[email protected]

I would seriously like to know how other "unschooling" parents handle
dating. Do you give your kids as much freedom with making dating decisions as you
do other things in their lives?

I have an almost 15 year old daughter who wants to go out with a boy at our
church. He's really nice, good family, but he's 16 and drives. Should we
just invite him over here? None of my other kids were even interested in
dating until they were much older, usually over 17 or even 18.

I would never insist on courtship...I think that's really controlling. But
it makes sense to start dating when you're at the age you're ready to get
married. I can see the point to it. My almost 20 year old broke up with a
boyfriend of over a year, and he was very upset over it. It broke her heart
because he would call up crying...she doesn't want to be with him (he has a lot
of bad issues...long story) but she doesn't want him to hurt. She called me
upset saying, "How do I help him not to hurt??!" Ugh...I got off the phone
and cried myself.

What decisions have you come to with your kids over dating? Is it possible
to keep it very "light" (superficial, fun) without bumping heads with your
kids?

Nancy B.




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[email protected]

In a message dated 7/21/05 11:33:50 AM, CelticFrau@... writes:


> I would seriously like to know how other "unschooling" parents handle 
> dating.  Do you give your kids as much freedom with making dating decisions 
> as you
> do other things in their lives? 
>

We do.

-=-I have an almost 15 year old daughter who wants to go out with a boy at
our 
church.  He's really nice, good family, but he's 16 and drives.   Should we
just invite him over here?-=-

"Just" instead of letting them go somewhere?
You know him already from church, right?
You know his family?
Why can't she go?

-=-None of my other kids were even  interested in
dating until they were much older, usually over 17 or even  18. -=-

Why should she be penalized, though, or even compared, because her siblings
didn't get invited out when they were 14?

-=-I would never insist on courtship...I think that's really  controlling. 
But
it makes sense to start dating when you're at the age  you're ready to get
married.  I can see the point to it. -=-

Socialization. Not all dating is courtship, and not all dating is leading
to marriage, but a lack of dating can lead to girls being infatuated by ANY
male attention, having had few chances for comparisons.

-=-What decisions have you come to with your kids over dating?  Is it 
possible
to keep it very "light" (superficial, fun) without bumping heads  with your
kids?-=-

Is it possible to keep WHAT superficial and fun?
You're not going on the date. Do you mean your reaction to them
superficial?
If you have serious concerns, don't be superficial, but if your concerns are
just the nervous parent general kneejerk voices-in-your-head concerns, try to
back away and look at it, as with other things, in light of principles of
respect and freedom.

Whether your daughter can keep her dates superficial (? not sure what you
mean by that) and fun is going to depend in part on how much energy YOU shove
into the IMPORT of what might be just going to a movie to see the movie. Don't
make a small deal into a big deal, and don't make a budding big deal into
marriage.

Sandra


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[email protected]

In a message dated 7/21/2005 1:44:07 PM Eastern Standard Time,
SandraDodd@... writes:

>>Socialization. Not all dating is courtship, and not all dating is
leading
to marriage, but a lack of dating can lead to girls being infatuated by ANY
male attention, having had few chances for comparisons.<<
************************
That's a really good point. Also, what was said about comparing her to my
other kids. She has always been really social, funny, loves groups and
crowds. She is very different in her own unique way, I don't know why I would ever
expect her to wait to date.

>>Is it possible to keep WHAT superficial and fun?
You're not going on the date. Do you mean your reaction to them
superficial?
If you have serious concerns, don't be superficial, but if your concerns are
just the nervous parent general kneejerk voices-in-your-head concerns, try
to
back away and look at it, as with other things, in light of principles of
respect and freedom.

Whether your daughter can keep her dates superficial (? not sure what you
mean by that) <<
***************************
I meant that I hopo her dates can be fun...I guess superficial isn't the
word to use...I mean that she can date boys without getting deep into a serious
relationship with ONE boy. So that she can see different people, get to know
a lot of boys, without feeling she HAS to have a steady boyfriend. I've
noticed (at least here) that kids won't even go out on a date with someone, but
they'll right away decide they're "going" with each other...exclusively.
That really closes the door to comparing and finding out what type of person
they REALLY like to be around. But I guess that's all up to her, not me. :o)

Thanks
Nancy B.




