Potty Training Advice Needed
Heather
Hi all, I know this is perhaps a bit off-topic from Unschooling but
was hoping that perhaps since lots of you have older kids and
experience, perhaps you could help me with this. I am having trouble
potty training my 3 1/2 yr old son. We've been working on it off and
on since he turned three (and some before then, but he wasn't ever
dry through the night untill then and so we didn't push it too much
and we also moved cross country in February and had read that you
shouldn't try when there is a big life change like that). We read
all the books (picture books about potty training like "Once Upon A
Potty etc), I have two Video's about Potty Training that he likes to
watch (was hoping Elmo would get him excited enough to learn! Since
Elmo is his favorite! No dice!)I put him in cloth training pants
every few days to 'try again' but he and I both end up frustrated
when he ends up wetting/messing his pants and just go back to
diapers or pull-ups. Have read a bit about letting him go about w/
no pants on at all, but it's pretty cold and don't know if he'd get
too cold? Not sure what to do. His sister is about to turn two the
end of this month(and is just getting verbal enough to start
thinking of training perhaps) and I am thinking perhaps I'll try and
train them at the same time so maybe he'll be more interested in it
if it's a group activity...? I am frustrated and feeling like a bit
of a failure. Like, if I can't even teach him to use the toilet, how
will I EVER teach him to read, write, etc etc etc... He's a bright
little boy in other areas and he likes to sit on the toilet, but
just to 'pretend' and practice 'wiping'(he's observed his Dad and I
going to the bathroom as we've read that is a good idea for him to
see so he knows 'what to do')... But as for him actually going in
the toilet, NO SUCCESS at all...?? I've also, untill lately, been a
bit on te side of 'he'll get it when he gets it' but am starting to
worry that he'll never want to! Has anyone else had a 'late bloomer'
in toileting and advice on what they did? As I've posted before too,
he's somewhat speech delayed and has only, in the last month or two,
been using the 'potty training jargon' from the books I've been
reading him. Any help or advice would be GREAT!!
Thanks in advance,
Smiles,
Heather
was hoping that perhaps since lots of you have older kids and
experience, perhaps you could help me with this. I am having trouble
potty training my 3 1/2 yr old son. We've been working on it off and
on since he turned three (and some before then, but he wasn't ever
dry through the night untill then and so we didn't push it too much
and we also moved cross country in February and had read that you
shouldn't try when there is a big life change like that). We read
all the books (picture books about potty training like "Once Upon A
Potty etc), I have two Video's about Potty Training that he likes to
watch (was hoping Elmo would get him excited enough to learn! Since
Elmo is his favorite! No dice!)I put him in cloth training pants
every few days to 'try again' but he and I both end up frustrated
when he ends up wetting/messing his pants and just go back to
diapers or pull-ups. Have read a bit about letting him go about w/
no pants on at all, but it's pretty cold and don't know if he'd get
too cold? Not sure what to do. His sister is about to turn two the
end of this month(and is just getting verbal enough to start
thinking of training perhaps) and I am thinking perhaps I'll try and
train them at the same time so maybe he'll be more interested in it
if it's a group activity...? I am frustrated and feeling like a bit
of a failure. Like, if I can't even teach him to use the toilet, how
will I EVER teach him to read, write, etc etc etc... He's a bright
little boy in other areas and he likes to sit on the toilet, but
just to 'pretend' and practice 'wiping'(he's observed his Dad and I
going to the bathroom as we've read that is a good idea for him to
see so he knows 'what to do')... But as for him actually going in
the toilet, NO SUCCESS at all...?? I've also, untill lately, been a
bit on te side of 'he'll get it when he gets it' but am starting to
worry that he'll never want to! Has anyone else had a 'late bloomer'
in toileting and advice on what they did? As I've posted before too,
he's somewhat speech delayed and has only, in the last month or two,
been using the 'potty training jargon' from the books I've been
reading him. Any help or advice would be GREAT!!
Thanks in advance,
Smiles,
Heather
Heather
Hi Heather,
I suggest using diapers or pullups and forget about potty training for
awhile. My son wasn't interested at that age either. We tried to insist
and he ended up proving to us that he was in control by not pooping at all &
ended up constipated. A very painful situation for all of us. So we put
the diapers back on. And waited. He was in a mothers day out program a
couple mornings a week at the time and over Christmas break, they told me he
couldn't come back unless he was potty trained. He was 4 yrs old by then.
