catfish_friend

Last Friday, I thought my family was not going to send DD1 to kindergarten this week.

After a weekend of discussion and mulling things over, I wanted to give DD1 the opportunity to experience the Waldorf-inspired charter (free public school) she was enrolled in. I figured that then she could make the most informed choice between school and Unschooling.

Well, she loves the school.

I have mixed feelings as I wanted to unschool, but DD1 is really happy with her school for the 2 days she's attended. She's very much an extrovert and her school is structured to have free play for most of the time she's there. And, due to the Waldorf inspired charter, there are no academics introduced until age 7. DH has taken the most initiative I've seen in months with engaging and playing with DD1 after school. The charter school requests no TV or media during the school week and DH is trying to provide options that are more fun than TV. And they built a teepee from bamboo poles left from the gardener, went fishing with a bamboo fishing rod in our front yard and also made fish kabobs from leaves in the yard on smaller bamboo sticks. They cooked dinner the last 2 nights together and I haven't seen them have so much fun together in a long, long time.

The tough part is seeing more conflict between DD1 and DD2. My guess is it's from them being disconnected for the school day and needing to recalibrate being together. And of course, keeping a school schedule sucks for a family of night owls (8a school start?!)!!!

I see at least one of my failures in prepping for Unschooling -- I hadn't previously found DD1 the opportunity to make a lot of good friends prior to school starting, so of course, my extroverted DD1 would LOVE school after the past few weeks of hanging just with her immediate family.

I also did not follow through with making life more sparkly than this Waldorf-inspired school. I often talked about doing things she wanted (ride the subway, go to the aquarium, zoo, ride ferris wheel, etc.) but put them off...

I have seen enough with deschooling so far, to want to continue moving towards Unschooling. The joy of connection, having fun together, learning while fun-ing and following one's own body clock are things I'm already missing. And I can see DD1 is already missing spending time with me and watching TV, though neither are so badly missed that she wants to stay home.

Of course, I'll honor what DD1 wants to do, but I'm going to keep upping my sparkly Unschooling and see how it goes.

In the meantime, it's not so bad if DD1 and DH seem happier with this arrangement.

But, now I have to decide on DD2's enrollment at an unstructured play-based preschool. On the one hand, DD2 sorely misses her big sister while DD1 is at school. But, to keep from having to deschool DD2, is it alright to unschool her rather than send her to the preschool that she knows (and likes, from dropping off her big sister the last 2 years)?!

The only indication that i'm getting closer to Unschooling is that I now have a family willing to go to an Unschooling conference in a couple weeks!!!

Am I only 1 step back now, or 3? Am I still heading in the right direction?

Ceci



Sent from my iDon'tAlwaysHaveItOnPhone

Sandra Dodd

-=-I also did not follow through with making life more sparkly than this Waldorf-inspired school. I often talked about doing things she wanted (ride the subway, go to the aquarium, zoo, ride ferris wheel, etc.) but put them off...-=-

What timeframe? How long ago did you start planning to unschool (or start feeling you were unschooling)?

-=-I have seen enough with deschooling so far, to want to continue moving towards Unschooling. The joy of connection, having fun together, learning while fun-ing and following one's own body clock are things I'm already missing. -=-

But you have a child at home. You can still do all kinds of fun things, even stay up late if one parent can get up with the school-going child.

-=-Of course, I'll honor what DD1 wants to do, but I'm going to keep upping my sparkly Unschooling and see how it goes.-=-

Maybe think of it as enriching your life, rather than your unschooling. She might like school for a long time, but she still has a full life, most of which is at home, and if home is full and rich, that's better than the alternative.

-=-Am I only 1 step back now, or 3? Am I still heading in the right direction?-=-

If your daughter loves school and you're trying to "up your sparkly unschooling" to make her unhappy with her choice, I'm not sure that's "right." If she decides she dosn't like school and you're willing to have her come home, whether it's next week or next decade, that seems like a huge luxury for her, because unlike most or all of her classmates, she chose to be there and can chose to leave.

Sandra



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kristi_beguin

>>>Well, she loves the school.

I have mixed feelings as I wanted to unschool, but DD1 is really happy with her school for the 2 days she's attended.<<<

Your daughter may love school for the whole year, but I just wanted to point out that some young children attending school are sometimes really, really excited for the first couple days, and the reality of what a school schedule really is may not be apparent to them right away. She might settle in and be happy for the whole school year, or maybe not.

