Help--I hate homeschooling!
Ren Allen
" Although some kids might think an all day video-game, cookie
eating, bath-free world would be fabulous, as a parent we know that
would lead to illness in the short term, obesity in the long term."
Well...how do you explain kids without arbitrary limits on video games
and food that aren't unhealthy at all, and are perfectly happy to do
other activities and eat overall balanced diets??
It's a myth that children will only play video games if you don't
limit them or eat only cookies if you don't force them to eat
otherwise!! Total myth.
Jalen and Sierra picked some "Yo-Go's" when grocery shopping last
night. They'd eaten most of them by the time we got home and were
groaning that they were both SICK of sugar and wanted some "real" food.
While I was fixing a proper meal, Sierra commented "It's funny 'cuz
most parents won't let their kids eat much sugar so they want it all
the time, but we want healthy food because you let us eat what we want"
Smart kid.
Her body lets her know when she's had enough sugar. They can't learn
what that feels like if someone constantly imposes their own limits on
the child.
Ren
learninginfreedom.com
eating, bath-free world would be fabulous, as a parent we know that
would lead to illness in the short term, obesity in the long term."
Well...how do you explain kids without arbitrary limits on video games
and food that aren't unhealthy at all, and are perfectly happy to do
other activities and eat overall balanced diets??
It's a myth that children will only play video games if you don't
limit them or eat only cookies if you don't force them to eat
otherwise!! Total myth.
Jalen and Sierra picked some "Yo-Go's" when grocery shopping last
night. They'd eaten most of them by the time we got home and were
groaning that they were both SICK of sugar and wanted some "real" food.
While I was fixing a proper meal, Sierra commented "It's funny 'cuz
most parents won't let their kids eat much sugar so they want it all
the time, but we want healthy food because you let us eat what we want"
Smart kid.
Her body lets her know when she's had enough sugar. They can't learn
what that feels like if someone constantly imposes their own limits on
the child.
Ren
learninginfreedom.com
julie
, "Ren Allen" <starsuncloud@...> wrote:
I totally agree that this is a myth, but sometimes I choose for my
(almost 7yr old) boy because *I* don't want to deal with a sugar-
bombed kid or a frenetic-from-video-games kid.
I still feel worried because it seems like he'll only eat a few
things or he seems picky, but I really think that his body craves
what it needs and with good food around he'll eat it. The other night
I had all these ideas of what he should eat for dinner; we were all
in the market buying stuff and I had ideas of "protein, carb and
veggies"--what're you gonna eat tonight? he chose a (yummy) 1/2 a
watermelon and ate that for dinner. the whole thing, didn't want
anything else. And what am I going to do, make him eat "protein,
carbs and veggies"? No! :)
~~Julie.
>Hi-
> It's a myth that children will only play video games if you don't
> limit them or eat only cookies if you don't force them to eat
> otherwise!! Total myth.
I totally agree that this is a myth, but sometimes I choose for my
(almost 7yr old) boy because *I* don't want to deal with a sugar-
bombed kid or a frenetic-from-video-games kid.
> Jalen and Sierra picked some "Yo-Go's" when grocery shopping lastfood.
> night. They'd eaten most of them by the time we got home and were
> groaning that they were both SICK of sugar and wanted some "real"
> While I was fixing a proper meal, Sierra commented "It's funny 'cuzwant"
> most parents won't let their kids eat much sugar so they want it all
> the time, but we want healthy food because you let us eat what we
>My son has told me the same thing.
I still feel worried because it seems like he'll only eat a few
things or he seems picky, but I really think that his body craves
what it needs and with good food around he'll eat it. The other night
I had all these ideas of what he should eat for dinner; we were all
in the market buying stuff and I had ideas of "protein, carb and
veggies"--what're you gonna eat tonight? he chose a (yummy) 1/2 a
watermelon and ate that for dinner. the whole thing, didn't want
anything else. And what am I going to do, make him eat "protein,
carbs and veggies"? No! :)
~~Julie.
> Smart kid.on
> Her body lets her know when she's had enough sugar. They can't learn
> what that feels like if someone constantly imposes their own limits
> the child.
>
> Ren
> learninginfreedom.com
>
Kathleen Gehrke
--- In [email protected], "Ren Allen"
<starsuncloud@...> wrote:
Well...how do you explain kids without arbitrary limits on video games
choose great food. They love salads, protien, they eat their vegies.
Not that they never eat candy and snacks, but done much like you
described Ren, with awaremess.
My one son who has been with us for a year had huge food limitations
in a foster home. He is like a man gone wild. We often discuss how
some foods might make him feel and what reaction his body will have to
overindulging past the point of comfort.
I am hoping he will learn to make the connections. My experience
personally and from my children is those outside limits are setting us
up to be out of control instead of helping us selfmodulate and learn
what works for each of our bodies.
Kathleen
<starsuncloud@...> wrote:
Well...how do you explain kids without arbitrary limits on video games
> and food that aren't unhealthy at all, and are perfectly happy to doI totally see that. My kids who have not had limits on their food
> other activities and eat overall balanced diets??
choose great food. They love salads, protien, they eat their vegies.
Not that they never eat candy and snacks, but done much like you
described Ren, with awaremess.
My one son who has been with us for a year had huge food limitations
in a foster home. He is like a man gone wild. We often discuss how
some foods might make him feel and what reaction his body will have to
overindulging past the point of comfort.
I am hoping he will learn to make the connections. My experience
personally and from my children is those outside limits are setting us
up to be out of control instead of helping us selfmodulate and learn
what works for each of our bodies.
Kathleen
Joanne
--- In [email protected], "Kathleen Gehrke"
<gehrkes@...> wrote:
discuss how some foods might make him feel and what reaction his
body will have to overindulging past the point of comfort.