So I told him that. And it was his choice, whether he wanted to continue at
the MDO program. He basically potty-trained himself over the holiday break.
My younger daughter trained herself about the time she was 3. She surprised
us! We weren't even thinking about it, since we'd been so stressed out
about my son's experience.
sincerely,
another Heather
tucson
I suggest using diapers or pullups and forget about potty training for
awhile. My son wasn't interested at that age either. We tried to insist
and he ended up proving to us that he was in control by not pooping at all &
ended up constipated. A very painful situation for all of us. So we put
the diapers back on. And waited. He was in a mothers day out program a
couple mornings a week at the time and over Christmas break, they told me he
couldn't come back unless he was potty trained. He was 4 yrs old by then.
So I told him that. And it was his choice, whether he wanted to continue at
the MDO program. He basically potty-trained himself over the holiday break.
My younger daughter trained herself about the time she was 3. She surprised
us! We weren't even thinking about it, since we'd been so stressed out
about my son's experience.
sincerely,
another Heather
tucson
On 12/3/06, Heather <johevili72@...> wrote:
>
> Hi all, I know this is perhaps a bit off-topic from Unschooling but
> was hoping that perhaps since lots of you have older kids and
> experience, perhaps you could help me with this. I am having trouble
> potty training my 3 1/2 yr old son. We've been working on it off and
> on since he turned three (and some before then, but he wasn't ever
> dry through the night untill then and so we didn't push it too much
> and we also moved cross country in February and had read that you
> shouldn't try when there is a big life change like that). We read
> all the books (picture books about potty training like "Once Upon A
> Potty etc), I have two Video's about Potty Training that he likes to
> watch (was hoping Elmo would get him excited enough to learn! Since
> Elmo is his favorite! No dice!)I put him in cloth training pants
> every few days to 'try again' but he and I both end up frustrated
> when he ends up wetting/messing his pants and just go back to
> diapers or pull-ups. Have read a bit about letting him go about w/
> no pants on at all, but it's pretty cold and don't know if he'd get
> too cold? Not sure what to do. His sister is about to turn two the
> end of this month(and is just getting verbal enough to start
> thinking of training perhaps) and I am thinking perhaps I'll try and
> train them at the same time so maybe he'll be more interested in it
> if it's a group activity...? I am frustrated and feeling like a bit
> of a failure. Like, if I can't even teach him to use the toilet, how
> will I EVER teach him to read, write, etc etc etc... He's a bright
> little boy in other areas and he likes to sit on the toilet, but
> just to 'pretend' and practice 'wiping'(he's observed his Dad and I
> going to the bathroom as we've read that is a good idea for him to
> see so he knows 'what to do')... But as for him actually going in
> the toilet, NO SUCCESS at all...?? I've also, untill lately, been a
> bit on te side of 'he'll get it when he gets it' but am starting to
> worry that he'll never want to! Has anyone else had a 'late bloomer'
> in toileting and advice on what they did? As I've posted before too,
> he's somewhat speech delayed and has only, in the last month or two,
> been using the 'potty training jargon' from the books I've been
> reading him. Any help or advice would be GREAT!!
>
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Ren Allen
~~I am frustrated and feeling like a bit
of a failure. Like, if I can't even teach him to use the toilet, how
will I EVER teach him to read, write, etc etc etc... ~~
You won't. Nobody will. He'll learn those things when they're
meaningful for HIM and no sooner. The faster you can accept his own
learning as the most important factor, the faster you'll begin to
understand unschooling.
You can keep on "teaching" him to use the toilet and eventually he'll
get it (possibly with more stress on both your parts than necessary)
but he'll get it because he's READY to get it, not because you taught him.
Instead of focusing on it so much, just embrace exactly where he's at
right now and enjoy this time. He'll figure out how to use a toilet,
he'll figure out how to read, he'll figure out things you wouldn't
even dream of teaching him...IF you can learn to trust.
