melissazietlow

Hello again,

As I seriously reconsider the unschooling lifestyle/mindset, I have
been trying to let go of my hang-ups on regulating food. This is a
topic I have seen much discussion about, but was not really ready for
until now. It came up after one of my recent posts to the discipline
board, but I thought it might be more appropriate to pursue the
conversation here.

I have been very confused and hung up on making healthy diet choices
for my children since birth. I have always thought it was my duty as
a parent to see that they eat right, and have limited sweets, etc. I
have been very skeptical as to how kids can learn right choices about
food at young ages, if they are allowed to eat what they choose. I
always thought kids will of COURSE choose what tastes good, and of
COURSE sweets and junk food taste better than most other things!
After all, when they are very young, they cannot understand what
healthy means. To me, this has been logical thinking.

As I posted on another list: My hang-up is that my older dd is very
picky, and I worry she will not get enough healthy food in without
intervention. If we allow her to snack/drink before a meal, she will
not eat the meal, etc. When she stays at my mother's, she is allowed
anything she pleases (unlimited sweets), and therefore rarely eats
healthy food over there. I notice she whines and begs over food
there, and then she comes home and throws up or keeps me up all
night. It really irks me. I keep coming back to the thinking that she
is not mature enough to self-regulate in this area.

I got several responses from another list that have made me re-think,
and over the last several days, I have allowed Orion more freedom in
choosing what she eats when. Unfortunately (or fortunately?) this
was a holiday weekend and everywhere we went, there were sweets and
junk food. She has gorged herself full of both and eaten very little
healthier food. I inwardly almost had a heart attack over what she
consumed at these family gatherings. Surprisingly, she did not get
sick this time, but I almost did!

I have been trying to communicate my feelings and opinions about her
food choices instead of controlling, to which she has listened but
still chose to eat chips over pasta salad, etc. I have been told
that a child will binge when first tasting (ha) freedom, but then
what can I expect? It is not easy to sit back and wait to see. I
feel such a sense of parental responsibility for her health!

Thanks,
Melissa Z.

Alyce

--- In [email protected], "melissazietlow"
<Zietlowfamily@w...> wrote:

I have been told
> that a child will binge when first tasting (ha) freedom, but then
> what can I expect? It is not easy to sit back and wait to see. I
> feel such a sense of parental responsibility for her health!
>
> Thanks,
> Melissa Z.

I believe that is so. Once the novelty wears off, it should settle
down. Plus, don't forget to have plenty of good stuff around the
house - fruit, melon, string cheese, etc... as well as some sweets.
How about making some chocolate covered bananas or caramel apples?
It's fun to do, tastes good, and you get sweets and fruit all at
once. :)

I was more "controlling" about it with my girls - especially the
oldest who is 20 now. By the time my son came along (now 8), I was
pretty lax. (We've even had "dessert" before dinner, or instead of -
one of my faves was the occasional hot fudge sundae for lunch. Why
not? If you want a hot fudge sundae, what is the sense in filling
up on food that is "good" for you first - then you're full and the
sundae isn't nearly so enjoyable.) He's actually the best eater of
the three of them as far as choosing "good" foods.

And here's a fine example of the result. The other day, we went to
a restaurant. He ordered not from the children's menu, but from the
adult side dishes - he usually orders from the adult menu as he
likes the variety. Anyway, he ordered 3 slices of bacon, cottage
cheese, and a half a cantalope. That may not be overall the
healthiest combo on the planet, but it's better than deep fried
chicken chunks and french fries (the only thing ever on a kids
meal!)... The waitress asked how we got him to eat "healthy". He
said, "I just do it myself" He eats candy too sometimes, don't get
me wrong. But candy and cheese and fruit and yogurt and cucumber
slices are all equal choices in his mind... it just depends on his
mood at the moment.

And funny, none of my three kids likes cake - we stick candles in
other things for birthdays - pudding, pizza, shrimp scampi -
whatever they are into that birthday.

I had a friend ask what kind of cake my son had for his recent
birthday. When we told him that Jay didn't want a cake - that none
of the kids even liked cake, the friend said... those kids aren't
right. lol. He says that a lot - but lovingly. They're
not "normal"... the way they eat, the way they think, the interests
they pursue, the way they are - and all these things I think is what
makes them so awesome. They are definitely themselves - enough so
that the world seems to take notice sometimes. Most of all, they're
happy.

~Alyce

Debbie Gillett



I have been very confused and hung up on making healthy diet choices
for my children since birth.  I have always thought it was my duty as
a parent to see that they eat right, and have limited sweets, etc.  I
have been very skeptical as to how kids can learn right choices about
food at young ages, if they are allowed to eat what they choose.  I
always thought kids will of COURSE choose what tastes good, and of
COURSE sweets and junk food taste better than most other things! 
After all, when they are very young, they cannot understand what
healthy means. To me, this has been logical thinking.

Jon and Rue Kream

>>I have always thought it was my duty as
a parent to see that they eat right
 
**I see my duty as providing a variety of foods to choose from so that Dagny and Rowan can listen to what their bodies tell them and easily access whatever they feel they need.
 
>>My hang-up is that my older dd is very
picky,
 
**Children's taste buds are so much more sensitive than adults'.  Still, in my experience, children who are free to choose their food will eat a wide enough variety to keep them healthy.
 
>>When she stays at my mother's, she is allowed
anything she pleases (unlimited sweets), and therefore rarely eats
healthy food over there.
 
**But if being able to make her own choices was not a special treat she wouldn't feel a need to binge when the opportunity presents itself. 
 
>>I have been trying to communicate my feelings and opinions about her
food choices instead of controlling,
 
**I would be careful about doing this.  If she is still getting the message that you do not think she will make good choices what she chooses could be in reaction to that rather than based on what she might actually want.
 
>>I feel such a sense of parental responsibility for her health!
**Would she be willing to take a vitamin each day?  Would that make you feel more comfortable about the choices she makes as you transition? 
 
Glad to see you here :0).  ~Rue
 
 

Betjeman and Barton Tea Merchants

I was exposed to the whole let them choose their own food idea a few years ago via the unschooling.com list.
 
It just made sense and that's what we do
 
DD does like sweets but she'll stop eating them when she's ready to.  We got her ice cream at McDonalds the other day - she ate 2 bites of it and was done.
 
Tonight we went out to Outback Steak House for dinner (early Father's Day to beat the rush)
 
She ate: a few blooming onion - onions (dipped in the ever popular ketchup)
 
- cucumbers, tomatos, a bit of an onion, some lettuce (all from dh's salad)
 
- some bread (no butter - her preference)
 
- some of my chicken
 
- ALL (except the yellow squash) of my side of veggies which included broccoli, carrots and snow peas.
 
