Katharine Wise

And then there are times when they hit with no recognizable reason. These have always left me bewildered. What do you do when there is no "problem" to be solved? I used to spend a lot of time with one of my children, then about 3 or 4yo, trying to help them think of what they could have done instead of hitting but always struggled with the fact that there often seemed to be no issue at hand. He would just walk across the room and hit, sometimes his brother sometimes a neighbor.

Katharine

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> It takes a long time, and a lot of help, for some children to learn

> how to "use your words".



Sandra Dodd gave her kids a 3 step process:



1) Use your words.



2) If that doesn't work, get an adult.



3) If that doesn't work, then you can hit.












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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Eugenie van Ruitenbeek

My youngest (3) does the same. We figured out it is his need to play with
his brother in his own way, not in the way the oldest wants and Tygo (3)
does not know how to tell Jesse that he wants Jesse to move into the
direction of Tygo. So he hits him. "For no reason" but when we asked Tygo if
he wanted to play with Jesse his eyes started to shine and he said: "Yes,
with my toys". Most of the time they do what Jesse is liking.



Eugenie





_____

From: [email protected]
[mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Katharine Wise
Sent: Saturday, February 24, 2007 10:36 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: [unschoolingbasics] was TV and punishment/now hitting



And then there are times when they hit with no recognizable reason. These
have always left me bewildered. What do you do when there is no "problem" to
be solved? I used to spend a lot of time with one of my children, then about
3 or 4yo, trying to help them think of what they could have done instead of
hitting but always struggled with the fact that there often seemed to be no
issue at hand. He would just walk across the room and hit, sometimes his
brother sometimes a neighbor.

Katharine





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

plaidpanties666

--- In [email protected], Katharine Wise
<katharinewise@...> wrote:
>
> And then there are times when they hit with no recognizable
>reason. These have always left me bewildered. What do you do when
>there is no "problem" to be solved?

I'd focus on the feelings of the kid who had *gotten* hit and help
him/her express those to the hitter. Sometimes kids hit just to see
what will happen. Its how they learn about the world. Hearing a
firm "Hey, I didn't like that!" *is* a real consequence. Its one more
piece of information about the world.

A more elaborate reaction can sometimes be so interesting that it
leaves the hitter even more curious - wow! I wonder if that will
happen next time? so I try to keep things simple and to the point.

---Meredith (Mo 5, Ray 13)

Rachel Salavon

<katharinewise@...> wrote:
>
> And then there are times when they hit with no recognizable
reason.



We are still working on this one. My sons are 5&7. The oldest has
done things like smack his brother in the head just walking by.
Pardon the bad analogy, but it reminds me of the way a dog asserts
his dominance over another dog. He might look at the other dog and
growl. Or put his mouth over the more submissive dog's muzzle and
hold him down. I think it has to do with maintaining control and
staying at the top of the pecking order.

I also think that aggressive boy behaviors are what many people try
to excuse with "boys will be boys" or fix with "they just need more
discipline." From my experience, aggression comes from a feeling of
powerlessness (which more discipline only exacerbates). The more
empowered a child feels over his life, the less he needs to control
or feel powerful over other kids. As I said, we are still working
on this one. A lot of ds's aggression these days is verbal - mostly
aimed at his brother. I know he is working through his
own "therapy" of sorts. But it is hard to know how to intervene.
If I tell my older ds to stop or if I glare at him or have a talk
with him about how he treats his brother all day, it alienates him.
He feels left out and frustrated and unwanted. It actually makes
the problem worse (because he uses his brother as a scape goat for
whatever problem he is having). At the same time, I need my younger
ds to feel safe.

I have seen real progress with both of them through peaceful
parenting. But the aggression hasn't completely gone away. I guess
it is just part of who we are right now -- something we will all
grow through.

Rachel>
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> > It takes a long time, and a lot of help, for some
children to learn
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> > how to "use your words".
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> Sandra Dodd gave her kids a 3 step process:
>
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>
> 1) Use your words.
>
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> 2) If that doesn't work, get an adult.
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>
> 3) If that doesn't work, then you can hit.
>
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>
_____________________________________________________________________
_______________
> Now that's room service! Choose from over 150,000 hotels
> in 45,000 destinations on Yahoo! Travel to find your fit.
> http://farechase.yahoo.com/promo-generic-14795097
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

Eugenie van Ruitenbeek

Today it was so strange. he kicked 'for no reason'.. he spit on Jesse. I
really don't know what is the matter with him.. I have trouble to stay calm
and I breath a lot. is this normal behaviour? I really don't like it..



And I don't know what to do.



_____

From: [email protected]
[mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Eugenie van
Ruitenbeek
Sent: Saturday, February 24, 2007 11:10 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: RE: [unschoolingbasics] was TV and punishment/now hitting



My youngest (3) does the same. We figured out it is his need to play with
his brother in his own way, not in the way the oldest wants and Tygo (3)
does not know how to tell Jesse that he wants Jesse to move into the
direction of Tygo. So he hits him. "For no reason" but when we asked Tygo if
he wanted to play with Jesse his eyes started to shine and he said: "Yes,
with my toys". Most of the time they do what Jesse is liking.

Eugenie
_,_._,___



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Eugenie van Ruitenbeek

Hi Rachel,



You wrote: I also think that aggressive boy behaviors are what many people
try
to excuse with "boys will be boys" or fix with "they just need more
discipline." From my experience, aggression comes from a feeling of
powerlessness (which more discipline only exacerbates). The more
empowered a child feels over his life, the less he needs to control
or feel powerful over other kids. As I said, we are still working
on this one. A lot of ds's aggression these days is verbal - mostly
aimed at his brother. I know he is working through his
own "therapy" of sorts. But it is hard to know how to intervene.
If I tell my older ds to stop or if I glare at him or have a talk
with him about how he treats his brother all day, it alienates him.
He feels left out and frustrated and unwanted. It actually makes
the problem worse (because he uses his brother as a scape goat for
whatever problem he is having). At the same time, I need my younger
ds to feel safe.

I have seen real progress with both of them through peaceful
parenting. But the aggression hasn't completely gone away. I guess
it is just part of who we are right now -- something we will all
grow through.



>>>>> I think this is a beautiful way of looking at this aggresion. I have
to work hard on this issue because I come from a family with lots of
violence and agression. I train myself to stay peaceful and I am glad I
succeed many times doing so but still wonder. what can I do?



Maybe it is just part of who we are right now. :>) Thanks for sharing> It
helps a lot.



Warmly,

Eugenie



,_._,___



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

plaidpanties666

--- In [email protected], "Eugenie van Ruitenbeek"
<emmvr@...> wrote:
>
> Today it was so strange. he kicked 'for no reason'.. he spit on
Jesse. I
> really don't know what is the matter with him.

This is the 3yo? Sounds pretty normal to me. 3s don't have much in
the way of communication skills, yet, so kicking, hitting, spitting,
are ways to explore the world of how people react *and* explore
different ways of self-expression. Frustrating, to be sure, but not
a sign of something wrong.

I'd suggest looking for ways to rearrange your time so you are right
there with the kids as much as possible - even right down on the
floor with them, not puttering around trying to get things done. If
you are *there* you will have a much better understanding of what's
going on - is the 3yo frustrated or just curious? You can also help
the other child set better boundaries and communicate his own needs.

---Meredith (Mo 5, Ray 13)