Teaching is irrelevant. Learning is everything. Trust that he needs to
do things in his own time, in his own way and simply be there for him,
supporting his own efforts. Earlier isn't better. Early potty
training, early reading early ANYTHING is no better than "late". When
he's 20 years old, you honestly won't be able to tell when he learned
any of those things. What matters more is that he'll have happy,
joyful memories of a mother that was peacefully travelling the path
with him, not pushing him to learn things.
Ren
learninginfreedom.com
of a failure. Like, if I can't even teach him to use the toilet, how
will I EVER teach him to read, write, etc etc etc... ~~
You won't. Nobody will. He'll learn those things when they're
meaningful for HIM and no sooner. The faster you can accept his own
learning as the most important factor, the faster you'll begin to
understand unschooling.
You can keep on "teaching" him to use the toilet and eventually he'll
get it (possibly with more stress on both your parts than necessary)
but he'll get it because he's READY to get it, not because you taught him.
Instead of focusing on it so much, just embrace exactly where he's at
right now and enjoy this time. He'll figure out how to use a toilet,
he'll figure out how to read, he'll figure out things you wouldn't
even dream of teaching him...IF you can learn to trust.
Teaching is irrelevant. Learning is everything. Trust that he needs to
do things in his own time, in his own way and simply be there for him,
supporting his own efforts. Earlier isn't better. Early potty
training, early reading early ANYTHING is no better than "late". When
he's 20 years old, you honestly won't be able to tell when he learned
any of those things. What matters more is that he'll have happy,
joyful memories of a mother that was peacefully travelling the path
with him, not pushing him to learn things.
Ren
learninginfreedom.com
Heather
> You won't. Nobody will. He'll learn those things when they'reThank you for that. I, as you've likely noticed, manage to get
> meaningful for HIM and no sooner. The faster you can accept his own
> learning as the most important factor, the faster you'll begin to
> understand unschooling.
>
myself worked into a lather about things too often... I realized
today (after getting my 'monthly friend') that likely my nagging
worries about this and other things have been hormone induced. I've
been working with my son on Potty Training and not having much
success and the more books I read about it, most of them refering
to '2 and SOMETIMES 3 year olds' gets me to thinking "Oh my
goodness! He's three and a 1/2! I HAVE TO GET IT DONE!!!" When, in
my calmer moments, I am more of a 'he has his own timing and will
learn when it's important to him'. He is interested in the potty
training books and likes to hear the stories, so I'll continue to
read them to him and just TRUST that he'll 'get it' when he decides
the time is right... Thanks again.
Smiles,
Heather
Heather
Heather,
Thanks! I've heard from a few people about older children (three and
four yr olds) doing just that, deciding to start using the toilet
and then doing so... But since my son hasn't yet and is somewhat
resistant to the whole thing, I started getting myself all worked
up... I guess I should just calm down about the whole deal and trust
him to know his own timing. He's very into his ABC's and numbers
right now, learning all the time on that score... He points out
letter/numbers whenever he see's them and says "What's that?" for
every letter and never tires of talking about them... So I guess
he's just got 'other things on his mind' and potty training isn't
one of them right now. I am new to the unschooling ideas and was
such a 'schooled' person that it's hard to get the ideas to 'stick'
(here I am getting myself worked up about my son's not being potty
trained when, even when I want to, I can't seem to get 'unschool
trained'! LOL!) I am trying to relax and embrace the 'live love
learn' ideas as I do so love the harmonious feelings they inspire in
me and want them for my family. Please be patient with me everyone,
I am trying! :)
Smiles and Peace,
Heather
Thanks! I've heard from a few people about older children (three and
four yr olds) doing just that, deciding to start using the toilet
and then doing so... But since my son hasn't yet and is somewhat
resistant to the whole thing, I started getting myself all worked
up... I guess I should just calm down about the whole deal and trust
him to know his own timing. He's very into his ABC's and numbers
right now, learning all the time on that score... He points out
letter/numbers whenever he see's them and says "What's that?" for
every letter and never tires of talking about them... So I guess
he's just got 'other things on his mind' and potty training isn't
one of them right now. I am new to the unschooling ideas and was
such a 'schooled' person that it's hard to get the ideas to 'stick'
(here I am getting myself worked up about my son's not being potty
trained when, even when I want to, I can't seem to get 'unschool
trained'! LOL!) I am trying to relax and embrace the 'live love
learn' ideas as I do so love the harmonious feelings they inspire in
me and want them for my family. Please be patient with me everyone,
I am trying! :)
Smiles and Peace,
Heather
alisonslp
If he is willing to try it, not resisting, I'd let him go bare bottom
with a long t-shirt. (maybe even a sweatshirt). Keep the thermastat up
a couple degrees. If he's being resistant to it, obviously it's better
to wait.
