookies and his are gone!) usually I just remind them that
those are the dairy/wheat free ones and ask that they make sure they
leave some for their brother. Most of the time they hadn't realized
they were the special cookies and immediately switch to regular ones.
Sometimes they remark that they like those better and I make sure I
buy a larger amount the next time!
Thanks for all the great reassuring discussion on this topic! I
especially feel better about the writing names on things!
Lisa Blocker
concerned/disturbed (?) by my kids writing their names on things in
the refrigerator... mostly soft drinks lately. We rarely buy it and
what led to them writing their names on it was that they would put one
in the fridge to chill then come back and someone else has taken it
not realizing someone had put it in for themselves! We did make a
"rule of consideration" (our own little coined phrase for when rules
are necessary for harmony) that if they take out a bottled water they
should make sure to put in a few more for others to have a cold one
when they need it. At any rate my husband bought a large variety
box of Jone's Sodas at Sam's ...because the kids each wanted to try
several flavors they wrote their names on the bottles in the fridge.
At first it struck me as somewhat selfish. Later I saw my 5 yr old
gladly give his 12 yr old sister one he had already claimed that she
decided she might like to try but found there were no more of that
flavor. They have been gladly giving each other a taste of ones they
found especially yummy that their siblings didn't think they would
like but wanted to have a taste later.
We also have food allergies (our 5 yr old) so I do buy specific things
for him that can be expensive. So far I haven't had to limit
anything because the others are rarely interested in his Rice Dream
ice cream or his Rice Dream rice milk. They do occasionally have a
few of his cookies or other things. In our case I have managed to
find recipes for most things so that I can make them more cheaply and
have them readily available in whatever amounts we need them. A
few times I have come across a teen happily munching on the
dairy/wheat free cookies and had a moment of panic (because of the
expense and thinking of the 5 yr olds face when others are having
regular cookies and his are gone!) usually I just remind them that
those are the dairy/wheat free ones and ask that they make sure they
leave some for their brother. Most of the time they hadn't realized
they were the special cookies and immediately switch to regular ones.
Sometimes they remark that they like those better and I make sure I
buy a larger amount the next time!
Thanks for all the great reassuring discussion on this topic! I
especially feel better about the writing names on things!
Lisa Blocker
Krisula Moyer
I wonder if it would be a cheap option to bake some gfcf treats for them on
a weekly basis. Not to say you ought to stop buying their favorites but
maybe some home made things could help stretch the grocery budget (and the
carb rich foods) to last the whole week. I found this cookbook on line -
it's pretty expensive but maybe you already have some resources?
http://stewartdehart.stores.yahoo.net/cookbook.html
good luck,
Krisula
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
a weekly basis. Not to say you ought to stop buying their favorites but
maybe some home made things could help stretch the grocery budget (and the
carb rich foods) to last the whole week. I found this cookbook on line -
it's pretty expensive but maybe you already have some resources?
http://stewartdehart.stores.yahoo.net/cookbook.html
good luck,
Krisula
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Deb Lewis
***What to do? While I don't want to set restrictions or limits, I'm
seeing that it might be necessary to plan a certain allotment for each
day and make that available each morning and then not set restrictions
or limits on when/where/how they eat it. But this is still restricting
in a sense, but they don't have access to the whole supply in the
house, so I'm just not sure how to make peace with this.***
You've already set limits by restricting their diets and now you're asking
about ideas for restricting allowed foods.
If you think this diet is good for them then it's your responsibility to
make the diet you chose for them available. Our kids don't have a
responsibility to be only as hungry as we want them or can afford for them
to be. <g>
Are you willing to rethink the diet issue? Are typically reported benefits
of this diet going to help your kids to a degree that will make the
potential emotional food related issues worth the risk? How do your kids
feel about being on the diet? If your kids are willingly on the diet they
might have ideas about making things stretch. If your kids don't have the
option of quitting the diet then
it wouldn't be right to ask them for ideas about further limiting their
foods. (You don't have to share more information
with us than you want... I'm just saying getting the kids to agree to
limiting foods if they really don't have a choice about being
on the diet is not really agreement or choice.)
I only read briefly about this diet and it seems there is one study that
showed some
benefit to kids and that study isn't widely supported. I don't believe
there has to be scientific proof a
thing is beneficial for it to be so. The benefits of unschooling are not
scientifically proven and the reports of benefits come from parents relating
their experiences. (much like the gfcf diet, it seems) The difference is
unschooling is not about restricting and limiting kids but about creating a
life of abundance and the diet is restrictive and limiting.
