KT

>
>
>I have two kids that went through drivers ed in NM. Neither of them
>took a single note! They passed the class and their tests, both
>written and behind the wheel with no problem.
>

I made a bet with my son Jake, 16 at the time, that he could walk into
the driver's testing center and take the test and pass it without ever
having read the book.

I knew he was a good tester, like I was. I knew he had been driven
around all his life and paid attention and learned a lot by osmosis, and
had common sense. I was trying to teach him about unschooling.

He passed. Only missed about 3 questions.

His brother, 14 at the time, did the same thing about 3 months later.
(In Arkansas you can get your learner's permit at 14.)

Okay, now think about that. I had to teach both of my teenage sons how
to drive during the same 6 month period. = : O

I learned that there is a physiological difference between the abilities
of 14 yo and a 16 yo drivers! But I was comforted that my 14 yo had two
whole years to practice before he could drive alone. Under the law at
the time, my 16 yo only got 6 months!

Tuck, glad to have survived...

[email protected]

Do insurance companies accept Driver's Education with homeschooled/unschooled
kids? I know my insurance company gives a discount for teens that have taken
Driver's Education and they send the school a form to fill out to verify that
their requirements have been met. What if they aren't in public school? Has
anyone gone through this?

--
**Belinda**


---------------------- Original Message: ---------------------
From: b.newbold@...
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [AlwaysLearning] Helping the other kids pick up
Date: Wed, 18 Jun 2008 23:39:01 +0000

> The first 3 answers that you gave would have been appropriate in my opinion,
> but the last one - do nothing - is not. But, that's just my opinion. If it
> were MY house and the visitor did not help tidy up the room they would not be
> invited back.
>
> --
> **Belinda**
>
>
> ---------------------- Original Message: ---------------------
> From: Jennifer <beanmommy2@...>
> To: [email protected]
> Subject: [AlwaysLearning] Helping the other kids pick up
> Date: Wed, 18 Jun 2008 20:39:44 +0000
>
> > Today we were all at a friend's house for a couple
> > hours. My two daughters are seven and five, and their
> > friend is six.
> >
> > When it was time for us to leave, the friend's family
> > was getting ready to go run some errands, and her mom
> > asked her to tidy up her room a little (where all the
> > girls had been playing earlier.)
> >
> > The friend asked my daughters if they would help her
> > tidy up. My seven year old said yes and went in the
> > room with her. My five year old simply said no and
> > continued playing.
> >
> > I didn't interfere.
> >
> > But I'm wondering ... should I have done anything?
> >
> > For example, tell her that she should help also, as
> > they were also using the stuff together?
> >
> > Should I have maybe said to her, "Here, let's you and
> > I go help them together?"
> >
> > Should I have told her it's not nice to go to someone
> > else's house and use their stuff, but then not help
> > put it away?
> >
> > Or was it not a big deal that she didn't help?
> >
> > Thanks
> > Jenny
> >
> >
> >
> > http://beanmommyandthethreebeans.blogspot.com/
> >
> >
> >
> >

Sandra Dodd

-=-Do insurance companies accept Driver's Education with homeschooled/
unschooled
kids?-=-

You can't "homeschool" driver's ed, as far as I know, though there
are some online schools that are legal in some places.

My kids all went to drivers' ed. Some towns might not have it
outside of school. I took it in school myself, but Albuquerque has
always depended on commercial schools (there are several here) and
I've heard it's not offered in school. So in that case, my kids were
just like all the other kids, only they really liked the classes!



Sandra

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[email protected]

In a message dated 6/18/2008 7:57:46 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
Sandra@... writes:

<<<You can't "homeschool" driver's ed, as far as I know, though there
are some online schools that are legal in some places.>>>



In Ohio, people under 18 years old are required to have a driver's education
course, over 18 they don't. At 18 you can just go in and take the tests and
if you pass, you're licensed. I would call the licence bureau myself and ask,
if it were me-they should know one way or the other if classes are required
and if there is an age stipulation to the class.

