agasma7

Apparently, I am missing something. so I am going to ask very basic
honest questions about unschooling in hopes that I can at least get
clarity. This is not to insult anyone, I am really asking.

Am I right or are approximate bed times taboo in unschooling circles?

What about insisting on respect from children (express yourself but
watch your tone kind of thing)? Is this also taboo?

The impression I get is that unschooling (please forgive my
ignorance I thought the unschooling ideals were limited to not
forcing the child to "do school" and letting them direct the
learning that WOULD be engaged in) parents engourage their kids to
have fun and experience life but don't require anything of the
children that they don't want to do.

Am I right about that? Am I asking this correctly?

If not, can someone please explain what "Unschooling" practically
and the philosophy behind teaching a child to navigate life.

I stay at home with my kids all day. None are in school and none are
homeschooling.

Thanks for your time.

Ren Allen

"Am I right or are approximate bed times taboo in unschooling circles?

What about insisting on respect from children (express yourself but
watch your tone kind of thing)? Is this also taboo?"

There are no "taboo's", but you might get questioned or given options
on this list that are different. That's all.:)

When a parent says "I trust you to learn what you want when you want"
but then insists on lights out at 9pm every night, that isn't trusting
the child to learn about their body's need for sleep.

That doesn't mean we aren't paying attention to their body signs of
tiredness, or helping them transition to sleep. It means a time is
less important than helping them to sleep when they're actually tired.
That's all. For some kids it will happen at roughly the same time
every night (unless they go through a growth spurt or other change)
for others it varies.

I'm not sure how anyone can "insist on respect" since respect would be
something another person feels. We can't control how another person
feels, but we CAN manipulate them enough to get fake respect.
I think it's better to act in a way that earns respect. If we treat
our children respectfully, they'll be more likely to give respect.

Most children are treated so disrespectfully, and then the parents
demand this "respect" they haven't earned. It's sad.

BUT, do I ask my child to treat me kindly? Sure.
Jalen (5) is a very intense child to say the least. He tends to act
out his emotions without pause...which leads to screaming or angry
words. When we have a moment to pause and talk, he really doesn't WANT
to be that way. In fact, after a particularly rough day today, he said
"I wish I didn't feel crazy inside".
He FEELS that out-of-control feeling and doesn't like it.

The best thing I can do for him, is to gently (which I sometimes fail
miserably at) remind him that I don't like being screamed at. When he
yells "get me my goggles", I DO say something along the lines of "I
don't like being screamed at, all you have to do is talk to me!"

I remind him daily that talking is a great way to get help. Slowly, he
is becoming more capable of calmiing himself faster. I have no control
over how he feels, but I can act in a respectful manner myself, and
that makes it likely he will learn those skills in his own time and
way. The rest of my children are very kind and sweet and yes,
respectful. It's all part of their learning...just like everything
else in life.

Ren
learninginfreedom.com

Michelle/Melbrigða

On 7/17/06, agasma7 <facingeast@...> wrote:

>
> Am I right or are approximate bed times taboo in unschooling circles?

All people have a bedtime (except those of us that tend to deal with
insomnia from time to time :) ) The key is learning when your body is
tired and responding to that. You can put a child to bed at 9:00 but
that doesn't mean that they are going to fall asleep at 9:00. My
daughter Emily is the perfect example of that. She is a night owl.
Was born a night owl. Has always been a night owl. Her energy rarely
gets running until mid afternoon and she is at her peak creativity
after 11pm. For years we tried getting her to go to bed at a bedtime
because she needed to live in "the real world." (rolling eyes). At
9:00 (or whatever her bedtime was) we would send her to bed. She
would almost always still be awake at 11:00 when I would check on her
before going to sleep. Then I would be dragging her out of bed at
6:00 am for school or when we stopped going to school around 8:00 so
she could have the whole day to do things. Somehow I thought that if
I could get her in a habit of getting up earlier then she would have a
more "normal" schedule. Now I know that what is "normal" for her is
this really weird (to me a morning person) schedule.

>
> What about insisting on respect from children (express yourself but
> watch your tone kind of thing)? Is this also taboo?

