Kim Zerbe

I'm reading your responses with interest. I think I've been lazy and frustrated lately. My son is 7 (never been to school) and I'm having a hard time sharing his newest interest. Seems like all he does is watch Pokemon episodes on TV or his laptop. Even when the TV is on another show, the laptop is going too. It's all he talks about. Occasionally he'll play Pokemon games on the wii or DS. He'll pause the show or game to show me the characters and their evolved forms. He's always (even right now!) talking about their powers and types and who should win in a battle. I say wow! or really? or something equally lame and I try to remember the names of the characters but it's just not sinking in.

My problem is that I just can't seem to get into it! It seems so lame to me and I'm having a hard time hiding my distaste. The episodes are weak. The dialogue is trite. I just don't get the appeal. Actually it grates on my last nerve. It's like torture to have it on all the time, I think I am going insane.

Anyone been through this?! Please help! I want to share in his excitement, it's just really hard to embrace something I find so lame.

Don't misunderstand, I totally know the games have improved his reading skills immensely, his memory for character names and stats is amazing (but he's always absorbed things well, at 18mos he knew every Thomas the train character, even some I didn't recall ever seeing!), and I think the whole experience is great for his imagination. And I am aware of all the subreferences like just now he asked me what an underdog is. I explained and he nodded, what I said made sense to the fight he was watching. I get the value for him, I do! He can even navigate the internet to find what he wants! I'm just having a really hard time getting into it and sharing his passion for it. Any ideas? Anyone been there?

Thanks in advance.

Kim

Deb <vwb777@...> wrote:

>
>I know you're right and that's what my heart tells me. To be honest I think I've just been lazy. I need to remind myself why we're doing this and quit whining. Thanks so much for responding.
>
>Deborah
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>--- In [email protected], Pam Sorooshian <pamsoroosh@...> wrote:
>>
>> >
>> > >>but he just wants me to be mama and him to be jr. Gorilla. >>>
>> >
>>
>> Oh my. You didn't say what had been going on before, but this so obviously
>> stands out as him wanting intensely to reconnect with you and feel totally
>> enveloped in your love and care. He might need months of it...so instead of
>> offering lots of gorilla stuff, offer lots of mommy and child love stuff.
>> Write little sweet notes and leave them where he'll accidentally discover
>> them. Make him VERY special foods - unexpectedly. And play and play and
>> play with him as much as possible. And cuddle as much as possible. Sing
>> together - little kid songs, perhaps. Take and show your delight in him as
>> a little child - he will be grown up SO soon. Let him be little and "just"
>> play.
>>
>> Take a year off from worrying whether he is learning anything
>> "educational". Instead, focus on his happiness and on your relationship.
>> Fill his emotional cup to overflowing with your love and attention and
>> kindness. You'll be so glad, later, that you took the time for this now.
>>
>> -pam
>>
>>
>> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>>
>
>

Schuyler

Is it dark where you are? Are you suffering from a touch of SADs that's making you feel like watching Pokemon over and over again is torture? Can you do something to help you feel better? fuller? more capable of engagement? Can you realign your vision, your thinking, to see Pokemon from a different angle? Robyn Coburn wrote once, and I wish I could find it, about watching television that she wouldn't have chosen, but that Jayn had, for plot devices or for costuming or for something else. You could watch the show for scenes being recycled. You could look for how the characters are the same or how they are different. You could dissect the show as you watch it instead of being annoyed by it. Find your own joy in Pokemon. You could think about the biology and what kind of animals or plants the pokemon are drawn from.

I love Pokemon. I have a great affection for Team Rocket and Meowth (that's right). When Simon was 3 and 4 and we lived in Japan we would get a Pokemon figure every time we went into downtown Kyoto, or anywhere, really, that had the figures. But it was an exchange for his coming along with us. Linnaea was tiny, so she didn't need any inducement. I've set up those figures in little tableaus in so many different places. And they were fabulous in the B'damen battles.


We drew Pokemon. We made Pokemon out of coloured glue on acetate paper and then put them in the windows. Simon learned about inches and feet and centimetres and metres from having me show him how big Pokemon would be from the information in the Pokemon book we got from a garage sale. We talked about where they get all that size from when they change from one form to another. I read a lot about SatoshiTajiri (I think Sandra may have some of that on her website: http://sandradodd.com/game/pokemon) and why Pokemon are as they are. When Simon was 4 my brother gave him a gameboy and I bought Pokemon gold for him. He would cuddle on my lap and I would play the game, reading all the text as we went through it. It was so wonderfully sweet to be with my boy, sharing the excitement and puzzle solving together.