Peace,
De



**************Gas prices getting you down? Search AOL Autos for
fuel-efficient used cars. (http://autos.aol.com/used?ncid=aolaut00050000000007)


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

emmy

this reminds me of my nephew came to stay with us from the islands
(samoa) and had never had a license. at the time he was 18, graduated,
never attended any drivers ed, nor had really drove (and quite
immature-see below LOL). he was able to just go in and take the tests. i
had gotten him a manual but he didn't really study it nor take it
seriously. eventually he went with someone else and actually got his
license-easy as pie. we live in florida btw.

i was completely surprised (and somewhat scared LOL) that it was so easy
for him. i think more so since he even had an accident before having a
DL-not to mention while going around the block in my husbands car
without our knowledge and leaving the scene. (he ran into a parked car-
while turning the corner too fast the speaker fell over in the backseat
-he had just partially installed it and so he actually turned/reached
around to get it-yes while turning fast and the music blarring!)

he got a ticket (i got a headache LOL) and yet since it was his first
offense he simply paid a fine, passed the tests and got his DL easy as
pie.

in florida, as i understand it if your under 18 you must take an *- its
actually called Traffic Law and Substance Abuse Education (it can be
online) to get a *learners permit. Drivers training (in the car) is
optional.

it states you can be 14 1/2.

emmy
www.emmytofa.com




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Sandra Dodd

-=-in florida, as i understand it if your under 18 you must take an
*- its
actually called Traffic Law and Substance Abuse Education (it can be
online) to get a *learners permit. Drivers training (in the car) is
optional.

-=-it states you can be 14 1/2.-=-



What about insurance, though? If there's a discount on the insurance
when one has taken driver's ed, what's required there?

Sandra

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Aar

dear friends,

i am wondering what to do and how to handle the situation where the guests' child/ren do small kicks and use bad words while playing casually.  though we dont use such words, our children see these words and actions fascinating (!) sometimes.  they even started calling us in diff names and pat in our heads like actions. this phase goes on and on for sometime.
i would like to know how to stop our kids doing unacceptable things.  please help.

thanks,
aar

--- On Thu, 19/6/08, emmy <foundthings@...> wrote:
From: emmy <foundthings@...>
Subject: Re: [AlwaysLearning] Driver's Ed
To: [email protected]
Date: Thursday, 19 June, 2008, 11:36 AM











this reminds me of my nephew came to stay with us from the islands

(samoa) and had never had a license. at the time he was 18, graduated,

never attended any drivers ed, nor had really drove (and quite

immature-see below LOL). he was able to just go in and take the tests. i

had gotten him a manual but he didn't really study it nor take it

seriously. eventually he went with someone else and actually got his

license-easy as pie. we live in florida btw.



i was completely surprised (and somewhat scared LOL) that it was so easy

for him. i think more so since he even had an accident before having a

DL-not to mention while going around the block in my husbands car

without our knowledge and leaving the scene. (he ran into a parked car-

while turning the corner too fast the speaker fell over in the backseat

-he had just partially installed it and so he actually turned/reached

around to get it-yes while turning fast and the music blarring!)



he got a ticket (i got a headache LOL) and yet since it was his first

offense he simply paid a fine, passed the tests and got his DL easy as

pie.



in florida, as i understand it if your under 18 you must take an *- its

actually called Traffic Law and Substance Abuse Education (it can be

online) to get a *learners permit. Drivers training (in the car) is

optional.



it states you can be 14 1/2.



emmy

www.emmytofa. com



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



























Bring your gang together. Do your thing. Find your favourite Yahoo! group at http://in.promos.yahoo.com/groups/

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Sandra Dodd

-=-In Ohio, people under 18 years old are required to have a driver's
education
course, over 18 they don't. At 18 you can just go in and take the
tests and
if you pass, you're licensed.-=-

Yes. But even at 18, insurance will be less for someone who had
driver's ed. My boys' insurance will be high until they're 25, but
it would be even more without driver's ed.



Sandra






[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Sandra Dodd

-=-i am wondering what to do and how to handle the situation where
the guests' child/ren do small kicks and use bad words while playing
casually. though we dont use such words, our children see these
words and actions fascinating (!) sometimes. they even started
calling us in diff names and pat in our heads like actions. this
phase goes on and on for sometime.
i would like to know how to stop our kids doing unacceptable things.
please help.-=-



You can't totally stop it, but if you talk to them casually and
calmly about why it concerns you, they can make a more informed
decision.

If it's really bad, maybe you could tell your kids that if they're
going to behave badly after guests leave, you might just want to stop
having guests.