Wanting to be respected is not taboo. *Expecting* someone, *anyone,*
is. I want to be respected, but my children are not going to learn to
be respectful unless they are treated with respect first. I was
channel flipping last night and came across an episode of The Nanny
(someone whose parenting philosophies I disagree with about 98% of the
time). Anyway the family that she was working with showed a mom who
basically ignored her two children. They sat in front of the tv all
day or played video games. This would be fine in an unschooling
family with a mindful parent. Then she decides that they need to do
something for her. I don't remember what, but the children are sitting
there watching tv and in the middle of the program the formerly
uninvolved parent turns off the tv and states that it is "her way or
no way. Sorry tv is off, get over it." After this there comes a huge
fight where the son actually gets physical with the mom hitting her
and she leaves him in his room. I think that I would be pretty ticked
too if someone had ignored me all day and then suddenly decided that
they were going to control my life, turning off something I was
engaged in and bullying me around being "boss." The mother showed NO
respect to these children and then got upset when her son showed her
no respect in return. He didn't comply. Children will not learn
respect if they, themselves, are not treated with respect. Do you
want to be respectful to people who treat you poorly?

I believe that my children have come to treat me with respect and
dignity because I have respected them, their needs and treated them as
loving whole people who have dreams, hopes and desires and helped them
in a achieving those things not because I gave them a list of rules to
teach them to "respect their elders." I also think that they are
respectful to most other people that they encounter. I have seen my
children, on occasion, be disrespectful towards someone, but it would
be a case where I would probably end up being disrespectful as well -
because they were not themselves being treated with respect.

--
Michelle
aka Melbrigða
http://eventualknitting.blogspot.com
[email protected] - Homeschooling for the Medieval Recreationist

agasma7

Okay...thanks. You know, I saw the Nanny episode last night (and the
one after it also) and spent a lot of time wondering where the mother
was and why she didn't just get them out more.

Ren, I am glad to know that you don't stay silent when someone is
screaming at you. I take a very similar approach to how you handle
your son. I talk to her in similar ways and I understand she doesn't
want to be so angry. She has always been an intense child. I do try to
teach her healthy ways of handling her passion. I try to help her get
her head around what is going on and to think about if she finds her
reactions to be useful to her. She usually stops and we talk about how
to better handle it or to learn to let little things go. (she's pretty
hard on her little sister)
I teach her tricks that I had to learn on my own. It works.


BEDTIMES:

I have a baby who is 1. I put him down at whatever time he gets fussy
in the evening which is usually between 7 and 8.

I have a 3 year old who I will put down if he seems especially tired,
and I am tired, and we are all soon going to bed...and that is usually
about 8:30-9. Last night he fell asleep on me watching tv.

My 6 year old and my 10 year old will get dressed for bed and usually
I have been directing them to bed between 8:30-9. Unless we are
watching something or have something to do and then when we are done,
they go to bed.

I keep them pretty active and they usually fall asleep within a half
hour or so.

So, since we aren't doing the school thing anymore, I have decided to
try taking away the bed times without telling them that's what I am
doing. Except for my 1 year old.

I did that last night with my kids and my son fell alseep on me, my 6
year old fell asleep on me, and my 10 year old went to be right after
I did. She asked me why I let her stay up. lol...she was totally
confused.

I don't force my kids to eat anything.
I don't force them to wear anything.
But we do agree on staying away from certain types of clothing.
I don't force them like everybody, but I do ask that they keep their
dignity and not result to intentionally insulting people.
I don't force school anymore.
I talk to them.

Do unschoolers here have ANY rules at your house? Is the unschooling
life a life of zero rules? Or is it not forcing the issue on little
things like bed times or clothes or how much they eat?

I am willing (and want) to try some things and test out these theories
and am willing to give it time. But I do have to understand what you
are talking about.

I was under the impression that [for example] when your children
screamed at you, nothing was said and you just let them go without
addressing the issue. When does one childs "freedom" infringe on
another childs' rights or even the parents' rights?

Thanks for taking the time to address my posts. :)

Deb

--- In [email protected], "agasma7" <facingeast@...>
wrote:
>
> I was under the impression that [for example] when your children
> screamed at you, nothing was said and you just let them go without
> addressing the issue. When does one childs "freedom" infringe on
> another childs' rights or even the parents' rights?
>
At exactly the same time that one adult's rights infringe on
another's. You can't yell Fire in a crowded theater. If your spouse
or SO yelled at you, what would you do? Apply that both ways: that
is, how would you respond to the yeller? And if you were doing the
yelling, how would your SO respond to you? We're just taking age out
of the equation and treating all persons in the household with
respect.

