Julie Bogart

I've been discussing unschooling with a few friends and some of them feel that
unschooling is "hard" and "takes a certain kind of personality." I wondered about that. Do
you need to have a certain bent? Personality? Background? Style of mothering?

What would make unschooling a bad choice for someone?

Julie B

mamaaj2000

I wonder if I have enough energy, specifically enough initiative to
find things to strew, to follow up on where my children's interests
lead, etc.

We'll see. Right now, I'm trying not to think about it. I have very
little energy, but the kids are happy.

--aj
--- In [email protected], "Julie Bogart"
<julie@b...> wrote:
> I've been discussing unschooling with a few friends and some of
them feel that
> unschooling is "hard" and "takes a certain kind of personality." I
wondered about that. Do
> you need to have a certain bent? Personality? Background? Style of
mothering?
>
> What would make unschooling a bad choice for someone?
>
> Julie B

J. Stauffer

<<What would make unschooling bad for anyone?>>

I think the downfall of unschooling for many people is that you have to be
willing to examine yourself, what you are doing, what you are thinking, in a
really tough way. That is extremely threatening for some people.

I think it was Sandra posted something about how she had never come across a
family meeting where the parents didn't already have a plan in mind and the
kids were supposed to rubber stamp it.

I know this happens a lot. I see it with friends quite a bit. I think
unschooling parents have to be very aware of the imbalance of power in the
relationship with their kids.

It is kind of like a "therapist/patient" relationship in that the parent can
twist things to make the kids do what they want them to do seemingly
willingly. The parent can use just the right inflection, the right amount
of eye contact, the right wording to manipulate their children into not
expressing their true choices.

Unschooling parents have to be willing to take a look at themselves and see
what is going on.

Julie S.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Julie Bogart" <julie@...>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Tuesday, September 07, 2004 9:48 AM
Subject: [UnschoolingDiscussion] What kind of mother wouldn't be a good fit
for unschooling?


> I've been discussing unschooling with a few friends and some of them feel
that
> unschooling is "hard" and "takes a certain kind of personality." I
wondered about that. Do
> you need to have a certain bent? Personality? Background? Style of
mothering?
>
> What would make unschooling a bad choice for someone?
>
> Julie B
>
>
>
>
> "List Posting Policies" are provided in the files area of this group.
>
> Visit the Unschooling website and message boards:
http://www.unschooling.com
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>

Seth W Bartels

I've been discussing unschooling with a few friends and some of them feel
that
unschooling is "hard" and "takes a certain kind of personality." I
wondered about that. Do
you need to have a certain bent? Personality? Background? Style of
mothering?

What would make unschooling a bad choice for someone?

Julie B


hi there...i've been lurking here digesting (and marveling at) all of the
discussions for about a week and annoying my husband with the onslaught
of messages in our inbox. ;) now i feel a desire to chime in!
introduction to follow later!

i hear this all the time...*you're so brave to homeschool* *i'm not
patient (smart, dedicated, etc) enough to do that!* *don't you get sick
of being with your kids all the time?* among other things i'm sure you've
all heard before. and beyond being simply amazed that people actually
say these things out loud, let alone think them, i'm always left
confused. while i realize that a lot of decisions i make are not
*normal* in our society these days, i don't consider myself exceptionally
strong or unique because i make them. and i don't consider my choices to
be harder than those of other, more mainstream choices. in fact, i'd
have to argue that most everything i do (or have done) is somewhat based
in my inherent laziness. ;) it's just easier to nurse my baby in the
middle of the night than to drag my butt all the way downstairs and fix a
bottle. and it's easier to sleep with my kids than to shove them off
somewhere else and have to get up to deal with their resulting
insecurities in the middle of the night. it's easier for me to listen to
their needs than to put them off and hear them scream about it. in the
same way, it's easier to sit back and enjoy the amazing ways my children
manage to learn what they want, when they choose to! it feels natural to
me, just like the rest of our lives. i never sat and chose to unschool
our kids...i didn't even know what it meant until i became interested in
homeschooling and figured out we'd been living it all along!

i think perhaps what's unique about a parent who chooses the road of
unschooling is that they have the courage to follow their instincts above
their schooling and that they're not so thoroughly drenched in the path
that was chosen for them that they can't see the light when it's opened
to them. i suppose some people never even know they have options. most
people are taught that we have roles to play in life that are
predetermined and they just follow them. i've always been a rule breaker
and now, as an adult, i'm glad of it! a whole new world is opening up to
me that most will never know exists and i believe that following this new
route has the potential to break the cycle of imbalance in our times.

but i digress...people seem to perceive anything different from *normal*
choices as more difficult. it feels to me like it's easier for most
people to avoid the compassion to pick up their crying infant in the
middle of the night because they're told it will make them more
independent to put themselves back to sleep. easier to bottle feed a
baby, even with the chore of sterilizing and filling bottles, because
they can sidestep the intimacy of suckling which is considered unpopular,
embarrassing, low-tech, and unnecessary these days. easier to send their
kids to school for someone else to *educate* because it's too much work
having to come up with and follow a curriculum. easier to trust someone
else than to trust themselves or their children's inherent goodness and
curiosity. children are born incapable of thought. they must be trained
to act appropriately...schooled to become proper productively functioning
citizens. and yet, is it working? everyone complains about schools and
their multitude of problems. but the focus only seems to shift slightly
sideways...if the classes were smaller, the teachers better paid, etc.,
everything would be perfect. but we all know this is far off the mark.
we have to stop sending our children away when they don't choose it.
stop pretending we know better than them what is interesting to them.
and just breathe and love and relax and trust.

maybe it is an extra special thing to be a parent who lives this way...at
least in our culture. maybe it does take some little something extra.
mostly, i think it's openness to new ideas and the ability to genuinely
follow your heart. unschooling children is an natural extension of
unschooling ourselves. its all interrelated.

have i gone on enough yet? yeesh... :)

lisa
stay at home mama to three super funky wee ones:
eve (6 1/2), sebastian (4), & lila moon (2)

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Game-Enthusiast

I think that it takes a mother who is willing to interact with and listen to
her children. That sounds so simple, but I know a lot of people who don't
*really* listen to their children and whose interactions with them are
limited to telling them what they've done wrong.

