Dealing with Grandma
tmissinne
I'm looking for advice on helping my son Deacon, who is five, deal with his Grandma's views on violence. First off, they absolutely adore each other and have since he was born. Often the first thing he says in the morning is asking whether he's going to see Grandma that day. His younger brother Evan, who is three, feels the same way. She gets down on the floor and plays with them, and ignores any adults who happen to be in the vicinity.
However, she has very specific views on violence which she has been expressing more regularly. They like to play Star Wars, and Indiana Jones, any game that involves sword, blasters, bazookas, magic (which, being a fundamentalist Christian, she also has problems with), etc. Recently she told them that she wouldn't play games involving violence with them -- even knights. Deacon asked me to tell her that it made him really sad, which I did. This led to her sending me an email basically saying that I'm damaging my kids and preparing them to be violent and go to war as adults. She has made comments in front of them like 'I miss my innocent little boys.' -- I let her know how hurtful that was.
I've forwarded her links to Sandra's page on video games, to Joyce's page on violent video games, and a couple of other links I've found. She's generally supportive of unschooling (I was homeschooling until I was ten, so she's very supportive of that), although I don't think she's read enough to really 'get it'.
What I need advice on is helping Deacon deal with his feelings about it. He's very concerned about other people's feelings --he's been worried since last night that I wouldn't have fun this afternoon at the amusement park because I was a little sick. I can see the conflict he feels, knowing that he loves something that Grandma disapproves of. I'd love any suggestions on how to help him deal with this.
Thanks
Trisha
However, she has very specific views on violence which she has been expressing more regularly. They like to play Star Wars, and Indiana Jones, any game that involves sword, blasters, bazookas, magic (which, being a fundamentalist Christian, she also has problems with), etc. Recently she told them that she wouldn't play games involving violence with them -- even knights. Deacon asked me to tell her that it made him really sad, which I did. This led to her sending me an email basically saying that I'm damaging my kids and preparing them to be violent and go to war as adults. She has made comments in front of them like 'I miss my innocent little boys.' -- I let her know how hurtful that was.
I've forwarded her links to Sandra's page on video games, to Joyce's page on violent video games, and a couple of other links I've found. She's generally supportive of unschooling (I was homeschooling until I was ten, so she's very supportive of that), although I don't think she's read enough to really 'get it'.
What I need advice on is helping Deacon deal with his feelings about it. He's very concerned about other people's feelings --he's been worried since last night that I wouldn't have fun this afternoon at the amusement park because I was a little sick. I can see the conflict he feels, knowing that he loves something that Grandma disapproves of. I'd love any suggestions on how to help him deal with this.
Thanks
Trisha
Pam Sorooshian
I think it is fine for grandma to have different likes and dislikes and
to have different standards than yours. Kids can understand that those
are games they don't play with grandma. Just tell them Grandma doesn't
like violent games and help them think of all the games she does like to
play with them
To have a good Grandma is such a wonderful thing in a child's life -
don't mess it up by insisting she be you - let her be herself and help
the kids accept who she really is.
I think it tends to be a sign of maturity and confidence that we stop
feeling like we have to engineer our kids lives so that other people
treat them or interact with them exactly the way we wish they would.
That's not really necessary. Your kids will learn more and become kinder
and gentler people if you help them be understanding of grandma's
personal preferences. Just smile lovingly and say, "Yeah, I know, but
that's just part of who grandma is and we do love her anyway."
-pam
to have different standards than yours. Kids can understand that those
are games they don't play with grandma. Just tell them Grandma doesn't
like violent games and help them think of all the games she does like to
play with them
To have a good Grandma is such a wonderful thing in a child's life -
don't mess it up by insisting she be you - let her be herself and help
the kids accept who she really is.
I think it tends to be a sign of maturity and confidence that we stop
feeling like we have to engineer our kids lives so that other people
treat them or interact with them exactly the way we wish they would.
That's not really necessary. Your kids will learn more and become kinder
and gentler people if you help them be understanding of grandma's
personal preferences. Just smile lovingly and say, "Yeah, I know, but
that's just part of who grandma is and we do love her anyway."