My youngest daughter tried out kindergarten two weeks ago. She was super, duper excited for days 1 and 2, but by day 4 the reality of getting up every morning, and hurrying to get ready to go by 8am had sunk in. She was done with school by the following Tuesday.

>>>I also did not follow through with making life more sparkly than this Waldorf-inspired school. I often talked about doing things she wanted (ride the subway, go to the aquarium, zoo, ride ferris wheel, etc.) but put them off...<<<

You can continue to make life more sparkly, especially with one still at home. It might be worth thinking about Waldorf-methods and how they might impact having a sparkly home. It's awesome that your DH has wanted to spend quality time with your daughter after school, but putting a restriction of the TV or other electronics just because the school said to do so might cause less sparkly-ness in the near future.

>>>But, to keep from having to deschool DD2, is it alright to unschool her rather than send her to the preschool that she knows (and likes, from dropping off her big sister the last 2 years)?!<<<

If school is the path your family is choosing, and you are committed to and supportive of that reality, you may not need to deschool if they enjoy school and want to stay there. What do you want to do? Would you rather have her at home, enjoying her presence and being able to spend quality time with her every day, or does having her be with friends and learning how to handle a school environment seem more important?

catfish_friend

On Sep 1, 2011, at 8:11 AM, Sandra Dodd <Sandra@...> wrote:

> If your daughter loves school and you're trying to "up your sparkly unschooling" to make her unhappy with her choice, I'm not sure that's "right." If she decides she dosn't like school and you're willing to have her come home, whether it's next week or next decade, that seems like a huge luxury for her, because unlike most or all of her classmates, she chose to be there and can chose to leave.
----------------

I guess I have an agenda -- I would like to unschool. And, I agree with you, it is not the best thing to try to "make" DD1 unhappy with school by making homelife more sparkly.

I know from experience that DD1 stores up stress from a school day (even when it's unstructured play-based and with respectful teachers) and off-loads it in unexpected and sometimes hurtful ways (mistreating her sister, telling her dad she hates him, etc.). When she and I were discussing the possibility of her staying home with me instead of school, DD2 said that she also wanted to stay home instead of go to preschool. Now that DD1 is in school, DD2 also wants to go to school.

With needing to be on the school's schedule, this past week has been full of tears at bedtime -- battles of wills between DH and DD1 and physical fights between DD1 and DD2, usually soon after they see each other once DD1 comes home.

I didn't have either of these happening with any kind of regularity this last month of hard core deschooling. I had been saying "yes" more for 3 months now, but really let go of limiting TV and food in the past month.

DH had been working full-time. Now he has a month off, but will then work full-time for 2 weeks or until he finds a suitable person to share his more than full-time job. He will probably work 3 long days a week.

Given this, I will need to find more balance between his and my parenting. He does not completely deny sugar or TV, but feels it necessary to be a gatekeeper of both.

Recently, it has become crystal clear to me that it really is the controlling of these things rather than the things themselves that inflict so much damage. We are in a Waldorf-y social circle, though, so I am definitely on my own with this view in my community.

One confusing thing is that DD1's school asks that children not watch or engage in media (TV, computer, smartphone, DVDs, movies, etc.) during the school week. DH has made a concerted effort to engage DD1 in more fun activities but DD1 keeps asking for TV. I feel that giving her TV access is her right at home, but I also feel that when committing to a school or other community/activity/institution, it is responsible to honor the rules, expectations and guidelines there.

DH and I need to have a discussion on this, but I'm not exactly clear on it for myself, yet.

Is it better to separate home from school for now and let DD1 watch TV though the school does not allow it? I've been talking to DD1 about how schools have rules and they expect you to follow them. I've also made it absolutely clear that she can choose to be home with me on any day at anytime rather than be at school if she likes. I asked if she liked school more than watching TV and she said that she wants to do both. My inclination is to give that to her, but I think DH is kind of happy with having TV restricted now.