I miss Pokemon. I miss that kind of play and discussion and Jessie and James and Misty and Ash and Brock. Brock's fabulous. I know the characters now are much different than they were, and I don't know much about them. It helps me to focus on them and their interests now to know that it is all temporary. I live time in a linear way. I get each day, each moment as a series. And once those moments have passed, the next one fills up the space. I don't get to go back and have that Pokemon time again. And my memory is phenomenally imperfect. That knowledge has helped me, on more than one occasion, to be sweeter, kinder, more engaged, more patient, than I might otherwise have been.


Schuyler





________________________________
From: Kim Zerbe <kim.zerbe@...>
To: [email protected]
Sent: Tuesday, 22 November 2011, 9:17
Subject: Re: [AlwaysLearning] Re: Are we stuck? Me too!

I'm reading your responses with interest. I think I've been lazy and frustrated lately. My son is 7 (never been to school) and I'm having a hard time sharing his newest interest. Seems like all he does is watch Pokemon episodes on TV or his laptop. Even when the TV is on another show, the laptop is going too. It's all he talks about. Occasionally he'll play Pokemon games on the wii or DS. He'll pause the show or game to show me the characters and their evolved forms. He's always (even right now!) talking about their powers and types and who should win in a battle. I say wow! or really? or something equally lame and I try to remember the names of the characters but it's just not sinking in.

My problem is that I just can't seem to get into it! It seems so lame to me and I'm having a hard time hiding my distaste. The episodes are weak. The dialogue is trite. I just don't get the appeal. Actually it grates on my last nerve. It's like torture to have it on all the time, I think I am going insane.

Anyone been through this?! Please help! I want to share in his excitement, it's just really hard to embrace something I find so lame.

Don't misunderstand, I totally know the games have improved his reading skills immensely, his memory for character names and stats is amazing (but he's always absorbed things well, at 18mos he knew every Thomas the train character, even some I didn't recall ever seeing!), and I think the whole experience is great for his imagination. And I am aware of all the subreferences like just now he asked me what an underdog is. I explained and he nodded, what I said made sense to the fight he was watching. I get the value for him, I do! He can even navigate the internet to find what he wants! I'm just having a really hard time getting into it and sharing his passion for it. Any ideas? Anyone been there?

Thanks in advance.

Kim

Deb <vwb777@...> wrote:

>
>I know you're right and that's what my heart tells me. To be honest I think I've just been lazy. I need to remind myself why we're doing this and quit whining. Thanks so much for responding.
>
>Deborah
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>--- In [email protected], Pam Sorooshian <pamsoroosh@...> wrote:
>>
>> >
>> > >>but he just wants me to be mama and him to be jr. Gorilla. >>>
>> >
>>
>> Oh my. You didn't say what had been going on before, but this so obviously
>> stands out as him wanting intensely to reconnect with you and feel totally
>> enveloped in your love and care. He might need months of it...so instead of
>> offering lots of gorilla stuff, offer lots of mommy and child love stuff.
>> Write little sweet notes and leave them where he'll accidentally discover
>> them. Make him VERY special foods - unexpectedly. And play and play and
>> play with him as much as possible. And cuddle as much as possible. Sing
>> together - little kid songs, perhaps. Take and show your delight in him as
>> a little child - he will be grown up SO soon. Let him be little and "just"
>> play.
>>
>> Take a year off from worrying whether he is learning anything
>> "educational". Instead, focus on his happiness and on your relationship.
>> Fill his emotional cup to overflowing with your love and attention and
>> kindness. You'll be so glad, later, that you took the time for this now.
>>
>> -pam
>>
>>
>> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>>
>
>


------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Kim Zerbe

Thanks Schuyler. I just spent the last 2 hrs playing the board game Sponge Bob Life with Damon. I used to dislike SB too but can finally laugh at the craziness and I don't think my son is going to want to be just like SB or model him. Just thought I'd check to see if anyone had replied to my post yet, knowing this is an international list and was delighted to see your response! This gives me something to take to sleep and ponder.

We do live in Oregon where the days are short and filled with rain. I am extra moody lately. Missing the sun. Damon stays up late and sleeps in late so our day time is already limited then most days are darkened by clouds. Plus he prefers to stay home so I'm feeling cooped up on days we don't leave the house. Not sure what to do about that. Trying to alter our sleep pattern but tonight opted for a game instead (hubby went to bed angry and i was not wanting to join him).

I do want to share his joy, just struggling. Thank you for your ideas and words of wisdom.