-pam
On 1/6/2010 9:00 AM, tmissinne wrote:
> However, she has very specific views on violence which she has been expressing more regularly. They like to play Star Wars, and Indiana Jones, any game that involves sword, blasters, bazookas, magic (which, being a fundamentalist Christian, she also has problems with), etc. Recently she told them that she wouldn't play games involving violence with them -- even knights. Deacon asked me to tell her that it made him really sad, which I did. This led to her sending me an email basically saying that I'm damaging my kids and preparing them to be violent and go to war as adults. She has made comments in front of them like 'I miss my innocent little boys.' -- I let her know how hurtful that was.
>
>
tmissinne
My concern is that he will feel he has to change who he is in order to get Grandma's approval. Considering the background she came from -- strict Mennonite, parents punished and she didn't even know why, regularly shamed etc. -- she's been amazingly willing to listen to what I've had to say (that's why I forwarded her the articles, attempting to help her feel more comfortable), and been so wonderful with my sons, which I let her know regularly.
I'm more worried about Deacon. I want him to be able to be himself -- it's one thing to avoid violent games around Grandma, but I can see his hesitation even when she's not here. Not because he doesn't enjoy them, but because he's worried about her.
I guess this is part of the larger picture of his personality. He's very concerned with others -- very sweet and considerate. I'm concerned that he will lose himself. He has a friend who's a year older than him, and a leader in their games. He hasn't wanted to see him since mid-November because he feels like his friend doesn't let him talk enough, or let him choose the game. I told him that if he didn't want to play what his friend comes up with, we could talk about it and find something they both enjoy. That he doesn't have to always do what his friend says. He said that he feels like he has to because he's is his friend. How do I help him walk that line between being considerate, and being true to himself?
I'm more worried about Deacon. I want him to be able to be himself -- it's one thing to avoid violent games around Grandma, but I can see his hesitation even when she's not here. Not because he doesn't enjoy them, but because he's worried about her.
I guess this is part of the larger picture of his personality. He's very concerned with others -- very sweet and considerate. I'm concerned that he will lose himself. He has a friend who's a year older than him, and a leader in their games. He hasn't wanted to see him since mid-November because he feels like his friend doesn't let him talk enough, or let him choose the game. I told him that if he didn't want to play what his friend comes up with, we could talk about it and find something they both enjoy. That he doesn't have to always do what his friend says. He said that he feels like he has to because he's is his friend. How do I help him walk that line between being considerate, and being true to himself?
--- In [email protected], Pam Sorooshian <pamsoroosh@...> wrote:
>
> I think it is fine for grandma to have different likes and dislikes and
> to have different standards than yours. Kids can understand that those
> are games they don't play with grandma. Just tell them Grandma doesn't
> like violent games and help them think of all the games she does like to
> play with them
>
> To have a good Grandma is such a wonderful thing in a child's life -
> don't mess it up by insisting she be you - let her be herself and help
> the kids accept who she really is.
>
> I think it tends to be a sign of maturity and confidence that we stop
> feeling like we have to engineer our kids lives so that other people
> treat them or interact with them exactly the way we wish they would.
> That's not really necessary. Your kids will learn more and become kinder
> and gentler people if you help them be understanding of grandma's
> personal preferences. Just smile lovingly and say, "Yeah, I know, but
> that's just part of who grandma is and we do love her anyway."
>
> -pam
alexandriapalonia
Why not encourage both of them (all three of them?) to play games they all enjoy?
We've explained since our kids were very little, that different people like different things, and that many people don't like (guns/sports/Harry Potter/dolls/tea/house), and that we have fun with people we care for by meeting them on some more neutral ground and playing something we (and they) both like.
So one set of grandparents we don't discuss Harry Potter with, and the other set makes wands and robes. We play blocks and trains and cars and house and tea and board games with all the grandparents.
It's a tight line to walk sometimes, and my fifth child got herself in and interesting situation one day when she went with her grandmother to her grandmother's church for a social group, and got into a conversation with the pastor's wife and forgot not to mention Harry Potter as a book she really likes (when asked what she likes to read).