As far as screaming (or hitting, kicking, whatever), sometimes that
is not the issue - it is a symptom. So, sending a child to their
room (or time out or whatever) does nothing to address the cause,
just the symptom. It's like sucking a Ricola cough drop for a
serious throat infection - it might calm the symptoms temporarily,
but the underlying issue is still there and will come back and more.
You may even do it enough that the child no longer screams at you -
doesn't mean the underlying issue is gone, just that they've gotten
better at hiding or ignoring it. Sometimes it may look like the
screaming is not being addressed (because there's no one
saying "Don't yell; go to your room" etc). There have been times in
the past when my son hit me and I just hugged him and gave him a
kiss (I'm sure there were people going "what is she, nuts?"). He
didn't need me to jump on him for hitting - he already felt bad. He
needed to know he was safe when those big feelings overwhelmed him.
Then we could talk and find out what was going on AND address
finding ways to deal with things that did not hurt others. I am his
partner in learning to deal with the world, not his adversary. Kids
come into the world fully equipped with a set of emotions. What they
don't have at that point are the skills to deal with expressing
those emotions in a manner that is safe for themselves and those
around them. That's where we come in.

Another part of the situation is learning our kids. Knowing when a
situation is getting too overwhelming and they need help. Knowing
when something just is not a good idea and skipping it. Knowing that
he needs to eat every 3 hours even though he's now 8, not a
nursling. And so on. Rather than always reacting defensively,
working proactively together to not get into those situations in the
first place. And if they do arise, finding safe ways to vent those
emotions and move on.

--Deb

[email protected]

-----Original Message-----
From: facingeast@...

Am I right or are approximate bed times taboo in unschooling circles?

-=-=-=-

Are they arbitrary? Just because *you* say so? Or is there an actual
reason to suggest that someone go to sleep before he's ready?

-=-=-=-

What about insisting on respect from children (express yourself but
watch your tone kind of thing)? Is this also taboo?

-=-=-=-

You can't insist on respect. You can earn it. You can *think* someone
respects you, but until he actually *does*, you're just fooling
yourself.

When you say, "Watch your tone," are you watching *yours*?

There are appropriate and inappropriate times for all sorts of things.

-=-=-=-=-

The impression I get is that unschooling (please forgive my
ignorance I thought the unschooling ideals were limited to not
forcing the child to "do school" and letting them direct the
learning that WOULD be engaged in) parents engourage their kids to
have fun and experience life but don't require anything of the
children that they don't want to do.

Am I right about that? Am I asking this correctly?

-=-=-=--

Have you read John Holt? He coined the word unschooling.

He wrote that he thought children were much brighter than adults give
them credit for. That they were capable of much more than adults think
they are. That they are generous and kind and want to learn to navigate
their world, but that adults seem to *need* to control them.

If you can trust them to learn academics, why do you feel you cannot
trust them to learn how to live in the world?
http://r02.webmail.aol.com/18735/aol/en-us/Mail/compose-message.aspx#
-=-=-=-=-

If not, can someone please explain what "Unschooling" practically
and the philosophy behind teaching a child to navigate life.

-=-=-=-=

Do you do anything that you do not choose to do? Why?


~Kelly

Kelly Lovejoy
Conference Coordinator
Live and Learn Unschooling Conference
http://liveandlearnconference.org

School's goal is to prepare them to be anything they want. But the
process is so dullifying and kids haven't explored the possibilities of
what they could be that many set their sites as low as possible. They
go to college to get a job to buy stuff. ~Joyce Fetteroll


________________________________________________________________________
Check out AOL.com today. Breaking news, video search, pictures, email
and IM. All on demand. Always Free.

[email protected]

-----Original Message-----
From: pamperedmichelle@...

> Am I right or are approximate bed times taboo in unschooling circles?

All people have a bedtime (except those of us that tend to deal with
insomnia from time to time :) )

-=-=-=-

People have to *sleep* sometime. They never need to be in a bed! <g>
Duncan prefers the sofa.

I had strict bedtimes as a child. I still have trouble falling asleep.
I lie there and think---just as I did as a child.

Duncan, on the other hand, will fall asleep when he's tired.

I'm green with envy! <g> Is my insomnia due to my bedtime? Maybe. Is
his quick-to-sleep due to his lack of one?

Maybe it's genetic.

Hard to say. But I know I'd spend hours and hours lying in bed before
I'd get to sleep. And I still do most of the time. Although it seems to
be getting better as I change the way I look at the bed and sleep.
Luckily, Duncan will never have that issue.