Kim


Schuyler <s.waynforth@...> wrote:

>Is it dark where you are? Are you suffering from a touch of SADs that's making you feel like watching Pokemon over and over again is torture? Can you do something to help you feel better? fuller? more capable of engagement? Can you realign your vision, your thinking, to see Pokemon from a different angle? Robyn Coburn wrote once, and I wish I could find it, about watching television that she wouldn't have chosen, but that Jayn had, for plot devices or for costuming or for something else. You could watch the show for scenes being recycled. You could look for how the characters are the same or how they are different. You could dissect the show as you watch it instead of being annoyed by it. Find your own joy in Pokemon. You could think about the biology and what kind of animals or plants the pokemon are drawn from.
>
>I love Pokemon. I have a great affection for Team Rocket and Meowth (that's right). When Simon was 3 and 4 and we lived in Japan we would get a Pokemon figure every time we went into downtown Kyoto, or anywhere, really, that had the figures. But it was an exchange for his coming along with us. Linnaea was tiny, so she didn't need any inducement. I've set up those figures in little tableaus in so many different places. And they were fabulous in the B'damen battles.
>
>
>We drew Pokemon. We made Pokemon out of coloured glue on acetate paper and then put them in the windows. Simon learned about inches and feet and centimetres and metres from having me show him how big Pokemon would be from the information in the Pokemon book we got from a garage sale. We talked about where they get all that size from when they change from one form to another. I read a lot about SatoshiTajiri (I think Sandra may have some of that on her website: http://sandradodd.com/game/pokemon) and why Pokemon are as they are. When Simon was 4 my brother gave him a gameboy and I bought Pokemon gold for him. He would cuddle on my lap and I would play the game, reading all the text as we went through it. It was so wonderfully sweet to be with my boy, sharing the excitement and puzzle solving together.
>
>
>I miss Pokemon. I miss that kind of play and discussion and Jessie and James and Misty and Ash and Brock. Brock's fabulous. I know the characters now are much different than they were, and I don't know much about them. It helps me to focus on them and their interests now to know that it is all temporary. I live time in a linear way. I get each day, each moment as a series. And once those moments have passed, the next one fills up the space. I don't get to go back and have that Pokemon time again. And my memory is phenomenally imperfect. That knowledge has helped me, on more than one occasion, to be sweeter, kinder, more engaged, more patient, than I might otherwise have been.
>
>
>Schuyler
>
>
>
>
>
>________________________________
> From: Kim Zerbe <kim.zerbe@...>
>To: [email protected]
>Sent: Tuesday, 22 November 2011, 9:17
>Subject: Re: [AlwaysLearning] Re: Are we stuck? Me too!
>
>I'm reading your responses with interest. I think I've been lazy and frustrated lately. My son is 7 (never been to school) and I'm having a hard time sharing his newest interest. Seems like all he does is watch Pokemon episodes on TV or his laptop. Even when the TV is on another show, the laptop is going too. It's all he talks about. Occasionally he'll play Pokemon games on the wii or DS. He'll pause the show or game to show me the characters and their evolved forms. He's always (even right now!) talking about their powers and types and who should win in a battle. I say wow! or really? or something equally lame and I try to remember the names of the characters but it's just not sinking in.
>
>My problem is that I just can't seem to get into it! It seems so lame to me and I'm having a hard time hiding my distaste. The episodes are weak. The dialogue is trite. I just don't get the appeal. Actually it grates on my last nerve. It's like torture to have it on all the time, I think I am going insane.
>
>Anyone been through this?! Please help! I want to share in his excitement, it's just really hard to embrace something I find so lame.
>
>Don't misunderstand, I totally know the games have improved his reading skills immensely, his memory for character names and stats is amazing (but he's always absorbed things well, at 18mos he knew every Thomas the train character, even some I didn't recall ever seeing!), and I think the whole experience is great for his imagination. And I am aware of all the subreferences like just now he asked me what an underdog is. I explained and he nodded, what I said made sense to the fight he was watching. I get the value for him, I do! He can even navigate the internet to find what he wants! I'm just having a really hard time getting into it and sharing his passion for it. Any ideas? Anyone been there?
>
>Thanks in advance.
>
>Kim
>
>Deb <vwb777@...> wrote:
>
>>
>>I know you're right and that's what my heart tells me. To be honest I think I've just been lazy. I need to remind myself why we're doing this and quit whining. Thanks so much for responding.
>>
>>Deborah
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>--- In [email protected], Pam Sorooshian <pamsoroosh@...> wrote:
>>>
>>> >
>>> > >>but he just wants me to be mama and him to be jr. Gorilla. >>>
>>> >
>>>
>>> Oh my. You didn't say what had been going on before, but this so obviously
>>> stands out as him wanting intensely to reconnect with you and feel totally
>>> enveloped in your love and care. He might need months of it...so instead of
>>> offering lots of gorilla stuff, offer lots of mommy and child love stuff.
>>> Write little sweet notes and leave them where he'll accidentally discover
>>> them. Make him VERY special foods - unexpectedly. And play and play and
>>> play with him as much as possible. And cuddle as much as possible. Sing
>>> together - little kid songs, perhaps. Take and show your delight in him as
>>> a little child - he will be grown up SO soon. Let him be little and "just"
>>> play.
>>>
>>> Take a year off from worrying whether he is learning anything
>>> "educational". Instead, focus on his happiness and on your relationship.
>>> Fill his emotional cup to overflowing with your love and attention and
>>> kindness. You'll be so glad, later, that you took the time for this now.
>>>
>>> -pam
>>>
>>>
>>> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>>>
>>
>>
>
>
>------------------------------------
>
>Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