My kids all learned very early. day and night dry and independent
(except wiping) by 25mths. People think I pushed them but I didn't. No
punishment, rewards, stress. I just stopped using diapers, let them
roam bare bottom and helped them become aware of their bodies. It's
all about opportunities, just like everything else. Helping them to
become aware. I had a language delayed boy as well (go figure, a
speech therapist with a language delayed child! LOL), but we used
signing, which helped a lot. Personally, I think it's much easier for
younger toddlers to ease into toileting. Their interests are less
diverse than older toddlers and they tend to be much more cooperative
(haven't hit the autonomy stage yet).
I'd go for it with your dd. Girls tend to learn quicker and at younger
ages and she may be the motivation for your son.
alison
with a long t-shirt. (maybe even a sweatshirt). Keep the thermastat up
a couple degrees. If he's being resistant to it, obviously it's better
to wait.
My kids all learned very early. day and night dry and independent
(except wiping) by 25mths. People think I pushed them but I didn't. No
punishment, rewards, stress. I just stopped using diapers, let them
roam bare bottom and helped them become aware of their bodies. It's
all about opportunities, just like everything else. Helping them to
become aware. I had a language delayed boy as well (go figure, a
speech therapist with a language delayed child! LOL), but we used
signing, which helped a lot. Personally, I think it's much easier for
younger toddlers to ease into toileting. Their interests are less
diverse than older toddlers and they tend to be much more cooperative
(haven't hit the autonomy stage yet).
I'd go for it with your dd. Girls tend to learn quicker and at younger
ages and she may be the motivation for your son.
alison
wuweimama
Per a quick search on the internet, I found that the most common
source of inability to control the bladder to be related to allergies.
Evidently, 50% of children who eliminated cow dairy became more
toileting abled. The other most allergenic foods were chocolate, eggs,
citrus fruits, and wheat.
I saw that bed wetting (enuresis) is highly hereditary. If both
parents had issues, than 77% of their children have issues with
inability to control the bladder. If only one parent, than 44% of
children had issues.
Apparently 20% of 5 year olds are not fully toileting. 14% of 7 year
olds are not; 4% of 12 year olds; and 1-2% of 15 year olds are not
fully toileting. Nighttime control is most difficult, especially for
boys and for those who sleep deeply. Avoiding liquids after 6pm
appears to help.
Indication for medical intervention is not typically recommended until
age 6 or 7. However most children who are not toileting independently
at 6, won't be at 7. Most concerns about toileting accidents were
related to urinary tract infections, diabetes and neurological issues.
Our son decided to use the toilet consistently around his 5th
birthday. He had no apparent physical reason, but had refused interest
in toileting. He prefered diapers. He was totally aware when he needed
to go. We had tried softer, smaller toilet seats for comfort, the 'wet
sensation training diapers', several different potty chairs, kept the
chairs nearby, encouraged when visible signs of voiding, etc.
Apparently, he was more comfortable standing to deficate, and too busy
to stop to void. I was fully comfortable that he would use the toilet
when he was ready and developmentally able. And he no longer needed
diapers at night at the same point. I believe it had to do with a
desire for complete autonomy in toileting.
HTH, Pat
source of inability to control the bladder to be related to allergies.
Evidently, 50% of children who eliminated cow dairy became more
toileting abled. The other most allergenic foods were chocolate, eggs,
citrus fruits, and wheat.
I saw that bed wetting (enuresis) is highly hereditary. If both
parents had issues, than 77% of their children have issues with
inability to control the bladder. If only one parent, than 44% of
children had issues.
