little journal note - new "computers" and learning
alisonslp
A couple days ago, both dd and ds decided to spend their extra
Christmas money on these little mini computers (barbie and batman).
They love laptops, as dh and I both have them. Anyway, traditionally,
I would never have let them buy one of these. The noise, the
"uselessness" of it... I have said before I have a thing about
electronic toys (educationally oriented or not) that I need to get
over. Anyway, I kept my mouth shut and they bought what they wanted.
Turns out it's an "educational" toy - has all these games related to
spelling, math, logic, music, etc. They are having a blast! DS has
spelled more words right with this little computer that he had from
Sept. - Nov. with our spelling work. And when he gets it wrong, he
doesn't get frustrated. He just tries again. He said to me - "mom,
this is SO much better that school work!" I just had to laugh and
agree with him. Then I joined him in playing one of the frogger type
games that was on it as well. I'm still not thrilled that these
electronic toys are making their way in my house but I must say that I
do have a new appreciation for the attention and dedication that I am
seeing in my son when he's playing with them.
alison
Christmas money on these little mini computers (barbie and batman).
They love laptops, as dh and I both have them. Anyway, traditionally,
I would never have let them buy one of these. The noise, the
"uselessness" of it... I have said before I have a thing about
electronic toys (educationally oriented or not) that I need to get
over. Anyway, I kept my mouth shut and they bought what they wanted.
Turns out it's an "educational" toy - has all these games related to
spelling, math, logic, music, etc. They are having a blast! DS has
spelled more words right with this little computer that he had from
Sept. - Nov. with our spelling work. And when he gets it wrong, he
doesn't get frustrated. He just tries again. He said to me - "mom,
this is SO much better that school work!" I just had to laugh and
agree with him. Then I joined him in playing one of the frogger type
games that was on it as well. I'm still not thrilled that these
electronic toys are making their way in my house but I must say that I
do have a new appreciation for the attention and dedication that I am
seeing in my son when he's playing with them.
alison
Deb Lewis
***DS has
spelled more words right with this little computer that he had from
Sept. - Nov. with our spelling work. And when he gets it wrong, he
doesn't get frustrated. He just tries again. He said to me - "mom,
this is SO much better that school work!" I just had to laugh and
agree with him. ***
So, are you not unschoolers? You've probably said but my sieve, I mean
brain, doesn't hold on to some things.
I was rabidly anti "educational" toy. They irked me. It IRKS me that
people who make toys should be trying to manipulate and trick kids into
learning. A kid can learn more from a shoe box filled with pine cones than
from researched, expert constructed, educational, beepy things.
But I let Dylan get what he wanted. He wanted some math machine we saw
somewhere and I stayed smilingly quiet and got it for him and turns out he
wanted to pretend it was an instrument panel on a space ship. I was
overjoyed. <g> But really, had he used it for it's intended purpose, if
that's what he wanted it for, he'd have had just as much fun as pretending
to be Mr. Spock. They know so much more than we do about what they want and
what they like.
My kid probably used it differently because he had no idea people studied or
worked at or played at math. At that time he may not have known what the
word math meant. I think we still have that machine but the cord shorted
out. Maybe I'll fix the cord and turn it on and see what I was afraid of
ten years ago.<g> Maybe we'll have fun remembering how he played with it.
I'll reminisce a little about how he almost always saw something other than
what he was looking at. His gloved fingers, bent a certain way made the
face of a monster in a story. Dryer sheets were webs of silk fired from
Mothra's offspring at an enemy. A math machine was an instrument panel
upon which the success of a dangerous mission depended.
I don't think he ever asked for an educational type toy for the purpose of
learning the thing the manufacturer was hoping to teach. Having been
unschooled his whole life he felt very little, if any, interest in school
looking stuff. He liked number puzzles for a while, those fat, magazine
style puzzle books in impulse isles at grocery stores. He did some Sudoku
but hasn't done those in a year or more. Never had a work book nor spelling
book that I remember. He did love mazes and we scoured the country (via the
internet) looking for maze books. He drew maze after maze for me to solve
and they were filled with peril. I would sometimes take a wrong turn and be
devoured by a dragon.
But spelling. No spelling lessons, no spelling work. A few years ago my
brother gave him an electronic speller, one of those things you can plug the
word in the way you think it's spelled and it will give you options for
words you might have meant. <g> He mostly used it when we played Scrabble
but I haven't seen it in a year or so.