Sandra Dodd

-=-He can even navigate the internet to find what he wants! I'm just having a really hard time getting into it and sharing his passion for it. Any ideas? Anyone been there?-=-

I learned all about Ninja Turtles and Power Rangers, when my boys were little, but by the time Pokemon came along I was supportive by driving them to tournaments and meets in town, and helping them buy and keep cards (they usually paid for the cards, but I provided binders and card-holder sheets). Kirby got a job at the gaming shop when he was 14, so they got discounts on cards after that.

I never learned the names of the pokemon characters, but I have helped make costumes, and for one of their friends' winter birthdays, I did a nice applique of his favorite character on a sweatshirt. Bulbasaur. :-) I remember that one. And Kirby's favorite was the pink one that sings people to sleep.

You can be supportive without watching all the shows. You can be a facilitator, still.

Sandra

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Joyce Fetteroll

On Nov 22, 2011, at 8:56 AM, Sandra Dodd wrote:

> You can be supportive without watching all the shows. You can be a
> facilitator, still.

There's something different about the dynamic of unschooling an only
though. At least it was with Kathryn for whom a big part of
exploration was exploring with someone else. From day one, you're
theirs to connect to. They don't have other kids in the family to
share an interest with. They don't have other kids Mom needs to be
shared with. So Mom is theirs. And if you're not into something, it
can feel like a rejection.

I probably would have liked Pokemon without the Gameboy game to play.
But the game really is a lot of fun and gives you a whole other
perspective to see Pokemon from. All the stats and abilities and
personalities have meaning in context. I even bought a DS to play
Pokemon on with her :-)

Joyce

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Karen

> Anyone been through this?! Please help! I want to share in his excitement, it's just really hard to embrace something I find so lame.

Pokemon marked the beginning of my being able to truly embrace my son's interests. I remember the moment clearly. We were in a bookstore, and Ethan picked up a Pokemon guide book. He fell in love with the characters. My mind went to, "Oh no, not Pokemon!" I'm embarrassed to say that I would have said something like, "Oh, we don't need Pokemon" in the past, and I would have directed him to something *I* thought was more valuable. Thankfully, I didn't do that this time, and that decision led us into the Pokemon World in full. I'm so happy it did, because I learned so much about Ethan, and so much about learning, by really getting into his excitement.

We watched all of the shows. Like you, I cringed at first. They were loud and repetitive and simple to my ears. To Ethan's ears, though, I could see they were exciting, empowering and every show had something for him to think about, and act out later. We did a lot of acting out in the yard. Ethan was always Raichu. I liked the little quiet Pokemon (I forget the name now). He protected me. He loved that! He loved that part of Pokemon - that these cute characters were so brave and strong. He loved their special abilities. He loved learning them, and then imagining what it would be like to have his favourites.

We played the card game, which I ended up really liking. For Halloween, we made a Raichu costume. So many people (kids and young adults) in our town knew who he was. He felt so proud of that. I think he felt like the hero, Raichu, himself. We took out books from the library and searched for cards on Ebay. I like drawing, so I picked up a how-to book on Pokemon characters. I made window stickers and drawings that we hung up on the walls. I made a couple of simple hand puppets for him and his friend to use. Surprisingly, Ethan was not interested in the video game.

I soon found myself exclaiming how much I loved Pokemon to adult friends (who mostly groaned). Then, gradually, the interest waned. I felt kind of sad, to be honest. We explored some other Manga, but so far, there hasn't been the same appeal. Although, he did really like The Avatar series.