When Dylan was first diagnosed with psoriatic arthritis we looked at the
information about diet. The benefits of a restricted diet were not
conclusive and Dylan decided it wasn't worth it to him to give up some of
the things he loved for a "possible" benefit. Dylan had already chosen a
primarily vegan diet (he occasionally eats honey) for himself, for
ethical reasons but was not willing to further limit his diet for
unproven potential health benefits. It's my belief (unproven by scientific
study <g>) that my support of Dylan's choices has been more beneficial to
his overall health than a diet would have been and especially if the diet
was not something he chose for himself.
If the diet stays:
Can you make a deal with your supplier to buy case loads of favorite foods
at a better price?
Can you buy bulk amounts at the best price of the ingredients to make their
favorite things?
A quick search showed a fifty pound bag of rice flour at Amazon ($4.50
shipping) for $56.00. That's about fifteen dollars more than a fifty
pound bag of organic wheat flour. Fifteen dollars isn't that much (but
I've also lived through
times when fifteen dollars was nearly impossible to come by) Start a coop
and buy two hundred pounds
at a time and see what kind of deal your health food store or your local
Asian market can make you. Can you grind your own rice flour?
Where in your budget can you make changes to increase money available for
food? Can you drop magazine subscriptions? Can you cut out services you
now pay for? Can you trade out for services? (an example might be cleaning
the Karate Dojo in exchange for kid's lessons.) Can you get a part time
job? Handyman or clean or mow lawns for extra cash?
Food is already an issue for them. You've linked food to behavior and
you've restricted some foods. They likely already feel needy. Any further
restricting you do could create more need. You can either let them decide
whether it's worth it or decide for them. If you decide for them and if
you choose to limit the amounts of their favorite allowed foods for budget
sake you may not be able to reconcile it with the unschooling philosophy.
It's not always easy, but it's always worth thinking about. <g>
Deb Lewis
seeing that it might be necessary to plan a certain allotment for each
day and make that available each morning and then not set restrictions
or limits on when/where/how they eat it. But this is still restricting
in a sense, but they don't have access to the whole supply in the
house, so I'm just not sure how to make peace with this.***
You've already set limits by restricting their diets and now you're asking
about ideas for restricting allowed foods.
If you think this diet is good for them then it's your responsibility to
make the diet you chose for them available. Our kids don't have a
responsibility to be only as hungry as we want them or can afford for them
to be. <g>
Are you willing to rethink the diet issue? Are typically reported benefits
of this diet going to help your kids to a degree that will make the
potential emotional food related issues worth the risk? How do your kids
feel about being on the diet? If your kids are willingly on the diet they
might have ideas about making things stretch. If your kids don't have the
option of quitting the diet then
it wouldn't be right to ask them for ideas about further limiting their
foods. (You don't have to share more information
with us than you want... I'm just saying getting the kids to agree to
limiting foods if they really don't have a choice about being
on the diet is not really agreement or choice.)
I only read briefly about this diet and it seems there is one study that
showed some
benefit to kids and that study isn't widely supported. I don't believe
there has to be scientific proof a
thing is beneficial for it to be so. The benefits of unschooling are not
scientifically proven and the reports of benefits come from parents relating
their experiences. (much like the gfcf diet, it seems) The difference is
unschooling is not about restricting and limiting kids but about creating a
life of abundance and the diet is restrictive and limiting.
When Dylan was first diagnosed with psoriatic arthritis we looked at the
information about diet. The benefits of a restricted diet were not
conclusive and Dylan decided it wasn't worth it to him to give up some of
the things he loved for a "possible" benefit. Dylan had already chosen a
primarily vegan diet (he occasionally eats honey) for himself, for
ethical reasons but was not willing to further limit his diet for
unproven potential health benefits. It's my belief (unproven by scientific
study <g>) that my support of Dylan's choices has been more beneficial to
his overall health than a diet would have been and especially if the diet
was not something he chose for himself.
If the diet stays:
Can you make a deal with your supplier to buy case loads of favorite foods
at a better price?
Can you buy bulk amounts at the best price of the ingredients to make their
favorite things?
A quick search showed a fifty pound bag of rice flour at Amazon ($4.50
shipping) for $56.00. That's about fifteen dollars more than a fifty
pound bag of organic wheat flour. Fifteen dollars isn't that much (but
I've also lived through
times when fifteen dollars was nearly impossible to come by) Start a coop
and buy two hundred pounds
at a time and see what kind of deal your health food store or your local
Asian market can make you. Can you grind your own rice flour?
Where in your budget can you make changes to increase money available for
food? Can you drop magazine subscriptions? Can you cut out services you
now pay for? Can you trade out for services? (an example might be cleaning
the Karate Dojo in exchange for kid's lessons.) Can you get a part time
job? Handyman or clean or mow lawns for extra cash?
Food is already an issue for them. You've linked food to behavior and
you've restricted some foods. They likely already feel needy. Any further
restricting you do could create more need. You can either let them decide
whether it's worth it or decide for them. If you decide for them and if
you choose to limit the amounts of their favorite allowed foods for budget
sake you may not be able to reconcile it with the unschooling philosophy.