She got quite an earful from the pastor's wife, but took it with aplomb, though she confided to me later that she really had a few choice words go through her head as she listened politely to the woman's opinions on Rowling's work.
We often talk about how different people view the world, and how it's often quite different from the way we view it, and how to negotiate the world with those folks in it, and when we have one of those interactions, try to deal with it as calmly and tactfully as we can. (I confess this daughter in particular is better at holding her tongue than I am -- though the things she tells me she didn't say are a real hoot).
And for those we know and hold dear, we focus on our commonalities and put aside the things we like that we know make them uncomfortable.
Andrea
We've explained since our kids were very little, that different people like different things, and that many people don't like (guns/sports/Harry Potter/dolls/tea/house), and that we have fun with people we care for by meeting them on some more neutral ground and playing something we (and they) both like.
So one set of grandparents we don't discuss Harry Potter with, and the other set makes wands and robes. We play blocks and trains and cars and house and tea and board games with all the grandparents.
It's a tight line to walk sometimes, and my fifth child got herself in and interesting situation one day when she went with her grandmother to her grandmother's church for a social group, and got into a conversation with the pastor's wife and forgot not to mention Harry Potter as a book she really likes (when asked what she likes to read).
She got quite an earful from the pastor's wife, but took it with aplomb, though she confided to me later that she really had a few choice words go through her head as she listened politely to the woman's opinions on Rowling's work.
We often talk about how different people view the world, and how it's often quite different from the way we view it, and how to negotiate the world with those folks in it, and when we have one of those interactions, try to deal with it as calmly and tactfully as we can. (I confess this daughter in particular is better at holding her tongue than I am -- though the things she tells me she didn't say are a real hoot).
And for those we know and hold dear, we focus on our commonalities and put aside the things we like that we know make them uncomfortable.
Andrea
> I'm looking for advice on helping my son Deacon, who is five, deal with his Grandma's views on violence. First off, they absolutely adore each other and have since he was born. Often the first thing he says in the morning is asking whether he's going to see Grandma that day. His younger brother Evan, who is three, feels the same way. She gets down on the floor and plays with them, and ignores any adults who happen to be in the vicinity.
>
> However, she has very specific views on violence which she has been expressing more regularly. They like to play Star Wars, and Indiana Jones, any game that involves sword, blasters, bazookas, magic (which, being a fundamentalist Christian, she also has problems with), etc. Recently she told them that she wouldn't play games involving violence with them -- even knights. Deacon asked me to tell her that it made him really sad, which I did. This led to her sending me an email basically saying that I'm damaging my kids and preparing them to be violent and go to war as adults. She has made comments in front of them like 'I miss my innocent little boys.' -- I let her know how hurtful that was.
>
> I've forwarded her links to Sandra's page on video games, to Joyce's page on violent video games, and a couple of other links I've found. She's generally supportive of unschooling (I was homeschooling until I was ten, so she's very supportive of that), although I don't think she's read enough to really 'get it'.
>
> What I need advice on is helping Deacon deal with his feelings about it. He's very concerned about other people's feelings --he's been worried since last night that I wouldn't have fun this afternoon at the amusement park because I was a little sick. I can see the conflict he feels, knowing that he loves something that Grandma disapproves of. I'd love any suggestions on how to help him deal with this.
>
> Thanks
> Trisha
>
Marina DeLuca-Howard
Grandma's worried about all the real violence in the world. That is
probably something you are protecting your son from at the moment. She
can't imagine violence as a game. But that's okay. Many people find this a
stumbling block.
I remember hanging out in drop in centres and playgroups and parks trying to
get a handle on real parents and kids with my firstborn happily nursing in a
baby carrier.
Violence was a real issue for many mothers. Many parents "banned" war toys,
water spurting toys(guns and others) and were quite smarmy about it. I
observed their kids were sometimes, not always, secretive and would make
their own toy guns out of sticks, even barbies bent at the waist and pointed
were "guns". Still other parents to my shock were spanking and screaming
and shaming their kids in public places. I supplemented my observations
with books on anthropology, child development and history. In the end I
followed my own instincts.