***DS has spelled more words right with this little computer that he had
from
Sept. - Nov. with our spelling work. ***
Are you hoping to move toward unschooling? I went through the school
system and I'm a terrible speller. My spelling improved considerably when I
started emailing friends and using spell check. Unschooling advice about
helping kids with spelling has been to spell words for them when they wanted
to know how a word was spelled. I can say as an adult who had spelling
lessons and spelling tests and spelling work in school that the only thing
that improved my spelling was having the correct spelling simply given to me
(with spell check.) I was in my thirties before I personally saw the truth
of that but my kid knows solidly that his spelling will improve the more he
writes and that a person can live well and happily even if they're not the
best of spellers. <g>
Deb Lewis
spelled more words right with this little computer that he had from
Sept. - Nov. with our spelling work. And when he gets it wrong, he
doesn't get frustrated. He just tries again. He said to me - "mom,
this is SO much better that school work!" I just had to laugh and
agree with him. ***
So, are you not unschoolers? You've probably said but my sieve, I mean
brain, doesn't hold on to some things.
I was rabidly anti "educational" toy. They irked me. It IRKS me that
people who make toys should be trying to manipulate and trick kids into
learning. A kid can learn more from a shoe box filled with pine cones than
from researched, expert constructed, educational, beepy things.
But I let Dylan get what he wanted. He wanted some math machine we saw
somewhere and I stayed smilingly quiet and got it for him and turns out he
wanted to pretend it was an instrument panel on a space ship. I was
overjoyed. <g> But really, had he used it for it's intended purpose, if
that's what he wanted it for, he'd have had just as much fun as pretending
to be Mr. Spock. They know so much more than we do about what they want and
what they like.
My kid probably used it differently because he had no idea people studied or
worked at or played at math. At that time he may not have known what the
word math meant. I think we still have that machine but the cord shorted
out. Maybe I'll fix the cord and turn it on and see what I was afraid of
ten years ago.<g> Maybe we'll have fun remembering how he played with it.
I'll reminisce a little about how he almost always saw something other than
what he was looking at. His gloved fingers, bent a certain way made the
face of a monster in a story. Dryer sheets were webs of silk fired from
Mothra's offspring at an enemy. A math machine was an instrument panel
upon which the success of a dangerous mission depended.
I don't think he ever asked for an educational type toy for the purpose of
learning the thing the manufacturer was hoping to teach. Having been
unschooled his whole life he felt very little, if any, interest in school
looking stuff. He liked number puzzles for a while, those fat, magazine
style puzzle books in impulse isles at grocery stores. He did some Sudoku
but hasn't done those in a year or more. Never had a work book nor spelling
book that I remember. He did love mazes and we scoured the country (via the
internet) looking for maze books. He drew maze after maze for me to solve
and they were filled with peril. I would sometimes take a wrong turn and be
devoured by a dragon.
But spelling. No spelling lessons, no spelling work. A few years ago my
brother gave him an electronic speller, one of those things you can plug the
word in the way you think it's spelled and it will give you options for
words you might have meant. <g> He mostly used it when we played Scrabble
but I haven't seen it in a year or so.
***DS has spelled more words right with this little computer that he had
from
Sept. - Nov. with our spelling work. ***
Are you hoping to move toward unschooling? I went through the school
system and I'm a terrible speller. My spelling improved considerably when I
started emailing friends and using spell check. Unschooling advice about
helping kids with spelling has been to spell words for them when they wanted
to know how a word was spelled. I can say as an adult who had spelling
lessons and spelling tests and spelling work in school that the only thing
that improved my spelling was having the correct spelling simply given to me
(with spell check.) I was in my thirties before I personally saw the truth
of that but my kid knows solidly that his spelling will improve the more he
writes and that a person can live well and happily even if they're not the
best of spellers. <g>
Deb Lewis
[email protected]
In a message dated 1/2/2007 10:37:10 A.M. Eastern Standard Time,
d.lewis@... writes:
I don't think he ever asked for an educational type toy for the purpose of
learning the thing the manufacturer was hoping to teach.
*******
Both of my kids really like "educational" toys. Especially my daughter.
She has a Barbie computer and pulls it out every so often. She says she is
going to learn to spell. She has never been to school.
My son is a little more suspicious of such things, having gone to preschool.
But he has a Leapster and really enjoys most of the games, even though most
are overwhelmingly schooly. A new one he got for Christmas has quizzes,
which he is enjoying very much. Go figure.
None of the overtly obvious learning toys are considered more or less
important than other toys. I buy both and the kids enjoy both. I don't notice
them "learning" more from the educational ones.
It *is* helpful when beginning to unschool to remind oneself that learning
happens everywhere and not to get hung up on the educational content listed on
the box. Actually, I copy the box and put it in my state records. <g> And
not to worry if they are using it "correctly", as Deb points out.
But just a different perspective in case someone is worried that their child
does use these "correctly". :)
Leslie in SC
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
d.lewis@... writes:
I don't think he ever asked for an educational type toy for the purpose of
learning the thing the manufacturer was hoping to teach.
*******
Both of my kids really like "educational" toys. Especially my daughter.
She has a Barbie computer and pulls it out every so often. She says she is
going to learn to spell. She has never been to school.
My son is a little more suspicious of such things, having gone to preschool.