Ceci

catfish_friend

On Sep 1, 2011, at 10:01 AM, "kristi_beguin" <foehn_jye@...> wrote:

> What do you want to do? Would you rather have her at home, enjoying her presence and being able to spend quality time with her every day, or does having her be with friends and learning how to handle a school environment seem more important?
-------------
My priority is to have a more peaceful and happy family. I think the girls are happier home with me. I think DH is happier with the girls in school. I think DD1 is a natural leader with a strong personality and she will be fine wherever she chooses to be. I am concerned that school might crush her independent spirit either from peer pressure or from school hierarchy (teacher knows all, kids know nothing). DD2 takes her lead from DD1 with wanting to go to school. DD1 is still nursing on-demand and she is much more introverted and shy than DD2, which makes me think DD1 would be happier in a smaller environment than school.

DD2 is likely to become one of the well-liked, popular types in a school setting. I think that could be an ego-boost, but I know that kind of social pressure can be tough, too. Ultimately, both my girls are highly sensitive. DD1 hides her sensitivity on the surface and for that reason in particular, I wanted to keep her home with me. At least if her sensitivity were visible to others less familiar with her, then issues could be addressed along the way. As it stands, most think she's dealing with things ok when in reality, she is destroyed inside. Only her dad and I pick up on this currently.

Ceci

Sandra Dodd

-=-I didn't have either of these happening with any kind of regularity this last month of hard core deschooling. I had been saying "yes" more for 3 months now, but really let go of limiting TV and food in the past month.-=-

That's the missing piece of information. You had only been deschooling for the summer. School kids don't count summer. Schooled adults don't, either.

So it was only a month that you failed to take them to do cool things? (I don't want to go back for the quote, but I had asked how long that was that it was insufficiently sparkly.)

Also "harcore deschooling" is contradictory. Deschooling needs to be pressure-free, calm, relaxed.

-=-With needing to be on the school's schedule, this past week has been full of tears at bedtime -- battles of wills between DH and DD1 and physical fights between DD1 and DD2, usually soon after they see each other once DD1 comes home. -=-

You could tell her that one condition of her going to school is to be nicer at home, and not act her day out on others. It's impossible to totally accomplish, but it's possible to begin to see and try to overcome.

-=-Recently, it has become crystal clear to me that it really is the controlling of these things rather than the things themselves that inflict so much damage. We are in a Waldorf-y social circle, though, so I am definitely on my own with this view in my community.-=-

If you see your family as your primary community, and outsiders as others, that might help, too.

Crystal clarity is good when you can get it. :-) I agree with you that it's not the thing (the TV, the toy, the video game), that it's the reactions and responsess of others and the desire and the added values and the forbiddenness and all the dustcloud around it.

-=- I feel that giving her TV access is her right at home, but I also feel that when committing to a school or other community/activity/institution, it is responsible to honor the rules, expectations and guidelines there.
-=-

You gave up your family's rights when you put her in Waldorf-land.

-=Is it better to separate home from school for now and let DD1 watch TV though the school does not allow it?-=-

Did you sign an agreement? Is there a waiting list for that school? The severity of the foul depends on the harm done to others, and to your integrity.

-=- I asked if she liked school more than watching TV and she said that she wants to do both. My inclination is to give that to her, but I think DH is kind of happy with having TV restricted now.-=-

A prescription for you and one for your husband:

http://sandradodd.com/schoolchoice
http://sandradodd.com/t/economics

Sandra

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Sandra Dodd

-=-I wanted to keep her home with me. At least if her sensitivity were visible to others less familiar with her, then issues could be addressed along the way. As it stands, most think she's dealing with things ok when in reality, she is destroyed inside. Only her dad and I pick up on this currently.-=-

If he's picking up on it and it's real, they he probably won't be happy with her being in school for very much longer.

Sandra

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NCMama

=-=One confusing thing is that DD1's school asks that children not watch or engage in media (TV, computer, smartphone, DVDs, movies, etc.) during the school week. <snip> Is it better to separate home from school for now and let DD1 watch TV though the school does not allow it?=-=

The school isn't in your home; they can't 'allow' or not allow your activities there.

I have a friend whose son was kicked out of a Waldorf School because her kids watched TV, and he talked about the characters during school, wanted to pretend to be them on the playground, etc.