I am hoping he will learn to make the connections. My experience
personally and from my children is those outside limits are setting
us
up to be out of control instead of helping us selfmodulate and learn
what works for each of our bodies.>>>>>>>>
Yes, I agree 100% and my children are also living proof! :-) My
three spent 4 years in foster care before coming home to us. They
all did it in their own time (my daughters quicker than my son) but
they all choose their own foods and how much they want.
Some real life examples instead of the "extreme" ones posted by
someone earlier:
1) My youngest still has some Valentine candy left, not to mention
almost all of her Easter candy. It's in a bag, in the cabinet and
she can reach it with no problem. She can eat it all in one day if
she wanted to...but she chooses not to because she knows (like I do)
that eating to much of it makes her feel sick.
2) My son (who has the hardest time listening to his body), said "no
thank you" to my mothers offer of candy in the store. He told her
that he had candy at home.
This happened slowly, not overnight. Food was the first and easiest
issue for me to loosen control because my middle daughter came to us
with an eating disorder and I was determined to help her with it.
~ Joanne ~
Mom to Jacqueline (7), Shawna (10) & Cimion (13)
Adopted into our hearts October 30, 2003
http://anunschoolinglife.blogspot.com/
http://foreverparents.com
<gehrkes@...> wrote:
>>>>My one son who has been with us for a year had huge foodlimitations in a foster home. He is like a man gone wild. We often
discuss how some foods might make him feel and what reaction his
body will have to overindulging past the point of comfort.
I am hoping he will learn to make the connections. My experience
personally and from my children is those outside limits are setting
us
up to be out of control instead of helping us selfmodulate and learn
what works for each of our bodies.>>>>>>>>
Yes, I agree 100% and my children are also living proof! :-) My
three spent 4 years in foster care before coming home to us. They
all did it in their own time (my daughters quicker than my son) but
they all choose their own foods and how much they want.
Some real life examples instead of the "extreme" ones posted by
someone earlier:
1) My youngest still has some Valentine candy left, not to mention
almost all of her Easter candy. It's in a bag, in the cabinet and
she can reach it with no problem. She can eat it all in one day if
she wanted to...but she chooses not to because she knows (like I do)
that eating to much of it makes her feel sick.
2) My son (who has the hardest time listening to his body), said "no
thank you" to my mothers offer of candy in the store. He told her
that he had candy at home.
This happened slowly, not overnight. Food was the first and easiest
issue for me to loosen control because my middle daughter came to us
with an eating disorder and I was determined to help her with it.
~ Joanne ~
Mom to Jacqueline (7), Shawna (10) & Cimion (13)
Adopted into our hearts October 30, 2003
http://anunschoolinglife.blogspot.com/
http://foreverparents.com
Kathleen Gehrke
--- In [email protected], "Joanne"
<billyandjoanne@...> wrote:
restriction will have such depravation that he will not be able to
make the connection.
Kathleen
<billyandjoanne@...> wrote:
>That is really good to know Joanne, cause I do worry if that
>
>
> This happened slowly, not overnight. Food was the first and easiest
> issue for me to loosen control because my middle daughter came to us
> with an eating disorder and I was determined to help her with it.
>
> ~
restriction will have such depravation that he will not be able to
make the connection.
Kathleen
Vijay Owens
Yesterday was my older daughter's 3rd birthday. We had all kinds of
party food that we don't normally have in the house: potato chips,
cake, brownies, etc. Not because these things aren't allowed, just
because none of us particularly likes them as everyday foods. When my
dd wants chips, I get her her own small bag of chips. When she wants
cookies I make her cookies or we buy some. But it's totally up to her
to ask for these things when the mood strikes.
Lately I've been "unfooding" myself, letting myself eat whatever I want
whenever I want to remove the power of the forbidden foods from my
childhood. I started out eating lots of cookies for breakfast with my
coffee, but the pendulum has swung back to the middle over time, and I
have been eating a healthy varied diet and very content with it.
I told myself it was a special occasion and I could eat as much of all
of these "naughty" foods as I wanted to. But it backfired because the
sweets were too sweet and the chips were too salty. So somewhere along
the line (since being denied all sugar as a child and then bingeing on
these sorts of foods as a teen) I've lost my taste for extremely fatty
and sugary foods.
My daughters, having been given free reign all their lives with food
were excited about the cake and such, but didn't actually eat any of
it. I made a delightfully disgusting concoction for the kids with
brownies oreos and gummy worms all mashed up and served with a trowel
in a flower pot. My dd took a few bites (maybe only one) and walked
away to go play. My husband and I looked at each other over the picnic
table and I asked, "Would you have ever walked away from a bowl of
something like that as a kid?" His answer, "Never in a million years."
And we've both struggled with our weight and are still figuring it out.
Food isn't just food for us, it's caught up in a complex tangle of
emotions.
We wanted something better for our daughters, and for us radical
unschooling is the answer.
That's not the whole story, but it's as much as I have time for at the
moment. I mostly lurk here, but because that just happened yesterday it
was fresh in my mind.
-Vijay
Full-time mom to Charlotte, 3 and Violet, almost 1
party food that we don't normally have in the house: potato chips,
cake, brownies, etc. Not because these things aren't allowed, just
because none of us particularly likes them as everyday foods. When my
dd wants chips, I get her her own small bag of chips. When she wants
cookies I make her cookies or we buy some. But it's totally up to her
to ask for these things when the mood strikes.
Lately I've been "unfooding" myself, letting myself eat whatever I want
whenever I want to remove the power of the forbidden foods from my
childhood. I started out eating lots of cookies for breakfast with my
coffee, but the pendulum has swung back to the middle over time, and I
have been eating a healthy varied diet and very content with it.