But I don't think that's the way to go.

If you can address it with humor, that might be best.

Sandra

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Vicki Dennis

On Wed, Jun 18, 2008 at 6:57 PM, Sandra Dodd <Sandra@...> wrote:

> -=-Do insurance companies accept Driver's Education with homeschooled/
> unschooled
> kids?-=-
>
> You can't "homeschool" driver's ed, as far as I know, though there
> are some online schools that are legal in some places.
>










Texas has recognized parent taught driver's ed which is utilized by
students of varying types of schools. Teen drivers cannot be issued a
license (including getting a "learners' permit) without taking both
classroom and behind the wheel training. The state recognizes particular
commercial curriculum which can be taught by parents or one can buy a text
and instructors guide/notebook from the state. The certificate to be
filed with your auto insurance company for the discount (substantial even
for girls but for unmarried males under 25 even more) is issued by the state
and looks the same for all schools. (Don't lose it, if you change insurance
companies the new one may wish to make another copy! Maybe not in today's
world of easy info sharing.)

I did a commercial program (several hundred dollars even in 1994) with one
son and the $20 parent taught program with the other. I had to buy an
approved student text but got that used and discounted from another
homeschooler. Both got the same insurance discount until aging out.
Neither had to take the driving portion of the test at the DPS where a
trooper rides with the driver. The school administrator; whether the
school be a commercial entity, or taught through a government school, or
parent taught ; certifies that the student has "passed" all areas of the
driving test. My opinion is that provision is abused far less by parents
than by commercial schools. I have heard of plenty of parents whose
decision was driven by the desire to "know" that their child was getting
lots of behind the wheel experience and was competent before being issued a
"full" license.

Short version: Texas has a parent taught driver's ed; I thought other states
(Illinois? Oklahoma?) did also.

vicki


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

elwazani

--- In [email protected], Sandra Dodd <Sandra@...> wrote:
>
> -=-Do insurance companies accept Driver's Education with
homeschooled/
> unschooled
> kids?-=-
>
> You can't "homeschool" driver's ed, as far as I know, though there
> are some online schools that are legal in some places.
>
>
> I've heard it's not offered in school. So in that case, my kids
were
> just like all the other kids, only they really liked the classes!
>
>
>
> Sandra

It varies by state...In Ohio , if you're under eighteen you have
to take the course...can not homeschool it and it is not offered in
our local schools...Beverly

cathyandgarth

--- In [email protected], Sandra Dodd <Sandra@...> wrote:
>
> If you can address it with humor, that might be best.
>

We always did this as well as simply not giving it a big response.
When my oldest started name calling at first we responded all
apalled, "don't do that, it hurts people's feelings, its nice" etc.
So, as the typical child scientist, he amped it up: what does it look
like when you hurt someone's feelings?! How far can you go with the
name calling before something happens?!

So we abandoned the reasonable conversation and just joined in, but
with more made up silly names. He would call DH or I a "stupid butt
head" and we would respond with something like: "oh yeah, well you
are a green brocoli head" and then he would say something like "NO --
you are a rat nose person" -- and then it would get really crazy as
we all tried to come up with wilder combinations. (Captain
Underpants book about Professor Poopypants is a very funny spin on
the crazy names game.)

We also informed him of how there is kind of a time and a place for
everything. But in the end, I think that kids often have to learn
the hard way that calling names doesn't go over well with friends or
siblings -- ie they called someone a name, the person cried, said
they didn't want to be their friend anymore; or they were called a
name, it made them cry, and then they had a chance to understand it
from an inside perspective.

I've mediated a lot of name calling arguments, it seems like it is a
part of every child's journey. And I always try to remember that
even as an adult there are times that _I_ want to call someone a
name, at some point along the way I learned how to hold my tongue and
I am sure that my children will too.


The original poster asked about unacceptable behaviour -- was it just
name calling or was there a *bad* words element to the question?