She's a little veggie nut at times.  Her drink of choice is OJ followed by Milk. 
 
I really believe just letting them choose works.  We don't go nuts buying candy because quite frankly we're not made of $$ but we don't deny her sweets when they are around or limit the amounts she can eat.  She stops quite happily on her own
 
Karen in Groton, CT

[email protected]

In a message dated 5/31/2004 5:43:28 PM US Eastern Standard Time, skreams@... writes:



>>I feel such a sense of parental responsibility for her health!

heres a interesting example,,,,my first two kids,,,were very much my guinea pigs,,,(sorry guys!)but i had soo much input as to what they ate or didnt from mom-in-law,,,they were too thin,,she felt they didnt eat anything but ''junk food'''.but i drove them and me nutz,,,made my oldest eat what he truly didnt want,,,and pbviously what he didnt need,,cause he would through up at her house when she'd insist he eat,,,,what ever,it was ,,,now,,,as 19,,and 18 yr.olds .not only dealing with weight issues...they are haveing to relearn what their bodies need and not....my 11 yr.old daughter eats what she wants,,,,literally,,and she
has no problem,,,,i have alot of respect for mom-in-law,,,but she isnt living our lives...

Kym Dean

Hi, all.  I talked with Caelan (shaylin) about the possibility of homeschool next year.  At first her biggest concerns were:  "Do I have to raise my hand?", "Can I just get up if I have to go to the bathroom?", "Do I have to stand when I read something to you?", and "Do we get recess?"  LOL  Of course, I said yes to the first 3 and no to the 4th.  :P  Just kidding!  I was dying!  After she started to "get it," we talked about the possibilities.  She loved the fact that she would be called names, hit, pinched, pushed, or made fun of.  How sad is that???  The other thing she liked was that there were no pop quizzes!  LOL  Other than that, she liked that she would be with me (hey, I got to take it while I still can!  LOL), and that we could learn whatever she wanted, whenver she wanted to learn it instead of waiting for the teacher to get to that topic.  After talking about it a bit, we decided we would do a little bit this summer to get used to the idea (not much, but a little), and then she just started going on about everything she wanted to learn!  It was great!  It was funny, because she started trying to come up with ideas for field trips, and her ideas were to go to the store to buy something and to go to a family members event (like a school play).  Ok, so she doesn't totally get it.....I told her those are things we do normally and wouldn't really qualify as field trips, but would qualify as learning!  :)  So, on to my question......
 
The first thing Cae wants to learn after school gets out is how to make a teepee and everything about them!  How cool!  So, I need some good resources about where I can find a how-to on these if someone has it.  I'm thinking we will make one big enough for the backyard, but thought we could make one for her dolls if that is too much of a chore.  The next thing is that she wants to learn about "Abraham Lincoln or whoever it was that invented electricity."  Ok, what the heck have they been teaching this kid???  LOL  So, Thomas Edison and electricity will be next.....any ideas on cool projects for that??  I figure that will be good for the summer since she will be doing a lot of camping with my mom.  She won't be home too much, so can't give us too much work on our summer break!  :)
 
Next, I just wanted to share a little "unschool" idea/game with y'all.  You might already be doing this, but Cae loves this game, so I thought I would pass it on....it dawned on me what a good learning tool it is, so instead of telling her know, I gladly played along with her.  ANyway, we play this in the car on trips to see our family (2-3 hour drives), but it could be played anywhere.  We call it the ABC game.  You take turns (1 starts with A, then the next B, etc).  You get 3 guesses to figure out the word they are thinking of.  After the 2nd guess you can ask for a hint.  Rarely do we get it right, and sometimes we bend the rules a little (like she gets a 2nd clue out of me, or gets one after the 1st guess), but she has a ball and the words she comes up with are phenomenal!  I didn't even know she knew some of these!  Most of her guesses are 7 or more letters!  It's a great vocabulary builder.  SOmetimes our clues are things like....it ends with a t, or it has an r in the middle.  Very fun for the kids, because she thinks it's a game, and not learning!
 
ANyway, this is long enough!

Kym Dean

I wish my daughter could just stop eating the sweets after just a few bites like someone elses does.....she would eat sweets non-stop.  DOn't get me wrong, she LOVES veggies and fruits and eats almost anything except mushrooms, but if she was given a choice, she would choose the sweets anytime!  I know because I almost always let her choose her snack.  However, if she has already had too many sweets for the day, I then step in and give her different choices (still a choice, but just not the one she chose).  I will admit there are also times I "dictate" what she can have.  Just depends, but mostly it's her choice.  Unfortunately, she doesn't choose enough of the good stuff.  She'll eat whatever I put in front of her for dinner, but would otherwise eat candy/junk food all day long, constantly (she eats WAY more than I do!), if I let her.  I'm hoping we can work on that when we start homeschooling....do more with nutrition so maybe she'll start making better choices.  She's gained almost 20 lbs in the last 18 months, so if we don't do something she will be big as a house, soon (she doesn't necessarily "look" fat now--except her belly!  :)  ).  We're trying to get more excercise in, too.  I think I might try some yoga with her, too.  I always wanted to try it.
 
Kym
-----Original Message-----
From: Jon and Rue Kream [mailto:skreams@...]
Sent: Monday, May 31, 2004 6:40 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: RE: [unschoolingbasics] FOOD for Thought

>>I have always thought it was my duty as
a parent to see that they eat right
 
**I see my duty as providing a variety of foods to choose from so that Dagny and Rowan can listen to what their bodies tell them and easily access whatever they feel they need.
 
>>My hang-up is that my older dd is very
picky,
 
**Children's taste buds are so much more sensitive than adults'.  Still, in my experience, children who are free to choose their food will eat a wide enough variety to keep them healthy.
 
>>When she stays at my mother's, she is allowed
anything she pleases (unlimited sweets), and therefore rarely eats
healthy food over there.
 
**But if being able to make her own choices was not a special treat she wouldn't feel a need to binge when the opportunity presents itself. 
 
>>I have been trying to communicate my feelings and opinions about her
food choices instead of controlling,
 
**I would be careful about doing this.  If she is still getting the message that you do not think she will make good choices what she chooses could be in reaction to that rather than based on what she might actually want.
 
>>I feel such a sense of parental responsibility for her health!
**Would she be willing to take a vitamin each day?  Would that make you feel more comfortable about the choices she makes as you transition? 
 