I told myself it was a special occasion and I could eat as much of all
of these "naughty" foods as I wanted to. But it backfired because the
sweets were too sweet and the chips were too salty. So somewhere along
the line (since being denied all sugar as a child and then bingeing on
these sorts of foods as a teen) I've lost my taste for extremely fatty
and sugary foods.
My daughters, having been given free reign all their lives with food
were excited about the cake and such, but didn't actually eat any of
it. I made a delightfully disgusting concoction for the kids with
brownies oreos and gummy worms all mashed up and served with a trowel
in a flower pot. My dd took a few bites (maybe only one) and walked
away to go play. My husband and I looked at each other over the picnic
table and I asked, "Would you have ever walked away from a bowl of
something like that as a kid?" His answer, "Never in a million years."
And we've both struggled with our weight and are still figuring it out.
Food isn't just food for us, it's caught up in a complex tangle of
emotions.
We wanted something better for our daughters, and for us radical
unschooling is the answer.
That's not the whole story, but it's as much as I have time for at the
moment. I mostly lurk here, but because that just happened yesterday it
was fresh in my mind.
-Vijay
Full-time mom to Charlotte, 3 and Violet, almost 1
On May 24, 2006, at 8:26 PM, Ren Allen wrote:
> " Although some kids might think an all day video-game, cookie
> eating, bath-free world would be fabulous, as a parent we know that
> would lead to illness in the short term, obesity in the long term."
>
> Well...how do you explain kids without arbitrary limits on video games
> and food that aren't unhealthy at all, and are perfectly happy to do
> other activities and eat overall balanced diets??
>
> It's a myth that children will only play video games if you don't
> limit them or eat only cookies if you don't force them to eat
> otherwise!! Total myth.
>
> Jalen and Sierra picked some "Yo-Go's" when grocery shopping last
> night. They'd eaten most of them by the time we got home and were
> groaning that they were both SICK of sugar and wanted some "real"
> food.
>
> While I was fixing a proper meal, Sierra commented "It's funny 'cuz
> most parents won't let their kids eat much sugar so they want it all
> the time, but we want healthy food because you let us eat what we
> want"
>
> Smart kid.
> Her body lets her know when she's had enough sugar. They can't learn
> what that feels like if someone constantly imposes their own limits on
> the child.
>
> Ren
> learninginfreedom.com
Pampered Chef Michelle
On 5/25/06, Vijay Owens <vijayowens@...> wrote:
sad, happy, glad, depressed, joyful, bored, lazy, busy, etc. There wasn't
an ocassion that we couldn't find a reason to eat. Funerals meant huge
free-for-all smorgasborgs. Yet the other message I had (that went along
side this) is that food was bad and made you fat. So I totally understand
your "complex tangle of emotions" and it is something I don't want to pass
down to my children!
--
Michelle
Independent Kitchen Consultant #413652
The Pampered Chef
850-474-0817
http://www.pamperedchef.biz/michellelr
Ask me how you can save 60% on some of our most favorite products!
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>I come from a long line of "emotional eaters." Our family ate when we were
>
> Food isn't just food for us, it's caught up in a complex tangle of
> emotions.
sad, happy, glad, depressed, joyful, bored, lazy, busy, etc. There wasn't
an ocassion that we couldn't find a reason to eat. Funerals meant huge
free-for-all smorgasborgs. Yet the other message I had (that went along
side this) is that food was bad and made you fat. So I totally understand
your "complex tangle of emotions" and it is something I don't want to pass
down to my children!
--
Michelle
Independent Kitchen Consultant #413652
The Pampered Chef
850-474-0817
http://www.pamperedchef.biz/michellelr
Ask me how you can save 60% on some of our most favorite products!
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Lesa McMahon-Lowe
>>>Food isn't just food for us, it's caught up in a complex tangle ofemotions.<<<
Man, do I know this! The thing I've begun to learn is to let myself feel
the feelings and have it be ok to feel... instead of covering up the hurt
and pain with food. Food has become way too big of an issue in my life and
I need to remove the obsession associated with it.
It's been a journey of self-discovery and learning to love self and treat
myself with care and acceptance... very much like we are doing with our
lovelies... we need to be sure to give ourselves the freedom too.
Lesa
http://lifeacademy.homeschooljournal.net
http://stoptherod.net/
http://parentinginjesusfootsteps.org/
"Conformity is the jailer of freedom and the enemy of growth."
-John F. Kennedy
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Breezy Stevens/ Lady Lasairíona of Crea
> Well...how do you explain kids without arbitrary limits on video gamesI guess all kids are different, 'cause mine aren't able to balance
> and food that aren't unhealthy at all, and are perfectly happy to do
> other activities and eat overall balanced diets??
themselves that way...
>I soooooo wanted the myth thing to be true! But, after 4 YEARS of
> It's a myth that children will only play video games if you don't
> limit them or eat only cookies if you don't force them to eat
> otherwise!! Total myth.
waiting for them to do something other than TV or video games, I no
longer believe that it's true for all kids, any more than any other
one-size-fits-all way of seeing kids. I gave up on the food thing long
ago, since my daughter was always sick, weak, tired and pale, and my son
became obese.
I have to agree with Tresa, and from experience. They weren't hatched,
because they require the assistance of their parents to grow into
healthy, happy adults.
Perhaps it's a myth FOR SOME PEOPLE, but not for us...
Breezy
Joanne
I'd love to discuss this more if you don't mind. My kids are
adapting to this freedom very well and I'm interested in why yours
didn't. You said "them" so I'm assuming you have more than one child
and I'm also very interested in finding out why all of your children
(as opposed to one of your children) couldn't find balance with all
those areas (food, video, tv) in four years.