And the kicking? Is someone getting hurt or is it just pretending?
I mean, in general, we try to use a *people need to feel safe in our
home* guiding principle -- but if the kids are play fighting, it is
just what it is, playing (and someone may get hurt but there was no
intention to cause injury). But if they are using kicking to hurt
someone they are mad at I just try to help them find a less injurious
way to solve the problem. This is another time when I try to really
sink into my memories of being a child -- remembering how it felt to
be so mad or frustrated that I *had* to lash out, that feeling of
energy charging down my arm, knowing that I wasn't going to solve the
problem but not caring because in the moment I was my emotions. This
allows me to empathize with both parties in a *fight* -- I don't want
anyone to get hurt, and I understand how hard it is in the moment to
keep it together enough to "use your words." Being available before
that moment occurs is good, key really -- guess that is all part of
being present -- when I feel the tension rising I can casually ask if
there is anything I can help with and that alone can go a long way to
averting the use of physical force.

Cathy

wisdomalways5

I would discuss with them why it is you do not want them to use certain
words or do certain actions- you may want to look at what they are doing
and see if it is really a hurtful problem or not because sometimes if
you make it something "they" can not say it becomes MORE interesting not
less-

Julie

www.the-life-of-fun.blogspot.com
<http://www.the-life-of-fun.blogspot.com>






--- In [email protected], Aar <nrama75@...> wrote:
>
> dear friends,
>
> i am wondering what to do and how to handle the situation where the
guests' child/ren do small kicks and use bad words while playing
casually. though we dont use such words, our children see these
words and actions fascinating (!) sometimes. they even started
calling us in diff names and pat in our heads like actions. this phase
goes on and on for sometime.
> i would like to know how to stop our kids doing unacceptable
things. please help.
>
> thanks,
> aar
>
> --- On Thu, 19/6/08, emmy foundthings@... wrote:
> From: emmy foundthings@...
> Subject: Re: [AlwaysLearning] Driver's Ed
> To: [email protected]
> Date: Thursday, 19 June, 2008, 11:36 AM
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> this reminds me of my nephew came to stay with us from the islands
>
> (samoa) and had never had a license. at the time he was 18, graduated,
>
> never attended any drivers ed, nor had really drove (and quite
>
> immature-see below LOL). he was able to just go in and take the tests.
i
>
> had gotten him a manual but he didn't really study it nor take it
>
> seriously. eventually he went with someone else and actually got his
>
> license-easy as pie. we live in florida btw.
>
>
>
> i was completely surprised (and somewhat scared LOL) that it was so
easy
>
> for him. i think more so since he even had an accident before having a
>
> DL-not to mention while going around the block in my husbands car
>
> without our knowledge and leaving the scene. (he ran into a parked
car-
>
> while turning the corner too fast the speaker fell over in the
backseat
>
> -he had just partially installed it and so he actually turned/reached
>
> around to get it-yes while turning fast and the music blarring!)
>
>
>
> he got a ticket (i got a headache LOL) and yet since it was his first
>
> offense he simply paid a fine, passed the tests and got his DL easy as
>
> pie.
>
>
>
> in florida, as i understand it if your under 18 you must take an *-
its
>
> actually called Traffic Law and Substance Abuse Education (it can be
>
> online) to get a *learners permit. Drivers training (in the car) is
>
> optional.
>
>
>
> it states you can be 14 1/2.
>
>
>
> emmy
>
> www.emmytofa. com
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Bring your gang together. Do your thing. Find your favourite Yahoo!
group at http://in.promos.yahoo.com/groups/
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Jenny C

"> i am wondering what to do and how to handle the situation where the
guests' child/ren do small kicks and use bad words while playing
casually. though we dont use such words, our children see these
words and actions fascinating (!) sometimes. they even started
calling us in diff names and pat in our heads like actions. this phase
goes on and on for sometime.
> i would like to know how to stop our kids doing unacceptable
things. please help."



First, it really helps to think of it in other terms than simply
"unacceptable". "Bad" words, wether you use them or not, have been very
accepted in our culture wether we pretend that isn't so or not. All
kinds of words, the good ones and the bad ones, have intent and meaning.
It has worked better for me to view them within that context rather
than, good/bad.

I have a teen and a 6 yr old. My 6 yr old is going to be exposed to big
kid things, that my oldest wasn't when she was 6. There is little I can
do about that! I think it's natural to explore all those cuss words, I
mean people use them all the time, it's part of our venacular, they are
in movies, and used in public spaces.