Glad to see you here :0).  ~Rue
 
 

Kym Dean

 
 
Hi, all.  I talked with Caelan (shaylin) about the possibility of homeschool next year.  At first her biggest concerns were:  "Do I have to raise my hand?", "Can I just get up if I have to go to the bathroom?", "Do I have to stand when I read something to you?", and "Do we get recess?"  LOL  Of course, I said yes to the first 3 and no to the 4th.  :P  Just kidding!  I was dying!  After she started to "get it," we talked about the possibilities.  She loved the fact that she would be called names, hit, pinched, pushed, or made fun of.  How sad is that???  The other thing she liked was that there were no pop quizzes!  LOL  Other than that, she liked that she would be with me (hey, I got to take it while I still can!  LOL), and that we could learn whatever she wanted, whenver she wanted to learn it instead of waiting for the teacher to get to that topic.  After talking about it a bit, we decided we would do a little bit this summer to get used to the idea (not much, but a little), and then she just started going on about everything she wanted to learn!  It was great!  It was funny, because she started trying to come up with ideas for field trips, and her ideas were to go to the store to buy something and to go to a family members event (like a school play).  Ok, so she doesn't totally get it.....I told her those are things we do normally and wouldn't really qualify as field trips, but would qualify as learning!  :)  So, on to my question......
 
The first thing Cae wants to learn after school gets out is how to make a teepee and everything about them!  How cool!  So, I need some good resources about where I can find a how-to on these if someone has it.  I'm thinking we will make one big enough for the backyard, but thought we could make one for her dolls if that is too much of a chore.  The next thing is that she wants to learn about "Abraham Lincoln or whoever it was that invented electricity."  Ok, what the heck have they been teaching this kid???  LOL  So, Thomas Edison and electricity will be next.....any ideas on cool projects for that??  I figure that will be good for the summer since she will be doing a lot of camping with my mom.  She won't be home too much, so can't give us too much work on our summer break!  :)
 
Next, I just wanted to share a little "unschool" idea/game with y'all.  You might already be doing this, but Cae loves this game, so I thought I would pass it on....it dawned on me what a good learning tool it is, so instead of telling her know, I gladly played along with her.  ANyway, we play this in the car on trips to see our family (2-3 hour drives), but it could be played anywhere.  We call it the ABC game.  You take turns (1 starts with A, then the next B, etc).  You get 3 guesses to figure out the word they are thinking of.  After the 2nd guess you can ask for a hint.  Rarely do we get it right, and sometimes we bend the rules a little (like she gets a 2nd clue out of me, or gets one after the 1st guess), but she has a ball and the words she comes up with are phenomenal!  I didn't even know she knew some of these!  Most of her guesses are 7 or more letters!  It's a great vocabulary builder.  SOmetimes our clues are things like....it ends with a t, or it has an r in the middle.  Very fun for the kids, because she thinks it's a game, and not learning!
 
ANyway, this is long enough!

melissazietlow

>>When she stays at my mother's, she is allowed anything she pleases
(unlimited sweets), and therefore rarely eats healthy food over
there.<<

**But if being able to make her own choices was not a special treat
she wouldn't feel a need to binge when the opportunity presents
itself.**

Today we were at my parents' and no sooner had we arrived than a box
of chocolate covered graham crackers was discovered. The kids and I
each had a few (more than I usually allow for a snack), then left the
garage where they were found. As we walked away, Orion said she
wanted more cookies. I said we left them in the garage. She said
she wanted to go back to the garage to see grandpa. I said, 'I think
you want to go back to the garage to eat more cookies. I would
rather you did not do that because I am about to make dinner and I
think you may be too full to eat the good food I make if you eat
more'. She said 'no I won't' and I let her go to the garage. She
and sister had several more there, then brought the box back to the
patio with them. They took turns playing and coming back for more
cookies -- Orion eyeballing me all the time, younger dd asking me for
more. I allowed it without making a big deal, except to ask Orion if
she thought eating 10, 11, 12 (TWELVE!!) cookies before dinner was a
good idea. She said she would eat dinner, which she of course did
not. I tried so hard not to show my complete frustration, and even
allowed a popsicle (!!) before we left, because they beg for one
when ever we leave there.

>>I have been trying to communicate my feelings and opinions about her
about her food choices instead of controlling,<<

**I would be careful about doing this. If she is still getting the
message that you do not think she will make good choices what she
chooses could be in reaction to that rather than based on what she
might actually want.**

I am failing this one in a huge way. On the way home we stopped at
my grandmother's (next door) and she promptly started whining for a
cookie. At this point I was losing my patience and focus, and said
no, because she had so many cookies and a popsicle already, and did
not eat her dinner. I told her that I would really like to let her
make her own choices about what she eats, but I would like to see her
make some healthy choices, so that I know her body will grow
healthy. Then I talked a little about sweets and snack foods, and
the fact that they do not give us energy that lasts, and that is why
she was still hungry.

As we pulled in the driveway, she said, 'Mom, I want a healthy snack
before bed -- PBJ sandwhich'. So she had 1 and 1/2 (ALOT for her).
We also negotiated milk instead of a can of grape pop (which she
brought home from family function and is not normally allowed to have
at all).

So goes our first week of new mindset. Ugh. I am so conflicted, and
hope I am not damaging them in this process!

Melissa Z.

Kym Dean

I don't think you are failing.....if you notice, after you explained it to her rationally, she did make her own decision, and a much healthier one.  Sometimes kids will do things we want them to, if only they know why we want them to do it!  I find that with my daughter all the time!
 
Kym
-----Original Message-----
From: melissazietlow [mailto:Zietlowfamily@...]
Sent: Monday, May 31, 2004 10:59 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: [unschoolingbasics] Re: FOOD for Thought


I am failing this one in a huge way.  On the way home we stopped at
my grandmother's (next door) and she promptly started whining for a
cookie.  At this point I was losing my patience and focus, and said
no, because she had so many cookies and a popsicle already, and did
not eat her dinner. I told her that I would really like to let her
make her own choices about what she eats, but I would like to see her
make some healthy choices, so that I know her body will grow
healthy.  Then I talked a little about sweets and snack foods, and
the fact that they do not give us energy that lasts, and that is why
she was still hungry.

As we pulled in the driveway, she said, 'Mom, I want a healthy snack
before bed -- PBJ sandwhich'.  So she had 1 and 1/2 (ALOT for her). 
We also negotiated milk instead of a can of grape pop (which she
brought home from family function and is not normally allowed to have
at all).

So goes our first week of new mindset.  Ugh.  I am so conflicted, and
hope I am not damaging them in this process!

Melissa Z.


Jon and Rue Kream

>>she was given a choice, she would choose the sweets anytime!  I know because I almost always let her choose her snack. 
 