It's not always easy, but it's always worth thinking about. <g>
Deb Lewis
Susan
Hi Deb,
Thanks for your reply. It's given me lots of "food for thought". <g>
they have what they need and of course I would never let them walk
around the house starving! I want to emphasize that week to week they
*are* getting enough to eat nutritionally and they're in excellent
physical health. As someone else pointed out, there are carbs in
vegetables and fruits and they eat lots of those, so it may not be a
carb issue as I originally thought.
Maybe they're grazers and need to eat smaller portions more frequently
throughout the day. They may need more fats since we tend to avoid
butter substitutes because of trans fats and fish/seafood because of
mercury levels. I'm going to try to find alternate sources of
omega-3/6 oils and other beneficial fats. I really like the monkey
platter idea I read about on Sandra's site. I realize it is my
responsibility to help them figure out what their needs are and I've
been thinking a lot about this stuff. The main issue at hand is
finding a way to provide them with enough of the *specific* foods they
desire to eat.
several dozen health issues. I realize this diet doesn't work for
everyone and that some people see little, if any, improvement. We're
fortunate in that regard because it's worked amazingly well for our
kids. Being free of gluten & casein has made dramatic differences in
their lives. Their improvements have absolutely floored their doctors
and even prompted a research study. The diet isn't something we've
randomly and mindlessly decided to force upon them. They both have
celiac disease and *must* be gluten free. They also have a milk
allergy as well, so being both gf and cf is working well for them.
It's the way they will eat for life, it's what they will have to live
with always.
they're used to and they really enjoy their foods. It is as normal to
them as it is for my mom to avoid chocolate because she is allergic.
It's just a fact of life for them, like people who need to avoid
peanuts or strawberries or any other food that seriously affects a
person's health and well being. The diet itself is not an area of
contention or disagreement with the kids. However, I know they would
be happier with having more of certain foods they really like and tend
to crave, and I am trying to find a way to give them that.
97% of the time the kids don't mind their diet. The other 3% are those
times when they see something they can't have, like if we are at
someone's house and someone (unexpectedly) pulls a big delicious
looking chocolate cake out of the fridge and the kids wish they could
have some. We try to prepare for most situations by making sure we
have their gfcf equivalent on hand for them, but there are times when
we're taken by surprise. But there are also (and increasingly more
often) times when they barely notice a plate of regular cookies and
don't give a second glance to someone eating a cheesy pizza.
special diets cannot also be unschoolers. :) It would be so much
easier if they did not have these special dietary needs. It would be
considerably less difficult (and less expensive) to shop for food, we
wouldn't have to worry about them getting exposed to
cross-contamination, we wouldn't have to pack up their foods every
time we leave the house, etc. Although I do see everything we do as a
choice, even if all the available options are difficult, and despite
all these challenges, knowing what we know now, I feel it would be
irresponsible and dangerous to give them gluten & dairy foods.
we might do the same thing! My kids were very young when they went
gfcf, but they "spoke out" about their needs the only way they could.
My son was miserable and cried nearly all the time, didn't want to be
touched (his skin was extremely sensitive) and he threw up a lot. He
had to be treated for pneumonia repeatedly. He was diagnosed with
severe asthma and GERD (among other things) which required 6 different
daily medications that he did not like to take. My daughter complained
of nearly constant stomach pains, had bowel problems, couldn't sleep
well at night, had poor speech and was very clumsy. We took her to the
ER several times for serious head bumps.
Going gfcf cleared most of these issues up within a week and DS was
able to go off all his meds. He no longer has asthma or throws up and
he enjoys being held. DD no longer has stomach pains or bowel problems
and her speech & agility improved tremendously and very rapidly.
That's just a *very* brief overview - there are so many more things
that improved, including numerous developmental issues.
While they didn't really choose this diet in the sense of actively
deciding to do it voluntarily because they were so young, within a
week we could see it was clearly beneficial in many ways. We have
talked to them about it over the years and they know why they are
gfcf. There has (unfortunately) been a few times when they
accidentally ate non-gfcf foods and they ended up pretty sick and many
of the old problems reappeared with a bang. DD in particular has a
"physical memory" of eating non-gfcf foods and she takes great care to
avoid feeling like that again.
foods co-op a few towns away to see if that will give us more buying
power. In the past few days I've been brainstorming about ways to find
their foods at better prices. I found several really good coupons
online which will help out. I didn't even know there were coupons for
these foods until I searched - the only thing I ever see in my local
paper are coupons for cleaning supplies, pet food, canned veggies and
deodorant. I'm very happy about this discovery!