What we've done with our kids, if give them examples of when those words
really aren't acceptable. Name calling, is mean, wether you call
someone "stupid" or "**ithead", both of them hurt equally bad. Our kids
understand the distinction of stubbing ones toe and hollering out
explatives and name calling, or name calling in fun or to be mean.
There are many subtle nuances to it, that some kids won't get unless an
adult helps them to use the language appropriately.

Clearly hitting and name calling isn't nice, address that, not wether or
not the word would turn a PG film into a PG-13 or R. If a parent is
shocked by bad words, and the kids are finding that fun, it really says
more about the parents than the kids.

Jenny C

> So we abandoned the reasonable conversation and just joined in, but
> with more made up silly names. He would call DH or I a "stupid butt
> head" and we would respond with something like: "oh yeah, well you
> are a green brocoli head" and then he would say something like "NO --
> you are a rat nose person" -- and then it would get really crazy as
> we all tried to come up with wilder combinations. (Captain
> Underpants book about Professor Poopypants is a very funny spin on
> the crazy names game.)


I love that! We do that too, it's fun to play with words. Kids learn
from playing, so naturally that extends into words!

Laureen

Heya!

On Thu, Jun 19, 2008 at 12:18 PM, Jenny C <jenstarc4@...> wrote:

>
> > So we abandoned the reasonable conversation and just joined in, but
> > with more made up silly names.
>
> I love that! We do that too, it's fun to play with words. Kids learn
> from playing, so naturally that extends into words!


We do the same thing. At this point, namecalling is actually an invitation
to play word games, and it's delivered in that teasing kind of "let's play!"
kind of way, with no malice whatsoever.

We have no problems with the boys cussing... provided there's correct
context (not just profanity for profanity's sake), but we also suggest
stretching into more creative terms of opprobrium, which has led both to
some awesome vocabulary discussions, and also opened their eyes to how
people perceive you, and react to you, depending on your choice of
vocabulary. Words have power, and they've figured that out. But it all
started with PoopyPantsHead. =)


--
~~L!

~ * ~ ~ * ~ ~ * ~ ~ * ~ ~ * ~
Writing here:
http://www.theexcellentadventure.com/

Evolving here:
http://www.consciouswoman.org/
~ * ~ ~ * ~ ~ * ~ ~ * ~ ~ * ~


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[email protected]

**Short version: Texas has a parent taught driver's ed; I thought other
states (Illinois? Oklahoma?) did also.**

No, Illinois law requires drivers ed for under 18's taught either by a public
high school or a commercial school. The high schools have to let private/home
schooled kids in but only when they have room so lots of kids take them over
the summer. In Illinois the issue for homeschoolers is getting their insurance
to allow the good student discount.

Driving is absolutely a state by state issue.

Deborah in IL





**************
Gas prices getting you down? Search AOL Autos for
fuel-efficient used cars.
(http://autos.aol.com/used?ncid=aolaut00050000000007)


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Vicki Dennis

On Thu, Jun 19, 2008 at 3:50 PM, <DACunefare@...> wrote:

> *In Illinois the issue for homeschoolers is getting their insurance
> to allow the good student discount.
>
> Driving is absolutely a state by state issue.
>
> Deborah in IL
>
> **************
>
>










Yep. And the good student discount (at least around here) is a company by
company issue.....even for institutional schoolers!

vicki


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Melissa Dietrick

> So we abandoned the reasonable conversation and just joined in, but
> > with more made up silly names. He would call DH or I a "stupid butt
> > head" and we would respond with something like: "oh yeah, well you
> > are a green brocoli head" and then he would say something like "NO --
> > you are a rat nose person" -- and then it would get really crazy as
> > we all tried to come up with wilder combinations. (Captain
> > Underpants book about Professor Poopypants is a very funny spin on
> > the crazy names game.)
>
>
> I love that! We do that too, it's fun to play with words. Kids learn
> from playing, so naturally that extends into words!
>

we do this too! I totally agree with the idea to let go of the
heaviness of a word or action and try to turn it around into playful
exploration...

My ds6 Leo who just turned 5 in may has so many olders he has had so
many words and actions to try out that with my olders (when they were
young) just never came up...

my favorite is when he started to experiement with spitting on people
to show his disfavor...we had to really search for the source as no
one here has ever used spitting except to clear their mucus from the
throat :oP.