Thanks.
~ Joanne ~
Mom to Jacqueline (7), Shawna (10) & Cimion (13)
Adopted into our hearts October 30, 2003
http://anunschoolinglife.blogspot.com/
http://foreverparents.com
--- In [email protected], Breezy Stevens/ Lady
Lasairíona of Creavanore <redgoddess@...> wrote:
adapting to this freedom very well and I'm interested in why yours
didn't. You said "them" so I'm assuming you have more than one child
and I'm also very interested in finding out why all of your children
(as opposed to one of your children) couldn't find balance with all
those areas (food, video, tv) in four years.
Thanks.
~ Joanne ~
Mom to Jacqueline (7), Shawna (10) & Cimion (13)
Adopted into our hearts October 30, 2003
http://anunschoolinglife.blogspot.com/
http://foreverparents.com
--- In [email protected], Breezy Stevens/ Lady
Lasairíona of Creavanore <redgoddess@...> wrote:
>>>I guess all kids are different, 'cause mine aren't able tobalance themselves that way...
>no
> >
> > It's a myth that children will only play video games if you don't
> > limit them or eat only cookies if you don't force them to eat
> > otherwise!! Total myth.
>
> I soooooo wanted the myth thing to be true! But, after 4 YEARS of
> waiting for them to do something other than TV or video games, I
> longer believe that it's true for all kids, any more than anyother
> one-size-fits-all way of seeing kids. I gave up on the food thinglong
> ago, since my daughter was always sick, weak, tired and pale, andmy son
> became obese.hatched,
>
> I have to agree with Tresa, and from experience. They weren't
> because they require the assistance of their parents to grow into
> healthy, happy adults.
>
> Perhaps it's a myth FOR SOME PEOPLE, but not for us...
>
> Breezy
>
[email protected]
>>I soooooo wanted the myth thing to be true! But, after 4 YEARS of waiting for them to do something other than TV or video games, I no longer believe that it's true for all kids, any more than any other one-size-fits-all way of seeing kids.>>So for 4 years your children did NOTHING but watch TV or play video games? Really? This is a pretty broad statement. They didn't ever go out to play, go over a friend's house, swim, bike, jump on the bed, read comics, go to the store, shoot water pistols...? Nothing?
Did they ever talk about what they were watching? Did you watch with them or bring home magazines about their favorite shows or actors? Did you show them websites that connected with their favorite shows or find a movie with the same actor to compare? How about a book with their favorite characters in it? Did you watch DVD's of their favorite shows with them so you could all check out the extra features?
Did you play their video games with them? Did you try getting them a subscription to electronic Gaming Monthly or another gaming magazine? How about websites with cheat codes? Do they know about those? Didn't they want to go look that stuff up? Did you help them? Have you asked them about the game characters, strategies, layouts and levels? Do you make yourself available and connected with their passions?
Are you really saying that your kids did NOTHING but watch TV and play video games for 4 years while you actively supported and joined them in a radical unschooling fashion, offering them opportunities for exploration and connections? Or are you saying they preferred to play and watch as opposed to what might have considered more educational choices?
--
~Mary
http://zenmommasgarden.blogspot.com/
"The miracle is not to walk on water. The miracle is to walk on the
green earth, dwelling deeply in the present moment and feeling truly
alive."
~Thich Nhat Hanh
-------------- Original message ----------------------
From: Breezy Stevens/ Lady Lasair�ona of Creavanore <redgoddess@...>
[email protected]
In a message dated 5/25/2006 3:07:32 PM Eastern Standard Time,
redgoddess@... writes:
Well...how do you explain kids without arbitrary limits on video games
themselves that way...
Breezy,
Have you really allowed your children total freedom in these areas for 4
years? Are you sure you haven't subliminally set limits or imposed judgment on
them for what they choose to do with their time? I am reading your words and I
hear judgment and belittling. May I suggest you make yourself a list of what
areas you are worried about, plan to "monitor" those areas, then sit back and
truly set them free for a month and rate exactly how much or little time they
spend doing things that you feel are wasting their time. Mark you calendar
today and promise not to judge, complain, raise your eyebrows, or expect
anything from them other than what they naturally choose to do for the next month.
Hit your personal rewind button if you fail to catch yourself suggesting they
do something other than what they choose. I think you will find that there is
more balance in their lives than you realize. Also, ask yourself what you are
really worried about if nothing changes on their part.
I'm learning that a lot of this unschooling thing is just about changing my
responses and myself. My kids are doing the same things they've always been
doing, playing and enjoying themselves, I'm just becoming more and more okay
with how they choose to live their lives, gradually letting more of my agenda go.
It's hard, but fantastic!
Trust your children. I think you will be surprised at how they respond.
Robin
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
redgoddess@... writes:
Well...how do you explain kids without arbitrary limits on video games
> and food that aren't unhealthy at all, and are perfectly happy to doI guess all kids are different, 'cause mine aren't able to balance
> other activities and eat overall balanced diets??
themselves that way...
Breezy,
Have you really allowed your children total freedom in these areas for 4
years? Are you sure you haven't subliminally set limits or imposed judgment on
them for what they choose to do with their time? I am reading your words and I
hear judgment and belittling. May I suggest you make yourself a list of what
areas you are worried about, plan to "monitor" those areas, then sit back and
truly set them free for a month and rate exactly how much or little time they
spend doing things that you feel are wasting their time. Mark you calendar
today and promise not to judge, complain, raise your eyebrows, or expect
anything from them other than what they naturally choose to do for the next month.
Hit your personal rewind button if you fail to catch yourself suggesting they
do something other than what they choose. I think you will find that there is
more balance in their lives than you realize. Also, ask yourself what you are
really worried about if nothing changes on their part.