I've spent some time fine-tuning our grocery budget and making more $$
available for their specialty products. I'm also going to take
advantage of every sale I can find. This past Saturday I was grocery
shopping and came across a display of close-out products. I about
jumped for joy when I saw a whole shelf of gluten-free pastas & cereal
bars on sale for *half off*. Whohoo! I went over my shopping list and
eliminated a few things so that I could afford to buy everything they
had at that price. The kids are tickled about this find. I think if I
search better and comparison shop, I can find good deals.
it and I know things will improve in the future. We're all doing
without/sacrificing to a certain extent, but we've been trying to
lessen the impact of this on the kids as much as possible. This period
of tight finances will not last forever. It too shall pass...
There is one about an hour from us and we're going to check on their
prices. We cannot buy just any rice flour/noodles we find cheaply
because there is a lot of cross-contamination when flours are
run/ground/processed on the same equipment. The products we buy at
local specialty stores are more expensive but have been tested for the
presence of gluten & are processed on dedicated lines. We'll
definitely investigate the Asian food market option though! It would
be great if we can find what we need at a good price.
want to pursue these activities.
"restrictions" people have to live with every day - lots of kids are
born with physical & mental challenges. For my kids a gfcf diet isn't
restrictive in a traditional sense of the word because there is no
viable alternative for them - it's just another aspect of their lives.
For them, gluten & dairy are akin to poisons. Calling a diet that
eliminates those substances "restrictive" is like calling an
environment that limits or excludes radon, strychnine and arsenic
"restrictive".
It's really part of trying to provide them with the best possible care
and no matter what their diet is labeled as - "restrictive" or "safe &
healthy" - it doesn't change their dietary needs and they'll have to
go forward with these same needs their whole life no matter how
we/they/others choose to view them. So we might as well not choose to
look at the diet from a negative light, but instead to look at how it
has a positive impact.
The true limiting issue comes from them not having as much desired
food items as they would like, which is why I asked for advice &
ideas, because I want to remedy that. There have been lots of great
suggestions and I'm in full problem-solving mode now, so I think we'll
find a way to meet their needs for these foods and continue down our
unschooling path!
Thanks again for your reply! Your comments have helped me re-examine
the benefits of their diet and reaffirm that, regardless of cost, it
is a blessing it is to be able to provide them with something that
gives them a better quality of life.
-- Susan
Thanks for your reply. It's given me lots of "food for thought". <g>
> If you think this diet is good for them then it's your responsibility toI total agree with that point. It's *my* responsibility to make sure
> make the diet you chose for them available. Our kids don't have a
> responsibility to be only as hungry as we want them or can afford for them
> to be. <g>
they have what they need and of course I would never let them walk
around the house starving! I want to emphasize that week to week they
*are* getting enough to eat nutritionally and they're in excellent
physical health. As someone else pointed out, there are carbs in
vegetables and fruits and they eat lots of those, so it may not be a
carb issue as I originally thought.
Maybe they're grazers and need to eat smaller portions more frequently
throughout the day. They may need more fats since we tend to avoid
butter substitutes because of trans fats and fish/seafood because of
mercury levels. I'm going to try to find alternate sources of
omega-3/6 oils and other beneficial fats. I really like the monkey
platter idea I read about on Sandra's site. I realize it is my
responsibility to help them figure out what their needs are and I've
been thinking a lot about this stuff. The main issue at hand is
finding a way to provide them with enough of the *specific* foods they
desire to eat.
> Are you willing to rethink the diet issue? Are typically reported benefitsIt has *very* greatly improved their quality of life and resolved
> of this diet going to help your kids to a degree that will make the
> potential emotional food related issues worth the risk?
several dozen health issues. I realize this diet doesn't work for
everyone and that some people see little, if any, improvement. We're
fortunate in that regard because it's worked amazingly well for our
kids. Being free of gluten & casein has made dramatic differences in
their lives. Their improvements have absolutely floored their doctors
and even prompted a research study. The diet isn't something we've
randomly and mindlessly decided to force upon them. They both have
celiac disease and *must* be gluten free. They also have a milk
allergy as well, so being both gf and cf is working well for them.
It's the way they will eat for life, it's what they will have to live
with always.
> How do your kidsThey have been on this diet for most of their lives so it is what
> feel about being on the diet?
they're used to and they really enjoy their foods. It is as normal to
them as it is for my mom to avoid chocolate because she is allergic.
It's just a fact of life for them, like people who need to avoid
peanuts or strawberries or any other food that seriously affects a
person's health and well being. The diet itself is not an area of
contention or disagreement with the kids. However, I know they would
be happier with having more of certain foods they really like and tend
to crave, and I am trying to find a way to give them that.
97% of the time the kids don't mind their diet. The other 3% are those
times when they see something they can't have, like if we are at
someone's house and someone (unexpectedly) pulls a big delicious
looking chocolate cake out of the fridge and the kids wish they could
have some. We try to prepare for most situations by making sure we
have their gfcf equivalent on hand for them, but there are times when
we're taken by surprise. But there are also (and increasingly more
often) times when they barely notice a plate of regular cookies and
don't give a second glance to someone eating a cheesy pizza.