Did I really love Pokemon? I did, but not because I thought it was brilliant, although there are some really brilliant aspects. I loved it because I shared it with my son. I got lost in the play with him. I really got to know him. And, in sharing this experience with him, I was finally able to see the learning that happens outside of the restraints of schoolish thinking.

Pokemon does have a lot of math, reading, art etc. But, more importantly, it is the experience of fully and joyfully embracing that which captivates one's imagination that brings learning to life. Learning, then, becomes bigger than subjects. It becomes a living curiosity that doesn't stop at math, reading and art, but moves fluidly through all experiences, making connections everywhere - building the structure on which the person will inevitably stand solidly.

Bernadette Lynn

I didn't like Pokemon when my children started watching it. I grew up being
told it was terrible and found it trite and repetitive when I actually saw
some episodes - but I decided to find good things about it so that I could
defend their interest when my husband was doubtful about it; I made an
effort to sit and watch it with the children without criticising or
complaining (and yes, it was an effort, to begin with).
It's all about friendship, loyalty and sportsmanship. The characters are
unstinting in their support for each other: they are trustworthy, generous,
caring, eager to learn new things, explore new places, have new experiences.

I love the way they thank each other for a great match, even if they
lose: they don't blame their Pokemon for failure, instead they apologise
for choosing the wrong tactics or for asking them to perform beyond their
abilities.

It's one of the few shows I've seen recently where adults treat children
with respect, and where the children treat adults as allies and ask their
advice. The baddies aren't completely bad and usually have a motivation for
what they do, even Team Rocket.

There are still things I don't like, as with most shows, but I enjoy
watching new episodes and the movies, something I never expected when my
children first discovered Pokemon. I love watching my children enjoy the
show and finding new Pokemon-related things for them to enjoy. And I love
being able to share in something they get so much pleasure from.


Bernadette.


On 22 November 2011 09:17, Kim Zerbe <kim.zerbe@...> wrote:

> I'm reading your responses with interest. I think I've been lazy and
> frustrated lately. My son is 7 (never been to school) and I'm having a hard
> time sharing his newest interest. Seems like all he does is watch Pokemon
> episodes on TV or his laptop.
> --
>
http://h2g2.com/dna/h2g2/U15459


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Sandra Dodd

-=-It's all about friendship, loyalty and sportsmanship. The characters are
unstinting in their support for each other: they are trustworthy, generous,
caring, eager to learn new things, explore new places, have new experiences.-=-

When Kirby was three or four and wanted to watch Ninja Turtles, Keith and I watched an episode to see whether we wanted to encourage or discourage his interest. After that episode, Keith said "it's Japanese management theory!" It was the late 1980's, when that group management with team leaders was all the rage in corporate management organization. Different turtles had different personalities and strengths, but they all really respected Splinter, who was encouraging and helped lead them to useful conclusions.

We liked it and thought it would probably do him a lot of good. It did! It has.

Last night we went to pick up barbecue to bring home (my husband Keith and I are visiting Kirby and his roommates in Austin), and one of the guys working there commented that he really loved Kirby's t-shirt. I bought it for him a few years ago. It's read screenprint on black, and says "Splinter's Dojo."

Sandra

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

shirarocklin

--- We do live in Oregon where the days are short and filled with rain. I am extra moody lately. Missing the sun. Damon stays up late and sleeps in late so our day time is already limited then most days are darkened by clouds. ---

I find taking Vitamin D drops helps with that. And I've heard that having bright, or sunlight lamps, can make a big difference too. The feeling of cooped up might clear up if you found a way to get the feeling of 'light' that you are missing...

Shira

Sandra Dodd

-=-I find taking Vitamin D drops helps with that. And I've heard that having bright, or sunlight lamps, can make a big difference too. The feeling of cooped up might clear up if you found a way to get the feeling of 'light' that you are missing...-=-

This isn't literal light, but I think it could help:
http://justaddlightandstir.blogspot.com/

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

maltmanjamie

--- In [email protected], Sandra Dodd <Sandra@...> wrote:
>
> -=-I find taking Vitamin D drops helps with that. And I've heard that having bright, or sunlight lamps, can make a big difference too. The feeling of cooped up might clear up if you found a way to get the feeling of 'light' that you are missing...-=-
>
> This isn't literal light, but I think it could help:
> http://justaddlightandstir.blogspot.com/
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

I bought a Phillips BluLight last Christmas and it helped me a lot with better patterning of awake/asleep times after travelling (or dealing with insomnia) , and overcoming minor winter blues. I live near Toronto, so we have a winter that is certainly long enough. I've read for some people, using it in the morning is better than a cup of coffee.

Might be worth a try?

Hope all if you in the US had a great holiday!

Jamie (the Dad)