But he has a Leapster and really enjoys most of the games, even though most
are overwhelmingly schooly. A new one he got for Christmas has quizzes,
which he is enjoying very much. Go figure.
None of the overtly obvious learning toys are considered more or less
important than other toys. I buy both and the kids enjoy both. I don't notice
them "learning" more from the educational ones.
It *is* helpful when beginning to unschool to remind oneself that learning
happens everywhere and not to get hung up on the educational content listed on
the box. Actually, I copy the box and put it in my state records. <g> And
not to worry if they are using it "correctly", as Deb points out.
But just a different perspective in case someone is worried that their child
does use these "correctly". :)
Leslie in SC
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Deb Lewis
***But just a different perspective in case someone is worried that their
child
does use these "correctly". :)***
It's the freedom to use a thing, - Leapster, pine cone, dryer sheet - on
your own terms, for as long as you want and to be finished when you want
that makes the difference.
***It *is* helpful when beginning to unschool to remind oneself that
learning
happens everywhere and not to get hung up on the educational content listed
on
the box.***
***And not to worry if they are using it "correctly"***
It's not easy for some folks to spend some significant amount of money on a
toy with promised educational benefits and then to see a kid use it for a
rocket launcher instead.<g> But it's a pivotal moment when a parent can
delight in his or her child's own unique vision rather than focus on a
prescribed use with the same tunnel vision of the manufacturer.
And I should mention that Dylan uses many things in their prescribed way;
stove, oven, microwave, furnace, TV, DVD player, PS2, computer, piano,
telescope, trampoline, and has had some fun/success/surprises in using those
things in other ways as well.<G>
Deb Lewis
child
does use these "correctly". :)***
It's the freedom to use a thing, - Leapster, pine cone, dryer sheet - on
your own terms, for as long as you want and to be finished when you want
that makes the difference.
***It *is* helpful when beginning to unschool to remind oneself that
learning
happens everywhere and not to get hung up on the educational content listed
on
the box.***
***And not to worry if they are using it "correctly"***
It's not easy for some folks to spend some significant amount of money on a
toy with promised educational benefits and then to see a kid use it for a
rocket launcher instead.<g> But it's a pivotal moment when a parent can
delight in his or her child's own unique vision rather than focus on a
prescribed use with the same tunnel vision of the manufacturer.
And I should mention that Dylan uses many things in their prescribed way;
stove, oven, microwave, furnace, TV, DVD player, PS2, computer, piano,
telescope, trampoline, and has had some fun/success/surprises in using those
things in other ways as well.<G>
Deb Lewis
alisonslp
--- In [email protected], "Deb Lewis" <d.lewis@...> wrote:
"take a permanent vacation" from school in early December. Before
that, we followed a relaxed classical approach with a focus on reading
writing and math. I have 6yr old twins (boy and girl) and a 3yr old
boy. I am more onboard with unschooling than DH. He's with the kids
three days during the week while I work and tends to want some
structure. He didn't feel comfortable just letting them "play" all day
long. So in dec, he had them read a little bit each day, write in a
journal and do some math activities. He didn't care what they chose to
write, read or play (games, computer game dealing with math) as long
as they did at least something structured. On the days I was home,
there was so much going on getting ready for the holidays and
visitors, that the kids were left to their own devices, but often
offered to help me.
I realize that "assigning" work, is not unschooling, regardless of how
much control the kids have about the actual activities. But given
that DH isn't quite on the same page as me just yet, and he is trying
to embrace this as best as he can, I see this as a reasonable
transition compromise. I will say that he hasn't asked for any "plan"
for the new year in terms of what he should be focusing on with the
kids. That's a good sign.
alison
So that's the situation at this point.
> So, are you not unschoolers? You've probably said but my sieve, II should have mentioned it again. We are new unschoolers. I decided to
>mean brain, doesn't hold on to some things.
"take a permanent vacation" from school in early December. Before
that, we followed a relaxed classical approach with a focus on reading
writing and math. I have 6yr old twins (boy and girl) and a 3yr old
boy. I am more onboard with unschooling than DH. He's with the kids
three days during the week while I work and tends to want some
structure. He didn't feel comfortable just letting them "play" all day
long. So in dec, he had them read a little bit each day, write in a
journal and do some math activities. He didn't care what they chose to
write, read or play (games, computer game dealing with math) as long
as they did at least something structured. On the days I was home,
there was so much going on getting ready for the holidays and
visitors, that the kids were left to their own devices, but often
offered to help me.
I realize that "assigning" work, is not unschooling, regardless of how
much control the kids have about the actual activities. But given
that DH isn't quite on the same page as me just yet, and he is trying
to embrace this as best as he can, I see this as a reasonable
transition compromise. I will say that he hasn't asked for any "plan"
for the new year in terms of what he should be focusing on with the
kids. That's a good sign.
alison
So that's the situation at this point.