I'm learning that a lot of this unschooling thing is just about changing my
responses and myself. My kids are doing the same things they've always been
doing, playing and enjoying themselves, I'm just becoming more and more okay
with how they choose to live their lives, gradually letting more of my agenda go.
It's hard, but fantastic!
Trust your children. I think you will be surprised at how they respond.
Robin
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Joyce Fetteroll
On May 25, 2006, at 3:02 PM, Breezy Stevens/ Lady Lasairíona of
Creavanore wrote:
is "assisting" them towards being what we think they should be.
So what were you doing to assist them during those 4 years?
What kinds of other opportunities did you have running through their
lives?
Did you have nutritious food that was as easy to grab as snacky food?
Did you bring food to them when they were watching TV and playing?
Did you involve them in shopping and cooking? Did you help them make
things they wanted to make?
What kinds of places did you take them to? Did you take them places
they wanted to go or places you thought would be good for them? Did
you only offer other opportunities after you were fed up with how
much TV and video gaming they were doing or did you offer because
they are fun opportunities? It's helpful to plan out things for
tomorrow or the week ahead of time so the kids know what's coming up
rather than waiting until they're involved in something to try to
pull them away.
Joyce
Creavanore wrote:
> I have to agree with Tresa, and from experience. They weren't hatched,No one would disagree with that! What unschoolers would disagree with
> because they require the assistance of their parents to grow into
> healthy, happy adults.
is "assisting" them towards being what we think they should be.
So what were you doing to assist them during those 4 years?
What kinds of other opportunities did you have running through their
lives?
Did you have nutritious food that was as easy to grab as snacky food?
Did you bring food to them when they were watching TV and playing?
Did you involve them in shopping and cooking? Did you help them make
things they wanted to make?
What kinds of places did you take them to? Did you take them places
they wanted to go or places you thought would be good for them? Did
you only offer other opportunities after you were fed up with how
much TV and video gaming they were doing or did you offer because
they are fun opportunities? It's helpful to plan out things for
tomorrow or the week ahead of time so the kids know what's coming up
rather than waiting until they're involved in something to try to
pull them away.
Joyce
Deb Lewis
***But, after 4 YEARS of waiting for them to do something other than TV
or video games, ...***
Why did you wait? What were you doing those four years?
If parents are going to unschool they need to be active. They need to
see the world as an interesting place and they need to be interested in
helping their kids enjoy that world. Some parents can't unschool but
that's not the same as unschooling not working for a child.
I think some people see only limited choices. Either I let my kids watch
TV all the time or I make them do something else. Unschooling isn't like
that. It takes more time and commitment on the parents part than
"letting" or "making." It means the world has to be made available to
kids. They have to have lots of good choices, not just mom's idea of
"educational" things to do, but interesting places to go, people to
visit, choices about what to do. They have to have at least one parent
modeling an interest in life and activity out in the big, wide world.
Deb Lewis
or video games, ...***
Why did you wait? What were you doing those four years?
If parents are going to unschool they need to be active. They need to
see the world as an interesting place and they need to be interested in
helping their kids enjoy that world. Some parents can't unschool but
that's not the same as unschooling not working for a child.
I think some people see only limited choices. Either I let my kids watch
TV all the time or I make them do something else. Unschooling isn't like
that. It takes more time and commitment on the parents part than
"letting" or "making." It means the world has to be made available to
kids. They have to have lots of good choices, not just mom's idea of
"educational" things to do, but interesting places to go, people to
visit, choices about what to do. They have to have at least one parent
modeling an interest in life and activity out in the big, wide world.
Deb Lewis
Marie Pressman
>> I think some people see only limited choices. Either I let my kids watchTV all the time or I make them do something else. Unschooling isn't like
that. It takes more time and commitment on the parents part than
"letting" or "making." It means the world has to be made available to
kids. They have to have lots of good choices, not just mom's idea of
"educational" things to do, but interesting places to go, people to
visit, choices about what to do. They have to have at least one parent
modeling an interest in life and activity out in the big, wide world.
[Marie Pressman]
This statement is huge for me because I find myself not being active and as
present as I should be. If my kids don't latch onto something I offer, I
let them go off and do their thing then I become involved in some household
task and it spirals downward from there. Often I just get exhausted by
their energy and my mind goes somewhere else. I've got to turn this around.
"Modeling an interest in life." Wow! I never thought about setting an
example that way. Thank you!!
I don't know whether it is just being lazy or just not my natural
inclination to be "interested".....or just KNOWING what it is I'm interested
in! However, what I'm interested in, might not be of interest to my kids
and vice versa. So it is it finding balance between the two that I should
strive for, or just devote my self to helping them be interested in their
interests?
Also, of all the books on unschooling that have been recommended, could you
suggest "the one" to start with.
Deb Lewis
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
freepsgal
> So it is it finding balance between the two that I shouldI personally believe in a balance. My relationship with my DH is
> strive for, or just devote my self to helping them be interested
> in their interests?
the same. There are things we like to do together, but we each have
our own interests as well. That's only natural. I've also found
that my interests sometimes sparks something within my children, and
vice versa. I'm living my life WITH my children so they see me
doing things I enjoy. But in order to be active in their lives I
sometimes have to put something I want to do on hold to do something
with them. They actually do the same thing for me. For example,
sometimes they see me playing Nintendo and they choose to stop what
they're doing to watch and help me.
> Also, of all the books on unschooling that have been recommended,This may vary as we probably all have our favorite books, but I'd
> could you suggest "the one" to start with.
recommend starting with Rue Kream's Parenting a Free Child: An
Unschooled Life. The first time I read it, I agreed with some of
the stuff but sort of skimmed over other stuff. As soon as I
finished the book though, I went right back to the beginning and
started it again, taking time to read it cover to cover and
discussing many of the comments with my DH. We both learned so
much!! My other long-time favorite is Alison McKee's Homeschooling
Our Children Unschooling Ourselves.