Apparently 20% of 5 year olds are not fully toileting. 14% of 7 year
olds are not; 4% of 12 year olds; and 1-2% of 15 year olds are not
fully toileting. Nighttime control is most difficult, especially for
boys and for those who sleep deeply. Avoiding liquids after 6pm
appears to help.
Indication for medical intervention is not typically recommended until
age 6 or 7. However most children who are not toileting independently
at 6, won't be at 7. Most concerns about toileting accidents were
related to urinary tract infections, diabetes and neurological issues.
Our son decided to use the toilet consistently around his 5th
birthday. He had no apparent physical reason, but had refused interest
in toileting. He prefered diapers. He was totally aware when he needed
to go. We had tried softer, smaller toilet seats for comfort, the 'wet
sensation training diapers', several different potty chairs, kept the
chairs nearby, encouraged when visible signs of voiding, etc.
Apparently, he was more comfortable standing to deficate, and too busy
to stop to void. I was fully comfortable that he would use the toilet
when he was ready and developmentally able. And he no longer needed
diapers at night at the same point. I believe it had to do with a
desire for complete autonomy in toileting.
HTH, Pat
trektheory
Although my son wasn't a late bloomer in this, if you go by what the
books say, I did everything wrong. I suspect that, when they are
ready, they are ready. Has he asked to stop using diapers? If not,
don't worry.
I'm fairly confident that he will not be going to college in diapers!
Oh -- one thing, I don't think you should use the pull-ups that they
sell. They mask the feedback, so there is no signal that he is going,
really.
When we started, it was winter, too. First time in underpants, my son
pretty much finished the job before he got to the bathroom. (Total
shock, I think!) Second time he stopped about half-way -- still a lot
to clean up, but more in the toilet. Next time he barely got wet.
The problem we had was with #2. Quirky kid -- he was fine if he was
bottomless, but if he was wearing pants, didn't want to stop what he
was doing to get undressed. (Or some such -- I don't know, really,
what his internal thought process was!) However, it was generally
VERY apparent that he was about to have a bm, so I learned to quickly
pull down the pants (gotta love elastic waists!), and then he was fine
about using the appropriate recepticle.
Also, my son wasn't too big on the potty chair, and generally used the
toilet -- backwards most often. Feel free to wait, experiment, etc.
My son is almost 15, and, despite my doing almost everything
differently than the books say to do, he seems fairly well adjusted!
Linda
--- In [email protected], "Heather" <johevili72@...>
wrote:
books say, I did everything wrong. I suspect that, when they are
ready, they are ready. Has he asked to stop using diapers? If not,
don't worry.
I'm fairly confident that he will not be going to college in diapers!
Oh -- one thing, I don't think you should use the pull-ups that they
sell. They mask the feedback, so there is no signal that he is going,
really.
When we started, it was winter, too. First time in underpants, my son
pretty much finished the job before he got to the bathroom. (Total
shock, I think!) Second time he stopped about half-way -- still a lot
to clean up, but more in the toilet. Next time he barely got wet.
The problem we had was with #2. Quirky kid -- he was fine if he was
bottomless, but if he was wearing pants, didn't want to stop what he
was doing to get undressed. (Or some such -- I don't know, really,
what his internal thought process was!) However, it was generally
VERY apparent that he was about to have a bm, so I learned to quickly
pull down the pants (gotta love elastic waists!), and then he was fine
about using the appropriate recepticle.
Also, my son wasn't too big on the potty chair, and generally used the
toilet -- backwards most often. Feel free to wait, experiment, etc.
My son is almost 15, and, despite my doing almost everything
differently than the books say to do, he seems fairly well adjusted!