**Hi Kym - I don't think almost always and always will result in the same attitudes towards food.  If kids know that sometimes the answer is going to be no they're going to want to grab whatever sweets they can while they're available.
 
>>but would otherwise eat candy/junk food all day long, constantly (she eats WAY more than I do!), if I let her. 
 
**Sandra Dodd has an interesting web page on just this subject: http://sandradodd.com/strew/ifilet . 
 
>>She's gained almost 20 lbs in the last 18 months, so if we don't do something she will be big as a house, soon
 
*How old is your daughter?   It's pretty common for kids to gain some weight in the time periods before they suddenly grow a few inches.
 
I know that my relatives feelings and perceptions about my weight affected me hugely when I was a child (they thought I was 'skinny').  It's important to me that my kids feel and be accepted just as they are.    ~Rue

Kym Dean

Yes, I'm a nurse, so I know growth spurts are common in her age, but she gained nothing in height (ok, she *might* be up about 1/4 of an inch now but that is questionable!  LOL) so the weight gain is not really due to growth, I don't believe.....should have seen more height than that at this point.  I am having trouble finding clothes to fit because she hasn't gained the height but is now out of her size 8s.  Even size 8 shorts are almost too small, and size 10s are too big.  :S  She was a preemie, so was always good on height, but lower end on weight until now.....now it's opposite!  LOL  She turns sideways and I swear she looks 9 months pregnant!  LOL
 
Kym
-----Original Message-----
From: Jon and Rue Kream [mailto:skreams@...]
Sent: Monday, May 31, 2004 11:33 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: RueRE: [unschoolingbasics] FOOD for Thought


>>She's gained almost 20 lbs in the last 18 months, so if we don't do something she will be big as a house, soon
 
*How old is your daughter?   It's pretty common for kids to gain some weight in the time periods before they suddenly grow a few inches.
 

Jonell Alvi

Hi Melissa,

I just wanted to jump in and say how glad I am that you brought up
this issue. And to offer my support.

We are struggling with just these issues at our house. My ds Ben is
4 and his diet is atrocious, when he chooses to eat at all. (My 11
month old eats more than he does.) My heart says to step back and let
him make his own choices about what he eats, but my head says he
can't be trusted to make good choices. But how can he learn to make
good choices without being able to make his own choices and learn
from the consequences? And round it goes.

Perhaps if it were easier for him to get his own foods that were
healthy he would eat them more. It is so easy to pull out a cookie
or a popsicle or fruit leather. Not so easy for him to get out
veggies or fuits or even open a cheese stick. Hmmm....I'm going to
make a bowl in the fridge and a bowl in the cupboard of good stuff
that he can have free access to and see how it goes.....I'll keep you
posted!


Jonell





--- melissazietlow <Zietlowfamily@...> wrote:
> >>When she stays at my mother's, she is allowed anything she
> pleases
> (unlimited sweets), and therefore rarely eats healthy food over
> there.<<
>
> **But if being able to make her own choices was not a special treat
>
> she wouldn't feel a need to binge when the opportunity presents
> itself.**
>
> Today we were at my parents' and no sooner had we arrived than a
> box
> of chocolate covered graham crackers was discovered. The kids and
> I
> each had a few (more than I usually allow for a snack), then left
> the
> garage where they were found. As we walked away, Orion said she
> wanted more cookies. I said we left them in the garage. She said
> she wanted to go back to the garage to see grandpa. I said, 'I
> think
> you want to go back to the garage to eat more cookies. I would
> rather you did not do that because I am about to make dinner and I
> think you may be too full to eat the good food I make if you eat
> more'. She said 'no I won't' and I let her go to the garage. She
> and sister had several more there, then brought the box back to the
>
> patio with them. They took turns playing and coming back for more
> cookies -- Orion eyeballing me all the time, younger dd asking me
> for
> more. I allowed it without making a big deal, except to ask Orion
> if
> she thought eating 10, 11, 12 (TWELVE!!) cookies before dinner was
> a
> good idea. She said she would eat dinner, which she of course did
> not. I tried so hard not to show my complete frustration, and
> even
> allowed a popsicle (!!) before we left, because they beg for one
> when ever we leave there.
>
> >>I have been trying to communicate my feelings and opinions about
> her
> about her food choices instead of controlling,<<
>
> **I would be careful about doing this. If she is still getting the
>
> message that you do not think she will make good choices what she
> chooses could be in reaction to that rather than based on what she
> might actually want.**
>
> I am failing this one in a huge way. On the way home we stopped at
>
> my grandmother's (next door) and she promptly started whining for a
>
> cookie. At this point I was losing my patience and focus, and said
>
> no, because she had so many cookies and a popsicle already, and did
>
> not eat her dinner. I told her that I would really like to let her
> make her own choices about what she eats, but I would like to see
> her
> make some healthy choices, so that I know her body will grow
> healthy. Then I talked a little about sweets and snack foods, and
> the fact that they do not give us energy that lasts, and that is
> why
> she was still hungry.
>
> As we pulled in the driveway, she said, 'Mom, I want a healthy
> snack
> before bed -- PBJ sandwhich'. So she had 1 and 1/2 (ALOT for her).
>
> We also negotiated milk instead of a can of grape pop (which she
> brought home from family function and is not normally allowed to
> have
> at all).
>
> So goes our first week of new mindset. Ugh. I am so conflicted,
> and
> hope I am not damaging them in this process!
>
> Melissa Z.
>
>





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G&M Contracting Inc., Kenneth Gillilan

>>>>Would she be willing to take a vitamin each day?  Would that make you feel more comfortable about the choices she makes as you transition?>>>>
 
I did this very thing and it really lifted the guilt mode I was putting myself in.  My kids dentist tells me often not to let my kids graze because it will give them cavities, but every time we go in to see him he tells me how great my kids teeth look.  Go figure!  The food hang up was huge for me, but I found that if I put healthy choices in the house along with a little junk they made mostly good choices.  The other issue was sitting at the table when my husband and I eat.(my husbands hang up more than mine)  They have been eating through out the day, so they are not hungry at dinner time.  Lately I have been getting arts and crafts stuff out so that we both get what we want.  They do crafts and talk to us while we eat. 
 
AnnMarie
-----Origin al Message-----
From: Jon and Rue Kream [mailto:skreams@...]
Sent: Monday, May 31, 2004 6:40 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: RE: [unschoolingbasics] FOOD for Thought

>>I have always thought it was my duty as
a parent to see that they eat right
 
**I see my duty as providing a variety of foods to choose from so that Dagny and Rowan can listen to what their bodies tell them and easily access whatever they feel they need.
 