Angela
game-enthusiast@...


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Julie Bogart

Welcome Lisa! I really enjoyed your first post. Very insightful. I loved this section
especially:

> i think perhaps what's unique about a parent who chooses the road of
> unschooling is that they have the courage to follow their instincts above
> their schooling and that they're not so thoroughly drenched in the path
> that was chosen for them that they can't see the light when it's opened
> to them. i suppose some people never even know they have options. most
> people are taught that we have roles to play in life that are
> predetermined and they just follow them. i've always been a rule breaker
> and now, as an adult, i'm glad of it! a whole new world is opening up to
> me that most will never know exists and i believe that following this new
> route has the potential to break the cycle of imbalance in our times.

"The path chosen for them"

So true.

My son withdrew from high school today. He told his friends he had decided to "take the
road less traveled." His school friends are jealous; his teachers, genuinely sad to lose him
(he particpates in class, of all things!).

And he is so happy today.

I've had a great (nearly) two years with our younger kids and see unschooling going
swimmingly for them.

I'm excited to see what happens with my oldest... I can feel the scales fall from our eyes.

And who knows what my sophomore daughter will do come the end of the semester?
<bg>

Julie B

Elizabeth Hill

** I've been discussing unschooling with a few friends and some of them
feel that
unschooling is "hard" and "takes a certain kind of personality." I
wondered about that. Do
you need to have a certain bent? Personality? Background? Style of
mothering?

What would make unschooling a bad choice for someone?**

Being uptight and controlling probably isn't a good start for an
unschooling parent. That's the first thing that pops to mind.

Caring a lot about what other people think, that is being the kind of
person that will crumple if a sister-in-law totally doesn't get
unschooling and sneers at it would be a problem.

Being cynical and derisive would be a total handicap (and sad for the
kids).

Who's got PamS's list of positive adjectives? Those are inspiring.

**don't you get sick
of being with your kids all the time?**

OK, liking your kids and wanting to spend time with them seems like a
necessary condition for happy healthy and fruitful unschooling.

Betsy

PS I'm not assuming that anyone who asks about this actually has these
qualities. These are just examples, writ large, of what temperaments
might not mesh with unschooling.

Seth W Bartels

thanks so much! i finally feel warmly welcome here alongside my
like-minded sisters and brothers (are there any fathers on the
list??)...and, i must say, it feels mighty good. :) i voraciously read
through all of these posts throughout the day and it seems that just when
i'm struggling with something, someone happens to pipe up about it. i'm
glad to have found this resource!

julie,
many congratulations to your son today! sounds like he's following his
heart (and his mind), which is very commendable. i find for myself that
i'm able to best clarify what i'm after by experiencing what's not quite
right. (did that make sense? sometimes i don't articulate myself well.)
it always seems clearer by contrast. sounds like he experienced this in
school. he went, he participated, he *succeeded* by their standards, yet
it still wasn't right for him. lesson learned! how fantastic!

happy day!
lisa


On Tue, 07 Sep 2004 17:29:21 -0000 "Julie Bogart" <julie@...>
writes:
Welcome Lisa! I really enjoyed your first post. Very insightful. I loved
this section
especially:

> i think perhaps what's unique about a parent who chooses the road of
> unschooling is that they have the courage to follow their instincts
above
> their schooling and that they're not so thoroughly drenched in the path
> that was chosen for them that they can't see the light when it's opened
> to them. i suppose some people never even know they have options.
most
> people are taught that we have roles to play in life that are
> predetermined and they just follow them. i've always been a rule
breaker
> and now, as an adult, i'm glad of it! a whole new world is opening up
to
> me that most will never know exists and i believe that following this
new
> route has the potential to break the cycle of imbalance in our times.

"The path chosen for them"

So true.

My son withdrew from high school today. He told his friends he had
decided to "take the
road less traveled." His school friends are jealous; his teachers,
genuinely sad to lose him
(he particpates in class, of all things!).

And he is so happy today.

I've had a great (nearly) two years with our younger kids and see
unschooling going
swimmingly for them.

I'm excited to see what happens with my oldest... I can feel the scales
fall from our eyes.

And who knows what my sophomore daughter will do come the end of the
semester?
<bg>

Julie B

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[email protected]

Julie S. wrote:
<<<<< The parent can use just the right inflection, the right amount
of eye contact, the right wording to manipulate their children into
not expressing their true choices. >>>>>

I've been known to go into my bedroom and shut the door so
Madelyn can't see me when I ask a question. That way my
interpersonally-intelligent daughter can't see my face and let
that influence her answer. . . . .


<<<<< Unschooling parents have to be willing to take a look at
themselves and see what is going on. >>>>>

And sometimes it ain't pretty. . . .

Mercedes
who "expects" to have her thoughts challenged on this list
<eg>