> The difference isI hope you're not saying that families with kids that must be on
> unschooling is not about restricting and limiting kids but about creating a
> life of abundance and the diet is restrictive and limiting.
special diets cannot also be unschoolers. :) It would be so much
easier if they did not have these special dietary needs. It would be
considerably less difficult (and less expensive) to shop for food, we
wouldn't have to worry about them getting exposed to
cross-contamination, we wouldn't have to pack up their foods every
time we leave the house, etc. Although I do see everything we do as a
choice, even if all the available options are difficult, and despite
all these challenges, knowing what we know now, I feel it would be
irresponsible and dangerous to give them gluten & dairy foods.
> It's my belief (unproven by scientificI totally understand that reasoning and under different circumstances
> study <g>) that my support of Dylan's choices has been more beneficial to
> his overall health than a diet would have been and especially if the diet
> was not something he chose for himself.
we might do the same thing! My kids were very young when they went
gfcf, but they "spoke out" about their needs the only way they could.
My son was miserable and cried nearly all the time, didn't want to be
touched (his skin was extremely sensitive) and he threw up a lot. He
had to be treated for pneumonia repeatedly. He was diagnosed with
severe asthma and GERD (among other things) which required 6 different
daily medications that he did not like to take. My daughter complained
of nearly constant stomach pains, had bowel problems, couldn't sleep
well at night, had poor speech and was very clumsy. We took her to the
ER several times for serious head bumps.
Going gfcf cleared most of these issues up within a week and DS was
able to go off all his meds. He no longer has asthma or throws up and
he enjoys being held. DD no longer has stomach pains or bowel problems
and her speech & agility improved tremendously and very rapidly.
That's just a *very* brief overview - there are so many more things
that improved, including numerous developmental issues.
While they didn't really choose this diet in the sense of actively
deciding to do it voluntarily because they were so young, within a
week we could see it was clearly beneficial in many ways. We have
talked to them about it over the years and they know why they are
gfcf. There has (unfortunately) been a few times when they
accidentally ate non-gfcf foods and they ended up pretty sick and many
of the old problems reappeared with a bang. DD in particular has a
"physical memory" of eating non-gfcf foods and she takes great care to
avoid feeling like that again.
> Can you make a deal with your supplier to buy case loads of favorite foodsSo far this hasn't been an option but we're looking into a natural
> at a better price?
foods co-op a few towns away to see if that will give us more buying
power. In the past few days I've been brainstorming about ways to find
their foods at better prices. I found several really good coupons
online which will help out. I didn't even know there were coupons for
these foods until I searched - the only thing I ever see in my local
paper are coupons for cleaning supplies, pet food, canned veggies and
deodorant. I'm very happy about this discovery!
I've spent some time fine-tuning our grocery budget and making more $$
available for their specialty products. I'm also going to take
advantage of every sale I can find. This past Saturday I was grocery
shopping and came across a display of close-out products. I about
jumped for joy when I saw a whole shelf of gluten-free pastas & cereal
bars on sale for *half off*. Whohoo! I went over my shopping list and
eliminated a few things so that I could afford to buy everything they
had at that price. The kids are tickled about this find. I think if I
search better and comparison shop, I can find good deals.
> Fifteen dollars isn't that much (but I've also lived throughAhh - this is our situation right now, but there is a good reason for
> times when fifteen dollars was nearly impossible to come by)
it and I know things will improve in the future. We're all doing
without/sacrificing to a certain extent, but we've been trying to
lessen the impact of this on the kids as much as possible. This period
of tight finances will not last forever. It too shall pass...
> > Can you buy bulk amounts at the best price of the ingredients to make theirSomeone else suggested going to an Asian market and buying in bulk.
> favorite things? <snip> or your local Asian market
There is one about an hour from us and we're going to check on their
prices. We cannot buy just any rice flour/noodles we find cheaply
because there is a lot of cross-contamination when flours are
run/ground/processed on the same equipment. The products we buy at
local specialty stores are more expensive but have been tested for the
presence of gluten & are processed on dedicated lines. We'll
definitely investigate the Asian food market option though! It would
be great if we can find what we need at a good price.
> Can you trade out for services? (an example might be cleaningThat's a heck of an idea! I'll have to keep that in mind for when they
> the Karate Dojo in exchange for kid's lessons.)
want to pursue these activities.
> you may not be able to reconcile it with the unschooling philosophy.I think we can find a way! There are unchangeable, unavoidable
> It's not always easy, but it's always worth thinking about. <g>
"restrictions" people have to live with every day - lots of kids are
born with physical & mental challenges. For my kids a gfcf diet isn't
restrictive in a traditional sense of the word because there is no
viable alternative for them - it's just another aspect of their lives.