>>My hang-up is that my older dd is very
picky,
 
**Children's taste buds are so much more sensitive than adults'.  Still, in my experience, children who are free to choose their food will eat a wide enough variety to keep them healthy.
 
>>When she stays at my mother's, she is allowed
anything she pleases (unlimited sweets), and therefore rarely eats
healthy food over there.
 
**But if being able to make her own choices was not a special treat she wouldn't feel a need to binge when the opportunity presents itself. 
 
>>I have been trying to communicate my feelings and opinions about her
food choices instead of controlling,
 
**I would be careful about doing this.  If she is still getting the message that you do not think she will make good choices what she chooses could be in reaction to that rather than based on what she might actually want.
 
>>I feel such a sense of parental responsibility for her health!
**Would she be willing to take a vitamin each day?  Would that make you feel more comfortable about the choices she makes as you transition? 
 
Glad to see you here :0).  ~Rue
 
 

Jon and Rue Kream

Hi Melissa - If you really want to give this a try I'd stop talking to her about food choices for now.  She's not going to make the choices an unrestricted child would make until she doesn't feel you watching what she eats and making judgements, silent or verbalized.  The fact that she was willing to lie to be able to go eat more cookies in the garage shows just how valuable certain foods have become to her.  Her desire for those cookies was strong enough to undermine the honesty of your relationship.
 
>>even
allowed a popsicle (!!)  before we left, because they beg for one
when ever we leave there.  
 
**Dagny and Rowan have never wanted any kind of food badly enough to beg for it. I do believe that's because they have never had to beg for any kind of food.
 
You can give food magic by doling it out or negotiating for it or making it something that they only receive at your whim.  A magic that guarantees there can never be *enough* of the forbidden food.  ~Rue

melissazietlow

--- In [email protected], "Jon and Rue Kream"
<skreams@c...> wrote:
**If you really want to give this a try I'd stop talking to her about
food choices for now. She's not going to make the choices an
unrestricted child would make until she doesn't feel you watching
what she eats and making judgements, silent or verbalized.**

You mean, say okay to every request, no comment even if it may
conflict with meal or other plans, etc.? Today my dh requested dd to
take a rest/quiet-time in our bedroom before her big baseball game,
since he needs to finish some work in the garage and I have not been
feeling well and desperately needed a break. They ate lunch (which
she had a can of grape pop with, no comment/negotiation) then Orion
asked me for a tootsie pop for dessert. Since dh wanted her to go to
bedroom in the next few minutes, I offered her a bag of fruit snacks
instead, and explained that a popsicle takes a long time to eat, and
is not allowed in the bedroom. She protested but then decided to
have the fruit snacks.

I suppose this was not much of a choice for her, so should I just
have said okay despite dh's wishes for the sake of not negotiating
and allowed food in a room where eating is off limits?

I can almost hear you ask if something else could have been worked
out as far as rest-time. Perhaps this is a whole other issue in
itself, but we were all at a point where some quiet was really
needed, and the only way for that to happen is if we separate for a
short time. I have not been forcing naps for several weeks(unless
younger dd has a meltdown and really needs it). Dh was trying to take
over for me this afternoon, and made the quiet-time decision (new
alternative to nap for when everyone gets overwhelmed,
overstimulated, or when mommy is about to drop over). Another control
issue...or a sanity issue? I have been having a difficult time
seeing clearly, and dh is only going by what I am coming to
understand about restrictions (both parenting and food related). I
really didn't want to question him, nor did I have the energy to give
up the offer.


**The fact that she was willing to lie to be able to go eat more
cookies in the garage shows just how valuable certain foods have
become to her. Her desire for those cookies was strong enough to
undermine the honesty of your relationship.

Yes, this really bothered me! What have we done to our child? And
what should I have done yesterday when she wanted to (almost did) eat
the ENTIRE box of cookies before dinner? Said nothing at all? And
make no comment when she does not eat a meal?


**Dagny and Rowan have never wanted any kind of food badly enough to
beg for it. I do believe that's because they have never had to beg
for any kind of food.

Yes, I see now. But now that we are in this situation, should we
allow it (popsicles, other foods formerly negotiated for) under any
circumstance without comment, when they beg for something?

**You can give food magic by doling it out or negotiating for it or
making it something that they only receive at your whim. A magic
that guarantees there can never be *enough* of the forbidden food.**

It seems we have done this. So how do we best handle the transition
time? I got the suggestion from another list to start by saying yes
more often, but it almost seems like you are suggesting total
freedom?

I so apprecriate all the input. Please do not take my questions as
anything other than a need for clarification. I am sure we will not
get through this without experienced perspective!

Melissa Z.

Alyce

--- In [email protected], "melissazietlow"
<Zietlowfamily@w...> wrote:

> You mean, say okay to every request, no comment even if it may
> conflict with meal or other plans, etc.?

Yes, say ok. It will level out.

Today my dh requested dd to
> take a rest/quiet-time in our bedroom before her big baseball
game,
> since he needs to finish some work in the garage and I have not
been
> feeling well and desperately needed a break.

Why did she have to go in her room?

They ate lunch (which
> she had a can of grape pop with, no comment/negotiation) then
Orion
> asked me for a tootsie pop for dessert. Since dh wanted her to go
to
> bedroom in the next few minutes, I offered her a bag of fruit
snacks
> instead, and explained that a popsicle takes a long time to eat,
and
> is not allowed in the bedroom. She protested but then decided to
> have the fruit snacks.

Short of letting her stay at the table and eat the popsicle, you
might have sent her in there with the popsicle, a bowl, some paper
towels and a can of spot shot to clean up anything that might have
spilled.
>
> I suppose this was not much of a choice for her, so should I just
> have said okay despite dh's wishes for the sake of not negotiating
> and allowed food in a room where eating is off limits?

You and dh need to figure out how to handle that one. Why is it off
limits? Obviously, you and he want to be on the same page so nobody
feels the other is undermining him/her.

>
> I can almost hear you ask if something else could have been worked
> out as far as rest-time. Perhaps this is a whole other issue in
> itself, but we were all at a point where some quiet was really
> needed, and the only way for that to happen is if we separate for
a
> short time.

Yes, you're right. hehe. Why couldn't you have been separate with
you in your room, hubby in the garage (I gathered?) and daughter
wherever she was content - her room, living room, kitchen... etc.

Another control
> issue...or a sanity issue?

When I am about to drop over, I tell the kids as much. They can
hang in their room, or watch tv... or crawl in the bed with me.
Whatever they're feeling like.