~Kelly

Kelly Lovejoy
Conference Coordinator
Live and Learn Unschooling Conference
http://liveandlearnconference.org

School's goal is to prepare them to be anything they want. But the
process is so dullifying and kids haven't explored the possibilities
of what they could be that many set their sites as low as possible.
They go to college to get a job to buy stuff. ~Joyce Fetteroll
________________________________________________________________________
Check out AOL.com today. Breaking news, video search, pictures, email
and IM. All on demand. Always Free.

Michelle/Melbrigða

On 7/18/06, agasma7 <facingeast@...> wrote:

> Do unschoolers here have ANY rules at your house? Is the unschooling
> life a life of zero rules? Or is it not forcing the issue on little
> things like bed times or clothes or how much they eat?
>

This is my current favorite quote as to rules, "First, your return to
shore was not part of our negotiations nor our agreement, so I must do
nothin'. And secondly, you must be a pirate for the Pirate's Code to
apply, and you're not. And thirdly, the Code is more what you'd call
"guidelines" than actual rules. Welcome aboard the Black Pearl, Miss
Turner. "

We have "guidelines" in our house. We agree to certain things like
treating each other with respect, helping when we can but
understanding that help isn't expected (such as in "can you help me
with the dishes so we can get them done quicker so we can bake
cookies?") Oh wait, we do have one rule, "Keon flush the toilet!"
OK, he doesn't always flush so maybe it is a guideline. LOL!

> I was under the impression that [for example] when your children
> screamed at you, nothing was said and you just let them go without
> addressing the issue. When does one childs "freedom" infringe on
> another childs' rights or even the parents' rights?
>

Oh I don't think so. I may not have a problem with *what* someone
says to me, but I might have a problem with HOW something is said to
me. I always acknowledge anger, fear, sadness, happiness, etc when I
hear it, but that doesn't mean that I can be abused. It's part of the
whole respect thing. This also goes for parents as well. Parents
can't yell at their children and expect their children to give them
the same respect back.

--
Michelle
aka Melbrigða
http://eventualknitting.blogspot.com
[email protected] - Homeschooling for the Medieval Recreationist

agasma7

> Are they arbitrary? Just because *you* say so? Or is there an
actual
> reason to suggest that someone go to sleep before he's ready?

No. There is no reason to put children to bed when they are not
tired.
But
I have 3 kids under 6. I use clues for them like; my one year old
gets fussy between 7-8. If i put him down, he goes right to sleep.
My 3 year old frequently asks to go to bed if I don't put him down
soon enough. Last night he just fell asleep on me. He had all the
tired clues. He never lasts past 9. So when I put him to bed, it's
usually about 8:30-9. If he gets up, I let him get up.
My six year old gets tired at the same time. sh eeither falls asleep
on me or she tells me she is tired and goes to bed. There are also
times when I say "bed time" and she just goes to bed and right to
sleep. The time she falls asleep on me is the same time I would tell
her to go to bed.
I have seen my oldest daughter lay in bed awake. So, because of
advice here, I will let her stay up until she gets tired. I trust
her to know when she's tired.
>
> -=-=-=-
>
> You can't insist on respect. You can earn it. You can *think*
someone
> respects you, but until he actually *does*, you're just fooling
> yourself.
>
> When you say, "Watch your tone," are you watching *yours*?
>
> Yes. Actually I am talking to her and drawing her back down to
> reality so things don't get blown out of proportion or so I can at
least understand why she is so upset.

It is good to remember that we should also remember our tone with
our children.
> -=-=-=-=-
>
> Have you read John Holt? He coined the word unschooling.
>
> He wrote that he thought children were much brighter than adults
give
> them credit for. That they were capable of much more than adults
think
> they are. That they are generous and kind and want to learn to
navigate
> their world, but that adults seem to *need* to control them.
>
> If you can trust them to learn academics, why do you feel you
cannot
> trust them to learn how to live in the world?

Sure I trust them. I don't force anything on them anymore. I do try
to teach them that we should work as team to get things done so we
can all play more.
>
> -=-=-=-=
>
> Do you do anything that you do not choose to do? Why?

Yes. All the time. Because it needs to be done or I choose to do it.


>
>
> ~Kelly
>
> Kelly Lovejoy
> Conference Coordinator
> Live and Learn Unschooling Conference
> http://liveandlearnconference.org
>
> School's goal is to prepare them to be anything they want. But
the
> process is so dullifying and kids haven't explored the
possibilities of
> what they could be that many set their sites as low as possible.
They
> go to college to get a job to buy stuff. ~Joyce Fetteroll
>
>
>
_____________________________________________________________________
___
> Check out AOL.com today. Breaking news, video search, pictures,
email
> and IM. All on demand. Always Free.
>

[email protected]

-----Original Message-----
From: facingeast@...