For them, gluten & dairy are akin to poisons. Calling a diet that
eliminates those substances "restrictive" is like calling an
environment that limits or excludes radon, strychnine and arsenic
"restrictive".
It's really part of trying to provide them with the best possible care
and no matter what their diet is labeled as - "restrictive" or "safe &
healthy" - it doesn't change their dietary needs and they'll have to
go forward with these same needs their whole life no matter how
we/they/others choose to view them. So we might as well not choose to
look at the diet from a negative light, but instead to look at how it
has a positive impact.
The true limiting issue comes from them not having as much desired
food items as they would like, which is why I asked for advice &
ideas, because I want to remedy that. There have been lots of great
suggestions and I'm in full problem-solving mode now, so I think we'll
find a way to meet their needs for these foods and continue down our
unschooling path!
Thanks again for your reply! Your comments have helped me re-examine
the benefits of their diet and reaffirm that, regardless of cost, it
is a blessing it is to be able to provide them with something that
gives them a better quality of life.
-- Susan
Deb Lewis
***I would never let them walk around the house starving!***
Yeah, I didn't think you were letting them starve,<g> but hunger can be
about more than a physically empty stomach. We can be needy for things we
think we're not getting enough of. That's a problem with limits.
***so it may not be a carb issue as I originally thought.***
It seems very likely an issue with allowed foods and their availability.
***I hope you're not saying that families with kids that must be on
special diets cannot also be unschoolers. :)***
Anytime one person is limiting the choices for another person it can
interfere with unschooling. That doesn't mean a parent will never limit a
child's choice, it means that parent might deal with issues other
unschooling parents don't have. If you're in that situation it may not
always be easy to reconcile a particular decision with unschooling.
If I had a child with a severe allergy to some food I would definitely have
kept that food out of the house. I would have socialized with people who
could easily and happily accommodate us and avoided going into the homes of
those who couldn't, until my kid was old enough to understand and avoid
those foods on his own. I have some experience with a child who chose a
diet different from anyone else we knew when he was very young, and I know a
very young person is capable of choosing and deciding.
An immediate life threatening allergy is different from an ethical choice
and even different from a general health maintenance diet. We know enough
about human psychology to know that even people who've had quadruple bypass
surgery and have been told that they should change their diet if they want
to continue to live well can have a difficult time or even find it
impossible to stick to a diet prescribed by someone else.
And like the bypass patient, who can feel resentful toward his doctor about
the diet limits even though the clogged arteries were not the doctors fault,
kids on restrictive diets can feel resentful toward the person who enforced
the diet. That's a potential problem that can interfere with unschooling.
If you're creative and thoughtful you might be able to make a difficult
situation work but it's not an ideal situation and that's what I meant.
***Calling a diet that
eliminates those substances "restrictive" is like calling an
environment that limits or excludes radon, strychnine and arsenic
"restrictive".***
There's a difference. <g> Your kids will probably never look at arsenic
laced river sediment and want to eat a big plate full. They might very much
want to try some chocolate cake. The difference is in their desire. The
difference is in their psyche. That's the difference that matters to
unschooling. When a person wants something they can't have they feel
restricted. I've never met a kid who was longing for radon but maybe I'm
just hanging with a different crowd. <g>
If your kids haven't made the association between certain foods and how
those foods leave them feeling then not getting the chocolate cake leaves a
big hole of need. The hole is the problem with regards to unschooling.
As their mom you should avoid the holes as much as possible. I don't think
you can do that by limiting the foods their allowed to have. And I think
that was your original question, why are they so needy and what can you do
about it. They're needy because they already feel limited, they already
have a hole. What can you do about it? Fill them up.
Even when adults can make an association between an activity or food and the
way that activity or food makes them feel, they often choose the activity or
food because they believe the pleasure of the thing is worth feeling
uncomfortable later. Emotionally healthy people can make those choices
and still give consideration to their physical health and maintain a
balance. Emotionally needy people just keep trying to fill the hole
inside them, sometimes at the expense of their physical health.
Unschooling won't work where people are emotionally unbalanced, where their
unfulfilled need is driving them. You're unschooling mission, if you
choose to accept it, is to eliminate neediness. <g>
***We cannot buy just any rice flour/noodles we find cheaply
because there is a lot of cross-contamination when flours are
run/ground/processed on the same equipment.***
Maybe you can find a used flour mill on ebay or on a swap board and grind
your own. Advertise in your local paper that you want a free flour grinder.
Some old lady might have one in her basement.
If you have friends and family members who buy birthday and Christmas gifts
for your family, maybe you could suggest gift certificates at the health
food store so the kids can by a bunch of their favorite things.