If being dismissed from the school is a possible consequence, you can talk to your daughter about that choice: You can choose to watch TV, but you might not be able to go to your school any more. NOT with the (expressed, visible, evident) hope that she'll feel overly controlled and choose not to go to school, but just as factual information. Together, you can choose how much of the school's guidelines you'll follow, with full knowledge of potential repercussions. It doesn't have to be all-or-nothing.

Caren

Sandra Dodd

-=-I have a friend whose son was kicked out of a Waldorf School because her kids watched TV, and he talked about the characters during school, wanted to pretend to be them on the playground, etc.-=-

That's one of the things they want to avoid, definitely, so if someone DOES let a Waldorf kid watch TV, advice her NOT to talk about the characters or shows at school.

-=- Together, you can choose how much of the school's guidelines you'll follow, with full knowledge of potential repercussions. It doesn't have to be all-or-nothing.-=-

Not just the mom and child, though, the dad. And I think it depends on other agreements and promises potentially made in order to be admitted.

If someone running an unschooling cover school (in places where people might prefer to sign up with someone as an overseeing supervising teacher, or whatever, which happens in some places), and if a condition to participate in that situation was that children NOT be forbidden to watch TV or use computers. and if one family wrote, "Together, you can choose how much of the school's guidelines you'll follow, with full knowledge of potential repercussions. It doesn't have to be all-or-nothing" I would think much less of the parents.

IF unschooling doesn't work in a world of arbitrary limitations, then getting a piece of paper (which is what some people want/need from such arrangements) saying "Yes, someone who understands this method certifies that I followed it," would be dishonest, if they knew they sneakily did NOT follow it. And beyond the sneakiness, it wouldn't work the same way. Connections can't be made when connections are so cut off.

The Waldorf school principles believe that tv is bad ALL the time... this "school week" ban is like being vegetarian during the week and compensating with weenie-roast barbecues all weekend. But still, if the parents agreed to it, that's something different than ignoring a public school directive about how and where a child must do homework or some thing. Waldorf isn't the default closest-government school.


IF a family with a younger, still nursing child at home is observing a ban on TV, that means the younger girl doesn't watch either? Or just not during the time her sister is home? THAT could be leading to some of the disharmony between them, all kinds of ways.

Sandra

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catfish_friend

> -------- So it was only a month that you failed to take them to do cool things? (I don't want to go back for the quote, but I had asked how long that was that it was insufficiently sparkly.)
>
> Also "harcore deschooling" is contradictory. Deschooling needs to be pressure-free, calm, relaxed. --------
>

Yes, a month. When I wrote 'hardcore' I meant that I honored the girls' requests as long as it wasn't problematic with regard to safety or another person's more pressing needs (DD2 napping for example). At their request, most days began with TV marathons and ice cream for breakfast, or at least, one of the options. (Side note: they hardly ever are asking for any sweets now, BTW.). I presented them with ideas of fun things to do and if they had an interest, we went and did it. But mostly, we hung out, me and my two girls and played board games, pretend we're traveling around the world games, cooked, cleaned, watched TV, shopped, slipped and slid on the slip and slide, etc. Many were initiated by them, but those that weren't were only done if they showed interest. It was pressure-free and calm and relaxed except when I had my rare but occasional hissy fit. An example was losing my cool and yelling at DD1 when we had been driving around for 20 minutes looking for parking near a big tourist attraction she wanted to go to and I told her that we had to go do something else. Sadly, I know there were at least 2 times like that when I lost perspective of what I was actually trying to do -- be connected with my girls!

> --------You could tell her that one condition of her going to school is to be nicer at home, and not act her day out on others. It's impossible to totally accomplish, but it's possible to begin to see and try to overcome.--------
>
I'm leery of making conditions for things but prefer to express my observations and opinions. I think conditions can be coercive rather than helpful towards gaining understanding. I just realized that I had not shared my observations with my girls on this particular subject and it is worth doing.

> ------- If you see your family as your primary community, and outsiders as others, that might help, too. --------
>
Helps some. Maybe I'm deschooling the peer pressure of group-think, too.


> --------- You gave up your family's rights when you put her in Waldorf-land. --------
>
Can you expound upon this?

> -------- -=Is it better to separate home from school for now and let DD1 watch TV though the school does not allow it?-=-
>
> Did you sign an agreement? Is there a waiting list for that school? The severity of the foul depends on the harm done to others, and to your integrity. --------
>
No agreement. Yes to waiting list. School is a public charter and I don't know if they are allowed to kick people out for not following the Waldorf ideas. On any given day, I've noticed the school has many children dressed in media character decorated clothing, for example.