The reason I like both of those books is because they really come at
it from the parents questioning. Too many people think that
unschooling has to do with just not using formal curriculum with
children, but I've been learning that there's so much more to
unschooling. It affects every aspect of our life, especially the
way we parent our children. I've become a much more patient mother,
and usually the one with a calm reasoning attitude in nearly
everything we do. That's so out of character for me, but that's how
much unschooling has affected my life. I like to think that my
children are happier and better off because I'm focusing on
unschooling my DH and myself. I don't need to un-school the kids,
but us, and the rest just seems to fall into place!
Beth M.
Deb Lewis
***I don't know whether it is just being lazy or just not my natural
inclination to be "interested".....or just KNOWING what it is I'm
interested
in! ***
Maybe it is your nature to appreciate a quiet life of contemplation.
That's cool.
Maybe, like most of us, you grew up with rules of "finishing what you
start" so that it became easier not to start something than to maybe get
stuck in some activity that turned out to be a joyless, soul-sucking
bummer.
***However, what I'm interested in, might not be of interest to my kids
and vice versa. So it is it finding balance between the two that I
should
strive for, or just devote my self to helping them be interested in their
interests?***
Yes, devote yourself to helping them do the things that interest them.
Our kids will only be with us a short time. We don't have all the time
in the world to become interested parents. If we wait a year to be
involved with our twelve year old we'll have missed it. He won't be
twelve next year and we'll never get that chance again. If we put our
interests ahead of our kids we'll run out of time with our kids.
But that doesn't mean never pursuing our own interests. It doesn't have
to be one or the other. It just means while we're parents of kids at
home they should be our focus because the other things we want to do can
be done lightly, without total immersion, without irretrievable loss or
can wait. Our kids can't.
So yes, unschooling parents do have to show an interest in their kids.
Even if what the kids are doing doesn't particularly interest us, it's
vital to be interested in their joy! We really should be devoted to
that! But part of how our kids will find and live their own interests
comes from our example. So when we find something interesting, we can
share that with them. When we have a passion we can pursue it. If you
love Tibet then by all means read about it and watch movies and buy
Tibetan wool and make traditional Tibetan rugs and whatever blows your
skirt up, but save the year long isolation in the Tibetan monastery until
your kids are happily occupied in their adult lives. <g>
So it won't look like balance; like your kids on one side with their
passions and interests and you other side with your passions and
interests. It will look more like unschooling, with all of you on the
same side standing in the big wide world and you holding the keys to the
car. <g>
***Also, of all the books on unschooling that have been recommended,
could you
suggest "the one" to start with.***
I really like Rue's book, "Parenting a Free Child: An Unschooled Life,"
available here: www.freechild.info
Deb Lewis
inclination to be "interested".....or just KNOWING what it is I'm
interested
in! ***
Maybe it is your nature to appreciate a quiet life of contemplation.
That's cool.
Maybe, like most of us, you grew up with rules of "finishing what you
start" so that it became easier not to start something than to maybe get
stuck in some activity that turned out to be a joyless, soul-sucking
bummer.
***However, what I'm interested in, might not be of interest to my kids
and vice versa. So it is it finding balance between the two that I
should
strive for, or just devote my self to helping them be interested in their
interests?***
Yes, devote yourself to helping them do the things that interest them.
Our kids will only be with us a short time. We don't have all the time
in the world to become interested parents. If we wait a year to be
involved with our twelve year old we'll have missed it. He won't be
twelve next year and we'll never get that chance again. If we put our
interests ahead of our kids we'll run out of time with our kids.
But that doesn't mean never pursuing our own interests. It doesn't have
to be one or the other. It just means while we're parents of kids at
home they should be our focus because the other things we want to do can
be done lightly, without total immersion, without irretrievable loss or
can wait. Our kids can't.
So yes, unschooling parents do have to show an interest in their kids.
Even if what the kids are doing doesn't particularly interest us, it's
vital to be interested in their joy! We really should be devoted to
that! But part of how our kids will find and live their own interests
comes from our example. So when we find something interesting, we can
share that with them. When we have a passion we can pursue it. If you
love Tibet then by all means read about it and watch movies and buy
Tibetan wool and make traditional Tibetan rugs and whatever blows your
skirt up, but save the year long isolation in the Tibetan monastery until
your kids are happily occupied in their adult lives. <g>
So it won't look like balance; like your kids on one side with their
passions and interests and you other side with your passions and
interests. It will look more like unschooling, with all of you on the
same side standing in the big wide world and you holding the keys to the
car. <g>
***Also, of all the books on unschooling that have been recommended,
could you
suggest "the one" to start with.***
I really like Rue's book, "Parenting a Free Child: An Unschooled Life,"
available here: www.freechild.info
Deb Lewis
Tina
<Her body lets her know when she's had enough sugar. They can't learn
what that feels like if someone constantly imposes their own limits on
the child.>
I SO wish we could get to this point in our family! My dh has some
REAL hang ups about food. He even tried to impose them on me...the
nerve! :-) I've tried to educate him on this way of thinking, but
I'm really not all that educated and secure in it myself. Any
recommended reading?
Thanks - Tina
what that feels like if someone constantly imposes their own limits on
the child.>
I SO wish we could get to this point in our family! My dh has some
REAL hang ups about food. He even tried to impose them on me...the
nerve! :-) I've tried to educate him on this way of thinking, but
I'm really not all that educated and secure in it myself. Any
recommended reading?