We live ninety one miles from the best health food store. There's a small
one thirty six miles away but they don't have everything we like, and
there's another one about sixty miles away, also short on some things we
typically buy. They will mail some items to us and in the winter or with
gas prices as high as they are, this is sometimes an economical and
convenient option. So if you live a distance from your health food store
ask about getting some items shipped to you. What a nice surprise for your
kids to get their favorite cookies in the mail some week you didn't have
time to get to the health food store!
Rice puddings are easy treats if your kids like sweets. Chocolate rice
pudding is one of my favorite foods. <g>
My brother makes peanut butter cookies without flour. He says his kids
love them. I haven't tried them, but the recipe is:
2 c. peanut butter
2/3 c. brown sugar
6 TBS. fructose
2 large eggs
Mix, roll into balls, flatten with a fork dipped in sugar, bake 10-12
minutes at 350. Let cookies cool on cookie sheet before removing.
Deb Lewis
Yeah, I didn't think you were letting them starve,<g> but hunger can be
about more than a physically empty stomach. We can be needy for things we
think we're not getting enough of. That's a problem with limits.
***so it may not be a carb issue as I originally thought.***
It seems very likely an issue with allowed foods and their availability.
***I hope you're not saying that families with kids that must be on
special diets cannot also be unschoolers. :)***
Anytime one person is limiting the choices for another person it can
interfere with unschooling. That doesn't mean a parent will never limit a
child's choice, it means that parent might deal with issues other
unschooling parents don't have. If you're in that situation it may not
always be easy to reconcile a particular decision with unschooling.
If I had a child with a severe allergy to some food I would definitely have
kept that food out of the house. I would have socialized with people who
could easily and happily accommodate us and avoided going into the homes of
those who couldn't, until my kid was old enough to understand and avoid
those foods on his own. I have some experience with a child who chose a
diet different from anyone else we knew when he was very young, and I know a
very young person is capable of choosing and deciding.
An immediate life threatening allergy is different from an ethical choice
and even different from a general health maintenance diet. We know enough
about human psychology to know that even people who've had quadruple bypass
surgery and have been told that they should change their diet if they want
to continue to live well can have a difficult time or even find it
impossible to stick to a diet prescribed by someone else.
And like the bypass patient, who can feel resentful toward his doctor about
the diet limits even though the clogged arteries were not the doctors fault,
kids on restrictive diets can feel resentful toward the person who enforced
the diet. That's a potential problem that can interfere with unschooling.
If you're creative and thoughtful you might be able to make a difficult
situation work but it's not an ideal situation and that's what I meant.
***Calling a diet that
eliminates those substances "restrictive" is like calling an
environment that limits or excludes radon, strychnine and arsenic
"restrictive".***
There's a difference. <g> Your kids will probably never look at arsenic
laced river sediment and want to eat a big plate full. They might very much
want to try some chocolate cake. The difference is in their desire. The
difference is in their psyche. That's the difference that matters to
unschooling. When a person wants something they can't have they feel
restricted. I've never met a kid who was longing for radon but maybe I'm
just hanging with a different crowd. <g>
If your kids haven't made the association between certain foods and how
those foods leave them feeling then not getting the chocolate cake leaves a
big hole of need. The hole is the problem with regards to unschooling.
As their mom you should avoid the holes as much as possible. I don't think
you can do that by limiting the foods their allowed to have. And I think
that was your original question, why are they so needy and what can you do
about it. They're needy because they already feel limited, they already
have a hole. What can you do about it? Fill them up.
Even when adults can make an association between an activity or food and the
way that activity or food makes them feel, they often choose the activity or
food because they believe the pleasure of the thing is worth feeling
uncomfortable later. Emotionally healthy people can make those choices
and still give consideration to their physical health and maintain a
balance. Emotionally needy people just keep trying to fill the hole
inside them, sometimes at the expense of their physical health.
Unschooling won't work where people are emotionally unbalanced, where their
unfulfilled need is driving them. You're unschooling mission, if you
choose to accept it, is to eliminate neediness. <g>
***We cannot buy just any rice flour/noodles we find cheaply
because there is a lot of cross-contamination when flours are
run/ground/processed on the same equipment.***
Maybe you can find a used flour mill on ebay or on a swap board and grind
your own. Advertise in your local paper that you want a free flour grinder.
Some old lady might have one in her basement.
If you have friends and family members who buy birthday and Christmas gifts
for your family, maybe you could suggest gift certificates at the health
food store so the kids can by a bunch of their favorite things.
We live ninety one miles from the best health food store. There's a small
one thirty six miles away but they don't have everything we like, and
there's another one about sixty miles away, also short on some things we
typically buy. They will mail some items to us and in the winter or with
gas prices as high as they are, this is sometimes an economical and
convenient option. So if you live a distance from your health food store
ask about getting some items shipped to you. What a nice surprise for your
kids to get their favorite cookies in the mail some week you didn't have
time to get to the health food store!