---------
> http://sandradodd.com/schoolchoice
> http://sandradodd.com/t/economics
>
--------

I had read these before and just read them again now. Funny how until I fully "get" it, the articles seem to be eye-opening on every read.

DD1 knows that she can be home with me at anytime. She even said to me the other day, "You worry about it too much." She's right!

And I've explained to DH the economics of scarcity along with the Rat Park study broadstrokes summary, but he responded with, "I don't care." He dismisses the research, he believes too much TV and sugar are bad and he thinks removing the limits are unconscionable and overly permissive parenting. I told him about half-eaten ice cream cones the girls gladly tossed in te garbage because they were done with them. He just does not accept or appreciate what I am sharing about this. He does not want to change his mind on these things. He doesn't feel they need to be eliminated, but he feels it's his duty to "guide" the girls to how much they should have of each.

Last night, DH and I had a huge argument because DD1 was asking for some TV now that the school week was over (school guidelines suggest a minimum of restriction during the school week). DH thought it was too late at night for her to be watching and that she was exhausted and needed to go to bed. Meanwhile, DH was downloading a concert to watch on his laptop. I said that just as he wanted to veg out after a long week by watching a concert, wouldn't it make sense that DD1 might want that, too? His response was, "I'm 40! She's 5!". DD1 could hear us arguing from her bath and she said, "I know, it's too late. I hear."

It's not the peace and joy I was working towards.

Got to work on the marriage communication...

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catfish_friend

On Sep 2, 2011, at 9:08 AM, Sandra Dodd <Sandra@...> wrote:

> -=-I wanted to keep her home with me. At least if her sensitivity were visible to others less familiar with her, then issues could be addressed along the way. As it stands, most think she's dealing with things ok when in reality, she is destroyed inside. Only her dad and I pick up on this currently.-=-
>
> If he's picking up on it and it's real, they he probably won't be happy with her being in school for very much longer. --------
>

DH blames many things for this, but school is not one of them. At her preschool, we were struggling with a 3-girl friend group dynamic where one of two girls was being excluded. The issue was that one of the girls was hardly ever excluded. DH blamed that girl for our DD1's last miserable year. I blamed the school and the parents of the emotionally bullying girl. I was working full-time, so I had little recourse. DH dealt with the situation the best way he knew how.

Ceci

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catfish_friend

On Sep 2, 2011, at 9:33 AM, Sandra Dodd <Sandra@...> wrote:

> IF a family with a younger, still nursing child at home is observing a ban on TV, that means the younger girl doesn't watch either? Or just not during the time her sister is home? THAT could be leading to some of the disharmony between them, all kinds of ways.
--------

Currently, one week into school, no TV has been watched while both girls have been home. DH and I have still to discuss exactly how this will be dealt with. It used to be DD2 turned the TV off when her big sister still was watching and long from done. I've often wondered if DD2 was not as interested in TV because it was hardly restricted for her compared to her older sister. Of course, it could be that they are just different in how much they enjoy TV, but interesting to think about.

Ceci

Sandra Dodd

-=-I'm leery of making conditions for things but prefer to express my observations and opinions. I think conditions can be coercive rather than helpful towards gaining understanding. I just realized that I had not shared my observations with my girls on this particular subject and it is worth doing.-=-

If sharing your observations means making little girls responsible for huge decisions they don't understand, simple "if/then" is more compassionate.

The term "coercion" is used MUCH too easily and too often by parents who are trying to find ways to live peacefully, but avoiding anything that can be construed to be coercion eliminates much normal interpersonal behavior, falsely and wrongly. It's the same with "bribery."

http://sandradodd.com/bribery

People should live by logic more than by slogans and rules.

If things were going very well for you, and you were NOT two or three steps forward and two or three back, then supporting your views might make more sense, but it's not going well for you, and if you're going to resist presenting plain conditions of life because someone has led you to think it's coercion, then that could be part of the problem.