Thanks - Tina
[email protected]
-----Original Message-----
From: Breezy Stevens/ Lady Lasairíona of Creav anore
<redgoddess@...>
waiting for them to do something other than TV or video games, I no
longer believe that it's true for all kids, any more than any other
one-size-fits-all way of seeing kids.
-=-=-=-=-
If you were waiting for them to do something else, they probably *felt*
that. So they were trying to get it all in until you decided to change
you mind and start limiting.
It has everything to do with *our* mindset. If we are simply biding our
time until they "come over to our side"---that's not the same thing as
seeing the true value in what they're doing. If you were *waiting*
instead of enjoying, then you were the problem, not them.
-=-=-=-
I gave up on the food thing long
ago, since my daughter was always sick, weak, tired and pale, and my
son
became obese.
-=-=-=-
This blows my mind. A parent watches her child become sick, weak,
tired, and pale? Obese?
What were you feeding them?
-=-=-=-
I have to agree with Tresa, and from experience. They weren't hatched,
because they require the assistance of their parents to grow into
healthy, happy adults.
-=-=-=-
I believe they do too. But parent who will neglect her children to the
point you described above isn't unschooling. That's neglect.
-=-=-=-
Perhaps it's a myth FOR SOME PEOPLE, but not for us...
-=-=-=-
Then maybe this isn't the path for you. You wouldn't be the first
parent who can't/won't get it. Nor will you be the last. So, why are
you here?
~Kelly
Kelly Lovejoy
Conference Coordinator
Live and Learn Unschooling Conference
http://liveandlearnconference.org
"The hardest problem for the brain is not learning, but forgetting. No
matter how hard we try, we can't deliberately forget something we have
learned, and that is catastrophic if we learn that we can't learn."
~Frank Smith
From: Breezy Stevens/ Lady Lasairíona of Creav anore
<redgoddess@...>
> It's a myth that children will only play video games if you don'tI soooooo wanted the myth thing to be true! But, after 4 YEARS of
> limit them or eat only cookies if you don't force them to eat
> otherwise!! Total myth.
waiting for them to do something other than TV or video games, I no
longer believe that it's true for all kids, any more than any other
one-size-fits-all way of seeing kids.
-=-=-=-=-
If you were waiting for them to do something else, they probably *felt*
that. So they were trying to get it all in until you decided to change
you mind and start limiting.
It has everything to do with *our* mindset. If we are simply biding our
time until they "come over to our side"---that's not the same thing as
seeing the true value in what they're doing. If you were *waiting*
instead of enjoying, then you were the problem, not them.
-=-=-=-
I gave up on the food thing long
ago, since my daughter was always sick, weak, tired and pale, and my
son
became obese.
-=-=-=-
This blows my mind. A parent watches her child become sick, weak,
tired, and pale? Obese?
What were you feeding them?
-=-=-=-
I have to agree with Tresa, and from experience. They weren't hatched,
because they require the assistance of their parents to grow into
healthy, happy adults.
-=-=-=-
I believe they do too. But parent who will neglect her children to the
point you described above isn't unschooling. That's neglect.
-=-=-=-
Perhaps it's a myth FOR SOME PEOPLE, but not for us...
-=-=-=-
Then maybe this isn't the path for you. You wouldn't be the first
parent who can't/won't get it. Nor will you be the last. So, why are
you here?
~Kelly
Kelly Lovejoy
Conference Coordinator
Live and Learn Unschooling Conference
http://liveandlearnconference.org
"The hardest problem for the brain is not learning, but forgetting. No
matter how hard we try, we can't deliberately forget something we have
learned, and that is catastrophic if we learn that we can't learn."
~Frank Smith
[email protected]
-----Original Message-----
From: Marie Pressman <pressmanm@...>
I don't know whether it is just being lazy or just not my natural
inclination to be "interested".....or just KNOWING what it is I'm
interested
in! However, what I'm interested in, might not be of interest to my
kids
and vice versa. So it is it finding balance between the two that I
should
strive for, or just devote my self to helping them be interested in
their
interests?
=-=-=-
It doesn't have to be interesting to them. Just make sure th ey see you
fascinated by something. Model, model, model.
What they're interested in doesn't have to be interesting to you. Just
be supportive of what they *are* interested in. Don't withhold $$ for
something because it's not *your* passion. Indulge their passions.
--=-=-=-
Also, of all the books on unschooling that have been recommended, could
you
suggest "the one" to start with.
-=-=-
Easy. Rue Kreams' Parenting a Free Child; A Unschooled Life Priceless!
~Kelly
Kelly Lovejoy
Conference Coordinator
Live and Learn Unschooling Conference
http://liveandlearnconference.org
"The hardest problem for the brain is not learning, but forgetting. No
matter how hard we try, we can't deliberately forget something we have
learned, and that is catastrophic if we learn that we can't learn."
~Frank Smith
From: Marie Pressman <pressmanm@...>
I don't know whether it is just being lazy or just not my natural
inclination to be "interested".....or just KNOWING what it is I'm
interested
in! However, what I'm interested in, might not be of interest to my
kids
and vice versa. So it is it finding balance between the two that I
should
strive for, or just devote my self to helping them be interested in
their
interests?
=-=-=-
It doesn't have to be interesting to them. Just make sure th ey see you
fascinated by something. Model, model, model.
What they're interested in doesn't have to be interesting to you. Just
be supportive of what they *are* interested in. Don't withhold $$ for
something because it's not *your* passion. Indulge their passions.
--=-=-=-
Also, of all the books on unschooling that have been recommended, could
you
suggest "the one" to start with.
-=-=-
Easy. Rue Kreams' Parenting a Free Child; A Unschooled Life Priceless!