I still remember when one mother commented on how lucky I was that Rowan was
such a good boy. I replied I didn't believe in that kind of label--good or
bad kids. As far as I was concerned that label was a euphemism for how well
parents used their own life experience to help negoitiate a successful
compromise when their agenda did not coincide with the priorities of their
child. I was just trying to explain why my two year old seemed to be so
"well-behaved". It wasn't that he was convienently willing to obey me, but
that I thought of him as my partner in situations rather than an
unpredicatble factor that needed subduing. To me what some parents jokingly
call "child wrangling" is violence. Grabbing, berating and coraling a child
into a stroller using force is real violence. A child pretending to fire
lasers is pretending. I could never fully convince others that they may
want to think about the meaning of the word "violence", and I still find it
sad.
I thought being honest about violence, preventing real violence and being
involved with children's play was very important. What I observed was that
play fights can led to real violence, but toys with guns or swords led to
abstract choreographed "violence". Many parents were very alarmed at the
sight of kids firing laser "guns" at one another, but seemed less alarmed by
kids whacking each other or pushing each other off playground equipment.
One thing I investigate is when kids are "playing" but one is constantly
hurting the other. Often the hurt child will want the "game" to continue
and the dynamic to continue. I have said to other people's kids(never mine,
oddly enough) nobody can give you permission to hurt them and dangerous
games that can lead to stitches or injury should be stopped.
With physical play a little observation is sometimes necessary to find out
if the play is consensual, if there is a power imbalance and if children are
using a game to hurt someone. I remember my cousin Linda and I playing
superheroes with her older sister. Linda was batgirl and I was hawkgirl or
some other bird of prey made up heroine. Her sister Lorrie was the
villain. We pounced on Lorrie and I remember backing off once she was in
pain, but her younger sister kept pounding her. As the youngest of course
she wasn't the object of discipline once the moms heard the screaming and
left the kitchen to find out what we were up to however. What they say was
crying and the older child hitting back. As women they are best friends
though as children there was a lot of violence in their relationship and it
seemed to go undetected by their parents.
Your mom may not want to draw the line between pretend and real violence,
but if she is a loving grandmother your children have hit the grandma
jackpot and that should be celebrated. Use your life experience to plan
activities your mother and children enjoy. Have fun snacks, lego and maybe
help your kids gift your mom with a theme party every time she visits. Make
a pinata and break it open...maybe grandma friendly creams or lip balms
could be included as prizes.
Marina
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
probably something you are protecting your son from at the moment. She
can't imagine violence as a game. But that's okay. Many people find this a
stumbling block.
I remember hanging out in drop in centres and playgroups and parks trying to
get a handle on real parents and kids with my firstborn happily nursing in a
baby carrier.
Violence was a real issue for many mothers. Many parents "banned" war toys,
water spurting toys(guns and others) and were quite smarmy about it. I
observed their kids were sometimes, not always, secretive and would make
their own toy guns out of sticks, even barbies bent at the waist and pointed
were "guns". Still other parents to my shock were spanking and screaming
and shaming their kids in public places. I supplemented my observations
with books on anthropology, child development and history. In the end I
followed my own instincts.
I still remember when one mother commented on how lucky I was that Rowan was
such a good boy. I replied I didn't believe in that kind of label--good or
bad kids. As far as I was concerned that label was a euphemism for how well
parents used their own life experience to help negoitiate a successful
compromise when their agenda did not coincide with the priorities of their
child. I was just trying to explain why my two year old seemed to be so
"well-behaved". It wasn't that he was convienently willing to obey me, but
that I thought of him as my partner in situations rather than an
unpredicatble factor that needed subduing. To me what some parents jokingly
call "child wrangling" is violence. Grabbing, berating and coraling a child
into a stroller using force is real violence. A child pretending to fire
lasers is pretending. I could never fully convince others that they may
want to think about the meaning of the word "violence", and I still find it
sad.