> Yes, this really bothered me! What have we done to our child?
And
> what should I have done yesterday when she wanted to (almost did)
eat
> the ENTIRE box of cookies before dinner? Said nothing at all?
And
> make no comment when she does not eat a meal?

I say let her eat the whole box. A couple times of that and there's
a good chance:

1.The magic will be gone as the taboo has been lifted.

2.She'll likely realize all on her own that maybe a whole box of
cookies at one sitting doesn't really agree with a person most often.

I seriously doubt she'll end up eating entire boxes of cookies on a
regular basis. How long has she been standing on the other side of
an imaginary wall eyeing the "buffet" with all those tasty things
she couldn't have or was able just to have enough to whet her
appetite - or that she had to wheel and deal and bargain for?

Suddenly, someone has torn down the wall and like any starving
person she's moved to go nuts. Once she gets her fill and realizes
the barrier isn't going back up, and that she'll be able to help
herself to whatever is on the buffet whenever she's feeling the
need, the binging will pass.

>
> Yes, I see now. But now that we are in this situation, should we
> allow it (popsicles, other foods formerly negotiated for) under
any
> circumstance without comment, when they beg for something?

Again, I really say yes.

> It seems we have done this. So how do we best handle the
transition
> time?

Ride it out. :) And do have healthy stuff at hand as well. Not
things that are hard for the kids to just grab or that need prep.
My kids love having a veggie platter in the fridge... chopped up
veggies and a dish of ranch dressing... sliced cheese on a plate
covered in plastic in the fridge... and some crackers... think of
things that are easy to grab. I even eat "junk" if I'm not feeling
like prepping something - even if I'm craving something healthy.
tsk. :)
I got the suggestion from another list to start by saying yes
> more often, but it almost seems like you are suggesting total
> freedom?

I believe that is exactly what we're suggesting. Well I can't speak
for all... but I suggest it.
>
> I so apprecriate all the input. Please do not take my questions
as
> anything other than a need for clarification.

Not at all! I'm still full of questions myself and learning all the
time. The more I learn, the more I realize how little I know.
lol. I hope you find some helpful answers here.

Alyce

Kym Dean

I heard something funny on the radio this morning....one of the djs was talking about his nephew who is now 19.  He said up until the age of 4 he ate almost anything.  Then, when he was 4 he had some problems and they thought he had some severe food allergies.  Somehow he got it into his little head that he could only eat cheetos, peanut butter, McDonald's french fries and milk safely.  That's what he lived on for the next 15 years!  No joke.  He said he even tried to bribe him at the age of 10 to eat a slice of pizza for 20 dollars, and the kid refused. The pediatrician said not to worry about it, just give him vitamins daily.  The kid is now 6'3" and healthy, and is totally into computers and is pretty smart.  How weird is that???  Not exactly the healthy diet, but still turned out ok.  We have always been told in school (thru my education and nursing classes) that children will not let themselves starve....if they get hungry enough, they will eat, even if it isn't as good for them as we had hoped.  Yes, we need to help them know what better choices are, but we have to be very careful in this society.  Too much emphasis is placed on food and size.  There would be less kids with eating disorders (and adults, too) if we didn't put so much pressure on everyone to eat this or only be this size.  We need to start changing the way people think by starting with our kids.  Unless your child becomes sick, don't pressure them too much.  They will come around.  I know I sometimes get stressed about how much junk Cae is eating (even though she eats most anything), but I really try hard not to make too big a deal over it....I want her to be healthy, no matter what she eats and what her size, and as kids they can be, even if they eat lots of things we view as unhealthy.  Just have lots of "good" snacks available to them and encourage them to try things at least once every 6-9 months (their tastes can change quickly) (we call it the "no thank you bite").  They'll learn.
 
Kym
-----Original Message-----
From: G&M Contracting Inc., Kenneth Gillilan [mailto:gmcontractinginc@...]
Sent: Tuesday, June 01, 2004 8:19 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: RE: [unschoolingbasics] FOOD for Thought

>>>>Would she be willing to take a vitamin each day?  Would that make you feel more comfortable about the choices she makes as you transition?>>>>
 
I did this very thing and it really lifted the guilt mode I was putting myself in.  My kids dentist tells me often not to let my kids graze because it will give them cavities, but every time we go in to see him he tells me how great my kids teeth look.  Go figure!  The food hang up was huge for me, but I found that if I put healthy choices in the house along with a little junk they made mostly good choices.  The other issue was sitting at the table when my husband and I eat.(my husbands hang up more than mine)  They have been eating through out the day, so they are not hungry at dinner time.  Lately I have been getting arts and crafts stuff out so that we both get what we want.  They do crafts and talk to us while we eat. 
 
AnnMarie
-----Origin al Message-----

pam sorooshian

On Jun 1, 2004, at 4:51 PM, Alyce wrote:

>
>> You mean, say okay to every request, no comment even if it may
>> conflict with meal or other plans, etc.?
>
> Yes, say ok. It will level out.

I agree.

I have to say that it does sound like you have a lot of junk food in
the house - more than what we typically have. And I especially agree
that kids will almost always choose the "easiest" thing, whether it is
an apple or a piece of candy.

Since you have set a precedent of being SO controlling, you might have
to spend months "acting" like the food she chooses is just totally fine
with you.

BUT - maybe put that energy that you have used in watching her food
intake like a hawk into making all kinds of relatively healthy creative
good snack foods. If it would help, we could give you some ideas here.

Which reminds me, it may be that she doesn't eat at mealtime as much -
but remember that's okay, too. Snacking/grazing is healthier.

Here are some ideas for stocking up on healthier snack foods:

Fruit is ALWAYS tastier when somebody else has sliced it up for us.
Spend the extra money to get really tasty good fruit - don't just get
it at the regular grocery store. Have cantaloupe, honeydew, and
watermelon chunks available in the fridge in small baggies so the kids
can grab one on the go.
Try putting a little cinnamon on apple slices - have them cold or, in
the evenings, heat them in the microwave.
Celery sticks with cream cheese and raisins is called "ants on a log."
Peanut butter balls (dried milk, honey, peanut butter, raisins) We like
these frozen.
Trail mix - again, have it available in little baggies so they can grab
it quickly.
Mini boxes of raisins.
Cute little cheeses.
Pudding - store bought or make your own.
Custard in little cups.
Peanuts in shells!

And then there are all the great frozen treats:
chunks of banana dipped in melted chocolate or caramel and rolled in
coconut - this is just SO good - thin the chocolate or caramel so it is
just a thin coating.

juice frozen in ice cube trays

and our all-time most favorite never-get-tired-of-it treat is FROZEN
GRAPES!!!! These are BETTER than candy!