~Kelly
Kelly Lovejoy
Conference Coordinator
Live and Learn Unschooling Conference
http://liveandlearnconference.org
"The hardest problem for the brain is not learning, but forgetting. No
matter how hard we try, we can't deliberately forget something we have
learned, and that is catastrophic if we learn that we can't learn."
~Frank Smith
Michelle/Melbrigða
On 6/1/06, kbcdlovejo@... <kbcdlovejo@...> wrote:
passions that my children tend to delve into their own passions as well. I
can be sitting quietly knitting and look up to see one of them working on a
puzzle or constructing something with legos or mastering a new DDR
routine/dance/whatever you call it. Recently I was busy making some cards
for my stamping class I go to and one of the kids said, "Want to do
something with paper, too." I told them that there was tons of paper on the
art shelves and in the paper box. Next thing I know I had paper cranes
flying from the kitchen door frame!
I hope everyone has an art shelf in their homes. We love our art shelf.
It's filled with paper, crayons, pens, markers, glue, stickers, paints,
brushes, clay, books modelling stuff, whatever we find to add to it. It's
free and open to be played with at any time. I've asked the kids just to
try to keep the area that they create in tidy and have made no limitations
on their creativity other than that. We have had an art gallery down the
hall and designer love letters (as well as the aforementioned paper crane
display). One morning I got up and Keon was painting paper plates. He'd
carefully laid out newspaper from the recycling bin on the table and was
happily creating - before breakfast.
I'm about to put up butcher paper down the hallway. We have two very long
hallways and I've thought about putting up long stretches of multiple panels
of white butcher paper down both the common hallway and down the "girl's
dormitory" hallway. Set a bunch of markers or crayons in a box and see what
happens.
--
Michelle
aka Melbrigða
http://eventualknitting.blogspot.com
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>Oh Kelly, this is so TRUE! I find on days that I am deep into my own
>
>
> It doesn't have to be interesting to them. Just make sure th ey see you
> fascinated by something. Model, model, model.
>
> What they're interested in doesn't have to be interesting to you. Just
> be supportive of what they *are* interested in. Don't withhold $$ for
> something because it's not *your* passion. Indulge their passions.
passions that my children tend to delve into their own passions as well. I
can be sitting quietly knitting and look up to see one of them working on a
puzzle or constructing something with legos or mastering a new DDR
routine/dance/whatever you call it. Recently I was busy making some cards
for my stamping class I go to and one of the kids said, "Want to do
something with paper, too." I told them that there was tons of paper on the
art shelves and in the paper box. Next thing I know I had paper cranes
flying from the kitchen door frame!
I hope everyone has an art shelf in their homes. We love our art shelf.
It's filled with paper, crayons, pens, markers, glue, stickers, paints,
brushes, clay, books modelling stuff, whatever we find to add to it. It's
free and open to be played with at any time. I've asked the kids just to
try to keep the area that they create in tidy and have made no limitations
on their creativity other than that. We have had an art gallery down the
hall and designer love letters (as well as the aforementioned paper crane
display). One morning I got up and Keon was painting paper plates. He'd
carefully laid out newspaper from the recycling bin on the table and was
happily creating - before breakfast.
I'm about to put up butcher paper down the hallway. We have two very long
hallways and I've thought about putting up long stretches of multiple panels
of white butcher paper down both the common hallway and down the "girl's
dormitory" hallway. Set a bunch of markers or crayons in a box and see what
happens.
--
Michelle
aka Melbrigða
http://eventualknitting.blogspot.com
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Tina
<Easy. Rue Kreams' Parenting a Free Child; A Unschooled Life
Priceless!>
I second that recommendation. I just LOVED this book. I almost felt
like a fly on the wall watching an unschooling life unfold. Very easy
read, and VERY enjoyable!
Tina
Priceless!>
I second that recommendation. I just LOVED this book. I almost felt
like a fly on the wall watching an unschooling life unfold. Very easy
read, and VERY enjoyable!
Tina
Ren Allen
'But, after 4 YEARS of
waiting for them to do something other than TV or video games, I no
longer believe that it's true for all kids, any more than any other
one-size-fits-all way of seeing kids."
I meant to respond to this a long time ago, but got busy with other stuff.
A parent that stands by, watching their child do something they
believe is detrimental for FOUR years is NOT being a mindful parent!!
Yikes.
Why would you WAIT for your child to do something else?
If you have several children that do NOTHING but tv and video games
for FOUR years, you are NOT offering them anything more interesting.
I don't believe it anyway.
I don't believe there could possibly be a whole entire family of kids
that did nothing else for four entire years!! Puhleez for sure.
Ren
learninginfreedom.com
waiting for them to do something other than TV or video games, I no
longer believe that it's true for all kids, any more than any other
one-size-fits-all way of seeing kids."
I meant to respond to this a long time ago, but got busy with other stuff.
A parent that stands by, watching their child do something they
believe is detrimental for FOUR years is NOT being a mindful parent!!
Yikes.
Why would you WAIT for your child to do something else?
If you have several children that do NOTHING but tv and video games
for FOUR years, you are NOT offering them anything more interesting.
I don't believe it anyway.
I don't believe there could possibly be a whole entire family of kids
that did nothing else for four entire years!! Puhleez for sure.
Ren
learninginfreedom.com
[email protected]
>>I hope everyone has an art shelf in their homes. >>Ours has evolved into an art room!
--
~Mary
http://zenmommasgarden.blogspot.com/
"The miracle is not to walk on water. The miracle is to walk on the
green earth, dwelling deeply in the present moment and feeling truly
alive."
~Thich Nhat Hanh
-------------- Original message ----------------------
From: "Michelle/Melbrig�a" <pamperedmichelle@...>