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[email protected]

In a message dated 7/21/05 4:59:28 PM, CelticFrau@... writes:


> I meant that I hopo her dates can be fun...I guess superficial isn't the 
> word to use...I mean that she can date boys without getting deep into a
> serious 
> relationship with ONE boy.  So that she can see different people, get  to
> know
> a lot of boys, without feeling she HAS to have a steady boyfriend.   I've
> noticed (at least here) that kids won't even go out on a date with someone, 
> but
> they'll right away decide they're "going" with each  other...exclusively. 
> That really closes the door to comparing and finding  out what type of
> person
> they REALLY like to be around.  But I guess that's  all up to her, not me.
> :o)
>

It's not even up to her, oddly enough.
But it's certainly not up to the mom. <g>

I have a newish collection of stuff on falling in love, and it's here:

http://biochemicallove.blogspot.com

It's about clues to the biochemical state of love, as found in song lyrics
(it's mostly about that) and Schuyler (who reads this list, I think) has posted
some links to recent research about it too, there.

And in case you're concerned that your daughter doesn't know enough about
"the facts" or might not ask you, there's a link to a sex ed list for teens here
(and the writings from a while back on another list in response to what about
young teen boys and internet porn):

http://sandradodd.com/sex

Neither of those sites is about dating, but sometimes thoughts of dating turn
to thoughts of love or sex (or at least nervousness in the mom regarding
either or both).

Sandra


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[email protected]

In a message dated 7/21/2005 5:59:24 PM Central Standard Time,
CelticFrau@... writes:

I've
noticed (at least here) that kids won't even go out on a date with someone,
but
they'll right away decide they're "going" with each other...exclusively.



~~~

It's my experience that that stuff doesn't last very long. I've heard kids
as young as 8 say they are "going out" with so-and-so. To me, that means
going OUT like to the movies or something, but to them it means they like each
other and the call or IM until someone says something unkind or they get a
better offer.

The important thing is that my sons feel free to tell me about the girls
he's interested in (Will's only 11--not on his radar yet). And so I'm not
spreading any negative mojo or disapproval about what I hear or overhear, and I'm
going to give him every opportunity to tell me all he can about what he's
doing and where he's going.

Which brings to mind....would you let your daughter go out shopping with a
GIRL who was 16 and drives? I wouldn't, unless I knew the girl really well,
and trusted her to drive safely. Same standard would apply to any boy my
daughter wanted to date.

Karen

www.badchair.net


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[email protected]

In a message dated 7/22/2005 6:24:27 AM Eastern Standard Time,
[email protected] writes:

I meant that I hopo her dates can be fun...I guess superficial isn't the
word to use...I mean that she can date boys without getting deep into a
serious
relationship with ONE boy. So that she can see different people, get to
know
a lot of boys, without feeling she HAS to have a steady boyfriend. I've
noticed (at least here) that kids won't even go out on a date with someone,
but
they'll right away decide they're "going" with each other...exclusively.
That really closes the door to comparing and finding out what type of
person
they REALLY like to be around. But I guess that's all up to her, not me.
:o)

Thanks
Nancy B.



*********************************
Nancy,
You probably realize that most of this is more about you than her. She is
young, and you want very, very badly for her never to get hurt by those scary
boys. (In my case it would be those scary girls, as I have a son.)

Those Christian Arranged Courtships, or even better, NO courtship but
arranged marriages seem pretty appealing about now, don't they? But we know you're
not really like that, and you're going to take a deep breath, whine a little
to your friends or partner about it, then be really supportive of your
daughters leap into this next life adventure.

She might discover that she just likes to go out and keep it light. She
might fall madly in love. He might be sweet and smart and fit into your family
right off. He might be a jerk.

Sure, have her invite him over to the house if you like. Make sure he's a
legal and safe driver. But trust your daughter. She might date lots of people,
learning what's important to her in a partner. She might just date this guy,
having found her partner early, learning what she needs to do to build a
relationship with him. She might date him, and learn what a relationship looks
like, so she's better equipped for her next relationship. She may discover she
prefers to be alone. It's all unschooling -- learning from life, whatever
path she finds.

It'll be okay. For parents, as well as young adults, it IS scary. But it's
pretty cool too.

Kathryn


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

nellebelle

>>>>>>>>>>>>> I've heard kids
as young as 8 say they are "going out" with so-and-so. To me, that means
going OUT like to the movies or something, but to them it means they like each
other and the call or IM until someone says something unkind or they get a
better offer.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

My 12 yod is "going out" with a 13 yob she met about a month ago. I asked her what that meant and she said "you don't go out with anyone else". I asked what happens when you meet someone else you would like to do stuff with. She said you get their number and call them later, then tell the first person you don't want to go out anymore. So, it seems that this going out, at least at this stage in her life, is not much of a commitment. Henry is the first boy who has shown this level of interest in her. One of the things Lisa and I have discussed is that she really doesn't know him that well. As time goes by and she gets to know him better, she will either decide that she really likes spending time with him or that she doesn't, after all.

They talk on the phone alot - probably for a couple of hours every day. They have gone to the movies twice, both times in a group and in the daytime, with parents doing the driving. This boy and his friend met my dd and her friend(s) at the theater.

The two boys came to the park last week for a free outdoor concert that we were attending. They all wandered around the park talking in a group of 2 boys and 3 girls. They didn't come to where dh and I were sitting, but I walked to where they were and chatted for a bit.

This past Monday, my neighbor, Sue, was visiting. My mom and Sue's dad were both in town, so we'd all gotten together for coffee that morning. Lisa asked if I would take her and Sue's dd to the movie. I reminded her that my car was in the shop, so I couldn't, but I could take them another day after the car was fixed. Sue thought a movie sounded like a good idea and offered to take the girls.

After the coffee visit was over (and my mom left right after that too) Lisa told me that Henry and his friend Eddy (also 13) were going to meet them at the movie. She realized that she needed to tell Sue this (that it wasn't just Bailey and my dd at the movie), but hadn't wanted to say it in front of everyone who had been there for coffee. I asked if she wanted to tell Sue or wanted me to - she asked if I would. I called Sue, who didn't mind that the two boys would be there and was impressed that Lisa had wanted her to know, rather than being sneaky about it. (Sue happens to be a school teacher and a rather controlling parent. Her kids go to school. She is the one who told me that she feared Lisa was on the road to delinquency when she died her hair tips black with a red rinse over all. Her daughter, Bailey, has "agreed" with her parents to not date until she is 16, and to date responsibly once she is able. She is 11 now.)

On our way to the park Wednesday, my dd Jackie said to Lisa, "Are you going to tell her?" Lisa said, "not yet". As we were getting out of the car, Lisa told me that she and Henry held hands at the movie. I thanked her for telling me. Then she said that Bailey and Eddy had held hands too. Remember Bailey, the one who isn't going to date until 16? This was the first time that she had met Eddy in person. And, I'm told that Eddy has a girlfriend, but she has not been around during the times when I've seen the boys.

Mary Ellen

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Pam Sorooshian

On Jul 21, 2005, at 10:32 AM, CelticFrau@... wrote:

> I would seriously like to know how other "unschooling" parents handle
> dating. Do you give your kids as much freedom with making dating
> decisions as you
> do other things in their lives?

Yes.

-pam

[email protected]

-----Original Message-----
From: CelticFrau@...


I would seriously like to know how other "unschooling" parents handle

dating. Do you give your kids as much freedom with making dating
decisions as
you do other things in their lives?

-=-=-=-

Yes. Very much so.

Cameron has a girlfriend now---they've been dating for over two years.

We talk a lot. A lot.

We talk about kissing and dates and sex and parenting and children's
names and sex and in-laws and condoms and birth control pills and date
rape and sex and marriage and weddings and grandparents and
gynocologists and sex and siblings and movies and home-buying and
decorating and sex and ..... <g>

We always include the girlfriend (not just this one---former
girlfriends too) in family plans---like parties and suppers and
sometimes trips. I would certinaly not hesitate to invite this boy to
supper. That's practically routine here! I often invite the parent(s)
as well. That way they aren't afraid of *us*!

Just be open and friendly and let him know you trust him to be kind and
sweet with your daughter. Let her know she can call you *any*time if
she feels uncomfortable. Make sure she has $$ in her pocket in case she
needs it. Don't treat her like a five year old. <g>

Lord, If I'd waited to date until I was ready to get married---I may
have waited forever! <G>

Break-ups are almost inevitable. Heartbreaks are too. Part of the
dating process is to start to feel comfortable in such a role and to
make early decisions/judgments on what/who will make a good spouse.

In another time, your fifteen year old might already be married with
two children! <g>

Trust her.

~Kelly



-=-=-=-=-=-

I have an almost 15 year old daughter who wants to go out with a boy at
our
church. He's really nice, good family, but he's 16 and drives.
Should we
just invite him over here? None of my other kids were even interested
in
dating until they were much older, usually over 17 or even 18.

I would never insist on courtship...I think that's really controlling.
But
it makes sense to start dating when you're at the age you're ready to
get
married. I can see the point to it. My almost 20 year old broke up
with a
boyfriend of over a year, and he was very upset over it. It broke her
heart
because he would call up crying...she doesn't want to be with him (he
has a lot

of bad issues...long story) but she doesn't want him to hurt. She
called me
upset saying, "How do I help him not to hurt??!" Ugh...I got off the
phone
and cried myself.

What decisions have you come to with your kids over dating? Is it
possible
to keep it very "light" (superficial, fun) without bumping heads with
your
kids?