I thought being honest about violence, preventing real violence and being
involved with children's play was very important. What I observed was that
play fights can led to real violence, but toys with guns or swords led to
abstract choreographed "violence". Many parents were very alarmed at the
sight of kids firing laser "guns" at one another, but seemed less alarmed by
kids whacking each other or pushing each other off playground equipment.
One thing I investigate is when kids are "playing" but one is constantly
hurting the other. Often the hurt child will want the "game" to continue
and the dynamic to continue. I have said to other people's kids(never mine,
oddly enough) nobody can give you permission to hurt them and dangerous
games that can lead to stitches or injury should be stopped.
With physical play a little observation is sometimes necessary to find out
if the play is consensual, if there is a power imbalance and if children are
using a game to hurt someone. I remember my cousin Linda and I playing
superheroes with her older sister. Linda was batgirl and I was hawkgirl or
some other bird of prey made up heroine. Her sister Lorrie was the
villain. We pounced on Lorrie and I remember backing off once she was in
pain, but her younger sister kept pounding her. As the youngest of course
she wasn't the object of discipline once the moms heard the screaming and
left the kitchen to find out what we were up to however. What they say was
crying and the older child hitting back. As women they are best friends
though as children there was a lot of violence in their relationship and it
seemed to go undetected by their parents.
Your mom may not want to draw the line between pretend and real violence,
but if she is a loving grandmother your children have hit the grandma
jackpot and that should be celebrated. Use your life experience to plan
activities your mother and children enjoy. Have fun snacks, lego and maybe
help your kids gift your mom with a theme party every time she visits. Make
a pinata and break it open...maybe grandma friendly creams or lip balms
could be included as prizes.
Marina
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Pam Sorooshian
On 1/6/2010 9:40 PM, tmissinne wrote:
degree. Who he IS? Just agreeing not to play some games would change who
is is? Isn't he the kid who plays other games with her, too?
Sorry - at the symposium - will write more on this later.....
-pam sorooshian
> My concern is that he will feel he has to change who he is in order to get Grandma's approval.We should change our behavior to accommodate those we love, to some
degree. Who he IS? Just agreeing not to play some games would change who
is is? Isn't he the kid who plays other games with her, too?
Sorry - at the symposium - will write more on this later.....
-pam sorooshian
Joanna
"He has a friend who's a year older than him, and a leader in their games. He hasn't wanted to see him since mid-November because he feels like his friend doesn't let him talk enough, or let him choose the game."
Kids will be in different relationships that call forth different qualities. Sure, they have tendencies towards being leaders, followers, reconcilers, idea kids, tech kids, etc., but they also have flexibility when playing with individual kids. If you put two leaders together, they'll either fight all the time, or one will naturally step down in that context. It's not going to change who they fundamentally are, though. Although it might help expand their ideas of who they are.
This is one of the huge positives of playing in multi age groups. I have appreciated it when my kids have had the opportunity to play with kids older than themselves, and then younger, because they will tend to get to have both experiences as leaders/followers, etc.
If your son has said that he wants to take some time off from this friend, then he is already aware of who he "is," and is uncomfortable maybe with the extremes of the friendship. Perhaps if he had time with another friend, maybe younger, he would have a chance to find his leadership qualities.
Joanna
Kids will be in different relationships that call forth different qualities. Sure, they have tendencies towards being leaders, followers, reconcilers, idea kids, tech kids, etc., but they also have flexibility when playing with individual kids. If you put two leaders together, they'll either fight all the time, or one will naturally step down in that context. It's not going to change who they fundamentally are, though. Although it might help expand their ideas of who they are.
This is one of the huge positives of playing in multi age groups. I have appreciated it when my kids have had the opportunity to play with kids older than themselves, and then younger, because they will tend to get to have both experiences as leaders/followers, etc.
If your son has said that he wants to take some time off from this friend, then he is already aware of who he "is," and is uncomfortable maybe with the extremes of the friendship. Perhaps if he had time with another friend, maybe younger, he would have a chance to find his leadership qualities.
Joanna