Rice puddings are easy treats if your kids like sweets. Chocolate rice
pudding is one of my favorite foods. <g>
My brother makes peanut butter cookies without flour. He says his kids
love them. I haven't tried them, but the recipe is:
2 c. peanut butter
2/3 c. brown sugar
6 TBS. fructose
2 large eggs
Mix, roll into balls, flatten with a fork dipped in sugar, bake 10-12
minutes at 350. Let cookies cool on cookie sheet before removing.
Deb Lewis
Debra Rossing
Is there any way you can buy *ingredients* so you can make things? For
example, buy the rice flour (or whatever else you've found that's safe)
and what all to *make* cookies whenever throughout the week, and/or buy
safe mixes (I know our co-op and most places like Whole Foods and Trader
Joe's have lots of options in this regard). Also, fruits and veggies are
FULL of carbs - how about adding potatoes of all sorts (russet, gold,
sweet, 'gem', etc) to meals for one. Beans/lentils are also another
"fill me up" type food. As are oats (if you can find 'safe' oats that
aren't cross contaminated with wheat - I think McCann's <sp> brand is a
fairly safe brand of oats for gluten free folks). It's possible to make
tortillas and pizza doughs with rice flour. A "shepherd's pie" of
potatoes, beans or lentils, and peas (or other safe veggie) is quite the
stick to the ribs meal. And, be sure to stock up on the rice-based pasta
whenever you can. For 'staple' items, I rotate what I stock up on - one
week I'll buy lots of pasta, another week lots of beans, and so on. That
way, the bottom line stays the same but I've got pasta for a month,
beans for a month, and so on. By the time the pasta runs low, it's the
pasta's turn to be stocked.
Deb
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example, buy the rice flour (or whatever else you've found that's safe)
and what all to *make* cookies whenever throughout the week, and/or buy
safe mixes (I know our co-op and most places like Whole Foods and Trader
Joe's have lots of options in this regard). Also, fruits and veggies are
FULL of carbs - how about adding potatoes of all sorts (russet, gold,
sweet, 'gem', etc) to meals for one. Beans/lentils are also another
"fill me up" type food. As are oats (if you can find 'safe' oats that
aren't cross contaminated with wheat - I think McCann's <sp> brand is a
fairly safe brand of oats for gluten free folks). It's possible to make
tortillas and pizza doughs with rice flour. A "shepherd's pie" of
potatoes, beans or lentils, and peas (or other safe veggie) is quite the
stick to the ribs meal. And, be sure to stock up on the rice-based pasta
whenever you can. For 'staple' items, I rotate what I stock up on - one
week I'll buy lots of pasta, another week lots of beans, and so on. That
way, the bottom line stays the same but I've got pasta for a month,
beans for a month, and so on. By the time the pasta runs low, it's the
pasta's turn to be stocked.
Deb
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Debra Rossing
Gee - I just realized how little "bread" (loaf type stuff) we've
actually been eating lately. We've chosen to just make our own and we've
got the ingredients (all sorts of flours) and even a bread machine to
make it easier (and cooler in the summer). But, we often just don't
bother with it. We do eat LOTS of brown rice and tortillas (bought at
our vegetarian co-op or homemade) and sometimes corn tortilla chips. One
of the big changes is minimizing our potato usage because, much to my
potato-loving chagrin, it really did a number on my blood glucose
readings to eat a basic baked potato. So, that whole balance is
different now.
Deb
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actually been eating lately. We've chosen to just make our own and we've
got the ingredients (all sorts of flours) and even a bread machine to
make it easier (and cooler in the summer). But, we often just don't
bother with it. We do eat LOTS of brown rice and tortillas (bought at
our vegetarian co-op or homemade) and sometimes corn tortilla chips. One
of the big changes is minimizing our potato usage because, much to my
potato-loving chagrin, it really did a number on my blood glucose
readings to eat a basic baked potato. So, that whole balance is
different now.
Deb
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Debra Rossing
Can you include in the planning/budgeting once a month trips to wherever
for staples (rice flour, gfcf pastas and mixes and so on) and include in
maybe some other fun stuff (whatever is available in that town that you
don't often get to see or do - like maybe a matinee movie or something)
and make a day of it once a month to stock up on the good stuff at
better prices?
Deb
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for staples (rice flour, gfcf pastas and mixes and so on) and include in
maybe some other fun stuff (whatever is available in that town that you
don't often get to see or do - like maybe a matinee movie or something)
and make a day of it once a month to stock up on the good stuff at
better prices?
Deb
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intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they
are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify
the system manager.
This footnote also confirms that this email message has been swept by
MIMEsweeper for the presence of computer viruses.
CNC Software, Inc.
www.mastercam.com
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