-pam
National Home Education Network
<www.NHEN.org>
Serving the entire homeschooling community since 1999
through information, networking and public relations.

melissazietlow

>>Today my dh requested dd to take a rest/quiet-time in our bedroom
before her big baseball game, since he needs to finish some work in
the garage and I have not been feeling well and desperately needed a
break.<<

> Why did she have to go in her room?


>>I can almost hear you ask if something else could have been worked
out as far as rest-time. Perhaps this is a whole other issue in
itself, but we were all at a point where some quiet was really
needed, and the only way for that to happen is if we separate for
a short time.<<

> Yes, you're right. hehe. Why couldn't you have been separate with
you in your room, hubby in the garage (I gathered?) and daughter
wherever she was content - her room, living room, kitchen... etc.


>>Another control issue...or a sanity issue?<<

> When I am about to drop over, I tell the kids as much. They can
hang in their room, or watch tv... or crawl in the bed with me.
Whatever they're feeling like.

Thanks, Alyce...
Since lifting imposed naptime several weeks ago (because she has
reached a point where she obviously doesn't need one, and because we
are changing our parenting views) we have tried many different
scenarios. If Ava (younger dd) needs a nap, Ava goes to the kids'
bedroom. If I need quiet time or a nap on the couch (which is more
and more often, as I am 8 months pregnant) we have been trying to
give Orion the choice of a chilling out in the living room chair with
a quiet activity, reading books, watching a movie at low volume, etc.
but she has not been able to remain quiet enough to let me rest (I
have always been sensitive to noise and it has increased during this
pregnancy). She simply cannot sit or keep her voice low for any
length of time -- she is a mover and constantly talks or sings to
herself, and cannot resist initiating conversation. So if my need is
great and dh is not occuppying our bedroom, a few times we have asked
her to go there for a short time with some books and toys, while I
lay on the couch. I do not feel comfortable leaving her alone in the
rest of the house while I rest in the bed (too many possibilities for
a 5yo).

Sigh. I guess this 'other issue' is really about conflict of needs
and how to go about solving these kind of conflicts in a way where
everyone feels respected, and satisfied. I don't want to force my
kids to do anything anymore, but coming to that place is really
taking effort and much more creativity/abilty than it seems we have
at times! We have been so accustomed to reacting without thought, to
looking without seeing, to making decisions instead of offering
choices, that it is like we are almost deaf and dumb!

How great that there is a place to come to, 'put it out there'. To
have someone listen who doesn't even know you, and care enough to try
and help is awesome.

Melissa Z.

melissazietlow

>> You mean, say okay to every request, no comment even if it may
conflict with meal or other plans, etc.?

> Yes, say ok. It will level out.

> I agree.

I will trust you on this! I have been sharing with my husband, and
he is more uncertain than me. We were feeling very deflated this
afternoon. However, we allowed dds to have cookies and juice drinks,
then ice cream after the baseball game and before dinner tonight,
without comment. If you can call hot dogs dinner!


> I have to say that it does sound like you have a lot of junk food
in the house - more than what we typically have.

Perhaps it sounds that way from my posts, but we really don't usually
have much junk in the house, on purpose. My mother has always
berated me for depriving the kids because of this fact (Funny,
because my mother has a negative weight/food issue)! It may have
come across as so because, like I said, we decided to relax the food
issue over a holiday weekend, then visited my parents' where there
was constant access to junk/sweets. We allowed the kids to bring
home 'treats' offered by family (why do they always try to force us
to take home all the junk?) which we rarely do. Also, before the
weekend, I allowed the girls to 'purchase' toostie pops and ice cream
at the store (without thinking about the holiday coming up) because
we have been out of easter candy for awhile. I have always tried to
provide fun, healthier snacks at home (although some you mentioned
were new)as well as fruit, etc. My mother has always said my kids
beg for treats because they don't EVER get them at home (not entirely
true -- we have allowed treats in moderation, and this has meant not
keeping the house stocked at all times). This (moderation) doesn't
seem all that restrictive to me. I think perhaps I have been too
restrictive about how much, and when to eat when opportunities are
available?

>Since you have set a precedent of being SO controlling, you might
have to spend months "acting" like the food she chooses is just
totally fine with you.

This makes me a little sad. Not because you said it, but because I
did not realize that I was as controlling as is becoming apparent. I
always thought I was doing the best for them. I have always
considered myself a deeply committed, highly involved/aware, but not
overbearing or smothering parent (I know some of those!). Then Orion
turned 4yo and everything started to come undone. Everything I
thought I was doing out of love started to fail, and I started to
feel like I was losing touch. Interesting that at the same time, I
discovered the idea of unschooling...

Melissa Z.

Alyce

--- In [email protected], "melissazietlow"
<Zietlowfamily@w...> wrote:
I
> did not realize that I was as controlling as is becoming
apparent. I
> always thought I was doing the best for them. I have always
> considered myself a deeply committed, highly involved/aware, but
not
> overbearing or smothering parent (I know some of those!). Then
Orion
> turned 4yo and everything started to come undone. Everything I
> thought I was doing out of love started to fail, and I started to
> feel like I was losing touch. Interesting that at the same time,
I
> discovered the idea of unschooling...
>
> Melissa Z.

Don't beat yourself up. You're working toward change now, and
that's something! You can't change the past, but you can make the
future terrific starting right in the present.

I was right where you are not very long ago... and still catch
my "old" self sometimes. It does get better. :) I have a lot of
guilt over my "past" mothering. But I have to not beat myself up
either. I was doing what I thought best based on the only thing I
knew. Then I discovered unschooling as well. It'll be ok! :)

Alyce

Jon and Rue Kream

>>You mean, say okay to every request, no comment
 
**Hi Melissa - Yes, I would say okay whenever you can (if there's a real life reason that you can't, such as a budget issue, then that's a real life issue and not you making an arbitrary decision).  I wouldn't count her cookies or tell her that you want her to make healthy choices when she wants a cookie or negotiate for her to drink milk.  When you do you're keeping the focus on what she's eating.  Let it become a non-issue.  Don't announce, "you can eat whatever you want now", just say yes when she asks for something, happily get it for her if she needs your help, and let it naturally evolve. 
 
>>Since dh wanted her to go to
bedroom in the next few minutes, I offered her a bag of fruit snacks
instead, and explained that a popsicle takes a long time to eat, and
is not allowed in the bedroom. 
 
**I don't have a problem with saying that I need some quiet time (and I know you must be worn out at this stage of your pregnancy!), but I think it's worth taking a minute to look for options: Why did they have to be in the bedroom for you to have some quiet time?  Could you have gone in there instead? Why is food off limits in the bedroom?  Could you lay a blanket down to catch any mess in there?  Does it really take that long to eat a popsicle?  Really, thinking about the options probably wouldn't have taken any longer than convincing her to take a fruit snack instead.
 