> Do you do anything that you do not choose to do? Why?

Yes. All the time. Because it needs to be done or I choose to do it.

-=-=-=-

You do things you do not choose to do? All the time?

Why?



~Kelly

Kelly Lovejoy
Conference Coordinator
Live and Learn Unschooling Conference
http://liveandlearnconference.org

School's goal is to prepare them to be anything they want. But the
process is so dullifying and kids haven't explored the possibilities
of what they could be that many set their sites as low as possible.
They go to college to get a job to buy stuff. ~Joyce Fetteroll


________________________________________________________________________
Check out AOL.com today. Breaking news, video search, pictures, email
and IM. All on demand. Always Free.

agasma7

>
> You do things you do not choose to do? All the time?
>
> Why?

Because they have to be done. If I don't do it, it doesn't get done.

I can see the level of dirt that would accumlate if I assumed my 6 and
10 year old would clean their room without my reminding. Food goes in
there, clothes everywhere. As it is, I have found rotting bananas
under the bed, complete with fruit flies.

I quite frequently clean it for them. Sometimes what we do is trade. I
do their room (because they like that the least) and they clean
something else in the house (like the kitchen or bathroom).

Deb

--- In [email protected], "Michelle/Melbrigða"
<pamperedmichelle@...> wrote:
>
> This is my current favorite quote as to rules, "First, your return
>to
> shore was not part of our negotiations nor our agreement, so I
>must do
> nothin'. And secondly, you must be a pirate for the Pirate's Code
>to
> apply, and you're not. And thirdly, the Code is more what you'd
>call
> "guidelines" than actual rules. Welcome aboard the Black Pearl,
>Miss
> Turner. "
LOL we just saw this on video and got a good chuckle out of it

> We have "guidelines" in our house. We agree to certain things like
> treating each other with respect, helping when we can but
> understanding that help isn't expected (such as in "can you help me
> with the dishes so we can get them done quicker so we can bake
> cookies?")

Exactly - calls to mind something going on today at home. DS got one
of those cheap plastic bristle dart games somewhere (forget why or
where). He fell in love with it. However, the bristle started
breaking making it even harder to get the silly darts to stick. Last
night, while Ds was at MIL's as usual, DH and I stopped in to a
sporting goods place to browse the kayaks (we're considering getting
a couple - they're way easier to manage/transport than our current
large canoe). While we were there, we passed the regular dartboards
and DH mentioned how much DS liked the little dartboard but how hard
it was getting with the broken bits. We looked at the selection and
picked an inexpensive, electronic, soft tip set (weighted like
regular darts but with plastic tips - can't pierce skin but would
hurt if hit hard with one). We set it in the back seat of the car
and headed to pick DS up. We hung around and chatted a bit as usual
then told DS there was a surprise in the car for him. He said his
goodbyes and headed to the car. When he saw what it was he gasped in
glee, jumped back out of the car and wrapped a big hug around me.
Then I said "Daddy told me how much you liked the dart game and how
it was getting broken" so he ran over to DH (who was still on the
sidewalk near the house, I was right at the car already) and gave
him a massive hug and thank you (which DH loved - I could see *him*
light up as well as DS' major glow of glee - being able to do stuff
like this for DS, getting things he would enjoy "just because" not
for any "reason" or anything he earned, is really healing for DH).
Anyhow, long story longer, by the time we got home, we set about
getting the batteries in and reading a bit of how to operate the
electronic settings. Then it was getting late (I need to get to be
so I can be up for work in the a.m) and DH wanted to be able to
clean and rearrange the basement 'rec room' area in order to make a
proper space to hang the dartboard. So, he told DS that he would be
cleaning and organizing the area in order to hang the board in the
morning. If he wanted to, DS could help with it which would help
things get done faster so they could play sooner. I'm guessing
they're already done and playing as I type.

One recent humorous bit is that DS has taken a liking to the weed
whacker for some reason. About two weeks ago, DH asked if DS would
like to weed whack while he (DH) was cutting some branches and doing
other yard work. DS said Sure! and got dressed, got his sunglasses
as eye protection and DH showed him how to safely use the thing. He
did about an hour that day and has done about an hour or so in
smaller bits since then without us mentioning a word. Last Saturday,
after he finished breakfast he said "I want to do some weed whacking
so I'm going to go get dressed" and off he went... No expectation,
just opportunities presented.