Linda
--- In [email protected], "Heather" <johevili72@...>
wrote:
>
> Hi all, I know this is perhaps a bit off-topic from Unschooling but
> was hoping that perhaps since lots of you have older kids and
> experience, perhaps you could help me with this. I am having trouble
> potty training my 3 1/2 yr old son. We've been working on it off and
> on since he turned three (and some before then, but he wasn't ever
> dry through the night untill then and so we didn't push it too much
> and we also moved cross country in February and had read that you
> shouldn't try when there is a big life change like that). We read
> all the books (picture books about potty training like "Once Upon A
> Potty etc), I have two Video's about Potty Training that he likes to
> watch (was hoping Elmo would get him excited enough to learn! Since
> Elmo is his favorite! No dice!)I put him in cloth training pants
> every few days to 'try again' but he and I both end up frustrated
> when he ends up wetting/messing his pants and just go back to
> diapers or pull-ups. Have read a bit about letting him go about w/
> no pants on at all, but it's pretty cold and don't know if he'd get
> too cold? Not sure what to do. His sister is about to turn two the
> end of this month(and is just getting verbal enough to start
> thinking of training perhaps) and I am thinking perhaps I'll try and
> train them at the same time so maybe he'll be more interested in it
> if it's a group activity...? I am frustrated and feeling like a bit
> of a failure. Like, if I can't even teach him to use the toilet, how
> will I EVER teach him to read, write, etc etc etc... He's a bright
> little boy in other areas and he likes to sit on the toilet, but
> just to 'pretend' and practice 'wiping'(he's observed his Dad and I
> going to the bathroom as we've read that is a good idea for him to
> see so he knows 'what to do')... But as for him actually going in
> the toilet, NO SUCCESS at all...?? I've also, untill lately, been a
> bit on te side of 'he'll get it when he gets it' but am starting to
> worry that he'll never want to! Has anyone else had a 'late bloomer'
> in toileting and advice on what they did? As I've posted before too,
> he's somewhat speech delayed and has only, in the last month or two,
> been using the 'potty training jargon' from the books I've been
> reading him. Any help or advice would be GREAT!!
> Thanks in advance,
> Smiles,
> Heather
>
Michelle Leifur Reid
On 12/3/06, Heather <johevili72@...> wrote:
back in diapers and when he is ready it will happen. I'll ask you
this question, Do you know *any* adults with no limitations who are
not potty trained? My son was over 4 before he was ready to go the
day without diapers and he was over 5 before he was going through the
night without diapers. We tried several times to get him toilet
learned but he just wasn't ready. I had a choice (and so do you) put
him in underwear and continue to be frustrated and angry because he
isn't "learning" or put him in diapers and give him a bit more time.
He's still *little* He's *only 3.
Michelle
> I am frustrated and feeling like a bitWhich should be a screaming message that he isn't read yet. Put him
> of a failure. Like, if I can't even teach him to use the toilet, how
> will I EVER teach him to read, write, etc etc etc... He's a bright
> little boy in other areas and he likes to sit on the toilet, but
> just to 'pretend' and practice 'wiping'(he's observed his Dad and I
> going to the bathroom as we've read that is a good idea for him to
> see so he knows 'what to do')... But as for him actually going in
> the toilet, NO SUCCESS at all...??
back in diapers and when he is ready it will happen. I'll ask you
this question, Do you know *any* adults with no limitations who are
not potty trained? My son was over 4 before he was ready to go the
day without diapers and he was over 5 before he was going through the
night without diapers. We tried several times to get him toilet
learned but he just wasn't ready. I had a choice (and so do you) put
him in underwear and continue to be frustrated and angry because he
isn't "learning" or put him in diapers and give him a bit more time.
He's still *little* He's *only 3.
Michelle
Heather
give him a bit more time.
the 'timing' thing out of my head... you know, expectations based on
his 'age' and whatnot... Seems everything you read in the books
on 'how to potty train' talk about 2-3 yr olds and it give you a
complex if you let it... I think I just need to throw out the
parenting manuals and rely MUCH MORE on my gut instincts and the
signals my kids give me... It would allow for much more peace in my
household and in my mind... and thiers too, I am sure...
Reformed from Expectations based on 'cookie cutter kids manuals' (or
trying to be!)
Heather
> He's still *little* He's *only 3.Amen! I've decided to! Thanks for your story... I just need to get
>
> Michelle,
the 'timing' thing out of my head... you know, expectations based on
his 'age' and whatnot... Seems everything you read in the books
on 'how to potty train' talk about 2-3 yr olds and it give you a
complex if you let it... I think I just need to throw out the
parenting manuals and rely MUCH MORE on my gut instincts and the
signals my kids give me... It would allow for much more peace in my
household and in my mind... and thiers too, I am sure...
Reformed from Expectations based on 'cookie cutter kids manuals' (or
trying to be!)
Heather