>>What have we done to our child?
 
**Nothing you can't change :0).
 
>>what should I have done yesterday when she wanted to (almost did) eat
the ENTIRE box of cookies before dinner?  Said nothing at all?  And
make no comment when she does not eat a meal? 
**Yes, that's what I would have done.  She's not going to want to eat a whole box of cookies every night.  I promise.  She might for a week, or two weeks, or however long it takes her to get her fill, but the magic of cookies will disappear if you can give it time and trust her.
 
>>should we
allow it (popsicles, other foods formerly negotiated for) under any
circumstance without comment, when they beg for something?
**Don't make them beg for anything.  Just say yes.  Again, if you have a real life 'circumstance' that prohibits them from having what they want (it's 11 pm and you don't HAVE any popsicles) that's different.
 
>>I got the suggestion from another list to start by saying yes
more often, but it almost seems like you are suggesting total
freedom? 
**I think the distinction being made when people say to start saying yes is that you don't want to freak the kids out by just saying, 'eat whatever you want'.  You can make the switch in your head, but not make an issue of it with the kids by just saying yes until they realize they don't even need to ask any more.
 
>>Please do not take my questions as
anything other than a need for clarification.
 
**Not at all!  And I hope you don't feel I'm criticizing in any way.  I just *know* that you don't have to have these issues with your kids, which can mean all that time you're spending negotiating and they're spending upset can instead be spent happily, and I want to help :0).  ~Rue
 

Alyce

--- In [email protected], "melissazietlow"
<Zietlowfamily@w...> wrote:

Eight months pregnant is a very tired place to be. And I'm hoping
someone else will jump in here with other ideas! :) But I'll give
it a whack. First, I don't know your husband's work or sleep
schedule, or yours for that matter, so if I present something that
is completely impossible, I apologize.

You said that when your dh isn't occupying the bedroom you sometimes
have her go in there to rest/have quiet time. When he IS in there,
can she go in and hang out with him while you rest or no? When he's
not occupying the bedroom, is he elsewhere on the premises where she
could go be with him while you rest? Do you have a trusted teen in
the neighborhood who would be willing to come over for a little bit
sometimes and entertain her while you rest? A neighbor? Friend? I
was lucky enough to have a neigbor who came over to help me out when
my son was an infant - I had the two girls as well... I didn't have
to pay her... We had her over for dinner or traded other favors like
running her to the store (she didn't drive.) So maybe there's
someone who might be willing to help when your dh can't be there?

We have been so accustomed to reacting without thought, to
> looking without seeing, to making decisions instead of offering
> choices, that it is like we are almost deaf and dumb!

I know. Like I said - been there! *shudder* But it sounds like
you're definitely on the right track now! And once you get over the
initial rough spots, it WILL come easier and you should all enjoy
each other even more.

Now if the next speaker will please jump in with some awesome input,
we'd appreciate it! :)

Alyce

[email protected]

In a message dated 6/2/2004 12:05:38 AM Eastern Daylight Time, Groups@... writes:
  I was doing what I thought best based on the only thing I
knew.  Then I discovered unschooling as well.  It'll be ok!  :)<<<<
 
Right.
 
When you know better, you do better.
 
~Kelly

 
 

[email protected]

In a message dated 6/2/2004 12:14:08 AM Eastern Daylight Time, Groups@... writes:
Now if the next speaker will please jump in with some awesome input,
we'd appreciate it!  :)<<<<
 
Naw. I think you're doing a great job!
 
Good suggestions!
~Kely

 
 

melissazietlow

> You said that when your dh isn't occupying the bedroom you
sometimes have her go in there to rest/have quiet time. When he IS
in there, can she go in and hang out with him while you rest or no?

No, he works night shift and is usually sleeping during the day.
Sometimes I feel like putting her in there even when he is sleeping
and locking the door!

>When he's not occupying the bedroom, is he elsewhere on the premises
where she could go be with him while you rest?

Our house is very, very small, but on rare days, if an opportunity
arises he will occupy kids in livingroom or take them outside! Today
he took the girls out in the yard for awhile, but had to finish a
side job in the garage before I felt ready to get up (rough day).
Hence he took her to bedroom and read her a book, gave her a few to
read on her own, and some stuffed animals. She made noise in there
awhile (muffled), but when I got up and peeked in, she was asleep.
More peaceful than having her downstairs asking her to be quieter
every few minutes, and having us both end up frustrated, etc.

>Do you have a trusted teen in the neighborhood who would be willing
to come over for a little bit sometimes and entertain her while you
rest?

I just interviewed a teenage girl who has been advertising for
babysitting. She came over once for a few hours, but cannot start
coming on a regular basis during the day until next week. I think it
will really help us all. This is a big step, as we have never had
anyone other than family watch the girls (somehow, after we had 2
kids, family is not so willing to offer help).


> But it sounds like you're definitely on the right track now! And
once you get over the initial rough spots, it WILL come easier and
you should all enjoy each other even more.

I really want to believe that, so I am going to trust...and carry on.

Thanks so much,
MZ

[email protected]

In a message dated 6/2/2004 3:56:36 AM Eastern Daylight Time, Zietlowfamily@... writes:
Then Orion
turned 4yo and everything started to come undone.  Everything I
thought I was doing out of love started to fail, and I started to
feel like I was losing touch.  Interesting that at the same time, I
discovered the idea of unschooling...<<<<<
 
 
The wonderful thing is that you are starting to understand this NOW.
 
Most parents start when the child is 13 or so! By the time they have a handle on it (and many NEVER do), the child has completely rebelled and there's that parent/teen struggle that becomes inevitable. It's full-blown by then, and the family can't recover in time before the child is out of the house!
 
You'll *both* appreciate your putting a bit more time and effort into this relationship now! Not to mention the younger children!
 
~Kelly

 
 

macschmerm

Hi there
I read in one of your posts that you are a light sleeper? That any
noise is bound to disturb your rest? I am the same way. Rarely I do
not have to get up to drive my husband to town, and when I don't have
to I like to sleep in another hour or so, but the sounds of him
getting ready can disturb me to the point of not being able to rest
more. So I got a pair of ear plugs, it doesn't block out all the
sound but dulls it so it isn't so invasive. Maybe you could get a
pair for when you nap and your husband is around to be available to
your daughter.

My daughter is almost nine and gets herself breakfast, feeds the
cats, wathces her shows, colours etc. So I know she is fine even when
I block out sound.

Tamara