--Deb

Deb

--- In [email protected], "agasma7" <facingeast@...>
wrote:
>
> >
> > You do things you do not choose to do? All the time?
> >
> > Why?
>
> Because they have to be done. If I don't do it, it doesn't get >done.
>
>
No they don't "have to" be done - you could choose to make a home for
fruit flies (maybe make extra income by selling them to genetics labs -
they're always experimenting on fruit flies lol). You could choose to
pay someone to come in and clean. You could choose not to buy bananas.
You could choose to not have beds with an "under" for things to get to
(DS' has a "mate's bed" which has drawers underneath so there's no way
for stuff to get "under" the bed - it's a big box with a mattress on
top). You could choose a lot of things besides cleaning under the
beds.

So when you say "Yes I do things I don't choose to do" that's not
quite accurate - you CHOOSE to do things that might not be your
favorite things to do because you dislike the consequences more than
you dislike the activity involved. You dislike fruit flies more than
you dislike cleaning under the bed - so you choose the cleaning. You
could choose the fruit flies. It's ALL choice.

Sometimes I think that in our culture, having a choice means picking
things we like when really it just means there are two or more options
to the situation - and there are very few situations that have no
options (dying is one). Even paying taxes is a choice - you can be
a "tax resister" and risk going to jail and having property seized.
You can move to someplace that has no income tax. And so on. I've even
considered on occasion moving to NH where there's no sales tax - but
(a) there's more homeschool regulation than here in CT (b) they have a
hefty 'entertainment tax' and we really like movies and dining out.
So, we CHOOSE to stay in CT because the lack of state intervention in
our unschooling lives really overrides the rest.

Choices are everywhere. And, it really changes my whole outlook when I
recognize that. I don't "have to" do the dishes ... but I like having
a clean, non-smelly, non-buggy kitchen and making it an active choice
empowers me rather than giving the dishes the power to change my
outlook. So, I choose to do the dishes, I select a dish liquid that I
like (the orange cleaners are nice - clean well and smell great). I
sometimes put on some music. More often I use it as quiet thinking
time.

--Deb

[email protected]

-----Original Message-----
From: facingeast@...

>
> You do things you do not choose to do? All the time?
>
> Why?

Because they have to be done. If I don't do it, it doesn't get done.

-=-=-=-=-

But you're CHOOSING to do it, right? Or is someone making you?

Seriously, choosing to see the things we do as choices is powerful! It
*will* change your life and the lives of those around you. I choose to
do all sorts of weird and difficult things because it makes me feel
good afterwards or I get some kind of sick thrill out of seeing the
poop scooped or the lawn mowed or the happy faces of conference
attendees! <bwg> I don't do them because I *have* to, but because I
*choose* to.

I could get a maid to come in weekly. I could eat of paper plates and
napkins. I *choose* to clean my house because then I know where things
are. I choose to wash dishes because I don't like throwing a bunch of
plastic in the landfills. I choose to wash cotton napkins rather than
condemn a tree. <g>

Changing the way I looked at these things was easier than I thought it
would be. Rather than huffing about having to fold laundry---aGAIN---I
took a deep breath and noticed how big the boys have grown. I grew
wistful thinking about the tiny little t-shirts they used to wear.
Rather than moan---aGAIN---about washing dishes when the dishwasher was
broken, I started thinking about my favorite dishes or what all we had
for supper. Rather than bitch--aGAIN---about cleaning the boys' rooms,
I think about Lisa Strebler, Joanna Wlikinson, and Diana Jenner, who
each lost a child. That really puts everything into perspective.
Quickly!

-=-=-=-=-

I quite frequently clean it for them. Sometimes what we do is trade. I
do their room (because they like that the least) and they clean
something else in the house (like the kitchen or bathroom).

-=-=-=-

I can do laundry to the last bit. I hate to put it away. I can do the
dishes to the last bit. I hate to put them away. Cameron likes to put
both away. Lucky me! <G>

One of the side benefits of seeing what we do as choices and not
chores is that our children do too. If we approach dirty or difficult
things in our lives as things we CHOOSE to do---JOYFULLY, rather than
with anger or bitterness---so will our children!

HUGE side benefit! <G>




~Kelly

Kelly Lovejoy
Conference Coordinator
Live and Learn Unschooling Conference
http://liveandlearnconference.org

School's goal is to prepare them to be anything they want. But the
process is so dullifying and kids haven't explored the possibilities of
what they could be that many set their sites as low as possible. They
go to college to get a job to buy stuff. ~Joyce Fetteroll


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