Sandra




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Sandra Dodd

-=-DH blames many things for this, but school is not one of them. At her preschool, we were struggling with a 3-girl friend group dynamic where one of two girls was being excluded. The issue was that one of the girls was hardly ever excluded. DH blamed that girl for our DD1's last miserable year. I blamed the school and the parents of the emotionally bullying girl. I was working full-time, so I had little recourse. DH dealt with the situation the best way he knew how.-=-

Too much detail about school.
You're looking too much at school.

http://sandradodd.com/schoolchoice
You can detach a little more. If you choose not to, please don't share so many details of school with this list. Let's talk about unschooling and natural learning.

My statement stands. It is an if/then statement. It is not coercive, it is predictive. If it turns out I'm wrong (which I doubt) it won't hurt me or my children or even this list. Please consider the ideas here instead of rejecting them.

There was a typo in the original, "they" it said, when it should have been "then," and I've corrected it below.

-=-If he's picking up on it and it's real, then he probably won't be happy with her being in school for very much longer.-=-

Sandra

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catfish_friend

On Sep 3, 2011, at 8:07 AM, Sandra Dodd <Sandra@...> wrote:

> If things were going very well for you, and you were NOT two or three steps forward and two or three back, then supporting your views might make more sense, but it's not going well for you, and if you're going to resist presenting plain conditions of life because someone has led you to think it's coercion, then that could be part of the problem.
--------

Maybe this is my hang-up. Since DH tends towards being authoritarian and also presents options to the girls such as, they can have sweets only after eating what he deems is suitable for a meal, I very well be thinking too extreme in trying to make sure I'm eliminating "coercive" options. DH argues all the time that I give our 2 year old in particular too many choices and that I am overwhelming her with them. Unfortunately, part of this may be coming from being reactionary to DH's way of parenting. Oddly, the arc of parenting is leaning more towards Unschooling, but without DH really embracing it, we are likely to stay on a kind of parenting seesaw between him and me.

The if/then suggestion clarification is helpful. I am going to think on it some more. DD1 seems pretty happy to me to make her own informed choices, but I will consider if I am giving her too many big choices that she is not yet ready to understand the larger consequences. I do think that if her body clock does not naturally shift to a morning schedule that she will start asking to miss school. She has dark circles under her eyes from 4 days this past week!

I think when our family goes to the Good Vibrations Conference next week, she will also be able to see more of what Unschooling could be like...

Ceci

Sandra Dodd

-=- Unfortunately, part of this may be coming from being reactionary to DH's way of parenting. Oddly, the arc of parenting is leaning more towards Unschooling, but without DH really embracing it, we are likely to stay on a kind of parenting seesaw between him and me.-=-

Here's the important part of that:

-=-this may be coming from being reactionary to DH-=-

Be partners. Help him get what he wants. He doesn't want to be a harsh bad guy but if he feels you don't care at ALL, then he's probably going further than he would have if he felt he had a partner.

http://sandradodd.com/spouses

If unschooling is the wedge between you, and there's a parenting seesaw, that doesn't leave a very stable place for your kids to rest.

Sandra




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catfish_friend

On Sep 3, 2011, at 6:15 PM, Sandra Dodd <Sandra@...> wrote:

> Be partners. Help him get what he wants. He doesn't want to be a harsh bad guy but if he feels you don't care at ALL, then he's probably going further than he would have if he felt he had a partner.
-----------

I have honestly tried my best to help him get what he want and needs. At DH's worst moments he says and does regrettable things that I am shocked by. At those times, I act to support safety for the girls and try as calmly as I can to suggest DH take a breath or a break away while everyone calms down.

I have led DH through a maze of ideas since we met and he has been open, but skeptical and sometimes even hostile to the ideas initially. Eventually, he embraces the idea and will share it with others with enthusiasm. I think he is an unschooler at heart, but maybe he's tired of all the work it takes to keep learning.

I also know that he needs a lot of "me-time" to recalibrate and that has been hard to come by. Ironically, putting the girls is school has robbed DH of time that he could have used for his own needs!

I support his need to do things like surf, jam on his guitar, watch sports, etc. When I get "me-time" I used to resent that I needed it to pay bills, do the accounting. Fortunately, from reading this list, I have learned to let go of my resentment for not getting the kind of time DH has gotten to do any fun stuff for me. I am happy when he gets what he needs. And I have fun with my girls whenever I can.