Turns out the little indian girl that spits on Captain Hook in Peter
pan was his inspiration!

we started responding with "oh its raining! Im getting my umbrella."
or I would grab him up with "is this the slobber kiss? let me try!"
and we would start to do really wet and spitty kisses till we were
laughing and icked by the slobber lol...I still laugh to remember, it
was such a beautiful way to connect. and after he was relaxed enough
to talk about what was really bothering him, and because the energy
had changed he would be really easy flowing with solutions.

with hitting i would do the same sort of thing (because leo was also a
hitter) - id over react in play my pain, id roll about in agony...
(if it was me)

then I d figure out what was going on.

of course we talk about these things outside of the situation, but
within the situation it is so very challenging at first to switch
gears and ive found to keep it light (with small children) the nicest way.

melissa
in italy
mamma of 7

Aar

Hi all,

Thanks for sharing your views.  When I talked with my elder son (10 yo), how he felt when someone suddenly called him in diff words & hitting him suddenly.  He said that he could understand how hard the parents feel when they were doing such things... Also said, he wants to take out those hard feelings on others (till completely he forgot the whole episode)...  We showed him some ways on how to "take out" the fire from him... This phase goes on and on for long time.

While my elder son talks freely with us after such episodes, its hard for our younger one to forget or stop such behaviour.

ok, i need to wait for this phase to go off...

thanks,
aar

--- On Thu, 19/6/08, wisdomalways5 <wisdom1133@...> wrote:
From: wisdomalways5 <wisdom1133@...>
Subject: Re: [AlwaysLearning]Name calling, what to do
To: [email protected]
Date: Thursday, 19 June, 2008, 9:14 PM













I would discuss with them why it is you do not want them to use certain

words or do certain actions- you may want to look at what they are doing

and see if it is really a hurtful problem or not because sometimes if

you make it something "they" can not say it becomes MORE interesting not

less-



Julie



www.the-life- of-fun.blogspot. com

<http://www.the- life-of-fun. blogspot. com>



--- In AlwaysLearning@ yahoogroups. com, Aar <nrama75@... > wrote:

>

> dear friends,

>

> i am wondering what to do and how to handle the situation where the

guests' child/ren do small kicks and use bad words while playing

casually. though we dont use such words, our children see these

words and actions fascinating (!) sometimes. they even started

calling us in diff names and pat in our heads like actions. this phase

goes on and on for sometime.

> i would like to know how to stop our kids doing unacceptable

things. please help.

>

> thanks,

> aar

>

> --- On Thu, 19/6/08, emmy foundthings@ ... wrote:

> From: emmy foundthings@ ...

> Subject: Re: [AlwaysLearning] Driver's Ed

> To: AlwaysLearning@ yahoogroups. com

> Date: Thursday, 19 June, 2008, 11:36 AM

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

> this reminds me of my nephew came to stay with us from the islands

>

> (samoa) and had never had a license. at the time he was 18, graduated,

>

> never attended any drivers ed, nor had really drove (and quite

>

> immature-see below LOL). he was able to just go in and take the tests.

i

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> had gotten him a manual but he didn't really study it nor take it

>

> seriously. eventually he went with someone else and actually got his

>

> license-easy as pie. we live in florida btw.

>

>

>

> i was completely surprised (and somewhat scared LOL) that it was so

easy

>

> for him. i think more so since he even had an accident before having a

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> DL-not to mention while going around the block in my husbands car

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> without our knowledge and leaving the scene. (he ran into a parked

car-

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> while turning the corner too fast the speaker fell over in the

backseat

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> -he had just partially installed it and so he actually turned/reached

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> around to get it-yes while turning fast and the music blarring!)

>

>

>

> he got a ticket (i got a headache LOL) and yet since it was his first

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> offense he simply paid a fine, passed the tests and got his DL easy as

>

> pie.

>

>

>

> in florida, as i understand it if your under 18 you must take an *-

its

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> actually called Traffic Law and Substance Abuse Education (it can be

>

> online) to get a *learners permit. Drivers training (in the car) is

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> optional.

>

>

>

> it states you can be 14 1/2.

>

>

>

> emmy

>

> www.emmytofa. com

>

>

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> Bring your gang together. Do your thing. Find your favourite Yahoo!

group at http://in.promos. yahoo.com/ groups/

>

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