Trickier lately is navigating a new sleeping situation. We moved last month and our family double queen bed is now 2 separate queens in 2 separate rooms. My 2 year old nurses on demand so I am still co-sleeping but DH is not. DH wants his wife back and has suggested that if I preferred sleeping with the girls that we have a problem. I am happy to sleep anywhere, but it is easier to sleep with my nightnurser.

Would appreciate feedback on weaning, supporting partnership in marriage and priorities for setting a foundation for Unschooling. How do I balance my daughters' needs and my husbands where they are at odds? My inclination is to help my girls over my husband since he is a grown man, and I think up until recently, DH felt the same way, but it seems this has shifted...

Ceci

Bea

--- In [email protected], catfish_friend <catfish_friend@...> wrote:

>
> Trickier lately is navigating a new sleeping situation. We moved last month and our family double queen bed is now 2 separate queens in 2 separate rooms. My 2 year old nurses on demand so I am still co-sleeping but DH is not. DH wants his wife back and has suggested that if I preferred sleeping with the girls that we have a problem. I am happy to sleep anywhere, but it is easier to sleep with my nightnurser.
>


If it will help your DH, you can tell him that you are not the only family where the kids sleep in a bed with mom, and dad sleeps in a bed by himself. We used to sleep all together, but lately my husband has slept in another bedroom most nights because my still-nursing-two-year-old moves a lot and I need more space. This has actually improved the relationship between me and my husband as we both sleep better. He is fine with the arrangement. And I can go and visit him at night when the girls are asleep :-) This kind of sleeping arrangement doesn't necessarily mean there is a problem in the marriage!

Bea

Sandra Dodd

-=-If it will help your DH, you can tell him that you are not the only family where the kids sleep in a bed with mom, and dad sleeps in a bed by himself. We used to sleep all together, but lately my husband has slept in another bedroom most nights because my still-nursing-two-year-old moves a lot and I need more space. This has actually improved the relationship between me and my husband as we both sleep better. He is fine with the arrangement. And I can go and visit him at night when the girls are asleep :-) This kind of sleeping arrangement doesn't necessarily mean there is a problem in the marriage!-=-

Same with us, when babies were little. The house we were in when the kids were born didn't have room for four or five in one room; the bedrooms were small. Kirby was in with us, and Marty and Kirby, at first, but we got a bigger bed in the play room/kids room, and whenHolly was coming, got a bunk bed with a single on top and double on bottom. I started off in there between babies most of the time. Sometimes one of the kids would go get in with Keith at some point. Sometimes Keith and I would meet in another part of the house for a bit.

When we moved to a bigger house, the kids were 5-11 years old and we slept in various combinations, but not all five in one place. Sometimes three or four in one place.

I think the purpose of sleep is more important than the where and when. I wrote about that in The Big Book of Unschooling, about purposes of things. It helps to make decisions when sleep, food, houses, and so forth are looked at in historical and biological terms and not just as what's in magazines, what's on schedules, what it seems The Brady Bunch (or choose your TV-family) did.

There are sleep stories here:
http://sandradodd.com/sleep

Sandra

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Tamara

My grandparents had separate rooms. They would apparently joke that he would bump into the furniture when he came to visit at night. I think for them it created a little bit of magic and mystique.

Apologies for not trimming the post. Not sure how to do it on IPad.

Tamara


--- In [email protected], "Bea" <beatrice.mantovani@...> wrote:
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> --- In [email protected], catfish_friend <catfish_friend@> wrote:
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> > Trickier lately is navigating a new sleeping situation. We moved last month and our family double queen bed is now 2 separate queens in 2 separate rooms. My 2 year old nurses on demand so I am still co-sleeping but DH is not. DH wants his wife back and has suggested that if I preferred sleeping with the girls that we have a problem. I am happy to sleep anywhere, but it is easier to sleep with my nightnurser.
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> If it will help your DH, you can tell him that you are not the only family where the kids sleep in a bed with mom, and dad sleeps in a bed by himself. We used to sleep all together, but lately my husband has slept in another bedroom most nights because my still-nursing-two-year-old moves a lot and I need more space. This has actually improved the relationship between me and my husband as we both sleep better. He is fine with the arrangement. And I can go and visit him at night when the girls are asleep :-) This kind of sleeping arrangement doesn't necessarily mean there is a problem in the marriage!
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> Bea
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